libera/#devuan/ Saturday, 2021-07-03

ksx4systemthere are no builds for Raspberry Pi nowadays01:12
ksx4systemhow do I install Devuan nowadays? old image and upgrade?01:13
ksx4systemofficial RPi OS no longer allows bullshitd removal :(01:13
golinuxksx4system: https://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=335101:20
ksx4systemgolinux, thnx01:24
ksx4systemig this is my only refuge01:24
golinux:)01:25
ksx4systemuh01:32
ksx4systemafaics there's no "flash and go" image nowadays01:32
fsmithredhttp://arm-files.devuan.org/01:39
fsmithredksx4system, those images are supplied by the community01:40
ksx4systemfsmithred, thnx :)))02:06
tuxd3vksx4system, "ig this is my only refuge" - welcome my friend! :)02:20
brocashelmfeels good to not need kde packages anymore. purged them all. kolourpaint got replaced with paint98/xp (wine), okular got replaced with firefox-esr (pdf mode), and soundkonverter got replaced with cdparanoia (cli)13:43
aarobrocashelm: now you need to get rid of MS paint -> https://itsfoss.com/open-source-paint-apps/13:59
brocashelmaaro: i tried them all (kolourpaint included) and didn't like them14:01
* aaro just uses gimp14:03
brocashelmi need a stable program for working with pixel art14:03
brocashelmi hate gimp, too14:03
Xenguykolourpaint is my goto for simple use cases14:26
XenguyI wonder if irfanview works in WINE?14:27
brocashelmkolourpaint has this consistent zoom bug that keeps going at max (3200%) after one click. i also prefer to see an icon for the pen for better pixel accuracy. this wasn't a problem at all on mspaint (98/xp), and the performance is just fine with wine14:31
GoatAvengerI never understood the appeal for KDE; but, apparently some people must dig it..14:45
sadsnorkbrocashelm, it may not be open source or GNU/Linux native [though either is XP paint), but have you tried Faststone?14:45
Orion_SAXenguy: yes https://appdb.winehq.org/objectManager.php?bShowAll=true&bIsQueue=false&bIsRejected=false&sClass=version&sTitle=&sReturnTo=&iId=783414:45
sadsnorkhttps://www.faststone.org/FSViewerDetail.htm14:45
brocashelmsadsnork: i have not tried it, no. might look into it14:51
stealth_Greetings! Is there a group that specializes in gaming for Devuan ?20:45
ksx4systemwhat could be wrong with that init script? it worked fine for years, now it only allows for manual operation (eg. doesn't start service on boot)20:50
ksx4systemhttps://paste.mgst.eu/?182dba74386adefd#CrtPnDqSfALdrrHBFVToSX8aT4wUqj66gck35sYVZfGD20:50
masonstealth_: There are a number of folks who enjoy games and use Devuan. Steam works well on it. There's no specific gathering place for Devuan gamers though.20:51
chozorhoI recently installed Steam on Devuan ^^20:51
chozorhoI'm impressed that it worked so well... I don't even have good hardware on this machine :D20:52
stealth_@chozorho, I'll try that as well20:52
ksx4systemupdate-rc.d lighttpd defaults and update-rc.d lighttpd enable didn't help20:52
gnarfacestealth_: make sure you use the distro steam package from the repos and not the ubuntu one from their website20:55
stealth_Oh.20:55
stealth_Do I need to enable something in the sources.list?20:55
gnarfacestealth_: yea.  that might be problematic.  it's in non-free20:55
stealth_I wish there were more native gaming apps20:56
gnarfacestealth_: also, if you are on stable (beowulf) and have a nvidia card actually new enough to be supported by modern titles you'll probably need the nvidia drivers from beowulf-backports20:56
gnarfaceand the same rule applies there as with the steam pacakge - use the ones in the repo not the ones from nvidia.com20:57
gnarfacewine should work though if you need support for current stuff like Battle.net you probably need the one from winehq-staging20:57
gnarface(which should work as long as you're careful not to install the dependencies from there too)20:58
gnarface(but if you screw it up ... same thing.  big mess)20:58
masonOh, I can vouch for that. I don't think Nouveau will be good enough for stuff from Steam.20:58
masonI use the proprietary nVidia drivers here, and really only because of Steam.20:58
gnarfacethere are in fact a ton of games in the repo without any particular hardware requirements but they're fairly casual stuff for the most part except for the ioquake3 engine which you have to get maps for elsewhere to make any use of20:59
gnarfacestealth_: anyway, those should be the important points, i might be able to help if you run into trouble as long as you didn't make too big of a mess already21:00
gnarfacestealth_: there's really almost nothing about it actually different from debian except that you'll get less misinformation here21:01
gnarfacestealth_: (though if you have a steam controller there are a couple exceptions i can guide you around)21:02
