| rpifan | we should keep social distancing on for a very long time | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| LjL | we have a pretty hard lockdown currently in Lombardy and the numbers are *barely* starting to be tamed | 00:00 |
| rpifan | think about the lower cases | 00:00 |
| rpifan | of flu and the common cold | 00:00 |
| rpifan | that alone is worth it | 00:00 |
| LjL | it's ridiculous to say that we should just continue with social distancing as "the solution" and forget about vaccines in the short to middle term | 00:00 |
| LjL | okay, fine | 00:00 |
| de-facto | we just should not rely on it, i agree with that, but we should employ every method available | 00:01 |
| LjL | i think at least 99% of people would disagree with you | 00:01 |
| rpifan | vaccines are fine | 00:01 |
| rpifan | but by the time they are shown to be properly reliable and effective | 00:01 |
| rpifan | the virus will have slowed down significally | 00:01 |
| rpifan | like last time | 00:01 |
| LjL | keeping social distancing (or what, lockdown? what is social distancing exactly?) on for an indefinite period of time even after we have vaccines, just because it takes care of flu, is honestly beyond the wildest ideas i've heard | 00:01 |
| de-facto | we will have to live with the virus for quite some time, so we need proper concepts for that, like other countries also did achieve to control it without vaccine. best case: vaccine comes and kills the majority of problems, worst case: due to some reason it wont, hence we should not rely on it | 00:02 |
| rpifan | we need to have a long term social distancing approach | 00:03 |
| rpifan | work from home | 00:03 |
| rpifan | reduction in traveling | 00:03 |
| rpifan | etc | 00:03 |
| rpifan | just the benefits to the environment are huge | 00:03 |
| de-facto | the stringency of social distancing also strongly depends on transmission probability and prevalence, hence it becomes much more difficult in current high transmission and high prevalence situations compared to for example the summer where both were significantly lower | 00:04 |
| LjL | rpifan, if you are just thinking "let's encourage work from home, and let's discourage traveling for the environment", then sure, that could be a good idea arguably, but it will NOT stop COVID at all, it will barely dent it | 00:05 |
| rpifan | it has slowed down covid | 00:05 |
| rpifan | yes europe had a second wave but that was obvious | 00:05 |
| LjL | if on the other hand you're thinking more "nobody can leave home without a valid reason", then THAT can make a big dent in COVID but is certainly, 100%, something most people won't tolerate when there is another possibility (a vaccine) available | 00:05 |
| rpifan | especially given the shitty cold climate here | 00:05 |
| rpifan | but it made a big dent in summer covid | 00:05 |
| LjL | and i am definitely one of those people, even though i currently support the lockdown | 00:06 |
| rpifan | the second option is to extreme | 00:06 |
| rpifan | and boring | 00:06 |
| LjL | rpifan, what has slowed down COVID were mostly hard lockdowns in spring | 00:06 |
| LjL | not soft social distancing | 00:06 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +181132 cases (now 12.4 million), +1608 deaths (now 261746) since a day ago | 00:06 |
| LjL | (except in Germany, yes, Germany is magical) | 00:06 |
| de-facto | unfortunately its not, look at how horrible we perform right now | 00:06 |
| LjL | de-facto, well, it was remarkable during spring at least | 00:08 |
| LjL | it would be nice to figure out what you did better | 00:08 |
| LjL | but i don't think even after we figure it out, we'll realize that we can beat COVID just with a light bit of social distancing | 00:08 |
| de-facto | quite simple: people were severely scared because of what happened in the other countries for example Italy | 00:08 |
| LjL | de-facto, well, what about the French and the Spanish and later the Britons, were they not scared? are you just more easily scared people? :P | 00:09 |
| de-facto | there was much more uncertainty and compliance with containment long before official lockdown was implelented | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | No. Not *just* a bit of social distancing. But that it one of many contributors to lowering the R_eff. | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | *that is | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | Hard lockdowns, masks, social distancing do really seem to have worked in some places. | 00:10 |
| de-facto | LjL, i think Germany had the advantage to be behind those other countries like 2-3 weeks or such | 00:10 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, please scroll up to figure out why i'm emphasizing a "light" or "soft" bit of social distancing, it's in contrast to lockdowns, and because rpifan thinks (aiui) we should hold off vaccines until they're proven safe and effective on a much wider population, and just keep on social distancing "for a long time" (indeterminate) because of COVID but also because it's good for the environment and because it limits the flu | 00:10 |
| tinwhiskers | I don't think the lockdowns have gone far enough so you're getting the costs but not the benefits. | 00:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh | 00:11 |
| de-facto | exactly | 00:11 |
| rpifan | well im germany | 00:11 |
| de-facto | we need *much* stricter containment | 00:11 |
| rpifan | and well the summer / spring lockdowns | 00:11 |
| rpifan | werent that great | 00:11 |
| rpifan | of course when the borders reopened we all traveled | 00:12 |
| rpifan | i also traveled to france | 00:12 |
| rpifan | to marseille | 00:12 |
| rpifan | spent two weeks down there | 00:12 |
| rpifan | and i can tell you for a fact the french were dummies | 00:12 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, that's not good either | 00:12 |
| aggi | the german pandemic was reported to be 'most deadly in 30 years' season 2017/18 already (source RKI german), but no cv19 tests were conducted at that time allthough medical experts insisted patients with 'flu symptoms' had to be tested for cv19 (Kekules, Lauterbach) | 00:12 |
