| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Tom Wenseleers (@TWenseleers): Even if thanks to vaccination, the infection fatality rate of SARS-CoV2 now gets close to that of influenza, the big question remains of how many more will get infected by SARS-CoV2 compared to influenza in a single year, and whether we will have 1 or 2 [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/TWenseleers/status/1487559782118604802 | 00:04 |
|---|---|---|
| Brainstorm | New from ##covid-19 Zotero group: Long covid: probably worth avoiding—some considerations - LessWrong: Type Web Page URL https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/JiLcxpWzCrnwkndsT/long-covid-probably-worth-avoiding-some-considerations Accessed 2022-01-29 23:11:05 Abstract I hear friends reasoning, “I’ll get covid [... want %more?] → https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/MHDDD5EM | 00:14 |
| Tuvix | In the US it's nowhere close to "like the flu", and hasn't even beel remotely close for a single week. I made some comparisons yesterday, but pandemic-long average we've seen over 12x the annual flu death rate. Currently in the US, where we're at or near the Omicron daily death peak, we're experiencing a 7-day average death rate 22.4 times greater than seasonal flu. | 00:16 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Correction for time when vaccinations were made available to all adults. Thanks @guyschultz for noting.Nearly half of the confirmed deaths occurred after February 1st. And, yes, excess mortality calculations show US already exceeds 1 million deaths pic.twitter.com/z7wSdhqSBO → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1487564501473902594 | 00:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): Covid2019: How blood from Wally the llama could treat omicron and future variants: show strong protection against every COVID-19 variant of concern and 18 other sabrecoronaviruses PREPRINT → https://old.reddit.com/r/Covid2019/comments/sfuugr/how_blood_from_wally_the_llama_could_treat/ | 00:33 |
| Timvde | Tuvix: 22 times greater in total or relative to infections? | 00:34 |
| Timvde | Because the tweet states the latter | 00:34 |
| Timvde | COVID (and especially omicron) is also an order of magnitude more infectuous | 00:35 |
| Timvde | So with the same IFR, you still get waaaayyy more deaths | 00:35 |
| Tuvix | I'm considering deaths specifically, although in the unvaccinated the deaths by infection rate are still significantly different. | 00:35 |
| Tuvix | vs. the vaccinated, I'm not sure about unvaccianted outcomes vs. flu, although I'm not sure that's a great metric since cases really aren't a "useful" statistic given Omicron. | 00:36 |
| Tuvix | Omicron has really changed the stats here, because even if the incidence rate of deaths to infections is lower, the raw rate of death is likely to be much worse anywhere there's still an immune-naive population relative to the prevailing varients. | 00:37 |
| Timvde | Tuvix: we're at 90%+ vaccination rate for adults, our numbers are three times as high as the delta wave from 2 months ago, and we have half as many deaths | 00:39 |
| Timvde | We also have about 60% of adults boosted, and also 90% of 65+ | 00:40 |
| Timvde | At the rate omicron is going through our population, I expect us to be fully open in maybe two months max | 00:41 |
| Tuvix | Yea, very different landscape from the US, and an obvious outcome on deaths. | 00:41 |
| Tuvix | I was a bit shocked to use CDC data and see that the 0-17, 18-29, and 30-39 age groups all did worse in death totals (each group about twice as many deaths) during the summer Delta surge, despite only 44% as many deaths overall of Delta vs. the prior winter. | 00:42 |
| Tuvix | It does make a bit of sense when you relize that the younger age-groups had less vacciantion coverage overall and the almost complete lack of restrictions most places all summer long left conditions ripe for disease spread. | 00:43 |
| Tuvix | Oof, /2 | 00:57 |
