| ryouma | she wanted to go to doctor and get a new doctor. i said call. | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| LjL | ryouma, uh, below normal? how much below? | 00:00 |
| ryouma | dunno | 00:00 |
| ryouma | and idk if it is a reliable thermometer | 00:01 |
| LjL | usually this thing gives a fever. but i've read of an unusual case that relapsed with a lower than normal temperature. still, there are a ton of other seasonal diseases around... | 00:01 |
| LjL | ryouma, what kind is it? i've got an ear thermometer and it's not realiable at all. armpit/mouth thermometer is still the most reliable in my book... mercury or similar if available, and if electronic, don't take it out right after it beeps, because they usually beep far too soon | 00:02 |
| ryouma | dunno | 00:02 |
| ryouma | ah i will tell her that if i can | 00:02 |
| ryouma | my own case is, gf not wililng to disinfect groceries. so... if they can last, they will sit 9 days. if not, take risk. | 00:03 |
| LjL | ryouma, disinfecting groceries is not something many people will accept to do i'm afraid. i couldn't convince my parents. | 00:04 |
| ryouma | my mother will, but she wants gloves. says can't find them anywhere. i tohught they were still available. i will send her some if i can. | 00:04 |
| LjL | ah too bad. we bought a box of many single-use gloves while they were still available. they may be out now | 00:05 |
| ryouma | at least she can disinfect then wash hands. point face away while doing it or something. she did not say she was low on disinfectant. | 00:05 |
| ryouma | but i will try to get some sent to her | 00:06 |
| LjL | ryouma, face away, so you mean disinfecting like with a spray? | 00:06 |
| ryouma | dunno what she does | 00:06 |
| Albright | I've got a couple boxes of plastic gloves because my ex liked to clean while wearing them instead of just using reusable gloves or bare-handed like a MAN. | 00:06 |
| ryouma | lol | 00:06 |
| LjL | Albright, do it bare-handed with the frequency many women do, and you'll probably find that you don't want to be such a man in the end | 00:07 |
| Albright | LjL: I'm not even talking about using ammonia and stuff. I'm talking about the dishes. | 00:07 |
| Albright | And now that she's gone, I do do all my dishes… bare-handed. It has yet to harm me, AFAIK. | 00:08 |
| Albright | We all have our quirks, I guess. | 00:08 |
| ryouma | "liked to clean" sounds good to me. i would gladly supply infinite gloves. | 00:09 |
| dunnp | some cool SIR modeling of the virus: https://arguablywrong.home.blog/2020/03/10/epidemiological-modeling/ | 00:09 |
| Albright | That's a misinterpretation of what I said. :P | 00:10 |
| ryouma | (yes i used only one interpretation) | 00:10 |
| Birosso | "U.K. Abandons Effort to Contain Virus as 10,000 May Be Infected" ~Bloomberg | 00:12 |
| Birosso | Okay. | 00:12 |
| zirpu[m] | anyone taking bets on how long before some jerk starts saying that xmas is cancelled? | 00:15 |
| LjL | Birosso, just went with the WHO i guess, when the WHO finally declared it a pandemic, that meant they were telling countries they could give up on containment and move on to mitigation | 00:15 |
| LjL | that's the terms they've kept using | 00:15 |
| ryouma | "All countries must strike a fine balance between protecting health, preventing economic and social disruption, and respecting human rights." well i liked the announcement until that sentence. hr are not balanceable, by international law. | 00:19 |
| ryouma | (right to health law and many more) | 00:19 |
| LjL | ryouma, well if you cannot curtain "human rights" at all, then you cannot do a lockdown | 00:20 |
| LjL | lockdown is quite incompatible with freedom of movement | 00:20 |
| LjL | also curtail* i consistently type curtain instead -.- | 00:21 |
| ryouma | i am not talking about quarantine and lockdown but mass atrocities and grave individual hr violations | 00:21 |
| LjL | ryouma, well sure, i can agree with that, but "human rights" are many things, including freedom of movement | 00:22 |
| ryouma | although the right ot health law is specific about a lto of normal health care things. factsheet 31. countries cannot use excuses to violate. | 00:22 |
| ryouma | LjL: yes, it gets confusing | 00:23 |
| Aooh | Y'all alive still? | 00:26 |
| Birosso | Ye-- *hachoo* Yes. | 00:26 |
| MoNsTeR | nobody is talking did coronavirus wipe you out | 00:27 |
| MoNsTeR | hola | 00:27 |
| Aooh | Kay NO one is talking figured y'all might be in distress. | 00:27 |
| MoNsTeR | great there is life | 00:27 |
| MoNsTeR | i was getting paranoid | 00:27 |
| mandiblegrip | MoNsTeR: Wipe you out financially? Or medically? | 00:28 |
| Aooh | *washe's hands* | 00:28 |
| Aooh | omy. | 00:28 |
| Aooh | Wash's* | 00:28 |
| MoNsTeR | both | 00:28 |
| mandiblegrip | MoNsTeR: Financially yes, medically soon. | 00:28 |
| MoNsTeR | my crypto took a killing today | 00:28 |
| zirpu[m] | awww. Disnyland is closing for the duration. i've never been, and never intend to go. so not really sad. | 00:29 |
| bigfluff | You know that's causing tantrums everywhere :) | 00:29 |
| MoNsTeR | yes mickey and mini did not wash there hands | 00:29 |
| IronY | Canadian users! | 00:30 |
| Aooh | where? | 00:30 |
| MoNsTeR | it is very important to have good hygiene | 00:31 |
| ryouma | gf going to stoer to get just one thing. doesn't want to wear gloves i have offered. | 00:31 |
| LjL | ryouma, right now we can't legally visit relatives unless they need care, for instance. that's nothing like torture but it's easy to argue it's a human right that's taken away | 00:31 |
| shotakoe1 | btw thanks Doug Ford (Ontario) for closing schools today | 00:31 |
| shotakoe1 | finally something is being done | 00:31 |
| shotakoe1 | now all morons who don't understand what is happening right now simply *have* stay home | 00:32 |
| shotakoe1 | fine gambit ) | 00:32 |
| ryouma | LjL: cases like lockdowns in pandemics might already be covered by the law as permissible exceptions. i do not know. | 00:32 |
| ryouma | but "we don't feel like it" is not a permissible exception. | 00:33 |
| MoNsTeR | yes close and decontaminate all schools and stores right away aye | 00:33 |
| Aooh | I heard the canadian goverment is allowing folks to stay home without having to worry about losing their jobs. | 00:33 |
| Aooh | that is cool. | 00:33 |
| ryouma | my own belief is that all countries should have taken actions muych earlier | 00:33 |
| ryouma | like cancelling public events and so on | 00:34 |
| shotakoe1 | Aooh: do you have a link for this? | 00:34 |
| Aooh | I agree @ Ryouma | 00:34 |
| MoNsTeR | very nice. they must be fans of bernie sanders | 00:34 |
| MoNsTeR | freeeee money without working | 00:34 |
| Birosso | Same in a lot of European countries, if it ever comes to that point. | 00:34 |
| shotakoe1 | I think it is still up to what companies decide | 00:35 |
| shotakoe1 | maybe there's some govt compensation | 00:35 |
| Aooh | I heard it from a healthcare provider but I didnt see the link Just look it up. its either in effect or about to be. | 00:35 |
| shotakoe1 | ok will search | 00:36 |
| Birosso | In most of Europe you get sick leave as much as you need. | 00:36 |
| Birosso | I know I do in Germany. | 00:36 |
| shotakoe1 | was about to work from home next week | 00:36 |
| Aooh | it be a good choice if you are sick. | 00:36 |
| Birosso | In addition to 3 days of paid time off for every 20 days worked. | 00:36 |
| shotakoe1 | no, in my case I just freaking out how careless and ignorant some people are | 00:37 |
| shotakoe1 | to the extent of wanting to self-isolate :) | 00:37 |
| LjL | Birosso, in Italy if you get it repeatedly your pay starts being reduced progressively | 00:37 |
| Aooh | I also heard that if you know you have it and go out into the world and cough on people you can have a huge fine I forget what they charge is but do you really want to deal with that. | 00:37 |
| LjL | Birosso, it was done because people took advantage of it with the help of dishonest doctors, but as always, it harms people who actually do just get sick | 00:38 |
| Birosso | LjL, I don't think the law is like that here. But employers will definitely bear down upon you, in the nicest way possible, and start demanding extra proof if you start being absent too much. | 00:39 |
| shotakoe1 | it feels like some companies are waiting to see when someone actually gets sick and then implement measures based on that | 00:39 |
| Aooh | the common cold/flu if you are infected and go out and "spread it" will infect 1 person every 20 mins.. yet the corona is 2.5 people with one sneeze.. idk how or why they said 2.5 like a you can only infect half a person now? | 00:39 |
| Birosso | In respectable establishments they instill loyalty and a sense of belonging into employees to minimise abuse of benefits. | 00:39 |
| Birosso | It's really something. | 00:39 |
| claudius323 | %data us | 00:40 |
| Brainstorm | claudius323: In all areas, US, there are 1680 cases, 2 deaths (0.1% of cases), 1610 recoveries as of March 12, 23:25Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 00:40 |
| LjL | yikes | 00:41 |
| Birosso | OH MY GOD! | 00:41 |
| Birosso | MERCY! | 00:41 |
| claudius323 | %data us | 00:41 |
| Brainstorm | claudius323: In all areas, US, there are 1680 cases, 2 deaths (0.1% of cases), 1610 recoveries as of March 12, 23:25Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 00:41 |
| LjL | the hell is up with the Matrix bridge, didn't it make long messages into URLs | 00:41 |
| LjL | Birosso, AS I WAS SAYING BEFORE THE BOT CRAPPED OUT ON US, oh you do need to provide a decent amount of proof here in general, partly because part of the cost is born by the state, not just the employer. as soon as you're sick, you must go to your doctor to obtain a sickness certificate (but if you're sick, shouldn't you stay at home?! well no), and then, you can be sick for the number of days your doctor prescribes. during those days, you must always be | 00:41 |
| LjL | at home except during some hours when you're allowed to, say, buy groceries. you can have surprise visits by state doctors. if you're not found at home, you incur fines | 00:41 |
| Aooh | I mean 14 days off.. any more and I am guessing they would be like okay time to come back to work. I think I heard the incubation period for it is 10-14 days. | 00:41 |
| skyofdust | My text to speech script is going bonkers haha | 00:42 |
| Birosso | I think a major difference between the two countries is the lower liklihood of a doctor in Germany being dishonest. | 00:42 |
| LjL | Birosso, probably | 00:42 |
| Birosso | They make *very* good money. | 00:42 |
| LjL | Birosso, not here. also, in the south, there are huge issues (at least perceived as huge) with fake disability, certified by, well, fake doctors i guess | 00:43 |
| LjL | Birosso, the police busted "blind" people who were driving cars, things like that | 00:43 |
| Birosso | :/ | 00:43 |
| Birosso | German nurses can be very scary, though. | 00:44 |
| Birosso | Niels Högel | 00:44 |
| Aooh | oh here they tell you to stay home NOT TO GO TO THE DOCTORS unless your having difficulty breathing or have other medical issues.. and when or of you do need to go they want you to call in and let them know you think you may have the virus to they can be ready in PPE. | 00:44 |
| shotakoe1 | Aooh: where are you? | 00:45 |
| Aooh | but yeah here they are telling us to stay home. | 00:45 |
| Aooh | Great white north. | 00:45 |
| superkuh | Just found out my local hospital doesn't even have anyone to do overnight respiratory therapy on staff. They haven't set up any mechanical ventilators and have no isolation rooms set up. Sent the first local positive patient to the next city over. | 00:46 |
| Aooh | Oh that is not good at all. | 00:46 |
| superkuh | Local staff broke HIPPA and leaked to a local conversation list. | 00:46 |
| LjL | we're also told to stay home and call the doctor if we have compatible symptoms. if we think we actually have covid, we're told to call 112. | 00:47 |
| Aooh | yea here as well @ LJL | 00:47 |
| Aooh | They want to break the chain of infection. | 00:47 |
| Aooh | so far its been helping.. I think we have only had one death and they cant say forsure if it was due to the virus/ but she did have the virus. | 00:48 |
| Aooh | out of 103 cases. | 00:49 |
| LjL | Germany managed to score no death out of... very many cases, although they have some now. but i feel there must be some differences in how/when they count and report them | 00:49 |
| LjL | recoveries are even worse, they're reported in all sorts of different ways, the numbers aren't even remotely comparable | 00:49 |
| ryouma | is it just me or has amazon only recently gotten more confusing with sponsored ads and featured items and not showing the products you actually want? | 00:51 |
| Aooh | oh yeah I mean in alot of cases its not reported due to people just self caring for themself or unaware they have the virus. in The USA alot of people cant afford the medical attention so alot of cases go unknown there due to not having the funds to seek medical attention. | 00:51 |
| LjL | ryouma, not sure about the sponsored ones, but i find Amazon search terrible in a multitude of ways | 00:51 |
| Aooh | So the reports are going to be flawd. | 00:51 |
| darsie | %data austria | 00:52 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +875 cases (now 134825), +3307 deaths (now 4689), +48446 recoveries (now 109071) 🔶 New York, US: +108 cases (now 328) 🔶 Hubei, China: +8 cases (now 67781), +10 deaths (now 3056), +1184 recoveries (now 50318) 🔶 China: +136 cases (now 80932), +3172 deaths (now 3172), +48110 recoveries (now 62901) 🔸 Australia: +3 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Canada: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +7 cases ( | 00:52 |
| Aooh | and come on people leave some TOILET PAPER for the rest of us.. fricking hoarders. | 00:53 |
| Aooh | :) | 00:53 |
| Birosso | EUROPE IS SO WEIRD! | 00:53 |
| Aooh | everywhere is weird. | 00:53 |
| Brainstorm | darsie: In all areas, Austria, there are 361 cases, 1 deaths (0.3% of cases), 356 recoveries as of March 12, 23:41Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Austria for time series data. | 00:53 |
| Birosso | Out of all things, toilet paper! I swear, I haven't laughed this hard in ages. | 00:53 |
| Birosso | Need the cartoon now, hold on. | 00:54 |
| BruntLIVE | toliet paper is different than toliet tissue | 00:54 |
| Birosso | https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/picture/2020/mar/08/ben-jennings-on-britains-coronavirus-composure-cartoon | 00:54 |
| BruntLIVE | its all about the ply quality | 00:54 |
| LjL | China sure had a lot of recoveries all at a time... | 00:54 |
| Aooh | right.. I mean good gosh.. Id be more into stocking up on soap and food incase you need to stay home for 14 days due to getting the virus.. And it dont give people to shits so... makes no sense. | 00:54 |
| claudius323 | anybody know the accurate numbers for the United States? | 00:55 |
| BruntLIVE | https://img.pr0gramm.com/2020/03/13/8a62f8f0bbdc457a.jpg | 00:55 |
| ryouma | serious q but why would there be accurate numbers? are epidemiologists eveywhere? | 00:56 |
| darsie | BruntLIVE: What's going on there? | 00:56 |
| Birosso | It's a joke on the TP hoarding. | 00:57 |
| Birosso | Looks like a drug dealer's setup, but they're packaging TP. | 00:57 |
| LjL | ryouma, there aren't accurate numbers | 00:57 |
| darsie | :) | 00:57 |
| LjL | ryouma, there wouldn't be accurate numbers even if epidemiologists *were* everywhere, tbh | 00:57 |
| Birosso | This entire TP situation is truly hilarious. | 00:57 |
| Aooh | oh yeah I saw that picture. lmao. | 00:57 |
| LjL | Birosso, right? | 00:57 |
| LjL | Birosso, next people will raid italian homes armed with hatchets to steal bidets | 00:58 |
| Birosso | LjL: I kid you not. I am typing through tears right now. | 00:58 |
| Birosso | Shhh! | 00:58 |
| darsie | If you have a bathtub, sit on the edge and shower your bum. | 00:58 |
| LjL | Birosso, salty water damages keyboards | 00:58 |
| Birosso | Some people don't yet know about bidets! | 00:58 |
| Timvde | Not sure if it's been posted yet, but: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00660-x | 01:00 |
| orgg | had one shipped to me by a friend... addressed to flaming roids inc - but that was a while ago when he was on a kick about how I really just needed to get one. | 01:00 |
| LjL | Timvde, not that i saw | 01:01 |
| Aooh | https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/index.html | 01:01 |
| MoNsTeR | This is the best corona virus tracker i have found https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 | 01:01 |
| orgg | https://rinseworks.com/product/abt-360-the-aquaus-360-handheld-bidet-for-toilet-nsf-certified-3-year-warranty | 01:01 |
| LjL | Timvde, but a lot has been written on the "spikes" and the ACE2 receptor, which this seems to be about | 01:01 |
| LjL | Timvde, honestly it's a bit over my head | 01:02 |
| Timvde | Yea, for me too | 01:02 |
| Timvde | I just figured some people here might find it interesting | 01:02 |
| LjL | Timvde, the ACE2 thing is interesting because there are ACE2-related drugs that might theoretically help... but i got lost on my way to figuring out *which* of many flavors could even theoretically be beneficial | 01:08 |
| ryouma | i might be mistaken or spouting irrelevant stuff but ace inhibitors can cause angioedema | 01:14 |
| LjL | ryouma, i am definitely not suggesting anyone take any medicines just because there's some theory that they might help, given they can also assuredly cause many side effects. at least not until/unless 1) you actually do have COVID 2) the healthcare system is unable to help you anymore | 01:15 |
| yn | any articles about the impact on potentially immuno-compromised folks? | 01:16 |
| ryouma | good q | 01:16 |
| ryouma | (i am) | 01:17 |
| yn | i might be | 01:17 |
| ryouma | had igg tested? | 01:17 |
| ryouma | subclasses | 01:17 |
| yn | igg tested | 01:17 |
| ryouma | below the new normal range? | 01:17 |
| yn | it's lupus-like but not lupus | 01:17 |
| ryouma | had anti-ds dna tested? | 01:17 |
| yn | i'm way over range | 01:17 |
| LjL | yn, none that in know in particular, but since my sister is on cyclosporin, to make me feel better i was told cyclosporin has actually seemed to help some people with SARS, and this virus is similar, and it also seems to (at least sometimes) cause serious damage due to the immune system overreacting | 01:17 |
| yn | ryouma: yes | 01:17 |
| ryouma | over range on which? | 01:17 |
| yn | lemme double check | 01:18 |
| LjL | so if you're not *severely* immunocompromised, at least, who knows, maybe having a slightly weaker immune system isn't necessarily a terrible thing... | 01:18 |
| yn | it's in my mychart | 01:18 |
| skyofdust | I've heard about Cloroquine and Hydroxicloroquine working | 01:18 |
| ryouma | depends on which parts of the immune system presmably. i have high inflammatory cytokines. that is potentially a concern.l | 01:18 |
| ryouma | chloroquine might or might not be a concern wrt fluoroquinolone poisoning | 01:19 |
| LjL | chloroquine is definitely not a candy bar | 01:19 |
| Albright | So today I'm getting emails from the animal shelter where I got my cat and the tire place where I got tires four years ago, and my cable internet provider about the steps they are taking against the virus. | 01:19 |
| ryouma | right | 01:19 |
| Albright | Oh, and also Chick-Fil-A. | 01:19 |
| ryouma | what steps are they taking? will internet be continued? | 01:19 |
| Albright | I don't know. I didn't read it. | 01:19 |
| LjL | ryouma, yes that sounds like a concern. but i don't understand thes ethings, really... you are immunocompromised *but* you have high inflammatory cytokines? in my simple understanding that's a sign of a hyperactive immune system. so i'm certainly missing something | 01:20 |
| yn | ryouma: mine is antiphospholipd antibodies | 01:20 |
| yn | i don't have the syndrome yet since i haven't had a blood clot yet | 01:20 |
| ryouma | LjL: immune system is highly complex. igg is one part; cytokines are another part. anti-ds dna is a marker of sle. | 01:21 |
| ryouma | i.e. autoimmunity | 01:21 |
| yn | i've been told i have sle but it's not lupus itself, but in the family of lupus | 01:21 |
| ryouma | sle is colloquially lupus | 01:21 |
| ryouma | thre is another lupus that is not the same | 01:22 |
| ryouma | waht is your anti-ds dna level? | 01:22 |
| ryouma | (and range) | 01:22 |
| ryouma | (no need to sayif you do not want to) | 01:22 |
| yn | ryouma: "Beta 2 Glycoprotein 1 Antibody, IgG" | 01:22 |
| yn | STD: 0.0 - 20.0 CU | 01:23 |
| ryouma | in any case, i do not know any answers re immuyne system abnormalities | 01:23 |
| yn | i'm 2,709.2 CU | 01:23 |
| ryouma | dunno that test | 01:23 |
| ryouma | i was referring to subclasses 1-4 | 01:23 |
| yn | "Beta 2 Glycoprotein 1 Antibody, IgM" is 129.2 CU normal is 0 - 20 | 01:23 |
| LjL | i infer that's highly out of range. what do i win? | 01:23 |
| yn | "Antibody to double stranded DNA measurement (ds-DNA antibody, quant)" is 31.7 IU/mL | 01:24 |
| ryouma | ok that's not too much above normal probably if it is anything like the test i took | 01:24 |
| yn | LjL: ikr? | 01:24 |
| skyofdust | Yeah hydroxicloroquine is also prescribed for malaria, more research is being made to check the blood concentration needed for COVID-19 and its translation to dosage.It's suspected the needed concentration to be close to the one needed for malaria. | 01:24 |
| skyofdust | Since the mechanism of action would be pretty close. | 01:24 |
| yn | ryouma: mine is some rare genetic thing; they are still figuring out what the genetic diagnosis is | 01:24 |
| ryouma | good! you have doctos on it. | 01:25 |
| yn | my ANA is all over the place, one month I'll be positive with a titer 1:2000+ and the next month i'm negative | 01:25 |
| ryouma | mine is all over the place also | 01:25 |
| yn | yeah, i'm seeing a cardiologist, rheumatologist, and recently a hematologist | 01:25 |
| LjL | it gives me outrage whenever i hear people saying this thing won't be a big deal because, basically, it won't affect them as healthy non-elderly. someone my parents are not important at all, and you two are not important at all. as long as they can go to a crammed stadium and spit while yelling to their team. | 01:25 |
| yn | ryouma: i might be getting my dna sequenced at work as part of a study | 01:26 |
| yn | i was talking to someone and they put me in contact with a genetic counselor | 01:26 |
| yn | so who knows | 01:26 |
| bigfluff | LjL: yes, and don't even bother to practice good hygiene, because...meh, screw everyone else | 01:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 00:24 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Italy's death toll tops 1,000, Formula One cancels the Australian GP → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 01:27 |
| LjL | Brainstorm, I KNOW GEE | 01:28 |
| yn | ryouma: but, yeah, they are still figuring it out; i e-mailed my rheumatologist to see if i'm considered "immunocompromised" | 01:28 |
| yn | haven't heard back yet | 01:28 |
| yn | ryouma: https://i.imgur.com/tBi0Xyf.png | 01:30 |
| Albright | %title https://www.mercurynews.com/2020/03/12/coronavirus-infected-tsa-employees-at-mineta-san-jose-airport-patted-down-passengers-put-hands-on-travel-documents/ | 01:31 |
| Brainstorm | Albright: Couldn't load page from www.mercurynews.com (416: Requested Range Not Satisfiable). | 01:31 |
| Albright | "Coronavirus: Infected TSA employees at Mineta San Jose Airport patted down passengers, put hands on travel documents" | 01:31 |
| Albright | The San Jose airport is the one commonly used for getting into and out of Silicon Valley. SFO has more international flights though. | 01:32 |
| LjL | well there's some good candidates for US superspreaders then | 01:32 |
| Albright | We cancelled the NHL and the NBA… time to cancel the TSA. | 01:32 |
| LjL | oh if only | 01:33 |
| LjL | maybe i'd go to the US one day if that were the case | 01:33 |
| Albright | Even most politically conservative Americans hate those assholes. | 01:36 |
| berndj | LjL, i think i understand your "outrage", but i feel like it's a translation issue, and not necessarily callousness | 01:38 |
| berndj | i don't mean translation as from english to italian. i mean as in translating meaning into words and back into meaning (lossy medium model of communication) | 01:38 |
| LjL | berndj, well what about, you get told "avoid gatherings, don't go to pubs, or this may very well kill your parents" on TV, and then you see some big crowds at pubs etc, and they're interviewed and they're like *shrug* "i don't care it doesn't affect me" | 01:39 |
| LjL | i'm not sure what there is to translate there, except maybe italian to whatever-their-heads-speak | 01:40 |
| berndj | i think they just don't know what a big deal this is. they're still in "this is just like the flu" mode | 01:40 |
| berndj | another idea comes to mind: the notion of "rational irrationality". or "bounded rationality" | 01:41 |
| LjL | berndj, there is also denial, although i think i've seen that more in people actually at risk, than in the ones putting them at more of a risk | 01:45 |
| LjL | anyway i don't grok much philosophy, but the article about "rational irrationality" on wikipedia doesn't take long to mention religion, so... it may be a theoretically neat way to describe some of the kinds of people i just don't like, anyway | 01:45 |
| berndj | the basic idea IIRC is that humans have finite time and cognitive resources. there's a cost to being "perfectly rational", and we evolved in an environment that demanded a cost/benefit tradeoff on that axis. so we work by heuristic ways of thinking | 01:47 |
| LjL | berndj, that sounds like bounded rationality. irrational rationality sounded a bit different on wikipedia | 01:48 |
| LjL | i think i can understand (in terms of accepting) bounded rationality better | 01:48 |
| LjL | irrationality even | 01:48 |
| LjL | no, rationality | 01:48 |
| LjL | i look at this graph https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy;Korea,%20South and apart from it having a glitch right now, i struggle to read it as anything but "we're royally fucked" | 01:52 |
| LjL | pardon my french | 01:52 |
| MoNsTeR | https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 | 01:58 |
| LjL | hmm? | 01:59 |
| contingo | the latest non-authoritative data shows you have 13,000 new recoveries today | 02:00 |
| contingo | so let's hope that's the case ;( | 02:00 |
| LjL | contingo, however we calculate recoveries | 02:00 |
| LjL | who even knows | 02:01 |
| eviscerate | The deadliest killer in human history: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qosf9EkEr28 | 02:01 |
| LjL | contingo, it does the same for korea though | 02:01 |
| LjL | i guess there's some people who are feeling doubly well | 02:01 |
| contingo | oh yeah | 02:03 |
| LjL | contingo, i don't like the sound of this https://youtu.be/9mrPHO-nkVE?t=57 :( | 02:05 |
| LjL | and i don't mean just his accent | 02:06 |
| contingo | the wikipedia list of pandemics through history is engrossing | 02:06 |
| contingo | many wormholes spiral from it | 02:06 |
| ryouma | rational ignorance is the term that i am familiar with. but it can be manipulated. | 02:08 |
| contingo | he gives a very very long answer to "are you having to choose who gets life-saving treatment, and who doesn't because of limited resources" | 02:12 |
| contingo | when I think if the answer was no he would just say no | 02:12 |
| python476 | what's that movie | 02:16 |
| python476 | the day earth stood still ? | 02:17 |
| contingo | good interview | 02:17 |
| LjL | contingo, the answer is yes, it's been yes for a while... but he said it in a similar way as my hospital-working connection said it: "they always do this kind of evaluation, really, you don't hear about it, but they do". however, i do feel there's a difference between not giving someone an ICU bed when you *have* an ICU bed because you genuinely think you'll just be making them suffer longer for no reason, and knowing that your ICU beds are saturated | 02:24 |
| berndj | contingo, i read it as partly euphemism for "yes, we choose who dies due to limited resources" and just plain "even with the resources normally available, we can't help this patient more than we harm them" | 02:24 |
| LjL | contingo, also, i've read the official recommendations that have been sent out by the anesthesiologist union, and it really does spell out that if there are no beds available anymore, they should set an age ceiling | 02:25 |
| LjL | contingo, he also used the word "triage", which is not very ominous here because we use it entirely differently in an ER setting, at least in layman understanding, but i've seen english-speaking people here react to that word in the "woah, it's war then" way | 02:26 |
| contingo | is your hospital-working connection an anaesthesiologist? | 02:27 |
| LjL | contingo, anyway the part i didn't like the sound of was that they seem to be starting to see progressively younger patients have bad symptoms. i mean... the triage and selection part, i definitely also don't like, but i was simply already aware of it :( | 02:27 |
| LjL | contingo, no | 02:27 |
| contingo | one of mine is | 02:27 |
| kreyren | mainwhile in czech republic https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tGzrJrAmrk | 02:28 |
| contingo | fairly senior, in Birmingham. Was due to stay with him this weekend for the camera expo before everything got cancelled. has sent some very hurried texts | 02:29 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +140 cases (now 134965) 🔶 Korea, South: +110 cases (now 7979) 🔸 Australia: +3 deaths (now 3) 🔸 Canada: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +7 cases (now 46) 🔸 Ontario, Canada: +1 cases (now 42) 🔸 Quebec, Canada: +1 cases (now 9) 🔸 US: +30 cases (now 1716), +29 recoveries (now 1645) | 02:29 |
| contingo | I would transcribe them here but they add no info | 02:30 |
| LjL | contingo, are things hectic already? | 02:31 |
| contingo | i get the feeling yes | 02:32 |
| contingo | OK I'll copy the last msg | 02:32 |
| LjL | contingo, might be a good thing... if they're hectically getting ready for what's to come, rather than struggling to deal with that's already there | 02:33 |
| contingo | get ur mask on doood!!! yeh will give u a shout once apocalypse blown over xxx | 02:33 |
| contingo | lol | 02:33 |
| LjL | ooookaaay | 02:33 |
| contingo | he's a bit dizzy | 02:34 |
| contingo | at the best of times | 02:34 |
| LjL | does he inject himself with what he's meant to inject patients with | 02:34 |
| contingo | he may have slight self-injecting tendencies | 02:35 |
| LjL | contingo, i think unless i manage to snatch surgical masks somewhere, i'll just pass on wearing these stupid fpp1 masks (aside from the fact that i've only one clean one left), first time i got a sore throat and felt generally meh, second time it gave me a headache. and that for potentially not protecting me nearly at all | 02:39 |
| contingo | I have no idea if he meant that facetiously or as a genuine imploration | 02:41 |
| contingo | I haven't been using my masks yet. I've been drawing my hoodies tight, to eye slit level sometimes though | 02:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 01:37 UTC: NY attorney general orders InfoWars' Alex Jones to stop selling coronavirus 'treatment' products: New York's attorney general said Thursday that her office has ordered InfoWars' Alex Jones to immediately stop selling and marketing products as a "cure" or "treatment" for the coronavirus. → https://is.gd/4sDXka | 02:45 |
| orgg | What a moron, LjL | 02:50 |
| LjL | i know | 02:50 |
| Poon_ | %data sweden | 03:02 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: In all areas, Sweden, there are 687 cases, 1 deaths (0.1% of cases), 685 recoveries as of March 13, 01:40Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Sweden for time series data. | 03:02 |
| bigfluff | %data oregon | 03:03 |
| Brainstorm | bigfluff: In Oregon, US, there are 24 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 01:40Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 03:03 |
| sneep | > Jones has been selling toothpaste, dietary supplements, creams and several other products through his website that claim to treat or prevent and cure the coronavirus | 03:03 |
| sneep | mkay | 03:03 |
| LjL | Jones being? | 03:03 |
| sneep | > NY attorney general orders InfoWars' Alex Jones to stop selling coronavirus 'treatment' products | 03:04 |
| skyofdust | Jesus, what a disgusting human being | 03:04 |
| LjL | vultures | 03:04 |
| sneep | He's famous for being batshit crazy and still having people who listen to him | 03:04 |
| LjL | sneep, i think humanity is famous for crazy things like that | 03:05 |
| LjL | we're probably some aliens' favorite sitcom, but obviously i got that from Futurama | 03:05 |
| python476 | man there must be countless meetings | 03:08 |
| python476 | what if the economic shag ripples into energy infrastructure and water supply issues | 03:09 |
| sneep | https://www.vox.com/2018/8/6/17655658/alex-jones-facebook-youtube-conspiracy-theories he's also famous for this | 03:09 |
| sneep | %title | 03:09 |
| Brainstorm | sneep: From www.vox.com: Alex Jones banned from YouTube, Facebook, and Apple, explained - Vox | 03:09 |
| LjL | python476, didn't happen in Wuhan, i am hopeful it won't | 03:09 |
| LjL | if it does there's no amount of prepping i can do in the time required, so meh | 03:09 |
| python476 | stoic much | 03:09 |
| LjL | more like... no, i don't know more like what, but stoic, i doubt it | 03:10 |
| python476 | my question is selfish .. no more electricity no more bitcoin mining, no more bitcoin | 03:10 |
| berndj | python476, here in south africa we're sitting with rolling blackouts (unrelated to the virus) | 03:10 |
| LjL | python476, true enough, i should cash in | 03:11 |
| python476 | berndj: what are these ? | 03:11 |
| python476 | oh .. | 03:11 |
| python476 | temporary cuts | 03:11 |
| LjL | berndj, we've had those for a couple of summers but i don't think it would even remotely compared to a complete energy and water supply breakdown... | 03:12 |
| berndj | python476, the kleptocrats have thoroughly rekt the electricity system, so the last few days the power's been going out 3x daily for 2 hours at a time | 03:12 |
| python476 | agreable.. | 03:12 |
| LjL | python476, it's when you're using the A/C and your stupid neighbors all decide to use it at the same time | 03:12 |
| python476 | yeah, the kettle bug | 03:13 |
| LjL | python476, then the energy supplier decides that one of you won't be using any A/C for two hours each week | 03:13 |
| LjL | ... or more, depending on just how much power they're buying from France that France is no longer selling | 03:13 |
| python476 | we were in the process of shutting nuclear plants | 03:14 |
| LjL | python476, well we're so much better than you since we've banned nuclear plants back in 1987 | 03:14 |
| LjL | then we've merely bought most of our energies off your nuclear plants | 03:14 |
| LjL | it worked for a while! | 03:14 |
| RougeRR | uk is fucking us | 03:24 |
| RougeRR | we r fucked | 03:24 |
| Potato1 | is the bot active? | 03:27 |
| Potato1 | \corona UK | 03:27 |
| Potato1 | nope | 03:27 |
| LjL | wrong bot | 03:28 |
| LjL | %covid uk | 03:28 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 590 cases, 2 deaths (0.3% of cases), 562 recoveries as of March 13, 02:15Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 03:28 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.1% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 0.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). | 03:28 |
| LjL | there is not only one bot on the whole of freenode y'know | 03:28 |
| dunnp | only 2 uk deaths? | 03:30 |
| LjL | possibly, but i'm not sure, Italy's numbers are currently broken on JHU (or at least the bot's datafeed of it) | 03:31 |