| de-facto | i did not travel at all in 2020 | 00:12 |
| de-facto | not even once used public transport | 00:12 |
| aggi | this indicates CV10 had begun winter season 2017/18 already, in germany | 00:12 |
| rpifan | in france ppl were kissing and going to crowed bars | 00:12 |
| LjL | rpifan, so in a nutshell you'd recommend that we all do exactly the opposite of what you've been doing | 00:12 |
| aggi | cv19 | 00:12 |
| tinwhiskers | aggi: what point are you trying to make? | 00:12 |
| aggi | truth | 00:12 |
| rpifan | no im advocating responsible lockdowns | 00:12 |
| rpifan | the problem is in places like britain france and spain | 00:12 |
| rpifan | ppl dont care | 00:13 |
| rpifan | and they are so addicted to social closeness its hard to enforce lockdwons | 00:13 |
| LjL | aggi, you were muted for that nonsense last time. does anything make you think it will be different this time? | 00:13 |
| rpifan | germans are a distant culture to begin with, they dont hug and touch much | 00:13 |
| LjL | i unmuted you to give you a chance, if you want to throw it away, be my guest | 00:13 |
| rpifan | they usually always keep space | 00:13 |
| rpifan | so there are cultural issues that sadly nice policing, same issue in the US | 00:13 |
| tinwhiskers | It sounds like aggi is saying covid is a hoax but that we didn't go far enough with control measures. | 00:14 |
| rpifan | every american is a dr and knows exactly whats the best solution, aka do whatever they want | 00:14 |
| tinwhiskers | I mean wtf are you trying to say aggi? | 00:14 |
| de-facto | aggi, nope it could not have been SARS-CoV-2 in 2017/2018 because otherwise we would see more genetic variety due to longer time of mutations diversifying the phylogenetic tree of it, it really looks like that it started in early 2020 late 2019 | 00:15 |
| aggi | how would you know if no test samples were taken? | 00:15 |
| de-facto | because they are taken now | 00:15 |
| tinwhiskers | You seem to be giving evidence on some point without having a point. How about stating your thesis then the points to back it up instead of the points with no thesis. | 00:17 |
| de-facto | if SARS-CoV-2 was circulating in human population that long ago two questions arise: 1) why did it not explode back then as it did now? (maybe due to a mutation enabling this not having occured yet?) 2) why dont we see the genetic diversity that should have accumulated during that time by mutations in the samples that are taken now? | 00:17 |
| LjL | aggi, if we didn't know what COVID-19 was and we didn't have tests for it, how the hell would "medical expert insist patients with flu symptoms be tested for COVID-19" | 00:17 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, are you still going back to NZ? also do you still have those lung issues? | 00:18 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, and a little | 00:19 |
| de-facto | on average SARS-CoV-2 should have like one mutation every 2 weeks or 24 mutations per year | 00:19 |
| LjL | de-facto, (playing devil's advocate) what if one particular variant had a distinct evolutionary advantage and wiped out all the other variants so that's the only one we see today | 00:20 |
| de-facto | how do you mean that? | 00:20 |
| de-facto | like what mechanism? | 00:20 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +175772 cases (now 12.4 million) since a day ago | 00:20 |
| tinwhiskers | You don't get one variant wiping out another when prevalence is so low because there's still plenty of potential hosts for any variant. No real competition. | 00:20 |
| tinwhiskers | It's only when they become endemic that competitive effects come in to play. | 00:21 |
| de-facto | yep | 00:22 |
| tinwhiskers | There could be competitive effects on small clusters with high prevalence though. | 00:22 |
| de-facto | still if it would have been wide spread enough to cause a peak in fatalities it surely would have been fit enough to survive (and mutate) hence also should be visible in the phylogenetic tree | 00:23 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh, for sure. | 00:23 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, well i think aggi probably believes prevalence isn't so low since it's been around since 2017 (and if you listened to what they said last time, "the 60s", although he was lumping every coronavirus together, apparently) | 00:26 |
| tinwhiskers | Perhaps. | 00:26 |
| tinwhiskers | You can also get selective pressure due to management or therapeutics that can favour certain stains. | 00:27 |
| tinwhiskers | But that's not happening in most places since management isn't effective :-) | 00:28 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, for that matter, a lockdown *that works* would cause selective pressure towards whatever could manage to beat the lockdown (like measles-style airborne-ness) | 00:28 |
| tinwhiskers | Right | 00:28 |
| de-facto | well and due to immunization aswell, creating an environment where escape mutations would have an advantage in comparison to one where immunity does not play a significant role yet | 00:28 |
| LjL | de-facto, bingo, so COVID-19 is a mutated variant of all the other coronaviruses we've had since the '60s | 00:29 |
| tinwhiskers | We're not at the stage in most of the world when one stain can supplant another, except in that handful of countries which are containing it. | 00:29 |
| de-facto | i am curious if the number of 24 "successful" mutations (as in surviving) will increase in such an environment | 00:29 |
| tinwhiskers | One can still become dominant, but not supplant another. | 00:29 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, you said stain twice but it's strain, ftr | 00:29 |
| tinwhiskers | Lol | 00:29 |
| tinwhiskers | I'm on my phone today because my power system has failed :-( | 00:30 |
| LjL | your phone keyboard hates evolutionary biology? | 00:30 |
| tinwhiskers | Heh | 00:30 |
