libera/#devuan/ Monday, 2020-05-11

onefangAnd the pros and cons of HTTPS is a #debianfork discussion.  The support question was answered.00:00
some_alexonefang: got it, thanks00:01
systemdleteHere's something kinda yeccchy:  sh: 0: getcwd() failed: No such file or directory00:30
systemdletethis happened while I was cd'd into a directory under /sys00:30
systemdleteonce I cd'd back out to, say, root home, the problem stopped.  I was trying to figure out what is causing an error message at boot.00:31
systemdleteThe error I have been seeing at boot (even after a cold reboot) is usbhid 1-5.2:1.1: couldn't find an input interrupt endpoint00:31
systemdleteIt turns out the device is my mouse, which is wireless and connected via my keyboard, through a switchbox I paid a bit of money for.00:32
systemdleteBut I don't notice any problems with the mouse, or the keyboard, or even the switch (which also runs on USB, btw)00:33
systemdleteThis is getting... kinda frightening.00:33
systemdleteThis is devuan ascii, and I've updated/upgraded as of yesterday.00:35
systemdletecorrection:  Seems that there is a new linux image and headers... but why didn't these upgrade?  I had to manually install them, which is odd since they are already installed00:39
ulletquestions questions00:42
systemdleteI know, I know... LOL00:42
systemdlete(wanna buy some linux?  Hot copies, so you have to promise not to tell anyone, ok?)00:43
systemdleteI'll try rebooting into this new image and see if the error disappears...00:45
* ullet ponders00:46
MinceRare you pondering what i am pondering?00:46
DonkeyHoteii think so, brain, but wouldn't the salmon just swim upstream anyway?00:48
MinceR:)00:49
DonkeyHoteinarf00:53
systemdleteStill getting that error.  I'll check my logs and see if they've been showing prior to recently01:29
ulletmaybe drive is going bad?01:33
systemdleteullet:  The hard drive is RAID1, so...01:59
systemdleteI just rebooted a couple of times and I have not seen errors from fsck on the way up02:00
systemdleteI guess I could force a fsck on root, in case that was missed02:00
fsmithredto always get the newest kernel for the release, install linux-image-amd64 (or other arch)02:00
fsmithredsame for headers02:01
systemdleteThat is already the case, thanks02:01
systemdleteso that is not it02:01
fsmithredmaybe it has to be dist-upgrade to get a newer version02:01
systemdletebut anyway, I am more concerned about the usb problem.  I can see from my system logs that the system was rebooted (by me) on Apr 27 and Apr 28.  The dmesg log for the 27th and prior do NOT show this error (usb endpoint missing), but 28th forward all show it.02:02
systemdleteNo packages were added or upgraded in the time in between.02:02
systemdleteThe only thing I can think of is the usb kvm switch.  I may have installed it right around that time, but I don't remember exactly when that was now.02:03
systemdleteMaybe the introduction of that switch is generating the reference to the mouse... the information about this switch says it does not support wireless mouse.  But I don't see how that can matter given that the mouse is running off the keyboard.  But it does say that.  Funny how I have not had any problems with *usb* until today (other than the usual usb weirdness that does no harm)02:04
systemdletesorry, it says02:05
systemdletedoes not support keyboard mouse... hmmm.02:05
systemdleteI wonder if that is what they mean.   Does this imply I must use a wired mouse to the keyboard?02:05
* systemdlete is asking a bit rhetorically here 02:06
systemdletehttps://www.amazon.com/dp/B075KBCPKZ?tag=duckduckgo-ffab-20&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=102:07
systemdlete"FJGEAR 4 Ports USB 2.0 HDMI KVM Switch Keyboard Mouse Switcher for PC, Windows, (Wireless mouse keyboard is not supported,No power)"02:07
systemdletemy keyboard is wired.  The mouse is not.  The mouse dongle is plugged into the keyboard.02:07
systemdleteSo I am not sure if I am in violation or not.02:08
systemdleteIt depends on how "wireless mouse keyboard" is defined.02:08
systemdleteThe thing is... it works.  Had not noticed the boot error until today02:09
systemdleteWas investigating a different problem that was occurring in a VM, which may be related to Zoom.02:10