| LjL | but well yeah it doesn't look like the numbers went *down* | 03:32 |
| dunnp | ah other sites say 10 deaths | 03:32 |
| LjL | the 562 recoveries are made up though | 03:32 |
| LjL | %covid united kingdom | 03:33 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 590 cases, 2 deaths (0.3% of cases), 562 recoveries as of March 13, 02:15Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 03:33 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.1% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 0.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). | 03:33 |
| dunnp | says 18 everywhere else | 03:33 |
| dunnp | strange | 03:33 |
| LjL | dunnp, there's something fishy in the data feed | 03:33 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, UK is currently reporting "United Kingdom;;590;+2;562;1584065700000" | 03:34 |
| LjL | the +2 looks like an increment, since the actual deaths are 10 | 03:34 |
| LjL | also, recoveries are all wrong for... most countries | 03:34 |
| dunnp | only 3 US states with no cases now | 03:34 |
| kreyren | ah it is | 03:34 |
| kreyren | Can i somehow subscript to brainstorm's tracking of cases? | 03:35 |
| LjL | kreyren, there is no such specific functionality but if you want to be subjected to all of the updates in PM, i can do that | 03:36 |
| kreyren | LjL, i would thank you | 03:36 |
| LjL | kreyren, there is also ##alerts that's currently mostly just spouting out those data (with the odd earthquake and other natural catastrophe mixed in) | 03:36 |
| kreyren | LjL, joined | 03:37 |
| Spec | can i subscribe to catfacts via brainstorm | 03:39 |
| dunnp | having a nice italian red tonight LjL | 03:40 |
| dunnp | anything new in Italy? | 03:40 |
| LjL | dunnp, yeah we hadn't had a surprise press conference announcing an emergency law tonight, i'm wondering if Conte is alright | 03:40 |
| LjL | hopefully he hasn't caught it like Trudeau and Trump and Bolsonero (who may or may not have or have not caught it or not) | 03:41 |
| dunnp | trump? | 03:41 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: roger | 03:42 |
| LjL | dunnp, nah not really, but he had some contact with positive people | 03:42 |
| dunnp | yea | 03:42 |
| Spec | when is burning man? | 03:42 |
| Albright | NOOOOOO XFL games have been cancelled | 03:42 |
| dunnp | hoping my conference in italy reschedules to be there when this is all over - I've never been to Milan | 03:42 |
| Albright | Damn it to hell! They've messed with football now! | 03:42 |
| LjL | dunnp, it's pretty enjoyable with few people around, just have to hide from the police | 03:43 |
| LjL | actually i have no idea, i only went to the pharmacy wearing a dodgy mask, then saw a scary line in front of a supermarket and prayed delivery services aren't going to stop | 03:44 |
| dunnp | yea | 03:44 |
| dunnp | I need to work out the best time to go shopping | 03:44 |
| LjL | i also didn't see any police, while i did see many police car in the central square, doing absolutely nothing, while a TV reporter stated that the square was actually deserted and Milanese were respecting the rules | 03:45 |
| dunnp | LjL: has your family always been from that part of Italy? | 03:45 |
| LjL | maybe they should try venturing into the parts of Milan that aren't... that square, too | 03:45 |
| LjL | dunnp, pretty much yeah | 03:45 |
| LjL | i mean, pretty much just from Milan and/or suburbs | 03:45 |
| dunnp | ah I am 1/4 Sicilian | 03:45 |
| LjL | was in Sicily a good few years ago, bit of a hectic holiday | 03:46 |
| dunnp | or according to 23andme 26.2% | 03:46 |
| LjL | we were ten people in a rented house with four bathroms, but... no water, at least not for long | 03:46 |
| dunnp | I've never been to Sicily though | 03:46 |
| Albright | Pierre Trudeau's wife's son's wife has tested positive. | 03:47 |
| Spec | LjL: are people out and about still? | 03:47 |
| LjL | Albright, i have NO idea who you just referred to | 03:47 |
| LjL | Spec, haven't gotten my face out of the apartment today | 03:48 |
| Albright | LjL: Sophie Trudeau, wife of Justin Trudeau, the current PM of Canada. | 03:48 |
| LjL | Albright, oh, her. | 03:48 |
| Zalyssa | someone doesn't know canadian political history. | 03:48 |
| Albright | Justin is the son of Pierre Trudeau, a former PM who was far more competent. | 03:49 |
| Spec | LjL: probably for the best | 03:49 |
| LjL | but i mean, even if i did, i just cannot parse that degree of family tree | 03:49 |
| Albright | "Competent" is the wrong word but let's go with it. | 03:49 |
| Zalyssa | it's not that complex, lol | 03:49 |
| LjL | Spec, from today's press conference, a reporter complained of having been bullied by police and threatened with fines for taking the dog out | 03:49 |
| LjL | Spec, later, the police published a list of things you can and cannot do, specifically mentioning getting dog out for poop as admissible | 03:50 |
| Spec | this is all a ploy for dog walkers to take over | 03:50 |
| LjL | Spec, they were pretty much already there | 03:50 |
| LjL | Spec, can't go to a park without it being filled with unleashed dogs owning the place | 03:50 |
| LjL | Spec, i listened to a podcast interview with a doctor who claimed China's and Italy's measures are probably counterproductive, but i have a hard time fathoming whatever would work better | 03:52 |
| tinwhiskers | %covid uk | 03:52 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 590 cases, 2 deaths (0.3% of cases), 562 recoveries as of March 13, 02:35Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 03:52 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: Mortality can be broadly expected to lie between 0.1% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 0.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). | 03:52 |
| LjL | maybe whatever Korea did | 03:52 |
| tinwhiskers | hrm | 03:52 |
| dunnp | some people would rather just have everyone infected and be over with it | 03:53 |
| dunnp | including some doctors | 03:54 |
| Spec | LjL: yes, probably want south korean methods :P | 03:54 |
| dunnp | dont think that is the best route | 03:54 |
| LjL | Spec, i'm not entirely sure what they've actually done to magically taper it off | 03:54 |
| dunnp | tooons of testing | 03:55 |
| dunnp | we need more avialable testing | 03:55 |
| Spec | dunnp: just flood the hospitals and have a far higher number of deaths | 03:55 |
| dunnp | agreed Spec | 03:55 |
| Spec | LjL: it'd be good to find out. | 03:55 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 02:51 UTC: Microsoft cancels Build, makes it virtual: The move comes after Microsoft canceled two conferences it had planned to host near its headquarters in connection with the spread of the coronavirus. Build 2020 will now be held online instead of in person. → https://is.gd/w0eYxO | 03:57 |
| LjL | dunnp, the extensive drive-through tests highlighted a relatively low mortality rate compared to our rather scary numbers, but was that really enough to stop the exponential? also i saw a rather scary picture with a... slightly long queue to buy masks. now, that means they HAVE masks in the first place, which sounds better than here. but that many humans crammed together, even though they were all *already* wearing masks admittedly, doesn't seem like a | 03:57 |
| LjL | great idea | 03:57 |
| tinwhiskers | %covid uk | 03:57 |
| dunnp | think how good cancelling all of these confernces will be for the environment | 03:57 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 590 cases, 10 deaths (1.7% of cases), 18 recoveries as of March 13, 02:55Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 03:58 |
| LjL | %addpoint tinwhiskers | 03:58 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: +1/-0, 1 | 03:58 |
| dunnp | all my chinese students had masks in class yesterday | 03:58 |
| tinwhiskers | I'll try to make it a little more robust to them changing column order shortly | 03:58 |
| dunnp | havent been able to buy them here for week | 03:58 |
| dunnp | maybe some people just have a lot more masks | 03:59 |
| LjL | dunnp, yeah i see a few people wearing all kinds of fancy masks and i wonder who the hell they stabbed to steal them from | 03:59 |
| LjL | dunnp, i couldn't find masks here already weeks *before* we started having any confirmed cases | 03:59 |
| LjL | although amazon had some, just for not so compelling prices | 04:00 |
| LjL | (still cheaper than anything that's around now, but nothing's really around now) | 04:00 |
| Spec | have you checked aliexpress | 04:00 |
| LjL | no, that wouldn't have much of a point | 04:00 |
| LjL | we can *hope* domestic deliveries keep working, but deliveries from china are slow and erratic at the best of times, mainly thanks to our solicitous customs officers | 04:01 |
| sneep | I don't get it, I know two people who arrived from Korea yesterday and AFAIK they have to stay put for two weeks, but they're not Korean so I'm wondering if they're exempted or something | 04:02 |
| dunnp | LjL: we've never had a whole lot of luck with antivirals | 04:05 |
| ryouma | has whoever in the uk said no need to cancel public events been in troublef or that yet>? | 04:06 |
| Spec | ryouma: do you think trump will see blowback from his comments, lol | 04:06 |
| LjL | dunnp, well whatever they can try on dying patients will have more chances of being rolled out quickly than a vaccine that has to go through risk/benefit testing | 04:06 |
| dunnp | LjL: what are the reports of younger people? | 04:06 |
| LjL | dunnp, not much really... someone mentioned that to me and i said "no, i don't think so", but then i heard it here https://youtu.be/9mrPHO-nkVE?t=57 (probably worth watching this all) and it seemed more credible, although he didn't give any real statistics. on fridays, ISS is supposed to be publishing their age group statistics, so... i guess i can check, now, and prepare to panic | 04:08 |
| xrogaan | What are you people's take on Dr Redfield behavior during this pandemic? | 04:09 |
| LjL | dunnp, well i believe the ISS bulletin i had in mind is just the one that's been posted in ##science https://www.epicentro.iss.it/coronavirus/bollettino/covid-19-infografica_eng.pdf and it reflects that doctor's statement that the median age is not 65. that's the median "case" age though, i assume, but then an 8.1% death rate in the 60-69 range doesn't sound cool | 04:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 03:05 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Formula 1, FIA and AGPC announce cancellation of the 2020 Australian Grand Prix | Formula 1® → https://is.gd/OzQPIM | 04:10 |
| dunnp | hard to estimate the age of actual infection for those who show few symptoms | 04:15 |
| dunnp | I'd wager that it is fairly uniform with the age distribution of the region | 04:15 |
| LjL | dunnp, well i'd have to compare this with previous reports for age trends, but they've only started publishing these (somewhat) detailed reports fairly recently | 04:16 |
| dunnp | right but is a 20yr old less likely to actually cath it? | 04:16 |
| dunnp | catch | 04:16 |
| dunnp | or just significantly more underreported | 04:17 |
| dunnp | gov of Ohio says that he thinks 100k people in the state are infected | 04:17 |
| dunnp | only 5 confirmed cases | 04:17 |
| LjL | dunnp, i suspect they're equally likely to catch it, but what i'm concerned here is the apparent rising claims of severity / death in the younger population. i think we'll need a few more of these reports before we can see a trend beyond doctors' guts feelings though | 04:18 |
| dunnp | yea | 04:18 |
| sneep | i was wondering how you managed to misspell dunnp a dozen times in a row | 04:18 |
| sneep | er, dunno | 04:18 |
| dunnp | I don't think it would make sense | 04:18 |
| LjL | to be clear it's not like if it "only" affects the elderly, i'll be okay with that. far from it. it's just not good news if it starts killing *even more* people. | 04:19 |
| dunnp | sneep: thats the origin of my nick ;) | 04:19 |
| xrogaan | dunnp: no, they get the virus. Everybody gets it. But infants don't get sick. | 04:21 |
| LjL | dunnp, i don't even know what i am supposed to read in the various seemingly conflicting ISS reports though. for instance this section from a press release (from march 10, so not quite ages ago) | 04:21 |
| xrogaan | That's what the reports say, I have no clue why. | 04:21 |
| LjL | %tr Il tempo mediano trascorso tra la data di insorgenza dei sintomi e la diagnosi è di 3-4 giorni. Il 10% dei casi è asintomatico, il 5% con pochi sintomi, il 30% con sintomi lievi, il 31% è sintomatico, il 6% ha sintomi severi e il 19% critici. Il 24% dei casi esaminati risulta ospedalizzato. | 04:21 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: The median time elapsed between the date of onset of symptoms and diagnosis is 3-4 days. 10% of cases are asymptomatic, 5% with few symptoms, 30% with mild symptoms, 31% are symptomatic, 6% have severe symptoms and 19% are critical. 24% of the cases examined are hospitalized. (MyMemory, Google) [... want %more?] | 04:21 |
| xrogaan | So kids don't show symptoms, don't get sick, and thus don't get tested. | 04:22 |
| LjL | 19% are critical? wasn't that 5% in the PDF slide? | 04:22 |
| LjL | i hope they swapped those numbers, and it's really 19% severe, 6% critical | 04:22 |
| dunnp | yea doesnt make sense LjL | 04:22 |
| LjL | but if they have, well, it would be nice if they like, proofread press releases | 04:22 |
| dunnp | thats why I wait for the papers mostly :/ | 04:22 |
| dunnp | research is moving fast | 04:23 |
| LjL | dunnp, by the time they're peer-reviewed enough not to call the virus 2019-NCOV, SARS-COV-19, SARS-COV-2 and a few other variants *within* the same paper, Italy may not even have internet connections working for all i know now | 04:24 |
| dunnp | people are doing very rapid peer review | 04:24 |
| dunnp | but I understand | 04:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 03:10 UTC: Coronavirus live updates: China reports 8 new cases, 7 additional deaths: To date, there have been 80,813 confirmed cases in China; among them, 64,111 cases have been cured and 3,176 people have died. → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 04:24 |
| dunnp | I turned a paper around in 4 hours | 04:25 |
| LjL | dunnp, anyway, the ISS reports aren't exactly complex studies, they just have to copy the numbers right... for the Italian version of the CDC, they're being a bit... too much like the CDC? | 04:28 |
| dunnp | :( | 04:28 |
| dunnp | the US has really dropped the ball for a long time | 04:29 |
| dunnp | such a great reputation | 04:30 |
| xrogaan | what reputation? | 04:30 |
| ryouma | the cdc brought us the tuskegee syphilis experiment too | 04:30 |
| ryouma | (phs) | 04:30 |
| LjL | don't worry, all the Hollywood series still make us believe the US would handle an epidemic with masterful skills that save the day | 04:31 |
| LjL | so ultimately, just fund Hollywood instead of funding the CDC | 04:31 |
| dunnp | totally different agency ryouma | 04:31 |
| ryouma | dunnp: cdc lobbied congress to make the experiment continue. they were part of it. they probably were part of guatemalan thing too, but i ahve not confirmed. cdc has a part of its website talkign about tuskegee btw. | 04:32 |
| dunnp | yep I get it US has no reputation of anything good | 04:32 |
| dunnp | just movies | 04:33 |
| ryouma | us has lots of good things | 04:33 |
| ryouma | jazz! | 04:33 |
| LjL | okay here's one good thing about the US, whatever government agencies do, they have to release as public domain (with a number of annoying exceptions, but still) | 04:36 |
| ryouma | cdc did do the guatemalan expeiments also. so did nih apparently. | 04:36 |
| LjL | here instead they dub mostly useless things under noncommercial licenses as "open data" | 04:36 |
| dunnp | ryouma: do you think that 1946 CDC is the same as CDC now? | 04:37 |
| ryouma | dunnp: yes, it has been until quite recently, but it's an area of specialized medical politics i don't have the health resources to bring up and respond to questions about at this time. | 04:38 |
| dunnp | wow | 04:38 |
| fructose | Even the poor people in the US are fat. That's nice, right? | 04:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 03:33 UTC: Coronavirus live updates: China reports 8 new cases and 7 additional deaths: To date, there have been 80,813 confirmed cases in China; among them, 64,111 cases have been cured and 3,176 people have died. → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 04:38 |
| dunnp | also wow | 04:38 |
| dunnp | so much anti-US sentiment | 04:39 |
| ryouma | dunnp: but not talking about experiments per se | 04:39 |
| dunnp | ryouma: Obama referred to that as a crime against humanity | 04:39 |
| dunnp | there was some pretty f-ed up shit by lots of people in the 40s | 04:39 |
| ryouma | it is arguably so accordig to most versions of the law. also the other thing. | 04:39 |
| ryouma | dunnp: didn;'t know obama said that. kudos. | 04:40 |
| LjL | has Trump un-said that yet? | 04:40 |
| swift110 | sup | 04:40 |
| swift110 | bad food is cheap | 04:40 |
| swift110 | good food tends to be expensive | 04:40 |
| LjL | what about nonperishable food that takes up little space for the calories and is also nutritious | 04:41 |
| ryouma | i am not anti-us | 04:41 |
| swift110 | hmm | 04:41 |
| ryouma | just pointing out problems is not anti(the country in which the problems exist) | 04:41 |
| dunnp | pointing out the Tuskegee experiment? | 04:42 |
| dunnp | let me find something in your history to complain about | 04:42 |
| tinwhiskers | So, anyway, I've been in town all day and haven't seen any news yet. Did anything that interests you, is particularly stupid or otherwise noteworthy happen today? | 04:42 |
| ryouma | well if you are fishing for stuff you might be anti whatever country... | 04:42 |
| dunnp | ^ exactly | 04:43 |
| ryouma | ok let's drop it? | 04:44 |
| dunnp | fine | 04:44 |
| ryouma | for teh sake of the channel? | 04:44 |
| LjL | dunnp, i get it that there was a bit of a multi-party jab about/against US stuff above... but, you know, we're taught at school that we were Very Bad in the 40s and earlier, and that we should be ashamed for all of that, and never forget, and all that. so i don't find it particularly odd or problematic to "point ot" the Tuskegee experiment | 04:44 |
| ryouma | (personally i think it's patriotic to try to fix problems witha n agency rather than say my country right or wrong) | 04:46 |
| tinwhiskers | the thing is nobody holds Italy's past against them because they don't pretend it didn't happen or make excuses and blame other people. the US never owns up to its mistakes so people can't let it go. | 04:47 |
| LjL | some people from the US tend to boast a lot about how great and free they are, while forgetting that institutionalized racism and other things like those were still a thing in the 60s while Europe was nothing like that anymore - which, admittedly, was mostly because the US got to practically write the new constitutions of much of Europe, so things are multifaceted | 04:47 |
| tinwhiskers | when people lay fault at the door of the USA they tend to be told they are just jealous because the don't come from the land of the free and the brave or some such nonsense. | 04:48 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, well just wait some longer and the new generations will happily tell you that fascism was the coolest thing ever, don't lose hope | 04:48 |
| tinwhiskers | heh. maybe | 04:48 |
| dunnp | institutional racism isn't in europe? | 04:49 |
| LjL | i'm not seeing many apartheid laws | 04:49 |
| dunnp | heh | 04:50 |
| p_hpd[m] | Yes it does | 04:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 03:47 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: PGA Tour cancels events including The Players Championship golf tournament → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 04:52 |
| LjL | there is racism, which is still bad. but making racism *the law* is another level of bad, IMO. just like there is, sadly, still slavery in practice, in many parts of the world, but that doesn't make having made slavery at least technically illegal all over the world a worthless achievement. | 04:53 |
| LjL | doesn't mean* | 04:53 |
| dunnp | what Us law are you referring to LjL? | 04:54 |
| LjL | none that is still on the books, thankfully | 04:54 |
| dunnp | ok well I am happy to end the anti-US free-for-all | 04:56 |
| dunnp | possibly it has also done some beneficial things | 04:57 |
| dunnp | but to the start - the CDC sure has dropped the ball on this | 04:57 |
| LjL | https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/jaipur/city-docs-cure-corona-patient-with-hiv-drugs/articleshow/74584859.cms ← a bit of a "let's put everything into the mix" approach, but hey, it worked apparently | 05:01 |
| ryouma | the cdc is good at praising itself | 05:02 |
| ryouma | also, it has a sendible policy on facial hair | 05:02 |
| ryouma | sensible | 05:02 |
| ryouma | that is really weird about the hiv drugs | 05:09 |
| ryouma | i wonder what effect | 05:09 |
| LjL | first actual quarantine in Spain it would appear https://twitter.com/naciodigital/status/1238232425232293889 | 05:12 |
| LjL | not entirely sure an Italian "red zone"-style quarantine is going to be useful when they already have 3000 infected countrywide... | 05:13 |
| dunnp | n=2 isnt great but lopinavir/ritonavir are protease inhibitors so could inhibit the ncov protease | 05:16 |
| dunnp | there was some work on using that combination on SARS before | 05:17 |
| dunnp | pretty bad for your liver though | 05:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 04:12 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 8 new cases, wife of Canadian PM tests positive → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 05:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 04:23 UTC: (news): Sophie Gregoire Trudeau, wife of Canada PM Justin Trudeau, tests positive for coronavirus → https://is.gd/yPkatT | 05:33 |
| tinwhiskers | https://www.thelocal.es/20200312/coronavirus-lockdown-first-four-towns-quarantined-in-spain | 05:43 |
| tinwhiskers | %title | 05:43 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: From www.thelocal.es: error parsing title ('NoneType' object has no attribute 'string') | 05:43 |
| tinwhiskers | :-( | 05:43 |
| tinwhiskers | Four towns in Spain's northeastern Catalonia region were put under quarantine on Thursday, the civil protection agency said, in a first in the country. | 05:44 |
| sneep | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_OECD_countries_by_hospital_beds interesting list | 05:48 |
| tinwhiskers | Also Philippines began lockdown today... MANILA — Philippine President Rodrigo Duterte on Thursday announced a halt on domestic land, sea and air travel to and from Manila, as well as community quarantine measures, in what he called a "lockdown" of the capital to arrest the spread of coronavirus. | 05:48 |
| tinwhiskers | Qatar is also in lockdown and measures are also due to go into effect tomorrow in Kuwait . | 05:50 |
| tinwhiskers | err, that might be today for Kuwait. | 05:51 |
| sneep | Seems like governments are wisening up | 05:51 |
| tinwhiskers | let's hope | 05:51 |
| tinwhiskers | South Korea are setting a great example and I hope other governments follow, but that's also a reflection on Korean culture I think so it's unlikely many places will be able to do so well. | 05:53 |
| kreyren | LjL, where do you get the data for b r a i n s t o r m? Can i configure it so that it would inform me about all new cases in czech republic? | 05:58 |
| kreyren | since https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 is far behind usually | 05:59 |
| tinwhiskers | kreyren: the data comes from http://offloop.net/covid19h/unconfirmed.csv which is a combination of few other sites | 06:06 |
| tinwhiskers | You're welcome to poll that for changes but please not more often than every 5 minutes. It updates every 15 minutes. | 06:07 |
| kreyren | tinwhiskers, noted thanks | 06:07 |
| tinwhiskers | more specifically it updates at 5,20,35,50 minutes past the hour | 06:08 |
| kreyren | noted will optimize | 06:09 |
| fructose | https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3074991/coronavirus-chinas-first-confirmed-covid-19-case-traced-back | 06:10 |
| IronY | Mr_Pink: update | 06:11 |
| kreyren | there is also https://onemocneni-aktualne.mzcr.cz/covid-19 for czech rep i guess that tracking in above would be behind this one? | 06:12 |
| Mr_Pink | There is no Tom Hanks updates at this time. | 06:16 |
| tinwhiskers | Mr_Pink: Yes, I've been collecting data on that. At present will still have only one Tom Hanks infected though so that's good news. | 06:17 |
| tinwhiskers | kreyren: they look pretty similar (both currently show 116) | 06:19 |
| tinwhiskers | %cases czechia | 06:19 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: In all areas, Czechia, there are 116 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 05:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Czechia for time series data. | 06:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 05:13 UTC: /u/slakmehl: "The current number of people tested is now up to almost 14,000. Still far, far too low. GA, MA, TX remain data holes." → https://is.gd/NhzimQ | 06:21 |
| yuttle[m] | %cases washington | 06:21 |
| Brainstorm | yuttle[m]: In Washington, US, there are 442 cases, 31 deaths (7.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 05:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 06:21 |
| yuttle[m] | ugh thats when they lock down wuhan | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | really? | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | interesting observation | 06:22 |
| yuttle[m] | city of wuhan had 356 cases | 06:23 |
| tinwhiskers | yipes. | 06:23 |
| yuttle[m] | oh wait | 06:23 |
| yuttle[m] | thats day 7 of lockdown | 06:23 |
| yuttle[m] | ... | 06:23 |
| tinwhiskers | Then a few weeks later, 30,000 | 06:24 |
| tinwhiskers | two weeks later | 06:24 |
| yuttle[m] | its gunna be really....reallllly bad here in US | 06:24 |
| tinwhiskers | wow. sobering numbers there yuttle[m] | 06:27 |
| yuttle[m] | okay apologies that was 356 new patients since lockdown | 06:27 |
| yuttle[m] | 639 on day of lockdown | 06:27 |
| yuttle[m] | in china at large | 06:27 |
| yuttle[m] | so %us | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | %cases us | 06:28 |
| Brainstorm | yuttle[m]: In all areas, US, there are 1762 cases, 41 deaths (2.3% of cases), 31 recoveries as of March 13, 05:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 06:28 |
| tinwhiskers | I make it 444 in Hubei on Jan 23 when the lockdown occurred, | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | somehting closer to that, this graph is pretty terrible | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | but | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | massive under testing | 06:28 |
| yuttle[m] | in US, we are at 1762 and only soft measures going into place | 06:29 |
| tinwhiskers | wow. What state will the world be in two weeks from now... | 06:29 |
| yuttle[m] | no kidding | 06:29 |
| yuttle[m] | im my town the only ppl i can tell preparing are school moms and radical lefties organizing food deliveries | 06:30 |
| Mr_Pink | is there a site that shows testing for every country? | 06:30 |
| Mr_Pink | %data india | 06:30 |
| Brainstorm | Mr_Pink: In all areas, India, there are 75 cases, 1 deaths (1.3% of cases), 4 recoveries as of March 13, 05:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=India for time series data. | 06:30 |
| tinwhiskers | Mr_Pink: I take it you've seen https://offloop.net/covid19/ | 06:31 |
| Mr_Pink | I have, but there's not overall tested just positives | 06:32 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh, I see what you mean | 06:32 |
| tinwhiskers | I've not seen that anywhere yet | 06:32 |
| tinwhiskers | I mean, not a collection for all countries | 06:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 05:33 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Coronavirus: China’s first confirmed Covid-19 case traced back to November 17 | South China Morning Post → https://is.gd/pCEuWB | 06:35 |
| Mr_Pink | March 6th report from India says: "A total of 4058 samples from 3404 individuals have been tested by the network. This includes testing of 1308 samples from 654 individuals evacuated from Wuhan, China and quarantined at ITBP and Manesar Camp and tested twice on days 0 and 14." https://icmr.nic.in/sites/default/files/press_realease_files/ICMR_PressRelease_COVID_19.pdf | 06:35 |
| Mr_Pink | +another 236 from Wuhan and a cruise ship. | 06:35 |
| Mr_Pink | They have 57 testing facilities as of then as well. All government-run hospitals. | 06:36 |
| yuttle[m] | This is an incredible documentary, even tho its probably CCP propaganda | 06:36 |
| yuttle[m] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XU9FVqwO4TM | 06:36 |
| Mr_Pink | oh 52 labs + 57 testing facilities. interesting. so definitely a lot of under-testing. | 06:37 |
| yuttle[m] | I cant see the US working anything like this | 06:37 |
| tinwhiskers | thanks yuttle[m] | 06:42 |
| ryouma | yuttle[m]: can you say more about "school moms and radical lefties organizing food deliveries"? where would one contact them to help them or to receive their services for bedriddena nd housebound? | 06:48 |
| yuttle[m] | ive heard this be the case in multiple towns in the US | 06:48 |
| yuttle[m] | local social media is what i would assume | 06:49 |
| yuttle[m] | im afraid they arent completly aware of the task ahead of them | 06:49 |
| yuttle[m] | thats what its like here | 06:50 |
| yuttle[m] | * here things are being tranmitted over local social media. other places same id assume | 06:50 |
| dunnp | school moms and radical lefties | 06:51 |
| yuttle[m] | For instance on the first rollout of the form to signup to be a deliver-er or deliver-ee there was no mention of protocol for contact or ppe | 06:51 |
| yuttle[m] | but that is being ironed out | 06:51 |
| rahiakherajot[m] | %cases India | 06:51 |
| yuttle[m] | unfortunately we are not anticipating the government to do that for us | 06:52 |
| Brainstorm | rahiakherajot[m]: In all areas, India, there are 75 cases, 1 deaths (1.3% of cases), 4 recoveries as of March 13, 05:46Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=India for time series data. | 06:52 |
| yuttle[m] | err im not at least | 06:52 |
| dunnp | our food delivery services are opperating as normal with the only change being that they will leave items on your from door step without coming inside | 06:52 |
| dunnp | shipt or instacart | 06:53 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah i dont ever order food, i wonder if thats the same | 06:53 |
| yuttle[m] | twitter is the only way i could learn of first official case here | 06:53 |
| dunnp | where yuttle[m]? | 06:53 |
| yuttle[m] | midwest college town | 06:53 |
| dunnp | well ohio shut down all schools which seems like prep | 06:54 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah im hoping are state does the same | 06:54 |
| dunnp | seems like most are | 06:55 |
| dunnp | and universities for sure | 06:55 |
| yuttle[m] | like.... some direction forward would be great | 06:55 |
| yuttle[m] | so many ppl want to help | 06:55 |
| yuttle[m] | but its a tragedy in the making if there is no leadership | 06:55 |
| yuttle[m] | its true, im honestly glad to see ppl taking it seriously | 06:56 |
| tinwhiskers | China started building temporary hospitals only two days after lockdown (761 infected at that time) and had the first finished two weeks later, for 1000 patients. | 06:56 |
| yuttle[m] | the sooner the better | 06:56 |
| tinwhiskers | We are SO behind | 06:56 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah i cant imagine that happening here | 06:56 |
| yuttle[m] | I can see makeshift hospitals being made out of the unimaginable amount of real estate we have | 06:57 |
| yuttle[m] | but china had an advantage of medical equipment being manufactured there | 06:57 |
| dunnp | all those corn fields | 06:57 |
| yuttle[m] | shoot, no one is staying in all those hotels | 06:58 |
| yuttle[m] | thats what they started to do in seattle, requisition an econolodge for covid patients | 06:58 |
| yuttle[m] | our ICU is tiny here, ik a nurse here who works in hospital and... well they are severly underprepared... like mentally | 06:59 |
| yuttle[m] | to be fair, wuhan was the first place it showed up. So they literally had no idea what they were dealing with | 07:00 |
| yuttle[m] | until novel pnuemonia cases were popping up like crazy | 07:01 |
| sneep | When I go to hospitals I don't see a lot of Chinese-made equipment in general | 07:01 |
| yuttle[m] | thats true, i guess i just assume | 07:02 |
| Mr_Pink | https://twitter.com/nicoleperlroth/status/1238343560719523843 | 07:02 |
| Mr_Pink | @nicoleperlroth0,02✓ (Nicole Perlroth): Please be vigilant about what #COVID2019 updates you click on in email. We are seeing active cybercriminal as well as Chinese, DPRK, Russian phishing campaigns baiting people into clicking on interactive coronavirus infection maps, updates, advisories. | 07:03 |
| yuttle[m] | ehw thats terrible | 07:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 05:51 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 8 new cases, wife of Canadian PM tests positive → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 07:03 |
| yuttle[m] | oh the first wuhan doctors suspected sars at first | 07:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 06:07 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Buongiorno a tutti, mentre eravate via → https://is.gd/3B9BTX | 07:16 |
| yuttle[m] | oh you betchya m8 | 07:16 |
| tinwhiskers | :-/ | 07:20 |
| tinwhiskers | that doco did smell a bit like propaganda but was interesting | 07:21 |
| tinwhiskers | a minor thing but I had heard people were able to go and buy their own groceries about once a week (maybe two) but that said they were buying online and the deliveries were left outside the building. | 07:22 |
| tinwhiskers | it seems like people were *completely* under house lockdown in most cases | 07:22 |
| yuttle[m] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ycrqXJYf1SU -- this one has a dead body? some parts smell like propaganda the other way | 07:23 |
| yuttle[m] | its austrailian | 07:23 |
| yuttle[m] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m0_zrIGjDto -- this is a good one on the food delivery in wuhan | 07:24 |
| yuttle[m] | thats what i sent to the local group wanting to make deliveries | 07:25 |
| yuttle[m] | i was basically like... do this as much as you can | 07:25 |
| yuttle[m] | which is so wild to me, that we as citizens, have to be making sure to buy our own disinfection and ppe, then go out, buy and deliver food for out neighbors | 07:26 |
| dunnp | why is that wild? | 07:26 |
| yuttle[m] | idk isnt that why taxes are paid? | 07:27 |
| dunnp | haha not for the incredibly low tax rate in the US | 07:27 |
| dunnp | remember US wants small gov't | 07:27 |
| dunnp | lower taxes! | 07:27 |
| yuttle[m] | Lower Taxes, More death! | 07:28 |
| yuttle[m] | has been the thing for a while | 07:28 |
| dunnp | when was the last time taxes went up? | 07:28 |
| dunnp | I paid like 6% effective last year | 07:28 |
| yuttle[m] | idek | 07:29 |
| dunnp | my friend in Wuhan had to self-isolate and do twice daily temp checks and also a temp check when getting food delivery | 07:29 |
| dunnp | food was delivered into a mail box for packages so the drviers and he never came into contact | 07:30 |
| dunnp | and he was told to wipe down the containers | 07:30 |
| dunnp | student's parents in a bit more rural part had to self isolate and didn't get food deliveries or temp checks | 07:31 |
| dunnp | but couldn't leave | 07:31 |
| dunnp | they all had masks | 07:31 |
| azy | how did they get food? | 07:32 |
| dunnp | it was assumed that they had food stores | 07:32 |
