| Brainstorm | New from Bloom Lab: @mccarthy_kr: RT by @jbloom_lab: SARS-CoV-2 variants have acquired resistance to antibodies (Abs). Abs to conserved epitopes overcome variation. A deletion in a transmitted virus disrupts Ab binding to a conserved receptor binding domain epitope. Focused responses may drive escape. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/WJ9sSz | 00:07 |
|---|---|---|
| LjL | I'm sure you'd know exactly | 00:13 |
| LjL | Anyway, since Italy is suddenly approving AZ for 65+ (suddenly but predictably, since it follows other EU countries doing so), does anyone know... is there any actual new data that clarifies it's effective on people of those ages, which was what the agencies were saying was missing, or have they just changed their minds, period? | 00:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: B.C. gets 1 million calls within 1st hour of opening phone lines to vaccine appointments for elderly → https://is.gd/tZorc6 | 00:17 |
| de-facto | LjL, i think it was the paper from Scotland comparing mRNA and Astrazeneca, but i am not entirely sure about if that is the only base of their update | 00:18 |
| LjL | de-facto: hmm that one is relevant indeed | 00:22 |
| de-facto | also we probably will see soon the result of a large US study ~30k participants | 00:22 |
| LjL | Except the US itself says it may get different result because they have different quality checks on the AZ production in their different facilities :P | 00:23 |
| de-facto | ~20k verum, ~10k placebo and ~25% over the age of 65 | 00:23 |
| LjL | Have they released any interim? | 00:26 |
| de-facto | .title https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3789264 <-- the Scottish paper | 00:27 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From papers.ssrn.com: Effectiveness of First Dose of COVID-19 Vaccines Against Hospital Admissions in Scotland: National Prospective Cohort Study of 5.4 Million People by Eleftheria Vasileiou, Colin R. Simpson, Chris [...] | 00:27 |
| de-facto | not sure about the US trial if there already is any preliminary results or such | 00:27 |
| LjL | Argh | 00:28 |
| LjL | I just realized I think | 00:28 |
| LjL | That when you explicitly call .title on a URL, it doesn't get sent to ##coronalinks | 00:28 |
| de-facto | .title https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT04516746 | 00:29 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From clinicaltrials.gov: Phase III Double-blind, Placebo-controlled Study of AZD1222 for the Prevention of COVID-19 in Adults - Full Text View - ClinicalTrials.gov | 00:29 |
| LjL | Hmm March 16 is soon | 00:29 |
| de-facto | yeah | 00:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Lancet (Online): [Clinical Picture] 18Fluorodeoxyglucose PET/CT findings in a systemic inflammatory response syndrome after COVID-19 vaccine: A 65-year-old woman attended our hospital with a 1-day history of fever and falls, saying that her legs had given out from under her. The patient's symptoms began within 1 day of the first dose of [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/gDfsF7 | 00:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: A new lab study shows troubling signs that Pfizer's and Moderna's COVID-19 shots could be far less effective against the variant first found in South Africa → https://is.gd/Qnbfhz | 00:48 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for France: +351 deaths (now 88933) since 23 hours ago — Switzerland: +8 deaths (now 10056) since 10 hours ago | 01:18 |
| LjL | de-facto, heard of this? certainly not doing the government any favor in the polls i bet https://www.dw.com/en/german-lawmaker-resigns-over-face-mask-scandal/a-56798497 | 01:35 |
| LjL | also <CarlSagan> [BBC - Science & Enviroment (video)] Coronavirus: Divers find Philippine reef covered with single-use face masks https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-56322369 2021-03-09T00:05:44 :( | 01:36 |
| Brainstorm | New from BMJ Open: Change in time spent visiting and experiences of green space following restrictions on movement during the COVID-19 pandemic: a nationally representative cross-sectional study of UK adults: Objectives Green space positively influences health and well-being; however, inequalities in use of green space are prevalent. Movement [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/PykXBS | 01:39 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for United Kingdom: +4992 cases (now 4.2 million), +73 deaths (now 124651) since 21 hours ago — Netherlands: +2105 cases (now 1.1 million), +15 deaths (now 15897) since 21 hours ago — Germany: +347 deaths (now 72698) since 7 hours ago | 01:43 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Recent Commits to links:master: Add bad new findings about mRNA vaccine effectiveness on South Africa… ( https://github.com/ljl-covid/links/commit/56972a490eac8e6ba23f0349d33b650eef22649b ) | 01:48 | |
| Brainstorm | New from https://covid19.specops.network : Add bad new findings about mRNA vaccine effectiveness on South Africa…: Add bad new findings about mRNA vaccine effectiveness on South African variantHopefully remember to update the link to the definitive one, since currently it's peer-reviewed but not officially published → https://is.gd/XiewxX | 01:50 |
| LjL | de-facto, this study also mentions the Brazil variant: "It is of equal con-cern that another variant known as P.1 or 501Y.V3 is increasing rapidly in Brazil and spreading far beyond13,14. P.1 contains three mutations (K417T, E484K, and N501Y) at the same RBD residues as B.1.351. Much of our findings on B.1.351 would likely be similar for this emergent variant." | 02:04 |