gnarfacestealth_: (valve's documentation for the steam controller, such as it is, glosses over a lot of important behavior because systemd just obviates it all by blowing away all the security barriers)21:02
stealth_Cool beans, thanks gnarface. I only have integrated graphics, from Intel and just looking to play native titles and maybe tf221:03
stealth_8th generation21:03
gnarfacestealth_: ah, that might work without any extra tweaking.  if opengl seems to be failing over to software mode make sure you have libgl1-mesa-glx21:04
ksx4systemhttps://paste.mgst.eu/?182dba74386adefd#CrtPnDqSfALdrrHBFVToSX8aT4wUqj66gck35sYVZfGD any ideas why this init script simply does not start at boot? worked fine for years on multiple servers, of course update-rc.d lighttpd defaults and even update-rc.d lighttpd enable was done21:04
stealth_Gotcha, thanks @gnarface21:05
gnarfaceksx4system: didn't look, just a guess;  "dpkg-reconfigure dash" and change your boot shell back to bash21:10
ksx4systemgnarface, never had to change anything to run this one lol21:11
gnarfaceksx4system: well my hypothesis is based on the fact the default had changed at some point21:12
gnarfaceksx4system: and you wouldn't be the first21:12
ksx4system?21:12
gnarfaceto run into that problem this month21:12
ksx4systemoh well21:12
gnarfaceor i guess within the last 30 days-ish, because it's a new month21:13
gnarfacesorry, time is a blur to me but it just hit someone else in relatively recent memory21:13
gnarfacewait, are you saying it stopped booting on its own?  maybe i misinterpreted your statement21:14
gnarfacei thought you meant it works on multiple servers but you can't get it working on a new one21:14
gnarfaceif it stopped working in place on a system that received no updates since it last worked, check the system time then check the logs21:15
ksx4systemgnarface, it stoppen working on brand new system21:16
ksx4systemit just didn't kick up the service after first reboot21:16
ksx4systemsame version of Devuan, other server - works every single time21:17
gnarfacedouble check the dash thing21:17
gnarfaceif the other servers are still booting with bash and this one is not then that is a smoking gun21:17
gnarfaceother than that i'd just have to check the logs21:18
ksx4systemdid that already, absolutely nothing in logs21:18
ksx4systemthat particular init script is ignored as silently as it is possible21:18
gnarfacewhat happens if you call it directly like "/etc/init.d/lighttpd start" as root?21:18
ksx4systemgnarface, manually? works fine21:19
ksx4systemon boot via rc.local? fails silently the same way21:19
gnarfaceif you run sysv-rc-conf does it show up like the other services?21:19
gnarfacelike the ones that work i mean?21:19
ksx4systemyes21:20
gnarfaceand this isn't a virtual machine?  this is bare metal?21:21
ksx4systemyup, bare metal21:21
gnarfaceand your'e sure ther'es nothing in any of the logs suspicious, especially /var/log/daemon.log or the output of dmesg right after boot?21:21
__userDoes it depend on network being started?21:21
ksx4system__user, nope21:22
__userERRR21:22
gnarfacehmm, yea it seems like a network configuration issue could be the case21:22
gnarfaceor a path issue to the docroot21:22
gnarfacebut i'd expect a logged error normally about that21:22
gnarfacealso i'd expect it not to work manually then21:22
__userksx4system: what starting number does it have?21:22
ksx4systemgnarface, absolutely nothing in /var/log/daemon.log about this particular script21:22
__userSxxlighttpd ? What is xx ?21:22
__userksx4system: look in syslog and see where lighttpd is configured to log, can be elsewhere21:23
ksx4system__user, S0321:24
ksx4system__user, it's configured to log where I told it to lol, /var/log/lighttpd21:24
gnarfaceksx4system: this is beowulf, right?21:24
ksx4systemgnarface, yup, latest stuff21:24
__userS03 is way too early for network imo21:24
ksx4system__user, lighttpd doesn't give a fsck about not having network on start :D21:25
ksx4systemit's just either reachable or not21:25
gnarfacethe lsb headers should preempt the symlink indexes anyway21:25
ksx4systemmby I'll just try recompiling lighttpd21:25
__userksx4system: depends if it was set to listen on 0.0.0.0 or on a specific address?21:25
gnarfaceas long as they're present and start with "S" i think the lsb priorities override the index #'s21:25
__userksx4system: no, don't recompile, it may not help21:25
ksx4system__user, it used to help sometimes21:26
ksx4systemespecially when I was surfing git snapshots instead of stable versions21:26
__userThis is not voodoo. If it were voodoo, youd use a dead chicken, not recompile anyway.21:26
ksx4systemlol21:27
gnarfaceksx4system: can you humor me about the dash thing just for science?21:27
