| de-facto | oh nice N vs S | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| nixonix | i quoted couple of interesting parts from that genome analysis, couple hours above | 00:00 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Covid jab rollout for 12 to 15-year-olds to start in schools in England → https://is.gd/sXVE4B | 00:00 |
| nixonix | now if you compare those ab curves to uk case curves, you see abs dont last forever. some come, some go | 00:01 |
| de-facto | fortunately N does not seem to raise after S saturated | 00:01 |
| de-facto | nice find | 00:01 |
| nixonix | also they used swab samples, and estimate the sensitivity to be 80% of blood samples | 00:02 |
| nixonix | those reports were hard to find. i saw a tweet with pic, and links on PHE pages went to 2020 reports only. they were reorganized, pages werent updated, and combined with flu. googling a bit helped | 00:03 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.gov.uk/government/statistics/national-flu-and-covid-19-surveillance-reports-2021-to-2022-season save the link | 00:04 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.gov.uk: National flu and COVID-19 surveillance reports: 2021 to 2022 season - GOV.UK | 00:04 |
| de-facto | .title https://imgur.com/a/FXeBA00 https://i.imgur.com/zGO9IsV.jpeg src: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1016276/Weekly_Flu_and_COVID-19_report_w36.pdf page 79 | 00:07 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From imgur.com: COVID UK: Population weighted 4-weekly rolling SARS-CoV-2 antibody seroprevalence in blood donors from the Roche S and Roche N assays - Album on Imgur | 00:07 |
| nixonix | doesnt say what kind of Roche assays were used, like IgG and IgM or just one type | 00:07 |
| de-facto | nixonix, someone else noted that blood donors may not be the typical group | 00:14 |
| nixonix | yeah, prob way more likely to get vaxed, and maybe avoid risky situations | 00:16 |
| nixonix | ah it was donors, i confused it to some other survey then, where i read they used swab... and estimated sensitivity | 00:17 |
| nixonix | so that was from blood obv | 00:17 |
| nixonix | must have been some other report i read too | 00:17 |
| de-facto | pretty cool to see them seroconverting by vaccination (S) without getting covid (N) | 00:19 |
| nixonix | blood is more sensitive, but still N doesnt look like it has increased enough with those uk waves, mening waning below threshold. but i have to compare | 00:20 |
| nixonix | too bad they dont have data on kids | 00:20 |
| de-facto | yeah | 00:20 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: Analysis of 2.1 million SARS-CoV-2 genomes identifies mutations associated with transmissibility ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/3QH2MZ7V ) | 00:21 | |
| Brainstorm | New from https://covid19.specops.network : ljl-covid: Add Pyr0-COV computational model of mutation transmissibility → https://is.gd/NgmYTS | 00:21 |
| nixonix | oh yeah, pupil antibody test, i had some from march, maybe they dont have more recent yet | 00:22 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/conditionsanddiseases/bulletins/covid19schoolsinfectionsurveyengland/round4pupilantibodydatamarch2021 | 00:23 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.ons.gov.uk: COVID-19 Schools Infection Survey, England - Office for National Statistics | 00:23 |
| nixonix | recent, but data from march | 00:24 |
| nixonix | "based on oral fluid collection as this is a non-invasive alternative to collecting blood but this test has a lower sensitivity (estimated at 80%); after adjusting for the sensitivity and specificity... | 00:24 |
| de-facto | how does it compare to parent age cohort prevalence? | 00:24 |
| nixonix | you mean identified in pcr tests? i havent compared. and just had a quick look on that, looking for those ab curves for age groups, that i found in that combined report then | 00:26 |
| de-facto | just curious how real incidence in school compares to real incidence outside school | 00:28 |
| Brainstorm | New from Johnson&Johnson: Johnson & Johnson Ebola Vaccine Regimen Demonstrated Robust and Durable Immune Response in Adults and Children in Data Published in The Lancet Infectious Diseases: Data show the vaccine regimen induced neutralizing antibody responses in nearly all participating adults and children 21 days after the second dose Adults receiving [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/ln1RxQ | 00:32 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/SixandLaura/status/1430329059007946759 | 00:33 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Laura Henderson (@SixandLaura): "Mutation in Spike Protein Cleavage Site and Pathogenesis of Feline Coronavirus 7/19/2013 “It is thought that mutations in FECV enable infection of macrophages…” [...] | 00:33 |
| nixonix | sars2 the same? apparently yeah, but not "productively". could it gain that through some future mutation? one of those doors... | 00:34 |
| de-facto | yuck | 00:40 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437540952072081411 | 00:41 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Israel has the *only* data for whether a 3rd shot can restore vaccine effectiveness (VE). This is how today's @TheLancet viewpoint disses that data and negates 3 CDC reports [...] | 00:42 |
| nixonix | hospitalization data is always more accurate than cases and it looked like in under 5 months VE vs hosp was down to 80% in israel | 00:43 |
| nixonix | from uk data i got similar results, using age group 70-79, and while not accurate either, combining AZ and mrna vaxes etc, it supports israels data imo | 00:44 |
| LjL | infection of macrophages... was that related to ADE? | 00:47 |
| nixonix | you need to look by age group and the time from vaccination naturally, to see the waning. if its combined ages, or like over and under 50 yo, it gets messy since with similar protection level most in hospital are old people, but if old have been vaxed way more often, it may be different | 00:47 |
| nixonix | yeah its one of them, but im just trying to check the mechanism, was it trough Fc | 00:51 |
