| ryouma``` | az needs to open much later | 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +4816 cases (now 3.7 million), +399 deaths (now 257768) since 49 minutes ago — Brazil: +3688 cases (now 113844), +363 deaths (now 7848) since 3 hours ago — US: +920 cases (now 1.2 million) since 49 minutes ago | 00:05 |
| ryouma``` | %data az | 00:05 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma```: In Bahia, Brazil, there are 3734 total cases (0.0% of the population) and 141 deaths (3.8% of cases) as of 41 seconds ago. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Bahia for time series data. | 00:05 |
| ryouma``` | %data arizona | 00:05 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma```: In Arizona, US, there are 9305 total cases (0.1% of the population) and 395 deaths (4.2% of cases) as of a minute ago. 88260 tests were performed (10.5% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Arizona for time series data. | 00:05 |
| ryouma``` | is there county level? | 00:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 22:03 UTC: Trump does not wear coronavirus mask at Honeywell factory that makes masks: President Donald Trump did not wear a mask as a coronavirus precaution during a visit Tuesday to a Honeywell factory in Arizona that is producing millions of N95 masks. → https://is.gd/2hAfHT | 00:08 |
| ryouma``` | infectons rising at same rate as always, deaths rising at same rate as always, no testing until recently. not a time to open it up. politics. | 00:09 |
| sookie | surveilance system is up, testing capacity increased, ventilator stockpile replenished, n95 masks stockpile replenished, standard of care improved, virus dynamics better understood | 00:32 |
| sookie | perfect time to start opening up | 00:32 |
| sookie | the elderly, morbidly obese, and diabetics can stay home longer and the rest can go out, wear masks, keep their distance from others and wash their hands often. | 00:34 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 22:32 UTC: U.S. hospitals are losing millions of dollars per day in the midst of the Covid-19 pandemic — and recovery may take years: Conservative estimates indicate that U.S. hospitals are losing more than a billion dollars per day by complying with the guidance from policymakers and the leading medical associations to [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/jAu4YG | 00:36 |
| rager | how do these people who stay home get food? | 00:37 |
| rager | how do the ones who require medical care receive this? | 00:37 |
| rager | if you're not testing to track hotspots of infection, you're more or less guaranteeing that plenty of those folks will die anyway | 00:37 |
| sookie | that's what i meant by suveillance system up0 | 00:39 |
| sookie | in the u.s. the cdc has surveillance up for covid in all 50 states with fema coordinating the emergency response in case of local outbreaks | 00:39 |
| sookie | not sure what other countries are up to | 00:39 |
| ryouma``` | getting medical care is a huge problem for many who are bedridden and housebound whether they are in lockdown or not. food gets delivered. | 00:40 |
| sookie | as for how the elderly get food? the same way they're doing it now. there are seniors-only hours for grocery stores and also delivery services | 00:40 |
| ryouma``` | food gets dlivered to healthy folk who are under lockdown* | 00:40 |
| ryouma``` | in many places | 00:40 |
| ryouma``` | the grandstanding in az does not make sense given this: https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Arizona | 00:42 |
| sookie | what grandstanding? | 00:42 |
| ryouma``` | it has not even reached peak yet. it has not even started flatter yet. | 00:43 |
| sookie | again folks | 00:43 |
| ryouma``` | see :08 | 00:43 |
| sookie | this was never meant to be permanent | 00:43 |
| sookie | it was meant to flatten the curve and give a pause while supplies and stuff got in order | 00:43 |
| sookie | it wasn't meant to wait for the peak, or wait for a downturn, etc. it was meant to flatten things. | 00:43 |
| ryouma``` | az citizens do not have access to masks | 00:44 |
| sookie | make you rown | 00:44 |
| ryouma``` | even accepting your claims | 00:44 |
| sookie | your own | 00:44 |
| ryouma``` | the curve was not flattened | 00:44 |
| sookie | amazon has them for sale and you can make your own from a tshirt | 00:44 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2410 cases (now 3.7 million), +194 deaths (now 257962) since 46 minutes ago — US: +1327 cases (now 1.2 million), +109 deaths (now 72163) since 46 minutes ago — Brazil: +871 cases (now 114715), +73 deaths (now 7921) since 46 minutes ago | 00:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 22:53 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Australia coronavirus live: Queen wishes Australia well as Ruby Princess inquiry continues – latest updates → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 01:04 |
| rager | what surveillance system? | 01:14 |
| rager | how many times have you been tested for COVID-19 this week, sookie ? | 01:14 |
| rager | this month? | 01:14 |
| rager | this year? | 01:14 |
| rager | until there's enough testing capacity to test everyone at-will a few times a week, the US does not have a surveillance system set up for this | 01:15 |
| rager | hell, even getting tests bi-weekly to everyone is a fever dream | 01:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 23:15 UTC: U.S. hospitals are losing millions of dollars per day in the midst of the Covid-19 pandemic — and recovery may take years: Conservative estimates indicate that U.S. hospitals are losing more than a billion dollars per day by complying with the guidance from policymakers and the leading medical associations to [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/jAu4YG | 01:18 |
| LjL | 18<22sookie18> it wasn't meant to wait for the peak, or wait for a downturn, etc. it was meant to flatten things. | 01:25 |
| LjL | you're completely respinning the way the word "flattening" has been used previously | 01:25 |
| LjL | "flattening the curve" means getting PAST the plateau AND the peak and actually having close to zero new cases | 01:26 |
| LjL | that's what it has meant in discourse all over the world, you don't get to redefine it based on what your government feels like doing | 01:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 23:25 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Australia coronavirus live: Queen wishes Australia well as Ruby Princess inquiry continues – latest updates → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 01:32 |
| sookie | no | 01:34 |
| sookie | flattening the curve is making sure the curve's bump doesn't exceed the hospital capacity line | 01:34 |
| sookie | it has nothing to do with getting past the plateau | 01:35 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2054 cases (now 3.7 million), +86 deaths (now 258048) since 53 minutes ago — US: +961 cases (now 1.2 million), +59 deaths (now 72222) since 53 minutes ago — Colombia: +640 cases (now 8613) since a day ago | 01:36 |
| sookie | LjL: https://i.imgur.com/Ka7Ho5l.jpg | 01:37 |
| sookie | it's making sure you don't go over the dotted line | 01:37 |
| sookie | rager: nonsense. you don't need to be able to test 330 million people multiple times to have surveillance. just like you don't need a fireman at every house in order to protect neighborhoods from fires. | 01:41 |
| LjL | i don't think you can even begin to predict whether the curve will flatten above or below your capacity if you are still just growing with no slowdown | 01:41 |
| sookie | that's another issue, and maybe so | 01:41 |
| sookie | but flattening has nothing to do with passing the plateau | 01:42 |
| sookie | it has to do with: flattening | 01:42 |
| LjL | https://covid19.healthdata.org/united-states-of-america used to have dotten lines for hospital beds and ICU beds, like it does for example for https://covid19.healthdata.org/italy ... any clue why they've been removed? | 01:43 |
| sookie | and so if you have a flattened trajectory, you can loosen things, and then contain and contact trace if you have local hotspots | 01:43 |
| sookie | ihme sucks | 01:43 |
| sookie | they've been wrong at every stage of forecasting | 01:43 |
| LjL | that's sort of what i expect with any COVID model | 01:44 |
| PlanckWalk | Absoutely agree that IHME sucks. It's not even a model, just a completely unjustifiable curve-fitting. | 01:44 |
| sookie | no idea why they removed the capacity line though, maybe they realized it was junk | 01:44 |
| PlanckWalk | The trouble with trying to maintain infection prevalence just under required hospital capacity is lag time. | 01:46 |
| PlanckWalk | So in practice you need to suppress much more heavily | 01:46 |
| sookie | or have a good surveillance system | 01:47 |
| sookie | u.s. cdc claims to have something they're confident with | 01:47 |
| PlanckWalk | Also, the measures required are essentially the same whether you suppress at 1% prevalence or 0.01% | 01:47 |
| sookie | so if they detect an outbreak in tempe, arizona, they deploy contact tracers and isolate. so they contain it. | 01:47 |
| PlanckWalk | And the costs for the latter are much lower | 01:48 |
| PlanckWalk | (1/100th as many contact tracers required, etc) | 01:48 |
| sookie | in other words, you put out the small fires | 01:48 |
| sookie | rather than closing down the entire countrry | 01:49 |
| PlanckWalk | The hospital capacity is almost irrelevant since if it gets anywhere near that, then you don't have small fires, you have a raging bushfire. | 01:49 |
| sookie | yes | 01:49 |
| sookie | it might be relevant in localize settings. like some town might have one area hospital and 10 icu beds or something | 01:49 |
| PlanckWalk | That almost exactly describes my area! | 01:50 |
| sookie | and a small local fire might end up with 20 hospitalization needs, so you'd have to either mobilize medical resources or transport the patients | 01:50 |
| PlanckWalk | We did have to do that. | 01:50 |
| sookie | you transported the patients? | 01:51 |
| PlanckWalk | Yes | 01:51 |
| sookie | interesting | 01:51 |
| rager | You don't need a fireman at every house to know if any houses are on fire | 01:51 |
| PlanckWalk | Also pulled in resources from elsewhere | 01:51 |
| sookie | i think the u.s. has opted for mobile hospitals. deployed by an agency called fema | 01:51 |
| rager | Without enough testing for even at-will tests, there is no surveillance | 01:51 |
| sookie | but if it's only a few people, i guess transporting them to another hospital might be easier | 01:52 |
| nb | the US also has 2 giant hospital shops operated by the US Navy | 01:52 |
| sookie | you don't need at-will testing | 01:52 |
| PlanckWalk | The thing is that by the time the first case was detected and quaratines started, there were already 100+ infections. | 01:52 |
| PlanckWalk | Those showed up over the next couple of weeks | 01:52 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: by now they have predictive models that tell them based on hospital cases and stuff like that how much community spread there is | 01:53 |
| PlanckWalk | (We quarantined thousands of people in their homes and some government-paid hotels) | 01:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 23:36 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: UK deaths highest in Europe as Trump looks to disband coronavirus task force → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 01:53 |
| sookie | so you don't need to wait for the lag, you make real-time inferences from the numbers | 01:53 |
| rager | Lol. There is not enough testing to even get all the people who are working right now tested | 01:53 |
| PlanckWalk | There were at the time no known community cases in the whole state | 01:53 |
| PlanckWalk | Despite pretty widespread testing | 01:53 |
| LjL | PlanckWalk, especially if the things we're starting to see in Europe with infections likely having started in Janauary or even December are verified. although there's also this other thing of the currently most common strain being a more infectious one than the original one. both of these are more rumors (well, headlines and quick skimming) to me than anything concrete though | 01:53 |
| rager | There is no surveillance. The disease are a still spreading through the community with no hope for tracing | 01:54 |
| rager | Your only argument is that you don't need perfect surveillance to be effective. I'm arguing that the US is so far from effective that you're speaking wishfully | 01:55 |
