libera/##covid-19/ Saturday, 2021-06-12

BrainstormNew from The Lancet (Online): [Clinical Picture] SARS-CoV-2 vaccine-induced immune thrombotic thrombocytopenia treated with immunoglobulin and argatroban: A 50-year-old woman attended our emergency department with a 3-day history of severe back pain and a severe headache. 10 days earlier she had received the first dose of vaccine against [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Slc6oW00:32
BrainstormUpdates for Guatemala: +1861 cases (now 269308), +28 deaths (now 8416) since 20 hours ago — Switzerland: +6 deaths (now 10859) since 19 hours ago00:33
BrainstormNew from BBC Health: (news): Covid: Is there a limit to how much worse variants can get? → https://is.gd/7JeLPk01:35
BrainstormUpdates for Namibia: +1432 cases (now 62806), +5 deaths (now 973) since a day ago01:36
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): China_Flu: Biological Warfare and the Lab Leak Hypothesis → https://is.gd/RVX6TF02:06
BrainstormUpdates for United Kingdom: +7597 cases (now 4.6 million), +12 deaths (now 128008) since 23 hours ago — Togo: +21 cases (now 13597) since 22 hours ago — Canada: +1493 cases (now 1.4 million) since 23 hours ago — Netherlands: +1522 cases (now 1.7 million), +5 deaths (now 17845) since 23 hours ago02:38
LjLoof02:38
ublxwheee next wave here we come02:41
LjLalso that BBC article is disheartening02:41
* ublx declines to read it then02:41
-RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Recent Commits to links:master: Change freenode to Libera ( https://github.com/ljl-covid/links/commit/03be413e402f65daf630c5f082411fd6aed249bf )02:43
BrainstormNew from https://covid19.specops.network : Change freenode to Libera: The channel that this project relates to is now officially on Libera (##covid-19) as well as Matrix (#covid-19:matrix.org) → https://is.gd/pf1GyG02:50
BrainstormUpdates for Uganda: +1566 cases (now 58515), +6 deaths (now 408) since a day ago — Malawi: +23 cases (now 34470) since 22 hours ago03:03
BrainstormUpdates for French Guiana: +214 cases (now 25506), +3 deaths (now 133) since 2 days ago03:40
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): Covid2019: Johnson & Johnson told to throw out 60M jab doses after possible contamination → https://is.gd/2FYbhN04:26
BrainstormUpdates for Zimbabwe: +192 cases (now 39688), +3 deaths (now 1629) since a day ago — Germany: +74 deaths (now 89987) since 23 hours ago04:30
BrainstormUpdates for Liberia: +102 cases (now 2484), +5 deaths (now 93) since 2 days ago05:07
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: CDC investigating heart inflammation following COVID-19 vaccine → https://is.gd/VKldtL05:30
BrainstormUpdates for Panama: +916 cases (now 386269), +8 deaths (now 6427) since a day ago — Rwanda: +202 cases (now 27862), +2 deaths (now 368) since 23 hours ago — United Kingdom: +7780 cases (now 4.6 million), +15 deaths (now 128012) since 23 hours ago — France: +54 deaths (now 110378) since 23 hours ago05:32
BrainstormNew from StatNews: Opinion: If vaccine apartheid exists, vaccine billionaires shouldn’t: Founders and investors have been allowed to bend the course of the pandemic to their private benefit. When a few people win big, everyone else loses. → https://is.gd/HysdUV06:12
BrainstormUpdates for Honduras: +1400 cases (now 245695), +32 deaths (now 6599) since 22 hours ago — Gambia: +6 cases (now 6008), +1 deaths (now 180) since 4 days ago — Germany: +81 deaths (now 90015) since 23 hours ago06:34
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: U.S. Sanctions Block COVID-19 Vaccines For Venezuela - Kawsachun News → https://is.gd/XVl8YZ06:34
BrainstormUpdates for England, United Kingdom: +6615 cases (now 4.0 million), +16 deaths (now 112479) since 23 hours ago — Moscow, Russia: +5853 cases (now 1.2 million), +60 deaths (now 20771) since 23 hours ago — Parana, Brazil: +5745 cases (now 1.1 million), +135 deaths (now 27921) since 23 hours ago — Piaui, Brazil: +1576 cases (now 283069), +20 deaths (now 6179) since 23 hours ago07:36
BrainstormUpdates for Mongolia: +1792 cases (now 73896), +9 deaths (now 351) since 23 hours ago — India: +84332 cases (now 29.4 million), +3801 deaths (now 365752) since 23 hours ago08:38
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: The world has reported more COVID-19 deaths in 2021 than in 2020, and it's only June. → https://is.gd/j20MQG08:43