| dunnp | they did | 07:32 |
| azy | because that's likely, or? | 07:32 |
| dunnp | thats all I heard | 07:32 |
| azy | people dont usually have stores, at least here | 07:33 |
| dunnp | they were more rural so maybe it is pretty common to have food | 07:33 |
| dunnp | but yea I dono | 07:34 |
| tinwhiskers | interesting | 07:34 |
| dunnp | she also sent them a ton of masks | 07:34 |
| dunnp | before the quarantine | 07:35 |
| tinwhiskers | I've been slowly stocking up on food each time I go into town. I'm pretty much good to go for a month or two now. | 07:35 |
| tinwhiskers | Could do with some more toilet paper :-) | 07:35 |
| dunnp | maybe they thought to prepare | 07:35 |
| romare | second case in Turkey, confirmed | 07:36 |
| dunnp | smh tinwhiskers | 07:36 |
| IronY | It was not that long ago that even in the west we had pantries and they were stocked | 07:36 |
| IronY | it still mostly works like this in rural areas | 07:36 |
| IronY | especially if the travel to acquire food is already large, you stock pile to avoid trips, save money, and be good if you cannot make a trip for an extended period | 07:36 |
| dunnp | I've been buying beans and pasta and rice | 07:37 |
| azy | people sleep on dried peas | 07:37 |
| IronY | yeah, I got a lot too, I am really hoping it does not come to that | 07:37 |
| IronY | girlfriend came home with like 10 difference chillies | 07:37 |
| azy | those are some good prepper greens | 07:37 |
| dunnp | mostly because I hate going to the store | 07:37 |
| IronY | I might be the only house that actually needs additional toilet paper | 07:37 |
| tinwhiskers | I could get by on coconuts, papaya and fish here without any supplies from town but a bit of variation is good. I have several 20 litre sealable containers with food now (to keep the rats out) | 07:37 |
| ryouma | my carer is refusing to wipe anything down, never cleans anything at all, refusing to get enough food to last a quarantine or lockdown or isolatioin or anything, saying i am overreacting, not undersatning that my medicines are needed, not caring that they are already running out, thinking the virus will stay on surfaces for minutes, contacting her uncle to justify each and every point as if we had the luxyry of argu | 07:38 |
| ryouma | ing, arguing when i can't hendle the stress for health reasons, threatening to kick me out on the street (i will die, bedridden), has no problem with her family flying in for a social gathering, the list goes on. i do not believe i have good chances of surviving. | 07:38 |
| IronY | Where are you? (if you don't mind me asking) | 07:38 |
| dunnp | I have a big garden I could plant but wasn't going to this year.. | 07:38 |
| ryouma | sw us | 07:39 |
| dunnp | ryouma: can't be in a wheelchair? | 07:39 |
| ryouma | cannot | 07:39 |
| dunnp | oh bedredden | 07:39 |
| ryouma | many comorbidities | 07:40 |
| dunnp | do you have instacart there? | 07:40 |
| ryouma | idk what that is | 07:40 |
| dunnp | grocery delivery service | 07:40 |
| tinwhiskers | no grocery delivery services here :-) | 07:41 |
| ryouma | i cannot go to hospital because of life-threatening conditions that the hospital will make worse | 07:41 |
| IronY | I think ottawa is going to be ok | 07:41 |
| IronY | considering patient 3 in my city is the countries leaders wife and a resident | 07:41 |
| adventurer | ryouma, have you got family to phone and ask to do | 07:41 |
| tinwhiskers | I don't follow | 07:41 |
| ryouma | no | 07:41 |
| IronY | will be hard for him not to take it seriously with his wife going down in history as patient 3 | 07:41 |
| dunnp | https://www.instacart.com/grocery-delivery | 07:41 |
| tinwhiskers | ah | 07:41 |
| adventurer | ryouma, can you order food or a cleaner over the internet | 07:42 |
| ryouma | my mother is in 80s and has a cough and is distant and cannot do anything no doubt | 07:42 |
| adventurer | then she can just put the delivery away | 07:42 |
| adventurer | and let the cleaner clean | 07:42 |
| adventurer | I don't know...I hope you will be ok ryouma | 07:42 |
| ryouma | adventurer: we have tried to get a cleaner. my health needs are pretty strict. | 07:42 |
| ryouma | i have no credit card or anything; she does that stuff. she would probably refuse. | 07:43 |
| tinwhiskers | yipes | 07:43 |
| adventurer | oh man that is not good | 07:43 |
| ryouma | my cash was stolen | 07:43 |
| dunnp | autoimmunie? | 07:43 |
| ryouma | that and more | 07:43 |
| dunnp | wow I cant spell tonight | 07:43 |
| adventurer | ryouma, maybe your mother can talk to the carer and ask her to organise a cleaner and food | 07:44 |
| tinwhiskers | and spare meds | 07:44 |
| ryouma | even in normal times my survival was on the edge | 07:44 |
| adventurer | and medicine | 07:45 |
| ryouma | i don't know if i can rely on my mother she has issues of her own and might not be willing. or kow what to do. she once did something or me long ago that i don't even remember about getting insurance or something that i could not do and is resentful | 07:45 |
| dunnp | difficult situation | 07:46 |
| adventurer | well she is your mother she is meant to go bat for you that's her job | 07:46 |
| adventurer | I don't know...I hope you will be okay ryouma | 07:46 |
| dunnp | in her 80s though adventurer | 07:46 |
| adventurer | ryouma, what about brothers or sisters? | 07:47 |
| adventurer | ryouma, what about your father? | 07:47 |
| ryouma | not possible | 07:47 |
| ryouma | the study i saw said the virus stays on srufaces for 9 days. carer contacted uncle to reassure her that not true. is the study wrong? | 07:48 |
| adventurer | ryouma, what country are you in | 07:48 |
| ryouma | us | 07:48 |
| dunnp | it is true ryouma | 07:48 |
| adventurer | I head 7 days on one source and 3 days from another | 07:48 |
| dunnp | I've been wiping down my groceries | 07:48 |
| ryouma | carer does not want to wipe down anything and would not do a good job of it anyway. so contacted uncle who is a medical researcher. "Survival time of the virus on a surface is probably minutes to hours. While it might be longer in certain circumstances, there's no good evidence that it's as long as 9 days, and in any case, he doesn't think 9 days is plausible. (An article I read said possibly 3 days on certain sur | 07:50 |
| ryouma | faces; that's more in line with what his name thinks is at the very edge of possible.)" | 07:50 |
| ryouma | so i ahve to give up on asking for that. but i really want to get the medicine i need. | 07:51 |
| tinwhiskers | %cases us | 07:51 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: In all areas, US, there are 1762 cases, 41 deaths (2.3% of cases), 31 recoveries as of March 13, 06:36Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 07:51 |
| ryouma | and she thinks getting enough disinfectant to do it is hoarding | 07:51 |
| dunnp | so hire someone else? | 07:51 |
| ryouma | it's a marriage-like ltr. although we had an argument tonight and idk if she cares whereh i life or die. she is probably tryin to figure out what to do to get rid of me. which, tehre is no real solution. | 07:53 |
| ryouma | due to comorbidities | 07:53 |
| ryouma | i could send her smoething about the 9 day thing and then say "but it's ok not to wipe down i know it is stressful for you to do o" or something. which would alt least point out suibtly that her assumption that just contacting her uncle to confirm whatever it is hhe wants to believe might not be epistemically sound. | 07:54 |
| ryouma | but i'd ahve to do that about many things needd to prepare and things needed just medically. i am thinking i am just not going to survive (virus will only kill some percent, but rest of health issues not being attended to, and not being able to get food and so on in lockdown and so on, will. and deifnitely medicine is a problem). | 07:56 |
| ryouma | oxygen concentrator broken, can probably fix with filters from amazon, but nobody to actually open it and install them. | 07:56 |
| ryouma | "So far I haven't seen anything about wiping down purchases or wearing masks if you live with someone who's immunocompromised." | 07:59 |
| ryouma | so always err on the side of whateverz | 07:59 |
| dunnp | tough situation | 07:59 |
| dunnp | earlier we linked to a paper that shows normal time of virual survival on different materials | 08:00 |
| dunnp | for similar coronaviruses | 08:00 |
| dunnp | her 'medical researcher' uncle is wrong | 08:01 |
| ryouma | doyou hav a keyword to search irc logs if i was logged in then? | 08:01 |
| ryouma | to find the url | 08:01 |
| dunnp | https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/S0195-6701(20)30046-3/fulltext | 08:01 |
| ryouma | i saw a metastudy on the virus itself that suggested 9 days | 08:01 |
| twomoon | are any of you guys actually quarantining yet? | 08:01 |
| dunnp | twomoon: I am - we have university classes canceled and k-12 schools closed so I am staying home | 08:02 |
| twomoon | sorry to hear that ryouma | 08:02 |
| yuttle[m] | https://www.reddit.com/r/COVID19 | 08:02 |
| yuttle[m] | is an alright place to search for research | 08:02 |
| yuttle[m] | they moderate damn well | 08:02 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah same ryouma | 08:02 |
| yuttle[m] | <twomoon "are any of you guys actually qua"> i am soft quarantining with a scratchy throat *shrug* | 08:03 |
| twomoon | the air is very dry here my throat is bad too | 08:03 |
| twomoon | earlier today i thought i was getting sick | 08:03 |
| yuttle[m] | yeah im hoping its just allergies from spring coming in | 08:03 |
| yuttle[m] | i usually dont get allergies but idk | 08:04 |
| sneep | I saw the studies claiming that the virus can survive on $surfaceX for Y days | 08:04 |
| ryouma | thank uyouy | 08:04 |
| yuttle[m] | im 27 and an herbalist i should be able to kick it. just dont wanna get anyone else sick just in case | 08:04 |
| sneep | But TBH, they seemed a bit meaningless to me | 08:04 |
| twomoon | herbalist? | 08:05 |
| twomoon | are you in china? | 08:05 |
| dunnp | been sick for about 2 weeks | 08:05 |
| dunnp | or allergies... | 08:06 |
| sneep | So the virus can sort of survive on a stainless steel surface for say 4 days, but we have no idea if that is anywhere close to what you'd expect in real life | 08:06 |
| yuttle[m] | @twomoons no midwest | 08:07 |
| dunnp | sneep: how is that meaningless? | 08:07 |
| dunnp | and what do you mean 'sort of survive' | 08:07 |
| sneep | They could be testing in a clean room | 08:08 |
| adventurer | If I am remembering what was said correctly I heard from a pretty intelligent source it can survive on metal for up to 7 days | 08:08 |
| adventurer | well still infect you | 08:08 |
| dunnp | sneep: what does that mean | 08:09 |
| adventurer | or 'could' still infect you | 08:09 |
| dunnp | adventurer: I just pasted a paper that also says this | 08:09 |
| sneep | In normal rooms, you have some kind of airflow and a bunch of bacteria and microfauna | 08:10 |
| dunnp | microfauna | 08:10 |
| dunnp | that eat viruses? | 08:10 |
| sneep | I doubt they're capable of avoiding the virus particles | 08:10 |
| greyman | %data turkey | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | greyman: In all areas, Turkey, there are 2 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 07:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data. | 08:11 |
| Poon_ | %data sweden | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: In all areas, Sweden, there are 687 cases, 1 deaths (0.1% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 07:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Sweden for time series data. | 08:11 |
| dunnp | virus is a lot smaller than bacteria and they wouldn't do anything if they interacted... | 08:11 |
| dunnp | besides... lets say airflow made it only 8 days instead of 9.. still need to disinfect | 08:11 |
| adventurer | https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/health/health-problems/live-coverage-of-australias-coronavirus-outbreak/live-coverage/1c9f53b5f9f7c48d7f41daa36d3ec447 | 08:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 06:58 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 8 new cases, wife of Canadian PM tests positive → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 08:12 |
| adventurer | Australia's treasure has it. | 08:12 |
| Poon_ | %data vietnam | 08:12 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: In all areas, Vietnam, there are 44 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 16 recoveries as of March 13, 07:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Vietnam for time series data. | 08:12 |
| adventurer | s/treasure/treasurer | 08:12 |
| Brainstorm | adventurer meant to say: Australia's treasurer has it. | 08:12 |
| yuttle[m] | id bet money trump has it | 08:12 |
| yuttle[m] | shoot id bet n95's | 08:13 |
| adventurer | ryouma, get your uncle to organize your meds, groceries and etc | 08:13 |
| adventurer | if the carer is not doing it | 08:13 |
| adventurer | just an idea | 08:13 |
| dunnp | its her uncle adventurer | 08:13 |
| sneep | My Google-fu says the coronavirus is 125 nm, bacteria are 200-10000 nm | 08:14 |
| sneep | Not that different | 08:14 |
| adventurer | oh sorry | 08:14 |
| adventurer | Carer is the uncle? | 08:15 |
| yuttle[m] | ryouma's story was kinda hard to follow | 08:15 |
| yuttle[m] | that honestly was unclear | 08:15 |
| adventurer | sorry I should pay more attention | 08:15 |
| yuttle[m] | <3 | 08:15 |
| yuttle[m] | <3's for ryouma regardless | 08:16 |
| dunnp | sneep: they dont interact regardless. also 10000 nm is 100x larger | 08:17 |
| sneep | Why do you think that they don't interact? | 08:17 |
| yuttle[m] | i think the jist was 9 days max, maybe less under less ideal conditions | 08:17 |
| dunnp | no cell surface receptors for the virus | 08:17 |
| adventurer | there are too many famous people in the numbers in AU for there not to be a heck load of us to also have it but the difference is average person couldn't get tested unless they recently travelled or had a contact who did | 08:19 |
| dunnp | sneep: look at how bacteriophages have to infect bacteria | 08:19 |
| ryouma | i think the question of wiping down groceries is moot because she will not do it but are you saying probably it's ok not to? | 08:20 |
| dunnp | she absolutely should | 08:20 |
| yuttle[m] | spraying 70 | 08:20 |
| yuttle[m] | ohp sorry | 08:20 |
| sneep | I wasn't thinking about bacteria getting infected, but rather decomposing bacteria eating them | 08:21 |
| adventurer | spray with glen 20 if you have limited movement to clean surfaces...that's my wild idea | 08:21 |
| yuttle[m] | spraying 70% isopropyl alchohol will also kill the virus. If wiping is to difficult spraying with alcohol and letting sit for 60 sec are within the guidelines of CDC procedure | 08:21 |
| adventurer | oh isopropyl...how do you get that? | 08:22 |
| dunnp | sneep: think about how bacteria would do that | 08:22 |
| yuttle[m] | its pretty common | 08:22 |
| yuttle[m] | in pharmacies and grocerys | 08:22 |
| yuttle[m] | at least it was... idk | 08:22 |
| sneep | I don't know enough about how bacteria eat | 08:22 |
| sneep | But there's a bunch of different bacteria everywhere, surely some of them are capable of eating virus particles? | 08:23 |
| dunnp | no I don't think so | 08:25 |
| yuttle[m] | i wonder if the US is going to walk out of the other side of this with alot less politicians and alot more communities providing for themselves | 08:26 |
| sneep | How do those virus particles break down at all then? | 08:26 |
| Mr_Pink | I don't know about other states but in CA if anybody is losing hours or sent home due to COVID19, you can apply for partial unemployment. Worth looking up if you're being affected in other places too. http://edd.ca.gov/about_edd/coronavirus-2019.htm | 08:27 |
| sneep | I'd imagine that it's got something to do with microorganisms either feeding on them or physically trampling over them | 08:27 |
| dunnp | sneep: they just dry out or are exposed to UV or some other cuastic agent | 08:27 |
| dunnp | no it isn't that they get eaten | 08:28 |
| dunnp | maybe they could get eaten by something but that wouldn't be a dramatic reduction in surface time regardless | 08:29 |
| dunnp | which is the whole point | 08:29 |
| dunnp | it is days not hours or minutes | 08:29 |
| twomoon | Mr_Pink, what if i have a home based business | 08:30 |
| twomoon | is there any relief for me if something happens that limits my ability to do business? | 08:31 |
| Mr_Pink | not that i know of yet sorry. im in your same boat. hoping to not run into issues with clients unable or unwilling to pay | 08:32 |
| dunnp | they are talking about sba loans to help | 08:32 |
| twomoon | as a home based business i basically pay my own payroll tax | 08:32 |
| twomoon | if there's payroll tax relief will i get fica tax reduction? | 08:33 |
| berndj | i guess everyone's still trying to be the "hero" and keep the events going | 08:54 |
| berndj | twomoon, no silly, bailouts are only for TBTF banks and car makers didn't you know? | 08:55 |
| berndj | dunnp, i understood it as being a spread, as in "mostly hours, but sometimes days" (surface time) | 08:56 |
| ryouma | so she gets groceries, uses them within hours. seems not safe. | 08:58 |
| ryouma | that alone would be a big news item but we are going to get more | 09:19 |
| azy | it's taking out our CEOs! | 09:20 |
| Timvde | azy: Our Leadership Team had a meeting yesterday, and the CEO insisted on all sitting in a different meeting room and video chatting | 09:34 |
| azy | Timvde, i bet that guy doesnt let you work from home | 09:38 |
| Timvde | azy: I am currently working from home | 09:39 |
| Timvde | And I will be for at least two weeks | 09:40 |
| Timvde | I'm happy to say they're not very hypocritical :) | 09:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 08:38 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Coronavirus, Delrio: "Diciamo sì al voto a distanza: la democrazia non si sospende" - la Repubblica → https://is.gd/JoKA2o | 09:48 |
| tinwhiskers | Apparently China is imposing travel restrictions in an effort to prevent cases of covid-19 entering the country :-) | 09:55 |
| azy | neat | 09:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 08:59 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Japan approves emergency powers for PM; global sports events scrapped → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 10:02 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +152 cases (now 135341), +1 deaths (now 4991), +10 recoveries (now 70444) 🔶 Denmark: +111 cases (now 785) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +4 cases (now 160) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +17 recoveries (now 64129) 🔸 Czechia: +3 cases (now 116) 🔸 Ecuador: +2 cases (now 19) 🔸 Germany: +5 cases (now 2750) 🔸 Greece: +17 c | 10:05 |
| Timvde | azy: we can even take home our extra monitor and other equipment if we want | 10:06 |
| Timvde | So no complaints here | 10:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 09:12 UTC: Coronavirus: UK measures defended amid criticism: Top science adviser dismisses criticism of the UK's approach to coronavirus. → https://is.gd/ZWvDTY | 10:16 |
| mefistofeles | %data Germany | 10:28 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Germany, there are 2750 cases, 6 deaths (0.2% of cases), 25 recoveries as of March 13, 09:17Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 10:28 |
| mefistofeles | wait, no new daily report from Italy? | 10:30 |
| mefistofeles | same with France | 10:32 |
| mefistofeles | and Spain | 10:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 09:33 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Coronavirus, corsie in Fiera a Milano: sei giorni di tempo per realizzare un ospedale modello Wuhan - la Repubblica → https://is.gd/DQIELK | 10:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 10:01 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Japan approves emergency powers for PM; sports events scrapped → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 11:11 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +723 cases (now 136064), +22 recoveries (now 70466) 🔶 Spain: +631 cases (now 3779) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +4 cases (now 160) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +39 recoveries (now 64151) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases (now 31) 🔸 Czechia: +4 cases (now 117) 🔸 Estonia: +14 cases (now 41) 🔸 Finland: +46 cases (now 155) 🔸 Fre | 11:12 |
| Biep[m] | !cases nether | 11:20 |
| Biep[m] | !cases burkina | 11:21 |
| Poon_ | %data sweden | 11:29 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: In all areas, Sweden, there are 688 cases, 1 deaths (0.1% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 10:10Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Sweden for time series data. | 11:29 |
| dTal | the bots are a little spammy in here | 11:29 |
| Zalyssa | I agree, they need to be big spammy | 11:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 10:36 UTC: France shuts schools as coronavirus spreads, hopes to avoid becoming the next Italy: French President Emmanuel Macron asks global leaders to act together to combat COVID-19, as the country strives to contain its outbreak. → https://is.gd/gz4xow | 11:38 |
| Biep[m] | I'd prefer two groups: one for news (with all the bots) and one for interactions and discussions. | 11:42 |
| dTal | The #coronalinks channel exists. It currently scrapes from #coronavirus only, but there's no reason it couldn't aggregate links from both channels. | 11:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 10:42 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Trump touts large-scale testing; Indonesia cases more than double → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 11:52 |
| Timvde | I'm with Biep[m] on this one | 12:01 |
| Timvde | It's becoming a bit too much | 12:01 |
| heigre[m] | !cases norway | 12:01 |
| Timvde | %cases Belgium | 12:02 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Belgium, there are 399 cases, 3 deaths (0.8% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 10:48Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data. | 12:02 |
| Biep[m] | There already is #CoVid19:matrix.org - unused at the moment, but we could go there to talk. | 12:02 |
| Timvde | Not updated yet | 12:02 |
| Timvde | 153 new cases | 12:02 |
| Timvde | Biep[m]: That's not reachable from IRC | 12:02 |
| Biep[m] | Ah. | 12:02 |
| Timvde | If you bridge it to some channel on Freenode, that would be an option | 12:02 |
| Biep[m] | I have no idea how to bridge, but if someone knows, I am sure the manager will be happy. | 12:03 |
| Timvde | LjL knows for sure | 12:04 |
| Biep[m] | Then this group would become a kind of ticker tape. | 12:04 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +102 cases (now 136166), +2 deaths (now 4993), +1 recoveries (now 70467) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +39 recoveries (now 64151) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases (now 31) 🔸 Cyprus: +9 cases (now 19) 🔸 Czechia: +4 cases (now 117) 🔸 Estonia: +14 cases (now 41) 🔸 Faeroe Islands: +1 c | 12:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 10:58 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Trump claims 'very large scale' testing; Indonesia cases double → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 12:06 |
| CatButtes[m] | Biep: It is pretty easy to set up | 12:07 |
| CatButtes[m] | You will need a chanop on the IRC side to authorise it | 12:08 |
| CatButtes[m] | And the matrix room needs to be public | 12:08 |
| dTal | It would be a shame to get rid of this channel as a discussion channel, and move it to some Matrix room. I doubt LjL would like that much either. | 12:08 |
| dTal | Why not just redirect links to #coronalinks? | 12:09 |
| CatButtes[m] | Then you add the IRC integration (Use the 4 squares by the channel settings button in riot) and fill out the details. The named chanop will get a message to approve and it all goes ahead | 12:09 |
| sneep | It's generally pretty hard to get people to switch channels | 12:11 |
| Biep[m] | Sorry - what is a chanop? I am a total n00b regarding this. | 12:13 |
| Biep[m] | I am merely a satisfied matrix user. | 12:16 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +480 cases (now 136646), +3 deaths (now 4996), +9 recoveries (now 70476) 🔶 Germany: +309 cases (now 3059) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +39 recoveries (now 64151) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases (now 31) 🔸 Cyprus: +4 cases (now 14) 🔸 Czechia: +4 cases (now 117) 🔸 Estonia: +14 ca | 12:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 11:15 UTC: Coronavirus: UK measures defended amid criticism: Top science adviser dismisses criticism of the UK's approach to coronavirus. → https://is.gd/ZWvDTY | 12:20 |
| Timvde | Biep[m]: It's somebody with operator privileges on the IRC side | 12:21 |
| Timvde | but yes, I'd keep this channel for general discussion and move the automatic posts somewhere else | 12:21 |
| Timvde | The commands can still work here | 12:21 |
| Timvde | What's the difference between this channel and #coronavirus? | 12:22 |
| Timvde | It has a single #, so that's the "official" channel? | 12:23 |
| pwr22 | I'm personally fine with the bots in this channel. They've been used as part of discussions a lot | 12:24 |
| pwr22 | Imo if people are just after stats for their own interest then chatting with them privately is the way to go | 12:25 |
| pwr22 | This is imo the best Coronavirus channel on matrix or IRC | 12:25 |
| sneep | 14:30 < Mr_Pink> is there a site that shows testing for every country? <-- I have a data source for Japan, 10205 according to https://gis.jag-japan.com/covid19jp/ | 12:25 |
| pwr22 | So I really don't want that to change! | 12:26 |
| dTal | Timvde: no real difference in focus, #coronavirus isn't any more "official", they just both got created at the same time | 12:26 |
| dTal | this channel is a bit smaller and a bit harder to find so it has fewer trolls | 12:26 |
| RougeRR | LjL, | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | my parents are fucking dumbasess | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | ive told them this was the big one since the beginning | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | they dismissed me | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | ive told them im quitting my part time public service job | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | they dismissed me | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | ive told them my father was more vulnerable | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | they dismissed me | 12:31 |
| RougeRR | ive told them they need to start practicing social distancing soon | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | they dismissed me | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | ive told them they needed to be wary with hand hygeine | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | they dismissed me | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | ive told them the uk government would handle this poorly and are continuing too | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | they are dismissing me | 12:32 |
| RougeRR | ive been right every single time | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | i think it annoys them that im right | 12:33 |
| MoNsTeR | seems like they should have listened | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | they should have | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | they are on most of the above now | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | but they wont admit it | 12:33 |
| MoNsTeR | good hopefully they are not sick | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | yeah | 12:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 11:31 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Premier League su Twitter: "The Premier League, FA, EFL and WSL have collectively agreed to postpone the professional game in England Full statement: https://t.co/XcDyzBp4Ol… https://t.co/lfaMOBx47c" → https://is.gd/pljGqu | 12:33 |
| RougeRR | they still want to go to france on monday in a campervan | 12:34 |
| RougeRR | i meanm...there are worse ways | 12:34 |
| RougeRR | but they dont seem to get that this is a public health care issue. PUBLIC | 12:34 |
| RougeRR | everyone has to do their part | 12:34 |
| MoNsTeR | tell them that this would be a bad time to seperate | 12:34 |
| MoNsTeR | they must take this very serious | 12:35 |
| RougeRR | yeah, they are fed up of me banging on about it now | 12:35 |
| RougeRR | wont listen | 12:35 |
| RougeRR | they dont understand exponential maths | 12:35 |
| RougeRR | "would you go to italy now?" | 12:35 |
| CatButtes[m] | <RougeRR "they still want to go to france "> If they call the camper van "The Winchester" they might be onto something there. I have more faith in the French government than the UK one right now (although that might be down to ignorance abouit the French on my part) | 12:35 |
| RougeRR | CatButtes[m], same | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | nah the UK government response is scary | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | "take it on the chin all in one go" | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | CatButtes[m], they are going to a remote area with my uncle | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | and getting ferry | 12:36 |
| berndj | is 37.5°C a noteworthy fever? | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | so like...could be worth it | 12:36 |
| Timvde | RougeRR: If they don't want to go to Italy now, that means they shouldn't want to be in France in like a week or so | 12:36 |
| RougeRR | Timvde, exactly | 12:37 |
| RougeRR | they dont get exponential growth | 12:37 |
| RougeRR | "well if the government says i shouldnt go, i wont go" | 12:37 |
| CatButtes[m] | berndj: Keep an eye on it. Have you had any paracetamol/ibuprofen? Because they will lower the temperature | 12:37 |
| RougeRR | "well there is nothing i can do about it, i cant control the government and boris so stop banging on about it" | 12:37 |
| RougeRR | fucking dopey cunt | 12:37 |
| berndj | CatButtes[m], no drugs | 12:37 |
| berndj | i had some throat lozenge a few hours ago, but i don't think that contains either of those drugs | 12:38 |
| RougeRR | berndj, | 12:38 |
| RougeRR | youtube.com/watch?v=sFcvPAzubRg | 12:38 |
| solsTiCe | the very long nick of the rrsbot is annoying | 12:38 |
| RougeRR | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fUir2Q1uxxs | 12:38 |
| CatButtes[m] | berndj: I would keep an eye on it for now. You are under the uk govs recommendation for self isolating (just)... | 12:40 |
| RougeRR | CatButtes[m], its just...she cant defend the government one day. Then when i show her why she is wrong. She shuts down the conversation | 12:40 |
| berndj | CatButtes[m], south africa | 12:40 |
| RougeRR | because shes annoyed about it | 12:40 |
| RougeRR | tbf i am fairly rude about it at this point | 12:40 |
| berndj | out "case definition" excludes people who haven't been over seas, or have had contact with people who've been in high-risk areas, and i haven't either | 12:40 |
| RougeRR | berndj, eh, that doesnt mean much | 12:41 |
| RougeRR | community spread is everywhere | 12:41 |
| RougeRR | but it could also be a cold/flu | 12:41 |
| berndj | our local "CDC" workalike thinks it isn't here yet :-/ | 12:41 |
| berndj | i mean, thinks community spread hasn't started here yet. i find that a bit implausible, but who am i | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | i dont know | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | they say 16 cases | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | but how would they know if there wasnt more | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | oh also my mother | 12:42 |
| berndj | i think it's up to 24 now. all returning travelers | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | "well we cant know what techniques work best yet can we, we have to just wait and see and we can look back in a few months" | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | NO, FUCKING DIPSHIT | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | we can see | 12:42 |
| RougeRR | we can look at all the other countries who have more cases and have taken these steps | 12:43 |
| RougeRR | and which took these steps earlier | 12:43 |
| RougeRR | "but experts" | 12:43 |
| RougeRR | yeah so all the other european countries experts are wrong? | 12:43 |
| berndj | *sadface* just saw the old lady down the road walk past. she's almost certainly dead if she catches this. so frail | 12:43 |
| RougeRR | they all want to tank their economies? | 12:43 |
| RougeRR | its not like we have a government who wants to shoot both our feet off come december | 12:44 |
| RougeRR | coronavirus is a god send, they can blame all the brexit woes on it | 12:44 |
| berndj | which dipshit are you talking about RougeRR ? | 12:44 |
| RougeRR | my mother | 12:44 |
| berndj | oh lol, i thought you were ranting about some politician | 12:44 |
| RougeRR | i mean all them too | 12:45 |
| RougeRR | question time last night was gr8 in the uk | 12:45 |
| RougeRR | ex chief medical officer shitting all over the current one | 12:45 |
| berndj | there's still "this is just like a flu, relax" sentiment going on around here :( | 12:45 |
| RougeRR | yeah | 12:45 |
| RougeRR | ppl r dumb | 12:45 |
| RougeRR | honestly its pretty obvious the death rate is hovering 1-5% | 12:46 |
| RougeRR | and is dependant on age, if you get treatment, and if you have underlying conditions | 12:46 |
| RougeRR | some dipshit my mate knows on "social media" | 12:47 |
| RougeRR | > And ordinary influenza is about ten times as deadly... And that's year after year🤔 | 12:47 |
| RougeRR | dipshit | 12:47 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1317 cases (now 137963), +85 deaths (now 5081), +253 recoveries (now 70729) 🔶 Iran: +1289 cases (now 11364), +85 deaths (now 514), +253 recoveries (now 3529) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Brunei: +12 cases (now 37) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +39 recoveries (now | 12:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 11:38 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Trump claims 'very large scale' testing; Indonesia cases double → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 12:47 |
| berndj | seeya, scheduled blackout incoming | 12:48 |
| RougeRR | ? | 12:48 |
| berndj | our power utility is rekt | 12:49 |
| RougeRR | i see, normal? | 12:49 |
| berndj | yes, currently 2 hours no power 3x a day | 12:50 |
| sneep | 20:36 < berndj> is 37.5°C a noteworthy fever? <-- yes | 12:51 |
| RougeRR | ah shity | 12:51 |
| berndj | my "slot" is 14:00 - ~16:00 | 12:51 |
| RougeRR | berndj, considered a 4g bouncer? | 12:51 |
| RougeRR | well even just 4g backup | 12:51 |
| dTal | worth noting the enormous difference between 1% and 5% death rate | 12:51 |
| berndj | RougeRR, i have a bnc. i just can't irc when the power's out | 12:51 |
| RougeRR | berndj, desktop? | 12:51 |
| dTal | half an order of magnitude in terms of fatalities | 12:52 |
| berndj | RougeRR, laptop with old battery. and the adsl router is on mains power anyway | 12:52 |
| RougeRR | dTal, im pretty confident fatalities depend on medical treatment rates | 12:52 |
| dTal | of course they do | 12:52 |
| berndj | (and the phone company seems to have let its backup batteries die) | 12:52 |
| RougeRR | and also ofc how much asymptomatic cases | 12:52 |
| RougeRR | more younger people would mean more asymptomatic or mild cases | 12:53 |
| dTal | there is a threshold effect - more than a certain number of cases, and suddenly people aren't getting ventilated | 12:53 |
| RougeRR | dTal, yeah ia gree | 12:53 |
| RougeRR | its a pretty low threshold too atm | 12:53 |