| rager | You haven't once even done anything but just restating your premises | 01:55 |
| PlanckWalk | Yes, I can't see it working in the US in anything like its current situation. | 01:55 |
| PlanckWalk | They would need much longer lockdowns, and vastly more government support, just to get to the point where testing tracing & isolation is possible. | 01:56 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: in the u.s. the federal guidelines are a 3-stage easing program with each stage requiring 14-days of passing some criteria | 01:57 |
| PlanckWalk | I don't think that's politically feasible there. | 01:57 |
| rager | To control the disease through surveillance, you need prevalence to be low enough that you can actually determine the source of infection | 01:57 |
| sookie | so best case scenario you have 3*2=6 week program assuming you can do the best and do each stage in the minimum of 14 days | 01:57 |
| rager | That and enough testing to find positive cases before they blow up into full community spread | 01:58 |
| sookie | this is left up to each stage. so different states can be in different stages | 01:58 |
| rager | The US feds have been nothing but feckless this whole time | 01:58 |
| rager | Try again | 01:58 |
| PlanckWalk | Is closing borders between US states politically possible? | 01:58 |
| sookie | left up to each state* | 01:58 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: not really | 01:58 |
| PlanckWalk | (Or even legal?) | 01:58 |
| sookie | Rhode Island tried | 01:58 |
| sookie | and NY screamed bloody murder | 01:59 |
| sookie | NY is run by an incompetent liberal governor who totally messed things up (NY is reponsible for 1/4 of all of the US's cases) | 01:59 |
| dzho | so far | 01:59 |
| dzho | it's the rest of the country's turn now | 01:59 |
| nb | sookie, KY tried apparently and court said no, that the constitution guarantees free movement between states | 01:59 |
| sookie | so Rhode Island and Florida were upset because NYers were fleeing to their states and seeding disease. | 01:59 |
| nb | I just saw that on the news today | 02:00 |
| PlanckWalk | Ugh. So if every state is doing their own thing and has very different prevalence, and movement between them can't be feasibly stopped, that's goign to hurt. | 02:00 |
| sookie | yes it is | 02:00 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 23:56 UTC: The coronavirus has mutated and appears to be more contagious now, new study finds: The new coronavirus strain began spreading in Europe in early February before migrating to other parts of the world, including the U.S., becoming the dominant form of the virus across the globe by the end of March, researchers at the [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/07u0Ao | 02:00 |
| sookie | that is one of the challenges | 02:00 |
| rager | NY's liberal government is proof that "liberal" means "centrist" | 02:00 |
| rager | Cuomo wouldn't even stop cutting medicare and Medicaid for the Corona virus | 02:01 |
| sookie | nb: i don't know what kentucky tried but rhode island wanted to and then people started claiming it was not constitutional | 02:01 |
| rager | He still is cutting funding to poor and old people's medical care | 02:01 |
| dzho | if interstate commerce is to be regulated, it'd have to be the feds that do it https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commerce_Clause | 02:01 |
| PlanckWalk | I don't really know the differences between R & D in the US. They're both so far off the charts of our political spectrum, and the polarization seems so intense and entrenched. | 02:02 |
| ryouma``` | coalitions of states are forming | 02:03 |
| LjL | like... confederates? | 02:04 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: it's now a differentiation that's premised in the absurd | 02:04 |
| sookie | in olden days, it was a difference in policy priorities | 02:04 |
| ryouma``` | PlanckWalk: where are you and d and r are off in which directions? | 02:04 |
| PlanckWalk | I'm in Australia | 02:04 |
| dzho | where the Liberals are on the right | 02:05 |
| PlanckWalk | I'm sure the difference between Labor and Liberal looks micoscopic to outsiders, and honestly not that different to a lot of Australians either. | 02:05 |
| sookie | you know, you also have to account for human nature when you develop policy | 02:05 |
| ryouma``` | r is more right wing, but d is still consiered right wing elsewhere int eh world | 02:05 |
| sookie | so in countries where you have autocratic police states, you can force people to quarantine or you round them up and put them in jail or something | 02:06 |
| sookie | in the u.s. that's not possible | 02:06 |
| ryouma``` | liberal in the us is an epithet meaning left wing; elsewhere it is an epithet meaning right wing :/ | 02:06 |
| sookie | and people are getting sick of staying in | 02:06 |
| sookie | so they have to take that into account. otherwise people will revolt. | 02:07 |
| nb | sookie, well, technicially the health departments in coordination with the courts do have the authority to force quarantines of people | 02:07 |
| ryouma``` | but my impression of australia is that it follows the us kind of. and is pretty right wing? | 02:07 |
| sookie | nb: try enforcing it | 02:07 |
| nb | but I don't think that could be applied unless they actually knew people were probably infected | 02:07 |
| nb | sookie, they have. At least in a few cases | 02:08 |
| nb | There was a case near me where they posted police outside someone's house | 02:08 |
| nb | to force them to stay in their house | 02:08 |
| sookie | oh, known infections yes | 02:08 |
| PlanckWalk | It does follow the US in a loose kind of way. It may be right wing in terms of world governments too. | 02:08 |
| sookie | i am talking about generalized lock-downs | 02:08 |
| nb | oh | 02:08 |
| nb | yeah, that wouldn't happen here | 02:08 |
| sookie | nb: many countries have that | 02:08 |
| sookie | in some latin american american countries (maybe most) they have curfews | 02:09 |
| PlanckWalk | But the differences in social and economics between Aus and US are pretty huge | 02:09 |
| sookie | like you can only go out between 10am and 3pm or something | 02:09 |
| sookie | and only to buy food | 02:09 |
| LjL | maybe i should have walks at like... now instead | 02:09 |
| LjL | now being 2am | 02:09 |
| LjL | we don't have a curfew and we are newly empowered with the ability to the the cops that we are just doing physical activity | 02:10 |
| sookie | i read that in panama they even did men on three days and women on three days and nobody out on sunday | 02:10 |
| LjL | that seems absurd | 02:10 |
| sookie | sunlight is better, virus dies faster | 02:10 |
| LjL | in spain they are dividing it into age groups | 02:10 |
| dunnp | US can and has implemented curfews | 02:10 |
| sookie | not absurd | 02:10 |
| LjL | which may be gratuitous but at least it's easy to see the reason | 02:10 |
| sookie | it's an easy way to reduce the amount of people out on streets by 50% | 02:10 |
| sookie | assuming men/women is 50/50 | 02:10 |
| ryouma``` | you can take odd-even birthdays | 02:11 |
| LjL | sookie, yes but sunlight other people are out too, and if i don't wear a mask i'm both at risk and illegal | 02:11 |
| LjL | not many people outside at 2am on the other hand i wager | 02:11 |
| sookie | ryouma```: easier for a cop to notice a woman out on a man's day than a 12th day birthday out on an odd day | 02:11 |
| PlanckWalk | The main thing about men/women divide is that a given household often has both. So if one gets infected the other probably does too. | 02:11 |
| sookie | LjL: true | 02:11 |
| PlanckWalk | But yes, it does reduce density and is easier to enforce | 02:11 |
| LjL | i guess | 02:12 |
| PlanckWalk | Easier to enforce than something like splitting by surnames | 02:12 |
| sookie | i still think i prefer to be out in the sun than at night, even taking into account the different amounts of people out | 02:13 |
| dunnp | are you in a big city sookie? | 02:13 |
| dzho | age segregation makes sense, given the differences in outcomes by age | 02:13 |
| sookie | the different dhs found in half-life in aerosol between no sun and sun was 2 hours vs 2 minutes | 02:13 |
| LjL | sookie, well yeah although i'm a bit of a night owl, but yeah i recognize it would be better, but i *have* been out in the sun today, to go to the pharmacy, wearing a mask... i don't know how SE Asians can just do it every day like it's nothing, but masks are hell. | 02:13 |
| dzho | I've been seeing that in people's behavior: younger folk seem less cautious and older folk more so. By, like, a lot. | 02:14 |
| dunnp | 2 minutes? I dono where is that from? | 02:14 |
| sookie | dhs report | 02:14 |
| PlanckWalk | I wish that in my family the old were more cautious :( | 02:15 |
| dzho | young families visiting each other, no masks. older folks out walking wearing masks even when walking alone and pretty much able to maintain safe distance from strangers. | 02:15 |
| dunnp | ah half-life | 02:15 |
| LjL | i'd say the majority of the people outside today (which were not few, at all) wore masks, but some of the ones not wearing them were group of younger people | 02:16 |
| dunnp | thats good to know | 02:16 |
| sookie | i don't have the link handy but i can find it if you really want it | 02:16 |
| dunnp | found it | 02:16 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: i think being old isn't enough. are they old and healthy? if so, they'd probably do fine. | 02:17 |
| ubLXI | anyone know off the top of their head whether DSMB stopped the ACTT (NIAID) remdesivir study? | 02:17 |
| sookie | i mean, yeah, even if you're healthy, if you're old you should take care. but i think the ones that end up dying have some chronic and serious co-morbidity | 02:17 |
| dzho | a lot do, some are inexplicable. | 02:18 |
| LjL | like "high blood pressure" | 02:18 |
| LjL | which is the get-out-of-jail-free card our health institute uses to say only 12% of those dead "with" coronavirus died "from" coronavirus | 02:18 |
| sookie | on that... | 02:18 |
| PlanckWalk | There are multiple 80+ who take only the minimum legally mandated precautions. | 02:18 |
| sookie | do we know if it's people with uncontrolled high blood pressure? | 02:18 |
| sookie | or also people with hbp who have it under control from drugs? | 02:19 |
| LjL | i don't, honestly, i'd like to know more about what they mean exactly | 02:19 |
| PlanckWalk | Still go into supermarkets at crowded times without masks, etc. | 02:19 |
| LjL | but i also have some doubt the health institute has the resources to examine each file in detail | 02:19 |
| LjL | sookie, the thing that just make alarm bells ring for me, as to italy specifically at least, was the exact wording they used. it was like: 12% have died from the coronavirus, while 88% had other comorbidities. it didn't say "while 88% died from other comorbidities". very subtle way to not-lie | 02:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 00:08 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Victoria records 17 new cases and NSW nine – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 02:21 |
| PlanckWalk | I'm pretty sure that 90%+ of deaths "with coronavirus" are cases in which COVID played a very large role in their death. | 02:23 |
| sookie | i agree, i think that's what they mean | 02:24 |
| sookie | that people had some serious health condition but it was the acute covid situation which ultimately precipated the death | 02:24 |
| dzho | and with this coagulation involvement I suspect there are sudden-onset deaths that haven't been considered COVID due to not having the usual respiratory presentationa nd lead up | 02:25 |
| sookie | it's a bit noisy, you get a bit of under-reporting and probably some over-reporting. but overall, the death counts are probably assigned properly (in terms of cause) | 02:26 |
| PlanckWalk | Even a death by drowning could be brought on by COVID if someone can't get the oxygen they need to swim to safety. | 02:26 |
| sookie | well that's stretching it a bit | 02:27 |
| PlanckWalk | Yeah, was looking for a borderline case | 02:27 |
| sookie | you could also die from covid if you're walking down the street and get run-over by an ambulance taking a covid patient to the er | 02:27 |
| PlanckWalk | I brought up drowning because I read that a doctor actually wrote one up as COVID-related. Someone was using it as a supposedly clear-cut example of artificial COVID death inflation. | 02:29 |
| PlanckWalk | But it doesn't seem that far fetched to mem. | 02:29 |
