tuxd3v | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GC5E8ie2pdM | 06:13 |
---|---|---|
bru | tuxd3v: Yup, Devuan is simply the best. | 06:46 |
tuxd3v | bru, -.- | 06:51 |
ziao | refractainstaller is not asking me to install the bootloader | 07:30 |
ziao | works fine with the netinstaller | 07:30 |
un22 | Hello all how do I join #devuan-arm... or can anyone tell me about status of devuan for raspberry pi 4? | 12:41 |
Joril | un22: I've built a working Devuan image for RPI4 using https://github.com/pyavitz/rpi-img-builder | 13:49 |
Joril | un22: when/if you come back :) | 13:49 |
alv | quit | 16:58 |
alv | hi all where are the jessie working repositories ?? also the backports ? | 18:03 |
alv | i tried many but all have some problems ? | 18:03 |
james1138 | I did not think Jessie had and backports - none that I could find. | 18:04 |
james1138 | deb https://deb.debian.org/debian/ jessie main | 18:05 |
alv | they do still exist ?? | 18:05 |
alv | ahhh ok sorry | 18:05 |
alv | strange i was having a pkgmaster.devuan.org/merged main backports | 18:07 |
alv | in one old system | 18:07 |
alv | opps it was jessie-backports main | 18:09 |
alv | not main backports | 18:09 |
gnarface | jessie is being mothballed, you'll want to get off it | 18:12 |
gnarface | some of the parts of the repo are already gone | 18:13 |
gnarface | (notably backports and security/volatile) | 18:13 |
james1138 | If you want to continue fetching Jessie backports, you need to use archive.debian.org instead | 18:13 |
alv | yes i saw it | 18:13 |
alv | no already trid archive | 18:14 |
alv | tried | 18:14 |
alv | not working too | 18:14 |
xinomilo | there's an archive.devuan.org with only jessie in... maybe that's it.. | 18:19 |
fsmithred | deb http://archive.devuan.org/merged jessie main contrib non-free | 18:24 |
fsmithred | alv, ^^^ This appears to be working. | 18:25 |
Guest60 | user account wasn't setup for some reason, but the root account and password worked fine | 20:06 |
Coffee__ | Okay, so I think I found a bug in the handling of USB ethernet devices after a few hours of messing around with it. It seems that it doesn't autoconfigure them in the slightest (I'm not a networking expert on Linux), so I had to run `ip link set enx00e04c0104a7 up` followed by `/sbin/dhclient` to finally get it working. I'm on beowulf, and I don't know which package I would report this issue in. (Possibly | 20:07 |
Coffee__ | related to #18 on the bug tracker.) | 20:07 |
nemo | don't have any USB over here regrettably.. | 20:08 |
nemo | Coffee__: but you can't do that in wicd network manager at least? | 20:08 |
Coffee__ | I tried everything I could in wicd, but could not get it working (maybe I'm an idiot) | 20:09 |
Coffee__ | wicd was happy to connect to the wifi if that is helpful information | 20:09 |
nemo | my personal complaint in beowulf on my SO's machine is that she does have to manually toggle wireless on, then join network | 20:09 |
nemo | it does not autojoin | 20:09 |
nemo | but haven't gotten around to resolving it | 20:09 |
nemo | in ascii she used mate network manager which worked flawlessly but that is apparently no longer an option | 20:10 |
nemo | that said, GUIs do seem to work for us, even with the manual step | 20:10 |
nemo | however no USB over here | 20:10 |
nemo | bit confused as to why USB would be special though. neither of your steps above seem like things wicd can't do | 20:10 |
Coffee__ | Yeah I also have that issue too for having to manually connect. I forced showing the usb adapter (it hides it by default) in wicd then clicked connect, but it widn't work. | 20:11 |
fsmithred | you set it as the default wireless interface in wicd preferences? | 20:11 |
nemo | fsmithred: hm. pretty sure. I'll recheck next time I'm up there | 20:11 |
nemo | fsmithred: she only has the one | 20:11 |
nemo | and is network is set to autoconnect, not that it does it | 20:12 |
fsmithred | and you spelled that "memorable" name correctly? | 20:12 |
fsmithred | asking Coffee__ | 20:12 |
nemo | but maybe I neglected something | 20:12 |
fsmithred | nemo, you're using wicd? | 20:12 |
nemo | well. there's no other option in beowulf last I checked | 20:12 |
