| Guest74 | Hi! I asked before for a help with network management software. | 00:05 |
|---|---|---|
| fsmithred | yeah, what happened? | 00:07 |
| fsmithred | what did you do? | 00:07 |
| Guest74 | I installed that other, alternative to the NetworkManager | 00:08 |
| fsmithred | connman | 00:09 |
| fsmithred | which parts? | 00:09 |
| fsmithred | I have connman connman-ui connman-gtk and connman-vpn installed. I use all but the last one. | 00:10 |
| fsmithred | I'd have to look at the laptop to tell you how I set it up to work on the desktop. | 00:10 |
| Guest74 | Yes. I decided to uninstall that, and just stay with NetworkManager for now to see if it was enough to just download the previously mentioned additional drivers | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | if you're lucky, n-m will just work. | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | good luck if you want it to do something other than what it wants to do. | 00:11 |
| fsmithred | and connman isn't much better in that respect. | 00:11 |
| Guest74 | For some reason I lost wireless, but also wired connection | 00:11 |
| Guest74 | The NetworkManager shows that it work well | 00:12 |
| fsmithred | it tells you everthing is ok when it's not? | 00:12 |
| Guest74 | That it connects, but when I try to ping, i get "temporary failure in name resolution" | 00:13 |
| Guest74 | when I ping 8.8.8.8, (the IP address directly) it works | 00:14 |
| Guest74 | Something is not ok with DNS resolving | 00:14 |
| Guest74 | How to fix this? | 00:14 |
| Guest74 | The primary DNS in the connection information seem to be local | 00:15 |
| Guest74 | 192.168.43.1 | 00:15 |
| Guest74 | I guess it is bad. | 00:15 |
| fsmithred | use a web browser to test instead of ping. Or ssh. | 00:16 |
| fsmithred | I ran into that today and thought it was a qemu problem. | 00:16 |
| fsmithred | ping didn't work, but I had a connection. | 00:16 |
| Guest74 | Web browser also informs that it cannot resolve address | 00:18 |
| fsmithred | ok, then it's not the same problem I had. | 00:18 |
| Guest74 | I don't know why would browser work ang ping not. | 00:18 |
| Guest74 | It cannot translate names to IP | 00:19 |
| fsmithred | no idea. I test stuff in qemu all the time and ping works. | 00:19 |
| fsmithred | including in my other chimaera systems | 00:19 |
| fsmithred | what's in /etc/resolv.conf? n-m probably messed with it. | 00:19 |
| Guest74 | Will check | 00:20 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | Hve you lokked at /etc/resolv.conf and the DNS server configured in network manager? | 00:20 |
| Guest74 | I did not. I'm trying to check. | 00:22 |
| fsmithred | cat /etc/resolv.conf | 00:22 |
| Guest74 | "No such file or directory" | 00:23 |
| Guest74 | In the file manager, it is described as a broken kink | 00:24 |
| Guest74 | link* | 00:24 |
| Guest74 | there is also a "resolvconf" folder there | 00:25 |
| Guest74 | Should I check this? | 00:25 |
| fsmithred | yeah | 00:27 |
| fsmithred | all I have in mine is unbound | 00:27 |
| fsmithred | you probably don't have that | 00:27 |
| Guest74 | there are 2 folders and 1 file in it | 00:28 |
| Guest74 | file is: "interface-order" | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | I don't know anything about that. Sorry. | 00:28 |
| Guest74 | "update.d" and "resolv.comf.d" are folder names | 00:29 |
| fsmithred | I have update.d/unbound and nothing else there. | 00:29 |
| fsmithred | you could just add the file | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | put your router's ip address in it. That's what's usually there. | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | or your favorite dns | 00:31 |
| fsmithred | but network-manager will probably change it anyway | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | mine said #Generated by NetworkManager | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | with nothing else in the file | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | I just fixed that, since I removed n-m yesterday | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | did you try putting static ip and dns settings in network-manager? | 00:33 |
| UsL | I have my router in /etc/resolv.conf | 00:33 |
| UsL | nameserver 192.168.1.1 | 00:34 |
| Guest74 | I didn't try with static. It was set only on DHCP previously | 00:35 |
| fsmithred | maybe just give it a dns setting | 00:35 |
| fsmithred | router address or maybe 8.8.8.8 to test (google) | 00:35 |
| Guest74 | Through static, on NetworkManager settings you mean? | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | somewhere in n-m | 00:36 |
| fsmithred | I don't think you have to use a static ip address to set a preferred dns address. | 00:36 |
| Guest74 | will try | 00:36 |
| Guest74 | How do I set preffered dns otherwise, then/ | 00:37 |
| Guest74 | Where? | 00:37 |
| fsmithred | and this is one reason why I hate network manager | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | left or right click on the taskbar icon | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | or find n-m in the menu | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | and poke around until it lets you see some settings | 00:38 |
| Guest74 | I put previously 8.8.8.8 as "additional DNS" in the connection settings. | 00:38 |
| Guest74 | Didn't help | 00:38 |
| fsmithred | does n-m see any wireless signals? | 00:39 |
| fsmithred | i think that's in 'configure connections' or something like that | 00:40 |
