libera/#devuan/ Monday, 2021-12-27

joergrC3 starts. https://streaming.media.ccc.de/rc3/relive12:33
plasmoduckHi, is there a Devuan persistant live usb I can use?14:23
onefangfsmithred makes Refracta for that sort of thing, but any of the Devuan live ISO images should be able to run from USB.  https://refracta.org/14:35
plasmoduckYes I know the images can run from usb, but I'm asking are they presistant? As in if I write to it/make changes will my files/changes still be there after boot?14:36
onefangHave a look at Refracta.  Or just install normal Devuan on USB, that's easy enough to do.14:40
onefangI have a MicroSD card with more than 20 Linux distros installed on it, and a MicroSD to USB converter.  I call it Magic Pixie Dust.14:41
plasmoduckonefang: I am not installing it on anything! lol14:45
plasmoduckI just spent the last 3 hours fixing my FreeBSD drive.14:45
onefangI meant install it ON the USB stick.  But look at Refracta, it might be what you want.14:47
plasmoduckearlier tonight I decided to install Devuan to an external usb hdd. Apparently it wrote some files to my internal FreeBSD drive efi partition and decided that would be a nice place to install Grub. So when I disconnected the external drived to tried to boot into FreeBSD again, I was greeted with the Grub shell/prompt which cold not find/boot anything.14:48
Hunter[m]I feel your pain. FreeBSD file systems are not friendly to anything else. Especially if you used ZFS like me15:01
Hunter[m]I had to wipefs -f -a to remove the signature when I switched to Linux15:03
Kingsywoohooo just migrated my first machine to devuan to test it out! everything is lovely so far.15:03
Kingsyhow does ifupdown work? it seems tobind wpa_suppllcant and dhcpcd together??15:04
onefangYeah the BSDs are not on my Magic Pixie Dust, coz they can't live on a Linux friendly disk partition system.15:05
Hunter[m]Im glad to just be using what works again, I hopped around for a good bit15:16
Hunter[m]Particularly I had trouble with apt15:16
Hunter[m]But I just need to research it more15:16
plasmoduckHunter[m]: yes I am using ZFS15:21
plasmoduckI fixed my problem thought15:22
plasmoduckI just rm -rf /boot/efi/efi/debian15:22
plasmoduckand rebooted back into FreeBSD15:22
fsmithredplasmoduck,  https://refracta.org/docs/readme.refracta2usb.txt15:38
fsmithredhttps://sourceforge.net/projects/refracta/files/tools/refracta2usb-2.4.3.deb15:38
Kingsyanyone in here run wayland along with prime-run with a intel/nvidia setup?15:46
Kingsyanyone in here use lutris? if so what vulkan packages do I need? do I NEED to add a ppa ?16:41
Guest2Hi everyone. I'm here today because my father suddenly passed away. I can't get my hands on the password and I really need to access it and I wanted to know if there's anyway to bypass it or start from zero without deleting the content in it. I'm not a computer engineer, Idk what to do.18:45
rwpHello Guest2.  What type of computer is this?  Is it a laptop or a desktop?18:49
Guest2Hi! Laptop18:50
rwpCan it boot from a bootable USB stick?18:50
rwpIf so then download the installation ISO, copy it to the USB stick, boot it, then use it to set a new password that you know.18:50
Guest2I'm not sure, I've heard him talking about that a few times. To boot from a USB do I just insert the usb at launch and will be asked if I want to boot from USB or do I have to go somewhere, like in a menu or something?18:51
rwpGuest2, I searched around a little and this recipe here looks reasonable too.  https://blog.eldernode.com/reset-forgotten-debian-linux-password/18:51
Guest2Awesome thank you very much, I'll try it and get back to you18:52
rwpThis is something that is relatively easy to do for someone who is comfortable with the system.  But if you are unfamiliar then it's just confusing.18:54
rwpI am also assuming that full disk encryption is not being used.  If the disk is encrypted...  Then there is no possibility of this type of recovery.18:55
Guest2I'm totally unfamiliar but gonna give it my best shot, it's really important to me18:55