| LjL | gah | 00:51 |
| -Bridgestorm- 🌐 地震! Earthquake! 5.9 M tremor, registered by GFZ,eqwatch_RD,yurekuru, occurred 8 minutes ago (22:46:00 UTC), during daytime, Southeast Of Honshu, Japan (32.26, 138.11) ± 9 km, ↓248 km likely felt 260 km away (in 新宮市…) by 28300 people (www.seismicportal.eu) | 00:54 | |
| LjL | did i seriously put 28300 as above the threshold for notifying? | 00:55 |
| LjL | oh i so did, if at or above 5.9, which this one so conveniently is | 00:55 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: Considerations in boosting COVID-19 vaccine immune responses ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/GPIX65WL ) | 00:56 | |
| nixonix | yeah, one of them is trough Fc-mediated effector functions with macrophage opsonization. somehow they dont succeed to destroy it, and it can then make macrophages virion factories too | 00:58 |
| LjL | what's the prognosis for cats? | 01:01 |
| nixonix | you want to open that door too? | 01:04 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/MomtoRox/status/1436674475022434305 | 01:04 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Momto Rox (@MomtoRox): "In cats, they get mild/asymptomatic corona when young which resolves. In 10% of those, the virus in their tissues converts to a different form (which is not contagious) but [...] | 01:04 |
| LjL | well, apparently i did, but i regret it now | 01:06 |
| LjL | i like how i remember last year when i feared that the virus might remain in our bodies, some people, especially ones who were seemingly familiar with biology, were like "no that just won't happen, this isn't a retrovirus or herpes" | 01:08 |
| nixonix | i havent tried to find more about those fat cells yet | 01:10 |
| pwr22 | Even more reason to get robust vaccines to hopefully stop us all dying from 10 year on poop covid | 01:10 |
| pwr22 | I guess ten years in cat time is like 50 years though | 01:11 |
| nixonix | it was up to | 01:11 |
| LjL | i've added a new tag "Persistence" for studies that look at the virus staying around on Zotero, in addition to and more specific than Long COVID | 01:14 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: Residual SARS-CoV-2 viral antigens detected in GI and hepatic tissues from five recovered patients with COVID-19 ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/FWMF7MBU ) | 01:16 | |
| LjL | "There is no effective vaccine against FIPV. DNA vaccination with plasmids encoding FIPV proteins failed to produce immunity.[24] Rather, it was observed that antibodies to the FIPV spike protein exacerbate the disease." (Wikpedia) \o/ | 01:17 |
| pwr22 | yay | 01:19 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/enn_nafnlaus/status/1433078059700297732 has a chart for those ronaviruses with furin site | 01:21 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Nafnlaus (@enn_nafnlaus): "No. https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1873506120304165 Also, remember that furin cleavage is a sort of "priming" event during S-protein production within [...] | 01:21 |
| nixonix | if you read leonardis tweets (who keeps opening those doors), some acronyms he uses: SAG is superantigen, FCS furin cleavage site, and SEB is probably Superantigen S. Aureus Enterotoxin B | 01:22 |
| LjL | at least, if our "equivalent" of FIP is MIS-C as someone worries in the Twitter thread, MIS-C (says Wikipedia) is fatal in 2% of cases, not 60-70% | 01:22 |
| LjL | %ca fcs | 01:25 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, That may also be called: furin cleavage site | 01:25 |
| LjL | %ca arv | 01:25 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, That may also be called: attack rate in the vaccinated | 01:25 |
| LjL | %ca ca | 01:26 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, That may also be called: COVID acronyms | 01:26 |
| LjL | (i actually cheated and am just using the same code as the %variant command) | 01:26 |
| pwr22 | %ca FIP | 01:27 |
| Brainstorm | pwr22, That may also be called: | 01:27 |
| pwr22 | ha ha | 01:27 |
| pwr22 | %ca LjL | 01:27 |
| Brainstorm | pwr22, That may also be called: | 01:27 |
| LjL | those are not CAs! | 01:27 |
| pwr22 | I was gonna ask about de-facto and hoped it would tell me that may also be called "absolutely strictly with no exceptions" | 01:28 |
| pwr22 | 😀 | 01:28 |
| de-facto | heh | 01:28 |
| LjL | %ca pwr22 | 01:29 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, I have no idea what, who, where, when or whence that is, sorry! | 01:29 |
| pwr22 | Ha ha | 01:29 |
| pwr22 | %ca ACE | 01:29 |
| Brainstorm | pwr22, I have no idea what, who, where, when or whence that is, sorry! | 01:29 |
| LjL | okay, that's fair enough :P i'll add things as they come up | 01:29 |
| LjL | it can take multiple "aliases", so i could also add short explanations | 01:30 |
| LjL | %ca COVID | 01:32 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, That may also be called: COVID-19, 2019-nCoV, Coronavirus disease 2019 | 01:32 |
| LjL | i absolutely needed a new command (but had low motivation to actually make a new one, so i reused one) after that pretty terrible prospect of forever-COVID | 01:33 |
| LjL | rather, forever-COVID-with-random-popup-death | 01:33 |
| pwr22 | Absolutely strictly needed? | 01:33 |
| pwr22 | 😛 | 01:33 |
| LjL | with no exception | 01:34 |
| nixonix | do you have the same, that sometimes when reading about new bad rona scenarios, they make me laugh. like hitting finger with a hammer | 01:36 |
| LjL | no | 01:36 |
| LjL | but my way of fighting them is... this channel, and the bot, and the links | 01:36 |
| LjL | i can't cure it 'cause i'm not a doctor, but i can like... do something | 01:37 |
| LjL | "doing something" even if it results in no actual effect is a powerful thing for your brain to feel like it's in control | 01:37 |
| LjL | also this lady is full of wonders | 01:37 |
| LjL | %title https://twitter.com/MomtoRox/status/1436458958613467137 | 01:37 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From twitter.com: Momto Rox (@MomtoRox): "Think COVID can just become endemic and it will be fine? This is that future:" | El Pajarito de NoGAFAM | 01:37 |