| Tuvix | Erm, wrong paste buffer. Just had some rosey doc on a TV segment suggesting that once we return to "pre-omicron" levels is a good time to pull back on prevention measures, in US-specific terms. Except our death rate post-Delta & pre-Omicron was still at the aveage death rate for the entier pandemic. | 00:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: State Dept says it 'never agreed' to China giving US diplomats COVID-19 anal tests → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sfw78l/state_dept_says_it_never_agreed_to_china_giving/ | 01:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): The pandemic is full of shots in the darkI wrote about 5 of them twitter.com/EricTopol/stat… pic.twitter.com/Kl88cnCVHI → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1487590291779424256 | 01:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Malgorzata (Gosia) Gasperowicz (@GosiaGasperoPhD): Vaccines that reduce both *infection* & disease are needed to combat the pandemic.In this Prof. Akiko Iwasaki @VirusesImmunity walks us through new mucosal booster strategy, nasal vs. intramuscular delivery & immunityWonderfuly [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/GosiaGasperoPhD/status/1487592205954871298 | 02:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Lung abnormalities found in long COVID patients with breathlessness → https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/sfxllz/lung_abnormalities_found_in_long_covid_patients/ | 03:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: The inactivated NDV-HXP-S COVID-19 vaccine induces a significantly higher ratio of neutralizing to non-neutralizing antibodies in humans as compared to mRNA vaccines → https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/sfxu8p/the_inactivated_ndvhxps_covid19_vaccine_induces_a/ | 03:16 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Omicron is beginning to break the resolve of the unvaccinated → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sfzg5l/omicron_is_beginning_to_break_the_resolve_of_the/ | 04:33 |
| Tuvix | ^ That's really not going to work in the US since there are effectively no meaningful wide-scale vaccination requirements that would compell people to do it who might be willing but need that mandate to do so or will continue to refuse. | 04:39 |
| Tuvix | Trends clearly show that even the higher risk of catching Omicron (and what we now see to be a higher risk of dying from it per-capita) hardly made a dent in the US newly first-vaccinated: https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tracker/#trends_dailydeaths_7daypeoplefullyvaccinated | 04:40 |
| Tuvix | That article has good points about Italy's success with some more meaningful requirements and a framework to begin enforcement, but I'd argue those have to be applied together, not just a poll that says people "support" them in a place like the US. | 04:41 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Science: science: Impact of prior SARS-CoV-2 infection on incidence of hospitalization and adverse events following mRNA SARS-CoV-2 vaccination: A nationwide, retrospective cohort study → https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/sfzhys/impact_of_prior_sarscov2_infection_on_incidence/ | 05:30 |
| LjL | Tuvix, unusual to see Italians being less uh more uh you know what i mean, maybe | 05:45 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Mayor of Terry Fox's hometown in B.C. calls out vaccine mandate protesters for defacing statue → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sg0qk7/mayor_of_terry_foxs_hometown_in_bc_calls_out/ | 05:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from This Week In Virology: TWiV 860: Evading a Toll on the road to RNA vaccines: TWiV reviews a seminal paper showing that chemically modified bases in RNAs suppress recognition by Toll-like receptors, a finding that that was essential for the development of COVID-19 mRNA vaccines. → https://www.microbe.tv/twiv/twiv-860/ | 06:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from Science-Based Medicine: Why Can’t We Discuss This Taboo Subject Everyone is Talking About?: Unlike doctors who work with COVID-19 patients, I am not afraid to discuss taboo topics. To find out more, become a member and receive exclusive content. The post first [... want %more?] → https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/why-cant-we-discuss-this-taboo-topic-everyone-is-talking-about/ | 06:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD (@michaelzlin): NYTimes covering what we covered in this thread earlier: Omicron exacerbates preexisting conditions, so some hospitalized "with COVID" are there because of COVID:nytimes.com/2022/01/29/hea… → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/1487677862240948227 | 07:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD (@michaelzlin): To be clear, the reduction in transmission is mostly from the vaccinated avoiding illness. Once infected with SARSCoV2, vaccinated shed as much virus as unvaccinated for the first 5 days. → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/1487687380207214592 | 08:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread | January 30, 2022: Please refer to our Wiki for more information on COVID-19 and our sub. You can find answers to frequently asked questions in our FAQ , where there is