dbbs | btrfs-progs needs to be installed | 00:00 |
---|---|---|
Afdal | wuzzat | 00:00 |
dbbs | also I installed reiserprogs and reiser4progs... should I do reiserfs again... I always liked it | 00:00 |
dbbs | presumably it's the btrfs programs? | 00:00 |
dbbs | :V | 00:00 |
Afdal | I've never used either of those file systems :'c | 00:00 |
dbbs | I always had the best luck with reiserfs in the past | 00:00 |
dbbs | I guess I'll blast from the past and install reiserfs. | 00:00 |
dbbs | I don't think reiser4 was ever completely finished but I could be wrong | 00:01 |
dbbs | do I need to add a swap partition or does it use a swapfile like the installer prompted me to do... | 00:01 |
Afdal | You can use files as swap? | 00:02 |
Afdal | News to me... | 00:02 |
dbbs | I dunno in the first screen of the installer there was a list of checkboxes and one said "use an existing swap partition instead of a swapfile" | 00:02 |
dbbs | I'll make a swap partition to be safe | 00:02 |
Afdal | probably best... | 00:03 |
Afdal | as long as it's not your SSD | 00:03 |
dbbs | now it's wanting to reformat my reiserfs partition as ext4 | 00:03 |
dbbs | :( | 00:04 |
dbbs | I guess I don't have any choice of what file system to use | 00:08 |
dbbs | even for my /home partition | 00:08 |
gnarface | did you grab the reiserfs package from the "load additional installer components?" if it's not there anymore then support may have been removed | 00:10 |
dbbs | where is load additional installer components | 00:10 |
dbbs | there's nothing on the desktop... | 00:11 |
dbbs | did afdal trick me by telling me to use the desktop installer | 00:11 |
dbbs | I admit I hate using textual fdisk.... | 00:11 |
dbbs | what if I checkbox do not format filesystems in the installation options | 00:12 |
dbbs | it should be able to install to reiserfs if I do that rite... | 00:12 |
gnarface | well which installer did you pick? | 00:12 |
dbbs | the desktop installer | 00:12 |
dbbs | i think it's in an xfce4 live environment? | 00:12 |
gnarface | oh, if it's the live one i'm not sure how you'd do it, but the netinstall one should have an expert mode option that gives you more flexiblity - that said, i haven't verified myself that it supported reiserfs for a few releases... i thought i remembered hearing it got removed | 00:13 |
dbbs | let me see if checking "do not format filesystems. I'll handle it myself." in the graphical installer works as long as I have the paritions already formated to reiserfs. i'll let you know the results so if someone asks in the future it helps. (I did have to install reiserfsprogs with apt first to get it to let me format to reiserfs in gparted first.) | 00:15 |
gnarface | yea the netinstaller should have a partitioning tool in both x11 and ncurses interfaces | 00:18 |
dbbs | it appears to be working | 00:18 |
gnarface | it at least used to support reiserfs in earlier versions, but you may have had to be in expert mode | 00:18 |
dbbs | it's copying the system over fine | 00:18 |
dbbs | Just had to install reiserfsprogs and select "do not format filesystems. I'll handle it myself." and select reiserfs in gparted? | 00:19 |
dbbs | We'll see if it boots lol | 00:19 |
gnarface | should be fine, reiserfs is still in the kernel in ceres | 00:19 |
dbbs | ok good | 00:19 |
dbbs | thanks for the help | 00:19 |
dbbs | hopefully grub2 detects windows and I don't have to rescue it | 00:20 |
gnarface | there usually isn't a problem as long as windows is on the first drive & partition | 00:20 |
dbbs | yeah it is | 00:20 |
dbbs | did it install the bootloader to the wrong drive... | 00:23 |
gnarface | you might have to re-run grub-install to uninstall it | 00:24 |
gnarface | i think by default it probably puts grub on all drives (another one that you can change in expert mode, iirc) | 00:25 |
dbbs | yeah it's not starting grub at al | 00:26 |
dbbs | it's just going into windows like I didn't do anything... | 00:27 |
Afdal | You may need to pass a directory parameter to your grub-install line | 00:28 |
Afdal | err not directory | 00:29 |
Afdal | but the name of your EFI system partition | 00:29 |
dbbs | grub-install cannot find efi directory... | 00:38 |
dbbs | How do I find the name of my grub partition. | 00:38 |
dbbs | :( | 00:38 |
dbbs | do you mean like | 00:38 |
dbbs | /dev/xyz | 00:38 |
Afdal | yeah like that | 00:38 |
dbbs | oh ok | 00:38 |
dbbs | hold on | 00:38 |
Afdal | what does your device mapper call it | 00:38 |
Afdal | gparted is helpful for this | 00:39 |
dbbs | yeah that's what I just used 2 seconds ago to find the name | 00:39 |
Afdal | or you can just use uh | 00:39 |
Afdal | blkid | 00:39 |
Afdal | or umm | 00:40 |
Afdal | no that's not what I'm thinking of | 00:40 |
dbbs | error cannot find efi directory | 00:40 |
dbbs | and I put the /dev/vnme0n1p1 in... | 00:40 |
gnarface | lsblk | 00:40 |
dbbs | nvme | 00:40 |
gnarface | for a efi machine you might need some package | 00:40 |