| LjL | you will certainly agree with "If the rampant spread of the virus continues and more critical mutations accumulate, then we may be condemned to chasing after the evolving SARS-CoV-2 continually, as we have long done for influenza virus. Such considerations require that we stop virus transmission as quickly as is feasible, by redoubling our mitigation measures and by expediting vaccine rollout." | 02:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from Bloom Lab: @jbloom_lab: If you want to spend a full hour of your life listening to me discuss #SARSCoV2 evolution tomorrow, details on my @HHMIJanelia seminar are below.If you're mildly interested but don't want to subject yourself to an hour of Zoom, here's a link to my slides https://slides.com/jbloom/interpreting-sars-cov-2-evolution → https://is.gd/6eZIVO | 02:11 |
| LjL | definitely not touching Zoom | 02:13 |
| LjL | but the slides were interesting | 02:24 |
| de-facto | which study? | 02:27 |
| de-facto | but yeah your quote basically says what we are talking here about months already | 02:27 |
| de-facto | afaik we even talked in the other channel about it in last spring or such that the phylogenetic tree will spread making monoclonal vaccines ineffective and therefore closing the window of time for eradication, making it endemic | 02:29 |
| de-facto | idk if we are there yet, but the window definitely is closing | 02:29 |
| LjL | de-facto, this latest in vitro study about variants neutralization | 02:39 |
| LjL | i know | 02:40 |
| LjL | i think we are there, but i hope we're not | 02:40 |
| LjL | i don't see how we can really get out of this | 02:40 |
| LjL | de-facto, anyway, https://www.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/m0t7qp/a_new_lab_study_shows_troubling_signs_that/gq9zjfg/ i would like your opinion on this comment. it seems to raise some interesting questions that i hadn't been paying too much attention to. (please ignore my flippant response) | 02:41 |
| de-facto | wow that article links to the original sources for every claim thats very good | 02:43 |
| LjL | well for starter it links to the study, which is... rare | 02:47 |
| de-facto | idk what should i say about reddit comments? making a lot of claims without sources ok why not but i cant confirm or decline that. imho is a bit more complex than that, first wave is not easily comparable with what we have right now, many things changed and it does not make too much sense to me to argue like this | 02:52 |
| de-facto | why not simply look a the fatality rates in a fully vaccinated cohort and compare that with a not-yet vaccinated cohort (of similar structure in regard to vulnerability) at the same time under similar circumstances? | 02:53 |
| de-facto | classic two arm study for efficacy | 02:53 |
| de-facto | if such data is available, i would assume it is from Israel? havent looked into their data but i linked to it some time ago | 02:54 |
| de-facto | i dont like reddit, but thats my personal opinion | 02:55 |
| de-facto | and btw http://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom;Israel&byPopulation=yes&cumulative=no&smooth=yes | 03:04 |
| de-facto | whats the delay for fatal outcomes like 2-3 weeks or such? | 03:05 |
| de-facto | What is the strength of NPIs for the comparison of UK and Israel? | 03:06 |
| de-facto | idk that whole line of argumentation does not make sense to me | 03:06 |
| de-facto | compare death rates? do so for vaccinated with non-vaccinated for same circumstances (except the vaccination) | 03:07 |
| LjL | i don't like this "i don't like reddit" theme | 03:14 |
| LjL | look at individual contributions, not the site that hosts them | 03:14 |
| LjL | you don't like this comment, fine, i found it interesting | 03:14 |
| LjL | it has nothing to do with whether it was posted on reddit or on de-facto.org | 03:14 |
| LjL | i would like to point out that a ton of interesting studies that Brainstorm picks up come from upvoted Reddit posts | 03:15 |
| LjL | (although whenever there's a "bad" post, someone starts yelling that i need to remove reddit from Brainstorm) | 03:16 |
| LjL | anyway it does make sense to me to look at the actual registered deaths and see if people are still dying like before despite a vaccine. if there's something we're missing about this thing's behavior, we want to catch it earlier rather than later. | 03:17 |
| LjL | would it be okay if given carefully selected cohorts the vaccine performs very well, but then at the end of the day, the excess deaths are worse than before? | 03:18 |
| de-facto | what is the death rate in the vaccinated cohort compared to a non-vaccinated cohort of constituents of the same category of risk groups at the same time on same location? | 03:20 |
| LjL | yeah clearly talking past each other. | 03:21 |
| de-facto | that would make sense to me as a comparison, if the comparison is done less directly (why would we not do the direct comparison if we can?) then we *very* carefully would have to normalize for the other factors that might be involved with death rates | 03:21 |
| de-facto | sure i get it, the end goal is to lower over all death rates, but for now it seems we are not there yet, so the best we can do for now is to try to look at how much less the likelihood of fatal outcomes is in cohorts of somewhat representative structure and to as fair of a comparison as possible with a control group | 03:23 |
| de-facto | .title https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2101765 | 03:33 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.nejm.org: BNT162b2 mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine in a Nationwide Mass Vaccination Setting | NEJM | 03:33 |