| PlanckWalk | To me* | 02:29 |
| dzho | https://www.gresham.ac.uk/lectures-and-events/covid-19 <-- page 23 of the PDF has some figures and a reference for virus titer decay curves on different materials, which I figure is a good entry point if one is looking at decay more generally (eg, in sunlight) | 02:31 |
| dunnp | there are pretty clear increases in deaths compared to baseline even beyond covid attributed deaths | 02:31 |
| PlanckWalk | We already know that COVID is causing some people to pass out unexpectedly (and sometimes die even out of water). | 02:31 |
| dzho | what I was trying to find is this set of per-country curves, total deaths by month versus previous years. | 02:31 |
| dzho | the Financial Times published it I think. | 02:32 |
| PlanckWalk | Economist, I read | 02:32 |
| dunnp | here is US: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/28/us/coronavirus-death-toll-total.html | 02:32 |
| PlanckWalk | This one I think, but it has a paywall for me https://www.economist.com/graphic-detail/2020/04/16/tracking-covid-19-excess-deaths-across-countries | 02:33 |
| PlanckWalk | (~3 weeks ago) | 02:33 |
| dzho | https://www.ft.com/coronavirus-latest <-- no paywall for me (I have no privileged access) subheading "Death rates have climbed far about historical averages..." | 02:33 |
| dunnp | also many people over 65 have comorbidities - doesn't mean they should be dying any time soon | 02:33 |
| PlanckWalk | Right | 02:34 |
| dzho | https://www.ft.com/__origami/service/image/v2/images/raw/http%3A%2F%2Fcom.ft.imagepublish.upp-prod-us.s3.amazonaws.com%2F58bd3d8e-8be2-11ea-9dcb-fe6871f4145a?fit=scale-down&quality=highest&source=next&width=1260 | 02:34 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: Fauci warns against rush to reopen and asks 'how many deaths are you willing to accept?' (10014 votes) | https://redd.it/gdzgt6 | 02:35 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 00:27 UTC: Trump does not wear coronavirus mask at Honeywell factory that makes masks: President Donald Trump did not wear a mask as a coronavirus precaution during a visit Tuesday to a Honeywell factory in Arizona that is producing millions of N95 masks. → https://is.gd/2hAfHT | 02:35 |
| dunnp | I believe that sookie is pushing the narrative that these people are already sick and dying anyway so whats the point of protecting them when it really isn't so bad for the rest of us | 02:36 |
| sookie | i'm not pushing any narrative. thanks. | 02:39 |
| sookie | i am simply trying to assuage PlanckWalk's concerns about his elderly relative. chances are they'll be ok if they're healthy. | 02:40 |
| PlanckWalk | They're mobile, but certainly all have comorbidities | 02:41 |
| PlanckWalk | I don't know any people 80+ who don't have any comorbidities. | 02:41 |
| dzho | right. | 02:41 |
| LjL | ditto | 02:43 |
| PlanckWalk | Though yes, even for 80+ the fatality rate is <20% so they probably won't die if they catch it. | 02:44 |
| LjL | not a very strong "probably" then though | 02:44 |
| PlanckWalk | And the prevalence here is low enough that they very likely wont' catch it. | 02:44 |
| ryouma``` | i hope not --- 17:36 <dunnp> I believe that sookie is pushing the narrative that these people are already sick and dying anyway so whats the point of protecting them when it really isn't so bad for the rest of us | 02:46 |
| ryouma``` | however, he did say this --- <sookie> you don't do this for something that only kills fewer than 1 out of every 100. and usually that 1 had some severe co-morbidity that had them on the way out anyways. | 02:47 |
| ryouma``` | on [2020-05-03 Sun 19:47] | 02:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 00:42 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Victoria records 17 new cases and NSW nine – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 02:49 |
| ryouma``` | is there some correction that can be made for late testing, limited testing, various policies for testing that could create a heat map for bayesian posterior probability of infection? | 02:59 |
| ryouma``` | 'cause some us states for exmaple have only started barely testing | 02:59 |
| ryouma``` | better data would help decisions about whther to go to doctor or dentist for non-covid-rlated stff | 03:00 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 00:46 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 03:03 |
| Tramtrist | well you cant say trump is wrong about that.. death is inevitable | 03:04 |
| ryouma``` | what was the pioint of not wearing a mask? | 03:05 |
| ryouma``` | during the grandstandign thing | 03:05 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2356 cases (now 3.7 million), +319 deaths (now 258367) since an hour ago — Mexico: +1120 cases (now 26025), +236 deaths (now 2507) since 23 hours ago — US: +753 cases (now 1.2 million) since an hour ago | 03:06 |
| disillusion | https://www.theguardian.com/global-development/2020/may/06/vietnam-crushed-the-coronavirus-outbreak-but-now-faces-severe-economic-test | 03:17 |
| disillusion | "Vietnam didn’t just flatten its coronavirus curve, it crushed it. No deaths have been reported, official case numbers have plateaued at just 271, and no community transmissions of the virus have been reported in the last two weeks." | 03:17 |
| disillusion | yay communism! | 03:17 |
| sookie | PlanckWalk: in other words, yes, i would encourage everyone in your household to be as cautious as they can be. but in context, it would be terribly unlucky for one of them to die. the numbers are on your side. so i wouldn't spend nights awake in a panic. | 03:19 |
| sookie | be concerned but don't lose your mind | 03:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 01:19 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Andrew Constance pulls out of byelection as new cases reported – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 03:24 |
| sookie | as far as 80+ year olds having some comorbidity, yes. but the ones that are worrisome for covid seem to be 1) heart problems 2) diabetes 3) morbid obesity | 03:26 |
| trajanus[m] | A credible and disturbing take on COVID.. | 03:26 |
| trajanus[m] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nFPeN17PVU8 | 03:26 |
| LjL | "Reminder: This documentary is a reupload. I did not make this. Please share and download this video. it will most likely be deleted by youtube." | 03:34 |
| LjL | now i'm not the biggest fan of the WHO and i'm unsure about this policy of youtube's | 03:34 |
| LjL | but it does clash with your unqualified claim of "credible" | 03:35 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews at 01:33 UTC: worldnews: Austria Has 90% Drop in Coronavirus Cases After Requiring People to Wear Face Masks | Science Times → https://is.gd/0De3Ft | 03:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 01:49 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Andrew Constance pulls out of byelection as new cases reported – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 03:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 02:11 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 04:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 02:14 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: UK deaths highest in Europe as Trump looks to disband coronavirus task force → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 04:27 |
| ryouma``` | i see, so a task force in the us was disbanded, which caused uk deaths to be highest. got it. | 04:42 |
| MjrTom | The race is over guys - we in the USA are declaring ourselves the winner, and are going to a pub to celebrate | 04:51 |
| sookie | can't stay locked down forever | 04:53 |
| ryouma``` | MjrTom: in a few weeks we will be even more tired of winning | 04:54 |
| MjrTom | We will need a huge, nation wide group hug | 04:55 |
| ryouma``` | https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2020/04/13/please-mr-president-can-we-stop-winning-so-much/ | 04:55 |
| ryouma``` | i am really proud of the rest of the world for not hating on americans. they are mostly really sympathetic. | 04:56 |
| sookie | stop apologizing for america, that's so obama 2009 | 04:57 |
| sookie | anyways, the easing is a no-brainer really. if you are scared or worried and want to stay holed up at home, nothing keeps from continuing to do that. | 04:57 |
| ryouma``` | i was sincerely praising the rest of the world, not apologizing for anything | 04:57 |
| sookie | and those who wish to start living again can do that | 04:57 |
| sookie | uh hih | 04:58 |
| sookie | praising them for not hating on america, which is a way to diss america | 04:58 |
| ryouma``` | let's not argue | 04:58 |
| ryouma``` | it isn't | 05:00 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 03:00 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 05:02 |
| MjrTom | I'm totally prepared to watch the world around me burn down. If everybody else is lucky enough, maybe it won't even be so bad for them, somehow | 05:04 |
| sookie | heh. yeah, a disease where 99%+ who get it survive is gonna burn it all down | 05:05 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2064 cases (now 3.7 million), +67 deaths (now 258434) since 2 hours ago — Brazil: +1238 cases (now 115953) since 4 hours ago — Quebec, Canada: +794 cases (now 33425), +118 deaths (now 2399) since a day ago | 05:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 03:05 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Victoria records 17 new cases and NSW nine – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 05:16 |
| MjrTom | The world death count is currently at about 43% of "a bad flu year" - an article I came across that was written about a year ago said about 600k die to the flu in a bad year | 05:17 |
| PlanckWalk | Heh, that brings to mind an earlier conversation I had about ascribing causes of death :) | 05:25 |
| sookie | the US has about 60K deaths in a bad flu year and it represents 4% of world population. | 05:26 |
| PlanckWalk | Since most deaths "of flu" are bacterial pneumonia secondary to a weakened immune system from flu. | 05:26 |
| sookie | if we assume every other country has the same us death rate that would mean 1.4 million in a bad year | 05:27 |
| sookie | so for it to be 600k in a bad year, that means the rest of the world has a lower flu mortality rate than the us | 05:27 |
| PlanckWalk | But yeah, we coudl lump influenza and other pneumonias together | 05:27 |
| sookie | i'm not sure those numbers make sense to me, but maybe they do. | 05:29 |
| PlanckWalk | It depends greatly upon ascribing causes of death | 05:29 |
| sookie | that's probably true. so you think the real death rates are quite constant across countries? | 05:30 |
| PlanckWalk | CDC ascribes a greater proportion of deaths to influenza than most other places, and it's much more difficult to separate them out than for (e.g. COVID) | 05:30 |
| sookie | yeah, these data are so hard to compare across countries. what a numerical nightmare. | 05:32 |
| PlanckWalk | Australia does much the same as the US, lumping "influenza and pneumonia" together in cause of death summaries. | 05:34 |
| PlanckWalk | They do have different codes if you drill deep enough, but then you're dealing with all sorts of corner cases and such :( | 05:35 |