| LjL | "43-year-old man infected 3x times during the pandemic with different variants each time. This last time, Delta nearly killed him. Before this, he was a healthy active person who mountain-biked and hit the gym often. Now his body and mind are destroyed." | 01:38 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/fitterhappierAJ/status/1426108985388711939 | 01:38 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Anthony J Leonardi, PhD, MS (@fitterhappierAJ): "I agree. "Endemicity" is not a way out, it is a way IN. Humans will be selected by the pathogen mostly. Look: our numbers dwindle while the pathogen [...] | 01:38 |
| LjL | "The 43-year-old first came down with symptoms in January 2020" ← where did he live for that to be possible? (or was it just possible for all of us but nobody had found out, and we're still not being told?) | 01:39 |
| nixonix | i see some sad stories in twitter, but i dont link them here | 01:40 |
| LjL | sorry | 01:41 |
| nixonix | no i didnt mean that. i just remembered one | 01:41 |
| nixonix | do link what you want. i see them anyway | 01:42 |
| nixonix | we have had like 10% if even that than most of europe, we are like watching what happens, not taking part here | 01:43 |
| LjL | "in Part 2 you say that HI is impossible" ← what is HI? | 01:43 |
| LjL | nixonix, Finns have a very distinctive, but not very diverse, genetic lineage, which is traced back to "only" about 1000 years ago. it makes you more vulnerable to some otherwise rare diseases, but who knows, maybe it has advantages too | 01:44 |
| nixonix | the threat is still there, with less population immunity etc, but somehow it hasnt hit here similarly. i mean the direct consequences, who knows about those permanent damages that are not diagnosed currently | 01:44 |
| LjL | #inspiring (or not) "We must all grieve our own versions of the future that are now lost to us. But we can move forward hence and emerge hopeful for a new and different future that still holds much promise and life." | 01:45 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Man who spent 21 days in quarantine, tested negative 9 times still brought COVID-19 to China → https://is.gd/DBefxv | 01:46 |
| specing | ^ "typhoid mary"? | 01:47 |
| nixonix | one genetist once described, the inherited diseases here are a bit different than in central europe, not worse or better | 01:47 |
| nixonix | geneticist | 01:48 |
| LjL | specing, that story sounds dodgy | 01:52 |
| LjL | i don't want to be the "China lies" guys, but "Chinese authorities did not reveal when, where or how the man caught the virus" isn't great when you have someone inexplicably incubating the virus for 21 days without showing positive | 01:53 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437551394412654596 | 01:54 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Pathetic infighting inside the @US_FDA and @WhiteHouse Administration about boosters is the last thing we need right now https://www.ft.com/content/af8da7d4-43ea-41d6-90ee- [...] | 01:54 |
| LjL | nixonix, https://drive.google.com/file/d/11tmnfzAxY2ZF2BgzCFQe-3oH5gBj9cU_/view ← (Leonardi) do you know what is the thing with memory? he cites a few of his claims but 6 doesn't seem to be about memory, maybe it's too early a finding and it's not published anywhere? but he even links to virological | 01:55 |
| nixonix | i was just thinking aloud there (remembering a tweet, small kids lost both of their parents, googling mother ventilator covid birth should find the news), that way more suffering in almost all the western countries already than here | 01:56 |
| nixonix | mild memory loss? im not sure what exactly does he mean, but prob several alzheimer type changes, lewy bodies, t-cell infiltration etc | 01:59 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: To the officials of the school board, July 14 ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/N82TN5IW ) | 02:01 | |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/fitterhappierAJ/status/1437545574639849477 | 02:02 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Anthony J Leonardi, PhD, MS (@fitterhappierAJ): "I'm going to share a hypothesis that is not mine, but we should consider it. RNA viruses like cov2 may enter a low replication state in tissues like [...] | 02:02 |
| -RSSBot[LjLmatrix- Zotero / COVID links Group / Top-Level Items: SARS-CoV-2 causes brain inflammation and induces Lewy body formation in macaques ( https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/L97IXHQK ) | 02:06 | |
| nixonix | not proven to happen in humans though | 02:08 |
| LjL | true, i usually avoid adding studies about animals or early phase 1's | 02:08 |
| LjL | i might be getting a little caught into these "doors" | 02:08 |
| LjL | but goddammit scarier elements never stop adding up to this virus's facets | 02:09 |
| nixonix | its good to follow some immunologists imo. either virologists dont know that much about immunology, or then they just tell the most optimistic scenarios in media. or those that know or have more worrying thoughts, dont want to be in media | 02:10 |
| LjL | look at this fucking twit https://twitter.com/rubyslippahs/status/1437568504039890944 | 02:13 |
| ublx | was that you or did Brainstorm incorporate some sass into his source code? | 02:16 |
| nixonix | ah, i didnt notice the nick in the thread. say AJ hi from the channel | 02:25 |
| LjL | heh | 02:25 |
| LjL | ublx, that is me. i deleted my "own" Twitter account years ago in one of my fit of rages against the internet | 02:26 |
| LjL | so now i sockpuppet Brainstorm as needed instead | 02:26 |
| nixonix | well, maybe ask him here some day. i wish we had a bit more activity | 02:26 |
| LjL | which kinds of makes one wonder why i deleted my account, but hey | 02:26 |
| LjL | nixonix, i just gave him a link to the Zotero in passing ;) the Zotero group should mention the channel iirc | 02:26 |
| LjL | but probably have to leave the library and go to the group page, so not quite immediately | 02:27 |