| de-facto | LjL, what do you think about that study? | 03:33 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Paraguay: +1817 cases (now 169860), +25 deaths (now 3343) since a day ago — Guinea: +242 cases (now 16912), +2 deaths (now 97) since a day ago — New Zealand: +4 cases (now 2409) since 23 hours ago | 03:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Jamaica receives first shipment of COVID vaccines from India → https://is.gd/MYOmTI | 03:45 |
| LjL | de-facto, i am confused by: | 03:47 |
| LjL | During the period from 14 to 20 days after the first dose, the estimated vaccine effectiveness for documented infection was 46% (95% confidence interval [CI], 40 to 51); symptomatic Covid-19 illness, 57% (95% CI, 50 to 63); hospitalization, 74% (95% CI, 56 to 86); severe illness, 62% (95% CI, 39 to 80); and death, 72% (95% CI, 19 to 100). During the period from 21 to 27 days after the first dose, the estimated effectiveness for these outcomes was 60% (95% | 03:47 |
| LjL | CI, 53 to 66), 66% (95% CI, 57 to 73), 78% (95% CI, 61 to 91), 80% (95% CI, 59 to 94), and 84% (95% CI, 44 to 100), respectively. | 03:47 |
| LjL | these seem like much lower efficacy rates than i had in my head, even though it's "just" after the first shot, but the first shot was supposedly very effective already if you didn't consider the first ~18 days... | 03:47 |
| LjL | here they are looking at days 20 to 27 (which includes the second shot), and they still have deaths (so not "100% effective against fatal outcomes" as it has sometimes been touted) and the other values are not so great either | 03:48 |
| LjL | wasn't it supposed to be around 85% effective for baseline "getting COVID" with one dose? | 03:48 |
| de-facto | yes i had that in mind like that too | 04:03 |
| de-facto | i guess it depends on their cohort | 04:04 |
| de-facto | were the other study cohorts chosen to represent the age structure of a population? | 04:05 |
| LjL | de-facto, dunno. in this one they say they had to get younger matches because the older population was basically already all vaccinated | 04:06 |
| de-facto | .title https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577 | 04:06 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.nejm.org: Safety and Efficacy of the BNT162b2 mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine | NEJM | 04:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Coronavirus: No time to go wobbly on EU’s vaccination strategy → https://is.gd/PMxAq5 | 04:06 |
| de-facto | thats the original phase III trial | 04:06 |
| LjL | and i'm also a bit "lost" about which Israeli study is which | 04:06 |
| LjL | i have https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.01.27.21250612v1 and https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.02.01.21250957v1.full which criticizes it | 04:06 |
| LjL | but i imagine when media talk about "'the' Israeli study" it's probably the one you linked? | 04:06 |
| LjL | de-facto, in that one there is a Table 1 with ages but it's only divided into 16-55 and >65 | 04:07 |
| de-facto | yeah median age also seems to be almost 7 years older | 04:08 |
| LjL | i'd say in the Israeli study, they have a *lot* more younger people, though | 04:08 |
| de-facto | yeah | 04:08 |
| LjL | de-facto, you know why i get a bit flippant when things like "there were no severe cases → so it still protects from severe cases" are said about studies like the SA one with just 20 cases? 'cause i remember reading extreme statements, presented as known fact, like (i'm sorry i really don't remember where it came from, it *may* have been one reddit commentator, which would just increase your dislike of it) something like "One thing we know for sure: s | 04:11 |
| LjL | o far we've had ZERO deaths from COVID in vaccinated people". which if you look at this study, is just not true. it would be amazing to have ZERO. | 04:11 |
| de-facto | well it never will be black and white, its always going to shift probability distributions towards one of the other extreme but they still will remain curves | 04:14 |
| de-facto | yes i agree we have to be careful with what we say, especially extremes like "vaccines are completely ineffective against SA variant" is as untrue as "we know for sure vaccinations protect 100% against fatal outcomes regardless of variant", both are not correct | 04:16 |
| de-facto | idk we just have to do our best without making any compromises on safety | 04:18 |
| de-facto | imho the best route would be to increase production rates, go for updated versions and vaccinate as fast as possible while crashing incidence down via very strict NPIs | 04:19 |
| de-facto | and for Israel, they do vaccinate quite fast but they also should crush incidence more violently via NPIs and once its low *hold* it low via herd immunity by vaccination | 04:21 |
| de-facto | basically Israel does vaccinate into their outbreak there | 04:21 |
| LjL | i only said that AZ appears to be completely ineffective against the SA variant - and that's pretty much spelled out in the study, the unknown is whether there is any effectiveness against severe disease, and i take issue with the fact it was originally suggested that there is, just because those 20 people didn't get severe disease. seemed like a case of the same fallacy: "oh, we have 20 people and they're all alive, so it's ZERO severe cases or deaths!" | 04:22 |
| de-facto | while Israel also having some NPIs (yet not sure how much) | 04:22 |
| de-facto | yeah ineffective against preventing symptomatic COVID by B.1.351 but if they only got minor symptoms it could not be excluded (but also not confirmed) if potential severe progressions would have been prevented | 04:25 |