ullettry swapping mouse02:10
systemdleteThe VM, btw, is running Ascii also, so maybe you can help me there, or at least give a listen.02:10
systemdleteullet:  ooh ooh.  Good idea!02:10
systemdlete(but I'll have to reboot)02:10
systemdlete+102:11
systemdleteI have another wireless mouse around here I think02:11
systemdleteAnd a wired mouse also02:11
fsmithredcan you plug the dongle directly into the computer instead of into the keyboard?02:12
systemdleteanyway, Zoom was crashing badly and kern.log shows stack traces02:12
systemdleteOh, the mouse works02:12
ulletzoom appears to be a new thing02:12
systemdleteand it works through the switch.  What are you trying to have me test, fsmithred?02:12
ullettherefore it is bad02:12
systemdleteLOL.   You are probably right, ullet.02:13
ullet:)02:13
fsmithredtest to see if it makes the warning go away02:13
systemdleteIt *is* proprietary, so...02:13
systemdleteok, fsmithred.  I can try that also when I reboot.  I'll be sure to take notes on all these tests.02:14
systemdleteBut if I solve the riddle, then I deserve to help solve the Covid problem.02:14
systemdletebecause it seems to be almost as difficult.02:14
ulletthat is in people's heads02:14
systemdleteWhat is it about lsusb?  The tree option doesn't show the device descriptions.  That would be helpful right now.02:15
systemdleteand usbtree no longer works.02:15
systemdleteullet:  More in the chest and lungs, actually.02:15
onefangSome of these switches fake info, so that when you switch your mouse and keyboard to another computer, the original still thinks it has them plugged in.02:17
systemdleteonefang:  Exactly, yes.  That is so the quiescent boxes won't think they've lost the head.02:18
* systemdlete thinks deeply about wireless mouse attached to keyboard, via the switch...02:20
systemdleteThis actually makes some sense, now that I think about it.  Linux tries to find an endpoint for the mouse, but the actual mouse is in front of the switch; I am thinking maybe it cannot query it -- it will query the "fake" kb and mouse.02:21
systemdleteHoweer, it is worth noting that lsusb does show the wireless mouse and correctly identifies it as a logitech, etc02:21
systemdletewell, I'll know more after these tests02:22
fsmithredso the fake info contains real content02:24
systemdleteapparently copied from the real "content"02:26
systemdletebut Linux does not squawk about the keyboard02:27
systemdletebut first, lunch02:27
systemdleteor dinner02:27
systemdletethen more testing02:27
systemdletethanks for all the suggestions -- that's very helpful02:28
systemdleteSo... I tried a number of different combinations of different mice connected to the kb, the pc, and so forth, and one thing I noticed was that, no matter which combination, I ALWAYS got the boot error about missing endpoint for the mouse.  But how could it be just any mouse, wired, wireless, directly connected, etc... so then I got to thinking04:24
systemdleteI booted the pc without ANY mice attached whatsoever!04:24
systemdleteAnd STILL the error message appears.04:24
gnarfaceusb mice?04:24
systemdleteSoooooo.   I think I conclude that the switchbox itself is the issue, though apparently not fatal.04:24
systemdleteyes, all usb mice04:25
gnarfaceoh, and a usb switch?  mabye04:25
systemdletethe problem is on a usb switchbox, so yes, usb mice.  all.04:25
systemdleteusb switch yes04:25
systemdletegnarface:  On the amazon web page for it, it even says does not work with wireless mouse keyboard, though I am not sure what that means precisely04:26
systemdletewireless mouse attached to kb, or wireless mouse+kb04:26
systemdletebut either way, I am guessing I can look forward to this issue for the near future.04:26
systemdleteNot sure if kernel devs can handle this or not.  It could be an actual hw flaw.04:27
systemdleteBut I feel a little more sane now that I've narrowed it down to the switch and/or kernel04:27
systemdleteI think I will write to the mfr and see if they can offer some insight or confirm this04:28
gnarfacesystemdlete: i do recall hearing of some type of fakey cheap usb kvm switches that were on the market that needed specifically a windows-only feature to work right, but i don't recall much specifically about it04:36