| LjL | immediate* | 02:27 |
| LjL | but if he goes "hey interesting collection you've got there" or something... | 02:27 |
| LjL | (doubtful :) | 02:27 |
| LjL | yeah https://www.zotero.org/groups/4391070/covid_links/ mentions the channel | 02:27 |
| LjL | it's how do they say, my memory, i still haven't got theanine, now i could get it, i am in milan... | 02:28 |
| LjL | it is | 02:28 |
| LjL | it is sobering | 02:28 |
| LjL | it is sobering to see someone who's an expert and stuff just say "yeah well, i refused to believe it until ..." | 02:29 |
| nixonix | he said something like that about t-cells (being perhaps more bad than good, in covid) | 02:29 |
| nixonix | cd8 killer t-cells. which they usually seem to mean, if just saying t-cells | 02:30 |
| LjL | argh | 02:34 |
| LjL | wanted to ask nixonix something, bit late | 02:34 |
| LjL | %tell nixonix I also have a list of COVID tweeters here https://twitter.com/i/lists/1326305739569324036/members if you know of other good ones that i've left out can you point them out? | 02:34 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, I'll pass nixonix your message when they are around. | 02:34 |
| de-facto | members only | 02:35 |
| LjL | oh? | 02:36 |
| LjL | it should be open, it doesn't have a lock icon | 02:37 |
| LjL | hmm i guess it's open but you need a twitter account | 02:37 |
| LjL | de-facto, you can see it from here https://twitter.com/i/lists/1326305739569324036 but you can't see the list of members, which was kind of the point. but still it's like a feed of them | 02:38 |
| LjL | i wonder if i could just get... an RSS feed of them from one of the nitters, instead of having separate feeds for each of them in the bot's config | 02:38 |
| de-facto | or with rss-bridge :) | 02:39 |
| LjL | de-facto, yep, probably can! you can see the list of members here https://nitter.eu/BrainstormBot/lists/COVID/members | 02:39 |
| LjL | de-facto, i don't know what rss-bridge is specifically but i assume it's an rss server that extracts data from twitter? i looked at things like that before but i really don't want to run a service just for this i think... the nitters do a "decent" job (despite rate limits) | 02:39 |
| LjL | i'll add https://nitter.eu/BrainstormBot/lists/COVID/rss for now experimentally to ##covid-ticker | 02:40 |
| grys | whats new | 02:41 |
| LjL | oh you don't want to know, based on what *i* saw that was new | 02:41 |
| LjL | but uh, in good/decent news | 02:41 |
| de-facto | LjL, https://github.com/RSS-Bridge/rss-bridge | 02:41 |
| LjL | https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.07.21263228v1 and related source code https://github.com/broadinstitute/pyro-cov | 02:42 |
| LjL | de-facto, ah, i think i stumbled upon that one before, it's nice that it covers several things. but Skalingo, Heroku, i don't know what these things even are, i assume a Docker will be involved, and... i've stayed a little behind in all this confusing new containerizing technology ;( | 02:43 |
| LjL | but uhm then it's also a debian package in "oldstable" (sigh, i will have to upgrade debian too, i don't wanna) | 02:43 |
| LjL | (does newstable even include python2?) | 02:44 |
| de-facto | yeah not that complicated, just a httpd+php unzip and thats it | 02:44 |
| LjL | maybe i'll try it, since Nitter tends to have rate limiting issues so we may miss some tweets | 02:45 |
| LjL | for now i've "solved" that by using multiple Nitter instances, different ones for each account, but... maybe some just won't work very often, and so some of the accounts will never/seldom be posted by Brainstorm, and we won't know until we pay attention | 02:45 |
| de-facto | the cool thing about that one is that one can easily extend their class to scrape almost any website to get an rss feed from it | 02:47 |
| LjL | is that what you did for the WHO? | 02:47 |
| de-facto | yep 65 LOC | 02:48 |
| LjL | what? | 02:50 |
| LjL | oh | 02:51 |
| LjL | yes, i get it | 02:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Israeli anti-vaxx leader dies of COVID-19 → https://is.gd/d9RaFN | 03:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid: Booster jabs for over-50s expected to be announced: A single dose of Pfizer will be offered at least six months after a second dose, the BBC understands. → https://is.gd/hdaP49 | 03:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Lancet (Online): [Viewpoint] Considerations in boosting COVID-19 vaccine immune responses: A new wave of COVID-19 cases caused by the highly transmissible delta variant is exacerbating the worldwide public health crisis, and has led to consideration of the potential need for, and optimal timing of, booster doses for vaccinated [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/O3LEfq | 03:52 |
| annaa_ | you guys have a consensus on pfizer boosters for > age 40-50 ? | 04:38 |
| LjL | i don't know if others consent (nixonix is gone!) but i'd give everyone a booster asap, period | 04:40 |
| LjL | i'd MUCH prefer to be giving a delta-specific booster, or a multivalent shot | 04:40 |
| LjL | but we don't have it | 04:40 |
| annaa_ | ok thanks | 04:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Boys more at risk from Pfizer jab side-effect than Covid, suggests study → https://is.gd/z4qc45 | 04:56 |
| twomoon | the non-western world needs their first shot before plump westerners get a booster or two, LJL !! | 05:03 |
| LjL | the non-western world isn't going to get mRNA shots anyway, mostly | 05:03 |
| LjL | and Europe is planning to donate most of the AZ it's going to get from now on, from what i've head | 05:04 |
| specing | yeah | 05:07 |
| specing | noone here wants to take AZ, my country already donated half a million doses | 05:07 |
| twomoon | ugh don't donate the junk | 05:08 |
| specing | LjL: I want to be able to go from vac center to vac center and collect vaccination stamps in my vaccination loyalty card^W^Wbooklet | 05:08 |
| specing | But all I got was this lousy QR code | 05:09 |
