filip | hi | 00:03 |
---|---|---|
cynicfm | hi | 00:11 |
cynicfm | hi | 00:16 |
cynicfm | can u see my messages ? | 00:23 |
fsmithred | yeah, you're here | 00:24 |
cynicfm | oh okay :). | 00:25 |
bozonius2 | grub-customizer | 02:18 |
bozonius2 | I'm looking around in the repos for it; reviews indicate it might be helpful tool | 02:18 |
bozonius2 | a helpful tool | 02:18 |
bozonius2 | (sticky keyboards!) | 02:19 |
bozonius2 | (fingers that don't do what they are supposed to!) | 02:19 |
bozonius2 | (hot weather!) | 02:19 |
bozonius2 | anyone know anything about grub-customizer? | 02:19 |
bozonius2 | or is that a "sissy" way of doing grub? | 02:20 |
nacelle | you probably meant to say "novice" | 02:21 |
nacelle | :-) | 02:21 |
bozonius2 | grub, especially grub2, nearly requires a pilots license to use it | 02:22 |
nacelle | but being a novice to grub configs... is probably OK | 02:22 |
nacelle | -shrug- | 02:22 |
bozonius2 | I've done some grub2 configs by hand... | 02:22 |
nacelle | try before grub :-) | 02:22 |
nacelle | lilo, or silo, etc. depending on architecture | 02:22 |
nacelle | and so many other bootloaders | 02:22 |
bozonius2 | lilo and elilo are no longer in support (since 2014 I think) | 02:23 |
bozonius2 | grub1 is no longer | 02:24 |
bozonius2 | (people will laugh at you if you still use grub1) | 02:24 |
nacelle | I was being sarcastic | 02:24 |
bozonius2 | I know | 02:24 |
bozonius2 | 's ok | 02:24 |
nacelle | perhaps I have a pilots license and am not aware | 02:25 |
bozonius2 | I deserve it, probably. | 02:25 |
bozonius2 | 747? | 02:25 |
* nacelle wonders if someone will lend a plane to find out | 02:25 | |
* bozonius2 thinks,maybe, a "test" plane? | 02:25 | |
bozonius2 | I guess I could try building the tool myself. Mainly to see what it can do. | 02:26 |
bozonius2 | mainly what I need is a way to chainload a syslinux boot from grub where all of the file systems are on lvm | 02:26 |
bozonius2 | (I'm pretty sure grub2 can do it) | 02:26 |
eyalroz | Where do I file a bug about mis-behavior of non-Devuan-specific code? | 08:56 |
eyalroz | Specifically, add-apt-repository? | 08:56 |
golinux | I see that's from Ubuntu. Ubuntu is not Debian. ymmv | 09:03 |
golinux | Ubuntu packages are not supported by Devuan. So there is no valid bug to report. | 09:04 |
golinux | You are welcome to debug (if that's possible) and maintain it for Devuan. | 09:06 |
golinux | Why can't you just edit the file directly? | 09:06 |
golinux | eyalroz: ^^^ | 09:07 |
eyalroz | golinux: It's a package available when using the Devuan mirrors, | 09:07 |
eyalroz | so it should be supported, shouldn't it? | 09:08 |
eyalroz | I'm working on a fix (it's a script after all) | 09:08 |
eyalroz | but I still need a place to report this | 09:08 |
golinux | I just searched pkginfo.devuan.org and nothing came up for add-apt-repository | 09:08 |
eyalroz | weird... | 09:08 |
eyalroz | The package is: software-properties-common | 09:09 |
Jjp137 | add-apt-repository seems to be part of the software-properties-common package, which comes from Debian (file list: https://packages.debian.org/stretch/all/software-properties-common/filelist) | 09:09 |
golinux | In any Devuan repo | 09:09 |
eyalroz | golinux: https://pkginfo.devuan.org/stage/ascii/ascii/software-properties-common_0.96.20.2-1.html | 09:10 |
golinux | You're faster than me! | 09:10 |
golinux | If you're sure it's a bug, submit it to bugs.devuan.org | 09:12 |
golinux | You might want to see if anybody else can confirm before doing that. | 09:13 |
golinux | Did you do a clean install? | 09:13 |
eyalroz | golinux: Yes | 09:13 |
eyalroz | It's a clear bug, that script tries to determine which kind of distro you're using, and it can't match Devuan | 09:14 |
eyalroz | so it throws an exception | 09:14 |
golinux | Maybe you could request upstream that they add Devuan. | 09:14 |
eyalroz | That's a possible resolution for the bug, yes; but someone needs to make sure they get the URL templates right./ | 09:15 |
golinux | Otherwise we'll probably have to maintain that package. unless the problem is outside the script. | 09:16 |
golinux | I'm not savvy enough to know much about how that's set up. | 09:17 |