| de-facto | sure in an ideal world we would develop the perfectly effective multivalent vaccine (containing all the latest variant sequences) and vaccinate everyone globally at the same time very quickly, it would reduce the chances of evasive mutations as much as possible but thats the ideal we should have in mind when working towards that goal (as good as we can) | 04:52 |
| de-facto | but there are also countries like Australia and New Zealand which were able to bring it down without any vaccines, so it is possible | 04:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Here's How Much Pfizer, Moderna, Johnson & Johnson Will Earn From COVID-19 Vaccines → https://is.gd/nj8S9w | 05:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: New outbreak of COVID-19 in B.C. care home where residents and staff were already vaccinated → https://is.gd/WyrC53 | 05:29 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Botswana: +1166 cases (now 32912), +54 deaths (now 413) since 4 days ago | 05:46 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: India at forefront in fighting Covid, 'really stands out' in terms of vaccine policy: IMF's Gita Gopinath → https://is.gd/ze4P85 | 06:10 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Belgium: +1117 cases (now 789008), +31 deaths (now 22292) since 22 hours ago | 06:55 |
| Brainstorm | New preprint: Post discharge persistent symptoms after COVID-19 in rheumatic and musculoskeletal diseases by Leticia Leon et al, made available as preprint on 2021-03-08 at https://medrxiv.org/cgi/content/short/2021.03.08.21253120 [... want %more?] | 06:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: After delays and ethics debates, Israel begins vaccinating 100,000 Palestinian day laborers → https://is.gd/vIiBYW | 07:02 |
| whytek | de-facto, and China... :) | 07:05 |
| whytek | I often think it's kind of interesting how New Zealand and Australia often get a mention re low numbers. | 07:06 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Isle of Man, United Kingdom: +108 cases (now 865) since 22 hours ago — Lombardy, Italy: +2301 cases (now 636278), +52 deaths (now 28790) since 22 hours ago — France: +10881 cases (now 3.9 million), +393 deaths (now 89011) since 22 hours ago — United Kingdom: +6061 cases (now 4.2 million), +86 deaths (now 124684) since 22 hours ago | 07:20 |
| CoronaBot | /r/covid19: Interim Public Health Recommendations for Fully Vaccinated People (80 votes) | https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/vaccines/fully-vaccinated-guidance.html | https://redd.it/m0mrgk | 07:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: India helping to address issue of vaccine equity: Top UN Women official → https://is.gd/2EMwkm | 08:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: (news): New US guidance says fully vaccinated people can meet without masks → https://is.gd/UIaPeA | 08:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread | March 09, 2021: The World Health Organization maintains up-to-date and global information. Please refer to our Wiki for additional information. You can find answers to frequently asked questions about Covid-19 and vaccines in our FAQ . → https://is.gd/XW4Cjz | 09:05 |
| kjd | so how can anyone ensure that s/he is vaccinated... | 09:13 |
| kjd | anyone could just say s/he is vaccinated and therefore don't need to take the necessary precautions | 09:13 |
| \mSg | If you don't trust the people you're meeting right now...maybe don't meet w/them...also, there's vaccination cards...but if you're relying on that instead of trust...well... | 09:15 |
| Arsanerit | carte jaune | 09:36 |
| Arsanerit | I don't understand this whole discussion about vaccination passes yes or no when carte jaune already exists as a WHO standard for (adult) vaccinations. | 09:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from EMA: What's new: PIP: Opinion/decision on a Paediatric investigation plan (PIP): Monovalent, live, recombinant, replication-incompetent adenoviral serotype 26 vectored vaccine expressing the full length glycoprotein of the Ebola virus Mayinga variant [Ad26.ZEBOV], decision type: , therapeutic area: , PIP number: P/0155/2020 → https://is.gd/Ae8lt3 | 10:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: WHO advises against mandating vaccine to travel → https://is.gd/aH6oXH | 10:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from WHO Euro: One year of WHO/Europe’s response to the COVID-19 pandemic: 24 January 2021 marks 1 year since the first cases of COVID-19 were detected in the WHO European Region. The Regional Incident Management Support Team (IMST), WHO/Europe’s COVID-19 response mechanism, had been activated the day before, as countries in the Region were [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/LyDMR1 | 10:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: STAT+: Biden’s silence on an FDA nominee underscores how tough it is to fill that job: Both Trump and Obama had named FDA commissioner nominees by this week in their presidencies — and neither was dealing with a global pandemic. → https://is.gd/9CZqv2 | 10:39 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: Opinion: Barriers keep many primary care practices from vaccinating seniors: Our practice has been so overwhelmed that we've had to seriously reconsider whether to continue the vaccination program. For smaller practices, offering Covid-19 vaccinations is utterly impossible. → https://is.gd/oJo4Ee | 10:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from WHO Euro: Women at the forefront of the COVID-19 response in Albania: “We will keep fighting until this virus is defeated”: On International Women’s Day, 8 March, WHO/Europe recognizes the huge contribution made by female health workers to the COVID-19 response. As Dr Hans Henri P. Kluge, WHO