BrainstormNew from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread | June 12, 2021: Please refer to our Wiki for more information on COVID-19 and our sub. You can find answers to frequently asked questions in our FAQ , where there is valuable information such as our: → https://is.gd/JsZCif09:05
BrainstormUpdates for Kyrgyzstan: +619 cases (now 109812), +5 deaths (now 1881) since a day ago — Uzbekistan: +314 cases (now 103206), +1 deaths (now 705) since 23 hours ago09:40
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: The world has reported more COVID-19 deaths in 2021 than in 2020, and it's only June → https://is.gd/ZuWmPy09:58
pwr22de-facto: "A third of all confirmed Delta variant patients who needed emergency care had received at least one vaccine dose" <- https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jun/11/covid-cases-in-england-rising-at-fastest-rate-since-winter-wave10:10
pwr22> given the efficacy of jabs against the Delta variant rises from 33% at the first dose to about 80% at the second10:12
pwr22Not sure where they're getting that data from10:12
pwr22Deaths: unvaccinated 23, vaccinated 1910:14
pwr22😧10:15
BrainstormUpdates for Andaman and Nicobar Islands, India: +36 cases (now 7233) since a day ago10:36
BrainstormUpdates for Russia: +13510 cases (now 5.2 million), +399 deaths (now 126073) since 23 hours ago — Puerto Rico: +62 cases (now 122516), +1 deaths (now 2530) since 22 hours ago — Laos: +11 cases (now 1990) since 21 hours ago11:01
-RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Feed: Ripartizione della quota dell’otto per mille dell’Irpef a diretta gestione statale - Assegnazione della quota per l’anno 2019 ( https://www.governo.it/it/articolo/ripartizione-della-quota-dell-otto-mille-dell-irpef-diretta-gestione-statale-assegnazione-1 )12:00
BrainstormUpdates for Philippines: +8003 cases (now 1.3 million), +145 deaths (now 22652) since 23 hours ago12:03
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Russia Raises 2020 Covid-19 Death Toll By 38% in Grim Admission → https://is.gd/eEPAzg12:38
yutaI heard that Infections in UK is increasing. panic again?13:18
darsieseems so: https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom&logScale=yes&cumulative=no&miscType=Reff13:26
yutadarsie, maybe , Japan follows UK.13:30
de-facto.title https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/11/us/politics/covid-vaccine-emergent-johnson-johnson.html13:37
Brainstormde-facto: From www.nytimes.com: F.D.A. Tells Johnson & Johnson That 60 Million Vaccine Doses Cannot Be Used - The New York Times13:37
de-facto.title https://imgur.com/a/Wbw1OKK https://i.imgur.com/L3a6Wq5.png src: https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus/DESH/Bericht_VOC_2021-06-09.pdf?__blob=publicationFile13:57
Brainstormde-facto: From imgur.com: COVID Germany: SARS-CoV-2-VoC Evolution - Album on Imgur13:57
de-facto"For VOC B.1.351 a share of 0.4% was determined for week 21/2021."14:01
de-facto"The VOC P.1 also has a very low share of 0.1%, the share of VOC B.1.617.2 is 2.5%, it should be noted here that, as noted in Table 3, the share of VOC B. 1.617.2 was subsequently calculated to 3.1% for week 20/2021."14:01
de-facto"Since, as in the previous weeks, late registrations are also expected for the current period, the proportions of the variant, as in previous reports, can change retrospectively (see preliminary remark)."14:01
de-facto(google translated from the PDF)14:01
de-factoso it seem, unfortunately, B.1.617.2 is on the rise in Germany too :/14:02
BrainstormNew from The Indian Express: World: UK considers up to 4-week delay to end lockdown due to Delta variant: Report → https://is.gd/jB9p6N14:03
yutade-facto, I see.14:09
de-factofortunately for both Japan and Germany the incidence is falling hence no explosion by delta voc yet14:09
de-factohttps://toyokeizai.net/sp/visual/tko/covid19/en.html14:09
de-factohttps://corona.rki.de/14:09
yutade-facto, july , we prepare explotion :)14:10
de-factobut the portion of delta voc (B.1.617.2) is increasing in both places14:10
de-factohopefully not14:10
de-factovaccinations are progressing and people hopefully still remain somewhat careful and do physical distancing14:10
precursoris delta any more dangerous?14:13
BrainstormNew from Gazzetta Ufficiale italiana: MINISTERO DELLA SALUTE - ORDINANZA 11 giugno 2021: Ulteriori misure  urgenti  in  materia  di  contenimento  e  gestionedell'emergenza   epidemiologica    da    COVID-19    nelle    RegioniEmilia-Romagna, Lazio, Lombardia, Piemonte, Puglia e nella  Provinciaautonoma di Trento. (21A03664) → https://is.gd/zIWXjD14:14
