libera/##covid-19/ Wednesday, 2022-04-06

BrainstormUpdates for Barbados: +432 cases, +2599 tests since a day ago — France: +209752 cases, +132 deaths since 13 hours ago — United Kingdom: +358 cases, +5 deaths since 3 hours ago00:05
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): —The 4th dose works vs severe disease but the challenge is Omicron, which has considerable immune escape, vastly different from the original strain.—Until now, from this report, the data were only at 12+ days (extended to 6 weeks)—There's another major study [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151146509795626189500:09
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): "Rates of confirmed SARS-CoV-2 infection and severe Covid-19 were lower after a fourth dose of BNT162b2 vaccine than after only three doses." 3.5x lower.This is largely explained by a less well functioning Immune system in elderly, that requires an extra boost → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/151146560330708172900:19
BrainstormNew from WebMD: U.K. Adds 9 Symptoms to Official COVID-19 List: The U.K. Health Security Agency added nine symptoms to its official list of signs that could indicate a COVID-19 infection. → https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220405/u-k-adds-nine-symptoms-to-official-covid-list00:28
BrainstormUpdates for Brazil: +24772 cases since 22 hours ago — Germany: +69556 cases since 12 hours ago — Spain: +27079 cases, +146 deaths since 4 days ago01:01
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Scott Gottlieb, MD (@ScottGottliebMD): “Shanghai reports 17,077 new coronavirus cases, the biggest one-day increase on record, with all 26 million people now on lockdown” — @BNODesk → https://twitter.com/ScottGottliebMD/status/151149586503428506102:15
BrainstormUpdates for Slovakia: +6512 cases since 13 hours ago — Solomon Is.: +386 cases since a day ago — Canada: +11011 cases, +93827 tests since 9 hours ago03:00
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): That means it's crucial now to make on-target vax. Omicron-reactive memory cells are a small subset; they're those that happen to acquire Omicron reactivity after SHM. The vast majority of Abs elicited by original vax don't react to Omicron.An [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151151574625736704503:31
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): "Twin Peaks" Final report from REACT-1 of ~110,000 NP swabs during March 2022 BA.2 wave in England: People age 55+ were the most affectedspiral.imperial.ac.uk/handle/10044/1… pic.twitter.com/AKQ1b26qAw → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151152041685819392403:50
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Josiah 'So Mild' Grindrod (@JT_Grindrod): Anyone that read the info coming out of China, and did the bare minimum of research on SARS-COV, knew SARS-COV-2 was nothing to fuck with. I've been on personal lockdown since Jan 2020... twitter.com/georgimarinov/… → https://twitter.com/JT_Grindrod/status/151153777515308236904:58
BrainstormUpdates for Australia: +78167 cases, +43 deaths since 23 hours ago — Thailand: +24252 cases, +94 deaths since 23 hours ago — United Kingdom: +418 cases since 8 hours ago05:05
LjL"Long COVID, which arises months after a COVID-19 infection, affects nearly 7% of all U.S. adults"05:10
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Schooley (@Rschooley): I'm always waiting for the other shoe to drop whenever the Covid news looks good as much as the next guy, but the amount of people yelling in replies as if he's saying anything more conclusive than, "So far, so good," is nuts. twitter.com/EricTopol/stat… → https://twitter.com/Rschooley/status/151154223517041459405:17
BrainstormNew from r/COVID19: COVID19: The new normal? Dynamics and scale of the SARS-CoV-2 variant Omicron epidemic in England → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/txcq3t/the_new_normal_dynamics_and_scale_of_the_sarscov2/05:55
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): This faster decay after dose 4 compared to after dose 3 (measured from peak) suggests Omicron-reactive memory cells are being used up faster than new B cell priming can replenish them. That's concerning for the period beyond 1mo (not studied, but does [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151156152585239757006:33
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): With Omicron boosters then the immune system will have a larger % of B cells making Abs that actually target Omicron. This will allow a longer time before decay to 50% VE, e.g. 6mo instead of the current 3mo. That makes annual boosting in the fall a [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151156331942492569606:43