| RougeRR | they need to start building field hospitals and stopping non-essential medical | 12:53 |
| dTal | which is why uk.gov's policy of not agressively curbing the disease as much as possible is moronic | 12:53 |
| RougeRR | exactly | 12:53 |
| RougeRR | i mean there is a balance yes | 12:53 |
| dTal | and they're saying 4 weeks until it's like Italy | 12:54 |
| sneep | They're just repeating the same mistake every other government made | 12:54 |
| RougeRR | but we only get the luxury of that balance, if we dont go full pandemic | 12:54 |
| dTal | I don't agree, I think it's more like 2 weeks | 12:54 |
| RougeRR | sneep, butbutbut HOW CAN WE KNOW!?!?!?! | 12:54 |
| RougeRR | ^ my mother | 12:55 |
| RougeRR | dTal, we can work it out | 12:55 |
| RougeRR | so italy is averaging aprox a 25% increase daily | 12:55 |
| RougeRR | UK is similar | 12:55 |
| RougeRR | italy was on 650 cases 26th febuary | 12:56 |
| RougeRR | yeah | 12:56 |
| RougeRR | id say 2 weeks | 12:56 |
| dTal | you have to account for differences in test protocol | 12:56 |
| RougeRR | oh of course | 12:56 |
| dTal | I think UK probably has about 10,000 real cases more or less | 12:56 |
| RougeRR | looking at their death rates might be better | 12:56 |
| RougeRR | they had 320 confirmed cases and 10 deaths on 24th | 12:57 |
| RougeRR | i mean none of this is exact or follows | 12:57 |
| RougeRR | but i dont think 2 weeks is a suprising number | 12:57 |
| RougeRR | What? is 2 weeks more of "normaly" guna help | 12:57 |
| RougeRR | !"The sport’s governing body have told the Guardian they will continue to follow government advice on the spread of Covid-19 and as such will not postpone the domestic league season unless things change." | 12:58 |
| RougeRR | FUCKING TORIES. | 12:59 |
| RougeRR | Kill the old, the weak and the poor | 12:59 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +451 cases (now 138414), +26 recoveries (now 70755) 🔶 Switzerland: +267 cases (now 1135) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Brunei: +12 cases (now 37) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +39 recoveries (now 64151) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases (now 31) 🔸 Cyprus: +4 cases (now 14) 🔸 | 13:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 11:58 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Global deaths just crossed above 5,000 → https://is.gd/1Wxb4Q | 13:01 |
| RougeRR | why is the football association more sensible than the UK gov? | 13:03 |
| RougeRR | Swansea City’s chairman, Trevor Birch, acknowledges the postponement of matches was “inevitable”. In a statement, Birch said: “The health and wellbeing of our staff, supporters, their families and the wider public will always remain of paramount importance to the football club. The decision to postpone fixtures was inevitable and totally understandable for what is an unprecedented and dynamically developing situation. We all hope | 13:03 |
| RougeRR | we can get back to normal as soon as possible, but the priority at the moment is for everyone to follow the health advice available and stay safe.’’ | 13:03 |
| RougeRR | "However, Vallance said the government’s approach was aimed at broadening the peak of the epidemic, and allowing immunity to build up among the population." | 13:09 |
| RougeRR | “Our aim is to try and reduce the peak, broaden the peak, not suppress it completely; | 13:09 |
| RougeRR | well that confirms it | 13:09 |
| RougeRR | the UK government approach is herd immunity and to let it rip through the UK | 13:09 |
| RougeRR | they are not trying containment | 13:09 |
| RougeRR | this is an entirely different and dangerous approach | 13:09 |
| pwr22 | I don't necessarily see the UK as handling this badly - though I'm quite emotionally affected by Boris Johnson basically telling me my dad is going to die 😭 | 13:10 |
| RougeRR | “If you suppress something very, very hard, when you release those measures it bounces back and it bounces back at the wrong time,” he said. The government is concerned that if not enough people catch the virus now, it will re-emerge in the winter, when the NHS is already overstretched." | 13:10 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, no its badly | 13:10 |
| RougeRR | not as badly as 3rd world countries like america | 13:10 |
| RougeRR | but badly | 13:11 |
| kristoffer[m]1 | !cases Norway | 13:11 |
| RougeRR | they are trying to increase exposure | 13:11 |
| pwr22 | Because they consider exposure inavoidable so they're trying to keep it at an ideal rate / time for management | 13:12 |
| RougeRR | i agree | 13:13 |
| RougeRR | but thats not what the UK is doing | 13:13 |
| dTal | I fear that "too much containment, not enough cases" is not a problem that the UK is likely to have | 13:13 |
| RougeRR | dTal, agreed | 13:13 |
| RougeRR | if they want to go for the "herd immunity" approach | 13:13 |
| RougeRR | do it deliberatly in a controlled manner | 13:14 |
| RougeRR | fucking start locking down cities, removing the vulnerable | 13:14 |
| RougeRR | and infecting the very healthy | 13:14 |
| RougeRR | but lol no public wont go for that | 13:14 |
| dTal | because it's fucking unethical | 13:14 |
| RougeRR | and this is? | 13:14 |
| dTal | we don't even know if immunity is a thing | 13:15 |
| dTal | this is just as unethical | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | we are pretty sure it is | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | but yes | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | i agree | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | unethical | 13:15 |
| dTal | I modestly propose BoJo be the first to be take one for the team and be infected for the greater good | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | but its basically the government approach | 13:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:04 UTC: Coronavirus: Trump claims 'very large scale' testing; Indonesia cases double: President Donald Trump said Friday that coronavirus testing in the U.S. would soon take place on a "very large scale basis." → https://is.gd/jKua0A | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | dTal, agreed | 13:15 |
| pwr22 | I feel UK is beyond the point where containment is viable so shutting down cities seems pointless | 13:15 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, it is | 13:16 |
| pwr22 | The UK isn't a big place - and it seems to be pretty much everywhere | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | they should be social distancing | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | and stopping large events | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | and isolating vulnerable | 13:16 |
| pwr22 | I expect they probably will when infection rates pick up | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | yeah too late | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | thats reactive not proactive | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | its an exponential curve | 13:16 |
| RougeRR | why bother in 2 weeks doing what you can do today | 13:17 |
| RougeRR | if we are really in this long term, why bother waitinf | 13:17 |
| pwr22 | They've got to try and keep that 20% that need hospital care as close as possible to the level the NHS can handle | 13:17 |
| pwr22 | Because right now they can handle the amount of cases that are happening | 13:17 |
| RougeRR | ... | 13:17 |
| RougeRR | so start now? | 13:17 |
| RougeRR | the quicker you control the spreach, the lower the exponential growth bubbles up | 13:17 |
| dTal | Yeah, there's a two week case lag | 13:18 |
| pwr22 | The NHS does things that are logical, not things that feel best | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, bullshit | 13:18 |
| dTal | pwr22: this is not logical | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | they do what the chief medical officer tells them | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | what the government tell them | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | are all of europe idiots then? | 13:18 |
| pwr22 | And I have no doubt they're bodelling for that | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | are they all doing it for a fucking laugh? | 13:18 |
| pwr22 | *modelling | 13:18 |
| dTal | In two weeks there will be 100x as many cases | 13:18 |
| dTal | even if everything shuts down *now* | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, so why are france, germany, ukraine, poland , latvia, estonia | 13:18 |
| dTal | because of the lag | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | alld doing the opposite | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | there is no lag | 13:18 |
| pwr22 | Well I don't have access to the data or analytics ability to convince myself of that so let just agree to disagree | 13:18 |
| RougeRR | these countries have less cases some of them | 13:19 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, you dopnt have to | 13:19 |
| RougeRR | WHY IS every other sensible country advocating the opposite | 13:19 |
| dTal | RougeRR: there is, because of the incubation period - if you wait until "the time looks right", you will be at least a week too late | 13:19 |
| RougeRR | why is out own ex health minister and our ex cheif medical office ripping the govenment approach a new one | 13:19 |
| RougeRR | dTal, exactly | 13:19 |
| RougeRR | they are doing this to either try "take it on the chin" and have herd immunity quickly | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | or | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | because they know we dont have the social and welfare system to support people | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | or both | 13:20 |
| pwr22 | dTal: they will be modelling for that | 13:20 |
| pwr22 | They aren't going to be blindly doing things based on the number of cases today 🤦♂️ | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, and all the other countries are not | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | sure | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | yeah | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | we are the ones in the right | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | every other country is wrong | 13:20 |
| RougeRR | all their experts are wrong, our tory appointed advisors are right? | 13:21 |
| dTal | god I wish I had your confidence in Tory competence and compassion for humanity | 13:21 |
| pwr22 | I don't think there's a right or wrong | 13:21 |
| RougeRR | we have the 2nd lowest sick pay in europe | 13:21 |
| RougeRR | £90 a week | 13:21 |
| RougeRR | stop and think about that | 13:21 |
| RougeRR | in italy its 60% of wages | 13:21 |
| pwr22 | I think it's a different strategy | 13:22 |
| RougeRR | it is a different strategy, | 13:22 |
| RougeRR | its fucking dangerous | 13:22 |
| pwr22 | Lets not lose sight here that we are trying to save peoples lives / prevent the collapse of society. I have no interest in getting into an unpleasant discussion on this - the virus is making our lifes unpleasant enough | 13:22 |
| dTal | I don't see the strategy to be honest | 13:22 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, then dont support the tories | 13:22 |
| dTal | the plan is to contain it *less* than we could? | 13:22 |
| RougeRR | they are not trying to save lives, they are trying to prop themselves up | 13:22 |
| pwr22 | I haven't been even slightly political here so lets keep that out of this channel please | 13:23 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, i didnt say you were | 13:23 |
| freedom4allnow | The flu has killed more people than this has. | 13:23 |
| RougeRR | freedom4allnow, WOW | 13:23 |
| RougeRR | no shit sherlock | 13:23 |
| freedom4allnow | Just in 2009 H1N1 flu pandemic: Between 8,870 and 18,300 deaths in the United States and up to 203,000 deaths worldwide specifically from H1N1 | 13:23 |
| RougeRR | lower fatality rate | 13:23 |
| RougeRR | yeah give it another 3 months | 13:23 |
| pwr22 | Eh? | 13:24 |
| pwr22 | > then dont support the tories | 13:24 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, you are supporting their dangerous strategy | 13:24 |
| RougeRR | and they have been proven to lie and lie and lie | 13:24 |
| freedom4allnow | There is a hidden agenda behind this. | 13:24 |
| RougeRR | at the expense of the welfare of the people | 13:24 |
| azy | unlike the other politicians | 13:25 |
| RougeRR | azy, yes | 13:25 |
| RougeRR | unlike the others | 13:25 |
| RougeRR | none are perfect | 13:25 |
| RougeRR | no other party is advocating shotting ourselves in both feet economically at the peak of a pandemic | 13:25 |
| azy | why is £90 a week not enough by the way? | 13:26 |
| RougeRR | azy, because thats less than rent.... | 13:26 |
| RougeRR | the average weekly wage is 500 a mon | 13:26 |
| RougeRR | month | 13:26 |
| pwr22 | RougeRR: politics is opinions - there are no doubt a lot of people who agree with you and a lot who don't. This room isn't about politics so please keep it out of here 🙂 . | 13:27 |
| pwr22 | I understand you are angry but this isn't the place to take it out on people who aren't involved in making the decisions you're angry about | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | so people base their bills around this, many people are living hand to mouth | 13:27 |
| azy | 60% of that is less than rent too | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | pwr22, no its not | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | its a fact | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | azy, no its not | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | weekly | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | vs monthly | 13:27 |
| azy | you get 60% of your monthly wages, weekly? | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | rent can range from £400-£1000+ | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | no | 13:27 |
| RougeRR | we get £90 a week | 13:27 |
| azy | opposed to 60%/4 a week? | 13:28 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +117 cases (now 138531), +2 deaths (now 5083), +3 recoveries (now 70758) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Brazil: +8 cases (now 85) 🔸 Brunei: +12 cases (now 37) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +40 recoveries (now 64152) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases ( | 13:28 |
| RougeRR | 60% of monthly wage | 13:28 |
| RougeRR | over a month | 13:28 |
| azy | yeah where did i go wrong? | 13:28 |
| RougeRR | is italy | 13:28 |
| azy | most people cant survive their current standard of living with 60% either | 13:28 |
| RougeRR | azy, but they can get by | 13:28 |
| azy | cant pay rent with that | 13:28 |
| RougeRR | so if the average monthly wage is £2000 | 13:29 |
| pwr22 | Ok RougeRR I'm going to drop my side of the convesation now. I hope you feel better soon 🙂 | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | in italy you would get £1200 | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | in the uk you would get £400 | 13:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:23 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: English Premier League suspended, US grants emergency approval for new test → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | k | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | that doesnt even cover rent for most | 13:29 |
| azy | thats a high number to go with 60% of | 13:29 |
| azy | why not 1000? | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | what the fuckl are you on about | 13:29 |
| RougeRR | UK sick pay is £90 flatrate | 13:29 |
| azy | you chose 2000 so that your 60% number can pay rent | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | italy pays 60% of your average wage | 13:30 |
| azy | instead of 1000, which wouldnt be able to | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | 2000 is the average wage in the uk | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | its not rocket science | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | so im comparing the two | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | figure | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | what is your question, go google this if you cant work it out | 13:30 |
| azy | you mean there's loads of people under 2k/month? | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | dipshit | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | wake up | 13:30 |
| azy | not an argument | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | what is your question? | 13:30 |
| azy | you're quite unpleasant | 13:30 |
| RougeRR | yes | 13:30 |
| azy | you cant even follow a basic discussion, while calling me a dumbass lol | 13:31 |
| RougeRR | you cant follow basic maths | 13:31 |
| azy | wHaT iS uR QuEsTiOn? GoOGlE iT | 13:31 |
| RougeRR | UK sick pay = £90 flat rate | 13:31 |
| azy | oh dear | 13:31 |
| RougeRR | Italy sick pay = 60% of your wage | 13:31 |
| pwr22 | RougeRR: who's the "dip shit"? | 13:31 |
| RougeRR | azy, | 13:31 |
| azy | me, anyone who disagrees with him, tories, tory voters | 13:31 |
| azy | everyones an idiot | 13:31 |
| pwr22 | And this is your last warning - play nice or you're getting kicked to call off | 13:31 |
| pwr22 | *cool off | 13:31 |
| pwr22 | Drop the insults | 13:32 |
| RougeRR | k fam | 13:32 |
| pwr22 | Drop the idea that your opinions are facts and other peoples are just opinions which are wrong | 13:32 |
| pwr22 | We can all be wrong heh | 13:32 |
| RougeRR | i mean no. | 13:32 |
| RougeRR | we can be more right | 13:33 |
| azy | in a face to face conversation you'd be really polite | 13:33 |
| RougeRR | vouchercloud.com/resources/sick-leave-across-europe | 13:33 |
| pwr22 | azy: please drop it - do not encourage them more | 13:33 |
| RougeRR | https://www.vouchercloud.com/resources/sick-leave-across-europe#uk | 13:34 |
| RougeRR | https://www.vouchercloud.com/resources/sick-leave-across-europe#italy | 13:34 |
| slash_ | "Many companies have their own 'company sick pay' program that is often, hopefully, more lucrative." lol I hope so, why is it so low in the UK? | 13:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:35 UTC: Ex-FDA chief: US capacity for coronavirus testing will soon be at more than 10,000 per day: "By probably next week, we'll be at capacity of tens of thousands of tests a day," former Food and Drug Administration Commissioner Scott Gottlieb told CNBC. → https://is.gd/7oT7em | 13:43 |
| RougeRR | poor social welfare system, its indicative of a larger policy | 13:43 |
| RougeRR | you are meant to pull yourself up by your own bootstraps, and purchase the correct boots with which to do it | 13:44 |
| RougeRR | similar to the united states but more watered down | 13:44 |
| slash_ | damn | 13:45 |
| slash_ | here the employer needs mandatory sick-pay insurance for their employees | 13:45 |
| RougeRR | hm neat | 13:45 |
| slash_ | employer pays 70-100% of salary for the first 2 years, after that it's national sick leave which is much lower | 13:46 |
| RougeRR | employees can purchase that here | 13:46 |
| RougeRR | I wonder if that could work. cant remember how much it is | 13:46 |
| slash_ | cost for employer is largely compensated by their insurance though, so they can high temp workers etc to replace sick people without too much extra cost | 13:46 |
| RougeRR | thats fairly good slash_ | 13:46 |
| RougeRR | the argument against sick pay is that people should keep money as a buffer i.e dont be poor. | 13:47 |
| RougeRR | and that people will abuse the system | 13:47 |
| RougeRR | kind of misses the point of a society and welfare system though | 13:47 |
| slash_ | here after 3 days sick, the insurance kicks in (first 3 days are employer risk), and the insurance company will send a doctor to evaluate if you are actually sick | 13:47 |
| RougeRR | yep | 13:48 |
| RougeRR | there are plenty of ways to mitigate it | 13:48 |
| slash_ | you can also be partially sick, so you could maybe still be required to do some work if possible | 13:48 |
| RougeRR | The UK was applauded in its budget (well the government patted itself on the back) for removing the 3 day wait time for statuatory sick pay | 13:48 |
| RougeRR | which means £60 more total | 13:49 |
| RougeRR | barely a drop over 2 weeks or more | 13:49 |
| slash_ | yeah, you need to protect employers and employees, it's a balance | 13:49 |
| slash_ | but that is just food alone lol | 13:49 |
| RougeRR | it is, it seems to rest on the assumption that you can choose not to be ill | 13:49 |
| slash_ | or well a bit more than food, but you can't live from so little | 13:50 |
| RougeRR | rent for a 1 bed flat in my city is £900 a month | 13:50 |
| RougeRR | flatshares are £500-600 | 13:50 |
| RougeRR | so SSP wouldnt even cover rent if living hand to mouth | 13:50 |
| slash_ | yeah that sounds pretty bad | 13:51 |
| RougeRR | yeah | 13:51 |
| RougeRR | so it means UK workers will keep going to work when sick because they have too | 13:52 |
| RougeRR | meaning diseases spread | 13:52 |
| slash_ | that's happening in the US too I hear | 13:52 |
| RougeRR | yeah its a similar deal | 13:52 |
| slash_ | but even here.. people often go to work sick lol | 13:52 |
| RougeRR | we are a bit better off | 13:52 |
| RougeRR | we have 25 holidays mandatory and most "better" paying jobs do offer some sick pay above statuatory | 13:53 |
| RougeRR | bbut a lot dont | 13:53 |
| slash_ | I never understand it either, if you let the sick people come to work, they'll make more people sick | 13:53 |
| slash_ | sick people are often less productive and it's probably costing the company money | 13:54 |
| RougeRR | slash_, yeah its a dumb false economy | 13:54 |
| RougeRR | underspending on mental health care is another | 13:54 |
| RougeRR | same as overworking people | 13:54 |
| slash_ | we have 25 days too, it's on the low end for Europe :p | 13:54 |
| RougeRR | just means they burn out | 13:55 |
| RougeRR | slash_, aye but its 25 days more than USA | 13:55 |
| slash_ | no wait, 20 days legally, I have +5 from my job | 13:55 |
| RougeRR | ah nice | 13:55 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +161 cases (now 138692) 🔶 Belgium: +157 cases (now 556) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Brazil: +8 cases (now 85) 🔸 Brunei: +12 cases (now 37) 🔸 Canada: +16 cases (now 158) 🔸 China: +1 deaths (now 3177), +40 recoveries (now 64152) 🔸 Croatia: +4 cases (now 31) 🔸 | 13:55 |
| slash_ | but 20 days excluding legal holidays so | 13:55 |
| slash_ | 2 days christmas, 1 new years day, 1 easter, 1 ascension and 1 kings day | 13:55 |
| slash_ | some of those might be in weekend | 13:56 |
| slash_ | usa is terrible, some people dont have a vacation day in literally years | 13:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:46 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Buffett moves shareholder meeting online, English Premier League suspended → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 13:57 |
| RougeRR | yeah ours is excluding holidays as well | 13:57 |
| RougeRR | some do include them | 13:57 |
| RougeRR | haha i like this guy | 13:57 |
| RougeRR | https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/coronavirus-latest-news-italy-man-circle-social-distancing-rome-a9399081.html | 13:57 |
| slash_ | it also depends on the type of job, some sectors can require employees to work up to 2 or 3 of those legal holidays | 13:58 |
| RougeRR | slash_, yeah here too | 13:58 |
| slash_ | haha | 13:58 |
| slash_ | but I guess that's obvious, especially for police, healthcare etc | 13:59 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +178 cases (now 138870), +1 deaths (now 5084), +7 recoveries (now 70765) 🔶 Spain: +115 cases (now 4073), +1 deaths (now 92) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Czechia: +3 cases (now 120) 🔸 Kuwait: +20 cases (now 100) 🔸 Norway: +15 cases (now | 14:09 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +330 cases (now 139200), +28 deaths (now 5112), +1 recoveries (now 70766) 🔶 Spain: +136 cases (now 4209), +28 deaths (now 120) 🔶 Netherlands: +190 cases (now 804) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Czechia: +3 cases (now 120) 🔸 Jordan: +1 r | 14:22 |
| romare | how long can virus stay on fruits/vegetables? | 14:35 |
| Birosso | Oh. My. Goodness. | 14:45 |
| Birosso | I don't usually say oh my goodness, but this situation calls for it. | 14:45 |
| Birosso | My German university just cancelled all lectures and exams. | 14:45 |
| Birosso | Unprecedented, in its 250 or so years of existence. | 14:46 |
| pwr22 | My work office is owned by a university so we may get shutdown soon by them | 14:47 |
| pwr22 | I didn't ever think I'd experience an event like this in my lifetime | 14:47 |
| superkuh | I knew I would. | 14:47 |
| exoteric | 9/11 is comparable in some manner | 14:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 13:43 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Ursula von der Leyen : daremo a Italia tutto quello che chiede → https://is.gd/1rdipi | 14:52 |
| Birosso | Translation of the article above (from the German version): The EU is setting a 37 billion Euros for a Corona response initiative. | 14:55 |
| python476 | Birosso: coursera awaits for you | 14:55 |
| Birosso | python476: I have TWO exams left. | 14:55 |
| Birosso | Just TWO! | 14:55 |
| python476 | so close yet so far | 14:55 |
| python476 | #life-is-tragedy | 14:55 |
| python476 | 91,773 <= JHU stats have been fubared | 14:56 |
| Birosso | Eh, the exams are the least of my problems. | 14:56 |
| rahiakherajot[m] | %data Bharat | 14:56 |
| Brainstorm | rahiakherajot[m]: Sorry, Bharat not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 14:56 |
| LjL | all country names are in English in the dat | 14:56 |
| rahiakherajot[m] | %data India | 14:56 |
| Brainstorm | rahiakherajot[m]: In all areas, India, there are 81 cases, 1 deaths (1.2% of cases), 4 recoveries as of March 13, 13:47Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=India for time series data. | 14:56 |
| python476 | Birosso: then what is the problem ? | 14:57 |
| LjL | Birosso, meanwhile though, China is the one that's actually sending us stuff we need like masks and ventilators, whereas Austria and Slovenia are stopping our *goods* trucks at borders. the EU had better do better than just press releases | 14:57 |
| LjL | also Spain is ridiculous, they have more than 4000 cases, and they "red-zone" an area with 70k people just because a two-digit case count there doubled | 14:58 |
| LjL | <romare> how long can virus stay on fruits/vegetables? ← potentially days, we don't really know for sure. wash them thoroughly. | 14:58 |
| Birosso | LjL, have your politicians made any comments on the lack of proper assistance from the EU? | 14:58 |
| LjL | Birosso, our president of the republic just has. i don't know if you're familiar with our political system but the president, while nominally head of state, has few powers (the PM has the power), and usually refrains from making any "strong" comments. this time he actually said he's disappointed with EU non-reaction and stuff | 14:59 |
| Birosso | I see. | 15:00 |
| LjL | today Milan closed all parks (that can be closed), following a few other cities in Lombardy doing the same | 15:01 |
| LjL | there's been a certain lack of clearness on whether you're allowed to have a stress-dissipating walk or a jogging session | 15:01 |
| Birosso | *Sigh* I'm torn now. I'm supposed to be moving out by the end of the month, but at the same time I'm being advised (by people) to stock up, especially since our little university town is a bit cut off and people aren't certain how the virus will start affecting the country logistically. | 15:01 |
| LjL | it's like, "strongly discouraged", but not forbidden, unless the cop you meet is on a bad day. and who isn't? | 15:01 |
| Birosso | Makes no sense to stock up if you're moving out! | 15:01 |
| Timvde | Birosso: It's very clear here that stocking up is not necessary (although people are totally doing that) | 15:02 |
| Timvde | I'm not planning to, either | 15:03 |
| LjL | Birosso, i don't know your full situation... but for now we aren't running out of basic goods like food. however, it can become a hassle (and a risk) to buy it due to long queues outside of supermarkets, and now that trucks are actually being stopped at border... what the hell do i know | 15:03 |
| Timvde | Just went to a very small shop that isn't currently getting raided to get through the weekend, and I'm hoping that the madness has calmed down by Monday | 15:03 |
| azy | https://twitter.com/MailOnline/status/1238012197537755136 | 15:04 |
| LjL | Timvde, well, smaller shops are kind of all closed here now, so anyone who was planning to do that to avoid the supermarket congestion can scrap those plans | 15:04 |
| Timvde | LjL: Well, it's still part of a large supermarket chain | 15:04 |
| Timvde | But it's a "fresh" shop, so they don't have a lot of canned stuff, or even toilet paper | 15:05 |
| LjL | Timvde, yeah, we have a mini-supermarket like that very close by. the fear there is that if any of the staff gets positive, they'll have to close it down. | 15:05 |
| Timvde | But that could happen in a large supermarket too, right? | 15:05 |
| LjL | Timvde, yes, none of which gives me any firmer conviction that food will remain easily available | 15:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test)* at 14:03 UTC: nCoV: From Iceland — COVID-19 In Iceland: 117 Confirmed Cases, New Information Site Online | 13MAR20 → https://is.gd/NcsDGl | 15:06 |
| LjL | anyway, hoarding is not necessary if you plan on stocking up *a bit* on a well-reasoned selection of nonperishable goods | 15:06 |
| Birosso | Timvde, I wouldn't think stocking up would be necessary if I lived in a somewhat populated city. The concerns that people are having is that because we're a small town and we depend on *daily* delivery trucks that bring food, etc. from surrounding regions, an interruption of said supply chain of more than week might start to become problematic. | 15:07 |
| Timvde | LjL: I'd think that it would only last a few days, until it is disinfected | 15:07 |
| Birosso | But then again, the town itself might start stocking up to address that possibility. | 15:07 |
| Timvde | Birosso: I see. Still, it would be better to just buy a _little_ bit extra over time than stock up at once | 15:07 |
| Birosso | It's worth mentioning that the university is all there is to the town; it's the only reason the town still exists. And like many universities in Germany (and certain other parts of the world)... | 15:08 |
| Birosso | We have A LOT of Chinese students. | 15:08 |
| Birosso | So that's leaving some people on edge. | 15:08 |
| Birosso | It doesn't make any difference for me personally, that last point, but... some people can be irrational. | 15:08 |
| Birosso | *most | 15:09 |
| LjL | Timvde, they've *just now* started "sanification" of the streets and other places in Codogno, where our cluster started. Milan's mayor announced he's going to do it also. i still have no idea what this spraying of disinfectant all over street is about, since as i keep saying people don't often lick sidewalks, but it's pretty clear at this point it's not just "for show" as people said at first about China. i'd really like a better explanation. anyway, point | 15:09 |
| LjL | here being that supermarkets may require some very thorough disinfection if they are found contaminated | 15:09 |
| LjL | anyway, the thing with trucks being stopped at the borders with Slovenia and Austria is unlikely to make our food supplies any better | 15:11 |
| mefistofeles | hey | 15:14 |
| mefistofeles | any big news I/we should know about? :P | 15:14 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, Spain is quarantining a 70k people area, for some reason i fail to exactly grasp. Macron made a speech to the nation last night. i think there are other quarantined areas in Austria or Germany or something but i missed that part | 15:15 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: ok, thanks for the info | 15:16 |
| mefistofeles | the university here is basically empty for the most part | 15:17 |
| mefistofeles | I just desinfected the office, just in case | 15:17 |
| LjL | also i see from BNO "BREAKING: Belgium closes all schools, bars, and restaurants due to coronavirus and bans all recreational events regardless of size" | 15:18 |
| LjL | also Sophie Trudeau actually is positive | 15:19 |
| Timvde | Yea, pretty much | 15:19 |
| Timvde | Although I do have a very ironic Pandemic Legacy session this Sunday with some friends... | 15:19 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: who is she? | 15:19 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, wife of Canada's PM | 15:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:16 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Buffett moves shareholder meeting online, English Premier League suspended → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 15:20 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +201 cases (now 139401), +10 deaths (now 5122), +43 recoveries (now 70809) 🔶 Hubei, China: +5 cases (now 67786), +6 deaths (now 3062), +1235 recoveries (now 51553) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Belarus: +6 cases (now 27) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzeg | 15:20 |
| Timvde | Only 5 new cases in Hubei, not bad | 15:20 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: I see | 15:22 |
| Timvde | Huh, the website I'm mostly using to track the cases looks broken | 15:22 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: also Bolsonaro | 15:22 |
| mefistofeles | if you haven't heard | 15:22 |
| Timvde | Its missing Italy? | 15:22 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, last i heard Bolsonaro was maybe-maybe-not positive to a first test but was waiting for a second | 15:22 |
| LjL | Timvde, which one is that? | 15:22 |
| Timvde | https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 | 15:23 |
| LjL | oh, the usual | 15:23 |
| Timvde | Total deaths also doesn't match the numbers below at all | 15:23 |
| LjL | Timvde, last night the data were all wrong with respect to recoveries | 15:24 |
| LjL | Timvde, italy is missing from the map too | 15:25 |
| LjL | %cases italy | 15:25 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 15113 cases, 1016 deaths (6.7% of cases), 1258 recoveries as of March 13, 14:17Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 15:25 |
| Timvde | Oof, 6.7% | 15:25 |
| Timvde | %cases Belgium | 15:25 |
| LjL | yeah :( | 15:25 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Belgium, there are 556 cases, 3 deaths (0.5% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 14:17Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data. | 15:25 |
| Timvde | No new deaths, good | 15:25 |
| LjL | my mom is yelling something to my dad, i think the supermarket is not delivering at all now, last delivery date shown in 28 march but there's no slots available until then | 15:26 |
| LjL | 120bpm probably explains why i have a racing heart feeling... | 15:34 |
| exoteric | music lives on | 15:35 |
| LjL | Timvde, now checked 4 supermarkets and none of them have delivery slots available anymore | 15:36 |
| superkuh | Oh no. No delivery. How will you survive? | 15:36 |
| Timvde | LjL: I'm planning to still go to the supermarket myself | 15:36 |
| Timvde | Just hoping to find a slightly more quiet moment | 15:37 |
| LjL | superkuh, it's not funny | 15:37 |
| Timvde | Delivery doesn't scale | 15:37 |
| superkuh | I drove to what I figured was the least popular grocer in town, saw the parking lot filled (never happens), then drove back home. | 15:37 |
| LjL | Timvde, neither does limited access to supermarkets with queues outside that fill up entire streets | 15:37 |
| superkuh | About 15 minutes ago. | 15:37 |
| Timvde | LjL: That's still the case in Italy? | 15:37 |
