| fsmithred | n4dir, I recall that you could have both sysvinit and systemd in debian jessie, and choose which init system to boot. Might have been possible in stretch, too. You can't have runt and sysvinit installed at the same time. | 00:16 |
|---|---|---|
| fsmithred | n4dir, install live-config-runit with runit-init | 00:16 |
| n4dir | fsmithred: ah, good thanks | 00:17 |
| n4dir | i am not willing to experiment with init on this (main) PC, because UEFI involved and all, chroot wouldn't be easy for me | 00:18 |
| n4dir | i will just switch as new hardware arrives | 00:18 |
| n4dir | good to know | 00:18 |
| fsmithred | did you start with a refracta iso? | 00:18 |
| fsmithred | or have one, actually | 00:18 |
| n4dir | yeah, that was refracta | 00:19 |
| n4dir | on the devuan install in qemu i already had runit | 00:19 |
| fsmithred | boot live, mount hard disk, mount uefi partition to /mnt/boot/efi, then run 'bind-mounts /mnt' and say yes, when it asks if you want to chroot | 00:19 |
| n4dir | so easy to, just not used to it | 00:19 |
| n4dir | thanks a lot | 00:20 |
| fsmithred | yeah, if you did it a couple of times it would feel perfectly normal | 00:20 |
| n4dir | i am being honest: i mainly want to switch to runit so i people ask, they don't bother me with sysv being old | 00:21 |
| n4dir | it serves me well, is easy and all | 00:21 |
| fsmithred | lol | 00:21 |
| n4dir | runit seems a little bit lighter though | 00:21 |
| n4dir | "seems" | 00:21 |
| fsmithred | I've only used runit a little, so I can't really say much about it. It works. | 00:23 |
| n4dir | yup. does. i sure tried it with devuan, installation, pretty sure with refracta too, and i have found an antix installation with it | 00:24 |
| n4dir | also void had it, iirc. | 00:24 |
| n4dir | i don't recall any problems anywhere | 00:25 |
| n4dir | only me not knowing it well | 00:25 |
| fsmithred | was it refractainstaller or refractasnapshot that was going to be removed? | 00:26 |
| n4dir | both, but only gui, base stayed | 00:26 |
| n4dir | iirc | 00:26 |
| fsmithred | I see I still haven't fixed the Recommends for refractasnapshot-base. | 00:27 |
| fsmithred | I need to add live-config-runit | 00:27 |
| brocashelm | fsmithred: the runit-services package from experimental converts more scripts over, hence why i had issues restarting network-manager | 00:27 |
| brocashelm | so i guess debian is finally making it happen to get closer to full runit implementation | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | yeah, I have not messed with that yet. I need to start fresh. | 00:28 |
| brocashelm | but where the services are placed is a bit different from what the archwiki says | 00:28 |
| n4dir | i found a wiki site debian about init choice, or init freedo | 00:28 |
| fsmithred | no, I'm the maintainer of live-config-runit | 00:28 |
| n4dir | when searching for what i asked, runit/sysvinit | 00:29 |
| fsmithred | oh, Lorenzo is working toward runit support in Debian. | 00:29 |
| brocashelm | yep | 00:29 |
| brocashelm | but i mean, instead of being in /var/service, it's in /etc/service (IIRC) | 00:29 |
| brocashelm | https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Runit#Usage | 00:29 |
| fsmithred | I know debian uses different locations for some of the files compared to other distros. | 00:30 |
| brocashelm | yeah | 00:31 |
| brocashelm | not sure why they do that. /var is more sensible for service management | 00:32 |
| fsmithred | time for dinner. bbl. | 00:32 |
| brocashelm | i see /etc as where the bulk of your system configs are stored, not services running currently | 00:32 |
| brocashelm | ttyl | 00:32 |
| n4dir | bye | 00:33 |
| hacksenwerk | Hi. | 10:22 |
| hacksenwerk | I have a little cosmetic bug here I think. | 10:22 |
| hacksenwerk | My disk is encrypted. After choosing a kernel to boot from in grub, you get the prompt to dencrypt it. | 10:22 |
| hacksenwerk | How ever, since daedalus this prompt appears in a line where something is already written. | 10:23 |
| hacksenwerk | It looks like this then: https://paste.debian.net/plainh/19429d18 | 10:23 |
| gnarface | odd | 10:23 |
| gnarface | i wonder if you can just add a line to the config file | 10:24 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: to wich config file? grub? | 10:24 |
| gnarface | yea | 10:24 |
| hacksenwerk | ok | 10:24 |
| gnarface | or to whatever is outputting the prompt itself | 10:25 |
| gnarface | i'm not sure if that's grub or something else | 10:25 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: plymouth had solve tat "problem" but I uninstalled plymouth now. | 10:26 |
| onefang | If you can squeeze in a shell command or something, then something like this might help - echo "" | 10:29 |
| hacksenwerk | Sorry was away for some minutes. | 10:41 |