golinux | I'd wait to see who shows up here for advice. | 09:18 |
eyalroz | golinux: For now, I've filed https://git.devuan.org/devuan/devuan-maintainers/issues/33 | 10:49 |
romo | Hey guys, is there a way to prevent the screen from blanking due to inactivity in ascii minimal live? | 14:16 |
gnarface | probably | 14:20 |
gnarface | in X? | 14:21 |
gnarface | or at the console? | 14:21 |
gnarface | in X this should work until it's restarted anyway: xset dpms 0 0 0 | 14:22 |
romo | gnarface: I don't believe minimal live even comes with anything graphical-related(?). I need the console-screen to "stay with me" while I run things like dd. | 14:23 |
gnarface | there is a way to set it there too, i just don't remember how off the top of my head | 14:25 |
debdog | xset dpms 0 0 0 | 14:25 |
debdog | xset s off | 14:25 |
debdog | or something alike | 14:26 |
debdog | (dpms are the timings and s is for the screensaver) | 14:26 |
gnarface | i thought xset only works in X | 14:26 |
gnarface | i could be wrong | 14:26 |
gnarface | he wants to disable it at the virtual console | 14:26 |
debdog | hmm, true | 14:26 |
gnarface | i think it may be different depending on whether he's using a framebuffer driver or not | 14:27 |
gnarface | and i think the raspberry pi does something entirely of it's own | 14:27 |
debdog | sorry, should have read the full story first | 14:28 |
romo | dpkg reports no xset. I'll check what exactly I'm bootin into there... | 14:28 |
romo | All right, so far I found boot options: std-toram, which equals /live/vmlinuz initrd.img boot=live noautologin vga=auto toram. I somehow doubt this is of any use? | 14:32 |
gnarface | vga=auto might do something | 14:33 |
gnarface | figuring out what driver your video card is using there would probably help more | 14:33 |
gnarface | it's probably also worth mentioning that most PC BIOSes do have a way to change the default DPMS settings | 14:34 |
gnarface | if yours has such a setting, you can most likely change it there without needing to touch the system configs | 14:34 |
debdog | mayhap this helps? https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/8056/disable-screen-blanking-on-text-console#32043 | 14:36 |
romo | Oh, I plan on using this as a carry around system. I was hoping there would be a way that isnt depandant any specific gpu or bios setting (or any hardware for that matter) it runs on. | 14:36 |
gnarface | well i'm sure there is | 14:37 |
gnarface | i just thought the BIOS might be an easier way out | 14:38 |
fsmithred | romo, are you planning to run in read-only mode, or do you plan to use a persistent volume? | 14:41 |
fsmithred | oh, that wouldn't matter if you use consoleblank=0 on boot command. | 14:43 |
romo | debdog: I was able to change and cat the changed value like that, I'm not sure when exactly it blanked before, I'm now waiting for it not to happen anymore. | 14:45 |
fsmithred | what value did cat show? | 14:46 |
romo | fsmithred: ah, excellent so that's available as boot option as well. if it works I'll just punch it in upon starting. No persistence required... | 14:46 |
romo | I set it to zero, which was reported back. | 14:47 |
fsmithred | yeah, I was going to suggest a hook script, but then I read further down the page | 14:47 |
fsmithred | oh, you didn't see what it was before you changed it? | 14:47 |
romo | I think it might have been 600, like in the example. I got excited... | 14:50 |
fsmithred | lol, I'm booting the iso now to check it | 14:52 |
fsmithred | yeah, 600 | 14:53 |
fsmithred | adding the option to the boot command makes it 0 | 14:56 |
romo | I took the scenic route and waited a bunch. It's not blanking anymore. Thanks a lot, everyone. I will now try to figure out how to disable curor blinking and then propose to that image. | 15:00 |
gnarface | you trying to kill pixels or something? | 15:03 |
romo | gnarface: I'm in the process of practicing bit-flipping. It's going great so far. | 15:04 |
gnarface | interesting | 15:05 |
filipdevuan | hey i installed antergos linux today but this distro feels a bit gay, but i was able to download bumblebee and wine and everything just worked in 5 minutes but i had best experience with devuan so far, just wish devuan had more modern desktop environment | 21:25 |