Guest2Oh I see... He was very focused on security so I'm guessing that's the case18:55
rwpIt's always best to have someone knowledgeable being able to see the screen and react.  So if you can't figure it out then look for a local person to help you out with it.18:57
rwpLocal user groups are in almost every area and people are always happy to help out.18:57
Guest2I will, it's indeed complicated. Well thanks a lot anyways for giving me some leads, really appreciate it!18:59
rwpWhen it boots up what type of a password asker is asking the question for a password?  Graphical?  Character based?19:04
Guest2It says "Please unlock disk sda5_crypt" if that's the question?19:05
rwpYes.  That was the question.19:10
rwpAnd I am sad to say that sda5_crypt is an encrypted disk partition.19:10
rwpWhich means that I do not think any recovery or password reset will be possible.  Unless you know the encryption passphrase for it.19:11
rwpBut you should definitely see if you can get a local person to look at the system hands on.19:12
Kingsyanyone seen this before -> nvidia-persistenced failed to initialize. Check syslog for more details.19:19
Kingsycoming from apt after installing nvidia-driver.19:20
rwpNot I.  But searching the web shows other people hitting it.  Is this the proprietary driver?19:21
Kingsyyeah19:21
KingsyI havent found a way around it yet.19:21
rwpHave you tried the suggested nvidia-smi fixes?19:22
rwpOf course I can't recommend the proprietary driver.  I have used it in the long past.  But have avoided it in recent years.19:22
Kingsyyeah, you mean going root, nvidia-smi -p ermmm I cant remember what else.19:22
rwpThat's what the wisdom of the web was suggesting.19:23
Kingsyrwp: yeah I don't have a choice. performance is just terrible with nouveau19:23
rwpUp until earlier this year 2021 I was using nouveau but then in the daily Sid kernel it broke and eventually I gave up, pulled the nvidia cards out, replaced them with an AMD Radeon.19:24
rwpNow using the in-kernel mainstream radeon driver.  No problems.19:24
Kingsyisnt the performance on that lacking too? or am I wrong?19:24
Kingsybut yeah. I don't have the luxury of siwtching cards right onw19:25
rwpYMMV.  I have the flexibility of having a lot of random hardware around my cave.19:25
Guest2Yes I figured "crypt" wasn't good. I'm gonna find a local and see if something can be done. Also gonna search the whole house to see if I can get my hands on the password. Thanks a lot man!19:25
rwpGuest2, I am sorry for your loss.  Good luck!19:26
Guest2Thank you!19:26
rwpGuest2, If it were me I would look to see if there is any backup of the system.19:27
rwpIf so then the backup might not be encrypted.  Or might have a different passphrase that you can find.  Don't know.  Just an idea.19:27
Guest2He did have a lot of USBs, I'm gonna check them out. I think I heard him talk about that a few times.19:29
Kingsyok I think I solved it by stoppng the daemon then running the apt command.19:32
Kingsyerorr has gone now.19:32
rwpI assume that running apt means applying system upgrades?  If so then yes possibly some dependent library was upgraded to a more compatible version.19:37
Guest2I found something called Devuan_beowulf on a USB. There are some files labeled "boot." Seems it was created on December 6th.19:37
rwpGuest2, That is very likely an OS installation image.19:38
Guest2So not good, because I need a backup right?19:39
rwpRight.  That would not be a backup.  That would be a new system installation image.19:39
Guest2Alright I see, gonna keep looking.19:39
rwpThis is motivating me that I have postponed digging some photos off my mom's computer and moving them to my own disk.  I shouldn't put that off forever.19:40
critri one unforseeable instant it could be lost forever.19:41
Guest2Oh yeah do it ASAP, we never know what could happen. Especially if it's easy to do. Postponing leads to regrets more often than not19:41
Kingsyanyone using runit with devuan?19:43