valuable information such as our: → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/sg48ws/daily_discussion_thread_january_30_2022/ | 09:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): As shown in Sci. Immunol. a few days ago, without the 3x vaccine:Three exposures to the spike protein of SARS-CoV-2 by either infection or vaccination elicit superior neutralizing immunity to all variants of concernnature.com/articles/s4159… → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/1487707731389788163 | 09:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Prior COVID infection more protective than vaccination during Delta surge - Reuters → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sg4xkm/prior_covid_infection_more_protective_than/ | 09:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Report puts timing of Novak Djokovic's positive COVID test into question → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sg60tf/report_puts_timing_of_novak_djokovics_positive/ | 11:16 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Darwin City, Australia: Due to covid, trucking logistics, a nationwide labour shortage, and flooding → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sg7360/darwin_city_australia_due_to_covid_trucking/ | 12:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: Global COVID Cases For 30JAN22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/sg7rvl/global_covid_cases_for_30jan22/ | 13:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: Russia Sees Record Population Decline As Excess Deaths Hit 1M | 29JAN22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/sg8qmg/russia_sees_record_population_decline_as_excess/ | 14:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: When omicron isn’t so mild | 30JAN22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/sg8ws3/when_omicron_isnt_so_mild_30jan22/ | 14:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: PH confirms almost 17k new COVID-19 cases | 30JAN22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/sg92ju/ph_confirms_almost_17k_new_covid19_cases_30jan22/ | 14:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): 10. SARS-CoV-2 will keep mutating, as all coronaviruses do. Now immune pressure will be an important selection factor. This means selection on drawing less attention (less pathogenic), neutralizing antibody and innate evasion, tropism to the URT.nature.com/articles/s4146… → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/1487790154160947200 | 15:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): 11. Cycles of SARS-CoV-2 infection will happen, finding a spot in the seasonal cycles. It will likely be mainly affecting those sensitive to other viruses such as influenza and RSV. Hospitalisations will sadly happen, but should largely not be additive. → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/1487790156086185984 | 15:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Taiwan VP, in U.S., repeats accusation China blocked vaccine access → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sgaj6y/taiwan_vp_in_us_repeats_accusation_china_blocked/ | 15:58 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Anyone who thinks that vaccines aren't working against Omicron might want to review the dataerictopol.substack.com/p/a-shot-in-th… pic.twitter.com/oI0wPRHeMC → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1487809030613467139 | 16:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Bloom Lab (@jbloom_lab): Good blog post by @dr_kkjetelina on what we do (not) know about how #SARSCoV2 might evolve in future, & how that relates to possible new boosters. Although note to extent there is any brilliance in science she describes, it's mostly from @eguia_rachel, @trvrb, [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/jbloom_lab/status/1487811682327953410 | 16:47 |
| lastshell | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMMulCwYArk | Texas Scientists Develop A Patent-Free Covid Vaccine | 16:51 |
| Arsanerit | Are there no patent-free vaccines yet? | 16:54 |
| Arsanerit | Even the ones developed in Cuba & China are patented? | 16:54 |
| lastshell | https://theconversation.com/corbevax-a-new-patent-free-covid-19-vaccine-could-be-a-pandemic-game-changer-globally-174672 | 16:57 |