muep_ | I think xfce is pretty modern, unless definition of modern is chosen so that there is a lot of transparency and animations | 21:27 |
filipdevuan | im probably gonna come back to devuan cuz when i was on this distro there were always clever and nice people here, antergros feels to much mainstream and people on different distros IRC's are just not the same | 21:29 |
golinux | A "more modern desktop environment" will be the undoing of Linux | 21:37 |
filipdevuan | yeah... but i always liked using gnome. if devuan could be devuan and have gnome 3 like fedora it would be sick, but heard that gnome is mainly systemd, im still not familiar with what systemd does and init i read only few articles about it but still not very clear why should i ditch systemd distros like i believe id itched windows | 21:39 |
golinux | Surely, I've posted this before for you to read: http://lkml.iu.edu//hypermail/linux/kernel/1408.1/02496.html | 21:43 |
golinux | gnome and gtk3 are part of the cancer | 21:44 |
golinux | bbiab | 21:44 |
filipdevuan | iv read it before | 21:45 |
filipdevuan | yeah but why all these devuan DE's have to look like windows 98 | 21:46 |
ivanshmakov | filipdevuan: Huh? Well, I’m not using Devuan right now, but I’m pretty sure that JWM, Openbox and VTWM do /not/ look like W98. | 21:47 |
muep_ | I like gnome as well, but it is far from being the only environment that I would consider sufficiently modern | 21:49 |
filipdevuan | yeah but why all these devuan DE's have to look like windows 98 | 21:49 |
ivanshmakov | I’ve experimented with both Gnome and KDE back in 2001 (or so.) I still have no clue on how any of that can be useful to me. | 21:50 |
muep_ | gnome of 2001 is pretty much not recognizable if you compare it to gnome of today | 21:51 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Visually? I bet it isn’t. Functionally? I’m not quite sure. | 21:53 |
muep_ | even functionally I'm quite sure | 21:53 |
muep_ | gnome originally was one of those things designed around the desktop metaphor | 21:54 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Personally, I have little interest in metaphors. Rather, I’m interested in getting job done. And I very much doubt that Gnome is going to improve how GCC works for me. | 21:55 |
muep_ | I pretty certainly would not want my window manager or other program filling that slow change how my compiler works | 21:56 |
muep_ | *that slot | 21:56 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: That’s the point. To me, there’s no desktop. If anything, there’re ‘tools,’ that sometimes get arranged in ‘toolkits.’ That’s all. | 21:57 |
muep_ | but having some at least reasonably ok window manager is essential for me to switch between programs I interact between the times I interact with gcc | 21:57 |
muep_ | these environments are just pre-assembled collections of such tools. then of course many users prefer to pick and set up their own and that is just fine | 21:59 |
muep_ | at least I am not that eager to set up all the little bits that gnome provides me out of the box. so e.g. now that I am inside an i3 session, I lack a convenient access to volume controls | 22:00 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Openbox have worked for me just fine for years. JWM appears to work, too. And having a terminal emulator made to have matching colors to the WM seems irrelevant – so long that XTerm still /emulates/ a terminal better. | 22:00 |
muep_ | when I want to adjust my audio volume, I fire up an xterm and then use alsamixer in it. but it feel very clumsy doing that | 22:01 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: I have alsamixer running continuously in a Screen window. I can reach that window via XTerm, from a Linux ‘virtual terminal,’ or even via SSH from some other host. | 22:02 |
muep_ | I'd see little point in running it in screen. if you have that terminal handy, it is just as much effort to open a new alsamixer as opposed to connecting to the screen session | 22:03 |
muep_ | but of course that works as well | 22:04 |
ivanshmakov | Actually, the majority of the software I use runs under Screen. Whenever I do something – except for, say, designing PCB layouts – I have my Screen session right at hand. From there, Alsamixer is always at C-a ' 27 RET. | 22:05 |