| PlanckWalk | In short, a lot of influenza-related death figures are estimates based on assumptions. | 05:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 03:39 UTC: Ordinary investors warned as hundreds of millions lost on volatile Australian stock market: Corporate watchdog says retail traders have been spectacularly bad at correctly picking the huge stock price fluctuations during coronavirus → https://is.gd/CxNsmD | 05:44 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: Texas Gov. Greg Abbott Caught on Recording Saying Reopening Will Increase Spread of Coronavirus (10082 votes) | https://redd.it/ge51mp | 05:45 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 03:51 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: Victoria records 17 new cases and NSW nine – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 05:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 04:12 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 06:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 04:23 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: UK deaths highest in Europe as Trump looks to disband coronavirus task force → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 06:34 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 04:45 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 06:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 04:54 UTC: Ruby Princess: Ruby Princess inquiry hears patient taken 'directly to Covid-designated area' at hospital → https://is.gd/WJXdx7 | 07:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 05:17 UTC: The patients who just can't shake off Covid-19: Most patients recover from Covid-19 quickly - but for some, symptoms linger for weeks. → https://is.gd/KYSP9Y | 07:23 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 05:27 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Global cases top 3.6 million, Trump says more deaths inevitable → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 07:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:30 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: UK deaths highest in Europe as Trump looks to disband coronavirus task force → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 07:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:42 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: government admits problems with Covidsafe app on iPhones – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 07:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 06:15 UTC: Singapore is not yet halfway through its coronavirus outbreak, says minister: Migrant workers living dormitories have accounted for around 87.6% of Singapore's total 19,410 confirmed cases as of Tuesday, according to the health ministry. → https://is.gd/avTJK2 | 08:19 |
| Butterfly^ | https://www.thenewstribune.com/news/coronavirus/article242512651.html Intentional coronavirus infection ‘parties’ reported in Eastern Washington county | 08:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 06:30 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: government admits problems with Covidsafe app on iPhones – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 08:40 |
| sookie | Speaking of the models. Remember the Imperial College model that predicted 2.2 million deaths in the US *with mitigation* that got the whole world in panic? | 08:49 |
| sookie | its primary scientist just resigned. for breaking uk lockdown rules to have sex with his lover. he had previously been diagnosed with covid. | 08:50 |
| sookie | https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/05/05/exclusive-government-scientist-neil-ferguson-resigns-breaking/ | 08:50 |
| sookie | his lover is married, with a husband and children. so ferguson potentially put a whole family at risk. | 08:51 |
| _abc_ | New? virus test promises responses in one hour. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-8290435/New-coronavirus-test-uses-CRISPR-gene-editing-detect-virus.html | 08:55 |
| _abc_ | Is there any explanation for what caused Italy to have two peaks of cases while most other countries had only one peak over the last 4 months? | 09:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:01 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: New Zealand reports one new case as Trump looks to disband Covid-19 taskforce → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 09:08 |
| sookie | i only see one peak for italy (around march 21) then a downhill trajectory that follows a sawtooth that is probably due to weekday vs weekend reporting | 09:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 07:03 UTC: 'Social bubbles' allow you to see friends as coronavirus lockdowns ease — but they might not work: Extending social contact to small groups outside our own households has been suggested as a way to get out of lockdowns but experts question how practical this strategy is to implement. → https://is.gd/DSFeCs | 09:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:20 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: New Zealand reports one new case as Trump looks to disband Covid-19 taskforce → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 09:22 |
| PlanckWalk | I see only one peak too. But it wouldn't be very surprising anyway, since there was a lockdown for Lombardy and then quite a bit later, a lockdown for the whole country. | 09:22 |
| sookie | weird story that is sure to fuel conspiracies: https://pittsburgh.cbslocal.com/2020/05/04/ross-township-apparent-murder-suicide/ | 09:25 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2222 cases (now 3.7 million), +57 deaths (now 258491) since 4 hours ago — Singapore: +788 cases (now 20198) since a day ago — Ukraine: +487 cases (now 13184) since a day ago | 09:39 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:34 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: Trump wants to disband Covid-19 taskforce; Germany looks to reopen shops and restart amateur sport → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 09:43 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +10559 cases (now 3.7 million), +86 deaths (now 258577) since 22 minutes ago — Russia: +10559 cases (now 165929), +86 deaths (now 1537) since 23 hours ago — Dem. Rep. Congo: +92 cases (now 797) since 10 hours ago | 09:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:50 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: aged care regulator threatens to shut down Newmarch House – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 09:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 08:38 UTC: Eurozone: Germany suffers record slump in factory orders amid Covid-19 lockdown - business live → https://is.gd/N4QJbn | 10:46 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test) at 08:47 UTC: Social Distancing PPE suit Covid-19: submitted by /u/magikalderbyshire60 to r/CoronaVirusInfo → https://is.gd/9yJNdV | 10:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 08:55 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: aged care regulator threatens to shut down Newmarch House – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 11:00 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 09:10 UTC: Eurozone: UK builders suffer worst slump on record amid Covid-19 lockdown - business live → https://is.gd/N4QJbn | 11:21 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2002 cases (now 3.7 million), +359 deaths (now 258936) since an hour ago — Bangladesh: +790 cases (now 11719) since a day ago — Belgium: +272 cases (now 50781), +323 deaths (now 8339) since a day ago | 11:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 09:25 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: aged care regulator threatens to shut down Newmarch House – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 11:35 |
| Brainstorm | New from BMJ at 09:32 UTC: Love in the time of coronavirus: John Berger’s 1995 novel To the Wedding1 was written in response to the horrors of the AIDS epidemic, which had a much higher fatality rate than covid-19 and an age profile affecting children and... → https://is.gd/LvLJve | 11:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 09:41 UTC: Coronavirus: How does contact tracing work and is my data safe?: Millions in the UK will soon be asked to download an app that helps to limit coronavirus spreading. → https://is.gd/KGOiZI | 11:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 09:44 UTC: Economic reforms prepared Egypt for the coronavirus crisis, minister says: The global pandemic would have been more difficult for Egypt if not for comprehensive reforms on taxes, budgets and foreign exchange that the country undertook, said Rania al-Mashat, minister for international cooperation. → https://is.gd/eeuuZf | 11:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 09:51 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus Australia updates live: more deaths expected at Newmarch House, minister says – latest news → https://is.gd/bnytbI | 12:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 10:14 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Trump wants to disband Covid-19 taskforce; Germany looks to reopen shops and restart amateur sport: President says it’s time to reopen businesses as US deaths top 70,000; number of Russian cases rises by more than 10,000 for fourth consecutive day; Spain set to extend state of emergency for [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 12:24 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2180 cases (now 3.7 million) since an hour ago — Belarus: +905 cases (now 19255) since 20 hours ago — Indonesia: +367 cases (now 12438) since a day ago | 12:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 10:25 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Prof Neil Ferguson quits government role after 'undermining' lockdown → https://is.gd/M949xt | 12:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 10:29 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: UK coronavirus live: Matt Hancock 'speechless' at Neil Ferguson breaking lockdown; Rory Stewart ends London mayoral campaign → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 12:38 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2510 cases (now 3.8 million), +78 deaths (now 259058) since 24 minutes ago — Iran: +1680 cases (now 101650), +78 deaths (now 6418) since a day ago — Qatar: +830 cases (now 17972) since 22 hours ago | 12:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 11:01 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Trump wants to disband Covid-19 taskforce; Germany looks to reopen shops and restart amateur sport: President says it’s time to reopen businesses as US deaths top 70,000; number of Russian cases rises by more than 10,000 for fourth consecutive day; Spain set to extend state of emergency for [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 13:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 11:14 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Spain's daily death toll rises again; EU to see sharp economic decline → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 13:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 11:18 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Prof Neil Ferguson quits government role after 'undermining' lockdown → https://is.gd/M949xt | 13:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 11:27 UTC: Spain's daily death toll rises again; EU to see sharp economic decline: Johns Hopkins University data showed over 3.65 million people have now been infected with the coronavirus and more than 256,800 have died. → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 13:34 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 11:37 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Prof Neil Ferguson quits government role after 'undermining' lockdown → https://is.gd/M949xt | 13:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test) at 11:46 UTC: Covid2019: The Seismic Response In The UK To The COVID-19 Lockdown → https://is.gd/Eww1xo | 13:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:00 UTC: Spain's daily death toll rises again; EU to see sharp economic decline: Johns Hopkins University data showed over 3.65 million people have now been infected with the coronavirus and more than 256,800 have died. → https://is.gd/Ql4fit | 14:02 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +3928 cases (now 3.8 million), +306 deaths (now 259364) since an hour ago — Spain: +3121 cases (now 253682), +244 deaths (now 25857) since 23 hours ago — Brazil: +346 cases (now 116299) since 9 hours ago | 14:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:04 UTC: Trump does not wear coronavirus mask at Honeywell factory that makes masks: President Donald Trump did not wear a mask as a coronavirus precaution during a visit Tuesday to a Honeywell factory in Arizona that is producing millions of N95 masks. → https://is.gd/2hAfHT | 14:09 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: Native American health center asked for COVID-19 supplies. It got body bags instead. (10106 votes) | https://redd.it/gebigv | 14:23 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 12:21 UTC: UK coronavirus live: Boris Johnson says he wants some lockdown easing to come into force from Monday: Keir Starmer challenges Johnson over extent of UK death toll; PM makes new pledge of 200,000 Covid-19 tests a day by end of May; Matt Hancock ‘speechless’ at Neil Ferguson breaking lockdown rules → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 14:23 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: Reopened restaurant workers in Dallas were told: Don't wear face masks — or don't work. (10014 votes) | https://redd.it/ge2vj7 | 14:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:26 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: US food industry shows promise of rebound, Germany sets path to reopening → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 14:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:41 UTC: (news): Millions of people are expected to fall ill with tuberculosis due to coronavirus lockdown → https://is.gd/WWSuER | 14:44 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2486 cases (now 3.8 million), +113 deaths (now 259477) since 46 minutes ago — Sweden: +702 cases (now 23918), +87 deaths (now 2941) since a day ago — Kuwait: +485 cases (now 6289) since a day ago | 14:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 12:47 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Prof Neil Ferguson quits government role after 'undermining' lockdown → https://is.gd/M949xt | 14:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 12:49 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Iran warns of 'rising trend' as virus cases top 100,000: China’s UN envoy says world must beat pandemic before investigating source; Trump wants to disband Covid-19 taskforce as deaths top 70,000; number of Russian cases rises by more than 10,000 for fourth consecutive day → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 14:58 |