gnarfaceit wouldn't fail completely, it would just critically fail at the one feature that made it useful04:37
systemdleteWell, this one was recommended by a fellow Linux user and it was not cheap.04:37
gnarfaceoh hmm.  well that is maybe not the issue then04:37
systemdleteOTOH, I also figured something out04:37
systemdletethe ad says "no power" -- so I think what they are saying is that since the switch is not powered, it can't talk to a wireless kb/mouse04:37
gnarfaceoh is this ascii?  maybe it's a kernel version issue, maybe there's quirks and they've been added to a newer kernel but not the ascii one04:37
systemdleteSo I think my hardware config is fine -- it must be, since it does work...04:38
gnarfaceit *might* just mean that since it's unpowered some wireless devices might not work?04:38
systemdletethe mouse supplies its own power by its battery.04:38
systemdleteright04:38
systemdletethere is some risidual power in usb that can power a keyboard I think04:39
gnarfaceyea, i don't know the numbers, but it's probably not a good idea to try to use it to charge anything04:40
onefangIf the switch is unpowered, then it gets it's power from the computer, and it can ask for more power and distribute that downstream to devices.  Assuming the computer can supply extra power.04:40
onefangIt might not do that if it's just assuming typical mouse and keyboard.04:41
gnarfacei would worry about frying stuff accidentally04:41
gnarfaceit should be safe, one would think, but it seems risky04:41
gnarfacelike, if it tried to charge a iphone would it trickle or would the wires get hot?04:42
gnarfacei would assume the former but also not risk it04:42
onefangModern USB stuff sorta negotiates power levels, but it's tricky with all the various versions, and cables may or may not support some of that.04:42
onefangMy keyboard isn't powered, but has a small USB hub in the back to support two other devices, like a mouse and graphics tablet.  Should be plenty of juice for that sort of thing.04:44
systemdleteYeah, I have a Happy Hacker (my 2nd one after 20 years with the first!) and this new one has 2 USB ports.  I attach the wireless mouse to the kb, since the mouse is powered by a battery.06:18
systemdleteThe KVM does have a (5mV?) power port, but the adapter does not come with it. However, I have not needed additional power so far, and hopefully I won't.06:19
systemdleteI found a matching adapter I have here, just in case I need it.06:20
onefangMines a Happy Hacker Lite 2. B-)06:21
systemdletemine too!06:21
systemdlete$20006:21
systemdleteI got 20 years out of the first one.  The letters on the keys had become worn, and the keys themselves had sort of melted a bit...06:22
systemdleteI think I got my moneys worth from it.06:22
systemdleteheheheh06:22
systemdleteI only paid $100 for the first one06:22
systemdleteI cleaned the old one about 3x over the years, and it still worked like new.  Just couldn't see the keys anymore06:23
systemdleteletters06:23
nemohmmm I'm on a beowulf devuan, and I was trying to build chafa17:32
nemoso I installed libmagick++-d17:32
nemoev17:32
nemoeverything built and linked correctly17:32
nemobut, on run it claims the libs are missing17:34
nemochecking in symaptic I see there's a couple of variants of libmagick++17:34
slvrmaybe build and execute are using different paths17:35
slvrI think you can run ldd on the bin and see the paths to all linked libs, and if they are missing.17:35
nemoI appear to be using libmagick++-6.q16-817:35
nemothe linker expects libMagickWand-6.Q16.so.317:35
nemoq16-8 provides:17:36
nemo/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libMagick++-6.Q16.so.817:36
nemo/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libMagick++-6.Q16.so.8.0.017:36
nemoI see there's a q16-7 (probably provides so.7)17:36
nemoaaaand a libmagickcore-6.q16-3 which might have something to do with 317:37
nemoslvr: I was just puzzled how I got into this situation in first place.  normally debian/devuan ensures libs I'm linking to actually exist17:37
nemoeh. lemme do a purge and rebuild17:37
nemomaybe some stale cache17:37
nemoyep. guess it was that. nevermind17:42
slvrwoot17:43
ulletit seems more fun to move to ceres, for me17:51
