libera/#maemo-leste/ Friday, 2022-05-27

missMyN900I provided some more information on the black screen bug last night (UTC-7, that is)00:01
missMyN900I have also discovered that it seems that I can pretty reliably work around it by pressing the power button multiple times in rapid succession00:01
missMyN900I also did a little experiment to test the battery drain00:03
missMyN900according to the battery indicator the battery was roughly 50% full (it does not show a percentage) when I put the PP in offline mode and locked the screen before going to bed00:04
missMyN900unfortunately the phone was completely dead 8 hours later when I woke up00:04
missMyN900so in other words, the drain is pretty severe and it is not the WiFi/modem that is causing it00:05
missMyN900it also seems to me that this is a scenario where the A64 suspend should at least be highly effective, so surely there must still be some room for improvement for ML on the PP?00:06
norayr50% is 8 hours is cool.00:12
norayryou can measure the power in console by00:12
norayrupower -d00:12
WizzupmissMyN900: sounds like a bug in mce wrt black screen00:17
missMyN900Wizzup: yes, I was starting to think that as well01:37
Wizzupand yes, we could integrate suspend to ram on the pp, but that will severely limit many things01:39
missMyN900just read an article that claims Mobian/Phosh achieves 24 hours standby time *with the modem enabled*, so seems like ML should be able to do better in offline mode01:51
Wizzupyes, but that means nothing else will work01:54
Wizzupe.g. you can't listen to music01:54
Wizzupor keep some application listening to internet traffic for incoming xmpp messages01:55
missMyN900Wizzup: honestly, that is acceptable to me for tablet use. I plan on just using my Pinephone as a mini Pinetab with LTE available should I need it01:56
missMyN900Wizzup: furthermore, the effort should transfer to the actual Pinetab itself since it has exactly the same SoC01:56
missMyN900and the Pinetab IMHO could truly be a great Maemo Leste device, especially for dev01:57
WizzupmissMyN900: right, it's useful but not really for "our" normal phone purposes01:58
Wizzupbut yes, it ought to be worked on some, it could be done with some mce module probably01:58
missMyN900It is cheap and versatile (Pinetab)01:58
Wizzuplike lock -> sleep unless in call01:58
Wizzupyes, I have a pinetab01:58
WizzupI brought it with me on my trip to make it work again, I have the dev version with an older panel01:59
missMyN900that is great to hear01:59
Wizzupit ought to already just work for pinetab,s except for one boot.scr thing01:59
Wizzupbut that I'll fix as well hopefully next week02:00
missMyN900Wizzup: when my iPhone dies, I will get a cheap, used, oldish Android phone that is supported by LineageOS and use it as dumb(ish) phone02:10
missMyN900the LTE dumb phones either suck or are actually custom low-end Android phones in which Google still has their tentacles02:10
missMyN900and anything without LTE is no longer an option here in the US, unfortunately02:11
missMyN900I liked the old days when I had one device that I liked and trusted and used for all sorts of things but I have come to realize that those are not coming back02:12
norayri built it! i built lagrange. let's see how it works from repos.02:52
uvos__missMyN900: could you ssh in when the backscree occures?08:39
uvos__missMyN900: i assume the backlight comes on?08:39
uvos__i doubt its mce08:39
uvos__please when it occures run "xset q" via ssh and check what is says about dpms08:41
uvos__if it thinks the display is off please run "xset dpms force on" and see if that helps08:42
uvos__a mce module that suspends when the display is turned off would be trvial, and probubly usefull on the pinetab at least08:42
humpelstilzchen[My PP likes to crash directly after waking up from sleeping (crust), so I would advise against automatic suspend09:21
uvos__thats not a good reason not to do something09:25
humpelstilzchen[I disagree. This must be fixed first.09:25
uvos__and using the feature will make people fix it09:26
uvos__;)09:26
humpelstilzchen[Doubt09:27
rafael2k /msg NickServ IDENTIFY kartn1010:12
rafael2kmorning10:12
rafael2ksorry ^10:12
rafael2kI'll take a look in quilt10:13
norayrmy reason to not suspend the phone is that when i wake up, i read what happened on irc during the night.11:01
norayruvos is it a legitimate reason? (:11:01
rafael2k_a switch to allow the user select the behavior seems nice.11:03