| LjL | are you connected to the grid? (a grid? what grid?) | 00:30 |
| tinwhiskers | Swipe and poor proof reading | 00:30 |
| tinwhiskers | No grid here | 00:30 |
| de-facto | LjL, well at some point in the (distant) past all those Coronaviruses may have shared a common ancestor, yet they diversified a lot, what did they say like 15k CoVs in bat population at least? | 00:31 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, makes sense, swipe has no way to tell between those two words since you're going to pass on R anyway | 00:31 |
| LjL | de-facto, i don't know but bats are like perfect environments for a large number of different viruses to thrive apparently since their immune system doesn't really aim to exterminate them but just to keep them under some control | 00:31 |
| de-facto | yeah | 00:32 |
| tinwhiskers | The batteries in my solar system have been failing progressively and the third one failed yesterday which takes me below a critical threshold. Since I'm only here for another 5 weeks it's hard to justify the cost of replacements so I'm trying to come up with a solution. | 00:32 |
| LjL | oh | 00:32 |
| LjL | are you sad to leave | 00:32 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah | 00:33 |
| tinwhiskers | Wife | 00:33 |
| tinwhiskers | No more need be said of that :-/ | 00:33 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Canada: +5509 cases (now 325711), +82 deaths (now 11406) since 23 hours ago — US: +174323 cases (now 12.4 million) since 23 hours ago | 00:38 |
| LjL | :( | 00:43 |
| aggi | the youtube channels which published reports from credible sources got banned | 00:45 |
| tinwhiskers | :-/ | 00:52 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +174763 cases (now 12.4 million), +1561 deaths (now 261749) since a day ago | 00:52 |
| ryouma | "There were more. Many more. A total of nineteen tables, in fact, in which NICE proceeded to pick through the details of a very sorry research literature. Overall, across no fewer than 172 CBT studies, NICE graded 153 (89%) as “VERY LOW” quality and the remaining 19 (11%) as “LOW” on quality. Not a single study was found to have exceeded that abysmal threshold." | 01:05 |
| ryouma | this psychologist does not pull punches when assessing his own field | 01:06 |
| LjL | ryouma, is this about CBT in general, or applied to some particular thing? | 01:16 |
| ryouma | a little context is needed to show why it is (highly) relevant, but idk if i am up to it. i will try in like 2 messages. | 01:17 |
| LjL | i'm not asking you to establish relevance, i'm just curious | 01:18 |
| LjL | well i guess it's also a little bit out of the blue so as an op i should ask you to establish relevance too. but i really wasn't thinking of that | 01:18 |
| ryouma | basically nice is the gatekeeping policy org in the uk that is also influential on other countries. they basically say what doctors in the nhs must do and not do. | 01:20 |
| ryouma | and they did a 180. and this really matters. a lot. | 01:20 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +171067 cases (now 12.4 million), +1528 deaths (now 261751) since a day ago | 01:20 |
| ryouma | first, the link is this: https://thesciencebit.net/2020/11/21/no-more-mr-nice-guy/ . there is also virology blog post i don't have the link for describing nicely why the so-called science media centre is corrupt by reference to its reaction to it. the long covid part is as follows. | 01:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Spending Review: Chancellor to announce £500m for mental health: The government hopes the funding will address the extra demand for services amid the Covid pandemic. → https://is.gd/yitFEE | 01:23 |
| ryouma | lots of history here (likely more than any individual can read in a year). the (uk but influential) nice guidelines for long covid might be imperiled but their m.e. guidelines (which were historically persecutory), are now on the science side, and it might be a quite interesting influence on the long covid nice guidelines, or a bureaucratic bloodbath if the long covid guidelines go for the gaslighting route, if a s | 01:24 |
| ryouma | ignificant part of long covid turns out to have a clinically usable biomarker that is identical to a good clinically usable biomarker for m.e. nice has seen the writing on the wall. but what will they do for long covid. is going to be worth watching closely. | 01:24 |
| ryouma | well, let me drop the read in a year stuff. just, many many years of history. | 01:26 |
| de-facto | "COVID-19 situation in the WHO European Region" https://npgeo-corona-npgeo-de.hub.arcgis.com/app/e6acbf22cc4f4b85949f59734244ba71 | 01:27 |
| ryouma | in particular, it will be needed to watch who got appointed to the long covid committee and what they say -- or do foia to get it | 01:28 |
| de-facto | "WHO European Region COVID19 Subnational Explorer" https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/3a056fc8839d47969ef59949e9984a71 | 01:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from FDA Press Releases: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Update: FDA Authorizes Monoclonal Antibodies for Treatment of COVID-19: Today, the FDA issued an emergency use authorization for two monoclonal antibodies to be administered together for the treatment of mild to moderate COVID-19 in adults and pediatric patients who are at high risk for progressing to [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/6fU3Ok | 01:35 |
| LjL | ryouma, it links to this article https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/15265161.2018.1445312?journalCode=uajb20 which i'd probably find interesting but well, it's paywalled | 01:37 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +169546 cases (now 12.4 million) since 23 hours ago | 01:38 |
| ryouma | i get infinite captcha so idk which link htat is | 01:38 |
| LjL | ryouma, title is "Why Bioethics Should Be Concerned With Medically Unexplained Symptoms" | 01:39 |
| ryouma | ok diane o'leary | 01:39 |
| ryouma | you can get the abstract right? | 01:39 |