Afdal | yeah lsblk | 00:40 |
dbbs | any idea what some package is :V | 00:40 |
dbbs | I've never done this complicated an install before outside of a server or gentoo... | 00:41 |
gnarface | i remember it had "efi" in the name | 00:41 |
dbbs | oh and arch | 00:41 |
Afdal | I'd be very surprised if he needed a special package | 00:41 |
Afdal | almost everyone is running an EFI setup these days | 00:41 |
Afdal | The only reason I'm still using MBR is because I have a WinXP partition | 00:42 |
dbbs | also this install didn't ask me what init system I wanted.. I wonder what it picked... | 00:42 |
Afdal | it'll be sysvinit if you didn't get the option to choose | 00:42 |
dbbs | ok I'm not picky | 00:43 |
Afdal | That's what I ended up with when I did an install over ssh with my Devuan setup | 00:43 |
golinux | Live CD just copies file in the iso to your HD | 00:43 |
Afdal | Seems only one of the installers actually asks which init you wanna use... | 00:43 |
golinux | Install media are described here: https://www.devuan.org/get-devuan | 00:44 |
gnarface | if you try it again with the netinstall it'll probably give you more options | 00:44 |
gnarface | like a lot more | 00:44 |
dbbs | yeah I read the descriptions | 00:44 |
rrq | dbbs: you may need to go into the boot setup of your machine and configure it to recognize and use the Devuan boot option | 00:45 |
dbbs | afdal told me what to install | 00:45 |
Afdal | D:> | 00:45 |
dbbs | I went to the bios and didn't see anything for devuan | 00:45 |
dbbs | :/ | 00:45 |
dbbs | Will this work better if I just do the other installer | 00:45 |
dbbs | I didn't think I'd already be mucking around with all these grubs | 00:45 |
dbbs | lol | 00:45 |
gnarface | well at this point i'd just boot the livecd, chroot into the install and re-run the grub-install | 00:45 |
Afdal | Yeah I don't think your BIOS has any interest in what operating systems you have installed | 00:46 |
Afdal | BIOS only cares about bootloaders | 00:46 |
Afdal | BIOS manages the bootloaders, the bootloader manages your operating systems | 00:46 |
gnarface | well, the bios may be able to force it to boot from the other drive though if grub is there, and then you could re-run the grub-install without chrooting | 00:46 |
rrq | your machine runs the UEFI bios, which somewhere keeps a list of its boot options. It may be trivial or not to get teh devuan option into it. | 00:46 |
dbbs | I don't remember how to chroot and what speecific commands I'd have to do :( I thought this would be somewhat easy to install like debian or ubuntu or fedora and I wouldn't have systemd... or snap packages... | 00:46 |
dbbs | I don't mind a text installer | 00:47 |
Afdal | I can walk ya through chrooting | 00:47 |
gnarface | well either way should work | 00:47 |
Afdal | I've had to do my share of that | 00:47 |
gnarface | mount -o bind /sys ./chroot/sys | 00:47 |
gnarface | mount -o bind /proc ./chroot/proc | 00:47 |
rrq | anything in the devuan installation only takes effect *after* you've got your UEFI system to recongize it | 00:47 |
dbbs | it has "windows boot manager" "pop os" "fedora" "usb" and "ubuntu" (only windows is actually installed) | 00:48 |
gnarface | mount -o bind /dev ./chroot/dev | 00:48 |
gnarface | mount -o bind /dev/pts ./chroot/dev/pts | 00:48 |
gnarface | chroot ./chroot /bin/bash | 00:48 |
Afdal | I've run endless chroots and grub-install commands in my adventures to get GRUB to recognize a LUKSv2 encrypted boot setup | 00:48 |
Afdal | I just mount stuff in /mnt/ | 00:49 |
Afdal | What's the point of ./chroot/ gnarface | 00:49 |
dbbs | hmmmm | 00:50 |
dbbs | well | 00:50 |
dbbs | which efi file do I want in my \EFI\debian folder | 00:51 |
dbbs | shimx64 grubx64 mmx64 or fbx64 | 00:51 |
gnarface | sorry presumably you'd have mounted the install drive in there already, Afdal, i left that step out | 00:51 |
Afdal | ehhh, I would let grub-install handle that dbbs | 00:52 |
gnarface | can be any directory, most advisably an empty one you made yourself though | 00:52 |
dbbs | I'm in my bios | 00:52 |
dbbs | it's giving me those options | 00:52 |
dbbs | I guess I'll try them down the list | 00:52 |
Afdal | Are you trying to run binaries? | 00:52 |
gnarface | i dunno, i just remembered a thing about needing to change /efi/debian to /efi/devuan or visa-versa in some cases though and i don't remember the details | 00:52 |
dbbs | i'm trying to set something in my bios so it will give me some kind of boot option | 00:53 |
dbbs | shimx64 says failed to set seccond stage. | 00:53 |
Afdal | hmm | 00:53 |
Afdal | I think the typical name is grubx64.efi | 00:53 |
Afdal | the binary that your BIOS actually runs at boot time | 00:53 |
rrq | dbbs: is there a manual "add option" ? | 00:53 |
dbbs | that just loads a grub terminal | 00:53 |
dbbs | no | 00:54 |
dbbs | I can change an existing option though | 00:54 |
Afdal | is it regular grub or grub rescue terminal | 00:54 |
fsmithred | are you using secure boot? | 00:54 |