norayri have some screenshots of lagrange, i built it with mobile ui.11:05
norayrit doesn't show this upper row with menu, and everything is more mobile like:11:05
norayrhttps://xn--y9azesw6bu.xn--y9a3aq/media/uploads/2022/05/26/a5018f31-9725-4705-bf26-a27fb84414a2.png11:05
norayrthis is a seach box: https://xn--y9azesw6bu.xn--y9a3aq/media/uploads/2022/05/26/82212b39-43da-4bc1-bf5b-c4b3be558c66.png11:06
norayrthis is a font chooser: https://xn--y9azesw6bu.xn--y9a3aq/media/uploads/2022/05/26/47e20e63-6c32-41c3-b4ab-079a3eebbe4f.png11:06
norayrunfortunately both on desktop and mobile it doesn't allow you to choose from all fonts recognized by system.11:06
norayrwhatever that means.11:06
norayrone needs to paste the font to that screen to add it.11:07
norayri can do that with keyboard.11:07
norayrbut need to connect bt kbd first.11:07
Wizzuprafael2k_: let me know if I can help11:39
WizzupmissMyN900: we/you can look at using android kernel + some userspace as a base with m-l on top like sailfish does, it's just not somethting we strive towards, we want mainline-only11:40
Wizzupnorayr: looks nice @ screenshots11:41
sicelonorayr: re:irc - you may want to get znc/bouncer11:49
missMyN900I have been looking for some Debian/Devuan applications that work well on ML/PP again20:24
missMyN900I realized that Mopidy+Mopidy-Mobile or Mopidy-Iris could work reasonably well as a music player20:25
missMyN900vlc with some certain skins too perhaps, so I am looking into those20:25
missMyN900I was interested in trying out sayonara too but apparently it is only available in Bullseye/Chimaera20:26
missMyN900I am really looking forward to the ML upgrade to Chimaera; then I can finally try netsurf-gtk (3.10) on ML!20:26
missMyN900uvos: yes, the backlight is definitely on when the black screen bug occurs. That is what I was trying to convey20:27
missMyN900hmm don't think VLC is using hw accel... Otherwise this MP4 video would not be straining the PP this much20:36
missMyN900pavucontrol seems to work a lot better now (GTK version) for some reason, then it did last time I tried20:37
missMyN900status menu volume applet is useless though20:37
missMyN900it is completely disconnected from the actual volume20:37
missMyN900(on the PP with current settings, that is)20:38
missMyN900smplayer seems to be more efficient but audio was out of sync and now the audio is completely gone...20:52
missMyN900very unfortunate as it works quite nicely on the PP overall20:52
WizzupmissMyN900: if you find ones that work well, please make a list21:05
Wizzupalso of things that don't work too well :)21:05
missMyN900Wizzup: yes, I was thinking of doing that21:16
Wizzupthat would be great :)21:17
norayrmissMyN900: i might package netsurf for current version of ml.21:23
missMyN900norayr: I don't think it is worth the effort if Chimaera will bring it in anyway21:24
norayri don't know when ml will switch to the chimaera, but maybe you're right.21:25
norayri was considering it anyway.21:25
norayrfor now, someone please add maefat to phoenix.21:26
missMyN900in a few months from what I've read21:27
Wizzupok, let me look at that now21:27
Wizzupnorayr: is it written in C or similar?21:30
Wizzupnorayr: maefat that is21:30
norayrc and gtk221:30
Wizzuplooks like it21:30
Wizzupok21:30
norayrit is already hildonized.21:30
norayri also need to package amazfish which supports different watches.21:31
norayrit would alse be cool to port that rock... something app, from ubuntu, which works with pebble watches.21:31
WizzupI have no clue where to add it this in jenkins... fun21:32
norayrparazyd may know.21:32
missMyN900only smartwatch I would ever be interested in is the pebble watch21:32
missMyN900I remember looking into it when I had a Jolla and there was a SFOS app for it21:32
norayrrockpool, it is now as well.21:32
norayrjust it works only with pebble classic watches, which aren't as cool as pebble 2, let's say, or pebble time.21:32
norayrpebble classic are pretty dumb, actually. i have one, i use it with sailfish on xperia.21:33
missMyN900Cortex M/RTOS watches are somewhat interesting to me21:33
norayrthis rockpool app which is a port of rocksomething from ubuntu, cannot work with ble devices.21:33
Wizzupnorayr: phone call21:33
missMyN900the Android and Tizen massively overpowered and power hungry watches are 0% interesting to me21:33
