libera/#devuan/ Tuesday, 2022-06-14

ManisHi. Not sure if that's the right place to ask, but is there any chance that there will be new netboot images soon? The current ones don't work anymore because d-i can't find the kernel modules for the old kernel (5.10.0-9) on the mirror.00:48
fsmithredas a guess, I'd say maybe a week or two before it's done00:52
jjakobManis: that's what I was just asking right before you came in :)01:54
jjakobso I guess other people use these things and not just me01:54
jjakobthe mini.iso also doesn't work - I'll try netinstall iso tomorrow01:55
arkhohi all03:18
jjakobhi03:34
brocashelmso, is dev1galaxy.org down?04:00
brocashelmsame as devuan.org (updates are not going through)04:00
golinuxbrocashelm: Being worked on atm04:05
rrqbrocashelm: could you pm me an IP address to followup?04:13
brocashelmrrq: let me try again and i will04:15
brocashelmok, looks like it loads now04:15
brocashelmi turned off my vpn and it loaded after (since my last messages)04:15
brocashelmi just thought you banned my ip addresses04:16
rrqmight have happened while schooling the sentry; it was a bit over-eager for a while04:17
brocashelmit's working fine now04:19
brocashelmthanks04:19
Manis@jjakob: That's one of the disadvantages of IRC, no scroll back when you join :-) But it's good to see that I'm not alone using netboot, the best way to install De*an (virt-install + preeseed = profit).08:19
ManisBut "a week or two" doesn't sound very reassuring to me :-/08:20
ManisIs there something like snapshot.debian.org for Devuan?08:21
DrongoHi there11:52
DrongoNot a great TZ for IRC. Might try later.12:05
used____Drongo it's a great TZ for IRC here, 1300 hours, sunny, birds chirping. Europe.12:06
ManisDrongo, don't wait to ask. Just post your question and if someone has an answer they will respond when they see it.13:10
jjakobManis: he left13:21
ManisTrue, didn't notice ;-)13:22
ham5urg_Does netinstall has a ssh-server into which root can login? For remote installations.13:58
Kittybash: man: command not found14:03
Kittyerm, any idea what package I've removed by mistake ?14:03
djphKitty: "man-db" , I think14:04
Kittyperfect, thanks14:06
Kittywonder how I uninstalled htat...14:06
djphno idea, maybe oops'd with a dependency?14:07
jjakobprobably by removing the metapackage that depended on it, it was removed as a not needed dependency14:09
Kittyham5urg_: yes, if you select it as an option when tasksel runs.14:14
jjakobdoes devuan BTS accept pseudo-package installation-reports like debian?14:39
jjakobor: what package do I report the netinst.tar.gz or mini.iso bug?14:40
jjakoblooks like it does https://bugs.devuan.org/cgi/pkgreport.cgi?package=installation-reports14:41
ham5urg_I've tried to boot devuan_minimal.iso with virt-manager inside an UEFI vm but failed (tried cdrom as SATA, SCSI, USB). Is devuan_minimal uefi-bootable?14:57
fsmithredham5urg_, you mean the minimal-live iso?14:59
ham5urg_fsmithred, yes.14:59
fsmithredif forget if that one does, but gimme a few seconds and I'll check.15:00
fsmithredyes, it should15:00
ham5urg_thanks15:01
fsmithredand it's booting now in qemu15:01
fsmithredI had to add some bios thingy for it to work15:01
fsmithredham5urg_, ...15:03
fsmithredovmf - UEFI firmware for 64-bit x86 virtual machines15:03
fsmithredovmf-ia32 - UEFI firmware for 32-bit x86 virtual machines15:03
ham5urg_fsmithred, I choosed without success, UEFI x86_64: /usr/share/OVMF/OVMF_CODE_4M.ms.fd15:06
fsmithred-bios /usr/share/ovmf/OVMF.fd15:07
fsmithredyou're running chimaera?15:07
fsmithredoh right, you're in a gui.15:08
fsmithreddoes the gui have the right path to the file?15:08
ham5urg_yes.15:08
ham5urg_daedalus, both the host and the iso15:09
fsmithredqemu-system-x86_64 -name devuan_chimaera_4.0.0_amd64_minimal-live.iso -enable-kvm -bios /usr/share/ovmf/OVMF.fd -m 768 -cdrom devuan_chimaera_4.0.0_amd64_minimal-live.iso15:09