masonFor the life of me I can't get LightDM to show a background, either per-user or global. The config is straightforward, but the convoluted pile is fighting me.20:45
fsmithredwhat convoluted pile?20:51
fsmithredcan't you just set the bg image in the config file?20:51
masonfsmithred: I tried with a couple syntax examples I found.20:51
fsmithredare you messing with the alternatives system?20:52
masonEvidently it can/does/? depend on an AccountsService thing I'd never heard of before today.20:52
fsmithredthat name sounds familiar20:52
masonNo, I've left all the package-installed stuff untouched.20:52
fsmithredcool20:52
masonI found this that seemed applicable: https://github.com/linuxmint/slick-greeter/issues/9420:52
mason(LightDM/slick-greeter I should say.)20:53
masonI'll try again with the gtk-greeter and see if that does any better.20:53
fsmithredI've never done per user bg. Don't see how that would work.20:54
fsmithredhow would it know which user is going to log in before they log in?20:54
masonAccording to one creation myth, there's a per-user file in /var/lib/AccountsService/users/ that is populated with this, but I've not dug into what yet, largely because even with it set properly it doesn't display an image.20:55
masonfsmithred: So, with slick-greeter, the user list is all there in a list, and whichever one is selected is the one whose background shows. It's slick when it works - Ubuntu does it.20:55
masonIt's not so slick when it doesn't work. :P20:55
masonFor myself, I use xdm, and my background pattern is the standard grey X stipple as God intended, but the kids like more bling.20:56
fsmithredfor lightdm, I've always changed it in the config file20:56
fsmithredthere's a line for background_image20:57
fsmithredprobably in the greeter config20:57
masonYeah. I'm trying again with lightdm-gtk-greeter and we'll see if that obeys.20:57
masonIt won't show the user list, but that's okay.20:57
fsmithredthere's a setting to show or not show user list20:57
masonMy four year old isn't reading just yet, so the theory was that seeing her background would help her figure it out. Starting with her typing in a simple password will be task enough. :)20:58
masonIn the gtk greeter, that works, but it controls a pop-up menu, not a list with everyone there on-screen at once.20:58
fsmithredoh20:58
masonfsmithred: Does setting background= work for you? It seems not to work here, regardless of whether I have it set in /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf or /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf.d/foo21:01
fsmithredtrying to find a VM that has lightdm21:01
fsmithredin the past, it has always worked for me to just list the path to the bg image21:02
masonThis is on Beowulf, FWIW, as I expect they're different versions.21:03
masonHm, even if I install lightdm-gtk-greeter-settings and have it set the image via the gui, no love.21:06
fsmithredinstalling lightdm now21:12
masonAh, cool - I'll be interested in seeing how it goes.21:13
fsmithredok, after install it uses the desktop-base bg without my doing anything other than selecting lightdm as default dm21:16
fsmithredand now it's stuck and I have to start over21:17
fsmithreddon't restart dm in qemu21:17
fsmithreduse init 1 instead21:17
fsmithredyeah, it works. I got a different bg21:21
fsmithredmy guess is you changed it near the top of the file instead of in the section that starts with [greeter]21:21
masondoh21:26
masonWhich file?21:26
masontrying lightdm.conf itself21:27
masonEven putting it there, at the end, no luck. I'll purge and try again with a fresh config, just that one line added.21:41
masonfsmithred: Which config file did you amend?21:41
eyalrozHello devuaners,21:44
eyalrozHow do I get rid of the message "udevd: Error running install command for nvidia" which I get on every boot of Beowulf?21:44
eyalrozI've been led to believe I might need to disable something in /etc/modprobe.d/nvidia.conf, but I'm not sure what line. Or - perhaps I need to do something else entirely?21:44
ulletidk. maybe a setup script21:46
ulleta kernel module generally doesn't handle installing21:46
eyalrozullet: I should mention my nvidia card works fine (although I don't use it as a display adapter)21:47