| lastshell | I'm not able to find other covid patent free results in google Arsanerit | 16:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Face The Nation (@FaceTheNation): .@margbrennan: If you had Omicron can you be reinfected with the new coronavirus strain?@ScottGottliebMD: "If you had Omicron infection, you should have subsequent protection from this new variant." pic.twitter.com/HYwKI2cBc9 → https://twitter.com/FaceTheNation/status/1487817756066070531 | 17:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Face The Nation (@FaceTheNation): "I think they're doing all they can do," says @ScottGottliebMD on the CDC's new COVID guidance for childcare centers, but points out "I think we should be focusing more on trying to keep the infection out in the first place." pic.twitter.com/aN5z9FfyCy → https://twitter.com/FaceTheNation/status/1487819232264007688 | 17:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): Sunday 30 January 2022 Update: submitted by /u/HippolasCage to r/CoronavirusUK → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronavirusUK/comments/sgcrkb/sunday_30_january_2022_update/ | 17:44 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Elizabeth Florio (@elizflorio): 8/Speaking of experts, I’m grateful for the efforts of @VirusesImmunity, @resiapretorius, @nathavindra and many others who believed the stories of long-haulers from the beginning. And beyond grateful for @itsbodypolitic— a lifeline for #LongCovid [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/elizflorio/status/1487831023803113472 | 18:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): The 3rd shot was supposed to rev up our memory T cell response and provide durable protection from severe illness vs Omicron. But the new Israeli data suggests that isn't the case. An explanation is needederictopol.substack.com/p/a-shot-in-th… pic.twitter.com/yABFSGktnw → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1487844688052711424 | 18:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Gobernador Pierluisi (@GovPierluisi): Former @US_FDA Commissioner, @ScottGottliebMD, briefed the Governors at the #NGAWinterMeeting on additional measures to overcome the pandemic and the development and impact of the Omicron variant. PR continues leading by example in the battle against [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/GovPierluisi/status/1487850515014815747 | 19:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Canada protest against COVID vaccine mandates blocks Ottawa for second day → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sgfkb6/canada_protest_against_covid_vaccine_mandates/ | 20:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD (@michaelzlin): So let's sum up this sorry situation, which is more sorry than I would have thought possible 1 year ago:HHS Secretary: lawyer who has never said a thing about COVIDFDA Commissioner: there isn't oneCDC Director: working from home via Zoom → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/1487868933914783749 | 20:27 |
| Alex1138[m] | how true is it that richer countries won't share with poorer countries so it's slowing the rate of global vaccination? | 20:46 |
| Alex1138[m] | and yeah maybe also the lack of 'open source' (that's a weird way of putting it, but i guess patent free?) vaccines | 20:46 |
| dTal | depending on how liberally you define "share", extremely true | 20:53 |
| Tuvix | Sharing and making production more universally accesible would be the best way to go, but that's complicated due all of finances, politics, Intellectual Property, and logistics. | 20:54 |
| dTal | it's complicated due to greed, in other word | 20:54 |
| dTal | I'm not clear what role Bill Gates plays in all this, but he certainly claims responsibility for keeping vaccines under license | 20:55 |
| dTal | I'm of the hacker generation that regarded Bill Gates as intellectual property public enemy #1, so it doesn't surprise me at all | 20:56 |
| aruns | dTal: Didn't Microsoft own the licence to BASIC, and Gates tried to charge the makers of the C64 or something a lot of money for using BASIC? | 20:58 |
| aruns | Or have I gotten that wrong? | 20:58 |
| dTal | https://newrepublic.com/article/162000/bill-gates-impeded-global-access-covid-vaccines | 21:00 |
| de-facto | challenge would be to guarantee proper quality control in order to preserve the trust people have in a vaccine type/brand | 21:01 |
| dTal | aruns: Microsoft owned *a* BASIC | 21:02 |
| de-facto | thats not trivial especially when scaling massively | 21:02 |
| de-facto | also supply chain shortages are still a limiting factor | 21:02 |
| dTal | de-facto: brand trust is absolutely not worth prolonging a global pandemic over | 21:03 |
| dTal | it's not even an unsolvable problem, just brand the licensed copies differently duh | 21:03 |
| dTal | companies do that all the time | 21:04 |
| de-facto | its more than that, e.g. what if a brand has bad quality control and people have a lot of problems with it and loose trust | 21:04 |
| de-facto | then it may even lead to less vaccinations over all in a worst case scenario | 21:04 |