missMyN900especially if they come with Google spyware as if having a Google Android phone is not bad enough already...21:34
missMyN900I guess the PineTime also interests me a bit21:34
missMyN900I think it is Cortex M based too21:35
missMyN900they need to make a RISC-V powered PineTime 2.0 :D21:35
missMyN900I guess I should try mpv on the PP even though I don't really like it in general21:41
missMyN900at least smplayer can use mpv as well...21:41
missMyN900Wizzup: does Firefox on ML have any tweaks nowadays?21:43
missMyN900I was thinking that actually you could use FF as a video player too21:43
missMyN900no hw accel though of course21:44
missMyN900Wizzup: is openmediaplayer dead by the way?21:49
Wizzupnot dead21:49
Wizzupsorry phone call..21:49
missMyN900LOL why is SMPlayer on https://leste.maemo.org/Wishlist when Devuan provides it already?21:52
WizzupI think there is a fremantle port of it with some changes, maybe21:53
Wizzup(still semi afk)21:53
missMyN900I am going to test feathernotes on ML as well since I use it on my Debian desktop21:56
missMyN900looking at the GUI it *should* work well21:56
missMyN900oh wait no hildon keyboard in Qt5 yet, right?21:56
missMyN900I guess I need to try some gstreamer-based player as well. Probably going to go with the XFCE one since there is no way I am dragging in all the GNOME (3/4) or KDE stuff with Totem or Dragon22:02
norayrmissMyN900, i guess hildon kbd will work, if you type latin characters.22:07
norayrjust there are two kbds.22:07
norayrone that appears when you tap in the input field, and one which appears22:08
norayrwhen you press a volume up button. (on pp it is volume up)22:08
norayrit works for me for non-latin characters as well, just i run setxkbmap in maemo terminal all the time22:08
missMyN900in which app is this?22:09
missMyN900is there a Qt5 virtual kb?22:09
missMyN900parole menus are unusable but if you click on the big play icon when no video is playing, then can you get the dialog to open a file22:10
missMyN900it is clearly not using hw accel but I think audio may be in sync (video is lagging to badly to know for sure)22:10
missMyN900I am really suspecting that there is connection between hw accel being utilized and audio being out of sync22:10
missMyN900obviously this is not really a ML issue, more of a linux-sunxi/Devuan issue22:11
missMyN900it is not really clear to me what accel API is being used and which one is currently preferred22:12
missMyN900I need to try mpv next22:12
missMyN900I hate to say it as I am not really an mpv fan22:14
missMyN900but it seems to be the best player so far22:14
missMyN900minimal lag if any22:14
missMyN900and audio seems to be (reasonably at least) in sync22:14
missMyN900I will try it with smplayer too22:15
missMyN900battery is dead...22:17
missMyN900to be fair I did strain it quite a bit today but it was dead in like 4 hours...22:17
missMyN900did install many applications and strain it with the video testing22:18
Wizzup21:56 < missMyN900> oh wait no hildon keyboard in Qt5 yet, right?22:19
Wizzupright not yet22:19
missMyN900Wizzup: sayonara is not yet available in Beowulf/Buster22:21
Wizzupwe do plan to upgrade to chimeara22:21
missMyN900but it should be in Chimaera and I noticed it depends on something called qt6-virtual-keyboard22:21
missMyN900so maybe that could be useful for ML?22:21
Wizzupwhat we 'need' or want it to port a piece of qt code from qt4 to qt5 that interfaces with the him22:22
Wizzuphildon-input-method22:22
WizzupI tried to do it in the summer of 2020 and I got stuck22:22
missMyN900is Qt5 that different?22:22
Wizzupyes22:22
Wizzupthey redid a bunch of stuff unfortunately and it required some fixing22:23
WizzupI don't remember the specifics now as it was a while ago22:23
missMyN900is there anyone else who has more experience with that type of thing?22:23
Wizzupyes, others could do it too, I could maybe too, given time, but it hasn't come up too much22:24
Wizzupthere is a way to invoke the keyboard in any X11 app22:24
WizzupI think it should be mapped to one of the buttons, uvos knows22:24
missMyN900yes, I am familiar with it22:24
Wizzupok22:24
missMyN900I used it in FF22:24
* _uvos_ posts this on d4 currently 35h uptime on one battery22:24
Wizzupnice :)22:25
_uvos_its vol up22:25
_uvos_on pp22:25
missMyN900PP is very jealous and sad22:25
Wizzupdid you change anything?22:25
_uvos_as allready stated22:25
_uvos_no22:25
Wizzupok, sorry :)22:25
_uvos_its just having a tood day22:25