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): Reference for VE on Omicron disease after dose 4, with kineticsnejm.org/doi/full/10.10… → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151156671679021056106:53
BrainstormNew from Il Sole 24 Ore: (translated) Covid is still frightening, towards the yes to the fourth dose immediately for the over 80s: The first scientific evidence shows that for this category of vulnerable people, a new protection is needed with vaccination → https://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/il-covid-spaventa-ancora-il-si-quarta-dose-subito-gli-over-80-AEWwPRPB07:12
BrainstormUpdates for New South Wales, Australia: +24116 cases, +14 deaths since 23 hours ago — Western Australia, Australia: +22447 cases, +16 deaths since 2 days ago — Sicily, Italy: +6514 cases, +43 deaths since 23 hours ago — Quebec, Canada: +4946 cases, +31 deaths since 23 hours ago08:01
BrainstormNew from EMA: What's new: Medicine: Human medicines European public assessment report (EPAR): Vaxelis, diphtheria, tetanus, pertussis (acellular, component), hepatitis B (rDNA), poliomyelitis (inactivated) and Haemophilus type b conjugate vaccine (adsorbed), Meningitis, [... want %more?] → https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/medicines/human/EPAR/vaxelis08:57
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): nCoV: Dr. Naomi Wolf on Pfizer: “They hid. They concealed. They redacted.” | 05APR22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/txg9je/dr_naomi_wolf_on_pfizer_they_hid_they_concealed/09:07
BrainstormNew from EMA: Human medicine assessment reports: (news): Human medicines European public assessment report (EPAR): Foclivia, pandemic influenza vaccine (H5N1) (surface antigen, inactivated, adjuvanted), Influenza, Human;Immunization;Disease Outbreaks, Date of authorisation: 18/10/2009, Revision: 12, Status: Authorised → https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/medicines/human/EPAR/foclivia09:45
BrainstormUpdates for Taiwan: +359 cases, +47462 tests since a day ago10:00
BrainstormNew from StatNews: STAT+: STAT-Harris Poll: Most Americans would get a Covid-19 booster shot if recommended: A new survey by STAT and The Harris Poll finds one in three U.S. adults are running errands or shopping unmasked, and half are going to work without wearing a… → https://www.statnews.com/pharmalot/2022/04/06/covid19-vaccine-mask-booster-harris-poll/10:43
dTalOnly 1 in 3? That surprises me. Here in UK it feels like mask wearing is a thing of the past11:04
undefined_bobhere not, even tho the rules are lifted since sunday11:06
undefined_bobpeople still wear them in the supermarket for example11:06
undefined_bobhaven't seen one without but a few who switched to surgical masks instead of N9511:07
dTaldarn that sounds like a different universe, where people are sane11:08
dTalrestrictions lifted and everyone still wearing N95s? How incredibly sensible11:08
undefined_bobwell, I read online about some people dont wear masks at the supermarket but they were the minority11:09
dTalthe only people in the supermarket I see wearing masks are the employees, and not even them a lot of the time11:09
undefined_bobI was yesterday at the supermarket and post office and didn't see one without mask11:10
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): Don´t confuse infection with disease. Know that vaccines protect against severe disease, know they ensure you will recognise SARS-CoV-2 also with mutations, also a new variant. But take your responsibility; don´t spread it, and take care of those more vulnerable. → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/151163356001221427811:21
BrainstormUpdates for Bhutan: +2291 cases, +7333 tests since a day ago11:59
BrainstormNew from StatNews: Tracking an FDA advisory panel meeting on Covid-19 vaccines and boosters: On the agenda of the FDA's advisory panel on vaccines today: boosters and the possibility of updating the vaccines to better match circulating SARS-CoV-2 strains. → https://www.statnews.com/2022/04/06/tracking-fda-advisory-panel-meeting-covid-19-vaccines-boosters/12:10
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: (translated) Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): So yes SARS-CoV-2 is developing. In the long term, we expect it to weaken in heaviness and become/remain endemic. In the short term, however, there remains a chance of some crazy bucking. Virus evolution is not a straight line.#covid #late [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/151165399022802125812:38