eyalrozI'm just annoyed by the error message.21:47
gnarfaceeyalroz: best guess is that nouveau and nvidia are both fighting over the card.  you have to pick one then blacklist the other.22:00
eyalrozI have a "blacklist nouveau" in another .conf file in modprobe.d ...22:01
eyalrozAlso - none of that stuff was done manually by me, nor by a manual nVIDIA installer...22:01
eyalrozI think those files came with the distro,22:01
eyalroz... so it's not exactly about what I have to do personally. IIANM.22:02
fsmithredmason /etc/lightdm/lightdm-gtk-greeter.conf22:02
gnarfaceeyalroz: oh, hmmm.... well the nvidia official drivers are in non-free, so if you didn't include non-free you wouldn't have got them even by accident.  but if you're blacklisting nouveau already then my hypothesis is probably wrong.22:02
gnarfaceeyalroz: (to be clear, my hypothesis was that nouveau was already loaded and then it was blocking nvidia's attempt to load after that)22:03
gnarfaceeyalroz: is it a very old card?  perhaps the error is about using the new drivers with a legacy card.  there's also a legacy nvidia driver package in there for older cards22:03
Venkerhi people22:03
gnarfaceeyalroz: or, alternately, if you're on ascii and it's a very new card, you might need to get the drivers&kernel from backports22:04
gnarfaceVenker: hi, just ask22:05
ulletmy vote for next release name is PETSCII22:05
VenkerI was coding a pull request or something like that for https://git.devuan.org/devuan-packages/openstack-devuan-images22:06
Venkerbut I can't get it to work22:06
Venkerit complains about extlinux package not found, but it is22:06
masonfsmithred: Alright, that did work, so now I need to pick apart how I was doing it to see what was breaking. Difference this time, I purged all the related packages and put them back in pristine, freshly installed state. Thank you.22:08
fsmithredyw22:09
fsmithredyou saw what I meant about the right place to edit the file?22:09
fsmithredit's a common mistake22:09
masonYes.22:09
eyalrozgnarface: I do include non-free. But - maybe nouveau is being blacklisted "too late"?22:12
eyalrozgnarface: I'm on Beowulf and it's a GTX 1050 Ti, so not that new.22:13
eyalroz... but not that old either.22:13
Venkerhttps://gist.github.com/pgmartinez/c5c8ae2ecf7d21aff53fdaadef4b167922:16
eyalrozgnarface: perhaps I should try an unload command for nouveau in the same file as the nvidia load commands, on an earlier line?22:30
gnarfaceeyalroz: uh... well maybe.  it's easy to check by looking in the output of lsmod.  afaik only one or the other can be loaded, though it's possible you've managed to end up with neither working right.  fyi the 1050 *is* too old though for the stock ascii versions, i'm pretty sure22:30
eyalrozgnarface: The nvidia drivers are what actually get loaded.22:31
gnarfaceeyalroz: sorry i mean that the 1050 *is* too new for the stock ascii versions22:31
eyalrozgnarface: But why would the stock ascii version matter, if I'm running Beowulf? ... and with CUDA 10.1 being installed?22:32
eyalrozAlso, GTX 1050 Ti was released in late 2016.22:33
gnarfaceeyalroz: oh, sorry i missed that you said that.  and actually if you're just using this for cuda and not using it as a display, i don't think it matters22:33
eyalrozUsing it just for computation.22:33
ulletare you good with ze NN's eyalroz22:33
ulleti'd like to upgrade old videos but it's OT here. sorry.22:34
gnarfaceeyalroz: but fyi according to this, 1050 support wasn't added to the linux version of the driver until version 375.20, in november of 2016: https://www.nvidia.com/Download/driverResults.aspx/111596/en-us22:35
gnarfaceeyalroz: (and the ascii version is frozen at 340.something, which is why i thought that was relevant)22:36
eyalrozullet: I'm actually exploring other aspects of GPU computing. NN's are very fashionable, I think they're not very challening in terms of putting the GPU to new uses. They work too well without you having to break a sweat, design-wise.22:36
ulleti'd be happy if i could operate them properly. oh well. i can write shadertoys.22:37
eyalrozgnarface: Luckily, beowulf has CUDA 10.1 with driver version 430.50 ...22:37