| Jigsy | %cases UK | 15:08 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 194990 total cases (0.3% of the population) and 29427 deaths (15.1% of cases) as of 10 hours ago. 1.4 million tests were performed (14.1% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 15:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 13:05 UTC: UK coronavirus live: Boris Johnson says he wants some lockdown easing to come into force from Monday: Keir Starmer challenges Johnson over extent of UK death toll; PM makes new pledge of 200,000 Covid-19 tests a day by end of May; Matt Hancock ‘speechless’ at Neil Ferguson breaking lockdown rules → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 15:12 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2024 cases (now 3.8 million) since 33 minutes ago — Saudi Arabia: +1687 cases (now 31938) since 23 hours ago — Bahrain: +122 cases (now 3842) since 17 hours ago | 15:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 13:18 UTC: US coronavirus live: Trump's move to disband taskforce provokes outrage – live: New cases of Covid-19 rising steeply in Minnesota, Nebraska and Puerto Rico as government focuses on reopening economy → https://is.gd/xkboWX | 15:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 13:34 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Prof Neil Ferguson quits government role after 'undermining' lockdown → https://is.gd/M949xt | 15:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 13:38 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Virus fears dip in swing states, Americans head back to Wendy's → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 15:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 14:08 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Iran cases top 100,000; German top-flight football set to resume: Donald Trump backtracks on threat to wind down Covid-19 taskforce; China’s UN envoy says world must beat pandemic before investigating source; Russian cases up by over 10,000 again → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 16:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:18 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Virus fears dip in swing states, Americans head back to Wendy's → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 16:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 14:24 UTC: UK coronavirus live: No 10 scales down scope of PM's new '200,000 tests per day' target: PM says some lockdown easing to come on Monday; Scotland to lift restrictions ‘as soon as possible’ as deaths fall for first time since crisis began → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 16:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:39 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Record private payrolls lost in April, and Friday's jobs report may be 'worst ever' → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 16:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 14:40 UTC: Nuffield Southampton Theatres goes into administration: Company suffers from the severe drop in ticket sales during the pandemic and uncertainty about a reopening date → https://is.gd/Wfh4in | 16:50 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +3291 cases (now 3.8 million), +182 deaths (now 259679) since an hour ago — US: +1863 cases (now 1.2 million), +156 deaths (now 72449) since an hour ago — Maryland, US: +1046 cases (now 28163) since 23 hours ago | 16:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 14:50 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: Boris Johnson aims for 200,000 tests by end of May → https://is.gd/YLAKtw | 16:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:58 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Record private payrolls lost in April, and Friday's jobs report may be 'worst ever' → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 17:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 15:10 UTC: UK coronavirus live: No 10 scales down scope of PM's new '200,000 tests per day' target: PM says some lockdown easing to come on Monday; Scotland to lift restrictions ‘as soon as possible’ as deaths fall for first time since crisis began → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 17:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:21 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Record private payrolls lost in April, and Friday's jobs report may be 'worst ever' → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 17:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:27 UTC: Watch live: New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo holds a press conference on the coronavirus outbreak: New York Gov. Andrew Cuomo is holding his daily press conference on the Covid-19 outbreak, which has infected more than 321,100 people across the state as of Wednesday. → https://is.gd/kF3A3B | 17:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 15:44 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Natasha Bertrand su Twitter: "Tapes of calls of FEMA and HHS officials across the country, obtained by POLITICO, reveal widespread worries about new waves of Covid-19 infections. “The number of deaths definitely will be high,” the director of the CDC’s influenza division said on May 1. https://t.co/ukcewnm8cS" → https://is.gd/E3cifN | 17:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:54 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Pandemic threatens US dairy farms, record private payrolls lost in April → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 18:01 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +6644 cases (now 3.8 million), +794 deaths (now 260473) since an hour ago — India: +2488 cases (now 52340), +64 deaths (now 1768) since an hour ago — US: +1856 cases (now 1.2 million), +318 deaths (now 72767) since an hour ago | 18:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:04 UTC: (news): WHO says 'there can be no going back to business as usual' after coronavirus pandemic → https://is.gd/x3FpC1 | 18:08 |
| LjL | bad news today for italy | 18:12 |
| LjL | more cases, more deaths | 18:12 |
| LjL | a TON of new recoveries but that's just evidence it doesn't mean anything | 18:12 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +8604 cases (now 3.8 million), +720 deaths (now 261193) since 18 minutes ago — United Kingdom: +6111 cases (now 201101), +649 deaths (now 30076) since a day ago — Turkey: +2253 cases (now 131744), +64 deaths (now 3584) since a day ago | 18:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:23 UTC: (news): Ford and 3M begin shipping respirators to front-line health workers fighting coronavirus pandemic → https://is.gd/dkdV62 | 18:29 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +2259 cases (now 3.8 million), +77 deaths (now 261270) since 19 minutes ago — US: +1195 cases (now 1.2 million), +68 deaths (now 72835) since 19 minutes ago — Chile: +1032 cases (now 23048) since a day ago | 18:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:37 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Pandemic threatens US dairy farms, record private payrolls lost in April → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 18:43 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: New bill would forgive medical school debt for COVID-19 health workers (10932 votes) | https://redd.it/gekfoz | 18:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 16:45 UTC: UK coronavirus live: official death toll rises to 30,076 as 649 more people die: Robert Jenrick holds daily briefing as daily number of tests stands at 69,463; PM says some lockdown easing to come on Monday → https://is.gd/WRfELw | 18:50 |
| _abc_ | This new here? Sorry about the source, could not find a better one for today. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8291755/Did-European-athletes-catch-coronavirus-competing-World-Military-Games-Wuhan-OCTOBER.html | 18:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 16:52 UTC: /u/slakmehl: What Is the Real Coronavirus Toll in Each State? - The New York Times → https://is.gd/DcoVik | 18:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:58 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: WHO says risk of returning to lockdown 'remains very real' if social distancing is eased too soon → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 19:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:18 UTC: (news): Cuomo says it's 'shocking' most new coronavirus hospitalizations are people who had been staying home → https://is.gd/XroBeB | 19:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:32 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: WHO says risk of returning to lockdown 'remains very real' if social distancing is eased too soon → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 19:39 |
| dzho | why does Brainstorm not report numbers for deaths for New York? It seems to for other states. | 19:41 |
| LjL | dzho, i'd have to look into it, but the logic in general is that whenever any place (often "World") happens to have more than +2000 new cases, it reports that *and* the other 3 biggest changes (it's limited to 3 in this channel at least). deaths are reported together with cases, but if either cases or death are less than +50, they aren't reported | 19:47 |
| LjL | i had reasons for doing it like this, not sure they make sense to you... i can certainly change the logic if there's a good argument for it or if the way the numbers evolve are just changing (that 2000 limited used to be 500 a now-long time ago) | 19:47 |
| LjL | %cases ny | 19:48 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Kenya, there are 582 total cases (0.0% of the population) and 26 deaths (4.5% of cases) as of 15 minutes ago. 25861 tests were performed (2.3% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.5% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ undetected), and less than 12.0% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Kenya for time series data. | 19:48 |
| LjL | well, i should definitely also fix this thing *sigh* | 19:48 |
| LjL | %case new york | 19:48 |
| LjL | %cases new york | 19:48 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In New York, US, there are 330139 total cases (1.7% of the population) and 25436 deaths (7.7% of cases) as of 15 minutes ago. 1.0 million tests were performed (32.1% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=New%20York for time series data. | 19:48 |
| dzho | I mean instead of this: | 19:50 |
| dzho | 14:51 <@Brainstorm> World: +3291 cases (now 3.8 million), +182 deaths (now 259679) since an hour ago 🔹 US: +1863 cases (now 1.2 million), +156 deaths (now 72449) since an hour ago 🔹 Maryland, US: +1046 cases (now 28163) since 23 hours ago | 19:50 |
| dzho | I see this only for New York: | 19:51 |
| dzho | World: +3902 cases (now 3.7 million), +81 deaths (now 255271) since an hour ago 🔹 US: +3183 cases (now 1.2 million) since an hour ago 🔹 New York, US: +2442 cases (now 329816) since an hour ago | 19:51 |
| dzho | so it shows cases, but not deaths. | 19:51 |
| dzho | huh, I don't think NY deaths have dropped that low | 19:51 |
| danielp3344 | So I decided I really wanted fast food today. | 19:51 |
| dzho | but maybe they are reporting often enough that they delta is that small I guess? | 19:52 |
| danielp3344 | But every #### place in town had a drive thru line wrapped 3x around the building | 19:52 |