| fsmithred | found it | 00:47 |
| Guest74 | fsmithred it sees all wireless connections | 00:47 |
| fsmithred | Guest74, right-click, Edit connections | 00:47 |
| fsmithred | ah, ok | 00:47 |
| fsmithred | good, so the hardware is working | 00:47 |
| Guest74 | Just it do not resolves ip addresses | 00:48 |
| fsmithred | edit connection. look in IPv4 settings | 00:48 |
| fsmithred | there's a line for Additional DNS servers | 00:49 |
| Guest74 | You mean, in the first, default DHCP options, tight? | 00:50 |
| Guest74 | right?* | 00:50 |
| fsmithred | not sure where you're looking | 00:51 |
| fsmithred | and it might be different because I only have a wired connection to look at | 00:51 |
| Guest74 | IPv4 settings | 00:52 |
| Guest74 | Method automatic (DHCP) | 00:53 |
| fsmithred | yeah | 00:53 |
| Guest74 | Lower there is a window. Should be anything in here? | 00:53 |
| fsmithred | below the big box says Additional DNS server | 00:53 |
| fsmithred | I would try putting something in that line | 00:53 |
| fsmithred | 8.8.8.8 | 00:54 |
| Guest74 | The big box, I meant | 00:54 |
| fsmithred | the all-seeing-eye should be able to resolve all addresses | 00:54 |
| fsmithred | no, don't put anything in the big box | 00:54 |
| fsmithred | that's for static ip addresses | 00:54 |
| Guest74 | Should there be anything other than 8.8.8.8 after "Additional DNSr | 00:55 |
| Guest74 | server"? | 00:55 |
| fsmithred | i don't think so | 00:55 |
| Guest74 | Ok | 00:57 |
| Guest74 | So the good thing is the "primary DNS" changed to 8.8.8.8. | 00:58 |
| Guest74 | The bad thing is, I still cannot connect with anything by name | 00:58 |
| Guest74 | I have no idea why | 00:59 |
| Guest74 | I can ping 8.8.8.8 | 00:59 |
| fsmithred | how/what did you install? | 00:59 |
| Guest74 | Probably other addresses directly as well | 00:59 |
| fsmithred | full desktop from installer iso? | 00:59 |
| Guest74 | Yes, if I remember well | 01:00 |
| Guest74 | The more customizable option | 01:00 |
| fsmithred | installed chimaera or you upgraded from beowulf? | 01:00 |
| Guest74 | So I could reuse home partition and install system on the root one | 01:01 |
| Guest74 | No. Fresh install. | 01:01 |
| fsmithred | ok | 01:01 |
| Guest74 | Had other system previously. | 01:01 |
| Guest74 | I would like to connect just, so I could reinstall NetworkManager, so the packet manager would fix this | 01:03 |
| Guest74 | But it is the same problem on the wired | 01:03 |
| fsmithred | you tried to get a wired connection with n-m or without n-m? | 01:04 |
| Guest74 | So I cannot fix it like this, cause I have no connection | 01:05 |
| Guest74 | With NM. Can I do this without it? | 01:05 |
| fsmithred | yeah | 01:06 |
| Guest74 | How to? | 01:06 |
| fsmithred | service stop network-manager | 01:06 |
| fsmithred | dhclient eth0 | 01:06 |
| fsmithred | both as root | 01:06 |
| Guest74 | Can I just kill the process? | 01:06 |
| fsmithred | yeah, probably. That's less graceful. | 01:06 |
| Guest74 | "dhclient eth0" what's exactly tgis? | 01:07 |
| fsmithred | but I can sympathize with the sentiment | 01:07 |
| fsmithred | that lets the system ask for an address from the dhcp server, most likely your router | 01:07 |
| Guest74 | I will try so then | 01:08 |
| fsmithred | if you kill it, check ps carefully. n-m may be running under a couple of names | 01:08 |
| fsmithred | network-manager NetworkManager maybe n-m-applet | 01:09 |
| fsmithred | brb | 01:10 |
| fsmithred | service network-manager stop (is the correct command) | 01:16 |
| Guest74 | I checked processes in the process manager | 01:18 |
| Guest74 | This is listed as NetworkManager | 01:18 |
| Guest74 | when I try with "service NetworkManager" the "unrecognized service" is returned | 01:19 |
| Guest74 | Why? | 01:19 |
| fsmithred | because the script name is network-manager | 01:19 |
| fsmithred | it's /etc/init.d/network-manager | 01:20 |
| Guest74 | Ok. Will try this | 01:20 |
| Guest74 | Warning: /etc/resolv.conf is not a symbolic link to run/resolvconf/resolv.conf | 01:26 |
| fsmithred | what command? | 01:26 |
| Guest74 | This error mssage afer "dhclient eth0" | 01:26 |
| Guest74 | After I stoppen the n-m service | 01:26 |
| Guest74 | And the connection does not work after this | 01:28 |
| fsmithred | did you get an ip address? | 01:29 |
| fsmithred | ip a | 01:29 |
| Guest74 | I didn't get any other response. How do I check it here? | 01:30 |
| fsmithred | 'ip a' gives you nothing? | 01:30 |
| Guest74 | will check | 01:30 |
| Guest74 | It lists me some info, for 1. 2. 3. | 01:32 |
| fsmithred | should be an address for eth0 | 01:33 |
| fsmithred | inet 192.168.something | 01:33 |
| fsmithred | what are 1. 2. 3. ?? | 01:34 |
| Guest74 | 2 is for 2. eth0 | 01:36 |
| fsmithred | oh, ok | 01:36 |
| Guest74 | At some point here is inet 192.168.1.12.24... | 01:36 |
| Guest74 | 12/24...* | 01:37 |
| fsmithred | ok, that's an address | 01:37 |
| Guest74 | Ok. But what's next? | 01:37 |
| fsmithred | check something to see if you have internet | 01:37 |
| rrq | if wlan0 is up as well to the same net the poor kernel gets confused | 01:38 |
| Guest74 | There is...Only by direct IP adress | 01:39 |
| Guest74 | Ping 8.8.8.8 works. Ping www.google.com does not | 01:40 |
| fsmithred | waht's in resolv.conf? | 01:40 |
| rrq | yes icmp is connectionless | 01:40 |
| Guest74 | rrq, wlan0 is as well, in the 2. | 01:40 |
| Guest74 | 3. * | 01:41 |
| rrq | "turn off" wlan0 while using eth0 .. or disable or deconfigure | 01:41 |