gnarfaceeyalroz: did you get CUDA from the beowulf repo or is that something you have to install from nvidia's shell script thingy directly?22:38
eyalrozullet: I can't do NN work myself. I just know that it's not a challenge getting them to run efficiently on GPUs. Analytic databases, however, are a different story...22:38
eyalrozgnarface: beowulf repo - I'm 95% certain.22:39
gnarfaceeyalroz: beowulf is at 418.something, mabye you have some of two versions installed and that's the conflict?22:39
gnarfaceeyalroz: do a "dpkg -l |grep nvidia -i" and see if you see 418.xx cruft mixed in there22:39
eyalrozI see the two different versions in the apt package cache22:40
gnarfacewe only care about installed versions22:41
eyalrozthe installed version is 430.50-122:41
eyalrozStatus: install ok installed22:41
gnarfaceeyalroz: i'm not seeing any sign of version 430 in the devuan repos22:42
eyalrozMaybe it's another sign of me having a somewhat messed up apt state again :-(22:42
masonfsmithred: Ah, found one issue with accountsservice - it only provides a systemd service unit.22:42
gnarfaceeyalroz: well, or mabye you got some stuff directly from nvidia and forgot?22:42
eyalrozgnarface: Nope, the package maintainer is "Debian NVIDIA Maintainers"22:43
gnarfacehmm, weird22:43
eyalrozand when I get stuff directly from nvidia, I get CUDA+drivers together and install CUDA to /usr/local/cuda-X.Y ; yet CUDA 10.1 is installed under /usr22:43
gnarfaceeyalroz: but pkginfo.devuan.org says you should have cuda 9.2.x, i think.  can you confirm?  https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/d1pkgweb-query?search=cuda&release=beowulf22:46
gnarfaceeyalroz: oh, 10.1 may have come from beowulf-backports...22:46
gnarfaceeyalroz: i'm seeing it here: https://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=cuda&searchon=names&section=all&suite=buster-backports22:46
eyalrozgnarface: Very possibly.22:46
gnarfaceeyalroz: but nvidia-driver in beowulf backports should be 440 now not 430, so maybe your backports are just out of date22:46
gnarfaceeyalroz: remember to add "-t beowulf-backports" or it will ignore backported packages during upgrades22:47
eyalrozMy backports are out of date, since I commented them out at some point to resolve some apt issues you helped me with :-)22:47
eyalrozOk, apt-get upgrade time22:47
gnarfaceeyalroz: yea that happens to often for me to remember the specific issue, sorry, but i would have definitely recommended to NOT just "apt-get -t beowulf-backports upgrade"22:48
eyalrozgnarface: Sorry I took you on a bit of a wilf goose chase again22:48
gnarfaceeyalroz: no worries, just don't apt-get upgrade all of backports.  uncomment it, then upgrade just the nvidia packages (with -t beowulf backports), then comment it out again22:48
gnarfaceeyalroz: (mabye add a comment about this in the sources.list so you remember next time)22:49
gnarfaceeyalroz: what kernel do you have?  you might need that too, not sure.  the backports one should be at 5.4 and the stock one is 4.1922:49
eyalroz5.2.0-322:50
gnarfaceyea, so that's definitely also an out-of-date backports kernel22:50
eyalrozgnarface: Turns out I also have a libc6 from backports. Ouch.22:53
gnarfaceeyalroz: ouch.  yea, that's specifically why i would have said not to just blindly apt-get upgrade the whole thing from beowulf and only just get the kernel and nvidia packages specifically (and any related firmware if relevant)22:53
gnarfaceeyalroz: from beowulf-backports*22:54
eyalrozgnarface: I had enabled backports when I first installed beowulf - a mistake on my part. Well, it looks like I'm going to have to lie in this bed after I've made it.22:56
fsmithredyou could pin beowulf-backports to -1 to downgrade22:58
fsmithreddpkg -l |grep bpo22:58
fsmithredto see what's from backports (plus a few false positives)22:58
eyalrozfsmithred: Can I actually downgrade everything from backports to the non-backports versions? When that includes downgrading libc6 and all of its dependent packages?23:01
gnarfaceeyalroz: according to Debian, downgrades aren't officially supported, however you can probably make it happen23:03
eyalrozgnarface: Not sure it's worth the trouble at this point, but it's good to know.23:04
eyalrozfsmithred: How to I do the pinning, exactly?23:05