fsmithred | and the autoconnect checkbox doesn't do it? | 20:12 |
nemo | she's not thrilled, definitely was more familiar w/ mate's | 20:12 |
nemo | fsmithred: it wasn't... hm. maybe I can remote in to her machine and launch wicd. lessee if it is on | 20:13 |
fsmithred | network-manager and connman are other choices | 20:13 |
Coffee__ | It won't let me choose a wired interface by name as far as I can see (responding to fsmithred). The USB ethernet is wired if that matters. My only choice is "wired-default" in a dropdown | 20:13 |
nemo | seems to be down. I'll check later | 20:13 |
fsmithred | oh | 20:13 |
fsmithred | ok, Coffee__ maximize the wicd window and you will see where the Preferences are hidden | 20:14 |
fsmithred | upper right | 20:15 |
fsmithred | put the enx-blah number in for default wired interface | 20:15 |
Coffee__ | I saw that earlier. Would it fix it if I filled in the "Wired interface" field? I guess I can reboot and see if you want me to. | 20:15 |
fsmithred | yeah, it needs to know which interface to use | 20:15 |
fsmithred | you can just restart wicd service | 20:16 |
Coffee__ | There is only one available so shouldn't it automatically pick it? It automatically picked the wireless interface. | 20:16 |
fsmithred | if you open the preferences and that number is already in the box, then yeah, it's automatic | 20:17 |
fsmithred | otherwise, not. | 20:17 |
Coffee__ | Hmm, okay I'm going to fill in the field and reboot and see if it automatically reconnects. I'll be back in a few minutes | 20:18 |
fsmithred | ok | 20:18 |
Coffee__ | fsmithred you were correct. It automatically connects now. I still feel that it was extremely unintuitive especially considering I only have one ethernet interface (not even one enabled, just one that exists). | 20:21 |
Coffee__ | If I wanted to propose changing this would I take to the maintainers of wicd? | 20:23 |
Coffee__ | *talk | 20:23 |
fsmithred | yeah, maybe. I'm not sure what the deal is with wicd | 20:24 |
fsmithred | there's a version in experimental, and there was or is some issue with python2 vs python3 | 20:25 |
fsmithred | there's a good chance that network-manager will be the default in chimaera, since wicd is missing. | 20:25 |
Hurgotron | aww? I liked wicd... | 20:28 |
fsmithred | me too | 20:28 |
n4dir | me too | 20:31 |
Coffee__ | What do you meaning by wicd is missing? Is it not available on chimaera? | 20:33 |
fsmithred | correct | 20:33 |
fsmithred | there is a version in ceres, but it's the same one that's in beowulf, and it's a devuanized version | 20:33 |
fsmithred | it's not in sid or bullseye | 20:34 |
rwp | Since I am not a python person and though I liked wicd there were some weird things about it, I will probably try connman for a bit and then try writing my own. | 20:43 |
rwp | Since I don't know what I don't know and the view from here does not seem that difficult. | 20:43 |
fsmithred | there's also simple-netaid in gnuinos repo | 20:44 |
fsmithred | I think there's also ceni available | 20:44 |
fsmithred | oh, and there's still setnet in devuan experimental | 20:44 |
fsmithred | rwp, https://lists.dyne.org/lurker/message/20200301.213630.00c83746.en.html | 20:46 |
fsmithred | I know there are several older discussions about simple-netaid on that list | 20:47 |
fsmithred | permission and security related stuff | 20:48 |
rwp | So that's a C library for building ifupdown-like tools? | 20:48 |
Guest60 | hey so on a fresh install my user account isn't set up, but the root works fine. should i switch to chimaera and make the user account later? | 20:58 |
gnarface | no, but it won't actually matter | 20:59 |
gnarface | you should make the new account now, because running as root isn't something you should do if you have to ask why not to | 20:59 |
Guest60 | alr | 20:59 |
gnarface | but it should be possible to make the new account either before or after upgrading | 21:00 |
gnarface | i'm assuming you have a reason to upgrade other than the missing user account, or i'd advise against it | 21:00 |
Guest60 | yeah | 21:01 |
Guest60 | i want to try testing out | 21:01 |