| Guest74 | How to? | 01:41 |
| fsmithred | stopping network-manager should have done that, I think | 01:41 |
| Guest74 | fsmithred did you mean "run/resolvconf/resolv.conf"? | 01:42 |
| fsmithred | no | 01:42 |
| fsmithred | /etc/resolv.conf | 01:42 |
| Guest74 | fsmithred it looks like stopping n-m didn't do so | 01:43 |
| Guest74 | fsmithred as I wrote, it is not recognized as a file but as some broken link | 01:44 |
| rrq | use command: ip addr change dev wlan0 10.0.0.2 | 01:44 |
| Guest74 | will try | 01:45 |
| rrq | nm won't discover that and the kernel stops being confused about thw 192.168.1.0/24 network | 01:45 |
| rrq | btw that 10.0.0.0/8 address is also a "private network" address block | 01:46 |
| rrq | = not routed over internet | 01:46 |
| Guest74 | So should I then restart, trying to use the wired connection to fix n-m with packet manager by reinstalling? | 01:47 |
| rrq | mmm I just entered this dialogue and don't use nm .. follow fsmithred's guide | 01:48 |
| fsmithred | I think you should get a connection that has dns working first, and then you can go back to using network manager | 01:49 |
| * rrq biab (real life distraction) | 01:50 | |
| fsmithred | Guest74, did you create /etc/resolv.conf? | 01:53 |
| fsmithred | and does it still exist? | 01:53 |
| fsmithred | and still have an address in it? | 01:53 |
| fsmithred | oh, now I have a /run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf | 01:54 |
| fsmithred | I just installed n-m in a chimaera VM | 01:54 |
| fsmithred | still can't ping, but I get name resolution. I can ssh to a named place. | 01:55 |
| fsmithred | like I said before. Don't use ping to test. | 01:55 |
| Guest74 | I didn't create this. It is recognized by the file manager as a broken link | 01:55 |
| fsmithred | it is an abomination created by network manager | 01:56 |
| fsmithred | just to trip you up | 01:56 |
| fsmithred | brb | 01:56 |
| Guest74 | wait... | 01:57 |
| Guest74 | Link to run/connman/resolv.conf | 01:57 |
| Guest74 | It is described like this | 01:58 |
| Guest74 | Run/connman is an empty folder | 02:01 |
| fsmithred | you have network-manager and connman installed?? | 02:02 |
| fsmithred | is eth0 configured in /etc/network/interfaces or /etc/network/interfaces.d/(any file name)? | 02:03 |
| Guest74 | I removed connman with the packet manager | 02:03 |
| Guest74 | I had it both installed after I installed connmsn, then I uninstaled connman | 02:04 |
| fsmithred | is eth0 configured in /etc/network/interfaces or /etc/network/interfaces.d/(any file name)? | 02:04 |
| Guest74 | So the NetworkManager only is installed | 02:05 |
| fsmithred | ok | 02:05 |
| fsmithred | I guess the run directory is still there because you haven't rebooted since removing connman | 02:05 |
| fsmithred | anyway, if you're going to use any network gui manager, you should not have the intefaces configured manually | 02:06 |
| fsmithred | so please check | 02:06 |
| Guest74 | I did so a couple of times since, as I remember | 02:06 |
| Guest74 | rebooted, it is. | 02:06 |
| fsmithred | what is in /etc/network/interfaces? | 02:07 |
| Guest74 | I will check about where is eth0 configured now, then | 02:07 |
| Guest74 | Interfaces.d is an empty folder, and interfaces is a file | 02:09 |
| fsmithred | ok look in the file. There should be two lines. | 02:10 |
| Guest74 | Source [this empty file]/* | 02:10 |
| fsmithred | for 'lo' | 02:11 |
| Guest74 | next, there is "auto lo" | 02:11 |
| Guest74 | And next "iface lo inet loopback" | 02:12 |
| Guest74 | That's everything, not including comments. | 02:12 |
| fsmithred | oh, ok | 02:13 |
| Guest74 | So there are 3 lines other than comments | 02:13 |
| fsmithred | that's the way it should be | 02:13 |
| fsmithred | the 'source' line means you can put configs inside files you add to the interfaces.d directory | 02:14 |
| Guest74 | Ok. What should I do next? | 02:14 |
| fsmithred | I don't know. n-m should be working. | 02:15 |
| fsmithred | you have network-manager and network-manager-gnome installed, right? | 02:15 |
| Guest74 | But what changed so it could work? | 02:15 |
| Guest74 | I did change the ip previously. Should this help after I run n-m one more time? | 02:16 |
| Guest74 | ip for wlan0 it is | 02:16 |
| fsmithred | that change would not persist beyond a reboot | 02:16 |
| fsmithred | maybe reboot and open a browser | 02:17 |
| Guest74 | N-m and n-m-gnome, yes | 02:17 |
| fsmithred | I really don't know. | 02:17 |
| fsmithred | like I said, I got angry at n-m yesterday because it wouldn't do what I wanted, so I removed it. I find it very difficult to use. | 02:18 |
| fsmithred | you have a working wired connection now? | 02:19 |
| Guest74 | Ok...So I started again n-m alone, and tried both wired and wireless | 02:19 |
| fsmithred | anything work? | 02:20 |
| Guest74 | Unfortunatelly not | 02:21 |
| fsmithred | sorry, I'm out of ideas. | 02:21 |
| Guest74 | Also turned off n-m again and tried wired, but name resolving does not work | 02:21 |
| fsmithred | probably because n-m interfered with it | 02:22 |
| fsmithred | we're up to almost five hours. Reinstall takes a lot less time. | 02:22 |
| gnarface | also networkmanager has literally never worked right in all of 20 years | 02:23 |
| fsmithred | or maybe try the desktop-live iso to see if network works. | 02:23 |
| fsmithred | firmware is already installed | 02:23 |
| gnarface | whoever designed it fundamentally hates linux and wants it to faceplant | 02:23 |