| de-facto | right now they give out production licenses under the original brand | 21:05 |
| de-facto | e.g. the doses of Moderna i got were produced by Lonza in Switzerland | 21:06 |
| dTal | license the vaccine but not the brand, if you're worried, it's that simple | 21:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: Lung abnormalities found in Long Covid patients with breathlessness | Hyperpolarised xenon MRI detected lung abnormalities in Long Covid patients with breathlessness which was not picked up by CT scans → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/sghddm/lung_abnormalities_found_in_long_covid_patients/ | 21:06 |
| de-facto | but its Moderna staying with their name for the quality(brand | 21:06 |
| dTal | this is a non-problem | 21:06 |
| de-facto | maybe, i am just saying that turst in quality is an important point | 21:07 |
| LjL | Matrix bridge is not being very fun | 21:07 |
| de-facto | but yeah it would be urgently important to increase immunity in e.g. Africa | 21:15 |
| de-facto | because we already have seen two nasty mutants emerging there, probably from long lasting infections | 21:15 |
| de-facto | well three | 21:15 |
| de-facto | Beta, Omicron and b.1.640.X | 21:16 |
| de-facto | so there need to be more free doses (far from expiry) to be delivered to those countries there | 21:17 |
| de-facto | and some program to increase trust in the quality of vaccines there | 21:19 |
| de-facto | i think this is a big challenge | 21:19 |
| de-facto | probably bigger challenge to establish trust in the vaccines than producing them with proper quality control | 21:21 |
| Tuvix | That's very hard when political figures openly use fear without any foundation in science to stoke mistrust intentionally. | 21:35 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Josiah 'So Mild' Grindrod (@JT_Grindrod): Friendly reminder that controlling COVID is a million times less disruptive than what it'll take to combat climate change. Some cheer for your Sunday afternoon. → https://twitter.com/JT_Grindrod/status/1487891719664193538 | 22:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: When Omicron Isn't So Mild: "roughly 2/3 of the coronavirus-positive patients in the system’s network had a primary diagnosis of COVID, but an additional 15% to 20% were diagnosed with other illnesses, like sepsis or [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/sgiqq4/when_omicron_isnt_so_mild_roughly_23_of_the/ | 22:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): UK data on booster effect vs Omicron ICU admission Besides its marked benefit vs hospitalization and death twitter.com/PaulMainwood/s… → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/1487900250056527874 | 22:33 |
| Alex1138[m] | i am actually glad i got 3 shots even though the 3rd seemed a bit silly at the time to get | 22:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: The anti-COVID-19 Drug Remdesivir Promotes Oncogenic Herpesviruses Reactivation through Regulation of Intracellular Signaling Pathways → https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/sgjlqq/the_anticovid19_drug_remdesivir_promotes/ | 22:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Toronto's medical officer of health says city eventually needs to 'learn to live with' COVID-19 → https://old.reddit.com/r/worldnews/comments/sgjx8j/torontos_medical_officer_of_health_says_city/ | 23:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Gov. Asa Hutchinson (@AsaHutchinson): Insightful words on the COIVD pandemic from @ScottGottliebMD this morning at the @NatlGovsAssoc Winter Meeting. He’s a leading voice in public health, and I greatly appreciate his perspective. pic.twitter.com/bzu7Oyxuj3 → https://twitter.com/AsaHutchinson/status/1487910925680189443 | 23:21 |
| Timvde | Alex1138[m]: I got my third on between Christmas and New Year, and I think that was perfect timing given the rise of omicron here | 23:38 |
| Alex1138[m] | not antivax at all, but i was like "well omicron is mild, i've had 2 shots, vaccines don't (really) help with transmissibility, so like..." | 23:40 |
| Timvde | Alex1138[m]: "mild" is relative, of course | 23:40 |
| Alex1138[m] | mhm | 23:41 |
| Timvde | And something that's hard to compare, as a lot of the population now has some sort of immunity already (because vaccinations or previous infection) | 23:41 |
| Dredd | LjL @LjL:libera.chat: what's the bridge doing? | 23:42 |
| LjL | Dredd, all y'all get K-lined en mass and/or "20000 client limit exceeded" then rejoin en masse, rinse and repeat, i've had to disable NickServ notifications because i kept reconnecting | 23:43 |