| LjL | yes | 01:41 |
| LjL | de-facto, useful data, pretty terrible interface | 01:41 |
| de-facto | yeah its quite heavy, yet gives a neat overview of incidence by subnational regions | 01:42 |
| ryouma | she once testified to a special rapporteur on lyme disease which faces similar persecution i.e. one of the category of diseases she is talking about | 01:43 |
| LjL | de-facto, https://covid-statistics.jrc.ec.europa.eu/Measure/DashboardMeasures?view=1 | 01:46 |
| LjL | de-facto, i found that because the first thing i clicked on from the WHO site had https://covid-statistics.jrc.ec.europa.eu/ as its source | 01:46 |
| LjL | https://github.com/ec-jrc/COVID-19 explains the way the measures are listed | 01:47 |
| de-facto | oh thats neat :) | 01:48 |
| LjL | de-facto, well the other worldwide site is kinda more comprehensive. this one has long text descriptions of the measures though | 01:51 |
| de-facto | which other worldwide site do you mean? | 01:52 |
| LjL | de-facto, the... thing with restrictions... that i linked to | 01:52 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +171545 cases (now 12.4 million), +1526 deaths (now 261760) since a day ago | 01:52 |
| LjL | i don't remember names | 01:52 |
| de-facto | https://covidtracker.bsg.ox.ac.uk/ ? | 01:53 |
| LjL | yes | 01:53 |
| LjL | to be fair bsg.ox.ac.uk is not a memorable name | 01:53 |
| de-facto | yeah | 01:54 |
| ryouma | bse.ox would be though | 01:55 |
| ryouma | not relevant but memorable | 01:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from https://covid19.specops.network : ljl-covid: Add WHO Euro subnational explorer → https://is.gd/ymfZDi | 02:00 |
| LjL | ryouma, my sister was bitten by a tick a while ago, and seemed to show initial signs of Lyme, but tested negative. then for good measure, she got bitten by another TWO ticks. now she has somewhat disabling atopic dermatitis, she always suffered from various eczema, but i wonder if it could have been a trigger | 02:00 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +170730 cases (now 12.4 million), +1501 deaths (now 261784) since 23 hours ago | 02:06 |
| de-facto | LjL, btw that subnational explorer was linked from the first link hence https://npgeo-corona-npgeo-de.hub.arcgis.com/app/e6acbf22cc4f4b85949f59734244ba71 | 02:12 |
| LjL | hmm, without the subnational part, that's probably not better than other trackers i have listed. i'll list it on the same line i guess | 02:13 |
| LjL | oh | 02:14 |
| LjL | i take that back | 02:14 |
| LjL | de-facto, have you clicked on PHSM? | 02:14 |
| ryouma | i do not know as kmuch about lyme as i should | 02:14 |
| ryouma | i also was bitten by ticks all the time in an endemic area | 02:14 |
| ryouma | but not treated | 02:14 |
| de-facto | oh thats awesome :) | 02:15 |
| gigasu_shida | how are your teeth doing ryouma ? | 02:18 |
| de-facto | there is loads of useful dashboards in those tabs | 02:19 |
| LjL | de-facto, also https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019/phsm for worldwide, but be aware that clicking "PHSM Dataset" or "Dataset API" just tries to dump the entire thing into my browser, nearly crashing it | 02:19 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +171368 cases (now 12.4 million), +1504 deaths (now 261787) since a day ago | 02:21 |
| de-facto | weird i have not noticed all those before, are they all new? | 02:22 |
| LjL | de-facto, we probably haven't been searching for the right things. this stuff tends to be a bit deep-nested | 02:22 |
| LjL | de-facto, the WHO's PHSM dataset probably includes the https://covidtracker.bsg.ox.ac.uk/ dataset since they say Oxford is one of the dataset contributors | 02:23 |
| de-facto | would make sense | 02:23 |
| LjL | de-facto, so maybe if you google the names of those other contributors in the table to the right, you'll find other datasets | 02:23 |
| LjL | i'll let you know once my browser is back under my control :P | 02:23 |
| LjL | this does make the decision on what to base Brainstorm's hypothetical code for restrictions information harder | 02:24 |
| ryouma | gigasu_shida: thanks for asking. they are under control subjectively (modulo carbamazepine). i am leaving high dose fluoride on them for long periods, and taking supplements. but the dentist i recently went to said they were an emergency and was surprised they were not a much worse problem at that time as the cavities are at the root. | 02:26 |
| LjL | what WHO calls OxCGRT is the https://covidtracker.bsg.ox.ac.uk/ dataset | 02:26 |
| gigasu_shida | ryouma: you may be having a suddenly bone attack, where your body sort of eats away at itself | 02:26 |
| de-facto | interesting so they do combine it then | 02:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: F.D.A. Grants Emergency Authorization of COVID-19 Antibody Treatment → https://is.gd/Ozoi2p | 02:27 |
| ryouma | concern is, i hope the oral surgeon got the message about canceling left after hours | 02:27 |
| ryouma | one* concern | 02:27 |
| gigasu_shida | ryouma: my mom had sudden bone loss on one tooth and the oral surgeon said it's like her body was sort of eating away at the bone | 02:27 |
| ryouma | gigasu_shida: yeah, idk. i tried to get a diagnosis and all i have gotten taht i remember was severe bone loss and severe periodontitis. don't know what causes that. | 02:27 |
| ryouma | it could be. i am taking supplements to reminieralize and i hope they are not doing the opposite. | 02:28 |
| gigasu_shida | it's strange that your cavities went so deep so suddenly tho | 02:28 |
| ryouma | gigasu_shida: any idea why the body does that? | 02:28 |
| ryouma | i thiunk prev dentist just did not tell me | 02:28 |
| gigasu_shida | no, i should've asked the surgeon about it more. i was curious also | 02:28 |
| ryouma | not sure though | 02:28 |
| gigasu_shida | but if you started with cavities, i'm not sure that's the same situation | 02:28 |
| gigasu_shida | although who knows it could be | 02:28 |
| ryouma | i really want to know what causes this | 02:28 |