de-factounfortunately it seems the delta voc (B.1.617.2, 21A/S:478K) https://covariants.org/variants/21A.S.478K is on the rise in every single country where it was detected https://covariants.org/per-country14:14
de-factoquestion is how well those sequence numbers reflect the prevalence (portions of mutants contributing to all infections) in reality14:14
de-factoultimately it *all* depends on the behavior of the people, if they can contain it with a reproduction R(B.1.617.2) < 114:16
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: Some COVID Long Haulers Are Being Diagnosed With POTS: Experts speculate that COVID-19 antibodies may be targeting the autonomic nervous system, which can cause POTS after an infection → https://is.gd/6IU9FM14:24
de-factoand we urgently need *massively* more vaccine production rates, by *orders of magnitude*14:27
de-factoas long as we tolerate massive incidence (hence massive breeding of mutants) in any place of the world we will have to expect new mutants to bounce back, such that those have special capabilities like fitness advantage (more contagious, more reproduction) some also immuno-evasive (with increased vaccine breakthrough rates)14:30
de-factoand since global traveling still is tolerated they will spread worldwide instantly (as demonstrated many many times by now)14:31
de-factoi know, its unfortunate, but that is the situation right now, we have to be honest and face it, if we dont want this we need to establish a global effort against it, not only specific countries, that does not work in a globalized world with a global pandemic14:32
de-factonot only would we need global solidarity with helping to bring down incidence (hence breeding) and increase vaccination rates (to make it more difficult for a new mutant to spread fast, hence buy some time to contain it), we also need to do such things in a globally *synchronized* way (which might be the most difficult part)14:35
de-factoi know i keep repeating myself on that for almost a year now, hence my hope on such an effort may be unrealistic14:36
de-factohttps://img.pr0gramm.com/2021/05/19/df311588f6ffede1.jpg14:37
de-facto.title https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0264410X2100736214:54
Brainstormde-facto: From www.sciencedirect.com: A new group at increased risk of a SARS-CoV-2 infection emerges: The recently vaccinated - ScienceDirect14:54
de-factoso i was correct with my assumption that in the first days after vaccination there might be an increased risk for infection14:55
BrainstormNew from The Indian Express: World: Russia’s Covid-19 cases spike by nearly 50% in a week → https://is.gd/EzqM7j14:56
de-facto.tell Arsanerit https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0264410X2100736215:04
Brainstormde-facto, I'll pass Humuhumunukunuku aka Arsanerit your message when they are around.15:04
BrainstormUpdates for Nepal: +2382 cases (now 606778), +61 deaths (now 8366) since 23 hours ago15:09
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Saudi Arabia bans foreigners from hajj over Covid concerns → https://is.gd/FED4Xv15:29
BrainstormUpdates for Bangladesh: +1637 cases (now 824486), +39 deaths (now 13071) since 22 hours ago15:34
dTalde-facto: as soon as I read the headline I thought "the increased risk comes from people letting their guard down", and then I read the article and that's indeed what it suggests15:36
dTalis that what you meant?15:37
BrainstormNew from This Week In Virology: TWiV 767: COVID-19 clinical update #66 with Dr. Daniel Griffin: In COVID-19 clinical update #66, Daniel Griffin covers treatment guidelines from IDSA, hospitalization of adolescents, estimating epidemiological dynamics from viral load distributions, incidence of infection according to baseline antibody status, assessment [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/GOF5Ce15:50
BrainstormUpdates for Zambia: +2358 cases (now 110332), +17 deaths (now 1365) since 22 hours ago15:59
dTalI actually find that *comforting*16:10
dTalit means having my guard up *helps*16:10
de-factowell it is one suggested mechanism, the other would be the (partial) reduction of immune system resources in the very first days (i think i read something about neutrophils etc)16:12
de-factothe consequence would be the same though: be extra careful in the very first days after vaccination16:12