fsmithredeyalroz, I don't know what happens if libc6 is from backports23:15
fsmithredI'll get you an example23:15
fsmithredthree lines in a file in /etc/apt/preferences.d23:15
fsmithredPackage: *23:16
fsmithredPin: release a=beowulf-backports23:16
fsmithredPin-Priority: -123:16
fsmithredoh23:16
fsmithredno23:16
eyalrozno?23:16
fsmithredpin beowulf to 100123:16
fsmithredsorry - got a fever and toothache right now23:16
eyalrozoh... I'm sorry to hear that!23:17
fsmithredanything I say could be from another dimension23:17
fsmithredfirst line is same - all packages23:17
fsmithredPin: release n=beowulf23:17
fsmithredPin-Priority: 100123:17
eyalrozfsmithred: shouldn't I also pin beowulf-updates and beowulf-security to something higher then?23:17
fsmithredprobably23:17
fsmithredyeah, that makes sense23:17
fsmithreduse n=beowulf, a=beowulf-whatever23:18
fsmithredI think23:18
eyalrozSo, a 3-line entry for each repo?23:18
fsmithredyes23:18
fsmithredcan all be in same file23:18
fsmithrednot sure if you need the -1 on bpo23:19
fsmithredI'd try without that first23:19
fsmithredapt -s upgrade to see what will happen23:19
fsmithredhow many backports packages did you end up with?23:20
eyalrozfsmithred: Apparently, nothing happens when I apt-s upgrade23:20
eyalrozoh, wait23:20
eyalrozfor the beowulf repo, should it be "n=beowulf, a=beowulf" ?23:21
fsmithredn for name23:21
fsmithreda for almost a name?23:22
eyalrozfsmithred: I don't follow. Do I need an n= and an a= for each of three repos?23:22
fsmithredno23:22
fsmithredplain beowulf gets 'Pin: release n=beowulf'23:23
fsmithredanything that's not exactly a codename gets a=23:23
fsmithredthat would be the other three23:23
fsmithred-backports, -security, -updates23:24
eyalrozAh, ok.23:24
eyalrozSo, apt -s upgrade gives:23:25
eyalroz calc-common : Breaks: apcalc-common (< 2.12.7.2-3~) but 2.12.7.2-2 is to be installed23:25
eyalroz libogdi-dev : Breaks: libogdi3.2-dev (< 4.0.0) but 3.2.1+ds-4 is to be installed23:25
eyalroz libogdi4.1 : Breaks: libogdi3.2 (< 4.0.0) but 3.2.1+ds-4 is to be installed23:25
eyalrozE: Broken packages23:25
eyalrozI could just remove these, maybe?23:26
fsmithredmaybe23:26
gnarfaceit might work23:26
fsmithredanother thing that might work is to use aptitude23:26
fsmithredit might give you alternatives23:26
gnarfaceyea, it's made for figuring out this type of thing23:26
eyalrozwhen I apt -s upgrade after the removal it comes up with another broken package23:27
fsmithredthat could go on for some time23:27
eyalrozoh, but after removing that, apt -s upgrade has a super-long output23:27
eyalrozwith a zillion downgrades. success!23:28
eyalrozLet's do this thing.23:28
fsmithredcool23:28
eyalrozand hope I don't get hosed.23:28
gnarfacemake sure you have a live image ready on usb or cd23:28
fsmithredyeah, good idea23:28
VenkerseeU23:29
eyalrozgnarface: I think I have one somewhere; plus I have a laptop if push comes to shove. Now just need to wait for some 4.5 GB of downgrade package downloads. Thank you both (gnarface and fsmithred).23:29
gnarfaceVenker: did anyone address your concern?  i don't know the answer, sorry.  maybe ask in #devuan-dev23:30
Venkergnarface: I will, thanks. I think I did some progress regarding that code23:30
systemdleteSo I installed tlp, and that brought with it network-manager, which I do NOT want; I use wicd.   So I uninstalled network-manager.  But /etc/init.d/network-manager lingers.  ???23:44
systemdleteIt's not enabled, but still, why is it still there, even after I removed it with the apt tools?23:45
systemdleteI tried re-installing it and uninstalling it.  No dice.23:45
systemdleteand why does installing tlp, which is power-related, drag a tool like network-mangler along with it?23:46
masonsystemdlete: When you delete things, you can purge them as well... apt purge foo, or apt --purge autoremove, etc.23:55
systemdleteoh yes.  I forgot about that.  But why does it tell me that /etc/init.d/network-manager is owned by network-manager?  Normally, if a package is not installed, I don't expect it to know anything about files owned by the package.23:57
systemdletebut to my primary question:  Why network-manager for tlp?23:59

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