| fsmithred | I can't find any evidence to dispute that. | 02:23 |
| gnarface | lots of people claim it does what they want, but after figuring out how to make it do what i want i realized the raw interfaces file is much simpler to understand on its own | 02:25 |
| gnarface | (and less buggy) | 02:25 |
| gnarface | if the choice is between n-m and connman, connman may be worth trying instead | 02:25 |
| Guest74 | Should I try changing that broken link to run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf instead? | 02:25 |
| fsmithred | which broken link? | 02:26 |
| gnarface | i didn't read the whole scrollback but just from context it sounds worth trying | 02:26 |
| Guest74 | fsmithred etc/resolv.conf | 02:26 |
| gnarface | (that's assuming it's still worth it to you to figure out what networkmanager is doing and why; for me this was a pyrrhic victory though) | 02:26 |
| fsmithred | ls -l /etc/resolv.conf | 02:26 |
| fsmithred | is it a symlink or a real file? | 02:27 |
| Guest74 | I forgot...How can I tell the diference? | 02:27 |
| fsmithred | line starts with l for link | 02:28 |
| fsmithred | and it shows what it points to at the end of the line | 02:28 |
| Guest74 | There is "l" on the start just before rwxrwxrwx | 02:29 |
| fsmithred | so it's a symbolic link | 02:30 |
| fsmithred | I don't know where it came from or what the best course of action would be. | 02:30 |
| fsmithred | anything I suggest now is just a guess | 02:30 |
| Guest74 | It shows what it points. The same thing that file manager shows that it points | 02:30 |
| gnarface | i think if there's also a file called /run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf and it has the dns configuration that was entered into networkmanager's gui, then it's safe to assume that symlink is supposed to point there | 02:31 |
| gnarface | it's not safe to assume it will keep pointing there after the next time networkmanager so much as flinches, but it's something | 02:31 |
| Guest74 | This file has only a comment that it is gennerated | 02:32 |
| Guest74 | Nothing more | 02:32 |
| gnarface | hmm | 02:32 |
| gnarface | bogus | 02:32 |
| fsmithred | in my VM I have both /etc/resolv.conf and /run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf. They are both real files and they both contain the same lines. | 02:32 |
| gnarface | well theoretically networkmanager is generating a valid config and hiding it somewhere, then choking on the vestiges of the natural config | 02:33 |
| gnarface | that's the usual pattern of failure anyway | 02:33 |
| Guest74 | but it points now to "run/connman/resolv.conf" | 02:33 |
| fsmithred | oh, then that's wrong. | 02:33 |
| fsmithred | I think you can delete it and probably just restart network-manager | 02:33 |
| gnarface | i'm not using dhcp or wireless, so i don't have a /run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf and my /etc/resolv.conf is not auto-generated | 02:34 |
| Guest74 | both this empty file and a broken link? | 02:34 |
| Guest74 | Delete both? | 02:34 |
| fsmithred | /etc/init.d/network-manager restart | 02:34 |
| fsmithred | or | 02:34 |
| fsmithred | service network-manager restart | 02:34 |
| gnarface | if they're empty and auto-generated then worst case scenario it just puts them back and you're at square 1 again | 02:34 |
| fsmithred | no, just delete the broken link: /etc/resolv.conf | 02:35 |
| gnarface | if wifi is involved then restarting wpasupplicant might trigger... something | 02:35 |
| gnarface | regeneration of some files maybe | 02:35 |
| gnarface | (iirc wpasupplicant also generates resolv.conf slugs, separate from whatever networkmanager is doing) | 02:35 |
| Guest74 | what is wpasupplicant? | 02:36 |
| fsmithred | it handles connecting to encrypted wireless | 02:36 |
| gnarface | a userspace daemon for key handling of wpa2 | 02:36 |
| Guest74 | Ok. So how do i use this? | 02:36 |
| fsmithred | usually without ever touching it | 02:36 |
| fsmithred | if you're using a gui like n-m | 02:37 |
| Guest74 | I restarted n-m | 02:41 |
| Guest74 | Deleted link stays deleted | 02:41 |
| Guest74 | Restart the system? | 02:42 |
| gnarface | DNS still not working? | 02:44 |
| Guest74 | It is not | 02:44 |
| UsL | lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 35 Aug 14 12:52 /etc/resolv.conf -> /var/run/NetworkManager/resolv.conf | 02:47 |
| gnarface | UsL: using networkmanager? | 02:48 |
| gnarface | UsL: that's how yours is setup? | 02:48 |
| UsL | yes. On ascii : ) | 02:48 |
| gnarface | hrmmm | 02:48 |
| gnarface | is Guest74 on chimera? | 02:48 |
| UsL | yes | 02:48 |
| fsmithred | dns is working on the machine you're using to talk to us? | 02:49 |
| UsL | yes | 02:49 |
| fsmithred | I meant that for Guest74 | 02:49 |
| Guest74 | Yes. It is. I am writing from the phonr | 02:50 |
| Guest74 | And tes, I am using Chimaera | 02:50 |
| UsL | I think the switch back and forth between nm and connman messed it up. | 02:51 |
| UsL | id you did try them both? | 02:51 |
| UsL | 'if | 02:51 |
| Guest74 | I tried them both, hence the issue | 02:51 |
| Guest74 | Removed connnman, and this happened | 02:52 |
| UsL | okay. I think for my chimaera install I'll go connman. I use xfce though and it defaults to n-m now that wicd is gone. | 02:53 |
| UsL | Guest74: did you try ifdown/ifup? I'd try to either delete resolv.conf, both link and real while service is stopped and ifdown then ifup and restart service. Since it seems it's borked anyway | 03:01 |