| LjL | superkuh, well, we aren't allowed to drive to a supermarket that isn't there nearest one to our home, so there is that | 15:38 |
| superkuh | Oh. | 15:38 |
| LjL | Timvde, "still"? they just started doing it, by law they can only allow a few people in at a time | 15:38 |
| contingo | how about a speciality supermarket, like a Chinese supermarket | 15:38 |
| LjL | contingo, Chinatown has closed down *everything* weeks ago before any law mandated it | 15:38 |
| Timvde | Because I really am still hoping that the hoarders will have hoarded enough in a few days and make room for us | 15:38 |
| LjL | Timvde, the queues are not because of hoarders, they're because of law requirements | 15:38 |
| Timvde | Oh | 15:39 |
| Timvde | What does the law require? Maximum x people in the supermarket at the same time, people need to be at least one meter away from each other in queues? | 15:40 |
| LjL | also <superkuh> Oh no. No delivery. How will you survive? ← by going to the supermarket, clearly, but if i get infected there, then guess what, my parents likely *won't* survive | 15:40 |
| contingo | LjL, here, actual Chinese supermarkets tend to be in giant retail / industrial park on the edge of the city. But if there is no Chinese food industry to support anymore, maybe they are closed too (although here a good portion of sales will be to private individuals) | 15:40 |
| superkuh | LjL, I didn't realize you were in Italy. | 15:40 |
| contingo | what is your parents' view of what to do? | 15:40 |
| LjL | Timvde, the requirement is to be at least 1m from one another, but in practice that's enforced by limiting accesses, i don't think they actually measure distances between people... although, the queues outside are partly endless *because* people are (at least when i saw them) keeping somewhat distant from one another | 15:41 |
| LjL | contingo, my mom was yelling and now just said "i guess we'll either starve or go to the supermarket and die from the coronavirus" | 15:41 |
| contingo | sigh | 15:42 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +210 cases (now 139611) 🔶 United Kingdom: +189 cases (now 798) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Belarus: +6 cases (now 27) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +2 cases (now 13) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +4 cases (now 23) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +7 ca | 15:43 |
| Birosso | LjL, why can't your mother just send you out? | 15:43 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: I mean, you as the young man, should go.. not them, then you should be properly disinfected when you enter the home and that should be enough, imho | 15:43 |
| mefistofeles | go with masks and whatnot, fwiw | 15:44 |
| LjL | Birosso, well she can, but it doesn't make much difference if i get infected. people in the same household are practically *guaranteed* to get infected if one of them is. and being young only makes you survive it better, it doesn't seemingly decrease your chances of *getting* it | 15:44 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, masks have been out of stock since forever. we do have *one*, that cost us €13 | 15:45 |
| Birosso | "A Belgium man arrested after licking his fingers and wiping them on pole in train" | 15:46 |
| Birosso | Bahahaha! | 15:46 |
| contingo | I feel how you feel w.r.t. when they only started listening about self-isolating when the TV said. Because I feel like I was imploring them like three weeks, via you, and you were as well, to majorly stock up on food supplies | 15:46 |
| contingo | but oh well that's not helpful now | 15:46 |
| LjL | contingo, we have *some* nonperishable goods, which they probably thought were the reasonable amount, but really i don't think they understood the magnitude and duration of what we're facing | 15:47 |
| LjL | contingo, my mom cried the other day and said "you were right on everything, it's all coming true now" | 15:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 14:43 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Singapore bans travelers from Italy, France, Germany, and Spain → https://is.gd/XOQ2al | 15:47 |
| LjL | what i can say... "yeah, i know". | 15:48 |
| contingo | there are strict quotas on everything inside the stores? | 15:48 |
| mefistofeles | also do realize that you are mostly just prolonging the time when you get infected, fwiw | 15:48 |
| LjL | contingo, no, there have never been, which i found dumb from the start. | 15:48 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, yes i realize that, but considering if they don't find a good treatment or vaccine by the time my dad gets it, he's as good as dead, i think i'll try not to think about that too much | 15:49 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: yeah that thought just won't help | 15:49 |
| LjL | i mean my heartrate already *is* 120 | 15:49 |
| hex17or | %data Germany | 15:49 |
| Brainstorm | hex17or: In all areas, Germany, there are 3117 cases, 7 deaths (0.2% of cases), 46 recoveries as of March 13, 14:33Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 15:49 |
| mefistofeles | it's amazing how Germany stays at 0.x death rate | 15:50 |
| LjL | amazing, and dubious | 15:50 |
| mefistofeles | indeed | 15:50 |
| mefistofeles | we do have more ICUs per habitant here | 15:50 |
| LjL | sure, but Korea, which managed remarkably well, still has 0.7% | 15:50 |
| mefistofeles | yes | 15:50 |
| azy | hows north korea doing? | 15:50 |
| contingo | what about Amazon grocery? | 15:50 |
| mefistofeles | they were also hit sooner, with less knowledge, as well | 15:50 |
| LjL | contingo, we have some of that on its way (hopefully) but they don't have a lot of things | 15:51 |
| LjL | azy, i don't think anyone knows | 15:51 |
| azy | yeah i dont suppose we'll get to know. theyre probably nicely isolated though | 15:52 |
| contingo | in terms of "perishables". there's lots of relatively long life fruit and veggies, many others freeze well, or have acceptable canned versions. If you do get a chance to majorly stock up, you can batch cook meal portions for freezing, if you have freezer space. But you will be aware of this | 15:52 |
| mefistofeles | yeah, I wouldn't expect them to be hit that hard, tbh | 15:52 |
| LjL | azy, South Korea reports that they know "hundreds" of soldiers died at the other end of the border. but that doesn't mean much does it | 15:52 |
| azy | i also wouldnt expect them to be able to deal with it well though | 15:53 |
| contingo | what do you make of the Iran mass graves satellite images | 15:53 |
| contingo | could be some other infrastructure? | 15:53 |
| azy | who's reporting it contingo ? | 15:53 |
| Birosso | So the Brazilian president, who two days ago said Corona was a fantasy created by the press, has today tested positive for Corona. | 15:53 |
| Birosso | Bahahaha! | 15:53 |
| azy | did he really say that though | 15:54 |
| contingo | several of the main UK media | 15:54 |
| LjL | contingo, actually i am probably guilty of not having researched too much in detail what to buy. there is the usual, legumes, and nuts... but then for instance powdered milk was just mentioned and i hadn't even thought of that. i've only skimmed through some prepping tips pages. | 15:54 |
| mefistofeles | Birosso: I think it's still not conclusive, though | 15:54 |
| contingo | https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/12/coronavirus-iran-mass-graves-qom | 15:54 |
| mefistofeles | Birosso: but did he say that? Who stupid... | 15:54 |
| mefistofeles | How* | 15:54 |
| LjL | contingo, the fact my parents didn't seem receptive to the idea made it feel somewhat fruitless and just anxiety-inducing to research what to buy | 15:54 |
| oxalis | \o/ there’s an outbreak in my hometown! | 15:54 |
| Birosso | azyAccording to nytimes adn several other websites, yes. | 15:54 |
| contingo | New York Times too | 15:54 |
| Birosso | mefistofeles: According to several UK and US news websites, he did. | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | Birosso: I see | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | wouldn't trust those, tbh | 15:55 |
| Birosso | "“During the past year, obviously, we have had moments of crisis. A lot of that is fantasy. And coronavirus, which is not all the mainstream media makes it out to be,” the president said, as he blamed the media for fuelling a crash in global oil prices." | 15:55 |
| Birosso | Independent. | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | ok, that is different from saying coronavirus is a fantasy in an absolute way | 15:56 |
| azy | ^ | 15:56 |
| Birosso | Indeed. | 15:56 |
| contingo | well I won't enumerate what I've batch-frozen, it's pretty much down to my personal tastes anyway | 15:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:59 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: The Masters is postponed, Buffett moves shareholder meeting online → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 16:01 |
| contingo | but if you do end up in a position where you want some guidance just ask | 16:03 |
| LjL | contingo, the aloe gel from amazon that i had half-ordered, meaning i had put it in my recurring orders for a silly discount (together with some biscuits), it was meant to be delivered around march 20, and instead it says next delivery date will be september 20 | 16:05 |
| contingo | :( | 16:05 |
| berndj | <sneep> They're just repeating the same mistake every other government made <-- can you enumerate some of these mistakes? | 16:06 |
| dTal | I can - waiting until things look bad so they don't look silly for over-reacting, when waiting that long means waiting till it's too late | 16:07 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +218 cases (now 139829), +3 deaths (now 5125), +4 recoveries (now 70813) 🔶 Spain: +125 cases (now 4334), +2 deaths (now 122), +4 recoveries (now 193) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Austria: +67 cases (now 428) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Belarus: +6 cases (now 27) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +2 case | 16:10 |
| mefistofeles | just now, in this very moment, I'm feeling like I'm getting flu symptoms...ffs | 16:11 |
| contingo | mefistofeles: :( you have a temperature yet? | 16:13 |
| mefistofeles | contingo: I don't know, I feel a little hot, but not sure if psychological xD | 16:19 |
| sneep | berndj: what dTal said | 16:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +121 cases (now 139950) 🔶 Austria: +143 cases (now 504) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Bahrain: +13 cases (now 210) 🔸 Belarus: +6 cases (now 27) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +2 cases (now 13) 🔸 Brazil: +66 cases (now 151) 🔸 Cambodia: +2 cases (now 7) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +4 cases (now 23) 🔸 British | 16:24 |
| astraliam[m] | yesterday in bed all day, headache, vomitting. i think it was a stress induced migrane, mostly caused by have to fight to convince my community we need to prepare. I won, we got some food in, a day in bed and now it's looking much brighter. Stress is probably the biggest comorbidity of all, don't let it get you! | 16:25 |
| Birrosso | Hmm-mmm, the Czech Republic has closed its borders. | 16:26 |
| Birrosso | Drastic. | 16:26 |
| Birrosso | (Source: expats.cz) | 16:27 |
| Birrosso | %cases germany | 16:29 |
| Brainstorm | Birrosso: In all areas, Germany, there are 3117 cases, 7 deaths (0.2% of cases), 46 recoveries as of March 13, 15:19Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 16:29 |
| astraliam[m] | !cases italy | 16:36 |
| berndj | Birrosso, mind saying in which town you are? | 16:44 |
| berndj | not heidelberg maybe? | 16:44 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, | 16:46 |
| RougeRRR | romare, 12-24 hours i expect | 16:46 |
| LjL | you expect what? | 16:49 |
| Birrosso | berndj, do I have permission to PM you? | 16:49 |
| berndj | sure | 16:49 |
| berndj | asking because i have family in germany | 16:49 |
| Birrosso | It's not Heidelberg, no. :) | 16:50 |
| berndj | are the germans being their usual orderly selves? | 16:51 |
| berndj | wow, singapore's go a good deaths:recovered ratio | 16:52 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, how is postal service in italy? | 16:53 |
| RougeRRR | is it running? | 16:53 |
| LjL | RougeRRR, yes, but i can't make predictions since apparently our neighboring countries are now making goods deliveries difficult too | 16:54 |
| RougeRRR | mmm | 16:54 |
| RougeRRR | okay | 16:54 |
| LjL | also, italy's postal service sucks at the best of times | 16:54 |
| RougeRRR | im just trying to work out what will happen in uk | 16:54 |
| RougeRRR | im ordering some bits now in anticipation | 16:54 |
| RougeRRR | new pc case, some meds for 6 months, few supplies | 16:55 |
| RougeRRR | channel islands might develop quickly | 16:55 |
| RougeRRR | malta just put a 14 day quarantine in | 16:55 |
| RougeRRR | guernsey advising against all non essential travel | 16:55 |
| mefistofeles | So I have this bathroom disinfectant, is it any good for a desk/office? | 16:55 |
| RougeRRR | jersey seems to maybe following...but yesterday were saying to carry on | 16:56 |
| RougeRRR | mefistofeles, yeah should be | 16:56 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, UK gov is fucking us | 16:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 15:55 UTC: /u/Isentrope: Contradicting earlier reports (again), President Bolsonaro’s Facebook account states that he has tested negative for the virus: → https://is.gd/ORfKGB | 16:57 |
| Timvde | Sooo, one of my colleagues is likely infected (They're _very_ vague about it, I quote: "Doctors don't do tests anymore with patients that are not in a risk group, but htere is a suspected infection") | 16:58 |
| Timvde | I suppose I should act as if I'm also infected now, at least for two weeks? :/ | 16:59 |
| slash_ | everyone here now started stockpiling toiletpaper, all online supermarket delivery sites are overloaded lol | 16:59 |
| RougeRRR | Timvde, yeah i agree | 16:59 |
| RougeRRR | slash_, yeah that hit here too | 16:59 |
| mefistofeles | Timvde: so they are showing the symptoms? | 16:59 |
| RougeRRR | its stupid cause its like a circular logic | 16:59 |
| slash_ | 40 pack toiletpaper on discount too this week | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | because people are stockpiling | 17:00 |
| Timvde | mefistofeles: I suppose so, that sentence is literally all information we got | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | and running out supplies | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | other stock pile | 17:00 |
| mefistofeles | Timvde: ah ok | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | to get ahead | 17:00 |
| slash_ | yeah but they started stockpiling only today | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | TOILET WARS | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | slash_, same here | 17:00 |
| contingo | %cases Guernsey | 17:00 |
| Brainstorm | contingo: Sorry, Guernsey not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | lol my parents are slowly eating their words | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | they are cancelling their french trip | 17:00 |
| Albright | Toilet paper tends to be one of those things I buy a massive pack of at Costco so I only have to buy it like once every year and a half… so I'm pretty well stocked up on TP right now. | 17:00 |
| RougeRRR | everything i have said will come to pass is happening | 17:00 |
| Albright | Maybe I'll be able to trade it for some rat meat after the collapse. | 17:00 |
| slash_ | RougeRRR they might not even have a choice soon | 17:01 |
| RougeRRR | Albright, oooh fancy | 17:01 |
| RougeRRR | slash_, thats the point | 17:01 |
| mefistofeles | lol | 17:01 |
| RougeRRR | they wilkl come bnack and have to isolate | 17:01 |
| RougeRRR | brb | 17:01 |
| slash_ | Norway already telling tourists to go home, or 14 day quarantine | 17:01 |
| slash_ | toiletpaper shortage isnt even a big issue, can just use water if needed (like a showerhead) | 17:03 |
| mefistofeles | sure | 17:04 |
| slash_ | and if the water supply shuts down, well.. | 17:05 |
| slash_ | we gonna have a bad time | 17:05 |
| pwr22 | <Albright "Toilet paper tends to be one of "> Me too buy buying from Amazon. I mainly do it so I can get 100% recycled stuff that's hard to find on shelves in the UK | 17:06 |
| pwr22 | Gonna go to a supermarket later | 17:07 |
| pwr22 | Will be interesting to see how much worse it is than last week | 17:07 |
| berndj | i wouldn't use recycled toilet paper | 17:07 |
| contingo | I am unintentionally somewhat prepped for a no water scenario | 17:07 |
| Albright | Yeah, I gotta head out to the store later too. So far people have been not panicking around here for the most part from what I've seen. The store has put out some quotas on some things, though. | 17:08 |
| berndj | i didn't see any sign of panic buying at the shop yesterday. maybe people are already stocked up from fears of political SHTF scenarios | 17:08 |
| Albright | berndj: Presumably it's made out of other types of paper. | 17:08 |
| mefistofeles | Albright: that's good, where is that? if you want to share | 17:08 |
| Albright | mefistofeles: Idaho, "flyover country" in the US. | 17:08 |
| mefistofeles | Ah right | 17:09 |
| pwr22 | Even last week when I went all the pasta was gone | 17:09 |
| mefistofeles | one of the less hit zones in the US; afaik | 17:09 |
| berndj | Albright, i'm just making a dumb joke ;) i'm assuming toilet paper is the "low quality" kind of paper, that's made from mechanically pulped wood? | 17:09 |
| Albright | %data Idaho | 17:09 |
| Brainstorm | Albright: Sorry, Idaho not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 17:09 |
| berndj | though i don't think i've seen yellowed toilet paper | 17:09 |
| slash_ | sawyer mini or a lifestraw for emergency water supply | 17:09 |
| slash_ | quite cheap too | 17:10 |
| Albright | I did plan on getting a life straw-type filter and a camping stove from Amazon last month, but I'm having my own financial crisis and ultimately decided to risk it. | 17:10 |
| contingo | random water-related stuff I have: a distiller, lots and lots of buckets with lids, purification tablets, lifestraws | 17:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:08 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Trump to declare national emergency, The Masters is postponed → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 17:10 |
| pwr22 | !cases idaho | 17:11 |
| contingo | plus bottled water | 17:11 |
| berndj | i have maybe 20kL of water left in my swimming pool, but it's gross. maybe ok to cook with if the municipal supply dies | 17:11 |
| slash_ | contingo be careful when storing tap water, it will contaminate after a while if not treated properly first | 17:11 |
| mefistofeles | why all this crazy talk all of a sudden? ;) | 17:11 |
| slash_ | haha yeah I don't think any of this will be necessary | 17:12 |
| contingo | I just happen to have stuff because of jungle trip supplies, that becomes of interest now | 17:12 |
| slash_ | but it cannot hurt to be prepared for "worst case scenario" | 17:12 |
| pwr22 | <slash_ "contingo be careful when storing"> Should be safe to drink if pasteurised before use? | 17:13 |
| skyofdust | You can always boil it, it'll be safe to drink after 5 min | 17:13 |
| slash_ | pwr22 yeah I think so | 17:13 |
| contingo | so you'll need a gas stove and canisters then | 17:13 |
| berndj | slash_, living in south africa is already a significantly-bad case scenario. i don't think we have much if any "fat" left in the system to draw on to deal with this virus | 17:14 |
| contingo | because if we collapse to the point of prolonged widespread unsafe tap water, main electricity is out too | 17:14 |
| skyofdust | I've got a 60 liter propane tank, meybe I'm taking it for grante | 17:14 |
| superkuh | Yep. Enough of this. | 17:14 |
| slash_ | berndj then it is a very sensible thing to be prepared yes | 17:14 |
| Albright | superkuh couldn't take all the blackpilling? | 17:15 |
| contingo | lol | 17:15 |
| ericberlin[m] | %data connecticut | 17:15 |
| Brainstorm | ericberlin[m]: In Connecticut, US, there are 5 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 16:04Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 17:15 |
| slash_ | this is the bronze age collapse all over again! | 17:15 |
| berndj | slash_, still, it isn't obvious to me at all whether i am / am not overreacting | 17:15 |
| contingo | lol | 17:16 |
| slash_ | excep without all the bronze | 17:16 |
| Acoustic[m] | Everybody realise that boiling the water removes the virus right? | 17:16 |
| skyofdust | I hope so | 17:16 |
| contingo | I need to revive my boy scouts morse signalling skills | 17:16 |
| Albright | Acoustic[m]: Boiling requires fuel, however. | 17:16 |
| slash_ | berndj better to overreact and be wrong though, especially if you think there is concern that there might be water shortages in your country | 17:16 |
| berndj | ironically our CDC-equivalent is one of the few institutions still working well. kinda our only hope maybe | 17:17 |
| tinwhiskers | At most about 20-30% of people will be out of action (and as many again supporting them) but there will be plenty of people to maintain infrastructure. | 17:17 |
| ericberlin[m] | Where is there a fuel shortage? | 17:17 |
| skyofdust | you need fuel for any kind of cooking, so unless you're not cooking you won't have where to boil water | 17:17 |
| Acoustic[m] | Civilisation won't collapse lol. We're trying to protect vulnerable people from dying, that's all | 17:17 |
| berndj | slash_, i really have no idea how labour-intensive all the essential services are. i imagine that water and electricity (generation at least) are pretty automated and don't need a *lot* of manual tending. could be wrong though | 17:18 |
| skyofdust | I've got a lifestraw in case boiling is not an option. | 17:18 |
| tinwhiskers | The power and water will stay on. It's not that sort of emergency. | 17:19 |
| slash_ | berndj I can't say for SA, it is very different for every country. For example, I live in the Netherlands below sea level, water pumps are used to keep this place from flooding and they need maintenance and power. So for me the concern isn't water, but lack of power and maintenance | 17:19 |
| ericberlin[m] | Oh, you're anticipating a future fuel shortage, I take it. | 17:20 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers, you have no idea how precarious things are here. maybe not in your country, but in mine | 17:20 |
| slash_ | berndj well I mean, the issue is still water, but more an excess of it in my livingroom than a shortage | 17:20 |
| berndj | wow, i hadn't even thought of that slash_. are there any estimates how quickly the land would flood if it all stopped tomorrow? | 17:21 |
| berndj | and are you, personally, below sea level? ;) | 17:21 |
| tinwhiskers | You'd be better having a spare electric kettle if your tap water is not potable. You may not be able to get out to buy another one if it dies | 17:21 |
| tinwhiskers | berndj: I very much doubt that. | 17:22 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers: as it is we're having 2 hours of blackouts, 3x a day | 17:22 |
| berndj | the electric utility it fubar | 17:22 |
| berndj | and that's without their staff being decimated | 17:22 |
| tinwhiskers | Losing one or two staff out of every ten is likely not going to make things worse. | 17:24 |
| slash_ | berndj not really sure, heavy rain would be an issue as it won't be pumped away, but otherwise I think we'd have a few weeks, so we should see the issue coming. I am around 2.5 meters below sea level, only my attic would be above the water if the dikes burst for ex | 17:24 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:19 UTC: Europe is now the 'epicenter' of the coronavirus pandemic, WHO says: "More cases are now being reported [in Europe] every day than were reported in China at the height of its epidemic," WHO official. → https://is.gd/E2Of6S | 17:24 |
| tinwhiskers | This is all fear mongering | 17:24 |
| sneep | Yeah, I really doubt the power will go out | 17:25 |
| slash_ | yeah it's very unlikely | 17:25 |
| berndj | sneep, mine's already going out 3x a day | 17:25 |
| sneep | South Africa? | 17:25 |
| berndj | maybe only 2x a day for the weekend | 17:25 |
| berndj | yes | 17:25 |
| slash_ | at least, in developed nations the risk is very low. But berndj is right, it might be different in other countries where the risk might be real | 17:26 |
| sneep | Well I don't know about .za | 17:26 |
| sneep | But they don't have a lot of cases, do they? | 17:26 |
| berndj | no, not yet anyway, that we know of. currently 24 | 17:26 |
| Albright | Something I bought a couple years ago just for kicks is a solar-powered rechargeable battery charger. The pack that holds the batteries can then be used to charge a USB device. So I can still have a working phone if the power goes out (assuming at least the cell towers can get power). | 17:26 |
| tinwhiskers | The 8 remaining staff of every ten may have to work a few more hours in this time of emergency. Infrastructure will not collapse because of the virus. | 17:27 |
| slash_ | if you're in Europe it's very unlikely water/power will be disrupted | 17:27 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers: this is a country where nurses strike and DGAF when patients die. you have no idea | 17:27 |
| tinwhiskers | You really think the nurses will go on strike during a pandemic? | 17:28 |
| berndj | yes | 17:28 |
| berndj | it's very plausible. absolutely psychopathic labour unions | 17:29 |
| skyofdust | Psychopatic? | 17:29 |
| skyofdust | Is wanting better work and living conditions psychopathic? | 17:30 |
| berndj | not categorically, but yes, it can be | 17:30 |
| tinwhiskers | I really don't think this fear mongering is healthy for other people in the channel | 17:30 |
| skyofdust | I hope it happens. | 17:30 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers, kindly butt out with the dismissive attitude. things might not collapse in first world countries, but i'm not in a first world country | 17:31 |
| Mr_Pink | San Diego schools finally closing | 17:31 |
| skyofdust | berndj +1 | 17:31 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers you are right, we should be focusing on measures to contain the virus etc, this is a bad situation, but even the worst case scenario is very very far removed from a "collapse of civilization" | 17:32 |
| Birrosso | skyofdust: I think your understandable frustration at his statement about unions might be clouding your judgement here. Even if your situation is bad, using a situation like this to try to better at the potential cost of human lives doesn't seem like a very nice thing to do. | 17:32 |
| sneep | berndj: Calm down, don't get too stressed out about it | 17:35 |
| p_hpd[m] | how many are infected in Denmark now | 17:36 |
| berndj | i'm not really stressed. i'm just low on patience for "nothing to see here, move along" type talk | 17:36 |
| skyofdust | You're tight Birrosso, we should be focusing on skinning alive those who have taken the most advantage if the situation right? Like those hoarding supplies, or those advertising panic shopping, or fake news, but no, we're here dissing fucking unions and strikes. | 17:36 |
| sneep | %cases denmark | 17:36 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +429 cases (now 140379), +2 deaths (now 5127) 🔶 Germany: +364 cases (now 3481), +1 deaths (now 8) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 Denmark: +13 cases (now 801) 🔸 Kazakhstan: +2 cases (now 4) 🔸 Norway: +14 cases (now 911) 🔸 Poland: +4 cases ( | 17:37 |
| skyofdust | right* | 17:37 |
| berndj | i might personally be ok, if what i have right now is a mild case | 17:37 |
| Brainstorm | sneep: In all areas, Denmark, there are 801 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 1 recoveries as of March 13, 16:35Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Denmark for time series data. | 17:37 |
| mefistofeles | more communities leaving IRC :( | 17:37 |
| sneep | who's leaving irc? | 17:38 |
| tinwhiskers | There's plenty to see here but collapse of infrastructure is not it. It's not productive or healthy. | 17:38 |
| mefistofeles | sneep: sunpy | 17:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:35 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Europe is now the 'epicenter' of the pandemic, The Masters is postponed → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 17:38 |
| mefistofeles | should we expect for Africa and/or Latin America to become the epicenter in the future? | 17:39 |
| berndj | mefistofeles, i'm very interested in that question :-/ | 17:39 |
| skyofdust | Why do you say that mefistofeles? | 17:39 |
| mefistofeles | I guess they are blocking themselves a little earlier than most Europe countries, but sill | 17:39 |
| mefistofeles | *still | 17:39 |
| mefistofeles | I see that happening | 17:39 |
| skyofdust | At mexico they're taking a smarter route than gathering everyone in testing centers | 17:40 |
| skyofdust | The directions are to isolate if you have any kind of symptom and call a public health number, someone will go to your place to test you and give you treatment if needed. | 17:41 |
| Birrosso | Meanwhile in Germany: People with bus or train subscriptions can exchange them for coupons matching the amount of days they have left on their subscription since transportation is going to be limited in the near future. | 17:42 |
| Birrosso | #priorities | 17:42 |
| tinwhiskers | some people say the virus won't do well in hotter climates but I really don't see anything substantial to base that on. | 17:42 |
| berndj | skyofdust, it isn't just that people want better pay and can't come to an agreement and then strike. it's that workers and employers reach an agreement, but then the unions decide to renege on that agreement and strike anyway, and particularly destructively so. | 17:42 |
| LjL | skyofdust, it was like that in Italy but now they've stopped testing people at home. if you want to get tested, you better feel bad enough to go to the hospital. | 17:42 |
| mefistofeles | skyofdust: that's what most europeans countries did, also | 17:42 |
| berndj | our health workers fall under a particularly aggressive union; their strikes routinely involve violence, trashing wards and assaulting patients even | 17:43 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers, i feel like australia is plenty hot | 17:43 |
| Acoustic[m] | berndj: country? | 17:43 |
| sneep | Birrosso: if you want people to comply with regulations it's best not to get them angry | 17:43 |
| berndj | Acoustic[m]: south africa | 17:43 |
| tinwhiskers | berndj: agreed | 17:43 |
| Acoustic[m] | !cases South Africa | 17:44 |
| sneep | Birrosso: so i'd say that sounds like a good policy | 17:44 |
| tinwhiskers | However it hasn't really taken off in Australia yet so that doesn't mean much. | 17:44 |
| Acoustic[m] | I would guess testing isn't to great though | 17:44 |
| tinwhiskers | There's nowhere really hot that it *has* taken off yet | 17:44 |
| berndj | i think we had our first confirmed case on monday | 17:44 |
| skyofdust | Ah okay, I got that feel because everybody was talking about testing centers a few days ago, sowwy, I hope the measures work a bit at least. | 17:44 |
| mefistofeles | testing in Austrial should be better than most latin americans countries, fwiw | 17:45 |
| berndj | Acoustic[m], not like south korea no. our CDC-equivalent has done 924 tests so far | 17:45 |
| mefistofeles | maybe Costa Rica is one to look up closer | 17:45 |
| mefistofeles | %data costa rica | 17:45 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Costa Rica, there are 23 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 13:33Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Costa%20Rica for time series data. | 17:45 |
| Birrosso | sneep: I wasn't saying it's not a good policy, not at all. Just pleasantly surprised at how they're covering all their bases so quickly. | 17:45 |
| mefistofeles | or maybe not, heh | 17:45 |
| LjL | why would this post be locked? https://www.reddit.com/r/Ebay/comments/fi0ql1/didnt_ebay_ban_the_sale_of_n95_masks_and_if_so/ i am seeing Reddit mods (or admins) being very arbitrary about anything involving the virus and related things | 17:46 |
| Birrosso | They're also allowing companies to obtain "uncapped" loans. (Germany) | 17:46 |
| berndj | what does that mean? | 17:46 |
| sneep | hey i want an uncapped loan | 17:47 |
| sneep | 1 quadrillion dollars would be cool | 17:47 |
| Birrosso | It means there is no upper limit as to how much money you can file for. | 17:47 |
| Birrosso | Sounds like they're relying on companies and people being sensible (which does work most of the time in Germnay.) | 17:47 |
| mefistofeles | Birrosso: I keep hearing that a lot from germans, yet, they are usually better at that than most others I know | 17:48 |
| sneep | better at not being sensible? :p | 17:49 |
| Birrosso | mefistofeles: Sorry, I'm a bit confused. What do you keep hearing a lot? | 17:49 |
| Birrosso | Yes, what Sneep asked. | 17:49 |
| Birrosso | BOT PLEASE! | 17:49 |
| mefistofeles | hah | 17:50 |
| Birrosso | It doesn't have to bombard us with the news. | 17:50 |
| sneep | you can /ignore it | 17:50 |
| sneep | i like the news links | 17:50 |
| mefistofeles | Birrosso: sneep , I keep hearing germans complaining about germans not being sensible, yet I find they are more sensible than most others I've met from other countries (included my own) | 17:50 |
| Birrosso | mefistofeles: There is the source of the confusion. I wasn't complaining about Germans not being sensible. | 17:50 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, wholds for companies/institutions as well, fwiw | 17:51 |
| Birrosso | I said it DOES work most of the time. | 17:51 |
| mefistofeles | Birrosso: oh, sorry, misread that | 17:51 |
| mefistofeles | :) | 17:51 |
| LjL | %title https://www.cnbc.com/2020/03/06/its-a-false-hope-coronavirus-will-disappear-in-the-summer-like-the-flu-who-says.html?recirc=taboolainternal | 17:52 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From www.cnbc.com: 'False hope' coronavirus will disappear in summer like flu, WHO says | 17:52 |
| jiffe | so the JHU numbers haven't really changed but the JHU map no longer shows corona cases in a lot more states now | 17:55 |
| tinwhiskers | jiffe: JH is merging their county data into state data and it's a bit of a mess still | 17:56 |
| jiffe | I see | 17:56 |
| berndj | is there any reason to believe that immunity to covid19 will not be a thing? | 17:57 |
| sneep | The WHO guy continues “We hope it does. That would be a godsend,” he added. “But we can’t make that assumption. And there is no evidence.” | 17:57 |
| LjL | berndj, some people appear to have been re-infected (but maybe they were just always infected instead, and just tested negative for some reason). but people do develop antibodies, and at least in vitro, these have been shown to neutralize the virus | 17:57 |
| Birrosso | Is it not possible to test this in a controlled lab environment, how temperature affects a virus? | 17:58 |
| Birrosso | Not a rhetorical question, in case anyone knows. | 17:58 |
| mefistofeles | Birrosso: yes, and has been | 17:58 |
| berndj | LjL, is that something that doesn't happen to at least some people with all viral diseases? | 17:58 |
| LjL | berndj, i don't know the answer to that | 17:58 |
| mefistofeles | but Birrosso , they are still pretty controlled unrealistic conditions | 17:58 |
| Birrosso | mefistofeles: Why is the WHO "hoping" then that the hot climate would kill it off? | 17:58 |
| Birrosso | Ah. | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | hope is mainly a guess, they don't expect it, though | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | not even a guess, like just what it is, hope | 17:59 |