| LjL | twomoon, it's not "junk"... it's vaccines that they can realistically use, instead of ones that need to be stored into freezers in places with no electricity | 05:09 |
| twomoon | oh ok | 05:09 |
| LjL | fwiw, i would have supported the patent waiver on all vaccines, so any country physically able to produce their favorite vaccine, could | 05:12 |
| LjL | but Pfizer and Bill Gates and many countries didn't want that | 05:12 |
| LjL | and i don't get a say in the matter | 05:12 |
| twomoon | is bill gates sponsoring the vaccines? | 05:13 |
| twomoon | or a patent owner | 05:13 |
| specing | I think he has his hands in AZ | 05:14 |
| LjL | twomoon, just a lobbyist i guess | 05:14 |
| LjL | but yeah i did hear that one of the things he swayed was the Oxford vaccine being "awarded" to AZ instead of being released to the public domain | 05:15 |
| LjL | which was the original intention, or something similar | 05:15 |
| twomoon | i wonder why he is lobbying for big pharma | 05:15 |
| twomoon | it just seems a bit odd | 05:15 |
| LjL | i don't pretend to understand these things | 05:15 |
| twomoon | ok let's drop it | 05:16 |
| LjL | but the whole Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation, i think it goes a bit beyond "we just want to be nice" | 05:16 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Denmark lifts all coronavirus restrictions - The Washington Post → https://is.gd/sJycli | 05:17 |
| twomoon | a lot of money from their foundations seeds all sorts of interesting projects | 05:19 |
| LjL | yes, i have no doubt about that | 05:19 |
| LjL | but it's hard for me to think all this money doesn't come with an agenda | 05:20 |
| twomoon | yeah | 05:21 |
| twomoon | and i'm curious now why he lobbied for AZ to get that patented vax recipe | 05:22 |
| LjL | i don't really know, it's just something i've repeatedly read. what i can say is, he built his entire fortune and personality around intellectual property. i doubt he's now thinking that medical intellectual property should not be a thing. | 05:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: R to @EricTopol: This is not about global equity, which the Lancet essay was clearly advancing. It's not either or. There are 76 million vaccine doses distributed in the US, not given, that are not going to be sent OUS. https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#vaccinations_vacc-total-admin-rate-totaland well over [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/cmS83q | 05:28 |
| twomoon | yeah good point ljl | 05:28 |
| grys | LjL: and afaik the vaccine recipients aren't being made aware of where their data, and what data specifically, will go | 05:59 |
| grys | LjL: such as into the intellectual property tool of that particular bill and gates foundation | 05:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid: Booster jabs for over-50s expected to be announced: A single dose of Pfizer will be offered at least six months after a second dose, the BBC understands. → https://is.gd/hdaP49 | 06:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: (news): Covid jab rollout for 12 to 15-year-olds to start in schools in England → https://is.gd/LKLVcb | 08:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from Science-Based Medicine: Preventing Malaria: A Glimmer of Hope?: Malaria is a parasitic disease transmitted through mosquito bites. There are 200-400 million new cases each year, with 400,000 annual deaths, plus great morbidity and economic burdens. It has been especially devastating for children in sub-Saharan Africa. Mosquito-control [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/MOV0jK | 09:02 |
| * calbasi[m] uploaded an image: (49KiB) < https://libera.ems.host/_matrix/media/r0/download/t2bot.io/25e29cbe8a7f4f050fd7ad416af0fbd45387fe32/image.jpeg > | 09:21 | |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid deaths rare among fully vaccinated - ONS: Out of 51,000 Covid deaths in England between January and July, only 256 occurred after two doses. → https://is.gd/0MmwNp | 09:44 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: Vladimir Putin to self-isolate after Covid-19 detected in entourage → https://is.gd/tZbqtg | 11:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid: Which children are being vaccinated and why?: The UK's four chief medical officers say all children aged 12-15 should be offered one vaccine dose. → https://is.gd/iJlbhj | 11:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from EMA: What's new: Document: COVID-19 vaccine safety update for Vaxzevria (previously COVID-19 Vaccine AstraZeneca): 8 September 2021 → https://is.gd/7IDbi6 | 11:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Putin to self-isolate due to coronavirus among inner circle → https://is.gd/tRz78v | 12:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: Rationing access to care remains elephant in the room | 14SEP21 → https://is.gd/FEyVMt | 12:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: COVID-19 cases in southeast China more than double as Delta spreads → https://is.gd/x3Qr8g | 12:27 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.12.21261991v1.full | 12:49 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.medrxiv.org: Transmission dynamics and epidemiological characteristics of Delta variant infections in China | medRxiv | 12:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid: Booster jabs for over 50s recommended: Experts say a single dose of Pfizer should be offered at least six months after a second dose. → https://is.gd/gY1uDp | 12:49 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.cdc.gov/library/covid19/08132021_covidupdate.html | 13:08 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.cdc.gov: CDC Library: COVID-19 Science Update: 08/13/2021 | 13:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from Baric Lab: @Baric_Lab: R to @Baric_Lab: Importantly, as immunity from vaccines and natural immunity wanes, we need therapies to treat breakthrough #COVID19 infections. Moreover, oral remdesivir could, theoretically, be taken as a pill to reduce #SARSCoV2 symptoms as we demonstrate