| danielp3344 | What | 19:52 |
| danielp3344 | What's with that?* | 19:52 |
| dzho | where? | 19:52 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +4011 cases (now 3.8 million), +529 deaths (now 261799) since an hour ago — US: +2317 cases (now 1.2 million), +310 deaths (now 73145) since an hour ago — Canada: +1329 cases (now 63375), +180 deaths (now 4223) since 16 hours ago | 19:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 17:50 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: UK becomes first country in Europe to pass 30,000 deaths → https://is.gd/r6biai | 19:53 |
| danielp3344 | dzho: where am I? | 19:54 |
| danielp3344 | or was that to someone else | 19:54 |
| dzho | danielp3344: yeah | 19:54 |
| danielp3344 | dzho: near bel air, MD | 19:54 |
| dzho | yikes | 19:54 |
| dzho | not a "we're all opened up now go ahead" state | 19:55 |
| danielp3344 | yeah exactly | 19:56 |
| pyna | we're opening US the same way we promote people to the next grade in public school | 20:00 |
| dzho | social promotion | 20:01 |
| pyna | in both cases it's mainly to get them off the books so metrics don't look as bad | 20:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:59 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: WHO warns of return to lockdown, NY sees homebound falling sick → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 20:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:11 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: NY sees homebound falling sick, WHO warns of return to lockdown → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 20:14 |
| dzho | yeah, what's up with that? 66% were staying home, they say. | 20:15 |
| LjL | dzho, yes it may be a matter of reporting speed and deltas. i will see if it's in my logs | 20:15 |
| dzho | oh right | 20:15 |
| dzho | so are these people being infected through others in the household acting as carriers? through deliveries? through something they were doing when they did go out? | 20:16 |
| LjL | dzho, nope, stupidly enough, i am currently logging all the data, but without the placename to go with them. how smart of me | 20:16 |
| LjL | well... 2442 cases, so let's see | 20:16 |
| dzho | sorry I'm looking at that last CNBC article | 20:16 |
| dzho | LjL: ah, glad you found something that could be sorted out, even if only going forward. | 20:17 |
| pyna | nice, the (cumulative) deaths from C19 went down by one between sun and mon from this datasource | 20:20 |
| LjL | dzho, well i'm utterly confused, since even if i search for the new york *numbers* in my logs, i don't see them. i have no idea, they should be there. but anyway, i've changed it so that the logs will contain the location, which means if it happens again maybe i'll have more info, and also i've reduced the minimum from 50 to 10 | 20:21 |
| pyna | we might have a resurrection/2nd coming | 20:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:16 UTC: (news): WHO says 'there can be no going back to business as usual' after coronavirus pandemic → https://is.gd/x3FpC1 | 20:21 |
| dzho | LjL: ok, thanks. We'll see how it goes. | 20:21 |
| pyna | sure we can go back to business as usual, as long as "accepting the tragedy, cruelty, and cancerous inequlality of unregulated capitalism" | 20:26 |
| pyna | is that business | 20:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:25 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: NY sees homebound falling sick, WHO warns of return to lockdown → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 20:28 |
| LjL | %cases ny | 20:38 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In New York, US, there are 330139 total cases (1.7% of the population) and 25436 deaths (7.7% of cases) as of 4 minutes ago. 1.0 million tests were performed (32.1% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 20:38 |
| LjL | at least i've made this work again \o/ for now | 20:38 |
| ubLXI | pyna: on your last point, here is a tragicomic effort (i think any comedy found is unintentional) to speak truth to power: https://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2020/05/people-and-jobs-or-wealth-the-government-has-to-decide-which-to-prioritise-and-there-is-only-one-right-answer.html | 20:47 |
| ubLXI | (long read) | 20:47 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +4351 cases (now 3.8 million), +475 deaths (now 262472) since 36 minutes ago — France: +3640 cases (now 174191), +278 deaths (now 25809) since a day ago — India: +428 cases (now 52987) since 36 minutes ago | 20:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:52 UTC: (news): Cuomo says it's 'shocking' most new coronavirus hospitalizations are people who had been staying home → https://is.gd/XroBeB | 20:56 |
| LjL | trajanus[m], no random memes please... | 20:59 |
| pyna | it's definitely funny how USians begrudge the human cost of communism, but are perfectly happy to pay serious human costs rather than regulate capitilism even slightly | 21:04 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | blind pursuit of an ideology. | 21:05 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | good times. | 21:05 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +5743 cases (now 3.8 million), +263 deaths (now 262735) since 18 minutes ago — US: +5742 cases (now 1.3 million), +263 deaths (now 73497) since 51 minutes ago — New York, US: +3355 cases (now 333494) since 3 hours ago | 21:08 |
| LjL | urrr | 21:08 |
| LjL | dzho, okay, in this case for instance i can confirm that the death count simply didn't change since last time | 21:09 |
| LjL | it's likely that new cases are reported more often than deaths | 21:09 |
| azy | https://preview.redd.it/dm45ok6sk5x41.jpg?width=640&crop=smart&auto=webp&s=76127a2cb85dd335ba234c48b37a7e117244ad33 | 21:09 |
| azy | gang | 21:09 |
| LjL | azy, that's not much higher up than the random memes i just asked not to post :\ | 21:10 |
| azy | fuck your authoritah | 21:10 |
| Tramtrist | did you guys see 90% of NYC cases were "home" ?? | 21:10 |
| Tramtrist | I didnt understand that at all | 21:10 |
| LjL | azy, suit yourself | 21:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 18:58 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: pandemic threatens future of eurozone; Spain extends state of emergency again → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 21:10 |
| Tramtrist | 90% of the NYC hospitalized cases | 21:10 |
| LjL | Tramtrist, "home" as in infected at home? | 21:11 |
| Raf[m] | probably WFH but going out to parks, etc and shopping contracting the disease | 21:11 |
| ubLXI | pyna: one of the commenters at the end links a view of communism that characterises the 1% as enjoying "a communism for the few" - https://bgladd.blogspot.com/2019/07/quadrant-iv-hierarchy-scarcity.html - haven't read but looks like going in an even more bleaker direction than my original post | 21:11 |
| Tramtrist | yeah thats my question too | 21:11 |
| Tramtrist | i believe it means they were teleworking etc.. and got infected while at home | 21:11 |
| Tramtrist | which makes no sense to me | 21:12 |
| ubLXI | well if they're locked indoors, where else would they get infected? | 21:13 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | your house isn't airtight. | 21:13 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | if it is, you'd be dead. | 21:13 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | you probably don't live in a positive-pressure cleanroom. | 21:13 |
| LjL | Tramtrist, hm yeah i don't know what to think about that article. the text, and what Cuomo said, suggests these people were "literally sheltering at home", but then the graph doesn't include things like "Going for walks", or "Going to supermarkets". and how many people simply replied they were sheltering at home because they were ashamed of replying they actually ignored the recommendations to stay at home? | 21:14 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | Tramtrist: considering that 60% of coronavirus cases don't present any symptoms, and of the ones that do, a majority are only minor, i wouldn't be surprised that 90% of people infected with coronavirus self-quarantine at home. | 21:15 |
| LjL | NoImNotNineVolt, based on the evidence we have so far it's very unlikely that the virus would just come into our homes through the wind or something | 21:15 |
| ubLXI | i was more thinking that lock down implies large numbers of people collected indoors in multi-occupancy households, and that any-cause introduction of infection runs the risk of that infection spreading to every member of the household whether all of them went outside or not | 21:15 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | LjL: i agree. | 21:15 |
| Tramtrist | ya i dont know what to make of any of it | 21:15 |
| LjL | ubLXI, yes, but 90% is a high number | 21:15 |
| LjL | ubLXI, do households typically have 10ish people? although my intuitive-maths may be wrong on thinking that would be required? | 21:16 |
| Tramtrist | basically .. the way i read it.. if you're at home you can get infected .. just by staying home! | 21:16 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | LjL: the recommendation was to stay at home but also to go outside for exercise while keepining a distance and wearing a face covering when practical. | 21:16 |
| ubLXI | i didn't read whatever article you're referencing, so i bow out | 21:16 |
| stinkpot | ljl is rental income considered unearned income ? | 21:16 |
| LjL | Tramtrist, yeah except it also says "a majority of the cases in New York City are minorities". now those people aren't going to be at home *all the time*, they are even more likely than wealthier people to go to supermarkets and other shops, repeatedly | 21:16 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i think the article being discussed is: https://www.cnbc.com/2020/05/06/ny-gov-cuomo-says-its-shocking-most-new-coronavirus-hospitalizations-are-people-staying-home.html | 21:17 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | the very first sentence reads "Most new Covid-19 hospitalizations in New York state are from people who were staying home and not venturing much outside, a “shocking” finding, Gov. Andrew Cuomo said Wednesday." | 21:17 |
| LjL | stinkpot, i... have no idea? | 21:17 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | the operative part being "and not venturing much outside" | 21:17 |
| stinkpot | i'm sorry | 21:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 19:13 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: NY sees homebound falling sick, WHO warns of return to lockdown → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 21:17 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | implying that they may have been venturing outside less than "much". | 21:17 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i think the most reasonable interpretation is that they haven't been going to work, but they've been leaving the house when necessary. | 21:18 |
| LjL | NoImNotNineVolt, yeah i feel that maybe the terms in the statistics were changed a bit until they reached Cuomo's mouth in an inaccurate way. i'd like to see whatever paper they come from, if there's one | 21:18 |
| stinkpot | NoImNotNineVolt: does it imply they caught it at the grocery store? | 21:18 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | stinkpot: or from checking their mail, or from buying a newspaper, or from chatting with a neighbor, or from any other possible place. | 21:19 |
| LjL | i don't know if it implies that but i consider grocery stores, supermarkets etc extremely high-risk places personally | 21:19 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | also, if we read the article, they cite a chart showing 66% of people were admitted from home. | 21:19 |
| stinkpot | most people who rarely go out only go out to get groceries or to mail a box | 21:19 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | as opposed to a nursing home, jail, assisted living facility, etc. | 21:19 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | you wouldn't get admitted from a grocery store. | 21:19 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | you'd come home and then call an ambulance :P | 21:20 |
| stinkpot | the grocery store also happens to be the highest risk place at the moment | 21:20 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i think the highest risk place is the doctor's office or hospital. | 21:20 |