rwpYes...  Well...  My mom passed away in 2010.  But I still have the Windows XP hard drive mothballed here.  At the time I just couldn't dig through it.  But I would like to get the photos off of it.19:43
rwpGuest2, If your father had the install image from Dec 6th then maybe he re-installed the laptop around that time too.  Not sure what else it would be useful for.  Which would mean that maybe there isn't much other than fresh system on the laptop now anyway.  Don't know.  Just guessing.19:46
Guest2I understand. Losing a parent/child or very close friend is the hardest thing in the world. Digging through his stuff is killing me but if I sleep on it and end up losing it forever I'll hate myself. Don't wanna push you in doing something you'll regret though, you know yourself far better than I do but give it a thought.19:47
Guest2Yeah he reinstalled very frequently, I think it's because he had lost access to his password. I'm just gonna keep close everything that could be useful and see if I can find a local to help. These situations are for sure hard to resolve when you're not in front of the computer.19:48
critrrwp, i understand completely. maybe just doing it without looking at them would be easiest.19:48
Guest2What does a backup look like? What should I be looking for? Any specific name or file type?19:49
fanderalGuest2: posting in the Devuan forums might get some answers. FWIW, searching 'linux how to disable encrypted hdd' found results.20:03
Guest2I tried to but got considered as spam, failed to answer the question to register. Thanks gonna take a look.20:06
golinuxGuest2: I have pm'd you20:47
sedroskenHave you attempted to guess the password? Typically a bad idea but I don't recall any sort of "timebomb" nuking the disk if you get it wrong so many times. Might be worth attempting, maybe it's something related to his children, my dad always used something related to one of our birthdays or such as a password, ill advised as that is21:41
sedroskennow granted the "timebomb" might be an option you can specify and he may have been that security-focused, so I hesitate to recommend it outright21:43
Guest2I tried a few and got scared of attempts. He used complicated passwords. I still have a few more to try. I already got 5 failed attempts, it told me that I had reached the limit but when I rebooted I could try again21:44
rwpAs far as I know that is rate limiting of password guesses only.  There is no self-destruct or hard-locking as far as I know.21:51
rwpHowever it is a passphrase at that point.  Can be anything.  Can be very long.  So...  Seems unlikely it could be guess.  But don't know.21:52
rwpIt's also a high security algorithm.  Not something that can be cracked.  At least not without large agent resources.21:53
Guest2That's for sure, he was very rigorous when it comes to security. He spent a lot of time on it so it's not gonna be a walk in the park.21:55
Guest2In his notebook he wrote "Grub" with a passphrase. I saw that term while doing research on devuan. There is also "Root" with a what seems to be a passphrase as well.21:57
fsmithredgrub is the bootloader, so that might be the first password to give21:57
Guest2Alright I'm gonna give it a shot21:58
fsmithredand the other is the admin password21:58
rwpRoot is the system superuser account.  Think of that as the Windows Admin user.21:58
Guest2Yeah I see21:58
rwpGRUB is the boot loader code.  GRand Unified Boot loader.22:00
rwpSince you already saw that "Please unlock disk sda5_crypt" prompt I think that would be past what would be the GRUB password.22:00
rwpWhich encourages me that the GRUB password is likely the sda5_crypt passphrase.22:00
Guest2Didn't work, it's probably an old one given how frequently he changed everything. Looking for other Grub passwords.22:04
fsmithredlinux passwords are case-sensitive22:05
Guest2I figured, I typed everything as it was written in his notebook, I included capital letters when necessary22:07
aitorfsmithred, i think it's possible to remove any user's password once you have access to the partition containing /etc (usually sda1) from a live CD22:34