ham5urg_aha, I try15:09
fsmithredthe daedalus iso should boot uefi, but I just tried it and it failed15:12
ham5urg_At least it's reproducible.15:14
fsmithredlol, yeah15:14
fsmithredI hate it when the bugs don't stand still.15:14
KittyDear Golinux, fix your network15:53
Kittyin modern linux, where's the place to put organisation specific scripts? I used to use /usr/local/sbin but that seems to not exist16:05
djphI'd use something under the /usr/local hierarchy for "site-local" stuff16:07
Kittyyeah, that's what I thought16:08
Kittythe flattened /usr thing is confusing me16:08
djphyeah, it's (IMO) dumb16:08
Manis-> hier(7)16:11
ManisI use /usr/local/bin. FHS says /usr/local/sbin is for "locally installed programs for system administration", but I find that strange because historically sbin are statically linked binaries used for booting.16:14
ManisYou should not need site-local statically linked binaries for booting.16:14
djphManis: FHS doesn't say sbin is static, but maybe I missed the note / caveat / etc.16:23
Manisdjph, no FHS doesn't say that, I wrote "historically sbin are statically linked binaries". But this meaning is probably long gone.16:25
ManisBut what does the s stand for in the modern age? system?16:25
ManisIt's certainly not static anymore `file /sbin/*` lists only dynamically linked binaries…16:26
djphManis: yeah, "system" ... mostly looks to be stuff that's necessary to boot, but that a normal user (incl. system users) would not be running16:27
ManisNot sure. I have /usr/sbin/sendmail, but all sorts of users run sendmail.16:29
djphyeah well, "/usr" makes a mess of what "/bin" and "/sbin" used to hold17:18
Kittylast week I mentioned I needed to unbind and then rebind to a new driver one of my ethernet ports17:19
KittyI have a script that is executed on pre-up for device lo17:19
Kittyand it works17:19
ManisWhat do you mean "rebind a new driver"?17:21
Kittyso unbind from i40e, and then bind it to vfio-pci17:22
Kittyhttps://lettieri.iet.unipi.it/virtualization/2017/vn09.pdf17:22
ManisHmm, this sounds like a job for udev to me.17:24
Manisor rc.local.17:24
Kittyyeah, udev doesn't do it17:28
Kittywe had a discussion abut it last week17:28
joergaiui /sbin and /bin are for stuff needed to boot up, where sbin is for programs fund under man section 8 aka "needs root permissions". Stuff under /usr/(s)bin was explicitly meant to net mandatory available at early boot time, until systemd and Poettering messed that up17:30
joergs/fund/found/17:30
Kittyyeah, it's got very messy and17:30
Kittyyes, Poettering should have all keyboard priviledges revoked17:31
ltsA stop job is running17:33
ltsSorry for any PTSD attacks17:34
jjakobsome distributions bash completion won't complete binaries from sbin if the user is not root17:35
jjakobso only root will get autocompletion of sbin17:35
joergperfectly sane17:36
joergas I said above, I think generally binaries in sbin need root permissions17:36
Kittyyeah, that's fine17:37
joergand you're not supposed to have the sbin dirs in your $PATH as non-privileged user17:37
joergwhich might suck when using sudo17:38
rwpBy default sudo uses secure_path="/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/sbin:/usr/bin:/sbin:/bin" so adds /sbin /usr/sbin /usr/local/sbin to PATH automatically.17:47
rwpIt's somewhat of a hint that you don't find system executables on path if you are not superuser.17:47
rwpBut instead it often confuses people that they try to run something that needs root but forgot to use sudo (or su) to become root.17:47
rwpAnd then the command is not foudn.17:48
rwpThe use of /usr/local in Devuan/Debian is really up to the local admin to control in almost all ways.17:48
joerg>><rwp> By default sudo uses...<< so does my bash completion17:49
rwpbash completion is pretty fancy and the result is very clever, I don't always load it though17:49