in mice. #antivirals → https://is.gd/wNaQlt | 13:10 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.cdc.gov/library/covid19/scienceupdates.html there are also newer science updates, great collection! | 13:13 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.cdc.gov: CDC Library: COVID-19 Science Updates | 13:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from ECDC: Data on the daily number of new reported COVID-19 cases and deaths by EU/EEA country: The downloadable data file is updated daily and contains the latest available public data on COVID-19. Each row/entry contains the number of new cases and deaths reported per day and per country in the EU/EEA. → https://is.gd/tBASDi | 13:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from WHO Euro: Countries of the WHO European Region adopt new regional immunization agenda for coming decade: An ambitious strategy to ensure equitable and life-long protection from vaccine-preventable diseases was adopted by the 71st session of the WHO Regional Committee for Europe. → https://is.gd/qHcpgA | 14:46 |
| Brainstorm | New from Contagion Live: United Kingdom Approves COVID-19 Vaccines in 12-15 Year Olds: This decision is in spite of the government’s vaccine group saying that vaccines only marginally benefit this age group. → https://is.gd/7qLofc | 15:09 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Aid and development: UK bets on boosters, vaccine for teens to prevent winter restrictions → https://is.gd/bs6Vel | 15:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: Deaths in the US 4th wave far exceeded expectations and the rates of peer countries with high vaccination rates. Quantifying the preventable lost lives and wherehttps://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/09/14/opinion/states-undervaccination-deaths.html @nytopinion @nytgraphics @2plus2make5 @jalinegerardin @Nat_Lash → https://is.gd/aKLYYb | 15:42 |
| LjL | bleh i always procrastinate, "do i buy another Aura? do i buy 5 of them? i've just ordered these Korean ones, so let's wait..." of course the Aura is now no longer in stock | 16:01 |
| LjL | (the Korean ones are maybe decent but definitely let air out from the top of the nose) | 16:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: UK to roll out Covid booster jabs for over-50s from next week → https://is.gd/NZuFYY | 16:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: What difference will jabbing young teens make?: How to weigh the pros and cons of a vaccine for a disease that is rarely serious in young people. → https://is.gd/0AJNRR | 16:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from Contagion Live: What to Expect With Influenza in the Era of COVID-19: Here are some insights into this upcoming 2021-2022 influenza season as well as concerns of the twindemic and addressing both the seasonal and pandemic viruses simultaneously. → https://is.gd/c6TMbo | 17:09 |
| Brainstorm | New from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Strategies to Continue Gynae-oncology Services in the Era of COVID-19 Outbreak: Concerns and Challenges in a Referral Centre in Malaysia → https://is.gd/9FRj62 | 17:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: Want to See What COVID Strain You Have? The Government Says No: The country is dotted with labs that sequence the genomes of COVID-19 cases, and the CDC tracks those results. But federal rules say those results are not allowed to make their way back to patients or doctors. → https://is.gd/omrzqu | 17:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from Anthony J Leonardi: @NjbBari3: RT by @fitterhappierAJ: Cardiomyopathy...in kids.Think about it. Demand safe schools. Protect kids. #COVIDisAirborne → https://is.gd/cbokn1 | 18:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: What the Delta wave did in New York City, a familiar patternhttps://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data.page#dailyBeginning in July cases went up for both unvaccinated and vaccinated, but MUCH more in the formerAnd hospitalizations among vaxxed well protected via @davechokshi @NYCHealthCommr → https://is.gd/pFeArg | 19:00 |
| midnightjoker | is there an israel study out, supposedly published july 27th, on their vaccine efficacy? the one widely reported by papers, that efficacy vs hospitalizations waned too | 19:03 |
| midnightjoker | "A study by the Hebrew University of Jerusalem published on Tuesday indicated that the Pfizer vaccine’s effectiveness in preventing serious illness has fallen to 80 percent" | 19:03 |
| midnightjoker | id like to check if it was stratified by age groups or not | 19:05 |
| lastshell | midnightjoke sadly isnot full data https://www.covid-datascience.com/post/israeli-data-how-can-efficacy-vs-severe-disease-be-strong-when-60-of-hospitalized-are-vaccinated | 19:08 |
| midnightjoker | link me the study, or whatever they published back then, if you can find. i havent found from my saved pdfs | 19:08 |
| lastshell | but give some rough estimates | 19:08 |
| midnightjoker | thats analysis made by somebody else (i have seen it). i want to see what they published | 19:09 |
| midnightjoker | they started to vax 60+ yo in august, so this should be before that: | 19:09 |
| midnightjoker | .title https://twitter.com/NuritBaytch/status/1422542511952826373 | 19:09 |
| Brainstorm | midnightjoker: From twitter.com: Nurit Baytch (@NuritBaytch): ".@IsraelMOH has updated its dashboard w/ age-stratified data on incidence of seriously ill delta COVID19 patients (חולים קשה) by vax status (i.e. they divide by the [...] | 19:09 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Putin in self-isolation due to COVID cases in inner circle → https://is.gd/ZBebqZ | 19:12 |
| lastshell | thanks Brainstorm, is there an english version ? | 19:12 |
| Brainstorm | Don't thank me! | 19:12 |
| midnightjoker | this is from recent, not from july, and has only 60+, not smaller age groups (suggesting waning, not simpson paradox): https://www.medrxiv.org/content/medrxiv/early/2021/08/30/2021.08.24.21262423/F4.large.jpg | 19:15 |