dbbs | no | 00:54 |
Afdal | If you're in the grub terminal then don't leave it yet | 00:54 |
dbbs | I can go back to it | 00:54 |
Afdal | see if you can boot from the grub terminal | 00:54 |
dbbs | :( | 00:54 |
dbbs | I don't know how | 00:54 |
Afdal | I can tell you | 00:54 |
Afdal | it's not hard | 00:54 |
Afdal | just gotta remember... | 00:54 |
dbbs | But I have a terrible memory you know this :( | 00:55 |
Afdal | lsmod something or other... | 00:55 |
dbbs | D:< | 00:55 |
Afdal | I just wanna see if it boots first | 00:55 |
dbbs | something or other | 00:55 |
Afdal | obviously you don't want to have to do this every time | 00:55 |
fsmithred | set root=(hd... something | 00:55 |
fsmithred | configfile /path/to/grub.cfg | 00:55 |
rrq | presumably devuan's efi boot has not got into the EFI partition. so you will indeed go back into the installer and deal with tht | 00:55 |
fsmithred | although that might not work with uefi | 00:56 |
fsmithred | if you chroot, you can just do grub-install and update-grub | 00:56 |
fsmithred | or even dpkg-reconfigure grub | 00:56 |
dbbs | :( | 00:56 |
Afdal | are you in the grub rescue console | 00:56 |
dbbs | not yet | 00:57 |
gnarface | oh, "dpkg-reconfigure grub" would be the better option, that one should give you an ncursess prompt with checkboxes for every drive partition | 00:57 |
dbbs | now I am | 00:57 |
Afdal | okay uh | 00:57 |
Afdal | type lsmod first | 00:57 |
Afdal | see if you have any modules loaded | 00:57 |
fsmithred | you got a grub rescue prompt, or a grub prompt? | 00:57 |
dbbs | I don't know the difference | 00:58 |
fsmithred | look at the words in the prompt | 00:58 |
Afdal | It'll say it's the rescue console if it us | 00:58 |
Afdal | is | 00:58 |
dbbs | I can reboot if you want me to go back | 00:58 |
fsmithred | not yet | 00:58 |
dbbs | I can't exactyl scroll up and find out what it said at the start | 00:58 |
fsmithred | does it say 'grub' or 'grub-rescue' | 00:58 |
dbbs | grub> | 00:58 |
Afdal | oh okay | 00:58 |
fsmithred | good | 00:58 |
Afdal | do ls | 00:58 |
dbbs | I did | 00:58 |
dbbs | it gave me a giant list I can't scroll up on... | 00:59 |
Afdal | do regular ls | 00:59 |
Afdal | not lsmod | 00:59 |
fsmithred | shift-pgup might work | 00:59 |
dbbs | ok | 00:59 |
dbbs | I did ls | 00:59 |
Afdal | but that's good, that means you probably have all the modules you need available | 00:59 |
Afdal | Do you see what look like your drive partitions? | 00:59 |
dbbs | I see like | 00:59 |
Afdal | they'll have different games according to GRUB | 00:59 |
Afdal | names* | 00:59 |
dbbs | proc hd0 hd0,msdos1 hd1 hd1 gpt1-7 | 01:00 |
Afdal | proc? | 01:00 |
Afdal | that's odd... | 01:00 |
Afdal | anyway | 01:00 |
dbbs | is this going to break my computer | 01:00 |
Afdal | do ls (hd0,msdos1) | 01:00 |
Afdal | this is just a list command | 01:00 |
dbbs | I know what ls is | 01:00 |
dbbs | >:O | 01:00 |
dbbs | I'm asking is doing all of this going to break my computer | 01:00 |
Afdal | no | 01:00 |
Afdal | we need to find your Devuan partition | 01:01 |
gnarface | it's just putting in a boot entry manually then booting from it, should be safe | 01:01 |
Afdal | do ls on those until you find the right one by its directory structure | 01:01 |
gnarface | hd0,msdos1 is probably the windows partition, i'd guess | 01:01 |
Afdal | yeah | 01:01 |
dbbs | that's my hdd | 01:01 |
dbbs | not my nvme drive | 01:01 |
dbbs | it's just a storage drive | 01:01 |
Afdal | so hd1 then? | 01:01 |
dbbs | yeah | 01:02 |
dbbs | I assume so | 01:02 |
Afdal | Do ls | 01:02 |
Afdal | and see what they look like | 01:02 |
gnarface | it's (drive,partition) | 01:02 |
Afdal | yeah | 01:02 |
Afdal | when you specify one of them it'll tell you what directories are in it | 01:02 |
dbbs | it's saying other than the 2 ntfs drives that they are no known filesystem detected | 01:02 |
Afdal | you should be able to recognize the linux one from that | 01:02 |
dbbs | probably because I did reiserfs | 01:03 |
fsmithred | and just to make it more interesting, drives are counted from 0 and paritions are counted from 1 | 01:03 |
gnarface | see if you can load the reiserfs module | 01:03 |
dbbs | how | 01:03 |
dbbs | :V | 01:03 |
Afdal | Oh you might not have the reiserfs module loaded | 01:03 |
gnarface | checking... | 01:03 |
Afdal | let's see, what's that called... | 01:03 |
fsmithred | insmod reiserfs? | 01:03 |
gnarface | insmod reiserfs | 01:03 |
gnarface | i think | 01:03 |
dbbs | file not found | 01:03 |
dbbs | >:( | 01:03 |
Afdal | ruh roh | 01:03 |
dbbs | Should I just reinstall with btrf | 01:03 |
dbbs | btfs | 01:04 |
dbbs | btrfs* | 01:04 |
dbbs | >:O | 01:04 |
Afdal | yeah lol you'll need to get that module added when you run grub-install then | 01:04 |
fsmithred | NO!!! | 01:04 |
dbbs | why no | 01:04 |
Afdal | Well now we know what your problem is | 01:04 |
dbbs | :( | 01:04 |