de-factoafaik there also are (anecdotal) reports of other (permanent) viral infections blooming after vaccinations, such as some herpes viruses caused ones, nothing dramatic, but it would also suggest that immune response is "directed" at the vaccine response in the very first days hence may potentially weaken temporarily for other tasks16:15
de-factobut since we dont have any statistics about that its not a clear correlation, yet it would fit in with the general idea that immune resources are dedicated for vaccine response in the first days and then return to normal after that16:16
de-factoi think its not a dramatic effect, otherwise it would have become obvious much earlier16:18
BrainstormNew from Politico: Johnson indicates England’s June 21 reopening could face delays: The UK prime minister called the spread of a new COVID variant 'a matter of serious, serious concern.' → https://is.gd/rMwrBO16:22
dTalde-facto: I think it's fairly unlikely that immune system load changes the chance of infection much16:24
dTalit might change the severity of progression, but covid evades the immune system at first anyway16:25
dTalif your daily lifestyle is such that your innate response is constantly battling off sub-threshold infections, you're extremely likely to catch the disease before you're ever vaxxed16:26
de-factohmm so if immune resources could be considered somewhat limited the question would be for what purpose they are invested in having the best overall immune protection16:33
de-factoand since vaccinations, on principle, would intend to somewhat alarm the immune system towards the "fake infection" (the vaccination), it only would be consistent if it would concentrate a bigger part of those limited resources towards that "potential eminent infection" (that only is a fake one by the vaccination process)16:34
de-factobut that is a bit of my own speculation, to be honest there16:34
BrainstormUpdates for Florida, United States: +11454 cases (now 2.3 million), +292 deaths (now 37265) since 6 days ago — St. Kitts and Nevis: +36 cases (now 119) since 6 days ago16:37
de-factoi think it also could be seen in other scenarios, i bet there would be a temporal correlation between colds and herpes blooming etc16:37
de-factomeaning if immune resources are directed towards some other infection they are not targeted on the permanent infections (or other ones that are not on the "highest priority" in the immune response)16:38
BrainstormUpdates for Germany: +77 deaths (now 90023) since 23 hours ago17:01
BrainstormUpdates for Palau: +1 cases (now 2) since 9 days ago17:39
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): Saturday 12 June 2021 Update: submitted by /u/HippolasCage to r/CoronavirusUK → https://is.gd/7yhIta17:48
BrainstormUpdates for Guernsey: +1 cases (now 824) since 9 days ago18:04
BrainstormUpdates for Uganda: +1735 cases (now 60250), +15 deaths (now 423) since 15 hours ago18:39
ottavio_I've just had my 2nd AZ jab. When am I supposed to start experiencing side effects?18:54
binwithin a few hours usually18:58
ottavio_bin: few as 3, 6 , 12 hours?18:59
binottavio_: within 48 hours apparently18:59
ottavio_I'm quite scared.18:59
binhttps://www2.hse.ie/screening-and-vaccinations/covid-19-vaccine/astrazeneca/side-effects/18:59
* bin offers ottavio_ a huge18:59
ottavio_I've read that18:59
binhow old are you?18:59
ottavio_5419:00
ottavio_bin offers ottavio_  a huge ... sum of money?19:00
binlolol19:00
bina hug*19:00
ottavio_ah19:00
ottavio_a check would do as well.19:01
bini think your age range has fewer side effects which is good19:01
binlol19:01
ottavio_well 1st jab was a nightmare19:01
ottavio_I literally felt I was going to die19:01
ottavio_Mixed with feeling I was already dead.19:01
ottavio_Couldnt ring my GP because I couldnt speak.19:02
binoh wow19:03
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Delta-variant COVID-19 cluster detected at Strasbourg art school → https://is.gd/ETR0Mh19:03
binI would be concerned too19:03
binbut if it makes you feel any better, i got the pfizer shot19:03
binand when i got the first one i felt HORRIBLE19:03
binlike really really tired19:03
binsuper sore19:03
bincouldnt think straight/brain fog19:03
generaChAdOx19:03
binbut then after the second one, just a sore arm19:04
ottavio_I should take my side effects as a compliment because they say that the younger have more side effects.19:04
ottavio_I never think straight so thats not a problem.19:04
binlol19:05