Regional Director for Europe, said in a [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/CqMzYV | 11:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from NPR: Here's What's In The American Rescue Plan As It Heads Toward Final Passage: The colossal package allocates money for COVID-19 vaccines, schools, small businesses and anti-poverty programs like the child tax credit. Here are the highlights, including what the Senate changed. → https://is.gd/LcvGVd | 11:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Coronavirus: Coronavirus vaccines, stimulus lift OECD economic outlook → https://is.gd/7gOc4R | 11:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from EMA: What's new: Medicine: Veterinary medicines European public assessment report (EPAR): Innovax-ND-IBD, Newcastle disease, infectious bursal disease and Marek's disease vaccine (live recombinant), Date of authorisation: 22/08/2017, Revision: 3, Status: Authorised → https://is.gd/OVu83E | 11:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from Retraction Watch: Elsevier journals ask Retraction Watch to review COVID-19 papers: At the risk of breaking the Fourth Wall, here’s a story about peer reviews that weren’t — and shouldn’t have been. Since mid-February, four different Elsevier journals have invited me to review papers about COVID-19. Now, it is true that we will [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/eLMMdV | 12:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Man, 69, dies from Covid after blood clot caused 3-hour erection, study claims → https://is.gd/70c0SL | 12:44 |
| rpifan | oh god | 13:32 |
| rpifan | thats awful | 13:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from EMA: What's new: Medicine: Veterinary medicines European public assessment report (EPAR): Purevax RCPCh, vaccine against feline viral rhinotracheitis, feline calicivirosis, feline panleucopenia and feline Chlamydophila infections, Date of authorisation: 22/02/2005, Revision: 16, Status: Authorised → https://is.gd/xaT5Vj | 13:36 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Patients combatting SARS-CoV-2 may develop myocarditis: Sometimes, when you're fighting off a virus or bacterial infection, your immune system starts a fight with your heart. When that happens, the heart muscle may become inflamed, a condition called myocarditis. → https://is.gd/Ozjv6N | 14:17 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Switzerland: +1378 cases (now 566412) since 23 hours ago | 14:30 |
| CoronaBot | /r/covid19: Pediatric nasal epithelial cells are less permissive to SARS-CoV-2 replication compared to adult cells (82 votes) | https://www.biorxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.08.434300v1 | https://redd.it/m124lk | 14:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: COVID-19 antibody study: 1 of every 8 Americans were infected by October 2020: In a first of its kind nationwide survey, Emory University researchers found that one in eight residents of the United States—more than 39 million people—had been infected with SARS-CoV-2 by the end of October 2020. → https://is.gd/YQIC2S | 15:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from StatNews: STAT+: Pharmalittle: Covid-19 forces FDA to postpone inspections; pharma urges Biden to reject WTO proposal: More than two dozen pharma companies are urging Biden to reject a proposal before the WTO to temporarily waive patent rights in order to widen access to Covid-19 medical products… → https://is.gd/Gsz7l1 | 15:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Russia to make Sputnik V vaccine in Italy; a 1st in European Union → https://is.gd/eDpUvw | 15:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: In 2018, Diplomats Warned of Risky Coronavirus Experiments in a Wuhan Lab → https://is.gd/bOSsE5 | 16:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: A year into the pandemic, the coronavirus is messing with our minds as well as our bodies: COVID-19 has hijacked people's lives, families and work. And, it has hijacked their bodies and minds in ways that they may not even be aware of. → https://is.gd/5xfAYD | 16:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Immune interference: Why even 'updated' vaccines could struggle to keep up with emerging coronavirus strains: Despite the success and optimism of the new COVID-19 vaccination campaigns being rolled out worldwide, the emergence of new viral strains threatens to undermine their effectiveness. Indeed, South Africa has been forced [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/kc96I7 | 16:24 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Timor-Leste: +19 cases (now 142) since 9 hours ago | 16:35 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Sudan begins vaccinating health workers against COVID-19: Sudan began inoculating frontline healthcare workers against coronavirus on Tuesday after receiving its first batch of vaccines last week, a health official said. → https://is.gd/jsxHSu | 16:55 |
| Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Efficacy and Safety of Nitazoxanide for Post Exposure Prophylaxis of COVID-19 in Household Contacts → https://is.gd/j7hQIB | 17:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Evaluation of Prognosis of COVID-19 Patients With Only CT Findings, Only RT-PCR Positivity and Both of Them Positive → https://is.gd/LgaLQc | 17:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Evaluation of Post-covid 19 Patients Who Receive Ozonetheraphy With Thorax CT → https://is.gd/NHMqHk | 17:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Psychological Impact of Covid-19 Assiut University Hospital Experience → https://is.gd/fyWjkA | 18:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from In The Pipeline: Drug Approvals Over the Last Ten Years: Here’s a look back at the last ten years of FDA drug approvals, and it’s a pretty encouraging read. As the authors mention, in the early 2000s there was quite a bit of worry about the directions that drug research (and drug approvals) might be taking. We were getting to the end of [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/h5uCEn | 18:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: A new predictive model helps identify those at risk for severe COVID-19: Researchers at the Buck Institute analyzed data from the COVID-19 Symptom Tracker app used by 3 million people in the United Kingdom, adding the use of immunosuppressant medication, use of a mobility aid, shortness of breath, fever, and fatigue to the list [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/RCinat | 18:40 |
| CoronaBot | /r/coronavirus: US daily death toll from Covid-19 below 1,000 for first time in months (10223 votes) | https://www.france24.com/en/americas/20210309-us-daily-death-toll-from-covid-19-below-1-000-for-first-time-in-months | https://redd.it/m136d0 | 18:42 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Recent Commits to links:master: Link to abstract (which has a link to the PDF) instead of to the prel… ( https://github.com/ljl-covid/links/commit/cb75bd312847072531f7aeab7a9d2e8f06cfc7b2 ) | 18:43 | |
| Brainstorm | New from https://covid19.specops.network : Link to abstract (which has a link to the PDF) instead of to the prel…: Link to abstract (which has a link to the PDF) instead of to the preliminary PDFwhich is what I generally do elsewhere on this page, too. Consider linking to doi.org though maybe? → https://is.gd/lSpthN | 18:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Home testing for COVID-19 could prevent infections and reduce deaths at justifiable cost: Mailing a package of SARS-CoV-2 tests to every household in America and asking people to use them once a week could greatly reduce total infections and mortality at a justifiable cost, a new study led by the Yale School of Public Health finds. → https://is.gd/g35nq5 | 19:13 |
| LjL | %vax radvac | 19:43 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, no such vaccine found. Try checking https://covidvax.org | 19:43 |
| whytek | I do find it remarkable that there is so much concern about other people being vaccinated. OK, I get the logic.. the vaccine itself is not efficient enough to actually protect you if you get vaccinated, it'll only work if everybody else is vaccinated too. But with the numbers, it seems like the statistical risk to you of contact with a (infected and contagious) un vaccinated person when you are vaccinated is low? | 20:02 |
| whytek | I imagine somebody here has donde the mathematics on it. | 20:02 |
| whytek | *done the | 20:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from New Scientist: People who have had covid-19 may only need one dose of vaccine: Small study shows people who have previously been infected with the coronavirus make similar levels of antibodies after one dose as people normally have after two shots → https://is.gd/ii4I79 | 20:05 |
| LjL | whytek, uh, the vast majority of people are unvaccinated in most countries | 20:05 |
| LjL | also the risk of being in contact with an infected and contagious unvaccinated person is the same whether or not you are vaccinated | 20:06 |
| LjL | maybe you meant something else, because that "when you are vaccinated" doesn't make a lot of sense | 20:06 |
| LjL | anyway if i am not vaccinated (which i'm not, like most people), and i need to be seeing some person who meets a lot of other people (like say a doctor), it's kind of important that that person is vaccinated. i think that's what most people would have as a concern. | 20:07 |
| LjL | and which is why it makes sense to vaccinate certain categories of people, not just for *their* protection, but because they are more likely to end up causing super-spreading events, i.e. giving it to many other people, just because they *come in contact* many people | 20:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from FDA Press Releases: FDA: Coronavirus (COVID-19) Update: March 9, 2021 → https://is.gd/2x6SKk | 20:15 |
| whytek | Ljl, as usual.. you make sense. | 20:18 |
| whytek | I'm commenting on sentiment I read, that projects towards a future when vaccination is "complete" and some % of the population has declined to be vaccinated. | 20:19 |
| whytek | so "other people" in this context is that group, not your local doctor. | 20:19 |
| whytek | IIUC we're looking at about 20-30% still unwilling to be vaccinated, although it appears to be a downward curve. | 20:21 |
| whytek | That's my quick worldwide average pulled out of my head.. | 20:21 |
| whytek | nothing specific. | 20:21 |
| whytek | It's less in some countries. | 20:22 |
| LjL | whytek, whew thanks, many people seem to be starting to think i really don't :P | 20:35 |
| LjL | whytek, the thing i think is that we're also dealing with vaccines that have a 60-70% efficacy. America, so far, has been only using Pfizer and Moderna, which have nearly complete efficacy at 95% or so | 20:36 |
| LjL | but it won't always be that way, J&J is approved now the efficacy of that is much lower | 20:36 |
| LjL | so you need herd immunity to stop the virus from circulating | 20:36 |
| LjL | you know that *your* vaccine only protects you a little, like 60%-70% | 20:37 |
| LjL | to be protected in a way that makes you feel safe, you also need to know that the virus isn't circulating | 20:37 |
| LjL | and the virus won't be circulating only if nearly everyone takes a 70%-effective vaccine (or 70% take a 100%-effective vaccine) | 20:37 |