fsmithred | you can do btrfs with the live installer, but there are a couple of threads on the forum you need to study first. | 01:04 |
dbbs | I'm okay with using btrfs | 01:04 |
Afdal | You'll need to go back to a live environment and get the module added to your EFI grub directory | 01:04 |
* gnarface doesn't want to give up on reiserfs | 01:04 | |
dbbs | >:O | 01:04 |
fsmithred | same here | 01:04 |
dbbs | me either but | 01:04 |
fsmithred | I think we can figure this out | 01:05 |
dbbs | If it will "just work" i would rather just... have it work | 01:05 |
gnarface | ls /boot/grub/i386-pc/reiserfs.mod | 01:05 |
gnarface | ? | 01:05 |
gnarface | still present on ceres, i would think this should be working | 01:05 |
dbbs | arlsfolder not found | 01:05 |
dbbs | there's no /boot/grub/i386-pc folder | 01:06 |
gnarface | ls (hd1,1) /boot/grub/i386-pc | 01:06 |
Afdal | reiserfs.mod, yeah that's what it's called | 01:06 |
gnarface | ls (hd1,1)/boot/grub/i386-pc | 01:06 |
gnarface | hmm, but without it already loaded it won't work | 01:06 |
fsmithred | /boot/grub/x86_64-efi/ | 01:06 |
Afdal | that's only if he formatted his EFI system partition as ReiserFS too | 01:06 |
Afdal | which uh, wouldn't load GRUB up at all if that were the case | 01:06 |
dbbs | file '/boot/grub/i386-pc' not foud | 01:07 |
Afdal | because his BIOS certainly can't read ReiserFS | 01:07 |
fsmithred | look in /boot/grub/x86_64-efi/ | 01:07 |
gnarface | we sure we're not on some stale grub install on the old storage disk hd0? | 01:07 |
dbbs | I don't know but this is getting way overcomplicated over my head and if I can just give in and use ext4 I'd much rather do that | 01:08 |
rrq | the EFI partition is a FAT partition | 01:08 |
fsmithred | take a deep breath | 01:08 |
dbbs | that doesn't help | 01:08 |
rrq | it needs to contaion the grub modules for other filesystems | 01:08 |
* Afdal gives dbbs a paper bag | 01:08 | |
dbbs | that doesn't help | 01:08 |
Afdal | c:} | 01:08 |
gnarface | as a sanity check: insmod gzio | 01:09 |
rrq | you need to reenter the installer and make sure grub installs to the efi partition | 01:09 |
gnarface | does it find that one? | 01:09 |
dbbs | it doesn't reply at all | 01:09 |
fsmithred | rrq, he installed from the live iso. | 01:09 |
dbbs | it's just like >grub | 01:09 |
rrq | yes | 01:09 |
dbbs | :( | 01:09 |
Afdal | Here's an example of what my grub-install command looks like when I need to do some tricky stuff: grub-install --target=x86_64-efi --efi-directory=/boot/efi --boot-directory=/boot --bootloader-id=GRUB --modules="luks2 part_gpt cryptodisk pbkdf2 ls cbtable normal reboot fat efi_gop efi_uga gcry_rijndael gcry_sha256 gcry_sha512" | 01:10 |
rrq | he made rootfs be reiserfs | 01:10 |
dbbs | oh so a bunch of stuff I don't want to type in eh | 01:10 |
rrq | might not have mounte /boot/efi | 01:10 |
dbbs | can I just reinstall as ext4 and avoid all this nonsense? | 01:10 |
Afdal | You might need to add --modules="reiserfs" to make sure the module gets added | 01:10 |
gnarface | dbbs: that means it worked | 01:10 |
dbbs | why will no one answer my question. | 01:11 |
gnarface | dbbs: after that do: insmod part_msdos | 01:11 |
dbbs | :( | 01:11 |
Afdal | What question | 01:11 |
gnarface | dbbs: then: insmod reiserfs | 01:11 |
gnarface | dbbs: tell me if all 3 of those insmods work in order | 01:11 |
dbbs | file not found for reiserfs | 01:11 |
rrq | dbbs: ... fsmothred knows the devuan live installler | 01:11 |
gnarface | dbbs: :( | 01:11 |
fsmithred | yeah, you can reinstall and use ext4 | 01:11 |
rrq | sorry fsmithred | 01:11 |
dbbs | yeah I'll just do that | 01:11 |
fsmithred | it takes about 10 minutes | 01:11 |
Afdal | No way | 01:11 |
dbbs | sorry I know it's not the fun let's figure out how to fix reiserfs way | 01:12 |
Afdal | Just go to the live environment and run grub-install again I:< | 01:12 |
dbbs | I don't mind fixing stuff when it's broken | 01:12 |
dbbs | but I just... would like the initial install to work. | 01:13 |
fsmithred | oh yeah | 01:13 |
gnarface | dbbs: for me on ceres, that file is in the "grub-pc-bin" package, not sure how you could be missing it, but that's a a bummer | 01:13 |
Afdal | In the future it seems the Devuan installers needs to pass a --modules="reiserfs" to its grub-install script | 01:13 |
fsmithred | the live isos have all the grub-*-bin packages installed | 01:13 |
rrq | gnarface: grub-pc-bin is for old bios, not for uefi; it needs grub-efi-$ARCH for uefi | 01:14 |
gnarface | oh, i see | 01:14 |
* gnarface fears and mistrusts efi | 01:14 | |
fsmithred | lol, I don't fear it anymore, but trust is thin | 01:14 |
dbbs | both packages are already installed on the live iso | 01:14 |
fsmithred | yeah, that's deliberate | 01:15 |
rrq | then /boot/efi needs to be the efi partition | 01:15 |
fsmithred | are you in a live session now, or still at the grub prompt? | 01:15 |
dbbs | special time zone for arizona smh | 01:16 |
fsmithred | just pick the zone and the system should know when summer hours start | 01:17 |