BrainstormUpdates for Cuba: +1372 cases (now 156238), +10 deaths (now 1075) since 23 hours ago — Italy: +1722 cases (now 4.2 million), +52 deaths (now 126976) since 22 hours ago19:29
de-factoiirc the side effects from AstraZeneca boosters were said to be less than for primers, possibly because both employ the same ChAdOx1 Adenovirus vector and immunity also builds up against the vector itself19:32
ottavio_de-facto: that is the scond jab is useless?19:40
ottavio_" immunity also builds up against the vector itself" ????19:40
dTalthe second jab is obviously not useless19:46
de-factoits not useless, i did not say that. obviously it increases immunity also against the antigen (sars-cov-2), otherwise they would not have approved the two dose trials19:48
de-factowhat i meant is that you probably will experience less side effects for second AZ shot while it increases your immunity against sars-cov-219:49
Lindisfarneanecdotally ppl report more flulike symptoms after 2nd19:49
de-factowith mRNA19:49
de-factowith vectors it seems to be the opposite19:50
LindisfarneSystemic side effects (diarrhoea, fatigue, headache, chills, nausea) affected fewer than one in four people, but were more common with AstraZeneca, with at least one symptom reported by 33.7% after the first dose, compared to 13.5% and 22% after the first and second respective dose of Pfizer.19:51
Lindisfarnehttps://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/astrazeneca-and-pfizer-what-are-the-side-effects-f19:51
Lindisfarnethere it is, without anecdotes19:51
dTalde-facto you answered too quickly :p19:52
dTalAstraZeneca is an mRNA vaccine Lindisfarne19:52
dTalwait now I'm confused19:54
LindisfarneThe Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine is based on the virus’s genetic instructions for building the spike protein. But unlike the Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna vaccines, which store the instructions in single-stranded RNA, the Oxford vaccine uses double-stranded DNA.19:54
LindisfarnedTal19:55
dTalde-facto: what do you mean "with mRNA, with vectors it seems to be the opposite"19:55
dTalLindisfarne: ah, okay19:55
dTalI was not aware of this subtle distinction19:56
Lindisfarnethese are the first mRNA vaccines ever19:56
Lindisfarnefirst ever distributed.  people have worked on them for decades prior19:57
Lindisfarneits not a subtle distinction at all; in fact, mRNA vaccination is ushering in an entirely new world of infectious disease management19:57
Lindisfarnehttps://www.statnews.com/events/targeting-mrna-the-new-frontier-of-tailored-therapeutics/19:58
de-factoAstraZeneca is using the same Adenovirus vector for primer and booster (ChAdOx1)20:00
de-factowith mRNA it seems that side effects are more pronounced with the second injection, while with same Adenovirus vectors they are more pronounced on first injection20:00
de-factomRNA = Pfizer/BioNTech, Moderna, CureVac20:01
BrainstormUpdates for Canada: +18 deaths (now 25891) since 17 hours ago20:06
* LjL-Matrix uploaded an image: (237KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/matrix.org/nQNktGUtsVcZoyuWfqnYhqwL/5f7b69da-b6f9-4762-9173-646d45a2f666.jpg >20:35
LjL-MatrixVery social distanced!20:35
BrainstormNew from r/WorldNews: worldnews: More evidence emerges of India’s true death toll from covid-19 - New surveys corroborate earlier estimates that the number is some six times higher → https://is.gd/5Cyr8620:49
BrainstormUpdates for South Africa: +9319 cases (now 1.7 million), +114 deaths (now 57706) since a day ago — Morocco: +455 cases (now 523620), +5 deaths (now 9207) since a day ago — N. Cyprus: +53 cases (now 7526), +1 deaths (now 34) since a day ago — Comoros: +5 cases (now 3899) since a day ago21:33
BrainstormUpdates for France: +43 deaths (now 110404) since 20 hours ago23:00
BrainstormUpdates for St. Kitts and Nevis: +36 cases (now 155) since 7 hours ago — Canada: +22 deaths (now 25895) since 20 hours ago23:37
dTalso clearly we should mix it up and use mRNA for the first dose and adenovirus for the second!?23:53
LjLdTal, in the absence of other medical, commercial or geopolitical hurdles, one would conceivably run a trial with both combinations in the first place :P23:56
dTalI don't think there's any theoretical reason why mixing brands *shouldn't* work?23:58
LjLdTal, not particularly, but also no reason why you wouldn't do a study before doing it in any combination23:59

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