gnarfaceat this point it's unlikely to hurt21:27
gnarfaceand you can change it back just as easily21:27
ksx4systemgnarface, it wasn't dash thing, I've tried too21:27
ksx4systemwell21:30
ksx4systemexecuting lighttpd manually via /etc/rc.local doesn't bring it up too21:31
ksx4systemwtf21:31
__useroh, now we're onto something21:31
__useras root?21:31
ksx4systemas root21:31
__userand manually does it?21:31
ksx4systemnope21:32
__userwhat command did you put in /etc/rc.local exactly?21:32
__usercan you paste it here? one line?21:32
ksx4systemyup, it was /opt/lighttpd/sbin/lighttpd -f /etc/lighttpd/lighttpd.conf21:33
__userIsn't /opt/lighttpd/sbin/lighttpd a symlink?21:33
gnarfacethis isn't actually the repo version of lighttpd, is it?21:34
gnarfacethat could be part of the issue21:34
__usersounds like it's not gnarface21:34
ksx4system__user, it's not - lighttpd binary actually lives there21:34
gnarfacein that case i would also examine build differences21:34
gnarfacethough i'm not sure exactly what i'd be looking for other than just any discrepancies21:34
ksx4systemgnarface, it's not - I've compiled it from clean lighttpd source just like I did for last 10 years or so21:34
__userand if you launch the same command from cli as root, does it start? ksx4system21:35
gnarfaceksx4system: yea but it's a moving target and the version in beowulf isn't21:35
ksx4system__user, manually? myself typing via ssh? yes it works21:35
ksx4systemvia /etc/rc.local? no dice21:35
__userok, can you share the config file?21:35
__userpaste it21:35
__usernot on here21:35
ksx4system__user, it's like 15 different files lol21:35
gnarfacepaste.debian.net doesn't have ads21:36
ksx4systemgnarface, I run my own pastebin ;)21:36
__userksx4system: just the /etc/ one21:36
gnarfaceksx4system: yea, but i'll actually look at paste.debian.net21:36
ksx4system__user, let me say that again: I've got like 15 different files in /etc/lighttpd, every single section has its own file for easier editing21:37
gnarfaceksx4system: does it have a section for increasing log verbosity?21:37
ksx4system__user, here's the base file21:37
ksx4systemhttps://paste.mgst.eu/?4162f9c56c9f238d#2axqP6LTuZm93u1K4LqHcYTZn4u47tNerqi2jkLGEFSD21:37
ksx4systemgnarface, surely I could increase verbosity21:38
__userwhat's your setting for "server.systemd-socket-activation" ?21:39
ksx4systemhmm21:40
__useralso "server.bind" and "server.use-ipv6"21:40
ksx4systemif server.systemd-socket-activation not on main file then it's lighttpd default21:40
ksx4systemserver.bind binds to 172.20.20.2 which is IP received by server via static DHCP lease21:41
__userdefault is disabled, or was, when the docs were written21:41
__userksx4system: can you change the binds to 0.0.0.0 and try again?21:41
ksx4system__user, why not, one sec21:41
__userI think 0.0.0.0 is called * in conf not sure21:42
ksx4systemit's actually 0.0.0.0 if you want to bind to whatever address server has21:42
ksx4systemrebooting21:43
__usersome want * some want 0.0.0.021:43
ksx4systemloooooool21:43
ksx4systemit worked21:43
ksx4systemlighttpd started after reboot :)21:44
__usercongrats.21:44
ksx4systemig now it wants 0.0.0.0 instead of exact WAN address lol21:44
__userIs your exact WAN address not nat'd in the local net where the server is?21:45
__userOr is it a vm and you fumbled the public ip with the admin ip21:45
__userksx4system: to make it work with fixed address, you need to set up a "network up wait loop" because some routers and the like take 5-30 seconds from lan detection to packet forwarding.21:47
__userOR schedule server start later if not detected started.21:48
ksx4system__user, I run OpenWrt on my router if that helps21:49
ksx4system__user, it's local network :) ports are forwarded from WAN connected to router21:50
joachinHello team, just giving a feedback about the chimaera net install.22:35
luser978ksx4system: right, then lighttpd needs the LAN ip or 0.0.0.0 . The wicd starts as S04 here, so, after S03lighttpd, needs to start in S05 instead, dhcpclient runs from wicd22:35
joachinthe net install is working well. The only inconvenience that I have, it's that the mute mic key is not working in any DE.22:36
luser978ksx4system: it worked before, because systemd-networkmess does "early" kernel dhcp, and opens a security hole with that.22:37
luser978luser978:  I'm also user__22:37
golinuxluser978: wicd is deprecated in chimaera due to python2 deps22:52
luser978he's on beowulf iirc?22:53
golinuxYes, on beowulf. python3 is in chimaera23:18
brocashelmi heard it's possible to package python2 for chimaera/ceres, so either a kind soul does that or you could also try connman (gtk or qt uis exist) as an alternative23:20
ksx4systemluser978, no wicd here :) CLI only system23:21

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