dbbs | lol | 01:17 |
fsmithred | doesn't work for AZ? | 01:17 |
dbbs | I already selected arizona I'm just being silly | 01:17 |
fsmithred | oh, ok | 01:18 |
dbbs | it has its own "time zone" because we don't have dst | 01:18 |
fsmithred | the rest of us are stuck on dst forever | 01:18 |
dbbs | I hate dst :( | 01:18 |
dbbs | did the rest of the us (other than hawaii) finally do year long dst | 01:18 |
fsmithred | yeah | 01:19 |
fsmithred | midnight will never again be in the middle of the night | 01:19 |
fsmithred | and we are drifting waaaay OT | 01:19 |
fsmithred | brb | 01:19 |
dbbs | okay now devuan started, so that's good | 01:22 |
dbbs | but grub didn't detect windows | 01:22 |
dbbs | or the installer didn't. | 01:22 |
fsmithred | run os-prober | 01:23 |
dbbs | ah | 01:24 |
dbbs | that thing | 01:24 |
dbbs | okay | 01:24 |
dbbs | i did that and update-grub | 01:24 |
fsmithred | I'm surprised it didn't run | 01:24 |
dbbs | says it found it and added it | 01:24 |
fsmithred | but it's not in the boot menu? | 01:24 |
dbbs | no no I just did it just this second | 01:24 |
fsmithred | oh | 01:24 |
fsmithred | whew | 01:24 |
dbbs | Lol | 01:24 |
dbbs | yeah it's starting now with windows so it's working | 01:25 |
fsmithred | you probably don't know this, but now that you bailed out on using reiser, I'm gonna have to try it. | 01:25 |
dbbs | hahaha | 01:25 |
dbbs | more power to you | 01:25 |
dbbs | :3 | 01:25 |
dbbs | Sorry if I wasn't being fun | 01:26 |
dbbs | I just didn't wnat to have to deal with this right on setup | 01:26 |
fsmithred | I understand | 01:26 |
dbbs | if I was working in a vm and could like... alt tab with the same keyboard between machines that would be different | 01:26 |
dbbs | But switching between these keyboards is a pain in the butt to me | 01:26 |
dbbs | more than anything | 01:27 |
dbbs | also I was worried (maybe stupidly) that I'd break the windows install | 01:27 |
dbbs | I could easily reinstall windows, I just had gotten it setup right and didn't want to touch it | 01:27 |
dbbs | is there a metapackage I should install if I want to use kde and have it install all the usual suspects I would from kubuntu-desktop on ubuntu | 01:28 |
gnarface | backups are always a good idea | 01:28 |
dbbs | :V | 01:28 |
dbbs | Oh I have backups | 01:28 |
dbbs | I just meant specific programs installed and stuff | 01:28 |
fsmithred | task-kde-desktop I think | 01:29 |
dbbs | I just don't have drive images | 01:29 |
dbbs | ok | 01:29 |
dbbs | thanks | 01:29 |
dbbs | :3 | 01:29 |
fsmithred | but mixing desktop environments can sometimes be tricky | 01:29 |
fsmithred | because of the policykit crap | 01:29 |
dbbs | that worked | 01:30 |
dbbs | :V | 01:30 |
fsmithred | wow | 01:30 |
dbbs | We'll see if I have issues | 01:30 |
fsmithred | is consolekit installed? | 01:30 |
fsmithred | and is slim or lightdm installed? | 01:30 |
dbbs | gimme a sec | 01:31 |
dbbs | :3 | 01:31 |
dbbs | policykit yes | 01:32 |
dbbs | slim is installed not lightdm | 01:32 |
fsmithred | you're in kde now? | 01:32 |
dbbs | no not yet | 01:32 |
dbbs | I meant it worked as in that was the correct package | 01:32 |
dbbs | Should I install lightdm... | 01:33 |
fsmithred | not sure | 01:33 |
fsmithred | I think maybe see if it works first | 01:33 |
dbbs | ok | 01:33 |
fsmithred | but I will check the release notes | 01:33 |
dbbs | I'm not against xfce but I prefer kde, you know how it is | 01:33 |
dbbs | we all like our things how we like them | 01:34 |
dbbs | afdal thinks i'm a heathen... | 01:34 |
fsmithred | lol, is consolekit installed? | 01:34 |
fsmithred | you might need elogind and libpam-elogind | 01:35 |
dbbs | no consolekit | 01:35 |
fsmithred | cool | 01:35 |
dbbs | what's elogind | 01:35 |
dbbs | I can install it after aptitude is done | 01:35 |
fsmithred | you probably already have it | 01:36 |
dbbs | let me check | 01:36 |
dbbs | yeah both are installed | 01:36 |
fsmithred | it handles the login session | 01:36 |
dbbs | like lightdm? or seperate | 01:36 |
fsmithred | it's a neutered piece of systemd that helps with satisfying dependencies | 01:37 |
gnarface | i had better luck with lightdm than slim with kde | 01:37 |
dbbs | sorry I'm stupid, I'm not like a beginning linux user these are just things I haven't ever had to touch | 01:37 |
gnarface | but that was beowulf | 01:37 |
dbbs | I'm on chimaera if that changes things | 01:37 |
rrq | try "man elogind" | 01:37 |
dbbs | does installing lightdm's package make it switch to lightdm | 01:38 |
fsmithred | I don't use slim because I did have problems with it in the past. | 01:38 |
dbbs | yeah it's open | 01:38 |
dbbs | the manpage | 01:38 |
fsmithred | you'll get a debconf dialog asking which dm to use | 01:38 |
dbbs | ok | 01:38 |
dbbs | i'll install lightdm then, I've used it in the past | 01:38 |
dbbs | is there something you wanted me to check in the manpage rrq | 01:39 |
fsmithred | I use lightdm or lxdm. | 01:39 |