| Tramtrist | yeah i avoid grocery stores like the... ya | 21:20 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | dentists offices as well. | 21:20 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | dentists will have a horrible time with this. can't make the patient wear a mask if you've gotta be all up in their mouth. | 21:21 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | they need ppe no less than an anesthesiologist who's intubating covid patients for vents | 21:21 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | it's terrifying :\ | 21:21 |
| Tramtrist | praying for on toothaches | 21:22 |
| bjmoose | I vote Boats, Nursing Homes and Prisons, then hospitals | 21:23 |
| bjmoose | or as in most previous epidemics, Military Bases/Barracks | 21:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 19:19 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: New Jersey extends public health emergency, Texas and Georgia restaurants slow to reopen → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 21:24 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | ya, prisons are screwed too. | 21:25 |
| _abc_ | I think dentists can go to fully enclosed suits and just shower between patients or something like that. | 21:36 |
| _abc_ | That leaves the disinfection of the parlor which can be sorted relatively easily between patients. | 21:36 |
| bin_bash | fully enclosed suits? | 21:37 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | and relatively easily? | 21:38 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | relative to what?! :P | 21:38 |
| Raf[m] | after like 3 showers it's going to get old really fast | 21:38 |
| _abc_ | relatively to hoping that a face shield and mask will keep them healthy | 21:38 |
| pyna | got an email from my dentist about re-opening and they're doing a whole bunch of hazmat things. not competent to speak on effectiveness but it's definitely gonna be different | 21:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 19:34 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: UK becomes first country in Europe to pass 30,000 deaths → https://is.gd/r6biai | 21:38 |
| _abc_ | Raf[m]: no. Standard decontamination is a shower / spray down with disinfectant | 21:39 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | pyna: my wife is scheduled to be patient #1 at her oral surgeon's reopening next week. | 21:39 |
| _abc_ | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9gqRBB8QgJU for example | 21:39 |
| _abc_ | NoImNotNineVolt: #1 pays more since she can get corona only from the dentist. | 21:39 |
| _abc_ | The next ones can also get it from the previous customer. Kidding. 50% | 21:40 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | ha, it's free because it's a follow-up. | 21:40 |
| pyna | here's what dentist emailed http://ix.io/2l3O | 21:40 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | the procedure will be insane now. chaperones aren't allowed in, but staff will come down to get your signature, etc. | 21:40 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | compared to how these guys were able to operate before, there's nothing relatively easy about this. | 21:41 |
| pyna | definitely relevant cause i need some work done and me and my pastor need to decide when the risk is worth it | 21:41 |
| _abc_ | pyna: your pastor? Anyway thanks for posting that. | 21:42 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | pyna: my wife is opting for sooner, on the basis that we really don't know how bad it might get. | 21:42 |
| Butterfly^ | https://i.imgur.com/kXMaVnp.jpg | 21:42 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | the pandemic, i mean. | 21:42 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | better the devil you know than the devil you don't, etc. | 21:42 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | with the lifting of restrictions, we expect a rapid increase in incidence rates. get it in while you can! :P | 21:43 |
| pyna | sorry, i say me and my pastor to mock the pseudo-existentialist MAGA crew | 21:43 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | lol. | 21:45 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i'm a militant atheist but i've been trying to be less of an asshole so i just bit my tongue. | 21:46 |
| bin_bash | yikes | 21:47 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | hey at least i'm trying :P | 21:47 |
| pyna | it's fine, the definition of what "me and my pastor" means is a faith-based judgement between me and my pastor. so the fact that i've chosen "one of my cats" to be "my pastor" is none of anyone's business | 21:48 |
| _abc_ | You have a pastor imaginary friend? Cute. | 21:48 |
| pyna | nah i tend to respond to gaslighting by gaslighting back harder. it's not hard, especially if you're been unlucky enough to be raised by philosophers | 21:50 |
| pyna | err, i should say, it's reflexive | 21:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 19:45 UTC: Coronavirus US live: Pelosi attacks Trump's focus on reopening and says 'death is not an economic motivator': House speaker asks in interview ‘why are we going down that path?’ President reportedly questions accuracy of death toll Trump reverses course and says coronavirus taskforce will stay US begins to reopen [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/xkboWX | 21:53 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Illinois, US: +2270 cases (now 68232), +136 deaths (now 2974) since a day ago — Connecticut, US: +374 cases (now 30995), +85 deaths (now 2718) since 23 hours ago — Tennessee, US: +248 cases (now 13938), +13 deaths (now 239) since a day ago | 21:53 |
| pyna | my cat is not imaginary, but of course, whether to believe my unfalsifiable, self-sourced statement about the existence of at least one cat, that is mine, is a personal decision that only you and you pastor can make | 21:54 |
| pyna | the part that gets me in the email from my dentist is "a commercial molecular | 21:56 |
| pyna | iodine mouthrinse with potent antiviral properties" | 21:56 |
| pyna | feel like i should be hoarding this magical mouthwash already | 21:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 19:56 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: New Jersey extends public health emergency, Texas and Georgia restaurants slow to reopen → https://is.gd/xpEYGw | 22:00 |
| ubLXI | who was gaslighting you, pyna? | 22:02 |
| pyna | my pastor and i have suspicions about, let's just say, "some people" | 22:03 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +3988 cases (now 3.8 million), +112 deaths (now 263178) since 24 minutes ago — Peru: +3628 cases (now 54817), +89 deaths (now 1533) since a day ago — US: +360 cases (now 1.3 million), +23 deaths (now 73792) since 24 minutes ago | 22:08 |
| sookie | saying "me and my pastor" is actually self-ridicule with a sprinkle of lacking self-awareness. | 22:10 |
| sookie | dentists are bleeding money. they have to pay rent, pay employees, etc. so they have an incentive to re-open, even if that means possibly infecting patients. | 22:11 |
| sookie | there are tons of stories of people getting hiv at dental offices (improperly sterilized equipment) | 22:11 |
| sookie | i wouldn't go to a dentist right now unless i had an abscessed molar that was spreading to my brain. | 22:12 |
| Biep[m] | <LjL "i had reasons for doing it like "> Would a percentual threshold make more sense? The first case in any area would be very interesting, and so would any fast growth. | 22:12 |
| Biep[m] | BTW - good solution, rounding the large numbers to avoid addition offsets. | 22:13 |
| LjL | Biep[m], i've thought about that, i am not sure what i could make it. a fraction of the total? italy would end up never being listed anymore, probably | 22:13 |
| LjL | Biep[m], lazy solution, i already had a library called "humanize" imported for that sort of thing | 22:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 19:57 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Trump suggests more deaths necessary price to reopen economy: US president says ‘we have to be warriors’; while pandemic threatens future of eurozone; and Spain extends state of emergency again → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 22:14 |
| pyna | self-ridicule is a subset of all-riducule so I'll give you that, have to get back to you on the self-awareness part | 22:16 |
| pyna | im not making light of dentists | 22:17 |
| Biep[m] | <LjL "Biep, i've thought about that, i"> Hmm - are you sure that would be a valid reason to reject it? 🤔😉 | 22:18 |
| LjL | Biep[m], well, yeah :P my bot doesn't seek perfect harmony with the world, it seeks practicalities including being useful to me | 22:18 |
| Biep[m] | Of course, I see that side. Just joking. | 22:19 |
| Biep[m] | * Of course, I see that side. I was just joking. | 22:19 |
| LjL | Biep[m], i guess i could do *either* >2000 *or* >fraction. however small numbers would likely be swamped by the bigger ones anyway, since those will be shown first... although on the Matrix ticker room, there's enough space to show everything | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 20:00 UTC: Watch now: Healthy Returns - the path forward with Dr. Ali Khan, former CDC disease detective: As some regions flatten the curve and other hotspots flare up, where are we in the pandemic? What is our readiness to reopen? When and what can we expect from a second wave of Covid-19? Today on "Healthy Returns: The Path [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/qudMAZ | 22:21 |
| pyna | LjL: normalize for per-capita a bit? | 22:22 |
| LjL | hmm | 22:22 |
| LjL | i could change the display so that it lists in order of new cases per capita, and whether it shows something or not is determined by whether delta > previous / X | 22:23 |
| LjL | where X could be... 10? 100? i don't really know | 22:23 |
| LjL | %cases italy | 22:23 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 214457 total cases (0.4% of the population) and 29684 deaths (13.8% of cases) as of 6 minutes ago. 2.3 million tests were performed (9.3% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 22:23 |
| LjL | should be at least /200 or so, to show today's italy numbers | 22:24 |
| LjL | i'm just using this as a reference to get an idea, i'm not saying it HAS to be whatever makes italy show up | 22:24 |
| Biep[m] | Ideally, the X should itself be dynamic - depending on what has been happening in the past. A single new case after a long lull would be important. | 22:25 |
| _abc_ | Valid cosplay, may have some modern applications... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZF0LFxtu7A | 22:25 |
| Biep[m] | And there could be a command for general figures including some specified area.. | 22:26 |
| LjL | err | 22:27 |
| Biep[m] | So you could do `%in-context Italy`, and it would show all the big changes, plus the figures for Italy. | 22:27 |
| LjL | i don't really see the use of that... if i call %cases italy it gives me details and there isn't really space for more figures for other countries | 22:27 |
| Biep[m] | People could see how their region was doing compared to elsewhere. | 22:27 |
| LjL | also i don't actually have historical data | 22:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 20:12 UTC: Coronavirus US live: Pelosi attacks Trump's focus on reopening and says 'death is not an economic motivator': House speaker asks in interview ‘why are we going down that path?’ President reportedly questions accuracy of death toll Trump reverses course and says coronavirus taskforce will stay US begins to reopen [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/xkboWX | 22:28 |
| Biep[m] | Oh, that makes it harder. I guessed you mightn't, whence the "ideally". | 22:28 |
| LjL | well, compared to... what? i'll think about it, i could do some kind of ranking and show the two/four countries above and below in cases per capita | 22:28 |
| LjL | Biep[m], i could store *one* previous delta without changing too much the data structures i'm using, i think. if i do that i could prioritize showing things where today's case/death increment is higher than yesterday's | 22:30 |
| Biep[m] | Oh, don't do it for me! Just thinking of your mixed goals of showing the big events worldwide, but also the smaller ones in your region. | 22:30 |
| Biep[m] | <LjL "Biep, i could store *one* previo"> That sounds interesting. | 22:30 |
| Biep[m] | %more | 22:31 |
| Brainstorm | Biep[m], don't keep calling this if there's nothing to show! Check the pastebin. | 22:31 |
| LjL | %more is broken :( | 22:31 |