| midnightjoker | simpson's | 19:16 |
| Sky_Net | Every 34th person in world met the infection | 19:16 |
| Sky_Net | oh god | 19:16 |
| midnightjoker | there are prob some tweets around in english, but its easy to understand, shortest had full vax, longest unvax, middle 1st dose. too bad one of groups seen only partly | 19:17 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.politico.com/news/2021/09/14/covid-israel-data-vaccine-efficacy-511777 | 19:18 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: At 2021-09-14 00:34:30 UTC, LjL told you: I also have a list of COVID tweeters here https://twitter.com/i/lists/1326305739569324036/members if you know of other good ones that i've left out can you point them out? | 19:18 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.politico.com: Biden Covid team sees vaccine efficacy waning in unpublished data from Israel - POLITICO | 19:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health: Covid winter plan promotes jabs but prepares curbs in England: Measures for England like compulsory face masks and working from home could be introduced if needed. → https://is.gd/xVRRfk | 19:22 |
| nixonix | ljl, needs logging in to see that tweet, i dont have an account because they want phone numbers etc to spy you (although twitter is less evil than google and fb, i still avoid regging to those who spread their scripts around). i pretty much paste here some of the tweets of those rona tweeters worth checking out | 19:23 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262423v1.full not the one from june 27th im still looking for, whether it's a study or something else. this is from couple of weeks ago | 19:28 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.medrxiv.org: Waning immunity of the BNT162b2 vaccine: A nationwide study from Israel | medRxiv | 19:28 |
| Brainstorm | New from Ars Technica: Science: COVID in children: Infections skyrocket 30X, now account for 30% of cases → https://is.gd/Th7Lz3 | 19:33 |
| LjL-Matrix | nixonix: just change twitter.com into bitter.eu, it will work, I tried yesterday after De facto told me | 19:33 |
| nixonix | from neut ab titers 3rd pfizer gives around 4.5 months more time than 2nd gave, vs infection. it seems they dont believe in israel, that severe symptoms keep away much longer: | 19:39 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-09-12/israel-preparing-for-possible-fourth-covid-vaccine-dose | 19:39 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.bloomberg.com: Bloomberg - Are you a robot? | 19:39 |
| nixonix | bitter.eu costs €19,999 | 19:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Indian Express: World: UK employee numbers surge above pre-pandemic level → https://is.gd/WnpjJk | 19:54 |
| jasper_ | nixonix: pretty sure LjL have meant nitter.eu | 19:56 |
| nixonix | "Using samples from the "low dose" 25mcg Moderna RNA COVID-19 vaccine clinical trial" - dudes, we want moar, not less... | 20:03 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437812087032406021 yeah, i noticed. uk knows too | 20:05 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "3 days, 3 different booster takes —Yesterday 2 FDA scientists who resigned + @WHO wrote @TheLancet that boosters should not be used —Today UK announced boosters for all age [...] | 20:05 |
| nixonix | they have their own data, just havent published it (i made a rough calculation with 70-79 yo from that another day) | 20:06 |
| nixonix | they are like antivaxers, want their people to be left partly unprotected even for severe symptoms... | 20:08 |
| nixonix | meaning that 3rd dose opposition | 20:08 |
| nixonix | israel shared information, but people refuse to believe it. usa hasnt nation wide information, but they have it from some regions. uk has, but it doesnt want to share. needs to secure vax deals before others... | 20:10 |
| lastshell | israle is pushing for a 4th boost ? | 20:13 |
| LjL | jasper_, hahah yeah i was typing on the phone while walking, it autocorrected. but that sounds like a nice domain for a nitter, if you're bitter about twitter | 20:17 |
| LjL | but not for €20k for sure :P | 20:18 |
| nixonix | israel is just preparing for that. they take seriously the health of their citizens | 20:19 |
| nixonix | i tried it too, in case it was a typo. didnt work | 20:20 |
| lastshell | a total circus | 20:26 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciimmunol.abk0894 | 20:27 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.science.org: Identification of resident memory CD8+ T cells with functional specificity for SARS-CoV-2 in unexposed oropharyngeal lymphoid tissue | 20:27 |
| nixonix | lots of different types of t-cells, but many of them arent necessarily too relevant, and depends on virus and individuals immune charasteristics. and even less, if its vaccine induced immunity | 20:29 |
| nixonix | those have cxcr5 receptor that recognizes cxcl13 produced by follicular dendritic cells, but neither pfizer's or moderna's mrna vaccines dont activate dendritic cells to produce it (az did, but apparently not too well, since it was found from around half of subjects) | 20:31 |
| nixonix | i wonder if it would work, if you shoot some squalene in shoulder after mrna vax. somebody must have tested it, and then checked if cxcl13 or il-17 was found | 20:34 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @segal_eran: RT by @EricTopol: New severely ill Covid-19 patients in Israel in the past week, per 100,000 people:Vaccinated with 3 doses: 0.28Vaccinated with 2 doses: 1.62Not vaccinated: 6.4 → https://is.gd/0EICKW | 20:38 |