missMyN900_uvos_: yes, I used it the last time I was using ML (last year)22:26
_uvos_i have no idea why its 50mW sometimes22:26
_uvos_and 90 others22:26
_uvos_*15022:26
missMyN900just realized the pun of zzztop...22:26
missMyN900is it available already for ML?22:26
missMyN900I want to try it on the PP22:27
missMyN900Wizzup: I did some Qt4 dev a long time ago22:28
missMyN900wrote a very basic SFOS application and got it published in the Jolla Store. That was many, many moons ago22:28
missMyN900I wonder if it is still in there22:28
missMyN900actually I created a desktop version of it too22:29
missMyN900it was all hosted on Bitbucket but they uncerimonously shut down their Hg repositories some time ago...22:30
missMyN900Wizzup: do you think it is worth sticking with HIM, actually? Perhaps it is better to just switch to some more modern Qt based solution?22:33
missMyN900I remember SFOS was(/is?) using Maliit22:33
Wizzupultimately, probably, but at this point I am not sure if it makes sense to remove it now, better to support it in qt5, since that is the mai nthing lacking22:33
Wizzupgtk3 will be pretty easy22:34
missMyN900I mean, maybe not remove it for Hildonized/GTK222:34
missMyN900but maybe it is better to create a new virtual kb for Qt22:34
missMyN900perhaps not the most beautiful solution but acceptable to me personally and it does not matter for the mapphones/N900 anyway22:35
missMyN900maybe ML can borrow the keyboard from Nemo?22:36
missMyN900SFOS keyboard is proprietary but the Glacier keyboard could be used22:36
_uvos_mostly a off the shelf vkb like onboard should work22:37
_uvos_except that ewmh support in hildon is broken22:37
_uvos_badly22:37
missMyN900what's that?22:37
_uvos_so it renders in the wrong place22:37
_uvos_extended protocolls for x clients to tell x wms what to do22:37
_uvos_with the windows22:38
_uvos_and yeah i agree that him is probubly a dead end22:39
_uvos_unless someone wants to seriously refactor it22:39
missMyN900_uvos_,Wizzup: https://github.com/nemomobile-ux/main/issues/15 looks like Glacier kb uses Maliit as well22:41
missMyN900actually, I think there are more Glacier pieces/applications that could be useful22:41
missMyN900https://github.com/orgs/nemomobile-ux/repositories?type=all22:42
missMyN900here's the kb: https://github.com/nemomobile-ux/maliit-nemo-keyboard22:42
missMyN900weather app, music player, gallery22:43
_uvos_the problem with these things is that they come with large unique frameworks22:45
missMyN900is it all that large?22:45
missMyN900it's Qt522:45
missMyN900I guess it could be an issue on N90022:46
Wizzupif we go for a qt5 only keyboard, what will you do for gtk2, gtk3, gtk4?22:47
Wizzupdoes nemo even support gtk with it's keyboard?22:47
Wizzuph-i-m worked on qt4, so it's sensible to try to port ot to qt5, and I agree it's not the prettiest.22:47
Wizzupapart from some other deficiencies like arrow keys22:47
Wizzupand sending strings rather than individual keys22:47
missMyN900I remember being so happy that SFOS had a special version of their keyboard for the terminal app22:48
missMyN900(with arrow keys)22:48
missMyN900that was a godsend22:48
missMyN900HIM could be used for GTK3 and 4 if it is easy to port to those like you said22:49
missMyN900but I think that most ML apps will be Qt?22:49
missMyN900specifically Qt5+22:49
missMyN900so they would use the new keyboard22:49
Wizzupyes, gtk3 is really easy22:50
Wizzupmost of m-l is gtk2, but some things are qt22:50
missMyN900well, but most of the Hildon apps don't need a vkb, do they?22:50
missMyN900I mean settings app, for example, doesn't need one22:51
missMyN900or clock app22:51
missMyN900I guess if you are expecting ML users to use a lot of Phosh (targeted) apps...22:52
_uvos_the clock is qt22:52
missMyN900Phosh apps would probably not run well on the N900 at least because it drags in all the GNOME 3+ bloat22:53
missMyN900GNOME3 is the most RAM hungry Linux desktop nowadays22:53
_uvos_we schould scheck out wht plamo apps in the devuan repo dont install22:58
_uvos_like okular-mobile22:58
_uvos_iirc its a depends problem with pvr22:58
_uvos_Wizzup: how do you get more info from apt "but it is not going to be installed"22:59
Wizzuphttps://askubuntu.com/questions/707333/how-to-debug-an-unmet-dependencies-problem23:02
Wizzupapt-get -s -o Debug::pkgProblemResolver=yes install wine23:02
missMyN900_uvos_: keepassxc doesn't install23:02