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: (translated) Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): Then it doesn't help to panic or say that you are completely done with it! What helps is to get vaccinated and get any boosters. Stay healthy and think of others too; especially the vulnerable!#covid #late vaccinate 19/19 → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/151165399177990144812:48
BrainstormNew from ScienceNews: What we learned about COVID-19 safety from a NYC anime convention: November’s Anime NYC convention was not a COVID-19 superspreader event, which means there are lessons to be learned. → https://www.sciencenews.org/article/covid-anime-convention-nyc-coronavirus-lessons-masks-tests13:07
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): Covid2019: Omicron is trouncing the argument for “natural immunity” to COVID: Unvaccinated people ... left with paltry levels of neutralizing antibodies against omicron. They also have almost no neutralizing antibodies against any of five other... → https://old.reddit.com/r/Covid2019/comments/txjreo/omicron_is_trouncing_the_argument_for_natural/13:17
BrainstormUpdates for Cook Is.: +189 cases, +1600 tests since a day ago14:04
BrainstormNew from Politico: Stronger, greener, better: harnessing digitalization to transform economies:  Telecoms networks kept us connected and working during the pandemic. Now the European telecoms sector is investing and innovating to transform economies, making [... want %more?] → https://www.politico.eu/sponsored-content/stronger-greener-better-harnessing-digitalization-to-transform-economies-2/14:14
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): nCoV: Global COVID Cases For 06APR22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/txkw5p/global_covid_cases_for_06apr22/14:24
BrainstormNew from StatNews: STAT+: Pharmalittle: Most Americans would get a second booster shot; FDA pulls Glaxo Covid treatment: A new survey by STAT and The Harris Poll finds 6 in 10 Americans have already decided they will get another Covid booster shot if it’s [... want %more?] → https://www.statnews.com/pharmalot/2022/04/06/covid19-vaccine-booster-glaxo-pfizer-mckinsey-opioids-patents/15:23
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: What It Was Like to Enroll Children in the COVID Vaccine Trial → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/txm3ms/what_it_was_like_to_enroll_children_in_the_covid/15:32
BrainstormNew from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: 'It was good to wake up': North Carolina man with COVID survives on ventilator for seven weeks - Johnson was on short-term disability with his benefits through the Pineville Police Department, but says after six [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/txmkl6/it_was_good_to_wake_up_north_carolina_man_with/15:52
BrainstormUpdates for Liechtenstein: +195 cases, +11542 tests since 5 days ago — Canada: +33 deaths since 22 hours ago16:03
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Tom Wenseleers (@TWenseleers): Shanghai becoming ever more dystopian. The joys of zero Covid policies combined with poor vaccination rates among the elderly. I'm glad we chose the more obvious route: getting vaccinated & then happily getting on with our lives... twitter.com/aliceysu/statu… → https://twitter.com/TWenseleers/status/151171303947264000116:42
BrainstormNew from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Prospective Observational Study to Evaluate a Possible Change in APS Antibody Profiles After COVID-19 Infection or Vaccination → https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT0531304817:02
BrainstormNew from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Clinical Evaluation for Batch Consistency of Ad5-nCoV in Chinese Healthy Adults → https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT0531364617:12
BrainstormNew from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): Safety and Immunogenicity of Recombinant SARS-CoV-2 Spike Protein Vaccine (CHO Cell) for the Prevention of COVID-19 → https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT0531302217:22
BrainstormUpdates for Germany: +193332 cases since 23 hours ago18:02
BrainstormNew from ClinicalTrials.gov: (news): SARS-CoV-2 Specific Immune Response After COVID-19 Vaccination in Cancer Patients → https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT0531307418:11