| LjL | that's because 70% or so is deemed to be the point at which you read herd immunity with this virus (although sadly with the variants it might be higher) | 20:38 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Italy: +19725 cases (now 3.1 million), +376 deaths (now 100479) since a day ago — France: +16356 cases (now 3.9 million), +297 deaths (now 89230) since 19 hours ago — Isle of Man: +87 cases (now 952) since 22 hours ago — Netherlands: +4340 cases (now 1.1 million), +44 deaths (now 15941) since 19 hours ago | 20:47 |
| whytek | Well, those slides and paper from Geert Vanden Bossche are without a doubt the scariest thing I have read yet. | 20:59 |
| whytek | I guess we can only hope that guy is loopy | 21:00 |
| LjL | who is that / which one are those? | 21:01 |
| whytek | https://mcusercontent.com/92561d6dedb66a43fe9a6548f/files/ee29efbe-ffaf-4289-8782-d323642a0072/concern_about_using_current_Covid_19_vaccines_for_mass_vaccination_in_the_midst_of_a_pandemic_Geert_Vanden_Bossche.pdf | 21:04 |
| whytek | https://twitter.com/GVDBossche/status/1367128400863846401 | 21:05 |
| whytek | https://www.deblauwetijger.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Geert-vanden-Bossche-2.pdf | 21:05 |
| whytek | That's what I have read. | 21:05 |
| whytek | I do not claim to understand the more technical parts, but I get the jist... | 21:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Coronavirus: France to give 500,000 vaccine doses to poorer countries → https://is.gd/qKAygG | 21:08 |
| LjL | "When one follows the science,andnothing but the science, it becomes extremely difficult to not label | 21:15 |
| LjL | 5Author: G. Vanden Bossche, DVM, PhD; 26 February 2021Page 5ongoing mass vaccination campaigns as a crime, not only to public health but also to individual health." | 21:15 |
| LjL | this sounds like politics, not science | 21:15 |
| bin_bash | I have a major problem with that PDF in that it does not cite any sources | 21:18 |
| LjL | his twitter account was made this month | 21:19 |
| LjL | the underlying message (as made more explicit by enthusiastic reply tweets) seems to be "do nothing, just let the pandemic do its thing" | 21:20 |
| LjL | it's not a new message | 21:20 |
| bin_bash | https://be.linkedin.com/in/geertvandenbossche | 21:20 |
| bin_bash | he's at least published https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=Geert+Vanden+Bossche&hl=en&as_sdt=0&as_vis=1&oi=scholart | 21:21 |
| LjL | really i don't know what to think anymore. he may have a point. i don't know. i don't think anybody really knows. | 21:28 |
| LjL | we may have accrued new technology and knowledge thanks to the scientific efforts done for this pandemic, but i think, perhaps unsurprisingly, we are also staring at the incredible amount of unknowns we have | 21:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: UK anger at EU claim it has banned vaccine exports: Foreign Secretary Dominic Raab writes to Charles Michel to say UK has 'not blocked the export of a single COVID-19 vaccine.' → https://is.gd/se9KiO | 21:39 |
| Arsanerit | what crime? | 21:39 |
| Arsanerit | Has the UK banned exports or not? | 21:40 |
| bin_bash | where'd you get crime from? | 21:41 |
| Arsanerit | 21:15:04 < LjL> 5Author: G. Vanden Bossche, DVM, PhD; 26 February 2021Page 5ongoing mass vaccination campaigns as a crime, not only to public health but also to individual health." | 21:41 |
| bin_bash | oh I thought you meant referring to the UK thing | 21:41 |
| Arsanerit | no | 21:41 |
| Arsanerit | well, that too, but in a different line | 21:42 |
| Arsanerit | No link between my two lines. | 21:42 |
| Arsanerit | I apologise for the confusion. | 21:42 |
| bin_bash | no worries, I thought maybe you misread claim as crime | 21:42 |
| bin_bash | I think what Bossche is saying that deploying prophylactic vaccines on a currently infectious population is a crime (hyperbole) because it will encourage variants | 21:43 |
| bin_bash | I'm not saying I agree with hin | 21:43 |
| bin_bash | him* | 21:43 |
| bin_bash | That's just how I'm interpreting what he's saying in the shortest form | 21:43 |
| Arsanerit | What does prophylactic mean? | 21:45 |
| bin_bash | it means that something is meant to prevent disease | 21:46 |
| LjL | bin_bash: I copypasted from the text after those slides | 21:46 |
| LjL | He said it's a crime to vaccinate during the pandemic basically | 21:46 |
| Arsanerit | Ok. | 21:46 |
| bin_bash | right | 21:47 |
| Arsanerit | That would appear to be a minority view. | 21:47 |
| bin_bash | Definitely. | 21:47 |
| LjL | It just doesn't sound exceptionally scientific to use a hyperbole like thst | 21:47 |
| bin_bash | agreed | 21:47 |
| bin_bash | I think he's extremely concerned and emotionally invested | 21:47 |
| bin_bash | he does actually make some good points though | 21:49 |
| bin_bash | One of the "features" of the vaccines is if you do still get covid, it's much more mild or asymptomatic | 21:49 |
| bin_bash | well that's helpful for the virus to spread more easily | 21:49 |
| Arsanerit | I thought recent research was indicating that even the spread is reduced for some of the vaccines. | 21:50 |
| LjL | bin_bash: well, that's if you're actually shedding infectious amounts. He does make the claim that with the variants, vaccinated people ARE shedding a lot of virus around, and, well, that's a claim I'd really really like to see a reference for | 21:53 |
| LjL | Anyway if he's in good faith, I understand that feeling of being "extremely concerned and emotionally invested" while everyone around you doesn't seem to get the point | 21:53 |
| bin_bash | LjL: https://www.cnbc.com/2021/02/12/recovered-covid-patients-have-been-reinfected-with-new-virus-strains-who-says.html | 21:57 |