dbbs | sure is a lot of packages for kde lol | 01:39 |
rrq | no, just suggested it to tell you what elogind is/does | 01:39 |
fsmithred | I think he wanted you to read a better description of elogind than I can give you. | 01:39 |
dbbs | oh thanks rrq | 01:39 |
rrq | a hotch-potch of things, some of which might be useful | 01:39 |
dbbs | what is this I am not good at computer etc | 01:40 |
dbbs | lol | 01:40 |
rrq | btw in early 1800s the coincidence of trains and personal time keeping devices gave rise to the notion of "political time zones", and since then midnight has not been midnight almost anywhere | 01:52 |
rrq | .. to hard to adjust the clock a secind every 10 km :) | 01:53 |
Afdal | When will timekeeping catch up to relativity though :'c | 01:58 |
jjakob | rrq: work and opening hours should adjust to the local time instead of people adjusting to the imaginary time | 02:02 |
jjakob | have a dynamic work and opening schedule that is recomputed every once in a while | 02:03 |
jjakob | oh, this is for offtopic... | 02:03 |
jjakob | Manis: thank you, I'll try it tomorrow, didn't have time yet | 02:04 |
dbbs | kde is working fine, I ended up switching to sddm after lightdm, it all works fine | 02:54 |
dbbs | I'll stick around here and stalk afdal, got it on my autologin irc servers... | 02:54 |
Afdal | {: | 02:55 |
dbbs | gotta make sure he behaves himself... | 02:55 |
Pon | Does anyone know how I can fix the problem where on an offline install tin installs inexplicably and then throws a hostname error causing the select and install software step to fail? | 03:55 |
rrq | first an "apt-get -f install" to bring it back to consistent state | 04:03 |
rrq | then install with adding "tin-" on the command line | 04:03 |
Pon | This seems like it could be a misinterpretation, the situation is that I'm trying to install devuan from scratch using the 4 GB AMD64 ISO. | 04:06 |
Pon | But I'll try it. | 04:06 |
Pon | Also for more information, I'm trying out Daedalus, but as far as I know, this error was already present back in Beowulf or something, and has never been fixed and I can't understand why. tin is just a usenet news reader or something, and it's causing offline OS installs to fail. | 04:07 |
rrq | in that case you should install a smaller system choice and then fatten it up via command line installs .. I don't know which installation variant(s) results in "tin" | 04:08 |
rrq | or alternatively, dive in via C-A-F2 when the "select software" dialog comes up and add an /etc/apt/preferences.d/ file to prohibit tin | 04:10 |
Pon | It looks like "console productivity" is pulling this in. | 04:11 |
Pon | I guess I could try installing without that... | 04:11 |
rrq | yeah, "tin" certainly shouldn't fail its installation in that way; maybe you'd like lodging a debian bug on that. | 04:16 |
Pon | Is console productivity a debian thing? | 04:17 |
Pon | It doesn't seem to be. | 04:18 |
Pon | It's a package anyone can look up, task-console-productivity. | 04:18 |
Pon | I just cannot understand this situation. In all my time using devuan this might be the one thing I most cannot understand. | 04:20 |
rrq | it appears "tin" fails its installation due to something missing with its deployment; but it should fail installing just because running it fails. | 04:21 |
Pon | But at least being able to leave out console productivity seems to make things a lot better than I thought they were. | 04:21 |
rrq | task-console-productivity is a "virtual package" that merely depends on other packages. I suppose one option is to exclude tin from its recommends | 04:22 |
Pon | It's a package tasksel uses to install other things, when you select "console productivity" during the "select and install software" step. At least during an "expert install". I'm not sure about other types of installs. | 04:23 |
rrq | yes, the whole installationis based on selecting some virtual packages that depends/recommends other packages (recursively) | 04:24 |
rrq | then each package installs via its own coding | 04:24 |
gnarface | maybe try it without recommends? | 04:24 |
gnarface | apt-get --no-install-recommends [package] | 04:24 |
gnarface | er, i mean apt-get --no-install-recommends install [package] | 04:25 |
Pon | There is no option for without recommends in the expert install (and probably not in a non-expert install either). If I used apt-get via the command line though, then I could do that. But I'm not sure that's relevant to OS installation. I guess it could be somehow. | 04:25 |
gnarface | sorry was skimming too fast | 04:26 |
rrq | IMO the fundamental issue is when packages get deployed just by being installed, and in particular when the installation fails due to deployment failure | 04:27 |
rrq | but that's kind of irrelevant here :) | 04:27 |
Pon | I am not sure what console productivity is. I just selected it thinking I would get nice potentially useful console utilities already installed. I guess it was my mistake for trying to always select it. | 04:28 |