| UsL | n-m must default to smthng resembling sane at least.. | 03:02 |
| fsmithred | need to edit /etc/network/intefaces to use ifupdown | 03:03 |
| UsL | oh, is that a newish thing? | 03:04 |
| fsmithred | no | 03:04 |
| UsL | hm.. | 03:04 |
| UsL | okay : ) | 03:04 |
| fsmithred | sometimes you get a couple lines for eth0 in /etc/network/interfaces | 03:05 |
| fsmithred | so you don't have to do anything | 03:05 |
| UsL | I see. | 03:06 |
| rrq | networking is not that hard .. sifting advice is harder | 03:07 |
| rrq | Guest74: got sorted? | 03:11 |
| gnarface | i dunno i used to agonize over gui network configuration for a long time before i realized the format of /etc/network/interfaces is a simple list of name & value pairs | 03:14 |
| gnarface | then i felt like, super betrayed, because just clicking around in the networkmanager menus to figure out where to type in your ip address takes longer than that to figure out | 03:14 |
| gnarface | so then after that i was convinced that networkmanager wasn't actually serious about its inferred purpose | 03:15 |
| rrq | yes I also think ifupdown is the eaiest, but you shouldn't try to mix that with a GUI tool, which is an alternative method | 03:15 |
| gnarface | and i can't really see any evidence to the contrary after all these years | 03:15 |
| gnarface | i know it's basically editorializing, but people waste a lot of time on this and it just isn't worth it | 03:15 |
| gnarface | read the interfaces man page | 03:16 |
| rrq | +1 | 03:16 |
| gnarface | (trust me it is worth it) | 03:16 |
| Xenguy | rrq, 'sifting advice' is indeed harder : -) | 03:16 |
| rrq | unfortunately the documentation fo wireless setup is spread out | 03:17 |
| gnarface | yea that's true but in the end 99% of people only need TWO MORE LINES added to their /etc/network/interfaces file | 03:17 |
| gnarface | (the SSID and the password) | 03:17 |
| gnarface | and of course then you probably want to change it to not be globally readable, since your wifi password is in there now, but that's still way easier than debugging n-m all day | 03:18 |
| gnarface | it can be cumbersome if you have to start managing a lot of locations but most people just use one | 03:19 |
| rrq | indeed, the variation for a roaming laptop is also simple, but documentation is spread out | 03:20 |
| rrq | man wpa_background is a good place | 03:21 |
| rrq | man wpa_action is also a good place | 03:22 |
| rrq | and so are wpa_$(a few more) | 03:22 |
| rrq | down and open in browser: https://git.devuan.org/devuan/installer-iso/src/branch/wip/docs/docs/docs/network-configuration.html | 03:26 |
| rrq | down=download | 03:26 |
| rrq | hmm that doesn't present nicely.. try https://git.devuan.org/devuan/installer-iso/raw/branch/wip/docs/docs/docs/network-configuration.html instead | 04:00 |
| Xenguy | 'raw' vs. 'src', it's a thing | 04:07 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | Is Devuan 5 based on Debian Bookworm available as the new testing distribution? If yes, how is it called? If no, when will it be? | 10:41 |
| gnarface | EmanuelLoos[m]: https://www.devuan.org/os/releases | 10:55 |
| gnarface | (Daedalus) | 10:56 |
| gnarface | dunno if it's in the repos yet though | 10:56 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | So a devuan equivalent for bookworm isn't available yet? Do you know what the hold up is? | 10:57 |
| gnarface | it might be there, i don't know for sure | 10:58 |
| gnarface | did you look in the repos? | 10:58 |
| gnarface | i wouldn't know what the hold up is | 10:58 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | gnarface: http://deb.devuan.org/merged/dists/ | 11:04 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | <gnarface> "did you look in the repos?" <- Is it deadalus? http://deb.devuan.org/devuan/dists/daedalus/ | 11:05 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | It is not in the merged bit in the devuan folder | 11:06 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | * It is not in the merged but in the devuan folder | 11:06 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | What is the difference between tose? | 11:10 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | * What is the difference between those? | 11:10 |
| Guest74 | Hi. I was there several hours earlier, asking for help with making an internet connection, while my NetworkManager broke | 11:43 |
| Guest74 | I fallen asleep and my device disconnected. I could read the messages about ifup and ifdown use to do this | 11:44 |
| Guest74 | The last message I could read referenced this | 11:45 |
| Guest74 | https://git.devuan.org/devuan/installer-iso/src/commit/f7b799decc156d1274cabed54b28c87e452aed8c/docs/docs/network-configuration.html | 11:45 |
| Guest74 | So I decided to try setting an "interfaces" file according to | 11:46 |
| Guest74 | Manual single DHCP wireless setup | 11:47 |
| Guest74 | And then I used "ifup wlan0" | 11:47 |
| Guest74 | I got several lines returned by the terminal, with an error message at the end | 11:48 |
| Guest74 | "Warning: /etc/resolv.conf is not a symbolic link to /run/resolvconf/resolv.conf"" | 11:50 |
| Guest74 | What should I do. Did I do something wrong? | 11:50 |
| Guest74 | When I set the "interfaces" file, I wrote in those lines(from Manual single DHCP wireless setup part) and commented out the rest that already was here | 11:53 |
| Guest74 | Should I create such a symbolic link? | 11:54 |