fsmithredaitor, the system is encrypted.22:36
aitorok22:36
fsmithrednormally, I would just do init=/bin/bash to set the root password22:37
Guest2I'm gonna call it a day, I looked everywhere pretty sure the password is lost but I'm tired and may have missed it. I'll keep looking, post on the forum and if no solution try to see if someone in my area is available to try and fix the situation. Thanks again for your help everyone, really appreciate it. Helps a lot to have people you've never22:42
Guest2even talked to help out like that. I'll be back tomorrow, see yall!22:42
fsmithredgood luck22:48
Kingsygot a strange issue. ifI close my laptop lid then open it again it seems like my machine is asleep and I cant wait it back up. if I press the power button I can see that X closes and I get some info the terminal about things shutting down. anyone seen this before?22:53
systemdleteI just installed chimaera 32 bit (netinstall) on an older model mainboard/cpu -- this is a XP-M processor.  I took all the defaults during the install, except that I did do a little bit of partitioning, separate swap partition.22:55
systemdleteAnyway, the problem is that xfce does not display a mouse pointer.22:55
systemdleteAlso, I get tons of nouveau bus errors right on the console, so I know something is wrong.22:55
systemdleteThe video is connected to a PCI card, not the board's video.22:56
systemdleteIt's an NVidIA NV18 GeForce4 MX 440 AGP(!) (and it still works :D gee it's so good to have old hardware around sometimes...)22:56
systemdleteI can see that the mouse itself works, because if I move it around I see the controls being highlighted (focused) and I can even manipluate the menus a little bit.22:57
systemdletethe xorg nouveau driver is installed, btw.  That was by the installer.22:58
systemdleteIt's a test box, so we can play around with it if needed.22:59
systemdleteShould I try the nvidia drivers instead?   Please tell me which packages I will neeed -- I always forget this.22:59
systemdleteOr should we try to get the nouveau software to work.23:00
systemdletebtw, I've noticed intermittent errors about firmware not being able to get loaded.23:00
systemdletegnarface, if you are lurking... you seem to know a lot about this23:02
systemdleteforgot to mention.  Also see message on every boot re EDAC amd64 not supported on 32 bit systems23:11
systemdlete(yeah, that's a lot... but hopefully all these bits of info might help produce a solution)23:11
aitornouveau is the driver,yes23:14
aitori've just read a thread in spanish in the forum of linuxmint, and it should work23:17
aitorhttps://forums.linuxmint.com/viewtopic.php?t=20898923:17
aitorand it's a 32 bit system23:17
aitorthe maintenance of this graphics card is discontinued23:19
systemdletemy spanish... is... eh... not so good?23:20
systemdletegoogle translate?23:20
systemdleteor perhaps you can tell me what I need to do here?23:21
systemdleteI mean, yes, it does work.  Nominally.  It's functional.  but a pain without the mouse pointer23:21
systemdleteaitor: I'm thinking maybe I need to block some option on the boot line?23:22
systemdlete(just not sure what)23:23
aitorbasically, the user got the nouveau driver after an update to linux mint 1723:23
aitorthe user did one change in the grub entry23:24
systemdletegoogle translate worked for me, actually.  Heheheh23:24
aitorreplacing "quiet splash" by "nouveau.noaccel=1"23:25
systemdleteah!23:25
systemdletethank you. That was what I was looking for.  I will try it now.23:25
aitorhe also ran inxi -Fxn to know his processor (AMD)23:29
aitorNote: he just updated his mint 13, but he didn't upgrade to mint 1723:30
systemdleteaitor:  THAT DID IT!  I got my mouse pointer back.23:37
systemdletethanks23:37
systemdleteI guess it is helpful to know spanish.23:37
aitorgood!23:38
systemdleteAlso, some of the ugly messages have gone away also, like the bus error.  But a new message shows up, but it is much quieter now.23:38
systemdleteLess messages.23:38
systemdleteThere was no "splash" on the boot line, just "quiet" -- i removed the quiet and replaced it with what you/the post sugggested23:39