| hacksenwerk | I see that there's still that quiet splash line instead if the default one in grub | 10:42 |
| hacksenwerk | maybe chnaging that again might help. | 10:42 |
| hacksenwerk | It must be chnaged anyway... | 10:42 |
| hacksenwerk | what was the default for: GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT | 10:44 |
| hacksenwerk | Internet always says quiet splash but that's because the distros seem to use plymouth by default... | 10:45 |
| hacksenwerk | I guess only quiet... | 10:45 |
| hacksenwerk | I try this and reboot, brb. | 10:46 |
| hacksenwerk | No that did nothing. | 10:55 |
| hacksenwerk | There's also nothing about that prompt so I don't know where to put an empty line... | 10:57 |
| hacksenwerk | I also reconized, that the tty is a bit broken. | 10:58 |
| hacksenwerk | sometimes at login when I did a typo and press ctr c for exmaple, my pointer flys over the text and text is broken | 10:59 |
| hacksenwerk | so maybe that's all a tty thing? | 10:59 |
| onefang | Maybe the "quiet" means "don't bother properly initing the tty, we wont use it"? | 11:00 |
| hacksenwerk | Hmm.. I don't know.. I give up x) | 11:06 |
| hacksenwerk | It's not a big deal anyway, just cosmetic. But a bit anoying, cause you can miss noticing the pop up of the prompt. | 11:07 |
| hacksenwerk | I think I'll dive deeper now into evilwm | 11:07 |
| hacksenwerk | (why is it called evil?) | 11:07 |
| onefang | Dive deep enough to find out, then tell us. B-) | 11:08 |
| hacksenwerk | onefang: about evilwm? | 11:08 |
| onefang | Yep. | 11:08 |
| hacksenwerk | That's a different thing | 11:08 |
| hacksenwerk | Not about that cosmetic issue. ;) | 11:08 |
| onefang | I know. Guess you didn't get my joke. lol | 11:09 |
| hacksenwerk | Oh dive deep, to find out why it's evil? | 11:10 |
| onefang | Yep. | 11:10 |
| hacksenwerk | lol | 11:10 |
| hacksenwerk | I hope not. xD | 11:10 |
| hacksenwerk | It's pretty small and easy, I don't think I'll find any suprises. ;) | 11:10 |
| hacksenwerk | I'll leave, I have to restart the xsession several times to test options of evilwm. | 11:13 |
| hacksenwerk | See you later. :) | 11:13 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: now the alsa cmus fun happend: | 12:08 |
| hacksenwerk | I'm listening to sound at cmus and wanted to change the volumen in cmus and it didn't work and cmus complained about "mixer is not open" | 12:09 |
| hacksenwerk | I changed then mixer.alsa.channel from PCM to Speaker and restarted cmus and now I can control the volumen in cmus again. :) | 12:09 |
| hacksenwerk | The only problem is: Speaker is my master volume in alsa... | 12:12 |
| hacksenwerk | So if I change the volume in cmus my master volume changes | 12:13 |
| hacksenwerk | But I am not quite sure if this is the default behaviour and cmus just doesn't have it's own volume, like freetube or other applications | 12:14 |
| hacksenwerk | I should have check this in pavucontrol before uninstalling it. x) | 12:14 |
| gnarface | you can always setup a softvol device in your alsa config just for cmus | 12:16 |
| gnarface | also, if you check the CARD value in the output of "aplay -L" you should be able to use that instead of "default" in the cmus config for the name of the alsa device | 12:17 |
| gnarface | ...and then it will use the usb device regardless of which order it shows up | 12:17 |
| hacksenwerk | oh ok :o | 12:17 |
| gnarface | or, you could make the alsa config just assign it to default by name instead of number, so it's always the default regardless of which order it comes up in, then you don't have to change cmus stock config for it to work... that's probably better actually | 12:18 |
| hacksenwerk | Ok I will save that to my notes and maybe come back to it in the future. :) | 12:19 |
| hacksenwerk | Thank you for your explanations! | 12:19 |
| gnarface | if you remove "quiet" from that kernel command-line it might fix the prompt misbehavior by the way | 12:20 |
| gnarface | it will output a bunch more status logs at boot though | 12:20 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: oh quiet too? I only removed splash | 12:21 |
| hacksenwerk | ok I will try that | 12:21 |
| hacksenwerk | brb | 12:29 |
| n4dir | adevices.sh might be of use, though as far i can tell it only uses the commands you'd usually use | 12:31 |
| n4dir | but if you have it in ~/bin, it is easy to have a reminder for those commands | 12:32 |
| n4dir | http://0x0.st/-d__.sh | 12:32 |
| n4dir | in case you trust me, else hunt the ardour forum, they still host it somewhere, it usually came from the jack-website | 12:33 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: so.. it can be said that it is better now, but it also can be said it is not xD | 12:36 |
| hacksenwerk | the prompt now still has no extra line and instead of popping up at the begining of an existing line at now pos up atthe end of an existing line | 12:37 |