| Guest74 | Sorry. I got disconnected. Did anybody answer? | 12:00 |
| rrq | no answer yet... that error seems odd; maybe resolvconf is installed when it shouldn't? | 12:02 |
| Guest74 | I don't know about this | 12:03 |
| rrq | you know how to check if something is installed? | 12:05 |
| Guest74 | I can with packet manager | 12:06 |
| Guest74 | It says, it is | 12:07 |
| rrq | if it's not something you want then you should purge it | 12:08 |
| rrq | welll, that's my advice | 12:08 |
| Guest74 | So should I purge this? | 12:11 |
| Guest74 | I thought that it is needed as the error somewhat reference this link | 12:12 |
| rrq | yes, resolvconf you would only use oif you regularly want to change which nameservers you use, apart from whatever DHCP gives you | 12:13 |
| rrq | in the normal setup /etc/resolv.conf is a text file | 12:14 |
| Guest74 | So why does the error message mention this link? | 12:14 |
| rrq | well, it was a warning and not error, and it comes I believe from the resolvconf package where it discovers that situation, which is not how it wants it to be | 12:15 |
| rrq | specifically you had its script in /etc/network/if-up.d/ | 12:16 |
| rrq | which gets run bu ifup when the interface in question has been brought up | 12:16 |
| rrq | that's the short answer | 12:16 |
| rrq | bu=by | 12:17 |
| Guest74 | So should I "apt-get purge resolvconf" and then "ifup wlan0" and it should work? | 12:17 |
| rrq | but you don't want that function at all, so purge resolvconf, whereby it removes that/those scripts | 12:17 |
| rrq | maybe; it depends on those other lines you talked about | 12:18 |
| rrq | you will need to do "ifdown --force wlan0" before ifup | 12:18 |
| Guest74 | What lines? How can I set this in "interfaces"? Is it more reliable to use eth0 instead? | 12:19 |
| Guest74 | I will purge and try this, then | 12:20 |
| rrq | 19:48 < Guest74> I got several lines returned by the terminal, with an error message at the end | 12:20 |
| rrq | btw, when dealing with error messages it's always best to address the first ones first, since the subsequent might be consequential | 12:21 |
| Guest74 | After purging it recomends me to reboot | 12:21 |
| rrq | no need; it's not windows, is it? | 12:22 |
| Guest74 | Of course it isn't. It recommends me so, though | 12:22 |
| rrq | :) | 12:22 |
| user____ | Right, the thing that did not work recommends you reboot. Would you do that? | 12:22 |
| user____ | There is no need to reboot for network things in linux. | 12:23 |
| user____ | pgrep -f $thing helps to find out if there are daemons still around | 12:23 |
| Guest74 | Ok, so I will do the ifdown force thing | 12:23 |
| rrq | Guest74: yes... then it is easier to bring up eth0 first | 12:24 |
| user____ | with $thing set to NetworkManager wicd connman and a few other things like dhclient | 12:24 |
| rrq | *instead* of wlan0 | 12:24 |
| user____ | I can't believe this discussion is still going on since yesterday. | 12:24 |
| Guest74 | It is the same day to me | 12:24 |
| user____ | Closing on 24hrs though. | 12:25 |
| Guest74 | It works! | 12:27 |
| Guest74 | Should I just reinstal resolveconf, and NetworkManager, then? | 12:27 |
| rrq | to make it not work again? | 12:28 |
| rrq | now do "ifdown eth0 ; ifup wlan0" | 12:28 |
| Guest74 | It did work before installing connman | 12:28 |
| Guest74 | I would like to return to this state | 12:29 |
| Guest74 | and check, if it works without previous issues(stopped it work from time to time) after I installed additional drivers | 12:30 |
| rrq | ok; then you need to clear out all but the "lo" lines from /etc/network/interfaces ... after "ifdown eth0" | 12:30 |
| Guest74 | rrq, why those commands? | 12:30 |
| Guest74 | I already did "ifup wlan0" | 12:31 |
| rrq | because ifupdown is only allowed to manage "lo" when you want nm to manage the networking | 12:31 |
| Guest74 | After ifdown force, it, I mean | 12:31 |
| rrq | I thought you wanted to use ifupdown and not nm | 12:32 |
| rrq | so "ifdown eth0 ; ifup wlan0" would be for deconfiguring eth0, then trying to configure wlan0 | 12:33 |
| Guest74 | I wanted to use ifdown cause nm was broken | 12:33 |
| Guest74 | Then use packet manager to try to fix this | 12:33 |
| rrq | that's fine; but nm and ifupdown are two (almost) competing methods for managing the networking | 12:34 |
| Guest74 | ifdown eth0 returns "unknown interface eth0" | 12:34 |
| rrq | ok; you said "it works" .. what was working then? wlan0 ? | 12:35 |
| Guest74 | Yes. Wlan0 | 12:36 |
| rrq | ok .. so now it works. why do you need network-manager? | 12:36 |
| Guest74 | After I did ifup wlan0, after ifdown force this | 12:36 |
| rrq | ok .. so now it works. why do you need network-manager? | 12:37 |
| Guest74 | Because now I do not have helpfull gui interface that would allow me to easily set up different wlan connections | 12:38 |
| Guest74 | It is not that I won't need to connect to other wlan networks later | 12:39 |
| rrq | install package wpagui with program wpa_gui | 12:39 |
| rrq | I haven't found a video on it but it's not terribly hard to learn | 12:41 |
| Guest74 | I installed this | 12:42 |
| rrq | main thing is to realize that the wireless connection is like a "virtual cable" between your adapter and the access point | 12:42 |
| Guest74 | Opened this, then it looks blanj, and scanning don't seem to work | 12:42 |
| Guest74 | blank* | 12:43 |
| Guest74 | Adapter, and network are not displayed | 12:44 |
| Guest74 | no options to choose, it is | 12:44 |