Guest60 | so i'll make the user account now and do the upgrade after | 21:01 |
Guest60 | i made it during install but it doesn't work for some reason | 21:01 |
Guest60 | i tried checking with the users command but only root comes up | 21:01 |
gnarface | well, "users" only reports currently logged-in users, so that's not a surprise | 21:03 |
Guest60 | does the same thing happen with who? | 21:03 |
gnarface | yes | 21:03 |
rwp | And also "w" which is another common who+uptime command. | 21:04 |
rwp | Those only report logged in users. Not on available logins. | 21:04 |
Guest60 | how can i see all user accounts then? | 21:04 |
gnarface | look in /etc/passwd | 21:04 |
gnarface | also look in /home/ | 21:04 |
rwp | A cheap and easy way is to "ls /home" or "ls -l /home" and see the home directories of users there. | 21:04 |
gnarface | yea, though if the user creation went awry for whatever reason, it might have failed to create a home directory | 21:05 |
Guest60 | wait nvm | 21:05 |
Guest60 | i guess i named the user account the wrong thing or smth | 21:06 |
Guest60 | anyways i think i know what the problem is | 21:06 |
Guest60 | how can i change my account name? | 21:06 |
fsmithred | some usermod commands | 21:07 |
fsmithred | usermod -l $newname $oldname | 21:07 |
n4dir | i wouldn't bother much with it. deluser olduser; rm -r /home/olduser, adduser newuser | 21:07 |
fsmithred | yeah, that's easier | 21:07 |
n4dir | as long you didn't know what exactly went wrong | 21:08 |
rwp | It's one of those things of, "If you have to ask then..." but I always simply edit the files and rename the directory manually. (shrug) | 21:10 |
fsmithred | if you have a desktop, the old user name might be hanging around in some hidden files | 21:10 |
rwp | Such as...?? | 21:11 |
rwp | I say pictures or it didn't happen! :-) | 21:11 |
n4dir | isn't it scripted somewhere in refractainstaller ? or at least "was" | 21:12 |
n4dir | hunt for them and rename them | 21:12 |
fsmithred | for i in $(grep -r "/home/$oldname" /home/$newname/.config | awk -F":" ' { print $1 }'); do | 21:13 |
rwp | "grep -r $oldname /home/$oldname" | 21:13 |
rwp | Jinx! :-) | 21:13 |
fsmithred | lol | 21:13 |
fsmithred | same in .kde if you use it | 21:13 |
fsmithred | same in .local | 21:13 |
rwp | I would use "find" for me but find puts people off so I thought grep -r. "find /home -type f -exec grep $oldname {} +" | 21:14 |
fsmithred | it's in there so that when you open a terminal or file manager, it knows what directory to show | 21:14 |
rwp | Instead of renaming since those .config files are created upon first use I would probably simply remove them and let them be created again. If they encode special things. | 21:15 |
n4dir | sledgehammer is the best hammer | 21:15 |
rwp | Assuming they are doing some type of caching of the name instead of using $HOME and $USER as they ought to be doing. | 21:15 |
rwp | There are only a few ways to do things correctly but there are an infinite number of ways for things to be done the wrong way... Sigh. | 21:16 |
rwp | In practice one of the worst problems in this space I would run into is sharing a $HOME directory across different DE versions. Because the DE versions would fight with each other. | 21:18 |
Guest60 | ok so i should rename the user folder, and go into the /etc/passwd file and edit the names for that user account | 21:18 |
Guest60 | right? | 21:18 |
rwp | Yes. Correct. | 21:18 |
fsmithred | and /etc/group | 21:18 |
Guest60 | alright | 21:19 |
rwp | Also know that the set of four account files are /etc/passwd, /etc/group, /etc/shadow, /etc/gshadow | 21:19 |
Guest60 | what do shadow and gshadow do btw? i saw it while installing grub in refracta | 21:19 |
rwp | Editing the username string in that set of four files is all that is needed. Plus ensuring that the home directory listed in /etc/passwd matches in /home | 21:19 |
n4dir | deleting and recreating the user still seems to be the most easy solution to me | 21:19 |
rwp | So edit those files and then "ls -l /home" and verify that everything is consistent and matching. | 21:19 |
fsmithred | ^^^ | 21:19 |
rwp | /etc/shadow holds the hashed password for the user. | 21:20 |