| sneep | https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4529600/ | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | :P | 17:59 |
| LjL | berndj, i've read it's likely that immunity won't last forever, though. the virus doesn't mutate the way the flu does, but it still could mutate enough to confuse antibodies over time... | 17:59 |
| sneep | %title | 17:59 |
| Brainstorm | sneep, the URL could not be loaded | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | %title | 17:59 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles, the URL could not be loaded | 17:59 |
| sneep | Chickenpox guy who got chickenpox again | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | oh | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | sorry | 17:59 |
| mefistofeles | title: "Reinfection of Varicella zoster in a vaccinated adult" | 18:00 |
| berndj | LjL, i caught something about this virus apparently mutating hardly at all? | 18:00 |
| LjL | Italian Civil Protection press conference should be starting soon | 18:00 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: please translate | 18:00 |
| tinwhiskers | Birrosso: many corinaviruses flourish in winter so there is some reason to think hot places may not be affected so badly, hence the hope, but no real evidence to back that up yet | 18:00 |
| LjL | berndj, that would seem like an overstatement to me... it hasn't mutated in ways that were found to affect its behavior, so far, but "hardly at all" is a strong claim | 18:01 |
| mefistofeles | yeah, that's one of the hypothesis on why the previous SARS-CoV kinda dissapeared all of a sudden | 18:01 |
| sneep | Even so -- it'll be winter in the southern hemisphere and the virus could wreak havoc in the south and then come back when it's winter here again | 18:02 |
| mefistofeles | it's not showing mutation rates as high as the influenza, also most of the mutations are non-missense mutations, afaik | 18:03 |
| mefistofeles | so far, that is | 18:03 |
| tinwhiskers | If you look at all the hot places that have the virus it's just as much a matter of timing that they currently have low numbers. It's just not clear yet if hot places will be less effected. My guess is the spread will be similar. | 18:03 |
| azbycx | Isn't iran a pretty hot place year round? | 18:04 |
| astraliam[m] | it's quite high so probably not now | 18:04 |
| tinwhiskers | azbycx: it's quite high in latitude | 18:04 |
| astraliam[m] | also altitude much of it | 18:04 |
| tinwhiskers | 32°N | 18:05 |
| sneep | Iran isn't that hot | 18:05 |
| LjL | i hope they haven't messed up the press conference live stream... it's "scheduled" for tomorrow instead of today on youtube | 18:06 |
| LjL | maybe i should check RAI too | 18:06 |
| mefistofeles | https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=iran+temperature you can put the "past year" in the figure, fwiw | 18:06 |
| mefistofeles | it isn'tthat hot, yes | 18:06 |
| azbycx | i didn't know about the altitude aspect. thank you. | 18:06 |
| LjL | yes they have :| | 18:06 |
| LjL | press conference already started, gah | 18:07 |
| LjL | and they already gave the numbers | 18:07 |
| Birrosso | What press conference? | 18:07 |
| LjL | recovered: +181, 1439 | 18:07 |
| LjL | italy civil protection | 18:07 |
| Birrosso | +181 deaths in the past 24? | 18:07 |
| pwr22 | <tinwhiskers "jiffe: JH is merging their count"> What are they doing exactly? | 18:07 |
| LjL | current cases: 14955, +2116 | 18:07 |
| Birrosso | Oof | 18:07 |
| pwr22 | Daily italy one I guess | 18:08 |
| pwr22 | 181 recovered | 18:08 |
| pwr22 | My brother is sick and self isolating | 18:08 |
| LjL | deaths: +250 | 18:08 |
| LjL | total cases: 17660 | 18:08 |
| LjL | 1328 are in ICU, +175 | 18:08 |
| mefistofeles | woah, 250 is a lot | 18:08 |
| LjL | this last one is... bad | 18:08 |
| LjL | Borrelli stated again that 10% of positives are in ICU | 18:09 |
| LjL | i'm still not watching the actual press conference, which i don't know where to get | 18:09 |
| LjL | this is a news report based on it | 18:09 |
| LjL | 6201 people are in self-isolation | 18:09 |
| LjL | if they can't get a live stream right, can they get anything else right? | 18:11 |
| LjL | okay i found a working stream | 18:11 |
| LjL | ... don't stop donating blood, there are no compelling reasons to, just arrange it in advance with donation centers. | 18:11 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +123 cases (now 140502) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 Denmark: +13 cases (now 801) 🔸 Estonia: +27 cases (now 68) 🔸 Greece: +57 cases (now 190) 🔸 Iraq: +7 cases (now 90) 🔸 Norway: +19 cases (now | 18:11 |
| LjL | second, i'd like to recommend something we previously reiterated: it's very important for people who are at home as contacts of a positive individual, or those who are in self-quarantine due to being positive, these people must act rigorously to avoid infecting other people who live in the same home | 18:12 |
| LjL | another thing i'm announcing is that by this evening, the ISS will publish an epidemiological bulletin, with trends at a provincial, regional and national level | 18:13 |
| LjL | it is not constantly updated, unlike the civil protection numbers, because its goal is to grasp the trends | 18:14 |
| LjL | this bulletin will always be published on tuesdays and fridays | 18:14 |
| tinwhiskers | pwr22: well last time I looked (I've just woken up so it may have changed) they had stopped recording data into the counties and started recording into states. The day before that they were recording into both and I had to divide the country total by two to make it correct. Things are just changing and it's unclear what they plan to do. I've given up trying to keep up with their constant tinkering for now and will wait for things to | 18:14 |
| tinwhiskers | settle down. | 18:14 |
| LjL | at other times, there is an infograph always available in italian and english | 18:14 |
| LjL | finally, a consideration on mortality: we continue reporting data that are progressively getting clearer, also thanks to our hospital directions, which despite their workload are sending us files allowing a detail analysis | 18:15 |
| LjL | the data we have as of today is that the average death age is 80.3, and only 25.8% are female | 18:15 |
| LjL | the average age of death is significantly higher than the average date of positives | 18:15 |
| LjL | there is a peak of deaths between 80-89 yo | 18:15 |
| dunnp | wow why so much male bias? | 18:15 |
| LjL | unfortunately, lethality, which is the ratio of dead among ill, is obviously higher in >80yo people | 18:16 |
| pwr22 | tinwhiskers: Ah, so the JHU data doesn't actually have a overall country total and then the state specific counts seperately? | 18:16 |
| LjL | the majority of these people have multiple comorbidities: only 2 dead have not been shown to have comorbidities | 18:16 |
| LjL | dunnp, smoke? | 18:16 |
| mefistofeles | dunnp: it has been hypothetized that the X chromosome has some pathogen detection sequences | 18:16 |
| LjL | the most frequent categories are people with 3+ comorbidities | 18:16 |
| dunnp | do many more men in italy smoke? | 18:17 |
| dunnp | mefistofeles: eh | 18:17 |
| LjL | the average age of ICU patients who die is lower, on average, than the general population. the most common symptoms in these are dyspnea and fever | 18:17 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, it is known that the X chromosome has that, but it's not known for a fact that it is that playing a role | 18:17 |
| dunnp | men have an X chromosome too | 18:17 |
| mefistofeles | yes, so less likely | 18:17 |
| astraliam[m] | not compared to China | 18:17 |
| LjL | a comment on the two dead who are younger than 40: one of these people was 39 and had neoplasia, while another, also 39, had some comorbidity factors, diabetes and obesity | 18:17 |
| mefistofeles | less likely to express if you only have one | 18:18 |
| dunnp | you know in women one of the X chromosomes in inactive | 18:18 |
| LjL | dunnp, lately men have gone down and women have gone up in smoking, but still, yeah | 18:18 |
| LjL | he said something about mortality that i did not understand | 18:18 |
| LjL | finally, i would again like to remind everyone who has any symptoms to stay home | 18:19 |
| LjL | on our sites you can find the technical reports and epidemic curves, which are the most up to date data we have available | 18:19 |
| LjL | questions | 18:19 |
| LjL | question: about the drug that was experimented with in Naples, did that experimentation continue? do you have any data on it? | 18:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 17:18 UTC: /u/slakmehl: BBC Breaking News su Twitter: "April's London Marathon postponed because of coronavirus outbreak #COVID_19uk https://t.co/NI28G7QMbN" → https://is.gd/wLZQsT | 18:20 |
| mefistofeles | dunnp: still some genes escape inactivation, not sure if these are relevant genes | 18:20 |
| LjL | answer: i can report that in these past few hours, AIFA, the italian drug agency, had a scientific committee meeting, which analyzed available evidence, and i believe they are deliberating on the possibility to start experimentations to understand better. | 18:20 |
| tinwhiskers | pwr22: as of a few days ago they only had counties but due to the numbers of counties getting ridiculous they decided to add states (it was really difficult to get state totals from their data too). So they added states in a few days ago, but were double-recording numbers. Now it looks like they are going to phase out the county data but I'm not sure. | 18:20 |
| LjL | we must always remember that we should start from an understanding of the mechanism of action. the drugs we're considering now are existing drugs for other pathologies, and before we can define them specifically as COVID-19 drugs, we need clinical trials. | 18:20 |
| pwr22 | Ah right | 18:21 |
| LjL | question: how's it that in italy, compared to other countries, deaths are still reported without a distinction between deaths "due to" and deaths "with"? | 18:21 |
| LjL | answer: i believe the data we publish aren't significantly different from other countries', but as we unfortunately predicted, this is a global epidemic, and in other countries, too, the curve is rising | 18:21 |
| LjL | mortality, as we said other times, is determined by a set of pathologies, and the pathologies we have identified are among the most common, concerning elderly fragile patients, who already have intrinsic risks. in these, a respiratory tract infection can more easily result in death. | 18:22 |
| LjL | so the distinction, intentionally, when we talked about people under 40, we analyzed them and found that they did have other pathologies, so the COVID-19 infection has likely made a complicated situation more complicated. | 18:23 |
| LjL | in the next few days, as we acquire all the files, we'll analyze further, but the data i've already shown you show something we knew: the people at risk are elderly and sick | 18:23 |
| LjL | question: government counsel has talked about a possible rise of cases in the center and south of Italy in these coming days. what kind of support do you envision for hospitals there? | 18:24 |
| pwr22 | tinwhiskers: Thanks for putting in the effort sorting out the data and sharing it 🙂 | 18:24 |
| LjL | answer: i believe it's likely we can expect cases this weekend, and part of these cases are due to some behaviors that happened in the past weekends. let's remember that the average incubation time is between 4 and 7 days | 18:24 |
| iz | %cases italy | 18:25 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +2578 cases (now 143080), +250 deaths (now 5377), +187 recoveries (now 71000) 🔶 Italy: +2547 cases (now 17660), +250 deaths (now 1266), +181 recoveries (now 1439) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 | 18:25 |
| LjL | so the pictures media showed of crowds of people gathering at sea beaches, or ski resport, or pubs, those are places where the virus likely circulated, and part of those people will likely become symptomatic in the next few days | 18:25 |
| Brainstorm | iz: In all areas, Italy, there are 17660 cases, 1266 deaths (7.2% of cases), 1439 recoveries as of March 13, 17:20Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 18:25 |
| LjL | we are sorry to say this, because we are always recommending to be responsible. we must also admit that in the past few days, most italians have realized how these behaviors are counterproductive, and must be avoided | 18:25 |
| LjL | we'll see the curve, we hope the events will prove us wrong. | 18:26 |
| LjL | we're working with the region since the beginning, and for several days, for enhancing ICUs and sub-ICUs: we are acquiring new material, especially ventilators, so we must work to enhance our structures and we are doing it | 18:26 |
| LjL | question: since this is an international crisis, not just italian, is there coordination between italian civil protection and civil protections of nearby countries, and their authorities? switzerland, austria, slovenia, and spain, which today declared a state of emergency? | 18:27 |
| LjL | answer: we do have a mechanism to share information in emergencies, which is the European Civil Protection mechanism. we have asked for support in that setting, we are in contact with them. we must say that in other circumstances, the system has worked better and there has been more cooperation. | 18:28 |
| LjL | since COVID is contagious, we must cooperate, but really we haven't had a direct cooperation or connection. | 18:28 |
| LjL | slash_, ↑ | 18:28 |
| LjL | question: about the important of donating blood, since the chinese aircraft with supplies arrived yesterday, and we know there are medical supplies are contained, and there is a team of Chinese doctors, among which there are frontline experiences, how will their experiences help? | 18:29 |
| LjL | (bit of an incoherent question) | 18:29 |
| LjL | answer: first i'd like to thank our Chinese colleagues for this support. we are indeed facing a global crisis, so no country can consider itself exempt, independent of the number of cases they have. in the world of science, public health and research, a global crisis means we only have one way to face it effectively: share data, share experiences, share best practices, and adapt them to new contets | 18:30 |
| LjL | the presente of these Chinese colleagues should be a great opportunity for that, to share evidence and experiences and how to adapt them to different social-cultural contexts | 18:30 |
| mefistofeles | I wonder if these chinese doctors/staff already recovered from covid | 18:31 |
| mefistofeles | that would make sense, wouldn't it? | 18:31 |
| LjL | question: i'd like some more information about the cases in Campania: i believe it's two patients who have been experimented on with this anti-arthritis drug, and those were in serious conditions, but not ventilated. how did this work out? | 18:31 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, it seems strange to me we don't ask those who have recovered to volunteer more since they will be safe. | 18:32 |
| LjL | answer: i can only restate what i said previously, considering i am not a clinicial: the rationale for using an active substance, like the one our colleagues used there and i think in some other hospitals too, is a rationale that tackles the immune reaction that the infection triggers | 18:32 |
| LjL | this drug is registered for a different pathology as of now, but the mechanism of action could prove useful in clinical manifestations of this coronavirus | 18:32 |
| dunnp | tinwhiskers: we don't know that you cant get re-infected right? | 18:32 |
| mefistofeles | dunnp: I guess that was for me? | 18:33 |
| LjL | having tested it on some subject is an early indication, but scientifically, we need some better defined trials, with a significant sample of subjects, and AIFA is moving in this direction. it's a promise and an opportunity, that must be explored and studied. | 18:33 |
| mefistofeles | oh, nvm, tinwhiskers also | 18:33 |
| tinwhiskers | dunnp: we know there's less chance of getting reinfected than getting infected | 18:33 |
| mefistofeles | ↑ | 18:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:23 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Europe is now the 'epicenter' of the pandemic, Louisiana postpones Democratic primary → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 18:33 |
| dunnp | I didn't know that | 18:33 |
| LjL | question: in the report coming with the draft law on economic measures, there are estimates of a peak around 20 March, with rises of even 2000 patients a day. can you confirm this estimate? | 18:34 |
| LjL | (i hope he said 2000, not 20000, not sure) | 18:34 |
| LjL | answer: the models mathematicians and epidemiologists work with keep some factors into account: R0, which is a measure that indicates how much every positive person will infect others. | 18:34 |
| LjL | another important value is the average time between becoming infected and becoming symptomatic | 18:35 |
| Mr_Pink | offloop needs a dark mode. pls protect my boomer eyes | 18:35 |
| LjL | if we put these two values together, we can come up with various models, and as these values change, the peaks also change | 18:35 |
| LjL | our strategy is to lower this R0 value as much as possible, to avoid peaks, because the criticality in this sitaution is the number of people who go to hospitals | 18:36 |
| LjL | this is the most critical thing to face, but if the peak is lower, this will allow to provide the best of assistance | 18:36 |
| LjL | flattening the curve will help the system not collapsing, while a very high peak could put the healthcare system in trouble | 18:36 |
| LjL | these scenarios are very influenced by our ability to comply with recommended measures | 18:36 |
| LjL | --- end | 18:37 |
| mefistofeles | thanks LjL | 18:37 |
| tinwhiskers | Cheers | 18:37 |
| mefistofeles | I like how he/she answers | 18:37 |
| mefistofeles | tbh | 18:37 |
| tinwhiskers | Who was answering the questions? They seem pretty good. | 18:37 |
| LjL | %cases italy | 18:37 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 17660 cases, 1266 deaths (7.2% of cases), 1439 recoveries as of March 13, 17:30Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 18:37 |
| LjL | this death rate... i just can't believe their reassurances | 18:38 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, two people, the chief of civil protection Borrelli, and someone who's a doctor | 18:38 |
| tinwhiskers | Ah | 18:38 |
| berndj | +1 for LjL typing speed! | 18:38 |
| LjL | i don't specify which is which, it's a bit hard | 18:38 |
| LjL | thanks | 18:39 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: that's ok, not that hard to guess anyways | 18:39 |
| tinwhiskers | Crazy bastards, getting experts to answer questions. | 18:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:45 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Louisiana postpones Democratic primary, Apple moves conference online → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 18:47 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 Veneto, Italy: +211 cases (now 1595), +10 deaths (now 42), +45 recoveries (now 100) 🔶 Toscana, Italy: +106 cases (now 470), +3 recoveries (now 10) 🔶 Piemonte, Italy: +260 cases (now 840), +20 deaths (now 46) 🔶 Marche, Italy: +133 cases (now 725), +5 deaths (now 27) 🔶 Lombardia, Italy: +1095 cases (now 9820), +146 deaths (now 890), +113 recoveries (now 1198) 🔶 Emilia Romagna, Italy: +316 cases (now 22 | 18:51 |
| LjL | i'm hearing the part of the press conference that i hadn't heard | 18:57 |
| LjL | we have apparently requisitioned PPEs that were otherwise for export | 18:57 |
| LjL | (like everyone else) | 18:57 |
| LjL | 5 million face masks distributed so far, i think they're just surgical masks though except for a small portion | 18:58 |
| zirpu[m] | whoever makes masks is busy busy right now. | 18:59 |
| LjL | %tr La casa Bianca sta tenendo una riunione d'emergenza dopo che Bolsonaro è risultato positivo al test. Bolsonaro e Trump hanno cenato insieme al secretario di communicazione Brasiliano (Già risultato positvo al test) 6 giorni fa a mar a lago. Secondo il figlio di Bolsonaro, stanno attendendo i risultati di un secondo test per verificare. | 19:00 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: The White House is holding an emergency meeting after Bolsonaro has tested positive. Bolsonaro and Trump dined together with the Brazilian communication secretary (Already a positive test result) 6 days ago on the sea at the lake. According to Bolsonaro's son, they are waiting for the results of a second test to verify. (MyMemory, Google) [... want %more?] | 19:00 |
| tinwhiskers | Perhaps Singapore is an example of a hot country that is not seeing the expected increase. Maybe there is something to the hot country theory... still hard to say but at least that's one place that supports the idea. | 19:01 |
| twomoon | i just think singapore takes it really really seriously | 19:02 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, that's the other possibility | 19:02 |
| twomoon | we'll see tho maybe i'm full of it | 19:02 |
| mefistofeles | tinwhiskers: it is commonly attributed to automatic epidemic controls they already had since 2003 SARS | 19:02 |
| mefistofeles | the lancet had an article on this | 19:02 |
| mefistofeles | for Singapore and Taiwan | 19:02 |
| tinwhiskers | Ah. Ok | 19:02 |
| tinwhiskers | Thanks | 19:02 |
| twomoon | yeah, in HK and singapore they literally glove up most of the time just to go to the grocery store | 19:03 |
| twomoon | the checkout clerk at the grocery store also suits up | 19:03 |
| twomoon | all this was protocol learned during 2002-2003 | 19:03 |
| twomoon | is* | 19:03 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +106 cases (now 143211), +1 deaths (now 5379) 🔶 US: +106 cases (now 1992) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31), +1 deaths (now 2) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 Denmark: +13 cases (now 801) 🔸 Estonia: +27 cases (now 68) 🔸 Greece: +5 | 19:05 |
| mefistofeles | https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30567-5/fulltext | 19:05 |
| mefistofeles | this is the one, I think | 19:05 |
| mefistofeles | maybe worth having it on the pastebin, LjL , what do you think? | 19:06 |
| mefistofeles | %title | 19:06 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: From www.thelancet.com: How will country-based mitigation measures influence the course of the COVID-19 epidemic? - The Lancet | 19:06 |
| mefistofeles | now that I Think about it, not sure if it is open access | 19:06 |
| mefistofeles | because I get it from my institution automatically | 19:07 |
| slash_ | well I can read it | 19:08 |
| tinwhiskers | mefistofeles: it is open | 19:08 |
| slash_ | yeah looks like it | 19:08 |
| mefistofeles | ok, nice | 19:09 |
| Targodan | %cases germany | 19:09 |
| Brainstorm | Targodan: In all areas, Germany, there are 3481 cases, 8 deaths (0.2% of cases), 46 recoveries as of March 13, 18:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 19:09 |
| slash_ | i am glad a lot of websites are removing paywalls for articles about this virus tbh | 19:09 |
| slash_ | this is not the time to make money | 19:09 |
| slash_ | maybe I should rephrase, as making money is a necessity: this is not the time to make a profit on information that can help our fight against this virus | 19:11 |
| mefistofeles | pwr22: woah, where's that? | 19:13 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, i don't know, some things appear to be optimistic, as in, shared by some other researchers but also not shared by some. also there are things like "School closure, a major pillar of the response to pandemic influenza A,14 | 19:13 |
| LjL | is unlikely to be effective given the apparent low rate of infection among children, although data are scarce", but i think we know now that children are likely equally as affected by the infection, just typically asymptomatic... so i dunno, i'd like contingo / yuriwho / dunnp to check out that paper | 19:13 |
| LjL | the paper being https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)30567-5/fulltext | 19:13 |
| aradesh | my boss has agreed to let me work from home :) even though i think he thinks that wes hould all just "get it and get it over and done with" | 19:13 |
| mefistofeles | %title | 19:14 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: From www.thelancet.com: How will country-based mitigation measures influence the course of the COVID-19 epidemic? - The Lancet | 19:14 |
| mefistofeles | ah, the one I linked, ok | 19:14 |
| pwr22 | Queue down the whole length of supermarket in Bristol UK | 19:14 |
| pwr22 | Soap isles empty | 19:14 |
| pwr22 | Bristol UK | 19:14 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: not sure what's your concern regarding to that paper | 19:14 |
| pwr22 | Fresh mushrooms are being panic bought it seems | 19:14 |
| aradesh | pwr22: i wonder how many cases of covid-19 were spread during then | 19:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:13 UTC: (news): New York state now has the most coronavirus cases in the US as new cases jump 30% overnight to 421 → https://is.gd/Odemqj | 19:15 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, well for instance stating that the fatality rate is definitely less than 1%, while considered plausible by many, doesn't seem anything like a certainty to me. the WHO asserts a different fatality rate, although the WHO has been pretty useless. i just want people with more knowledge than me to check it | 19:16 |
| aradesh | some countries have very low fatality rates so far, though | 19:17 |
| aradesh | germany with 3481 cases, but 8 fatalities | 19:17 |
| adventurer | but they had next to no cases two weeks ago aradesh | 19:18 |
| aradesh | so? | 19:19 |
| LjL | aradesh, that's way too good to be true imo, i feel there's something we're missing about germany's data... south korea is probably a better example of an optimistic scenario, although their 0.7% could be even lower since even with drive-through testing, more symptomatic people will tend to get a test than people who feel fine | 19:19 |
| LjL | adventurer, in italy, time from diagnosis to death is sadly in the order of less than a week, so that's not necessarily "the" reason :( | 19:19 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: well, there's no reason to believe that the viurs has mutated enough to change its incidence/mortality, and the CFR is just that, lower than 1% even adding the variance/errors, apparently | 19:20 |
| mefistofeles | for some confidence interval, which I would say it's around 99.5% or so | 19:20 |
| contingo | LjL will have a look later... you know I have a good stats background, but my expertise and research experience has been more in pure genetics, evolutionary bio, not so much medicine, epidemiology or public health stuff, others will have a clearer view | 19:21 |
| adventurer | aradesh, so it takes some time to die from it | 19:21 |
| mefistofeles | that being sad, the CFR is just one of the may numbers to care for, it's not even the most important | 19:21 |
| aradesh | ah | 19:21 |
| mefistofeles | *many | 19:22 |
| darsie | https://graphics.reuters.com/CHINA-HEALTH-SOUTHKOREA-CLUSTERS/0100B5G33SB/index.html | 19:22 |
| darsie | https://medium.com/@tomaspueyo/coronavirus-act-today-or-people-will-die-f4d3d9cd99ca | 19:22 |
| LjL | darsie, that latter one is in the topic | 19:23 |
| darsie | Ah, maybe I posted in the wrong chan, then. | 19:23 |
| darsie | No, ok. | 19:24 |
| twomoon | that tomas pueyo article was very good for my parents to read | 19:24 |
| twomoon | very helpful in getting them to take some action | 19:24 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, it may not be the most important but i hope you can see that from my point of view in italy, even though an ultimately much lower CFR than the apparent CFR is definitely something i hope for, i have some difficulty believe it true. it's not like i don't believe it's true in Korea, but it doesn't have to be true in other places where healthcare gets overwhelmed, unfortunately. there are two factors here: korea seemingly managed it well, and | 19:26 |
| LjL | korea did extensive testing. the latter would point to a low CFR in general, but the former might indicate it's lower in Korea than in other places. i don't think it's reasonable to cherry-pick Korea (or currently Germany) and just brush Hubei and Italy off as "they only tested sick people". that's certainly a factor but not likely everything there is to it | 19:26 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: the thing is that up to 80% of cases are mild or asymptomatic, so Italy surely has much more cases than reported, and that should lower the CFR... also there's the age thing, which is specially problematic for Itally | 19:27 |
| mefistofeles | *Italy | 19:27 |
| LjL | yes, but age being higher in Italy doesn't somehow make its possibly-higher CFR less relevant than say Korea's. on the other hand, of course missing mild or asymptomatic cases would, but i think the extent of this is yet to be determined, and just a blanket "certainly less than 1%" seems premature imo | 19:28 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:25 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: New York cases jump 30% overnight, Apple moves conference online → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 19:29 |
| aradesh | i hear that in sweden, they've given up testing people | 19:30 |
| aradesh | helpful. | 19:30 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: those two effect add if you do the comparison between Korea and Italy, Korea had tested WAY more people than Italy, and the age is significantly higher, more than 10% in relative ratio | 19:31 |
| berndj | when i was in italy ~ 15 years ago it seemed like EVERYONE smoked | 19:32 |
| mefistofeles | also, a third effect probably as well, Korea having more ICU beds than Italy, per capita | 19:32 |
| figuinhas | hello | 19:32 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, the widespread testing is an "effect", the age is just a fact. CFR doesn't get lower when you account for higher average age. CFR is just what it is. you can *predict* that in younger countries will be lower, but that doesn't make it lower *for us*, while on the other hand, the bias due to lack of enough testing would | 19:33 |
| figuinhas | I would like someone else's opinion making a decision | 19:33 |
| adventurer | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2019%E2%80%9320_coronavirus_pandemic#/media/File:Log-linear_plot_of_coronavirus_cases_with_linear_regressions.png | 19:33 |
| adventurer | ROW deaths | 19:33 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: that's exactly why you cannot measure the CFR just using Italy | 19:33 |
| mefistofeles | you have to use the whole world, and that's what WHO does | 19:34 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, I think we are agreeing :P | 19:34 |
| LjL | nor just using Korea. the global CFR that you *can* directly measure, for now, is higher than 1%. | 19:34 |
| figuinhas | I start working from home next monday, I live alone, shall I stop visiting my parents and have lunch with them? I live in Portugal | 19:34 |
| aradesh | LjL: other place with too good to be true data? norway, 933 cases, 1 death | 19:34 |
| mefistofeles | figuinhas: it's better to isolate from the elderly, yes | 19:34 |
| aradesh | denmark, 0 deaths | 19:35 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, as possible | 19:35 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: you should stop visiting them | 19:35 |
| figuinhas | they live 3 kms from me | 19:35 |
| figuinhas | in their home | 19:35 |
| tinwhiskers | That makes no difference | 19:35 |
| figuinhas | they are not in a nursing home | 19:35 |
| figuinhas | she is 63 | 19:35 |
| figuinhas | he is 64 | 19:35 |
| mefistofeles | you can buy groceries for them, if needed, disinfect them before handing them, also they should re-disinfect it | 19:36 |
| figuinhas | my father still works | 19:36 |
| mefistofeles | figuinhas: ok, not that old, but stilll | 19:36 |
| aradesh | problem for me is, i don't trust my dad. he will take 0 precautions, and demand to see me... | 19:36 |
| darsie | %data austria | 19:36 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +865 cases (now 144076), +19 deaths (now 5398) 🔶 France: +785 cases (now 3661), +18 deaths (now 79) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31), +1 deaths (now 2) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 Czechia: +21 cases (now 141) 🔸 Denmark: +13 case | 19:36 |
| Brainstorm | darsie: In all areas, Austria, there are 504 cases, 1 deaths (0.2% of cases), 6 recoveries as of March 13, 18:35Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Austria for time series data. | 19:37 |
| LjL | i can't imagine gatherings like https://img7.yna.co.kr/photo/yna/YH/2020/03/03/PYH2020030303210001300_P4.jpg to have a net positive effect, even if you do manage to buy a face mask from there in the end | 19:38 |
| adventurer | 2 weeks ago Norway had 20 cases now they have over 500 | 19:38 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: no matter what, less contact is better. If you can just call them instead do that. If you need to deliver something keep your distance. | 19:38 |
| adventurer | less then 20 cases | 19:38 |
| adventurer | so 29/2 they had 15 cases | 19:39 |
| adventurer | now over 500 | 19:39 |
| aradesh | is there a risk that places like china, south korea, will get a new outbreak? | 19:39 |
| aradesh | they'll have to remain 'locked down' for a really long time | 19:40 |
| aradesh | how long am i gonna have to be working from home for? o.O | 19:40 |
| darsie | Partial deaths are odd. Fortunately none happened :) https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Austria | 19:40 |
| adventurer | on 29 of Feb Italy had 1,128 cases | 19:40 |
| nick34348 | That's insane. Why was the outbreak so bad in Italy compared to other countries? | 19:40 |
| adventurer | now italy has 17,660 | 19:41 |
| figuinhas | I was just checking an interview in a beauty saloon live in tv | 19:41 |
| tinwhiskers | nick34348: mostly just because they got it sooner | 19:41 |
| twomoon | mefistofeles, do you think USA is gonna have a worse crisis than italy? | 19:41 |
| adventurer | nick in two weeks their cases went from 100 to over 10,000 | 19:41 |
| adventurer | time will tell if every other place will explode in case number just the same | 19:41 |
| mefistofeles | twomoon: I don't | 19:42 |
| adventurer | it seems likely | 19:42 |
| mefistofeles | I think avoiding social contact is way more common there already | 19:42 |
| twomoon | thank you mefistofeles you give me hope | 19:42 |
| adventurer | i mean it seems to be growing fast in many places | 19:42 |
| berndj | this herd immunity strategy seems like a really high-stakes game, although i can see the logic in some of it. i wouldn't want to be the one playing that trolley problem game | 19:42 |
| adventurer | but depends on what people do to prevent spread | 19:42 |
| eviscerate | Why isn't it called Wuhan Virus? | 19:42 |
| figuinhas | the girl who was taking care of the client's nails pushed the mask touching the interior of the mask | 19:42 |
| nick34348 | I think we can get it under control provided that people self-quarantine when they're sick and that they test a lot of people | 19:42 |
| eviscerate | i bet it makes us all turn into zombies | 19:43 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, just my guess, which is a bad guess in the best case :) | 19:43 |
| twomoon | lol | 19:43 |
| adventurer | eviscerate, they didn't want to name it after a place or animal to prevent sigma or misunderstandings | 19:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:35 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: New York cases jump 30% overnight, Louvre and Eiffel Tower shut down → https://is.gd/MSnH0C | 19:43 |