| hacksenwerk | xD | 12:37 |
| gnarface | doh | 12:38 |
| gnarface | well it was worth a try | 12:38 |
| hacksenwerk | I wonder: is there something like very quiet for grub, so that it only shows the encryption prompt? | 12:38 |
| hacksenwerk | or at least hide that two lines that shows the kernel (in my paste file) | 12:39 |
| gnarface | dunno | 12:39 |
| hacksenwerk | hmm.. | 12:39 |
| hacksenwerk | I'll do a search... | 12:40 |
| hacksenwerk | It would be nice, cause imho for beginners it is nice to have plymouth, wich hides all that stuff that has the potential to scare them :) | 12:41 |
| hacksenwerk | if theres is such option, plymouth would be obsolete | 12:42 |
| hacksenwerk | hmm seems like not: https://www.kernel.org/doc/html/latest/admin-guide/kernel-parameters.html | 12:47 |
| hacksenwerk | quiet [KNL] Disable most log messages | 12:48 |
| hacksenwerk | that's the only one (I searched for quiet, and for message) | 12:48 |
| hacksenwerk | but there is this here: { null | "" } Use to disable console output, i.e., to have kernel console messages discarded. This must be the only console= parameter used on the kernel command line. | 12:49 |
| hacksenwerk | But I'm not sure if that can be put in GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT= | 12:50 |
| hacksenwerk | And if so, I don't know if it disables that encryption prompt too. xP | 12:50 |
| hacksenwerk | Maybe I ask at #kernel | 12:52 |
| hacksenwerk | gnarface: I tried now loglevel=0 in grub config, but it produces more output than quiet | 13:53 |
| hacksenwerk | someone in #kernel suggested that to me | 13:53 |
| hacksenwerk | Where do I have to go, to suggests adding a new kernel parameter for GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT= | 13:57 |
| hacksenwerk | The kernel devs or the grub devs, or both? | 13:57 |
| hacksenwerk | I would like to suggets them to add a paramter, that hides all messages, except that decryption prompt and it's messages when typing the wrong or the correct passphrase. Something like: GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT=veryquiet or GRUB_CMDLINE_LINUX_DEFAULT=cryptonly or something | 13:59 |
| hacksenwerk | That would also make plymouth useless and therefor save time and effort to develop it. | 13:59 |
| rustyaxe | make it useless? It's been useless for years :P | 14:05 |
| rustyaxe | that'd be a kernel thing tho, and you can already make the kernel quiet | 14:05 |
| rustyaxe | quiet loglevel=0 | 14:06 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: nah it's useful to hide everything except that decryption dialog, Especially beginners can get confused or scared when they see so much output. | 14:10 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: as I posted earlier loglevel=0 is even more verbose than quiet | 14:11 |
| rustyaxe | use them together. | 14:12 |
| rustyaxe | of course beginners will be even more confused when something breaks and theres no useful log output to tell *what* broke.... | 14:13 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: hm.. yeah I will try that | 14:16 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: But that's nothing beginners should have to struggle with. The focus must be, that they stay at the fre os and not going back to micr$oft or apple... | 14:17 |
| hacksenwerk | And tehre are still log files ;) | 14:17 |
| rustyaxe | struggle with? lol | 14:17 |
| rustyaxe | if they're afraid of computers they should stick to smart phones | 14:18 |
| rustyaxe | id much rather have useful console output during boot when the disk well might not even be accessible to the kernel yet | 14:18 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: Yeah great advice, that way you keep linux a niche on desktops... | 14:18 |
| hacksenwerk | yes _you_ | 14:18 |
| hacksenwerk | but others ar _not_ you | 14:18 |
| hacksenwerk | anyway that oft | 14:18 |
| rustyaxe | i dont really care if it idiots can use computers. they have smart phones, tbh, designed just for that. | 14:18 |
| hacksenwerk | rustyaxe: ok you are some extremly arrogant dude. | 14:19 |
| hacksenwerk | Very social ey? | 14:19 |
| onefang | And we have #devuan-offtopic designed just for these sorts of conversations. | 14:19 |
| hacksenwerk | onefang: yes but this is not a conversation, I will block that guy that's healthier I think :) | 14:20 |
| hacksenwerk | The oss club should get rid of their toxic people.... | 14:21 |
| rustyaxe | hacksenwerk: Nah just tired of linux getting less and less useful everywhere elsewhere in the name of making it a desktop OS for people who can barely operate a smart phone. (: | 14:21 |
| rrq | hacksenwerk: apparently you have "insmod progress" in your grub.cfg; remove that to get a clean boot | 15:02 |
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