fsmithred | my arrows were supposed to point to n4dir's statement | 21:20 |
rwp | /etc/gshadow is mostly useless and I am still trying to understand why it was created. Just for symmetry? Probably. | 21:20 |
fsmithred | deluser oldname && adduser newname | 21:20 |
fsmithred | done | 21:20 |
rwp | Deleting and recreating is maximally safe. But manually editing gives the opportunity to learn. Which has long term advantages. | 21:21 |
n4dir | i think you also have to delete the home directory. But it really is like 30 seconds altogether | 21:21 |
fsmithred | yeah, probably | 21:21 |
rwp | n4dir, One should rename the home directory at the same time. "mv /home/$oldname /home/$newname" That's it. | 21:21 |
rwp | So that it matches the last field of /etc/passwd which lists the $HOME directory. Which would have been renamed when editing /etc/passwd because of the name. | 21:22 |
n4dir | well. then you have to hunt with grep. but anyway. | 21:22 |
rwp | grep? We had this FUD about grep. But it really isn't needed. Pictures or it did not happen! | 21:22 |
n4dir | Guest60: can make the pictures, if you need them | 21:25 |
Guest60 | i think i'll be fine | 21:25 |
Guest60 | but thanks | 21:25 |
fazzah | hi, how can i stop my devuan os going to sleep/screensaver when i watch fullscreen video in firefox? | 21:26 |
rwp | fazzah, You don't know it but you are staring into a dark abyss with that question. I have seen fights break out over it. | 21:29 |
Guest60 | n4dir, so if i did deluser oldname && adduser newname, all i would have to do is passwd newname to create a password for the new account right? | 21:30 |
n4dir | adduser will already ask for a password | 21:31 |
Guest60 | oh ok | 21:31 |
fsmithred | grep -rn home/fsmithred .config |wc -l | 21:31 |
fsmithred | 422 | 21:31 |
rwp | fsmithred, Wow! Who are the offenders? I will try that here. | 21:32 |
rwp | Also, you didn't need -a to avoid the "binary file matches" breakage? | 21:33 |
fsmithred | wow, a bunch are supertuxcart | 21:33 |
n4dir | uh yeah ! | 21:33 |
rwp | I am getting hits in chromium history sqlite database. | 21:33 |
fsmithred | geany, rosegarden, vlc, | 21:33 |
fsmithred | desktop icons | 21:33 |
fsmithred | rwp I never use -a | 21:34 |
fsmithred | I don't mind knowing that my pattern is in a binary file, especially if it's my name | 21:34 |
rwp | The -a was never needed before grep added checking for binary files. So now I almost always add -a. | 21:35 |
rwp | I don't see the need to know it was a binary file. Just being a file is good enough for me. | 21:35 |
rwp | I get 54 hits. Mostly in chromium sqlite history files. Then something about "ghb" a few hits. Then a five cached xfce desktop icons. | 21:36 |
fazzah | rwp, oh, how is that so? | 21:36 |
rwp | In my case there is nothing that that is more than old cache files that would not create any problem. | 21:36 |
rwp | fazzah, Every part of the screensaver and Firefox and everything points fingers for the blame at the other parties. | 21:37 |
rwp | And I can say this here but not in other channels... systemd is also involved and being very opinionated it is also causing problems with screensavers. | 21:37 |
rwp | Thankfully we don't need to worry about that particular breakage. | 21:37 |
fazzah | are there solutions? it's not convenient when watching a football game... | 21:38 |
rwp | I did a quick search and found this 7 year old reference: https://support.mozilla.org/en-US/questions/987207 | 21:38 |
nemo | rwp: wait wut? | 21:38 |
nemo | rwp: systemd has problems with... screensavers? | 21:38 |
fsmithred | turn the screensaver off | 21:38 |
rwp | Also this reference. https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/117222/disabling-xscreensaver-when-firefox-is-playing-htm5-video | 21:38 |
nemo | ah | 21:38 |
fsmithred | you can use the power manager to save power | 21:39 |
rwp | I am not running a screensaver or screen locker and therefore I do not personally have a problem with it locking while playing videos. | 21:39 |
rwp | nemo, Last rant I remember was from jwz (who else?) who ranted about how systemd had broken things. | 21:39 |