| rrq | I'll neeed to shift over to wieless and I can guide you | 12:45 |
| Guest74 | I checked "current status" | 12:45 |
| Guest74 | Status: Could not get status from wpa_supplicant | 12:46 |
| Guest74 | and after this...How do I set VPN with this? | 12:47 |
| fsmithred | it won't scan for me | 12:49 |
| user____ | Permissions on wpa_gui and or wpa_supplicant control socket? | 12:50 |
| fsmithred | 'iwlist wlan0 scan' does work for me, so I know the adaptor is getting a signal. | 12:50 |
| user____ | fsmithred: as root? | 12:51 |
| fsmithred | yes | 12:51 |
| user____ | right, wpa_gui does not run suid. Check that? | 12:51 |
| fsmithred | 'current status' gives me the same message that guest got. | 12:51 |
| user____ | Also scan try from wpa_cli | 12:51 |
| user____ | Users see older read stored state if not privileged | 12:51 |
| fsmithred | Could not connect to wpa_supplicant: (nil) - re-trying | 12:51 |
| user____ | wpa_cli scan is worth a try with sudo... | 12:52 |
| user____ | Try to restart wpa_supplicant. pgrep -f wpa_supplicant says what? | 12:52 |
| user____ | wpa_gui does not start the daemon afaik, it needs starting from /etc/init.d. | 12:53 |
| user____ | wpa_gui does not start the daemon afaik, it needs starting from /etc/init.d/ <- | 12:53 |
| fsmithred | what's the init script called? | 12:53 |
| user____ | Dunno, don't remember | 12:53 |
| fsmithred | nm, there isn't one | 12:54 |
| user____ | https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/wpa_supplicant_gui/ relevant | 12:54 |
| rrq | Guest74: for romaing you'll need to use the "Standard DHCP wireless setup" instruction boxes | 12:54 |
| user____ | last message, pavlushka | 12:55 |
| user____ | https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Wpa_supplicant#Connecting_with_wpa_cli >> fsmithred | 12:55 |
| Guest74 | Can't I have a faster GUI based solution with this? | 12:56 |
| rrq | Guest74: you used "Manual single DHCP wireless setup" ... which is for a manual (=no gui) setup of a single wireless access point | 12:56 |
| user____ | which "this" do you have in mind Guest74 | 12:56 |
| rrq | faster than what? | 12:56 |
| user____ | fsmithred: the article references wpa_cute which is an upgraded wpa_gui | 12:57 |
| Guest74 | ifup ifdown it is. I got it just recommended ro stay with this, if I understand this well | 12:57 |
| user____ | Do not use "this" again Guest74, we are discussing at least 3 different programs, no way to guess what you mean. | 12:58 |
| Guest74 | If si, then how to set this to work, with the similar capabilities through gui. I would like to connect with such to the wlan and lan networks, and to VPNs if possible | 12:59 |
| user____ | tbh, the crap docs and fragmentation in linux ui is starting to seriously piss me off. Additionally, people who actually know how to do things have an attitude when talked to nicely. | 13:00 |
| user____ | Guest74: no more "this" or no more answers. Use a proper noun for "this". Such as "wireless networking" | 13:00 |
| Guest74 | 3 different? Ifdown/ifup is considered as one, yes? Then the second is n-m. What's the third? | 13:01 |
| user____ | connman and or wpa_gui, with wpa_cute it's 5 | 13:01 |
| rrq | no wpa_gui/wpa_cute is for managing the wireless encryption for wpa_supplicant | 13:02 |
| Guest74 | I got rid of connman. I am not referring this anymore, unless mentioning past things I did | 13:02 |
| rrq | Guest74: a roaming setup would be accoring to the "Standard DHCP wireless setup" so you'll need to change to use that | 13:03 |
| Guest74 | Isn't wpa_gui/wpa_cute and ifup/ifdown the same solution, just with gui, and without one? | 13:03 |
| user____ | no | 13:03 |
| rrq | yes | 13:03 |
| user____ | :) | 13:03 |
| user____ | okay, talk to rrq, I'll be quiet | 13:04 |
| user____ | also, why drop connman when there's this? https://man.archlinux.org/man/community/connman/connman-vpn.8.en | 13:04 |
| rrq | Guest74: not the important bit about being in the group that is allowed to talk to wpa_supplicant | 13:05 |
| rrq | not=note | 13:05 |
| rrq | in parenthesis: ifupdown manages the network adapters, and it starts wpa_supplicant for managing the wireless transport encryption; wpa_gui talks to wpa_supplicant telling it which accesspoint and key to use | 13:09 |
| rrq | wpa_gui also operates the adapter to scan for accesspoints | 13:10 |
| rrq | this also goes through wpa_supplicant | 13:11 |
| gnarface | EmanuelLoos[m]: yes, that's it. looks like they're working on it. "devuan" is just the devuan-forked packages, "merged" is the same packages merged with the unchanged debian ones | 13:21 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | So, can I already use the daedalus release in the devuan folder? | 13:24 |
| fsmithred | I don't think we've done any work on daedelus yet, so whatever is in that repo if it exists would be the same as ceres. | 13:25 |
| fsmithred | ceres=sid | 13:25 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | fsmithred: Well, as far as I understand it only packages where no bugs where found in a while make it into testing, right? | 13:27 |
| fsmithred | new versions of packages go into ceres (unstable) and then move into testing after a week. That happens automatically. | 13:28 |
| fsmithred | and for us, chimaera is still testing | 13:29 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | fsmithred: If there are no bugs found in that week, right? | 13:29 |
| fsmithred | correct | 13:30 |