| Dredd | LjL @LjL:libera.chat: we should probably report it to the libera and matrix staff | 23:49 |
| LjL | Dredd, it's been happening for two days with tons of clients involved, they can't not have seen :P | 23:49 |
| Dredd | Seems like they need a larger limit | 23:49 |
| Dredd | Well... They somehow missed it last time 😁 | 23:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from COVID on Twitter: Tom Wenseleers (@TWenseleers): Will post some more on BA.2 & BA.1.1. one of these days, but in the meantime you can have a look at @trvrb's thread below. I'm a bit slow these days, because I'm struck by Covid for the moment myself... twitter.com/trvrb/status/1… → https://twitter.com/TWenseleers/status/1487919857740001284 | 23:50 |
| LjL | Dredd, also the latest mass quick was with message (Quit: You% have% been% kicked% for% being% idle) which sounds like they messed up the message a little while doing it manually | 23:50 |
| LjL | my guess would be they tried to lower the amount of clients to stay within the limit by kicking idle ones manually | 23:50 |
| Dredd | Ha ha | 23:50 |
| Dredd | Did I get kicked? | 23:51 |
| LjL | i'm not really sure Libera is willing to allow more clients, since this is the limit i saw last time it was hit, and it wasn't raised, and that was months ago... | 23:51 |
| LjL | Dredd, * Dredd has quit (Quit: Client limit exceeded: 20000) | 23:51 |
| Dredd | Libera should stop being silly and trying to exercise irrational forms of control | 23:52 |
| LjL | [20:13:07] <jess[m]> I'm trying to chase up getting the l.c bridge fixed | 23:52 |
| LjL | [20:13:20] <Tobbi[m]> libera bridge down? | 23:52 |
| LjL | [20:13:28] <jess[m]> sort of | 23:52 |
| LjL | Dredd, it's not particularly irrational not to want bridges with tens of thousands of people quitting and rejoining at the same time | 23:52 |
| LjL | Matrix can be neat but it should not be a DDoS on Libera really | 23:52 |
| Dredd | Sadly for them matrix long ago dwarfed the size of them as they were even back in free node | 23:52 |
| Dredd | It is still growing | 23:53 |
| Dredd | Eventually if that doesn't stop then statistically matrix users will come to dominate all popular channels bridged | 23:53 |
| LjL | yes, and that's probably why many IRC people were/are wary of it, because it basically ate it up with this "friendly bridging" trick | 23:54 |
| Dredd | I'm all for having a limit, just saying 20k is a tiny tiny fraction of daily active matrix users | 23:54 |
| LjL | i am happy to coexist but i'm not happy for Libera to virtually disappear "because Matrix is better and everyone is on it anyway" | 23:54 |
| Dredd | It's time to raise it | 23:54 |
| LjL | if that came to be the case i'd just be on both places, but definitely not stop being on IRC | 23:54 |
| Dredd | A favourite quote of mine "if you don't like change, them you'll like irrelevance even less" | 23:55 |
| LjL | i'm used to being part of "irrelevant" niche things | 23:55 |
| LjL | so i guess i don't share that feeling | 23:55 |
| LjL | besides, Matrix.org itself has had even bigger problems than Libera historically when the bridge disconnected. while on the Libera side it's "just" a matter of seeing many join/quit messages at the same time, matrix.org pretty much stopped working entirely due to the lag that got created | 23:56 |
| LjL | so i'm not really sure having a limit is just something desirable on the Libera side | 23:56 |
| LjL | and i'm not them, but if the limit is staying at a given point, i assume it's because it's felt that it would be too much above that point | 23:57 |
| Tuvix | They need tof ix the disaster of their bridge, but it seems they can't do that. Matrix is clearly not designed properly to handle real-world situations. | 23:57 |
| LjL | i don't really know, maybe they have their reasons or maybe they're trying to work things out (as jess suggests), but i just don't share this idea that since IRC is poised to become irrelevant, i should embrace that and hop | 23:57 |
| LjL | Tuvix, the bridge != Matrix | 23:58 |
| Tuvix | The bridge *is* the Matrix conneciton here. | 23:58 |
| LjL | Matrix itself has not been having any issue the past days | 23:58 |
| LjL | it's still not "Matrix" | 23:58 |
| Tuvix | If they're unable to run a HA bridge properly, then maybe they shouldn't do it, or hire people who have a clue. | 23:58 |
| Tuvix | Case in point, it's obviously not HA becuase the entier ruddy thing tips over, sometimes multiple times a day. | 23:58 |
| LjL | i think both of you are having silly attitudes at the opposites of the Matrix vs IRC situation so i don't know, join #matrix and #libera respectively and yell at them, i guess | 23:59 |
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