| nixonix | link it here, if you find it by age-groups (segal's tweet). or some older ones, from end of july to recent | 20:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @JoyHenningsenMD: RT by @EricTopol: 📣This timely discussion btwn @EricTopol & @florian_krammer is a MUST-read 💯 and covers:▪️the #DeltaVariant trajectory▪️vaxx vs natural infxn▪️antibody tests ▪️#boosters▪️@pfizer vs @moderna_tx ▪️to mix & match❓ [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/8OUMTq | 21:11 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437861061449842689 | 21:42 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Does abdominal #obesity reduce the immune response to @BioNTech_Group /@Pfizer's vaccine? https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.10.21262710v1 Looks that way for [...] | 21:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: Does abdominal #obesity reduce the immune response to @BioNTech_Group /@Pfizer's vaccine?https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.10.21262710v1 Looks that way for people without prior Covid. As assessed by waist circumference ✓ (far better than BMI) serially, including after 3 months → https://is.gd/Yuln3N | 21:44 |
| twomoon | why does it seem so unscientific to try to correlate waist circumference to malady susceptibility? ugh | 21:51 |
| twomoon | or BMI for that matter | 21:51 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Zimbabwe bars unvaccinated civil servants from work → https://is.gd/UBjZD2 | 21:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from CIDRAP: 83% of stem cell recipients produce antibodies after 2 COVID-19 vaccine doses: Mary Van Beusekom | News Writer | CIDRAP News Sep 14, 2021 Of the cancer patients, 62% reached the highest possible antibody levels. → https://is.gd/MEBS2v | 22:05 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-888762/v1 | 22:08 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.researchsquare.com: Persistence of antibodies against Spike glycoprotein of SARS-CoV-2 in health care workers post double dose of BBV-152 and AZD1222 vaccines | Research Square | 22:08 |
| nixonix | indian bharat adjuvanted whole virus vax vs indian made AZ. not neut abs studied, but maybe something interesting about waning (who knows how well it correlates with neuts, though) | 22:09 |
| nixonix | 4 weeks after 2nd: "Covishield recipients produced a median of 1223.2 AU/mL (IQ: 482.2–5476.0) of anti-S IgG which is higher than covaxin induced antibody concentration of 342.7 AU/mL (IQ: 76.1-892.8) [Figure 1]. In seronegative individuals, the rate of seroconversion after 28 days after the first dose was 81.9% for Covishield and 16.1% for | 22:09 |
| nixonix | Covaxin | 22:09 |
| nixonix | 20 weeks after 2nd: AZ 637.20, covaxin 95.12 | 22:10 |
| nixonix | "Limited data exists on long-term antibody kinetics among the BBV-152 and AZD1222 vaccine recipients, and to the best of our knowledge the present study first time reports the persistence of spike RBD antibody post vaccination." | 22:10 |
| nixonix | "Various studies carried out with BNT162b2 (Pfizer–BioNTech) and ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 (Oxford–AstraZeneca) detected significant decline of five-fold for ChAdOx1, and by about two-fold for BNT162b2, between 21–41 days and 70 days" | 22:11 |
| nixonix | yet they found covishield/AZ binding ab's only halved in that period of 16 weeks between those timepoints | 22:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: Your Diet Could Cut Your Odds for Severe COVID-19: A new study suggests a diet full of fruits and vegetables may help lower your risk of COVID-19 than those with unhealthy diets. → https://is.gd/75nRRQ | 22:16 |
| nixonix | "probabilistic risk assessment and data on human-bat contact, human SARSr-CoV seroprevalence, and antibody duration to estimate that ~400,000 people (median: ~50,000) are infected with SARSr-CoVs annually in South and Southeast Asia | 22:18 |
| nixonix | bat SARS-related coronaviruses (SARSr-CoVs) | 22:18 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.09.09.21263359v1?rss=1 | 22:19 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.medrxiv.org: A strategy to assess spillover risk of bat SARS-related coronaviruses in Southeast Asia | medRxiv | 22:19 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2021/09/13/toronto-mayor-and-health-experts-call-for-safe-zones-as-protests-target-ontario-and-canadian-hospitals.html | 22:36 |
| nixonix | .title | 22:50 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From is.gd: Your Diet Could Cut Your Odds for Severe COVID-19 | 22:50 |
| nixonix | what. it was about protests in canada | 22:50 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/hjelle_brian/status/1437825117103419394 novavax | 22:50 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Brian Hjelle, virologist (@hjelle_brian): "I love the stuff but it's only 50% vs delta which kinda broke my heart ❤." | nitter | 22:50 |
| nixonix | no information found about neutralizing vs delta. either he has some leaked info, or he calculated it from their previous data and later press release on 3rd dose | 22:51 |
| nixonix | it was a bit under 50% vs SA variant. but thats not bad i think, compared to other vaxes. so its prob more than that 50% vs delta, i think. why havent they released neutralizing information... | 22:53 |
| nixonix | .title https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1437890711139995648 | 23:39 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From twitter.com: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "New data on waning immunity justifying 3rd shot (boosters) from @PHE_uk today, reviewed and graphics @FT https://www.ft.com/content/cf83b3a1-fe06-4c9f-999c-7500090aee7c 1. [...] | 23:39 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol: @EricTopol: Key summary graphicIsraeli data for >1 million people, age ≥60 for unvaccinated, vaccinated 2-doses, and + booster: cases, severe disease, and deaths from https://www.ft.com/content/cf83b3a1-fe06-4c9f-999c-7500090aee7c → https://is.gd/f28f4R | 23:53 |
| nixonix | .title https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/phe-monitoring-of-the-effectiveness-of-covid-19-vaccination#history i think they used these in that FT article | 23:56 |
| Brainstorm | nixonix: From www.gov.uk: PHE monitoring of the effectiveness of COVID-19 vaccination - GOV.UK | 23:56 |
| nixonix | https://www.ft.com/content/cf83b3a1-fe06-4c9f-999c-7500090aee7c https://archive.is/5mCTd | 23:58 |
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