| LjL | de-facto, yes, i definitely recommend googling all the terms to the right. so far ACAPS got me to https://www.acaps.org/projects/covid-19 and https://www.acaps.org/secondary-impacts-covid-19 while CSHVienna got me to https://csh.ac.at/covid19/ | 02:28 |
| gigasu_shida | i just remember the surgeon telling my mom something like "the body just decides it's going to give up on a tooth" or something like that | 02:29 |
| ryouma | well i have been losing teeth over past couple of years at a pretty fast rate. and cavities. and gum recession. etc. | 02:29 |
| de-facto | hehe so a lot to investigate :) | 02:29 |
| ryouma | in my case it is all over the mouth though. the molars are what have been extracted and filled. | 02:30 |
| gigasu_shida | it's bizarre to me that suddenly they can all go root canal | 02:31 |
| gigasu_shida | i remember one dentist saying the alkalinity of your mouth affects cavities greatly | 02:31 |
| gigasu_shida | or acidity | 02:31 |
| gigasu_shida | i forgot which is better | 02:31 |
| ryouma | bacteria produce acid | 02:34 |
| ryouma | and acid food is bad | 02:34 |
| LjL | also having a dry mouth makes you stop producing protective substances in the saliva | 02:34 |
| ryouma | previously i have nose issues that could have contributed but i am mostly breathing ok throuhg nose | 02:35 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for US: +171522 cases (now 12.4 million), +1507 deaths (now 261790) since a day ago | 02:35 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: COVID-19 spread when 5 million people left Wuhan for Chinese New Year, yet 50 million Americans will still travel for Thanksgiving (10520 votes) | https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/covid-19-spread-when-5-million-people-left-wuhan-for-chinese-new-year-yet-50-million-americans-will-still-travel-for-thanksgiving/ar-BB1b9Yi6 | https://redd.it/jyiopa | 02:38 |
| LjL | de-facto, and also https://github.com/HopkinsIDD/hit-covid | 02:47 |
| LjL | this doesn't look very up to date though | 02:49 |
| LjL | or at least only for some countries | 02:49 |
| LjL | based on the interactive viewer at https://akuko.io/post/covid-intervention-tracking | 02:49 |
| LjL | i think Oxford still wins for the purpose of adding its API to the bot | 02:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: FDA authorizes Regeneron's Covid treatment, taken by Trump, for emergency use: Regeneron's therapy is part of a class of treatments known as monoclonal antibodies, which are made to act as immune cells that scientists hope can fight infections. → https://is.gd/CModmn | 02:51 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for France: +14810 cases (now 2.1 million) since 22 hours ago — N. Cyprus: +72 cases (now 1048) since 11 days ago — Netherlands: +7562 cases (now 481494), +62 deaths (now 8896) since 22 hours ago — New Zealand: +9 cases (now 2028) since a day ago | 02:52 |
| gigasu_shida | ryouma: do you take a calcium-k2-d3 supplement? | 03:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Trump stays mum on sharing vaccines as leaders push for equality → https://is.gd/4XI8kh | 03:08 |
| ryouma | gigasu_shida: i take 5kiu d3 1x/d, the carlson k2 (5k something) 3x/d, 10kiu dry vitamin a (dry just becasue it is what i had) 1x/d, but no calcium. i eat cottage cheese. recently i take a bit of mg lycinate-glycinate and 12.5mg zinc. | 03:14 |
| tinwhiskers | %title https://www.nytimes.com/2020/11/21/health/regeneron-covid-antibodies-trump.html | 03:25 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: From www.nytimes.com: F.D.A. Grants Emergency Authorization of Antibody Treatment Given to Trump - The New York Times | 03:25 |
| gigasu_shida | you should take a combo pill that has calcium/k2/d3 ryouma | 03:26 |
| ryouma | i will see if amazon has anything | 03:27 |
| ryouma | i was concerned about too much calcium for some reason i don't recall. i think i tried calcium bu itself a few y ago and it didn't feel right | 03:27 |
| ryouma | this is one of my concerns re dental treatment --- 18:38 <CoronaBot> 04/r/coronavirus: COVID-19 spread when 5 million people left Wuhan for Chinese New Year, yet 50 million Americans will still travel for Thanksgiving (10520 votes) | https://www.msn.com/en-us/health/medical/covid-19-spread-when-5-million-people-left-wuhan-for-chinese-new-year-yet-50-million-americans-will-still-travel-for-thanksgiving/ar-BB1b9Yi6 | 03:27 |
| ryouma | | https://redd.it/jyiopa | 03:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: COVID-19 deaths of Serbian clerics highlight virus worries → https://is.gd/XKBFNY | 04:09 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Boris Johnson to end England’s national lockdown on Dec 2 → https://is.gd/W1fRfm | 04:45 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Belgium: +3224 cases (now 556904), +170 deaths (now 15522) since 23 hours ago | 04:53 |
| de-facto | %cases Germany | 05:51 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: In Germany, there have been 918271 confirmed cases (1.1% of the population) and 14239 deaths (1.6% of cases) as of 6 hours ago. 26.5 million tests were performed (3.5% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.5% (assuming prevalence as in tests) and less than 2.3% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 05:51 |
| de-facto | RKI Germany: Infections +15741 (918269 total), Fatalities +138 (14022 total) | 05:51 |
| de-facto | RKI Germany: 3634 COVID-19 cases on ICU including 2109 on ventilators (58%) | 05:53 |
| gigasu_shida | oh god ryouma you're scaring me...50m americans traveling for thanksgiving =/ | 05:56 |
| gigasu_shida | for the first time i have anxiety over the holiday season arriving | 05:57 |
| euod[m] | seems pretty realistic. | 06:00 |
| euod[m] | from people I've talked to, they're all planning on flying home or whatever for thanksgiving. | 06:00 |
| ryouma | gigasu_shida: just look at the effect on the country from a single motorcycle rally in north dakota. this time it will be the whole country infecting the whole country | 06:01 |