| darsie | eviscerate: I think to avoid stigmatization of Wuhaners. | 19:43 |
| darsie | We could name it foreign virus :). | 19:43 |
| LjL | %title https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eF3LO-b9QKo | 19:43 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From www.youtube.com: 🔴 LIVE: President Trump URGENT Press Conference on National State of EMERGENCY - YouTube | 19:43 |
| nick34348 | Yeah and actually, now that I think about it they did that with other viruses too. Like SARS originated in Guangdong I think, but they just called South Asian Respiratory Virus, instead of naming it after Guangdong | 19:44 |
| LjL | first i found, not sure if he's spoken yet, confused | 19:44 |
| mefistofeles | fwiw, the US curve is following Italy's closely in new cases, but it's separating (more separation = better) in the death cases | 19:44 |
| azy | i think it's pretty rare for people to self isolate, right? speaking from england, tons of people aren't doing that | 19:44 |
| tinwhiskers | nick34348: that's good in theory but a lot of people who are not sick will refuse to self-quarantine, particularly in the USA | 19:44 |
| figuinhas | nick34348, what is happening in Italy can happen in most places. In my opinion was related with not testing people with symptoms, only contacts | 19:44 |
| mefistofeles | btw, most countries/regions follow an exponential growth similar to that in Italy, at least at the beginning, it later changes | 19:44 |
| figuinhas | It would never happen in countries which are proactively searching for cases | 19:44 |
| eviscerate | i called it wuhan flu before you guys woke me that it's not a flu. | 19:45 |
| figuinhas | good example Singapore | 19:45 |
| mefistofeles | figuinhas: yes, Singapore and Korea and Taiwan are special cases, they were already more prepared for this since latest SARS | 19:45 |
| mefistofeles | I linked an article about this a few mins ago | 19:45 |
| adventurer | maybe they are doing some things right | 19:45 |
| nick34348 | Yup. And Taiwan did a great job of handling it too, they only had like forty something cases in total despite being really close to China | 19:45 |
| tinwhiskers | Good article too | 19:46 |
| mefistofeles | tinwhiskers: right? I found it even entertaining, tbh | 19:46 |
| mefistofeles | like, a good read overall | 19:46 |
| aradesh | eviscerate: it isn't flu? | 19:46 |
| mefistofeles | ↑ | 19:47 |
| nick34348 | aradesh no it's a coronavirus, it's another kind of virus | 19:47 |
| mefistofeles | s/?// | 19:47 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles meant to say: tinwhiskers: right I found it even entertaining, tbh | 19:47 |
| mefistofeles | oh, lol | 19:47 |
| darsie | Is it possibel to avoid covid-19 transmission in shared flats? | 19:47 |
| figuinhas | there was this guy that told me, this might have effects in the human body in long term | 19:47 |
| nick34348 | coronaviruses come in all kinds of different variants. Certain coronavirus variants can cause the common cold, whereas previous strains of it caused SARS and MERS | 19:47 |
| eviscerate | it isn't a flu | 19:48 |
| eviscerate | it's a corona-virus | 19:48 |
| mefistofeles | darsie: should be hard, but I guess it is possible, just avoid contact and be separated as much as possible | 19:48 |
| mefistofeles | use mobile to communicate :P | 19:48 |
| figuinhas | he told me having fever for long periods of time might cause impotence in man | 19:48 |
| eviscerate | it's a different beast entirely | 19:48 |
| mefistofeles | disinfect everytime you go into a common area | 19:48 |
| figuinhas | whoopsie | 19:48 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: it might, but it's a bit early to say if so and how often that happens | 19:48 |
| darsie | We are 6 ppl in a shared flat. | 19:48 |
| figuinhas | I didn't mean impotence | 19:48 |
| figuinhas | I meant sterility | 19:48 |
| mefistofeles | the covid-19 has shown to have some effect on male sexual performance, afaik | 19:49 |
| nick34348 | What's the difference? | 19:49 |
| mefistofeles | oh right, not performance... like fertility, rather | 19:49 |
| figuinhas | yeah fertility | 19:49 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: Yeah, also maybe heart and... Err kidney damage I think | 19:49 |
| nick34348 | Oh okay I get the difference I just looked it up | 19:49 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: and neural damage possibly | 19:50 |
| mefistofeles | it's been shown you can actually get your nervous system infected, if you have some previous conditions | 19:50 |
| nick34348 | I think at this point we can only speculate as to what kind of long-term damage this virus could cause. There isn't a lot of evidence out there yet | 19:50 |
| figuinhas | be aware that many patients take 6 weeks to recover | 19:50 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: but it's really too soon to say | 19:50 |
| figuinhas | that is a long time having fever and coughing | 19:51 |
| darsie | Is transmission before symptoms a fact? | 19:51 |
| yuriwho | LjL: regarding that Lancet opinion paper, I agree with the author social distancing (reduce mass gatherings and reducing sustained close contact) as well as early self isolation upon symptoms (isolation from household members if possible) are the most important in areas with sustained community transmission (like much of the EU). Isolation and contact tracing for the earlier stage countries is still paramount. | 19:51 |
| figuinhas | darsie, it is considered a fact | 19:51 |
| tinwhiskers | The fever probably won't last that long. Pneumonia takes a while to recover from. | 19:51 |
| mefistofeles | nick34348: true, but that doesn't mean anything could happen | 19:51 |
| mefistofeles | there are some things discarded already | 19:51 |
| nick34348 | metistofeles like what? | 19:51 |
| darsie | Ok, so we should start separation before someone gets symptoms ... | 19:52 |
| figuinhas | but it is more likely to have transmission while having symptoms | 19:52 |
| LjL | yuriwho, i didn't have a problem with the advice provided, but some of the things stated as known fact seemed less than established to me | 19:52 |
| tinwhiskers | darsie: yes | 19:52 |
| mefistofeles | nick34348: not exactly true, but for example the fact that kids evidently don't die or even show symptoms | 19:52 |
| tinwhiskers | You must assume everyone is infected for social distancing to work | 19:52 |
| mefistofeles | s/true/sure | 19:52 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles meant to say: nick34348: not exactly sure, but for example the fact that kids evidently don't die or even show symptoms | 19:52 |
| figuinhas | Someone declared today, that children have high rates of transmission without showing symptoms | 19:53 |
| mefistofeles | they may have, indeed | 19:53 |
| figuinhas | I believe it might be related with being cute | 19:53 |
| tinwhiskers | Heh | 19:53 |
| mefistofeles | influenza-A is a case of that happening, asymptomatic for some/many children but still contagious | 19:53 |
| darsie | tinwhiskers: Well, ofc I must assume every stranger is infected, but my flat mates could tell us if they have symptoms. | 19:53 |
| tinwhiskers | darsie: they won't know they are infected at the time they are first spreading it to you | 19:54 |
| darsie | k | 19:54 |
| figuinhas | I have no source about the higher rates of transmission by children | 19:54 |
| figuinhas | I saw it on TV | 19:54 |
| figuinhas | I don't ever remember the channel | 19:54 |
| figuinhas | if somebody could check it | 19:54 |
| figuinhas | it would be nice | 19:54 |
| mefistofeles | nick34348: or for example the fact that apparently only one case for this neuronal infection has been shown, because of previous conditions | 19:54 |
| LjL | my sister went out and reports there's still way too many people circulating as if nothing's happening in our area of Milan | 19:55 |
| tinwhiskers | :-( | 19:55 |
| mefistofeles | s/neuronal/neural | 19:55 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles meant to say: nick34348: or for example the fact that apparently only one case for this neural infection has been shown, because of previous conditions | 19:55 |
| LjL | they are criminally prosecutable if they don't have a "good reason" but police seems concentrated only in the city center areas where tourists used to be. those are empty, duh. | 19:55 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: sad, I guess they have good reasons to do so | 19:55 |
| mefistofeles | I hope, rather | 19:55 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: anyways, as far as you can, just avoid people | 19:56 |
| mefistofeles | even your family | 19:56 |
| twomoon | yup. | 19:56 |
| LjL | except for my sister, i can't avoid them, i live with them | 19:56 |
| mefistofeles | also, why was your sister out? | 19:56 |
| darsie | I cancelled babysitting my nephew once a week. | 19:56 |
| tinwhiskers | Teenagers think they are bulletproof and in this case they pretty much are not sure not considering the risk they are placing older folk at. Selfish | 19:56 |
| LjL | to buy groceries | 19:56 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: ok, disinfect them/her | 19:57 |
| mefistofeles | as possible | 19:57 |
| tinwhiskers | Erm. Sorry. Autocorrect | 19:57 |
| twomoon | uhh tinwhiskers my parents think they are bulletproof | 19:57 |
| twomoon | it's the other way around here | 19:57 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, tried to get my family to understand that needs to be done, but so far they've just kept calling it overkill. i don't have much control over this. | 19:57 |
| mefistofeles | every parent thinks that, it's common | 19:57 |
| tinwhiskers | A lot of old folk tend to be stoic and won't admit they are not bulletproof | 19:58 |
| berndj | maybe parents have experience with being subjectively sincerely worried their child might die from some illness | 19:58 |
| figuinhas | just told my parents I am not going to visit them | 19:58 |
| figuinhas | my mom sounded really sad | 19:58 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: I mean, it maybe is (imho) but what do you have to lose by disinfecting something/someone? | 19:58 |
| tinwhiskers | Teens really believe they are bulletproof | 19:58 |
| berndj | not that i think they're right to generalize that to *this time* | 19:58 |
| Birrosso | Time! | 19:58 |
| mefistofeles | Birrosso: time is what quarantined people have, for the most part | 19:59 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +199 cases (now 144275) 🔶 Germany: +194 cases (now 3675) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31), +1 deaths (now 2) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 Chile: +10 cases (now 43) 🔸 Czechia: +21 cases (now 141) 🔸 Denmark: +13 cases (now 801) 🔸 Estonia: +38 cases (now 79 | 19:59 |
| Birrosso | mefistofeles: You win! | 19:59 |
| mefistofeles | haha | 19:59 |
| figuinhas | tinwhiskers, not just teens | 19:59 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, time, and potentially precious disinfectant. it seems worth it to me, but my opinion counts for... well, a portion of the overall opinion. | 19:59 |
| tinwhiskers | figuinhas: you can call them twice as often to make up for it | 19:59 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, anyway i'm more concerned about my sister *going* to the supermarket in the first place. i'd rather have groceries delivered but that doesn't seem to be feasible long term, it's all being overwhelmed | 20:00 |
| mefistofeles | yeah I can see that happening | 20:00 |
| figuinhas | tinwhiskers, in a way I kynda wished being quarantined with them... not alone | 20:00 |
| mefistofeles | anyways, have to go, take care | 20:01 |
| adventurer | teens death likelihood from CV was reported as .02% compared to over 80s of >14% | 20:01 |
| LjL | %title https://nationalpost.com/pmn/health-pmn/poland-to-close-borders-to-foreigners-from-sunday | 20:02 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From nationalpost.com: Poland to close borders to foreigners from Sunday | National Post | 20:02 |
| yn | https://thehill.com/changing-america/well-being/prevention-cures/484942-japan-confirms-first-case-of-person-reinfected | 20:07 |
| ALT_F4 | Anybody home? | 20:08 |
| tinwhiskers | Hi ALT_F4 | 20:08 |
| ALT_F4 | Hi tin! | 20:08 |
| LjL | last time Trump spoke, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_WM_pMp0Hg were the ones who had the earliest stream | 20:09 |
| LjL | %title | 20:09 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From www.youtube.com: Special Report: Trump holds news conference on coronavirus pandemic - YouTube | 20:09 |
| LjL | still not started | 20:09 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, panic buying has set in | 20:09 |
| RougeRRR | no bog roll | 20:09 |
| ALT_F4 | Just joining the channel. I work in the NHS in the UK. happy to answer any questions anyone might have. | 20:09 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, oooh hey | 20:09 |
| darsie | ALT_F4: Your nick makes me not believe you. | 20:09 |
| LjL | also your IP | 20:10 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, soo the government strategy, are they actually trying to increase the peak before leveling off | 20:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Increase the peak? | 20:10 |
| ALT_F4 | You are welcome not to believe me :) | 20:10 |
| RougeRRR | as in higher numbers infected before leveling off | 20:10 |
| RougeRRR | jesus christ | 20:10 |
| RougeRRR | rss bot | 20:10 |
| Birrosso | I don't believe him. | 20:10 |
| LjL | RougeRRR, i'm going to kill Guardian | 20:11 |
| LjL | now | 20:11 |
| LjL | it's just too much | 20:11 |
| tinwhiskers | RougeRRR: they are trying to lower the peak | 20:11 |
| RougeRRR | tinwhiskers, funny way of doing it | 20:11 |
| RougeRRR | every other country has put in social distancing and cancelled large events | 20:11 |
| ALT_F4 | It's fine, in terms of government strategy - I work for a local hospital, so we don't have this kind of clearance. I'm not clinical so cannot answer medical question. | 20:11 |
| tinwhiskers | Hardly "every" | 20:11 |
| Birrosso | ALT_F4: Are you using a VPN? | 20:11 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, ah well i was asking for opinion | 20:12 |
| ALT_F4 | I do however work in a press office so do get the content from higher up. | 20:12 |
| ALT_F4 | yes, i'm on a VPN. | 20:12 |
| RougeRRR | how do you rate government strategy compared to european counterparts | 20:12 |
| darsie | ALT_F4: What's your work email address? | 20:12 |
| RougeRRR | why are they not advocating social distancing and limiting events/schools | 20:12 |
| ALT_F4 | I think the government are very slow. | 20:12 |
| RougeRRR | it seems more deliberate than slow? | 20:12 |
| ALT_F4 | @darsie, you have to be kidding right? The nhs use firstname.seccondname@nhs.net | 20:13 |
| RougeRRR | like they are trying to chase early heard immunity | 20:13 |
| RougeRRR | or are they trying to preserve economy over lives | 20:13 |
| RougeRRR | or prevent double peak due to nhs and hit big peak now | 20:13 |
| RougeRRR | also weirdly jersey/guernsey are taking very different approaches atm (im living in jersey currently) | 20:14 |
| ALT_F4 | We are trying our best to do what we can. At my level, we cannot see anything relating to economy over lives. | 20:14 |
| ALT_F4 | Please understand, I work for NHS over GOV. | 20:14 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, i understand | 20:14 |
| RougeRRR | im just trying to understand why our response is differing | 20:15 |
| RougeRRR | i dont think its just slow speed | 20:15 |
| RougeRRR | any ideas of at what level of infection difficult decisions need to start bneing made? | 20:15 |
| ALT_F4 | It is a struggle. A lot of people thing there are secrets in the NHS and GOV. When it comes down to it, I've lived in my hometown all my life and ended up working here. | 20:15 |
| ALT_F4 | I don't see the NHS as a machine, I see it as my neighbours and friends. | 20:16 |
| darsie | ALT_F4: What fraction of the UK will get covid-19 within a year? | 20:16 |
| RougeRRR | i understand that | 20:16 |
| RougeRRR | but i feel the larger strategy is very odd | 20:16 |
| RougeRRR | what would you like to tell us ALT_F4 i feel we arnt asking right questions | 20:16 |
| ALT_F4 | In terms of percentages, I think it will be high, I don't want to give an actual percentage, solely because I don't know myself. | 20:17 |
| darsie | So 50% ish | 20:17 |
| ALT_F4 | I do think a lot of people will have it now that are not reported. and they could get better without realising. | 20:17 |
| ALT_F4 | Maybe 605 | 20:17 |
| ALT_F4 | *60% | 20:17 |
| RougeRRR | id think so | 20:17 |
| RougeRRR | because then herd immunity helps | 20:17 |
| ALT_F4 | Yes | 20:17 |
| RougeRRR | thats not at one time though | 20:17 |
| RougeRRR | hopefully... | 20:17 |
| ALT_F4 | I know there is a worry about fake news. | 20:18 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, do you know anything on immunosupressants? | 20:18 |
| ALT_F4 | Rouge, sorry, I don't work in a clinical setting so cannot advise on drugs. | 20:18 |
| RougeRRR | ahh no worries | 20:18 |
| python476 | got back from outside | 20:18 |
| RougeRRR | so you have a press role? | 20:18 |
| RougeRRR | hey python476 | 20:18 |
| python476 | didn't like breathing at the mall | 20:18 |
| python476 | hey RougeRRR | 20:19 |
| python476 | you're stocking R's | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | hey, yeah i went to shops | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | theyve started panick buying | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | so i picked up some RRRRRs | 20:19 |
| python476 | where you at | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | lol | 20:19 |
| tinwhiskers | What do you mean by 60% of people now have it? | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | jersey | 20:19 |
| ALT_F4 | It's not press, i don't want to say exactly what I do. | 20:19 |
| python476 | old jersey | 20:19 |
| darsie | Define R. | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, fe | 20:19 |
| ALT_F4 | tin, no 60% don't. | 20:19 |
| RougeRRR | python476, yeh | 20:19 |
| darsie | ah, nm. | 20:19 |
| ALT_F4 | i think it may reach that point. | 20:19 |
| python476 | R is undefined | 20:19 |
| tinwhiskers | Ok | 20:19 |
| ALT_F4 | One thing I would say. | 20:19 |
| python476 | you know what, there's a slightly chaotic vibe in mall here | 20:19 |
| python476 | not really but | 20:19 |
| ALT_F4 | Is wearing a mask without the condition is not really done by staff. | 20:20 |
| darsie | tinwhiskers: That was a response to me asking how many will get it within a year. | 20:20 |
| python476 | I feel like you could take shit from the stores and walk out, people wouldn't stop you | 20:20 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, yeah i dont think its worth masks unless you have a great one and loads of filters | 20:20 |
| ALT_F4 | No | 20:20 |
| ALT_F4 | There is CCTV everywhere. | 20:20 |
| ALT_F4 | And the trust will send to the police | 20:20 |
| ALT_F4 | I agree with this. | 20:20 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, hes talking about the mall | 20:20 |
| ALT_F4 | oh | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | not stores like medical stores | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | i think | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | haha | 20:21 |
| ALT_F4 | Ok | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, any idea how much a better situation NHS would be in if we didnt have austerity | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | any idea on field hospitals | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | ventillator availability | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | how decisions will be made on who gets on | 20:21 |
| RougeRRR | one | 20:21 |
| python476 | who here caught the virus btw ? | 20:21 |
| Birrosso | Uh, is Trump holding a speech right now? | 20:22 |
| RougeRRR | oh also lol after 3 weeks of arguing n telling my parents to not go aweay | 20:22 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, yeah think so | 20:22 |
| azy | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuyJ5XWPnw0 | 20:22 |
| azy | yeah | 20:22 |
| RougeRRR | ill tune in | 20:22 |
| ALT_F4 | The question about austerity - ofcourse, it would be better. That's a one ended question. | 20:22 |
| ALT_F4 | Ventillator - I saw some tweets saing there was like 15 ventillators in the country?! That's bs. | 20:23 |
| Birrosso | No audio (for now). | 20:23 |
| ALT_F4 | We have several in our ICU, that's no true | 20:23 |
| RougeRRR | yeah jersey just said it had 26... | 20:23 |
| Birrosso | Oh, it's just low. | 20:23 |
| Birrosso | Headphone users, beware. | 20:23 |
| RougeRRR | we have 100k pop and something like 20%+ vulnerable or over 60 | 20:23 |
| LjL | Birrosso, i don't think the speech has begun yet | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | they just sent letters out to 17k people | 20:24 |
| LjL | Birrosso, i'm monitoring several stream that are *supposed* to have it, when it happens | 20:24 |
| Birrosso | LjL: They're standing around waiting. | 20:24 |
| ALT_F4 | If you haven't caught and are serious about not getting it, the washing of the hands is important. But moreso, not touching your face when you are out and about. | 20:24 |
| Birrosso | This link, LjL: | 20:24 |
| ALT_F4 | I know of people wearing latex gloves too and from work | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, yeah im social distancing | 20:24 |
| Birrosso | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuyJ5XWPnw0 | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | i also was working part time in a bar | 20:24 |
| python476 | aww man, a hoax spins saying bolsonaro got infected | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | i quit cause i dont need money | 20:24 |
| ALT_F4 | they remove them by pinching the outsides and folding them inwards, then washing hands etc. | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | and my dad is 60+ on immunosupressant | 20:24 |
| Birrosso | People are liking/disliking before the speech has even begun. | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, ty for tip | 20:24 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, i do wonder about just using one coat for going out | 20:25 |
| RougeRRR | n washing it daily | 20:25 |
| LjL | Birrosso, well that's one i *wasn't* monitoring | 20:25 |
| ALT_F4 | Gloves are way cheaper than gel atm. you can get 200 gloves for about £6 | 20:25 |
| LjL | now i'm monitoring it too but if i add another my computer will die, i'm pretty sure | 20:25 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, | 20:25 |
| ALT_F4 | Your coat... if you touch or cough onto your sleeves, don't let them touch your face. | 20:25 |
| RougeRRR | guernsey has advised against all but essential travel, banning large events, advocating social distancing | 20:26 |
| ALT_F4 | I only have waterproof style coats, I have two, i wash one each month. I might upgrade to fortnightly. | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | jersey has made no commitments, and is telling people to contineu going on holiday | 20:26 |
| ALT_F4 | I won't be going on holiday for a long while. | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, surely it would have to be daily? | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | yeah my folks cancelled their france trip | 20:26 |
| LjL | RougeRRR, consistency in response isn't being a feature of this outbreak | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | i live in jersey ALT_F4 atm | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, yeah these are two islands | 20:26 |
| ALT_F4 | RougeRRR - The coat no, not daily. | 20:26 |
| RougeRRR | essentially the same | 20:26 |
| ALT_F4 | The virus is not airborne. | 20:27 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, but it doesnt live beyond 24hrs or so | 20:27 |
| RougeRRR | so surely every day? | 20:27 |
| ALT_F4 | You have to be in proximity with someone for around 5 min | 20:27 |
| RougeRRR | but if they coughed on your coat? | 20:27 |
| RougeRRR | like after you went out? | 20:27 |
| ALT_F4 | Yes, but the bacteria cant fly, just dont let the material touch your face. | 20:27 |
| RougeRRR | and you wash hands but keep coat on? | 20:28 |
| RougeRRR | so take coat off after you go out? | 20:28 |
| ALT_F4 | I get it, put my coat on a hook, wash my hands and take a shower. | 20:28 |
| RougeRRR | okay thats sort of thing im asking for advice on | 20:28 |
| LjL | ALT_F4, bacteria...? | 20:28 |
| ALT_F4 | If someone coughs on you, and you are genuinely concerned. Remove it from the inside if possible, roll it into a ball and put on a hot wash. | 20:28 |
| RougeRRR | i will designate one coat for my public spaces coat | 20:29 |
| RougeRRR | thanks ALT_F4 | 20:29 |
| python476 | i want a tutorial to turn plastic bottles into face shield | 20:29 |
| python476 | and a plasma arc sanitizer | 20:29 |
| RougeRRR | might just detol it nightly | 20:29 |
| RougeRRR | trump incoming | 20:29 |
| ALT_F4 | python476 - this won't have much affect. | 20:29 |
| RougeRRR | drumpf | 20:29 |
| ALT_F4 | you need filters | 20:29 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, anything else you want or think we should know | 20:29 |
| Birrosso | It has begun. | 20:30 |
| ALT_F4 | If you want to know how the NHS are doing it. Look up videos "Donning and Doffing PPE" | 20:30 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, awesome ty | 20:30 |
| azy | trump starting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuyJ5XWPnw0 | 20:30 |
| RougeRRR | drumf inbound | 20:30 |
| ALT_F4 | it will show you how medical professionals put on and take off PPE | 20:30 |
| RougeRRR | inb4 full travel ban | 20:30 |
| RougeRRR | blames yurop | 20:30 |
| python476 | ALT_F4: imagine a breathing tube with a plasma arc at the entry, nothing would survive | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | oh god | 20:31 |
| python476 | btw, what makes virus survive many days ? their membrane dont break down ? | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | he looks ill | 20:31 |
| ALT_F4 | They use hoods with breathing tubes if you have a beard. | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | where you compare what weve done to other areas of the world | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | .... | 20:31 |
| ALT_F4 | IF you use an N95 style mask and have a beard, it won't protect you at all. | 20:31 |
| LjL | Trump is speaking. What has been done in other countries is pretty incredible. As you know Europe, which we designeated as a hotspot now, and closed that border a while ago... | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | ALT_F4, yeah im actually clean shaven for a year | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | for first time in years | 20:31 |
| LjL | But through very collective action, we'll overcome the virus | 20:31 |
| RougeRRR | he looks ill | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | honestly | 20:32 |
| LjL | I also announce Wednesday night we're suspending foreign nationals who've been in Europe in the last 14 days from entering, and others will be subject to extra screening | 20:32 |
| python476 | RougeRRR: slightly | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | i agree | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | not massively | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | but somewhat | 20:32 |
| python476 | god please make him cough | 20:32 |
| python476 | just once | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | might be stress | 20:32 |
| python476 | :D | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | cough plz | 20:32 |
| RougeRRR | hes probably holding it in | 20:32 |
| python476 | RougeRRR: lack of burgers | 20:32 |
| LjL | Like our earlier aggressive actions with China, these measures save life. I appreciate a number of people behind me say we've saved a lot of lives by making this designation. | 20:33 |
| Birrosso | "We've been working very hard on defeating the Corona virus. We've made tremendous progress, better than what has happened in other areas of the world. A lot of that has to do with the closing of the borders. As you know, Europe is a hotspot right now, so that was luckier, through talent or through luck - call it what you want." But through sheer determination, we will overcome the virus. | 20:33 |
| Birrosso | Our medical professionals are doing a tremendous job. The WHO has confirmed that mayn of the things we said were 100% correct. Like earlier, our banning of China has saved a lot of lives. A number of people behind me have said that saved a lot of lives at early designation. But we're in a different phase. We have old and obsolete rules that have worked under certain circumstances, but they | 20:33 |
| Birrosso | won't work anymore now. To unleash the full power of the federal goverment, I am | 20:33 |
| Birrosso | officialy declaring a NATIONAL EMERGENCY. | 20:33 |
| ALT_F4 | Heading off for dinner. | 20:33 |
| RougeRRR | seeya soon ALT_F4 | 20:33 |
| ALT_F4 | Will come back over the weekend :) | 20:33 |
| RougeRRR | please stick around | 20:33 |
| RougeRRR | thanks :) | 20:33 |
| RougeRRR | stay safe | 20:33 |
| LjL | To unlseash the full power of the government, I am officially declaring a national emergency. | 20:33 |
| Birrosso | This will open access to up to 50 billion dollars of... very importantly, and a large amount of money for sttates and localities to fight againtst this disease" | 20:33 |
| LjL | This will open access to up to 50 billion dollars | 20:33 |
| LjL | Birrosso, okay you do it then! | 20:33 |
| RougeRRR | he seems like he has a fever | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | No, you go! | 20:34 |
| LjL | no | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | I have already stopped! | 20:34 |
| LjL | you're listening to an earlier stream | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | I erased the 4 lidnes I had now! | 20:34 |
| LjL | also type better and faster | 20:34 |
| LjL | go on | 20:34 |
| ALT_F4 | Ending point, I do think most people will be okay, if healthy. It will be the elderly and people with respiration issues. But we are not told what the GOV knows, just like you. | 20:34 |
| ALT_F4 | Only what they want us to know. | 20:34 |
| ALT_F4 | Have a good evening! | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | Broad new authority to the secretaty of health, immediately waive provisions of applicable laws and regulations to give doctors maximum flexibility. | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | This includes the following authorities: | 20:34 |
| Birrosso | The ability to waive law as to enable telehealth, a fairly new and incredible thing that's happened in the not so distant past. | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | I tell you, what they've done with it is inccredible. | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | It gives remote doctors visits and hospitals the power to waive certain requirements that limit the number of beds | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | and the length of stay. | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | The ability to waive | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | the reuqiremnets of a three-day hospital stay prior to a nursing home. | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | Waive rules that hinder the abilitiy to bring addiotnal doctors on board. | 20:35 |
| Birrosso | (Excuse the typos) | 20:35 |
| LjL | you are excused | 20:36 |
| Birrosso | The authority to waive rules that restrict where hospitals can care for patients within the hospital, increasing the capacity. | 20:36 |
| Birrosso | We'll remove every obstacle to provide the required care that the people need. | 20:36 |
| RougeRRR | SNIFF | 20:36 |
| RougeRRR | SNIFF | 20:36 |
| Birrosso | 10 days ago I brought CEOs of commercial labs and directed them to immediately work on increasing the ability of tests. | 20:36 |
| Birrosso | Other countries have worked with us and are doing similar things. | 20:36 |
| Brainstorm | New from Gazzetta Ufficiale italiana at 19:36 UTC: DECRETO-LEGGE 11 marzo 2020, n.16: Disposizioni urgenti per l'organizzazione e lo svolgimento dei Giochiolimpici e paralimpici invernali Milano Cortina 2026 e delle finaliATP Torino 2021 - 2025, nonche' in materia di divieto dipubblicizzazione parassitaria. (20G00032) → https://is.gd/7K2riv | 20:36 |
| Birrosso | As a result of that, we're annocing today a new partnership with private sector to increase testing and our capacity to deal with Corona virus. | 20:37 |
| Birrosso | But we don't want people to take a test if we feel that they shouldn't be doing it. | 20:37 |
| Birrosso | ONly if you have certain symptoms. | 20:37 |
| Birrosso | Using federal emergency authority, we've approved a new test from Roche, expect up to half a million additonal tests by next week. | 20:37 |
| Birrosso | I want to thank Roche, great company. I also want to thank Thermo Fisher. | 20:37 |
| Birrosso | It's going very quickly, which will bring 1.4 million tests within next week. | 20:38 |
| twomoon | "we don't want people to take a test if we feel they shouldn't be doing it. ...only if you have certain symptoms" | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | And 5 million more additional tests later on. | 20:38 |
| RougeRRR | twomoon, uik i same | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | Drive-through tests will be carried out in critical locations identified by doctors. | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | People will be swabbed without leaving their car. | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | Google is developing a website to determine whether a test is warranted and to | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | facilitate testing at a nearby location. | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | We have many locations around us, by the way. | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | We cover very strongly our country. | 20:38 |
| Birrosso | Stores in virtually every location. | 20:39 |
| twomoon | "again we don't everybody taking this test it's totally unnecessary" lol | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | Google has 1700 engineers workign on this right now. They've made a lot of progress. | 20:39 |
| RougeRRR | unlike websites of the past? | 20:39 |
| RougeRRR | what | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | Our main goal is to stop the spread and to help Americans who have been impacted by this. | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | Again, we don't want everyone to take the test. | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | This is not necessary. | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | We're gonig to pass through this. | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | We've learned a lot. | 20:39 |
| twomoon | 1700 google engineers lol....wtf | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | (Thanking people and stuff again) | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | Thanking Doctor Burke. (It's not clear yet what she has done.) | 20:39 |
| Birrosso | Doctor Burkes is now speaking. | 20:40 |
| Birrosso | At the beginning we proactively devolped an assay that was then converted to a diagnostic system. | 20:40 |
| LjL | he's known her very well... in the last 6 days | 20:40 |
| Birrosso | But last tuesday, seeing the spread around the globe | 20:40 |
| Birrosso | we started to realize our testing wasn't adequate to meet the needs of the US. | 20:40 |
| Birrosso | The president asked immediately for an overhoul. | 20:40 |