| bin_bash | https://www.wave3.com/2021/02/22/health-department-reinfected-after-finishing-full-covid-vaccination-cycle/ | 21:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from NPR: Africa CDC Director On The Continent's Outlook For Vaccinations: Africa is lowest in the world in COVID-19 cases and deaths — but also in vaccinations. Dr. John Nkengasong says he's working on multiple fronts to secure doses and improve distribution. → https://is.gd/dR7S2j | 22:10 |
| whytek | I wouldn't get hung up on the "crime" line. | 22:12 |
| whytek | I also think the age of a twitter account is irrelevant. Alhough it seems like a strange thing to many who have integrated social media to such an extent in their lives, there are people who had no interest.. | 22:14 |
| whytek | Until, maybe, something comes up and you feel you need to get a message out. | 22:14 |
| LjL | Well like you I cannot say I have the knowledge to get into the merits of what he's saying, so I can only evaluate indirect clues. Another one is the "paper" having a watermark of "UNCLASSIFIED - DO COPY - DO DISTRIBUTE" which is a bit typical of certain propaganda | 22:14 |
| whytek | Yeah, that's weird. | 22:14 |
| LjL | According to his LinkedIn, he's been in an *avalanche* of important-sounding vaccine-related positions. Usually those people need to be on social media whether they personally like it or not | 22:15 |
| whytek | I whole-heartedly agree with you LjL, on "new technology" and "staring at unknowns" | 22:16 |
| whytek | Ok, I'm not going to try to character assasinate - I'm just going to take note and move along... | 22:17 |
| whytek | Not like there's a lot I can do about it right now anyway. Not even my personal decision on getting a vaccine as that is not even on the table. | 22:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from Medical Xpress: Diseases, Conditions, Syndromes: Study confirms very low risk of severe allergic reaction to COVID vaccines → https://is.gd/JbhW0W | 22:21 |
| CoronaBot | /r/covid19: Persistence of symptoms up to 10 months following acute COVID-19 illness (86 votes) | https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.07.21253072v1 | https://redd.it/m1aw0e | 23:02 |
| de-facto | .title https://science.psu.edu/news/some-vaccines-support-evolution-more-virulent-viruses https://science.psu.edu/news/andrew-read-elected-fellow-royal-society https://pastebin.com/eqyYLaBv | 23:17 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto, the URL could not be loaded | 23:17 |
| de-facto | "Some Vaccines Support Evolution of More-Virulent Viruses" | 23:18 |
| de-facto | from 2015 about Marek's Disease in Chicken population | 23:18 |
| de-facto | .title https://journals.plos.org/plosbiology/article?id=10.1371/journal.pbio.1002198 | 23:24 |
| de-facto | "Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission of Highly Virulent Pathogens" | 23:24 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From journals.plos.org: Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission of Highly Virulent Pathogens | 23:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: COVID corruption scandal hounds Angela Merkel's CDU/CSU. Germany's latest political scandal is directly tied to the coronavirus pandemic; Two conservative politicians received kickbacks for brokering mask deals → https://is.gd/agMVv6 | 23:24 |
| Arsanerit | Weren't some scientists worried about the UK holding back the second dose as they feared this might stimulate variants of concern? | 23:25 |
| Arsanerit | CSU is not Anglea Merkel's. | 23:25 |
| de-facto | cited 204 times according to https://scholar.google.com/scholar?q=Andrew+Read+%22Imperfect+vaccination+can+enhance+the+transmission+of+highly+virulent+pathogens%22 | 23:25 |
| de-facto | i should emphasise this is NOT SARS-CoV-2 but Marek's Disease in chicken population, so a completely different thing, but the principles are interesting | 23:26 |
| Arsanerit | I would like to be vaccinated twice, please (unless it's with th Johnson & Johnson COVID-19 vaccine or Ad5-nCov). | 23:29 |
| de-facto | the closer vaccinations can come to the ideal of sterilizing immunity the better | 23:30 |
| Arsanerit | When can we expect CureVac COVID-19 vaccine (CVnCoV)? | 23:31 |
| de-facto | soon | 23:39 |
| de-facto | .title https://berthub.eu/articles/posts/curevac-vaccine-and-wonders-of-biology/ | 23:39 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From berthub.eu: The CureVac Vaccine, and a brief tour through some of the wonders of nature - Articles | 23:39 |
| de-facto | .title https://www.curevac.com/en/covid-19/ | 23:44 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.curevac.com: COVID-19 - CureVac | 23:44 |
| de-facto | .title https://www.curevac.com/en/2021/02/12/curevac-initiates-rolling-submission-with-european-medicines-agency-for-covid-19-vaccine-candidate-cvncov/ | 23:44 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.curevac.com: CureVac Initiates Rolling Submission With European Medicines Agency for COVID-19 Vaccine Candidate, CVnCoV - CureVac | 23:44 |
| de-facto | .title https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/news/ema-starts-rolling-review-curevacs-covid-19-vaccine-cvncov | 23:45 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.ema.europa.eu: EMA starts rolling review of CureVac’s COVID-19 vaccine (CVnCoV) | European Medicines Agency | 23:45 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: French nuclear tests contaminated 110,000 in Pacific, says study → https://is.gd/ePIXzy | 23:55 |
| Arsanerit | de-facto: days, weeks, months? | 23:59 |
| Arsanerit | gn | 23:59 |
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