fsmithred | plus screensavers that do anything other than blank the screen are a waste of energy, so you should feel guilty about using them | 21:39 |
nemo | https://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=811261 ← this definitely works at home though | 21:40 |
rwp | nemo, Reference: https://www.jwz.org/blog/2020/12/xscreensaver-5-45/ | 21:40 |
nemo | I watch full length movies in firefox with the kids all the time | 21:40 |
nemo | fsmithred: heh. our screensaver at home is slideshow. it runs for about 15 minutes and often provides family entertainment/happiness | 21:40 |
nemo | so no guilt here 😝 | 21:40 |
nemo | then screen powers off | 21:40 |
nemo | it's kind of like a spontaneous family photo album pause | 21:41 |
fsmithred | sounds nice | 21:41 |
fsmithred | I used to run a screensaver to help heat the room | 21:42 |
nemo | wow. that systemd behaviour is pretty wtf | 21:42 |
rwp | nemo, It's not really surprising that jwz ranted about something. I was more shocked that he actually had nice things to say about something. (VLC in this case.) | 21:42 |
nemo | well. vlc is pretty awesome | 21:43 |
rwp | vlc is pretty excellent. Although mostly I find myself using mpv most of the time. | 21:43 |
rwp | But yes... That systemd behavior is a classic WTF! But perhaps more like, it's systemd so WCGW? | 21:44 |
nemo | I *have* run into a problem with vlc on the family account on the living room chimæra that I haven't figured out yet | 21:44 |
nemo | for some reason, if I close vlc, it stays open in background, hanging. | 21:44 |
nemo | not all the time, but often enough. and result is that I can't launch it again until I run a killall -9 vlc | 21:45 |
nemo | I tried blowing away all vlc settings that I could find on this account, but the problem simply returned again | 21:45 |
nemo | I probably should talk to them about it instead of resorting to kills | 21:45 |
fsmithred | I used to have a special button on the panel with the command 'pkill vlc' | 21:46 |
fsmithred | worked great | 21:46 |
fsmithred | or maybe it was pkill -9 vlc | 21:46 |
fsmithred | I think that was back in jessie | 21:47 |
fsmithred | so, not a new problem | 21:47 |
nemo | intersting | 21:50 |
nemo | +e | 21:50 |
nemo | ok. so if it isn't a new problem, maybe VLC is aware of it and has more info | 21:50 |
nemo | fsmithred: I thought maybe it was related to running it as an applet or something but doesn't seem to be | 21:51 |
nemo | fsmithred: I'm thinking for family's sake I'll just make a VLC wrapper that runs kill first. They never launch 2 videos at once anyway | 21:51 |
Guest60 | so if my sources.list says merged beowulf main should i just change it to merged chimaera main | 21:53 |
fsmithred | Guest60, yes, then update and upgrade | 21:54 |
Guest60 | alright | 21:54 |
fsmithred | for chimaera you only need one line | 21:54 |
fsmithred | there's no -security or -updates | 21:54 |
Guest60 | ok | 21:54 |
fsmithred | if you have just a base system, it should go well | 21:54 |
fsmithred | if you have a desktop, you may run into some difficulties | 21:55 |
Guest60 | should i get rid of the de then? | 21:55 |
fsmithred | what do you have? | 21:55 |
Guest60 | xfce | 21:55 |
fsmithred | and did you select the desktop from the installer? | 21:55 |
Guest60 | there wasn't an option given in refracta | 21:56 |
fsmithred | task-xfce-desktop, desktop-base might not be ready | 21:56 |
fsmithred | devuan-live or actual Refracta iso? | 21:56 |
Guest60 | devuan-live | 21:56 |
fsmithred | so yeah, you have the task package | 21:56 |
fsmithred | upgrade and see what happens | 21:56 |
Guest60 | alright | 21:56 |
fsmithred | if it gets removed you can install it again | 21:57 |
Guest60 | yeah | 21:57 |
fsmithred | hm | 21:57 |
fsmithred | can always try it with --simulate | 21:57 |
fsmithred | for future reference, if you want to run testing, it's easier to just install the base, upgrade, then add the desktop. It goes a lot faster that way. | 21:58 |
fsmithred | but you don't get that choice with the live | 21:58 |
Guest60 | yeah i'll run simulate first | 21:59 |
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