| xrogaan | anybody knows how to find the compiling command for a debian package? | 14:57 |
| xrogaan | like, which option has been enabled | 14:57 |
| gnarface | you can see it in the source package | 15:00 |
| EmanuelLoos[m] | xrogaan: I would start by looking in the Makefile. I suppose you mean a Debian source package. | 15:01 |
| DPA | debian/rules | 15:02 |
| xrogaan | I think this https://github.com/ourway/webfsd simply stole the whole codebase from https://linux.bytesex.org/misc/webfs.html | 15:05 |
| xrogaan | and removed all reference to the original author | 15:05 |
| xrogaan | like https://github.com/ourway/webfsd/commit/dd8e1a5cc2dc6d9a7f42ec036c0d6bfcac7e6a75 | 15:05 |
| xrogaan | was trying to figure out it webfsd was compiled with thread support. | 15:08 |
| Guest1588 | hello! | 15:12 |
| Guest1588 | I see that neovim 0.5.0-1 was released in debian experimental | 15:12 |
| Guest1588 | How do I know when it's coming to devuan experimental? Is there a tracker somewhere? | 15:13 |
| gnarface | pkginfo.devuan.org but i'm not sure if it lists experimental | 15:16 |
| Guest1588 | thanks!! | 15:19 |
| Guest1588 | indeed it doesn't track experimental | 15:19 |
| Guest1588 | I have firefox 91.0-2 from devuan experimental installed | 15:19 |
| Guest1588 | and it's not there | 15:35 |
| rrq | devuan doesn't merge debian's experimental, but has it's own | 15:40 |
| rrq | doesn't help you | 15:41 |
| rrq | you may need to add debian's experimental sources.list point and install from there | 15:42 |
| Guest1588 | right, I might do just that, and I didn't know that devuan doesn't merge debian's experimental, thank you | 15:46 |
| brocashelm | you can tell a repo is merged or devuan's by the /merged or /devuan after the url | 15:48 |
| brocashelm | but experimental is the only one that's not merged and devuan's experimental just has some misc stuff like the icon themes iirc | 15:49 |
| Guest1588 | "you can tell a repo is merged or devuan's by the /merged or /devuan after the url" this really answers a lot of questions! thank you | 16:07 |
| golinux | gnarface: For future reference . . . Daedalus will appear sometime after Chimaera is officially released. | 17:36 |
| golinux | EmanuelLoos[m]: ^ ^ ^ | 17:37 |
| Vall | Hello everyone | 20:29 |
| Vall | My first connect since the sh!tstorm over there at Freenode, of which I was blissfully unaware until now ;-) | 20:30 |
| Vall | Anyway, I need some info on how well (if at all) KVM/QEMU is running on Devuan ARM64, specially on the Raspberry Pi4. Can anyone help? | 20:30 |
| Vall | I'm about to make a major (for me) hardware investment, and want to check whether what I want to do is viable/doable/stable | 20:34 |
| fsmithred | Vall, I'm pretty sure there's a #devuan-arm channel. Maybe check there. | 20:35 |
| Vall | Ah! | 20:35 |
| Vall | Thanks fsmithred, I wasn't aware | 20:35 |
| Vall | Will go there | 20:35 |
| fsmithred | athough tuxdev does come in here sometimes | 20:35 |
| fsmithred | also in -offtopic | 20:35 |
| Vall | fsmithred: does it make sense in -offtopic? I don't think it's so much off... | 20:36 |
| fsmithred | no, it doesn't | 20:37 |
| Vall | Hehehe | 20:37 |
| Vall | OK ;-) | 20:37 |
| Walex | Vall: "how well (if at all) KVM/QEMU is running on Devuan ARM64, specially on the Raspberry Pi4" is not really a Devuan issue, it is a KVM-on-ARM64 issue. The distros just support what the kernels support. | 22:28 |
| Vall | Walex: well, there's the matter that the kernel must have compiled-in support, and also the matter of the exact KVM/QEMU versions that are in the repos, etc. | 22:53 |
| Vall | All of that wouldbe distro specific. | 22:54 |
| vvande | What's the best way to install on a non-UEFI computer. | 23:32 |
| vvande | I had Devuan 1 on the machine, but I'm changing the HDD and wanting to upgrade to 3.1 | 23:33 |
| vvande | I've been trying to boot from a netinstall iso on a USB stick, but realized it's not working because of the EFI requirement. | 23:35 |
| vvande | 23:35 | |
| Vall | vvande: if you have good internet connectivity, I would use the netboot install | 23:35 |
| vvande | thanks | 23:35 |
| vvande | I've never tried that. | 23:35 |
| vvande | internet is not too bad (3.6mpbs) but if it takes a while, so be it. It's gotta get done. :) | 23:36 |
| Vall | works great for me. You just need PXE on the card, and a PXE server: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Netboot | 23:36 |
| Vall | No worries re: UEFI, etc | 23:36 |
| Vall | Most network cards nowadays have PXE | 23:37 |
| vvande | "PXE on the card" ? | 23:37 |
| Vall | Yep | 23:37 |
| vvande | on board network card | 23:37 |
| Vall | Ok | 23:37 |
| vvande | I'll check what it says in the BIOS> | 23:37 |
| Vall | So enable PXE on the BIOS configuration screen | 23:37 |
| Vall | exactly :-) | 23:37 |
| vvande | gotcha | 23:37 |
| Vall | PXE is super-practical | 23:38 |
| vvande | Intel D915G motherboard. Quite old, but I want to use that in this case. | 23:38 |
| Vall | Olde but goode ;-) | 23:38 |
| Vall | I'm quite a fan of Intel mobos | 23:38 |
| Vall | It will certainly have PXE available | 23:38 |
| vvande | yes, I'm using it because it's the last one without the Intel Managent Engine. | 23:39 |
| vvande | OK, thanks for your help Vall | 23:39 |
| Vall | No worries mate, and good luck | 23:39 |
| vvande | I'm going to look at the BIOS now. | 23:39 |
| vvande | :) | 23:39 |
| vvande | 23:39 | |
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