| euod[m] | if you look at google flights price trends there's a big spike around christmas, 21st, 22st, 23rd so people are obviously flying home then too. | 06:02 |
| ryouma | hospitals in various states are already overwhelmed | 06:02 |
| ryouma | this is basically mass murder | 06:02 |
| ryouma | plus the disability | 06:02 |
| euod[m] | no argument. | 06:03 |
| ryouma | (and i have to step into that for dental work i can't even make a decision on) | 06:03 |
| euod[m] | we can't really help with that other than to sympathize. | 06:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from This Week In Virology: TWiV 684: Persistence of SARS-CoV-2 immune memory: Daniel Griffin provides a clinical report on COVID-19, and Shane Crotty explains a study of antibodies, B cells and T cells in patients which suggests that immunological memory to SARS-CoV-2 might be long-lived. → https://is.gd/gTLtYB | 06:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express (Health): Destination of the week: Here are some of the world’s most expensive cities to live in during COVID-19 pandemic → https://is.gd/86vW4t | 06:23 |
| gigasu_shida | oh ryouma i just saw a picture of chicago's airport | 06:26 |
| gigasu_shida | this is gonna be crazy | 06:26 |
| gigasu_shida | the two hospitals near me are at 83% and 90% ICU capacity ryouma =/ | 06:26 |
| gigasu_shida | i'm scared outta my mind | 06:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: US surpasses 12 million COVID-19 cases → https://is.gd/jwNyT9 | 06:47 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Ukraine: +14864 cases (now 629850), +220 deaths (now 11149) since a day ago — Japan: +2586 cases (now 130871) since a day ago — Saskatchewan, Canada: +433 cases (now 6237) since a day ago — Germany: +13872 cases (now 927990) since a day ago | 07:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Saint Petersburg, Russia: +2476 cases (now 95270), +70 deaths (now 4896) since 23 hours ago — Dnipropetrovsk Oblast, Ukraine: +1342 cases (now 27544), +40 deaths (now 727) since 23 hours ago — Sumy Oblast, Ukraine: +961 cases (now 21833), +4 deaths (now 297) since 23 hours ago — Moscow Oblast, Russia: +916 cases (now 101853), +15 deaths (now 1886) since 23 hours ago | 07:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: How Steve Bannon and a Chinese billionaire created a Right-Wing coronavirus media sensation → https://is.gd/UN68pU | 07:46 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Georgia: +4048 cases (now 104732), +49 deaths (now 976) since a day ago | 08:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Ireland faces 3rd lockdown in January professor says . → https://is.gd/lM6eFU | 08:47 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: FDA Authorizes Monoclonal Antibodies for Treatment of COVID-19 (80 votes) | https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/coronavirus-covid-19-update-fda-authorizes-monoclonal-antibodies-treatment-covid-19 | https://redd.it/jymbq8 | 08:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: How one airline’s pandemic hurt becomes everyone’s pain → https://is.gd/ieLSGm | 09:23 |
| pas5 | %cases NL | 09:57 |
| Brainstorm | pas5: In Netherlands, there have been 483037 confirmed cases (2.8% of the population) and 8908 deaths (1.8% of cases) as of 2 hours ago. 3.9 million tests were performed (12.4% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Netherlands for time series data. | 09:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from "COVID-19 pandemic in Denmark" on Wikipedia: Pardy: /* Statistics */: Statistics ← Previous revision Revision as of 08:51, 22 November 2020 Line 224: Line 224: |xAxisAngle=-60 |xAxisAngle=-60 − |x=27 Feb, 28 Feb, 29 Feb, 1 Mar, 2 Mar, 3 Mar, 4 Mar, 5 Mar, 6 Mar, 7 Mar, 8 Mar, 9 Mar, 10 Mar, 11 Mar, 12 Mar, 13 Mar, 14 Mar, 15 Mar, 16 Mar, [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/58UIK3 | 09:59 |
| Haley[m] | %cases usa | 10:25 |
| Haley[m] | %cases france | 10:25 |
| Brainstorm | Haley[m]: In US, there have been 12.5 million confirmed cases (3.8% of the population) and 261790 deaths (2.1% of cases) as of 7 hours ago. 178.8 million tests were performed (7.0% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.1% (assuming prevalence as in tests) and less than 3.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 10:25 |
| Brainstorm | Haley[m]: In France, there have been 2.1 million confirmed cases (3.2% of the population) and 48518 deaths (2.3% of cases) as of 3 hours ago. 19.8 million tests were performed (10.9% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=France for time series data. | 10:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Report: Israel to procure, transfer millions of COVID-19 vaccines to Palestinians → https://is.gd/X60nUr | 11:48 |
| Timvde | %cases Belgium | 11:49 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Lithuania: +2307 cases (now 47047), +12 deaths (now 386) since a day ago | 11:50 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In Belgium, there have been 556904 confirmed cases (4.8% of the population) and 15522 deaths (2.8% of cases) as of 7 hours ago. 5.7 million tests were performed (9.8% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data. | 11:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: (news): Coronavirus: £3bn for NHS but Sunak warns of 'economic shock' to come → https://is.gd/23BeFA | 12:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: US approves COVID therapy, G20 pushes for global vaccine access: US drug regulators gave emergency approval to a COVID-19 antibody therapy on Saturday and G20 nations pushed for global access to vaccines as the pandemic led to further closures in parts of the world. → https://is.gd/jYI2uQ | 13:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Turkey reports record daily number of new COVID-19 patients: Turkey recorded its highest daily number of new COVID-19 patients Saturday as the country's first weekend curfew since June came into force. → https://is.gd/fRcELr | 13:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: UK leader