BrainstormNew from COVID19 Vaccine Tracker: valerie: Altimmune Inc: AdCOVID → https://covid19.trackvaccines.org/vaccines/75/18:21
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): You can read my 2021 metathread (linked from the pinned tweet) for examples of the groupthink-sustained mistakes, but they include the wrong beliefs that 70% vax rate would end the pandemic, that vax people can't spread disease, and that Delta wasn't [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151174229727622758818:31
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Yet less than 30% of Americans have had a 3rd dose.That ranks 71st among the list of countries.Breakdown by age, as of yesterdaycovid.cdc.gov/covid-data-tra… pic.twitter.com/vizcuMg9nF → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151174424592472064018:40
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): ... during this pandemic basic scientists have been underconsulted in all these areas. Had their advice been heard *across lanes* then we'd have done many things better: masked from the beginning, ramped up N95 production right away... → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151174557780079821418:50
BrainstormNew from COVID19 Vaccine Tracker: valerie: AIM Vaccine: LVRNA009 → https://covid19.trackvaccines.org/vaccines/189/19:00
BrainstormUpdates for Vanuatu: +1 deaths since 19 hours ago19:05
`St0nercan someone link me some legit articles on people catching covid19 multiple times? it's a hard thing to search for19:13
peetaur`St0ner: yeah it's like they just use the old clearly invalid PCR test data and call it a 2nd ...or just hard to find19:30
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Marc Veldhoen (@Marc_Veld): @EricTopol *escape from Omicron-derived neutralisation antibodies; allowing re-infection; immunity will remainagainst severe disease. → https://twitter.com/Marc_Veld/status/151175613438176051319:30
`St0nernah i mean people legit getting sick with covid19 multiple times19:36
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Michael Lin, MD PhD   (@michaelzlin): 2022.04.05: A comparison of VE of our 1st-gen vax on original strain vs Omicron, with referencestwitter.com/michaelzlin/st… → https://twitter.com/michaelzlin/status/151175741156388864319:40
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): That added doses of vaccines directed vs a strain from over 2 years ago, now with such marked divergence of amino acids from mutations (distance BA1 vs BA.2 > Beta to Gamma) work to protect vs severe Covid, hospitalizations and death, is noteworthyantigenic map [... want %more?] → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151176369307104870420:00
BrainstormUpdates for Japan: +52762 cases, +66 deaths since 13 hours ago20:08
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Left is Delta, 3rd dose; Right is Omicron, 4th doseProtection ve death. It's reduced, the curves are less divergent vs Omicron BA.1 than Delta, but still making a differenceReferences erictopol.substack.com/p/a-new-wave-a… pic.twitter.com/E7WOcPK5mG → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151176546006002893420:10
BrainstormNew from WebMD: Mask-Wearing Will Continue in Some Situations: Polls: More than half of doctors and nurses surveyed in a Medscape poll said they expect to keep wearing face masks in certain scenarios. → https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220406/mask-wearing-will-continue-in-some-situations-polls20:20
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): No difference between BA.1 and BA.2 for vaccine protection has been seen to date (surprising and good)3rd dose, all ages, protection vs hospitalizations, ICU (critical illness) and death pic.twitter.com/hw694JMgnp → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151177909244136243720:59
BrainstormUpdates for United Kingdom: +51311 cases, +2947 deaths, +611114 tests since 20 hours ago21:04
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Unfathomable. Why did it take @WHO 2 years to say #COVIDisAirborne?  nature.com/articles/d4158… feature @Nature by @dyanilewis pic.twitter.com/q87QEqLPwH → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151178835682846720021:37
oerheks Why did it take @WHO 2 years to say #COVIDisAirborne? it did not take 2 years.21:37
oerheksEric Topol again, hmmm?21:38
TimvdeAccording to our national numbers, people aged 65+ with 2 vaccines are much more likely to end up in the ICU than people who aren't vaccinated at all :/21:40