muep_ | good for you then, I guess | 22:06 |
ivanshmakov | I hope to try edbrowse. Who knows, perhaps I’d be able to work with .js-heavy Web sites from within Screen, too?… | 22:07 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: For me, for my coworkers, and for my employer, I suppose. | 22:07 |
muep_ | yes if they are the kind of users who want to run all their stuff in screen | 22:08 |
muep_ | I do not like it much. it always reserves me some handy keyboard shortcut, like C-a by default | 22:08 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: No, they’re the kind of users who benefit from me being able to do my job efficiently. | 22:09 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Some rebind that to C-w, but that’s even more handy a shortcut, IMO. | 22:09 |
muep_ | I'm not saying that you should change the tools that work for you well | 22:09 |
muep_ | but I would say that the toolset you say is good for you is not something that I would recommend everyone to adopt | 22:10 |
muep_ | feel free to keep doing it if it works for you | 22:10 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: I recommend this toolset to whomever I see has similar interests and who I can take responsibility of helping with its adoption. | 22:12 |
muep_ | feel free to. I do not quite get what this "I have this awesome pre-made setup so I see no need for projects to make different pre-made setups" is | 22:15 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: It’s not as much about being ‘pre-made’ as it’s about minimalism. | 22:17 |
muep_ | ok | 22:19 |
ivanshmakov | I’m not arguing in favor of adopting this visual style or that; more like about adopting a preference for software that is less complex while being functionally equivalent. | 22:20 |
muep_ | that's a good preference if you have available the resources for setting it up | 22:20 |
ivanshmakov | For instance, alsamixer is less complex than pretty much any GUI mixer. | 22:20 |
muep_ | either in yourself or in some other person who helps | 22:21 |
muep_ | I find alsamixer wasteful of my time and I'll happily pay some CPU time and RAM to save my time | 22:22 |
muep_ | but I have not yet set up anything sensible for this i3 | 22:22 |
muep_ | so alsamixer is what it will have to be for now | 22:22 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: That may very well be the case, but I’d suspect it to be a matter of perception. | 22:23 |
muep_ | at work I do not use audio so there my setup has not had to involve volume controls either | 22:23 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Curiously, did you try, e. g., binding ‘xterm -e alsamixer’ to a hotkey? | 22:25 |
muep_ | no. next time I open my i3 configuration, I might add some amixer commands there | 22:25 |
muep_ | but that extra terminal window is specifically what I am unhappy about in using alsamixer | 22:26 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: And why is it that a terminal window makes you unhappy? (While, I presume, a non-terminal window does not.) | 22:27 |
muep_ | it adjusts out the layout of the workspace | 22:28 |
muep_ | or blocks my view of some other window that I want to look at | 22:28 |
muep_ | preferably I would have a transient overlay like what gnome does when I adjust the volume. or an icon change in some corner of the screen. or no visual feedback at all | 22:29 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Perhaps you can try to script around amixer(1) instead? | 22:30 |
muep_ | I mentioned that as my likely next step | 22:30 |
ivanshmakov | muep_: Right; missed that. | 22:32 |
ivanshmakov | (“No visual feedback” is about as minimalistic as I like.) | 22:35 |
gnu_srs1 | muep_: ivanshmakov: Have you tried mate? That is gnome2 at it's best (before destroying the desktop and requiring 3D graphics). | 23:39 |
ivanshmakov | gnu_srs1: At one point, I’ve tried Gnome 1 (before there was 2), and found no use for it. | 23:50 |
golinux | filipdevuan was the one longing for gnome. | 23:51 |
golinux | and a "modern" desktop | 23:52 |
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