Pon | https://www.devuan.org/os/announce/ascii-stable-announce-060818 "hundreds of CLI and TUI utils" that's the most information I've managed to find on what it is yet. | 04:30 |
rrq | Pon: yes, perhaps you'd prefer lodging a devuan bug against task-console-productivity (part of tasksel), although its "bug" is that it includes "tin", which has an installation bug :) | 04:31 |
Pon | YEah which IIRC does not cause the bug/failure when you do an online install, IIRC it only does it during an offline install. | 04:32 |
Pon | But now that I know it's console productivity, this is a lot more understandable to me, this is just an extra optional task that devuan made and I guess they are only testing offline installs without it | 04:33 |
Pon | If I really want to I can even install task-console-productivity after I boot to my new OS, with or without recommends, so the situation isn't so bad once I know what's going on to this degree, but to people who don't, this may be very strange and frustrating. | 04:35 |
rrq | I guess lodging two bus would be ideal: against tin re its broken installation variant, and re t-c-p re its inconenient choice of packages ... | 04:43 |
rrq | bus=bugs | 04:43 |
rrq | ...and /re/on/ and /con/conv/ | 04:45 |
Pon | I was able to install fine. But does anyone know why lightdm might not be showing up? It just makes a blinking text cursor in the top left. | 06:03 |
dbbs | is devuan chimaera based off of debian bullseye | 12:54 |
dbbs | ? | 12:54 |
debdog | yes | 12:55 |
debdog | https://www.devuan.org/os/releases | 12:55 |
dbbs | oh lol | 12:55 |
dbbs | I saw that and just saw stable not bullseye | 12:55 |
debdog | hehe, that happens | 12:56 |
dbbs | Thanks I just wanted to get a game from debian repos that I didn't find in the devuan repos | 12:56 |
dbbs | :3 | 12:56 |
debdog | if it's in debian's official repo it shoulld™ be there | 12:56 |
dbbs | I didn't see it but I was in the muon package manager frontend | 12:57 |
dbbs | let me see if it just installs with apt... | 12:57 |
debdog | what's its name? | 12:57 |
dbbs | yeah it's not there | 12:57 |
dbbs | the package is uqm | 12:57 |
debdog | aptitude search uqm | 12:58 |
debdog | i uqm - The Ur-Quan Masters - An inter-galactic adventure game | 12:58 |
dbbs | is there something wrong with my repos? | 12:58 |
debdog | hmm, odd. what does your sources.list look like? | 12:59 |
dbbs | deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged chimaera main | 12:59 |
dbbs | then chimaera-updates chimaera-security and chimaera-backports are #commentedouut | 13:00 |
debdog | are you up-to-date? (even though I suppose it should be there even if not) | 13:00 |
dbbs | I ran upgrade yesterday | 13:00 |
debdog | maybe it is in non-free | 13:00 |
dbbs | how do I add that | 13:01 |
debdog | or contrib | 13:01 |
dbbs | sorry I just installed devuan yesterday | 13:01 |
debdog | deb http://deb.devuan.org/merged/ chimaera main non-free contrib | 13:01 |
dbbs | or rather what line do I put in | 13:01 |
dbbs | okay | 13:01 |
debdog | then apt update | 13:01 |
dbbs | thanks :3 let me try it | 13:01 |
dbbs | yes | 13:02 |
dbbs | that fixed it | 13:02 |
debdog | \ø/ | 13:02 |
debdog | oops | 13:02 |
debdog | \o/ | 13:02 |
dbbs | now I don't have to manually install stuff \:3/ | 13:02 |
dbbs | lol | 13:02 |
debdog | hehe | 13:02 |
dbbs | Devuan is pretty cool so far, i was kind of surprised with how many packages are available that this one game wasn't in the repos | 13:03 |
dbbs | but it was all along | 13:03 |
debdog | except for a few packages which depend on systemd everyting is available as in the debian repo | 13:04 |
dbbs | cool :3 | 13:05 |
dbbs | that's how I assumed it would be based on what my friend told me about it | 13:06 |
dbbs | but now you've confirmed it | 13:06 |
onefang | uqm itself is in contrib, there are optional music and voice bits in non-free, but the uqm-content package is non-free, and is a dependancy of uqm. | 13:16 |
onefang | Looks interesting, installing it now. SOmething to do on the weekend. | 13:16 |
dbbs | it's a great game imo | 13:29 |
dbbs | my only hint for the first minute of the game is your ship will be hard to control (it's upgradeable after you collect resources and get access to the starbase) and head for the starbase | 13:29 |
dbbs | :3 | 13:29 |
dbbs | the starbase around eaerth | 13:30 |
djph | what game? | 13:38 |
djph | oh, 'uqm' ? | 13:38 |
debdog | gameplay is somewhat similar to EVN or Endless-Sky | 13:40 |
onefang | Now we have drifted off to #devuan-offtopic. | 13:42 |
djph | just a bit | 13:42 |
debdog | Endless-Sky is in devuan repo, so yes, partly | 13:43 |
golinux | dbbs: Some useful links: | 15:19 |
golinux | https://pkginfo.devuan.org/cgi-bin/policy-query.html | 15:19 |
golinux | https://pkgmaster.devuan.org/bannedpackages.txt | 15:19 |
golinux | Debian repos should not be used directly. | 15:21 |