TimvdeBut I guess it must be said that they probably got their vaccines over a year ago21:40
TimvdeBut still, significantly worse odds is... weird21:41
samuraisafetycan anyone post links to covid related tweets / articles?21:42
Timvdesamuraisafety: this is a public channel, so sure?21:42
samuraisafetyah ok. thank you. I wasn't sure if it was just for the auto shares/bots to do that21:42
samuraisafetyhttps://twitter.com/EnemyInAState/status/151178362185364685421:43
samuraisafetyis there a better way to share that would allow a preview?21:43
samuraisafetyI also follow this guy. He 'broke' the  covid story first: https://twitter.com/DrEricDing21:45
BrainstormNew from CIDRAP: COVID-19 Scan for Apr 06, 2022: Efficacy of 4th COVID vaccine dose C-sections, inductions during pandemic → https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/04/covid-19-scan-apr-06-202221:56
BrainstormNew from CIDRAP: Global COVID cases fall for second week as BA.2 rises: Lisa Schnirring | News Editor | CIDRAP News Apr 06, 2022 Among SARS-CoV-2 isolates, 99.8% are Omicron, and 93.6% of those are the faster-spreading BA.2 subvariant. → https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/04/global-covid-cases-fall-second-week-ba2-rises22:06
BrainstormUpdates for Italy: +69885 cases, +150 deaths, +461448 tests since a day ago — France: +18 cases since 22 hours ago22:07
BrainstormNew from CIDRAP: COVID-19 health workers suffer combat-type moral trauma: Mary Van Beusekom | News Writer | CIDRAP News Apr 06, 2022 "It is sobering to see how many health care workers are troubled at a moral level." → https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/04/covid-19-health-workers-suffer-combat-type-moral-trauma22:16
de-factoTimvde, do you have a source for that?22:43
Timvdede-facto: yes, but it's Dutch: https://www.vrt.be/vrtnws/nl/2021/10/23/coronacijfers/22:43
TimvdeBut if you scroll down, it's the bar graph22:44
TimvdeLight blue is unvaccinated, middle blue is 2 doses, dark blue is boosted22:44
TimvdeFirst graph is cases, second graph hospitalisations, third graph ICU, fourth graph deaths22:45
de-factowhat means "per 100 000"? per 100 000 citizens or per 100 000 of that category?22:49
de-factoexample: given C = 100k citizens with C = N (naive) + V (vaccinated) + B (boosted), H end in hospital with H = Nh (naive) + Vh (vaccinated) + Bh (boosted): do they now say attack rate is AN = Nh / N or AN = Nh / C ?22:53
de-factothe first would be incidence per category (comparative) the second would depend on the portion of those C = 100k citizens that actually are in that category (e.g. if all would have been vaccinated C = V then all hospitalized would have to be vaccinated H = Vh )22:55
BrainstormNew from CIDRAP: Biden moves on combating long COVID: Stephanie Soucheray | News Reporter | CIDRAP News Apr 06, 2022 → https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/04/biden-moves-combating-long-covid22:55
de-factoTimvde, if they divide per citizens (consisting of all categories) your assumption is not valid, if they divide per category it potentially would be a valid assumption22:57
Timvdede-facto: per 100k from that category22:57
Timvde(iiuc)22:57
TimvdeLet me check the source22:58
TimvdeIf not per category, it wouldn't make sense, lol22:59
de-factoits not immediately clear to me (at least from that website there)22:59
TimvdeThen the graph would be absolutely worthless22:59
de-factoyes thats what i want to investigate22:59
TimvdeThe source says "per vaccinatiestatus en per leeftijdsgroep", which means "Per vaccination status and per age group"23:02
TimvdeBut I *think* they may also have an English report23:02
de-factoso they divide the initial 100k citizens 1) per vaccination status and that then 2) per age group?23:03
TimvdeHmm, only Dutch, French and German23:03
BrainstormUpdates for Canada: +8106 cases, +38 deaths since 20 hours ago23:03
Timvdede-facto: left graph is absolute numbers, right graph is per 100k: https://i.ibb.co/VDYkfkV/image.png23:05
BrainstormNew from COVID on Twitter: Eric Topol (@EricTopol): Does home pulse oximetry monitoring improve outcomes with Covid?A randomized trial says no@NEJM nejm.org/doi/full/10.10… pic.twitter.com/0is6vuK7sc → https://twitter.com/EricTopol/status/151181115702342041823:05
Timvde(for cases, here, not hospitalisations)23:05
Timvdede-facto: this is for hospitalisations: https://i.ibb.co/7YYBhky/image.png23:06
Timvdeand ICU: https://i.ibb.co/wLPLks9/image.png23:06
TimvdeHere the legend leaves out the "and" in the middle23:08