systemdleteOne thing though.  I was unable to edit or even interrupt the boot countdown during grub.23:39
gnarfacesystemdlete: sorry didn't read the whole scrollback but i suspect you want to run the non-free nvidia-legacy drivers for that card23:39
gnarfaceoh, disabling hardware accel in nouveau is a good trick if that worked too23:39
systemdletegnarface:  I think aitor may have solved this forme23:39
systemdleteyes23:39
gnarfaceyea, just saw that23:39
systemdletesorry to bug you my friend.  Have a happy holiday23:39
gnarfaceit's unlikely acceleration is functioning usefully for this card in nouveau anyway but ymmv on stuff that needs opengl23:40
gnarfacehappy holidays to you too23:40
systemdletethanks23:40
systemdleteand a very very merry to aitor!23:40
Kingsycan anyone think of a reason why I need to run /etc/init.d/neworking stop then start again on each boot to get a networking connection established?23:40
Kingsythe stop part takes AGES too. like a good minute.23:40
aitorsystemdlete, then... can i sleep peacefully tonight?23:41
systemdleteas peacefully as you like aitor.  AFAIC, you have earned some deep rest.23:41
aitorlol, bye :)23:42
systemdletethanks much, again and again23:42
* systemdlete will def add this to his notes in elog...23:42
aitorsee you tomorrow, bye23:42
gnarfaceKingsy: can be a anything from dns misconfiguration to impending power supply failure23:43
systemdletedoes anyone know why I can't interrupt grub to edit the command line and other things?  I'm wondering if it has something to do with my kvms (kb-vid-mouse switch)23:43
gnarfaceKingsy: need some more data points23:43
Kingsygnarface: how can I get more data on this>23:43
gnarfacesystemdlete: the key is "e" if i recall23:44
gnarfacesystemdlete: but auto-boot should stop the moment you press any key at all23:44
systemdletedid that, gnarface.  Didn't work.  Neither did the space bar23:44
gnarfacesystemdlete: i think if the grub timeout is 0 you can't interrupt it23:44
systemdletethis is chimaera, btw23:44
systemdleteoh!23:44
systemdletethe timeout is about 4 seconds, iirc23:44
systemdletewhatever the default install does23:45
gnarfacethat should be plenty to see it start counting down (default is 5 i think)23:45
systemdletesounds about right23:45
gnarfaceKingsy: well, you probably have all the data already, you just need to deliver the appropriate parts of it23:45
systemdleteMy setup is that the k,v, and m go through an electronic kvm switch.  I am wondering if this old hardware is smart enough to recognize usb that early in the boot?23:46
Kingsyhehe probably. I am looking in the syslog now but I cant see anything that jumps out23:46
gnarfaceKingsy: for starters, are you using DHCP?  are you using a graphical network configuration tool (which one?)23:46
Kingsygnarface: sorry! of course. I am using dhcp. I am using ifupdown, no graphical config tool23:47
gnarfaceKingsy: if it's wireless,  that also tends to have a lot more potential for problems23:47
systemdleteKingsy:  Make sure you are not running both networkmanager AND the networking service -- I've had coordination nightmares with that combo in the past.23:47
Kingsygnarface: yeah its wireless23:47
Kingsynaaa I didnt install network manager.23:47
systemdleteAlso, double-check the time set on your system -- if it is far off from the rest of the network that might create problems also23:47
systemdleteKingsy, wicd?23:48
Kingsyno. just ifupdown. I added the following to /etc/network/interfaces.23:48
systemdleteok23:48
systemdletejust checking23:48
gnarfaceKingsy: if there's a 60 second pause somewhere in the boot-up process or network start-up process too, there's the possibility of a misconfiguration in ip or hostname stuff23:48
Kingsyits not on the boot process. what happens is23:48
Kingsyit boots perfect.23:48
Kingsybut when I get to a prompt I don't have an internet connection23:48
gnarfaceKingsy: oh, yea the time thing is important now; you have to be well less than within 5 minutes of the correct time for lots of basic dns and ssl encryption to work right now23:49