to end England's coronavirus lockdown on Dec. 2: British Prime Minister Boris Johnson plans to end an England-wide lockdown as scheduled on Dec. 2 and will announce a return to regional restrictions as statistics show that coronavirus infections have stabilized. → https://is.gd/KirSqR | 13:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from "COVID-19 pandemic in Denmark" on Wikipedia: Pardy: /* Statistics */: Statistics ← Previous revision Revision as of 13:03, 22 November 2020 Line 224: Line 224: |xAxisAngle=-60 |xAxisAngle=-60 − |x=27 Feb, 28 Feb, 29 Feb, 1 Mar, 2 Mar, 3 Mar, 4 Mar, 5 Mar, 6 Mar, 7 Mar, 8 Mar, 9 Mar, 10 Mar, 11 Mar, 12 Mar, 13 Mar, 14 Mar, 15 Mar, 16 Mar, [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/58UIK3 | 14:14 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: As U.S. coronavirus cases soar toward 200,000 a day, holiday travel is surging (10098 votes) | https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2020/11/21/coronavirus-thanksgiving-travel/ | https://redd.it/jynj1a | 15:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Post - November 22 | Questions, images, videos, comments, unconfirmed reports, theories, suggestions → https://is.gd/93xqWe | 15:02 |
| rpifan | one good thing about europe | 15:05 |
| rpifan | is we wont be traveling until december | 15:05 |
| rpifan | thanksgiving will certainly be bad | 15:05 |
| jacklsw | thankful to be alive | 15:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: US surpasses 12 million coronavirus cases → https://is.gd/nl19QA | 16:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: WHO predicts 3rd wave of COVID-19 in Europe in early 2021 → https://is.gd/8XcFkN | 16:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Hackers 'try to steal Covid vaccine secrets in intellectual property war' → https://is.gd/x95KJ1 | 17:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): Sunday 22 November Update: submitted by /u/HippolasCage to r/CoronavirusUK → https://is.gd/epnViZ | 18:11 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: Anti-COVID-19 efficacy of ivermectin in the golden hamster (87 votes) | https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.11.21.392639v1 | https://redd.it/jyulus | 18:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: Trump coronavirus vaccine chief has had ‘no contact’ with Biden transition team: Operation Warp Speed chief adviser Dr. Moncef Slaoui has "been informed" not to share vaccine information outside of the Trump administration, he tells NBC's Meet the Press on Sunday. → https://is.gd/AWDk39 | 18:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: US targets mass virus vaccine campaign by year's end: The United States hopes to begin a sweeping program of COVID vaccinations, reaching perhaps 20 million people by year's end, top public health officials said Sunday as cases surge across the worst-hit nation. → https://is.gd/fCon1g | 19:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Turkey's COVID-19 numbers at record levels for second day: Turkey saw a record number of people diagnosed with COVID-19 for the second day running on Sunday as 6,017 new symptomatic patients were documented, the health ministry said. → https://is.gd/hJhku1 | 19:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health: Trump coronavirus vaccine chief has had ‘no contact’ with Biden transition team: Operation Warp Speed chief adviser Dr. Moncef Slaoui has "been informed" not to share vaccine information outside of the Trump administration, he tells NBC's Meet the Press on Sunday. → https://is.gd/AWDk39 | 19:52 |
| mother | looks like a repeat | 20:00 |
| LjL | yeah :\ | 20:24 |
| LjL | i removed the thing that prevented repeats because it also prevented... most posts | 20:24 |
| LjL | i'm not entirely sure why it's so stubborn, CNBC in particular | 20:24 |
| tinwhiskers | %title https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2020/11/20/inconclusive-results-missing-data-why-experts-are-pushing-back-on-a-study-questioning-masks/ | 20:34 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: From www.adn.com: Inconclusive results, missing data: Why experts are pushing back on a study questioning masks - Anchorage Daily News | 20:34 |
| tinwhiskers | They were responding to another (very controversial) outlier study whose findings "conflict with those from a number of other studies," according to the New York Times, citing numerous experts. "Critics were quick to note [that] study's limitations, among them that the design depended heavily on participants reporting their own test results and behavior, at a time when both mask-wearing and infection were rare in Denmark." | 20:36 |
| tinwhiskers | Even the Denmark study itself acknowledged its own limitations, citing "Inconclusive results, missing data, variable adherence, patient-reported findings on home tests, no blinding, and no assessment of whether masks could decrease disease transmission from mask wearers to others." And it also acknowledges large gaps in adherence to proper mask usage among its participants: "Based on the lowest adherence reported in the mask group | 20:36 |
| tinwhiskers | during follow-up, 46% of participants wore the mask as recommended, 47% predominantly as recommended, and 7% not as recommended." | 20:36 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/coronavirus: ‘It’s frightening. It’s insane’: Fort Lauderdale bars packed with mask-less partygoers (10042 votes) | https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/fl-ne-wharf-reopens-with-crowd-20201121-tbn5prnf2rbulkl7lopo4la2iu-story.html | https://redd.it/jyu4nv | 20:39 |
| rpifan | nice | 20:43 |
| genera | did you click it? its geolocked here | 20:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: More than 1 million people passed through US airports Friday, despite Covid warnings → https://is.gd/RgJQCY | 21:47 |
| metreo1 | cases Canada | 22:20 |