| LjL | i divided the bot into three bots, to satisfy requests and complaints, so that the heavier parts of it don't slow down the other parts. however that also means the bot responding to your %more is not the same bot as the one posting news | 22:32 |
| Biep[m] | Oh, I see. I was amazed already at being told off, given the output of not five minutes ago.. | 22:32 |
| LjL | yeah that would work normally | 22:32 |
| Biep[m] | Thanks anyway for a great service! | 22:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from Ars Technica at 20:25 UTC: Features: Whistleblower complaint: How denial, cronyism steered Trump pandemic response → https://is.gd/n6e9QM | 22:35 |
| _abc_ | I can't tell off hand if the US response was out of line with that other countries had. Probably not. | 22:38 |
| LjL | %more | 22:39 |
| LjL | %more should be active again for the news "bot", as well as the "general bot"... it will simply not say anything, instead of telling you to check the pastebin, if it has nothing to show | 22:39 |
| LjL | which *could* mean it shows two things, but, eh | 22:39 |
| LjL | also i've changed the case update rules more or less in the way i've described, either >2000, or >N/100, and sorted by newcases/population | 22:40 |
| LjL | at least that's the idea, we'll see what it actually shows :P | 22:40 |
| pyna | "the notion that everyone should get tested is simply nonsensical" - Kayleigh McEnany, White House Press Secretary, just now | 22:43 |
| sookie | i agree. no need to test everyone. | 22:48 |
| sookie | eventually it might be good to do widespread antibody testing to get a sense of how widespread this was. but as a retrospective. | 22:50 |
| sookie | for active infection management, you just need sufficient & strategic testing | 22:50 |
| bjmoose | Looking more like 1 million US deaths by Spring 2021 to me | 22:51 |
| sookie | based on what? | 22:52 |
| bjmoose | surrender | 22:52 |
| bjmoose | similar to police shootings, and mass shootings, it's just the US way | 22:53 |
| sookie | oh i see. so based on bullshit. | 22:53 |
| bjmoose | sookie: do you want a chart? | 22:53 |
| sookie | not really, i've discounted your commentary already. | 22:54 |
| pyna | "the notion that he [fauci] is being blocked is farcical" | 22:54 |
| bjmoose | yes, keep hoping for 100k US Dead 'as a good job' | 22:54 |
| pyna | is the notion nonsensical? | 22:54 |
| sookie | she explained what happened. | 22:55 |
| bjmoose | re-open meme while there daily deaths are climbing | 22:55 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 20:50 UTC: Coronavirus live news: Trump suggests more deaths necessary price to reopen economy: US president says ‘we have to be warriors’; while pandemic threatens future of eurozone; and Spain extends state of emergency again → https://is.gd/4VMYXH | 22:56 |
| bjmoose | pyna: s'what happens when you have a Crime Family in charge | 22:56 |
| bjmoose | US to World "drop dead" | 22:56 |
| sookie | lowey (democrat partisan from house) talked to chief of staff about fauci. cos asked "what will subject matter be" and lowey promised to get back to him next day with that info. instead of that, next day lowey made a press release about fauci being blocked | 22:57 |
| sookie | in other words, it was just like impeachment | 22:57 |
| sookie | a democrat publicity stunt | 22:57 |
| sookie | i am glad trump isn't allowing democrats to waste fauci's time. fauci has important stuff to do. the u.s. is in a middle a pandmic. the lead virologist shouldn't be wasting his time answering questions from clowns. | 22:58 |
| freelock | yep, Trump's incompetence and corruption is purely a democratic publicity stunt. Right. | 22:58 |
| pyna | no, she statedd that not being blocked from testifying before the Senate, means that the very idea that he is not being blocked from testifying before the House is "farcical" | 22:59 |
| sookie | no, she explained why fauci is not testifying before the house | 23:00 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | it's unfortunate how so many things end up viewed through the lens of politics when it really doesn't seem to make sense. | 23:01 |
| sookie | it's becuase they're clowns who couldn't intelligently explain the subject matter | 23:01 |
| pyna | if i have two court hearings, and only go to the one i want, the notion that i did not attend the hearings is farcical | 23:01 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | because then inevitably people start using the word clowns figuratively, and the conversation just goes downhill from there. | 23:01 |
| pyna | judges love shit like that | 23:01 |
| sookie | fauci is in the middle of a pandemic. if a judge demanded that a brain surgeon in the middle of surgery go discuss nonsnese, the judge would be laughed out of court. | 23:02 |
| sookie | also, congress is not a court of law | 23:02 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | aren't there enough political channels on irc where those viewpoints can be hashed out between people that somehow haven't tired of retreading the same ground? | 23:02 |
| pyna | so why are we dangerously allowing him to testify before the senate | 23:02 |
| sookie | i agree | 23:02 |
| sookie | but it's pyna who keeps bringing this up | 23:02 |
| sookie | for some reason pyna believes this is a politics channel. | 23:03 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i couldn't be bothered to scroll up to see how this started, so i'm not trying to single anyone out. i didn't intend to do so implicitly by mentioning 'clowns'. | 23:03 |
| pyna | i pasted a quote and sookie started arguing about it | 23:03 |
| sookie | what was the purpose of pasting the quote? | 23:04 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | but it's not like fauci is in the lab making groundbreaking discoveries and then being silenced to the great detriment of anyone suffering from the pandemic. | 23:04 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | he's just a bureaucrat. | 23:04 |
| pyna | sookie: why does that matter, you're the one that started arguing | 23:04 |
| sookie | the purpose of quoting it was in to generate a reaction right? | 23:04 |
| sookie | or else you'd simply keep it to yourself | 23:04 |
| sookie | so you got a reaction | 23:05 |
| LjL | i don't know what any of you is on about. to be fair you're clearly watching some press conference that i am not. but i don't like the tone and even less do i like it when aggressive tone is being used on subject that do not make sense to those in the channel who aren't following the thing you are. so please either have a discussion less full of "clowns", "bullshit" and all that, or don't have it | 23:05 |
| sookie | maybe not the one you wanted, maybe you wanted someone joining you in attacking trump. but you got another view. | 23:05 |
| pyna | that's between you and your pastor, bud. leave me out of it | 23:05 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | let's adopt a more passive tone that's more common in the science community than the foaming-at-the-mouth tone that's more prevalent in political circles :P | 23:06 |
| pyna | maybe you wanted someone joing you in attacking me, but i would never say such a thing | 23:06 |
| sookie | i did say clown, which was my way of saying non-serious. i didn't think that weas so offensive. especially given this: "<freelock> yep, Trump's incompetence and corruption" or "<bjmoose> pyna: s'what happens when you have a Crime Family in charge" | 23:06 |
| sookie | i didn't call anyone corrupt or part of a crime family. i just said they were not serious (ie clowns) | 23:07 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | dismissing others' views as not serious is less effective than pointing out any logical flaws they may be predicated upon. | 23:07 |
| sookie | i didn't call anyone HERE a clown | 23:07 |
| sookie | i called the democrats doing that fauci stunt clowns | 23:08 |
| sookie | NoImNotNineVolt: is calling someone a crime family or a corrupt also less effective than pointing out logical flaws? | 23:08 |
| NoImNotNineVolt | i refer you to ljl's request. | 23:09 |
| bjmoose | https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1258076761755193346 | 23:09 |
| bjmoose | a chart for you | 23:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from Ars Technica at 20:58 UTC: Science: Meat plants become COVID-19 hotspots; 58% test positive at one plant → https://is.gd/HTjm9T | 23:10 |
| LjL | sookie, yes, i am not okay with "crime family" or those other things. i am not targeting you in particular, the whole discussion reads surreal. | 23:10 |
| sookie | LjL: understood, thanks. | 23:10 |
| sookie | in context, "clowns" seemed the least harsh adjective. it's not even really offensive. | 23:11 |
| sookie | i'll say unserious next time | 23:11 |
| bjmoose | sookie: you mean like "sh*thole" ? | 23:11 |
| bjmoose | your hero | 23:11 |
| sookie | i don't really have heros | 23:12 |
| bjmoose | https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/native-american-health-center-asked-covid-19-supplies-they-got-n1200246?cid=sm_npd_nn_fb_ma&fbclid=IwAR2b48igwGFH-dcwh7wFiAEMiOf-hnMEFi8xFfOYxtzwnDhV9nA9aZkFZyA&fbclid=IwAR3SdAFeeONmVVRpK8vwdMqCdOfUICriclmdiM355fnkpsGhZXmXMbTH1dQ | 23:12 |
| bjmoose | https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/native-american-health-center-asked-covid-19-supplies-they-got-n1200246Q good at bodybags, not good @ PPE | 23:13 |
| pyna | for my part i will try to say less and link from the List of Fallacies more | 23:13 |
| bjmoose | IMO it is a crime family | 23:13 |
| pyna | i agree! *hugs* | 23:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 21:06 UTC: Coronavirus US live: Pelosi attacks Trump's focus on reopening and says 'death is not an economic motivator': House speaker asks in interview ‘why are we going down that path?’ President reportedly questions accuracy of death toll Trump reverses course and says coronavirus taskforce will stay US begins to reopen [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/xkboWX | 23:17 |
| LjL | bjmoose, what makes you think that using an asterisk instead of just writing "shithole" changes anything? | 23:20 |
| LjL | also you may enjoy doing things that may be easily construed as slander, but i don't enjoy having to point out that the channel dissociates itself from that sort of thing, so i'd raher you just didn't | 23:21 |
| bjmoose | walks like a duck talks like a duck https://twitter.com/davidmcswane/status/1258035535936921601 | 23:25 |
| bjmoose | thanks for the hospitality | 23:27 |
| LjL | oookaaay | 23:29 |
| shiv | Hi folks...did anyone look up Catechin/Curcumin and Coronavirus? | 23:32 |
| LjL | Spec, uuuuuh *maybe* F-Droid are going a bit overboard with tagging things with NonFreeNet, check the follow-ups to this submission https://gitlab.com/fdroid/rfp/-/issues/1288 | 23:35 |
| LjL | Australian Android users and fiddlers: https://github.com/fiidau/COVIDSafe-Scanner | 23:36 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Wyoming, US: +27 cases (now 631) since 23 hours ago — World: +6824 cases (now 3.8 million), +795 deaths (now 263973) since an hour ago — Uganda: +2 cases (now 100) since 22 hours ago | 23:37 |
| LjL | %wa population of wyoming | 23:37 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Wolfram|Alpha (Wyoming | population): Result: 578759 people (2019) → https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=population+of+wyoming | 23:37 |
| juancarlos | it's like 600k | 23:37 |
| LjL | hm | 23:37 |
| juancarlos | oh, it said | 23:37 |
| juancarlos | I missed the number with glare | 23:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 21:31 UTC: (news): Coronavirus: UK becomes first country in Europe to pass 30,000 deaths → https://is.gd/r6biai | 23:38 |
| LjL | well clearly some things have to be tweaked a little about Brainstorm's new heuristics i think | 23:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 21:40 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Australia coronavirus live: $102bn blow to household budgets; charter flights touted for international students – latest updates → https://is.gd/UZptFi | 23:45 |
| pepee | https://litfl.com/coronavirus-disease-2019-covid-19/ | 23:47 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for World: +12 deaths (now 263985), +183 cases (now 3.8 million) since 20 minutes ago — US: +12 deaths (now 74114), +183 cases (now 1.3 million) since 20 minutes ago — Kentucky, US: +8 deaths (now 283), +112 cases (now 5934) since 23 hours ago | 23:54 |
| lolo9696 | hola | 23:59 |
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