de-factook since the ratios (naive, vaccinated, boosted) change relative to each other the denominators have to be different, hence indeed per category (otherwise the ratio of the absolute numbers would be conserved and just scaled)23:09
de-factoif a category depends on membership in a parent category that parent also should appear in the denominator of the child category23:14
de-factoe.g. hospitalized per infection attack rate in each category23:16
de-factoTimvde, do you have a link to the german report?23:17
Timvdede-facto: oh, yikes23:17
TimvdeI just saw there was a button for German23:17
Timvdebut: https://covid-19.sciensano.be/de/covid-19-epidemiologische-situation23:18
Timvdenvm I guess :P23:18
Timvdede-facto: as I understand it, only age and vaccination status are in the denominator23:19
de-factoso the PDFs are only in NL?23:19
de-factoand FR23:20
de-factowhich was the PDF for your screenshots?23:21
BrainstormNew from WebMD: Omicron Subvariant Hasn’t Caused a Surge of Cases: The Omicron subvariant BA.2 is causing most of  the COVID infections in the United States, but so far it hasn’t resulted in a surge of cases. → https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20220406/omicron-subvariant-hasnt-caused-a-surge-of-cases23:24
Timvdede-facto: apparently23:27
TimvdeThis is the pdf from my screenshot: https://covid-19.sciensano.be/sites/default/files/Covid19/COVID-19_Weekly_report_NL.pdf23:27
de-factothanks23:28
TimvdePages 25 and 26 (in the PDF, not the printed numbers)23:28
Timvde(oh, they're the same)23:28
de-factoits very strange, i dont know a word of NL but somehow can read parts of it because its similar to German and English23:30
Timvdeit is :)23:31
de-factobut i have to "speak it" in my head, because i dont know the spelling :P23:33
TimvdeHeh :P23:34
TimvdeIf you want, I can translate some pieces23:34
de-factothanks, i can also use machine translation in case i need it for parts23:34
de-facto"The denominators used for the calculation of the incidences correspond to the total number of persons who 14 days before the date of the calculation listed vaccination status."23:40
TimvdeYes, since vaccines are only fully effective after 2 weeks, they disregard people within two weeks after their vaccination, which makes sense I guess23:43
TimvdeThat's a very small number anyway, we only have a few thousand more vaccinations per day23:43
de-factoyes but it says per category, hence your assumption holds i guess23:44
de-factowe dont really know the contamination attack rates, e.g. if vaccinated and boosted have more exposures to the pathogen in daily life23:45
de-factoid assume there are some behavioral differences potentially23:46
de-factoand also to be member in a derived category requires membership in a parent category, e.g to be infected requires contamination, hospitalized requires infection, to be in intensive care requires to be hospitalized etc23:47
TimvdeMy uneducated guess was one of: unvaccinated have historically had more cases, cutting out the most vulnerable and giving also decent immunity in the rest (maybe even better than through vaccines, but that doesn't mean that it's better to be unvaccinated when you first get sick), or alternatively, the more vulnerable are more likely to be vaccinated, 2 doses are not very effective against23:49
Timvdeomicron and people aged 65+ who got two doses, got them over a year ago by now23:49
Timvde(why they would refuse a booster after getting two doses, I have no idea, it's a general trend somehow)23:50
de-factoyes could also be a combination of those effects (they are not mutually exclusive)23:52
de-factosurely there are some biases involved by now, its not comparable to double blinded studies or such23:53
de-factoand indeed, boosting broadens the antibody spectrum significantly, also covering some more distant variants such as Omicron23:53
LjLsamuraisafety: you can type %print or %title before the URL to get the bot to post a preview23:54
de-factobut id assume that hints we urgently need s-protein signature update in the vaccines, to also include a collection of the most prevalent variants, including Omicron23:55
Timvdede-facto: I also read somewhere (in this channel, probably) that the test with updated vaccines aren't significantly better than a second booster :/23:57
TimvdeI hope that's not true23:57
de-factoi think it depends on the time for b-cell maturation / contraction23:57
TimvdeYou think that on short term, purely looking at antibodies, there may not be a big difference, but on long-term immunity, there could still be?23:58

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