| metreo1 | .cases | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Pennsylvania, US: +6541 cases (now 313788), +38 deaths (now 9917) since a day ago — Turkey: +6017 cases (now 446822), +139 deaths (now 12358) since a day ago — Azerbaijan: +3196 cases (now 93094), +24 deaths (now 1131) since a day ago — US: +148000 cases (now 12.6 million), +907 deaths (now 262534) since 23 hours ago | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | metreo1: In World, there have been 59.2 million confirmed cases (0.8% of the population) and 1.4 million deaths (2.4% of cases) as of a minute ago. 956.3 million tests were performed (6.2% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.3% (assuming prevalence as in tests) and less than 3.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=World for time series data. | 22:20 |
| metreo1 | .cases | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | metreo1: In World, there have been 59.2 million confirmed cases (0.8% of the population) and 1.4 million deaths (2.4% of cases) as of a minute ago. 956.3 million tests were performed (6.2% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.3% (assuming prevalence as in tests) and less than 3.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=World for time series data. | 22:20 |
| metreo1 | .cases Canada | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | metreo1: In Canada, there have been 329605 confirmed cases (0.9% of the population) and 11455 deaths (3.5% of cases) as of 41 seconds ago. 10.8 million tests were performed (3.0% positive). Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.0% (assuming prevalence as in tests) and less than 4.1% (considering only deaths and recoveries). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Canada for time series data. | 22:20 |
| Xela[m] | Hi, small info about HCQ: In vitro inhibition of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus | 22:27 |
| Xela[m] | by chloroquine | 22:27 |
| Xela[m] | '1-s2.0-S0006291X0401839X-main.pdf' | 22:27 |
| CoronaBot | 04/r/covid19: Test sensitivity is secondary to frequency and turnaround time for COVID-19 screening (86 votes) | https://advances.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/11/20/sciadv.abd5393.1 | https://redd.it/jyzp5p | 22:28 |
| LjL | Xela[m], that's not actually a link | 22:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from NPR: Americans Could See A Vaccine By Mid-December, Says Operation Warp Speed Adviser: Dr. Moncef Slaoui, the chief scientific adviser for Operation Warp Speed, says that some Americans could start receiving a COVID-19 vaccine by the second week of December. → https://is.gd/fDD0Cn | 22:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Spain PM says virus battle plan 'is working': Spain's strategy to curb a rise in coronavirus infections "is working", Prime Minister Pedro Sanchez said Sunday as he unveiled details of plans to vaccinate much of the population next year. → https://is.gd/FBAmn4 | 22:50 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Oregon, US: +1502 cases (now 65170), +1 deaths (now 820) since a day ago | 22:51 |
| de-facto | Xela[m], this here? https://sci-hub.se/10.1016/j.bbrc.2004.08.085 | 23:20 |
| de-facto | its a paper about SARS-CoV-1 in cell culture (lab not humans) from 2004 | 23:21 |
| Xela[m] | ' | 23:22 |
| Xela[m] | Hi, small info about HCQ: In vitro inhibition of severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus | 23:22 |
| Xela[m] | by chloroquine | 23:22 |
| de-facto | is that about SARS-CoV-1 aswell? | 23:23 |
| de-facto | the current pandemic is caused by SARS-CoV-2 btw | 23:24 |
| Xela[m] | CoV-2 is not from CoV-1 family ? | 23:26 |
| de-facto | yeah its the same family of Beta-Coronaviruses, yet with some different properties | 23:26 |
| de-facto | thankfully, SARS-CoV-1 got like 10% fatality much more than SARS-CoV-2 | 23:27 |
| de-facto | btw there were many studies about HCQ in humans infected with SARS-CoV-2 and it seems it did not show the desired benefits | 23:31 |
| de-facto | %title https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/10/09/hard-data | 23:33 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From blogs.sciencemag.org: Hard Data on Remdesivir, and on Hydroxychloroquine | In the Pipeline | 23:33 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2022926 | 23:34 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.nejm.org: Effect of Hydroxychloroquine in Hospitalized Patients with Covid-19 | NEJM | 23:34 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.recoverytrial.net/results/hydroxychloroquine-results | 23:35 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.recoverytrial.net: Hydroxychloroquine results — RECOVERY Trial | 23:35 |
| de-facto | and many others aswell | 23:35 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Switzerland: +25 deaths (now 4056) since 23 hours ago | 23:37 |
| Xela[m] | Remdesivir is not working against CoV-2 and CoV-19 , France passed an order to buy it ! Why ? | 23:43 |
| Xela[m] | Results not good during tests | 23:43 |
| tinwhiskers | It has shown some fairly unconvincing yet positive results, but maybe France ordered it a while ago? | 23:44 |
| tinwhiskers | For example the medium dose group had a better effect than the high dose group, which was barely better than placebo. | 23:45 |
| ubLIX[m] | doesn't that imply toxicity? | 23:46 |
| Xela[m] | HCQ study : https://c19study.com/ | 23:46 |
| Xela[m] | 177 study | 23:46 |
| tinwhiskers | it could imply toxicity | 23:47 |
| tinwhiskers | or that the effect that was seen was mostly just good luck | 23:47 |
| ubLIX[m] | remdesivir and its status as "standard of care" kinda seems like an example of expedient expediting gone wrong | 23:48 |
| tinwhiskers | if HCQ has a benefit it's marginal at best and it does have some risks so on balance it's not recommended. | 23:49 |
| tinwhiskers | some studies have found a positive effect and some have found no effect, so it's no silver bullet anyway. | 23:49 |
| Xela[m] | * 177 studies | 23:52 |
| Xela[m] | % of death looks more important in country who are not using HCQ ... | 23:55 |
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