golinux | All "safe" pkg are merged with Devuan by amprolla https://git.devuan.org/devuan/amprolla3 | 15:23 |
dbbs | thanks golinux | 15:47 |
dbbs | sorry if I'm not reading all the right docs automatically lol | 15:47 |
dbbs | sorry if I ask more stupid quetions in the future | 15:49 |
fsmithred | you don't need to apologize for asking questions here. | 15:50 |
dbbs | ok | 15:50 |
dbbs | thanks | 15:50 |
dbbs | I've had some RTFM type replies to me way in the past | 15:51 |
fsmithred | yeah, we try not to be like that | 15:51 |
dbbs | that's good :3 | 15:51 |
fsmithred | because it's mostly useless | 15:51 |
fsmithred | i.e. saying that without providing some answer is useless. R'ing the FM is usually not useless. Just sometimes cryptic. | 15:52 |
dbbs | Well sometimes documentation is... lacking | 15:52 |
dbbs | or old or whatever | 15:52 |
fsmithred | yup | 15:52 |
dbbs | Or in my favorite linux package ffmpeg, a mile long | 15:52 |
fsmithred | do you know how to search a string in a man page? | 15:53 |
dbbs | mmmm | 15:54 |
fsmithred | type / | 15:54 |
dbbs | not off the top of my head | 15:54 |
dbbs | oh like aptitude? | 15:54 |
fsmithred | then type the search pattern | 15:54 |
fsmithred | enter | 15:54 |
fsmithred | then '/ enter' to gget to the next one | 15:54 |
dbbs | ok that's easy | 15:54 |
dbbs | thanks | 15:54 |
fsmithred | yw | 15:54 |
debdog | or just "n" | 15:54 |
dbbs | also easy | 15:55 |
dbbs | aren't those the same exact ones from aptitude? | 15:55 |
debdog | I think, yes | 15:55 |
dbbs | ok just making sure | 15:55 |
dbbs | I have a lot a lot of experience with aptitude | 15:56 |
fsmithred | I have almost no experience with the ncurses aptitude. I just use it on command line. | 15:56 |
debdog | as long as a switch to apt is forced I'll stay with aptitude, too | 15:56 |
fsmithred | It reminds me too much of the old-old-old debian installer. | 15:56 |
dbbs | haha | 15:57 |
fsmithred | dselect | 15:57 |
debdog | erm, *isn't | 15:57 |
u-amarsh04 | aptitude is pretty good to use these days with the control-U for undo | 16:19 |
Guest14 | Hi, | 16:48 |
Guest14 | What do these kernel startup options in GRUB mean? | 16:48 |
Guest14 | .linux /live/vmlinuz boot=live hostname=parrot quilet persistence components initrd=/live/initrd.img | 16:48 |
onefang | Should that be "quiet", not "quilet"? | 16:49 |
Afdal | <fsmithred> do you know how to search a string in a man page? | 16:50 |
Afdal | What the hay, I never knew that... | 16:50 |
Afdal | I just pipe searches to grep!!! | 16:50 |
brocashelm | is it just me, or is mintstick now provided by debian/devuan? | 16:51 |
brocashelm | i thought it was only for mint | 16:51 |
brocashelm | looks like it's only hit the sid repo...? https://pkgs.org/download/mintstick | 16:56 |
Pon | Did anything change with how apt-cdrom works? I used to be able to use it to install packages post-os-installation off my usb drive. I apparently can't anymore, it just says it can't find the cdrom. I don't remember needing to put it in /etc/fstab before but I tried putting it in there this time and I was able to confirm my fstab entry worked but I still couldn't get apt-cdrom to work. | 18:27 |
Pon | And apt-get update just says that I need to use apt-cdrom, which is what I'm used to. | 18:28 |
fsmithred | Pon, I haven't used apt-cdrom, but there have been times when I had to make a symlink from /dev/cdrom to wherever the usb was mounted. | 19:06 |
Pon | That works? So replacing the mount directory with a symlink? | 19:08 |
fsmithred | I think so. Last time I did it was a few years ago, possibly before devuan existed. | 19:08 |
fsmithred | normally if you only have the cdrom line in sources.list and no online repos enabled, then all should come from the CD by just using 'apt install <package>' | 19:09 |
Pon | I'm using to also needing to use apt-cdrom add before I can do that, for some reason. | 19:10 |
Pon | used* | 19:10 |
fsmithred | what's in sources.list? (don't paste the file here) | 19:10 |
Pon | Just the cdrom line, everything else is commented out. | 19:11 |
fsmithred | it gave you that message with the update command or with the upgrade command? | 19:12 |
Pon | Update said use apt-cdrom. | 19:13 |
fsmithred | well, maybe it expects you to have a new CD/DVD that has newer packags than the one you used to install the system. | 19:13 |
fsmithred | just a guess | 19:13 |
Pon | I don't think so, the line in sources.list is for the one I used to install it. | 19:14 |
fsmithred | yeah, so there's nothing to update | 19:14 |
fsmithred | nothing available at your location, I mean | 19:14 |
Pon | hm, well, it's just, I can't seem to install packages off the usb either. | 19:15 |
fsmithred | what's it say if you try to install something? And what did you try to install? | 19:15 |
Pon | Unable to locate for one package, no installation candidate for another. | 20:03 |
Pon | I tried to install elogind. | 20:03 |
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