rwpA few years back the secure_path thing was added to sudo and people who did not track that change to sudoers ended up without those paths added.  Causing trouble.17:50
rwpIt was really a downstream Debian packaging issue and not an upstream sudo issue.17:51
joergI discussed that topic yesterday, my bash completion freezes the shell when i do a `ssh server-decommissioned-found-in-sshconfig:<TAB> `17:51
joergoops17:51
joergI discussed that topic yesterday, my bash completion freezes the shell when i do a `scp server-decommissioned-found-in-sshconfig:<TAB> `17:51
rwpI have been disconnected from the Internet and offline from the 3rd through the 13th.  Longest I have been away from the world in a long time.17:51
joergfor a timespan until the completion trying to connect via ssh to the server times out17:52
joergbash completion must be in the top 10 rank of cutest *nix things ever17:54
fsmithredit's one of my favorite features.17:55
joergvyata made a whole UI based on it17:55
joerg(EdgeRouter CLI)17:55
fsmithredI'm having a hard time visualizing that.17:56
fsmithredis that like windows is now? Can't find the menu so you have to start typing whatever you want in the search box.17:57
joergby the comand "config" you basically just change the completion database17:57
joergat least that's what it looks like to the user17:57
joergit's the router's ssh interface17:58
Kittyugh, who thought the best way to do config of vim was to hide it in /usr/share/vim/vim82/default.vim17:58
fsmithredso it's keyboard oriented but relies on remembering the name of what you want instead of the name and the special key combination?17:58
Kittycos it's not considered a conf file, so gets overwritten by apt17:58
Kittyand it seems to get precident over /etc/vim/vimrc17:59
fsmithredyikes17:59
Kittyyeah17:59
fsmithredKitty, all was fine until that last one.17:59
joergfsmithred: only thing to remember is <TAB><TAB> ;-)17:59
Kittyinsearch on by default17:59
Kittyand breaking middle click mouse paste are so so so so so so so infuriating18:00
fsmithredafk for a little while18:00
Kittyyeah, I had to go have a lay down when I discovered this stupidity too...18:00
joergthat sounds ... STUPID18:12
Kittyyes very18:18
Kittyalso argh, hit wrong button and forgot to install grub18:18
Kittyhmm, rescue mode does not work well if you are using encryption18:20
joergouch18:24
joerganyway thanks, you inspired me to give vi(m) another evaluation/try, after a >20 years ago I decided I want something that actually makes use of all the great HID like mouse and function keys and whatnot, and GUI ;-) Now I'm looking at gvim and think >>they could have done that already back when wordperfect was a thing<< :-) IOW it looks tempting to give vi another try18:27
fsmithredKitty, is your /boot encrypted? Normally rescue works for me with encrypted partitions, but I keep /boot separate.18:34
Kittyyeah, I had to go around the menus a few times, it took me to the partitioner by default, I had to go back out of that to find the right option18:37
jjakobI debugged and did some fixes for the VyOS bash-completion scripts. It's very complicated code. It gets the available conpletions from the config API written in C. So the C program gives it back possible completions in shell-escaped strings.23:56
jjakobI would have loved if the VyOS project went in a different direction than it did.23:57
jjakobTheir goal was replacing *all* the old perl/c code with Python. It wasn't going well. Bugs everywhere, things really slow, migrations failing23:58
jjakobThen I did some new features in Python. Added IPv6 support for OpenVPN, rewrote some system DNS and resolv.conf code, added some IPv6 code to the generic interfaces classes23:59

Generated by irclog2html.py 2.17.0 by Marius Gedminas - find it at https://mg.pov.lt/irclog2html/!