Kingsyif I do /etc/init.d/networking stop, then I need to wait for down state for 60 seconds or so23:49
Kingsythe start after that is quite fast and I get a connection23:49
gnarfacedoes it stay connected?23:49
Kingsyyep its perfect.23:49
systemdletebut is the time sync'd to ntp time?23:49
KingsyI havent installed ntp23:49
Kingsyso probably not.23:49
systemdletehmmmm.23:50
gnarfacei'd install ntpdate and do a 1-time sync then test the reboot again23:50
systemdletecan you connect to other local computers in your lan?23:50
gnarfaceKingsy:  ntpdate pool.ntp.org && hwclock --systohc23:50
Kingsyalright I can try that.23:50
gnarfaceKingsy: (just to rule out the possible time issue)23:50
Kingsysystemdlete: yeah its connected to the networking just fine. its just getting the connection requires a stop and start of the networking service.23:50
gnarfaceyea, if you have other computers to test against that wifi device, make sure they're not exhibiting similar behavior23:51
Kingsygnarface: they don't, other machines can connect to the same wifi connection just fine/23:51
systemdletebad wifi card?23:51
KingsyI don't think so either. it was fine on void linux earlier today until I moved to devuan23:52
gnarfacei'm having wifi issues in chimaera too, i'm not convinced they're hardware related but they do also look hardware or at least power-supply related23:52
systemdleteinteresting, ok23:52
gnarfacealso, i don't typically use wifi for anything so this might have been going on a while23:52
systemdleteKingsy, have you tried installing beowulf for contrast?23:52
systemdleteI mean if you have time and a spare partition and most of all, patience23:53
golinuxIt's a lack of wicd issue.  :)23:53
systemdletenot trying to make you do even more work, but I just thought it might be revealing.23:53
systemdleteI haven't tried wifi with chimaera on my laptop yet.23:53
systemdleteMostly because my AP is not working atm.23:54
Kingsyok that didnt work.23:54
gnarfacei'm trying to set up an AP so i'm having to debug this from both ends23:54
Kingsylet me show you what I had to do to get it working23:54
systemdletein fact, that's why I'm here.  I'm trying to get this testbox up and working so I can try openwrt on it.  But first, I want to make sure a more nominal setup like devuan works on it.23:55
gnarfacewait a second Kingsy, in your /etc/network/interfaces file, are you using "auto wlan0" or "allow-hotplug wlan0" ?23:55
Kingsyhttps://bpa.st/JJFQ <- so when I booted the wlan0 interface was down. you can see I tried to start it first. then I stopped it. then started again and the connection was established. the stop took around 30 secs to a minute.23:55
gnarfaceKingsy: some hardware behaves better with "auto" even though the new upstream defaults have changed to "allow-hotplug"23:55
Kingsyyes allow-hotplug wlan023:56
Kingsyand23:56
gnarfaceKingsy: uh, also please use paste.debian.net or just /msg me the pastes if you want me to look at them; i'm paranoid23:56
Kingsyiface wlan0 inet dhcp23:56
Kingsyahh ok moment23:56
gnarfaceyea, try changing auto to allow-hotplug and reboot.  save the paste for after if that doesn't work23:56
Kingsygnarface: http://paste.debian.net/122496623:57
Kingsyah ok sorry23:57
gnarfacethe last wifi device i can remember actually liking was a lucent/orinoco gold card pcmcia23:57
systemdleteok, thanks to all.  aitor, gnarface, the whole crew.  You guys are just great.  Always helpful and FRIENDLY about being helpful.  Unlike some other channels out there.23:57
Kingsygnarface: sorry, what auto?  my interfaces contains -> allow-hotplug wlan0 <- and iface wlan0 inet dhcp <- on the next line, followed by the ssid and psk23:58
gnarfaceKingsy: replace "allow-hotplug wlan0" with "auto wlan0"23:59
Kingsydone, gonna reboot. moment23:59
gnarfaceKingsy: i even have non-wireless network devices that fail to come up right at boot with "allow-hotplug"23:59

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