missMyN900I discovered that months ago and reported it here23:03
missMyN900it is missing kf5-walletmanager23:03
missMyN900_uvos_: how many Plasma Mobile apps are there in the Devuan repo?23:04
_uvos_just 2 i think23:06
missMyN900I am going to try Nemo on the PP soon too23:06
missMyN900don't really like that they switched to Manjaro but it is probably a good idea to try a Manjaro based image again23:07
missMyN900and I like Glacier23:07
humpelstilzchen[missMyN900: (smartwatch) did you see the BangleJs? https://banglejs.com/. Can be freely programmed in javascript, a maemo bridge would be possible.23:09
missMyN900ah that is why Maep is not showing anything23:10
missMyN900it is trying to get my location23:10
missMyN900the GPS indicator is showing up in the status area23:10
missMyN900brings back the memories...23:10
missMyN900I wonder if it will actually get a fix with the PP23:10
humpelstilzchen[I prefer modrana over maep. Got a fix in the last test23:11
missMyN900humpelstilzchen: oo that intrigues me23:11
missMyN900IIRC Modrana did not work for me on the PP when I tried it last year23:12
missMyN900I remember it from the N900 though23:12
missMyN900not that I used it much23:12
missMyN900if only we could have Nokia Maps...23:13
_uvos_fix schould work on all devices23:14
_uvos_fix schould work on all devices23:14
_uvos_but no agps so takes a very long time23:14
missMyN900I just really cannot fathom anyone wanting more than a Cortex M in a smartwatch...23:14
missMyN900What is the point?23:14
missMyN900Who would want terrible battery life with a watch?23:15
_uvos_on mapphones you can feed the modem agps info by hand23:15
_uvos_then it locks fast23:15
missMyN900yes, I know23:15
missMyN900but I am being patient :)23:15
missMyN900it is charging anyway23:15
_uvos_mayeb you can do that on pp too23:15
missMyN900network location is greyed out23:15
_uvos_its not implemented23:15
missMyN900it says supl.nokia.com, which I guess is dead23:15
humpelstilzchen[there is a PP script that loads agps data from the internet23:16
missMyN900I guess it talks to the modem?23:16
missMyN900so it should be distro agnostic?23:16
_uvos_you also need to enable high resolution time23:16
humpelstilzchen[PP agps: https://gist.github.com/alastair-dm/263209b54d01209be28828e555fa662823:17
_uvos_on mapphones you must have chrony running23:17
_uvos_otherwise the kernel dosent provide high acuraccy clock if required for agps23:18
missMyN900don't think I will ever be getting a mapphone though unfortunately23:18
humpelstilzchen[missMyN900: also battery life on banglejs watch is ok, unless you enable gps...23:18
_uvos_ie ajdtime fails23:18
missMyN900can't really justify spending money on a smartwatch for the foreseeable future though23:18
missMyN900wait Maep still doesn't show anything even if I am completely zoomed out23:25
_uvos_for some reason in maep you can pan away from the entire world23:27
_uvos_as far as you want23:27
missMyN900it doesn't matter how far I zoom in or out or what map I select23:28
missMyN900wait it has crashed23:28
missMyN900location acquisition has stopped as well23:28
_uvos_might be 64 bit problem23:29
_uvos_it works fine on mapphone23:29
_uvos_maybe check with gdb if you have the time23:29
humpelstilzchen[I believe I had a problem with maep that it did not disable any map until I removed its folders from /home/user23:30
WizzupmissMyN900: btw openmediaplayer is not dead, the port is just not finished23:40
missMyN900ok that is good to hear23:45
missMyN900tried SciTE but it is not very useful23:45
missMyN900I thought it would be GTK2 based and therefore Hildonized23:45
WizzupmissMyN900: thanks for all the testing btw, please keep notes and make bug reports23:45
* Wizzup needs to go afk23:46
Wizzuptravelling tomorrow to make the maemo association on Monday23:46
Wizzup:)23:46
missMyN900also triggering HIM seems to work with neither pluma nor scite with the current image23:46
missMyN900at least on PP23:46
missMyN900volume up does not do anything anymore23:46
missMyN900Wizzup: cool23:47
buZzi have icd2 on hellaverbose, and it seems that every time i boot, it needs to have ofono reproffision my simcard, while ofono normally stores that based on IMSI23:48
WizzupI brought a pinephone and pinetab with me for coming week23:51
Wizzupdo some debugging :)23:51
xmnWoot woot!23:52
missMyN900I am glad they will represented at the MA :D23:53
WizzupMA?23:54

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