| Birrosso | LabCorp have taken the charge of bringing additional testing access across the country. | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | We are very grateful to the universities and large hospital systmes that developed their own tests. | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | THis has resulted in expanded countries across NY, Cali, Colorad. | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | Following the meeting last week, major equipment companies took immediate action to adopt and develop new testing systmes. | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | Roche again... | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | This approach centered on unleashing the power of the private sector | 20:41 |
| Birrosso | providing convenient testing to hundreds of thousands of americans. | 20:42 |
| Birrosso | We have developed a solution that we believe will meetn the future testing needs of Americans. | 20:42 |
| Birrosso | I understand how difficult this has been. I was part of the HIV response team in the 80s. | 20:42 |
| Birrosso | It took us to almost 1985 to have a test. | 20:42 |
| Birrosso | It took us 11 years to have a therapy. | 20:42 |
| RougeRRR | oh god she was in charge of aids | 20:42 |
| Birrosso | From these lessons we have the ability now to mobilize (rest got lost) | 20:42 |
| RougeRRR | we are fucked | 20:42 |
| python476 | hoi | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | This intense effort has resulted in innovative solutions and systems that bring the quality testing we have devolped to US citizens at high speed. | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | Korea positivity rate between three and four percent. | 20:43 |
| zirpu[m] | maybe they learned something from before? | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | With LabCorp, it's between 1 and 2 percent. | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | New approach to test (SHE IS HOLDING A POSTER UP) | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | Screening: No, Yes? | 20:43 |
| LjL | oh lord, a giant slide | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | If yes, proceed to drive thru. | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | Then labs | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | then results in 24 to 36 hours. | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | That is the intent of this approach. | 20:43 |
| Birrosso | This is only in the US, and we want to bring this across the continent. | 20:44 |
| RougeRRR | tbh google helping is best | 20:44 |
| RougeRRR | much more competent | 20:44 |
| Birrosso | Trump: I'd like to have Tony come up here (WHO?) | 20:44 |
| Birrosso | He's been working a lot (No idea on what). | 20:44 |
| Birrosso | Tony: | 20:44 |
| Birrosso | This is an example of what I've been referring to in my discussions with many of you in the audience as a proactive, aggressive, trying to stay ahead of the curve. | 20:44 |
| LjL | it's Anthony Fauci | 20:44 |
| Birrosso | And what you can see now with this order is that we're going to be able to remove the constraints to be able to do everything we possibly can | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | to implement everything we have talking about | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | containment and mitigation. | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | That curve that goes up, we don't want to have that curve! Want to suppress it. And I think what we have done today is going to be instrumental in helping us achiieve that. | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | As the president said, this would end. | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | But what we have decided today is going to help us end it sooner. | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | Trump: | 20:45 |
| Birrosso | Celebrities behind me, biggest retailers, guy from Walmart | 20:46 |
| Birrosso | (...) | 20:46 |
| Birrosso | Walmart is helping with supplies | 20:46 |
| Birrosso | for the drive-thru tests. | 20:46 |
| Birrosso | Walgreens: | 20:46 |
| LjL | he looks scared | 20:46 |
| Birrosso | (Said nothing of any consquence) | 20:47 |
| Birrosso | Target: | 20:47 |
| LjL | lots of hand shaking, great idea | 20:47 |
| Birrosso | We look forward to help the administration and alleviate the threat, bla, bla, bla. | 20:47 |
| Birrosso | Walgreens is promising to help stock up local stores and prevent areas from running out of supplies. | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | Becton Dickinson (Medical company): | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | Ramping up manufacturing capacity. | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | Trump: Thank you. Great job. | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | West Diagnostics: | 20:48 |
| LjL | is this a parade | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | This is hilarious. :D | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | West Diagnostics: | 20:48 |
| Birrosso | We're working with the FDA to help combat this. | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | The capacity of the public will be considerably inrceased. | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | Roche (the favourite): | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | WE THANK THE FDA FOR THEIR RAPID APPROVAL OF OUR TEST. | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | We really appreciate their hepl in getting that to market as fast as possible. | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | It's critical for laboratories and to help us get medical facilities set up. | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | Trump: YOU CAN DO IT. YOU ARE A GREAT COMPANY | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | (KILL ME) | 20:49 |
| Birrosso | House call provider from the US: | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | We go to the vulnerable and elderly. | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | We stand ready to help. | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | Whether they're in clinics or their home. | 20:50 |
| RougeRRR | notice how its all companies | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | (Not sure what that was about) | 20:50 |
| RougeRRR | murrrrica capitalism | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | (Exactly, RougeRRR) | 20:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 19:47 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Trump Declares National Emergency Over Coronavirus Pandemic → https://is.gd/pPDQUr | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | Trump: We're gonig to be changing a lot of the old rules and specifications and regulations. | 20:50 |
| Birrosso | LabCorp: We're working every second and every day to increase our testing capacity. | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | We're working with Quest and other hospitals to ensure that we can do everything we can to increase testing. | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | We understand how important testing is | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | and we are committed to doing everything possible. | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | (Seriously, kill me) | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | CVS (WHO?): | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | We make sure our customers have the safety they need. | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | We are commited with public health officials to... | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | LjL | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | I'm done. | 20:51 |
| Birrosso | This is ridiculous. | 20:51 |
| LjL | they are committed with working with the administration | 20:52 |
| Birrosso | This is an advertising segment. | 20:52 |
| LjL | LHC Group, more of the same | 20:52 |
| Birrosso | To help students and their families, interest on student loans have been waived. | 20:52 |
| Birrosso | Until further notice. | 20:52 |
| LjL | Following emergency actions today: | 20:52 |
| LjL | to help students and families i've waived interest in all federal loans | 20:52 |
| LjL | that's a big thing for a lot of students | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | Based on price of oil, secretary of energy will purchase at a very good price a large amount of oil, strategic reserve. | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | Saving the taxpayer billions and billions of dollars. | 20:53 |
| RougeRRR | lol elbow bump at last | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | Towards that wonderful goal which we've achieved, the goal of energy independence (what?) | 20:53 |
| RougeRRR | "oooh i like that, thats good" | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | we're going to fill it up, the price has gone down quite a bit | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | we're gonna fill it up! Woo! | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | VP speaking: | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | This day should be an inspiration to every American. | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | (What?) | 20:53 |
| Birrosso | Thanks to your leadership, not only are we brining the whole of goverment to fight the corona virus | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | we're brining all of America | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | Okay, he's just kissng up to Trump now. | 20:54 |
| RougeRRR | billions and billions | 20:54 |
| tinwhiskers | What an embarrassment | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | He's literally just praising him. | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | Americans returning will be screened and asked to | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | voluntarily participate in a 14-day quarantine. | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | You brought the best of America to address this, Mr President. | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | We've been working with states across the country. | 20:54 |
| LjL | voluntary coercion | 20:54 |
| Birrosso | We've tailed specific reccommendations from CD for certain statse | 20:55 |
| Birrosso | we've been in contact with govs around teh country. | 20:55 |
| Birrosso | (Praising Trump again) | 20:55 |
| azy | Can I literally blow you, Mr President? | 20:55 |
| RougeRRR | mmmm your asshole tastes so good | 20:55 |
| LjL | stay classy(er than him) | 20:55 |
| RougeRRR | mmmm will you piss on me trumpy? | 20:55 |
| LjL | okay | 20:55 |
| LjL | seriously | 20:55 |
| Birrosso | "Historic public-private partnership" | 20:55 |
| Birrosso | We have laid the foundation to meet our needs! | 20:55 |
| LjL | we all feel similarly i think, but no need | 20:55 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, would you say that if it was hitler | 20:56 |
| azy | hes that guy who repeats the joke | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | As the president said, you will go to a website and type in your symptoms. | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | And then you will be directed TO ONE OF THESE INCREDIBLE COMPANIES | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | WHO ARE GOING TO GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF THEIR PARKING LOT | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | SO PEOPLE CAN DRIVE BYF AND DO TESTS | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | (OH MY GOD LOL) | 20:56 |
| Birrosso | That was VERBATIM. | 20:56 |
| LjL | i saw | 20:56 |
| tinwhiskers | Birrosso: I'm so sorry you have to write this. | 20:56 |
| LjL | he doesn't have to | 20:56 |
| LjL | but sometimes we're masochistic | 20:57 |
| tinwhiskers | No, fair | 20:57 |
| ryouma | public private partnershipt seemshigher priority than just doign what is needed | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | I am very masochistic. | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | We have cases in 46 states now! | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | While the risk of illness remains low | 20:57 |
| RougeRRR | ill just write a bot to take the cc text direct from youtube Birrosso | 20:57 |
| RougeRRR | lol | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | we ask that yo practice common sense. | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | RougeRRR: Alright! | 20:57 |
| LjL | what Pence really wants to say is "I hope the president has caught it and I haven't and I'll succeed him without an actual election" | 20:57 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, haha ill get it setup | 20:57 |
| Birrosso | He is so blatantly kissing up | 20:58 |
| Birrosso | it's disgusting. | 20:58 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, yeeeeeeeeeeeep | 20:58 |
| LjL | Guidelines about visitations to nursing homes will be set up (haven't they said this before?) | 20:58 |
| RougeRRR | brb i need a whisky | 20:58 |
| Birrosso | "Mr President, every American should be proud of this incredible Private-Public partnership that's going to be speeding ahead and help us test millions af Americans." | 20:58 |
| LjL | Wash your hands, use common sense, look at the most vulnerable | 20:58 |
| Birrosso | They keep going on about the companies and whatnot! | 20:58 |
| Birrosso | CMS, that runs Medicare and Medicaid, can now suspend regulations that get in the way of treating patinets. | 20:59 |
| Birrosso | This is a massive mobilization of our country's resources to combat this virus. | 20:59 |
| Birrosso | The flexbility we are offering is going to provide a godsend to our medical health professionals. | 20:59 |
| Birrosso | NURSING HOMES ARE TO RESTRICT ALL VISITORS AND NON-ESSENTIAL PERSONNELL. | 20:59 |
| Birrosso | With the except of end-of-life situations. | 20:59 |
| Birrosso | We appreciate that you're worried about your elderly in nursing homes | 20:59 |
| RougeRRR | LjL, lol have your parents finally cottened on | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | but we're doing what we must, what we can, to protect them. | 21:00 |
| RougeRRR | mine have | 21:00 |
| RougeRRR | they wont admit i was right | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | Trump: Everyone has a role in defeating this virus. | 21:00 |
| RougeRRR | but they have | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | Most ffective weapon now is to limit the damage and slow the spread. | 21:00 |
| LjL | RougeRRR, mine have admitted i was right, at least one of them | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | The choice we make, and our precautions | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | are critical in combatting the virus. | 21:00 |
| LjL | she literally said "You were right all along, every thing you said came true, we should have listened" | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | The CDC has published guidelines on the Corona virus, and it's very heavily used right now, I will say! | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | This will enable every American to respond to Corona and protect themselves and others. | 21:00 |
| Birrosso | While the risk to healthy YOUNG Americans remains very low, anyone can be a carrier | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | and risk transmission to older Americans and those with underlying health conditions. | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | Those who are most at risk, they have not done very well. | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | Especially if they have a health problem, they have not done well with this virus. | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | We want tno prevent the spread and transmission of the disease. | 21:01 |
| ryouma | and what is the policy to doeal with tat | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | It's incredible what's happening with the sporting world with so many of the great sports we're used to | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | they're not going to be meeting this year. | 21:01 |
| Birrosso | And they've done a great service, actually, helping to avoid further spread. | 21:02 |
| LjL | it's too bad given the density of important information he's providing, but i have to leave for dinner | 21:02 |
| Birrosso | Nothing major right now. | 21:02 |
| Birrosso | "You never know!" | 21:02 |
| Birrosso | Major change in attitude. | 21:02 |
| Birrosso | "You have hotspots around the world right now that you never thought it would be possible." | 21:02 |
| RougeRRR | LjL ahh good | 21:03 |
| RougeRRR | thats nice | 21:03 |
| Birrosso | Postpone assemblies, yada yada. | 21:03 |
| RougeRRR | mine wont admit it really but lol they have by their actions | 21:03 |
| Birrosso | In the coming weeks, we'll have to make changes and sacrificies. | 21:03 |
| Birrosso | Again, we're learning a lot for the future or future problems like this... | 21:03 |
| ryouma | postpone assemblies -- like first amendment? | 21:03 |
| Birrosso | OR WORSE! | 21:03 |
| Birrosso | IT COULD GET WORSE! | 21:04 |
| Birrosso | Some of the doctors say it will wash through, it wall flow through. | 21:04 |
| Birrosso | (Like a miracle?) | 21:04 |
| Birrosso | In a number of weeks I think you're going to find that a very accurate term. | 21:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 20:02 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Virginia closes all public schools → https://is.gd/9HBHSk | 21:04 |
| Birrosso | "Our numbers are great, especially when you compare them with other places that have lower populations." | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | Meaning number of infected. | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | He is reassuring families that the goverment will do everything in its power to save their lives. | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | "No nation is more prepared or more equipped to save this crisis.' | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | "As you know, WE ARE RATED NUMBER ONE IN THE WORLD" | 21:05 |
| tinwhiskers | Jfc | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | "We are helping other nations. And many of them are doing well." | 21:05 |
| tinwhiskers | Lol | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | With faith and heart and hope, we will succeed. | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | We will prevail. | 21:05 |
| Birrosso | We will be very, very successful. | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | And we will learn for the future. | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | Q&A now. | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | Where are you with the house bill yesterday? You were opposed to it. | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | What has happened since then? | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | "We don't think the dems are giving enough. We were negotiating." | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | "Then all of a sudden they didn't agree to what they promised to agree to." | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | "They're not giving enough, not doing enough for the country." | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | Question about students loans: | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | What are specific targeted measures are you thinking about taking? | 21:06 |
| Birrosso | Trump: We are looking at many different things. We are gonig to be relasing a paper in about two hours, stating other steps, important ones. | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | Q: I want to know if you are in contact with the Brazilian president, after a member of his delegation was tested positive. | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | Q: Senators X and Y are self-isolating. | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | Are you doing to protect yourself as well with similar measures? | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | Trump: I have no symptoms | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | Had a meeting the Brazilaian president | 21:07 |
| Birrosso | GREAT GUY, DOING FANTASTIC FOR BRAZIL | 21:08 |
| Birrosso | As you know, he tested negative today. | 21:08 |
| Birrosso | We're talking about Corona country to country. It was reported that he may have a problem, but he doesn't. Fortunately. | 21:08 |
| LjL | As we know he saix | 21:08 |
| Birrosso | Q: When can you guarantee that everyone will be able to have a test? | 21:08 |
| Birrosso | We've redesigned the old, outdated regulations we had to address this new unique situation. | 21:09 |
| Birrosso | We'll have the ability to do in the millions over a small period of time. | 21:09 |
| RougeRRR | millions and millions | 21:09 |
| Birrosso | Frankly, the old system worked very well | 21:09 |
| Birrosso | but for smaller numbers, not this kind of numbers. | 21:09 |
| Birrosso | Okay, I need to let my hands rest. | 21:09 |
| M_[m]4 | > I have no *wheeze* symptoms | 21:09 |
| Birrosso | I'm already doing transcription 6 hours a day. | 21:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Thanks Birrosso | 21:10 |
| LjL | Appreciated, also look at your status window | 21:10 |
| Birrosso | LjL: What am I looking for? | 21:10 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, why are you doing it 6 hours a day? | 21:10 |
| RougeRRR | job? | 21:11 |
| Birrosso | RougeRRR: Part-time job until I graduate. | 21:11 |
| Birrosso | Well, "part-time" | 21:11 |
| RougeRRR | ahh nice one man | 21:11 |
| RougeRRR | what is your wpm? | 21:11 |
| RougeRRR | what board? | 21:11 |
| Birrosso | Board? | 21:11 |
| pwr22 | BBC News - Coronavirus: Why is the UK not shutting schools like other countries? | 21:11 |
| pwr22 | https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-51874084 | 21:11 |
| Birrosso | What do you mean "what board?"? | 21:11 |
| LjL | Kb | 21:11 |
| Birrosso | Ah | 21:12 |
| Birrosso | Das Ultimate 4 | 21:12 |
| Birrosso | https://data.typeracer.com/pit/profile?user=omarsm | 21:12 |
| RougeRRR | precipitously | 21:12 |
| RougeRRR | big word for trump | 21:12 |
| RougeRRR | nice Birrosso | 21:13 |
| Birrosso | Used to be faster, but I care less about that number now. | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | ahh im like 80-100 depends if im talking off the top of my head or reading at the same time | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | same | 21:13 |
| Birrosso | Between this and the piano, I was straining my hands too much. | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | i am using a compaq g80-1800 atm | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | its the same as the cherry | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | but i have model m/f | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | and some other alps boards n a filco | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | this is vintage mx brown | 21:13 |
| RougeRRR | more like modern clears | 21:14 |
| RougeRRR | mx-11800* | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | There was this one extremely-heavy keyboard I tried once | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | I can't remember its name. | 21:14 |
| RougeRRR | http://i.imgur.com/2Wg8ljk.jpg?1 | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | But it was the most-satisfying I have ever typed on. | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | The sound! | 21:14 |
| RougeRRR | same as this | 21:14 |
| RougeRRR | noice | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | Yes, it was actually a Compaq. | 21:14 |
| Birrosso | But old | 21:15 |
| RougeRRR | i love model m | 21:15 |
| Birrosso | It had a PS2 connection. | 21:15 |
| RougeRRR | got 3 model f | 21:15 |
| RougeRRR | mmm | 21:15 |
| RougeRRR | i used to be big into keyboards | 21:15 |
| Birrosso | Yes, it was a model M I tried. | 21:16 |
| azy | ew | 21:16 |
| Birrosso | I don't know exactly what sort of switches it had, but they were LOUD! | 21:16 |
| Birrosso | Louder than blues | 21:16 |
| Birrosso | and so satisfying! | 21:16 |
| azy | hows that compare to a thinkpad clit mouse? | 21:16 |
| RougeRRR | mmm nice | 21:16 |
| RougeRRR | azy, its awful | 21:16 |
| RougeRRR | i dont use trackball | 21:16 |
| RougeRRR | i have a thinkpad x250 actually | 21:16 |
| Birrosso | I love the appearance and the feel of my Das, but it's brown. :/ | 21:16 |
| RougeRRR | im using it atm | 21:16 |
| azy | i got really used to my x200 clitmouse | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | but im rebuilding desktop soon | 21:17 |
| Birrosso | I bought it used for 50 Euros, used one month. | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | i love the clitmouse | 21:17 |
| Birrosso | They guy who bought it wanted to force himself to learn touch-typing. I guess it didn't work. | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | https://xkcd.com/243/ | 21:17 |
| Birrosso | He had trouble selling it afterwards since it's blank. I don't think he was aware that he could replace the key caps. | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | im still not a fan of DAS/Blank caps | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | i used to change keyboars a lot and it would still confuse me or others | 21:17 |
| Birrosso | I didn't seek it out. Just bought it because it was ridiculously cheap | 21:17 |
| Birrosso | compared to new price. | 21:17 |
| RougeRRR | iobviously touch type, but sometime i need to look to find myself | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | especially when i drink | 21:18 |
| Birrosso | I rely heavily on muscle memory, so... | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | my dad is always gobsmacked by how quick i type...its like | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | i program | 21:18 |
| Birrosso | looking is never necessary. | 21:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 20:11 UTC: (news): Google is making a coronavirus information site to help find testing as more kits become available → https://is.gd/REp9x5 | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | i type 8 hours a day + | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | of course i type quickly | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | im suprised how quick typing on a smart phone has got for mwe | 21:18 |
| RougeRRR | he always thingks im furiously typing lol, its like no.. this is just how i type | 21:18 |
| Birrosso | Good for you. I still struggle with touch screens. | 21:19 |
| Birrosso | I'm 25, but I look like a 60+ year-old when I'm handling a smartphone. | 21:19 |
| RougeRRR | i used to be the same honestly | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | i was all for physical keyboards | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | im 26 | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | i used to have a nokia n900 linux | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | but i have got way quicker from uysing irc on my phone and typing angry reddit comments | 21:20 |
| Birrosso | I do have a touch-screen device, the Nexus 7 2013. I love it. But I rarely type on it. | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | i HATED smart phones | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | and touch screens | 21:20 |
| RougeRRR | i still dont like touch screens, but ive got way quicker. auto correct has come a long way lol | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | yeah noice | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | im on some xiaomi | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | redmi note 7? | 21:21 |
| Birrosso | I still hate them. The only thing they offer (aside from being a phone) is mobility. Anything else, you're 100 times more efficient on a computer. | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | oh 100% | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | i dont get how people survive with out a laptop/desktop | 21:21 |
| Birrosso | Just all the time when I'm using them I keep thinking how I would've taken much less time if I had used a computer, whatever it is I'm doing. | 21:21 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, yep | 21:22 |
| Birrosso | It's a worrying trend. I think | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | i get super annoyed by it and end up switching | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | yeah i agree | 21:22 |
| Birrosso | more people than not have a smartphone but no computer. | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | this new generation coming in are less technically able that my generation | 21:22 |
| Birrosso | Indeed. | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | less n less people actually know how to use tech despite how prevelant it is | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | they only know how to use it as a suer | 21:22 |
| RougeRRR | user | 21:22 |
| Birrosso | RougeRRR | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | I study engineering. | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | Can you imagine I have classmates who DO NOT OWN A COMPUTER? | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | FUCK off trump | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | As ENGINEERS! | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | mocking someone | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | for fucking mispronouncing | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | the fucking dipshit cunt | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, what how | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | One of them was telling me one day he was going to building X of the university to do some CAD designs. | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | I asked him why he wouldn't do it from home, with the weather being so bad. | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | And he said he didn't have a computer!@ | 21:23 |
| RougeRRR | Birrosso, how do they survive in engineering without one... | 21:23 |
| Birrosso | Then I realised many don't! | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | what do they use? | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | It's a catastrophe. | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | Like I said | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | like you dont have to have anything fancy | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | basic laptop | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | they go to the university's PC pools | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | and use the university's PCs. | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | do they need heavy hardware?? | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | cause if so fair enough | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | but still | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | Not really, no. | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | own a cheap laptop | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | i got my x250 for £200 | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | You won't run them on a Chromebook running Ubuntu... | 21:24 |
| Birrosso | but a cheap laptop, sure. | 21:24 |
| RougeRRR | i7 5600u, 8gb ram, 1080p ips, 500gb ssd | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | £200 | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | bargain | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | i wana upgrade ram | 21:25 |
| Birrosso | That's more than enough. | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | yeh | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | just run ubuntu 19 | 21:25 |
| twomoon | who was the woman featured during trump's speach today? | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | got a desktop too | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | but i need to rebuild it | 21:25 |
| Birrosso | I have only ever used desktops. | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | ryzen 3600, 2x 8gb 3200mhz, 500gb ssd, 2tb hdd, msi b450, corsair case, rx480 8gb | 21:25 |
| RougeRRR | yeah i often do | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | I have a similar problem with laptops compared to desktops. They only offer mobility, and nothing more. | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | but i got the thinkpad to use for portability | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | Rest is all cons. | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | I got... | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | i work from coffeeshops n work n shit | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | a Chromebook for 40 Euros, used | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | useful to have | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | put Gallium OS on it. | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | yeah | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | Now I have a fully-functioning laptop for basic stuff. | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | for coding n some virtual machines | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | my thinkpad is cheap and durable and powerful enough | 21:26 |
| RougeRRR | 10 hour battery | 21:26 |
| twomoon | Birosso who was that woman during the speech today | 21:26 |
| Birrosso | Yep, long battery is great. | 21:27 |
| twomoon | did you hear Doctor Burke? | 21:27 |
| Birrosso | twomoon: She said she was part of, or maybe the lead of, a response team back in the 80s | 21:27 |
| Birrosso | for dealing with the HIV outbreak. | 21:27 |
| Birrosso | Yes. | 21:27 |
| Birrosso | Doctor Burke | 21:27 |
| RougeRRR | trump saying he did all he could | 21:27 |
| twomoon | i'm not finding any names on google. google sucks | 21:27 |
| RougeRRR | bullshit | 21:27 |
| RougeRRR | fucking garbage human | 21:27 |
| Birrosso | Maybe it's not spelled Burke. | 21:27 |
| RougeRRR | millions n millions | 21:28 |
| twomoon | oh doctor Debbie Birx | 21:28 |
| twomoon | Deborah Birx | 21:28 |
| twomoon | weird name never seen before | 21:28 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 20:28 UTC: Coronavirus: UK measures defended after criticism: The government defends its coronavirus plans as confirmed cases rise to 798. → https://is.gd/ZWvDTY | 21:32 |
| SandyToo | peace | 21:33 |
| adventurer | shalom SandyToo | 21:36 |
| SandyToo | hi | 21:39 |
| SandyToo | was reading this: https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/index.html | 21:39 |
| SandyToo | still there? | 21:39 |
| SandyToo | are you from Israel adventurer? | 21:40 |
| SandyToo | what does designation [m] signify? | 21:43 |
| adventurer | no I am not from Israel | 21:45 |
| SandyToo | shalom greeting? | 21:45 |
| SandyToo | Jew? | 21:46 |
| SandyToo | I have questions is the reason i ask | 21:46 |
| adventurer | No I just felt like saying it | 21:46 |
| SandyToo | oh | 21:46 |
| SandyToo | cool | 21:46 |
| adventurer | ask questions | 21:46 |
| adventurer | someone might know the answer | 21:46 |
| SandyToo | are there any christians present? | 21:46 |
| SandyToo | heal the sick folks? | 21:47 |
| tinwhiskers | evidence Iran is under-reporting: https://www.adn.com/nation-world/2020/03/12/irans-coronavirus-burial-pits-are-so-vast-theyre-visible-from-space/ | 21:47 |
| tinwhiskers | no surprise really | 21:47 |
| SandyToo | unbelievable | 21:47 |
| SandyToo | Saudi Arabia has asked pilgrims to stay home? | 21:48 |
| adventurer | SandyToo, better to try to prevent as many people having it as possible, wash hands, use hand sanitizer, keep social distance. | 21:48 |
| SandyToo | why would you think I'm not already doing those things? | 21:48 |
| adventurer | I don't know, I didn't know | 21:49 |
| SandyToo | and yet, you say "better" | 21:49 |
| SandyToo | unbelievable | 21:49 |
| tinwhiskers | "More than 80 [people] have been buried in this section so far, and they say only 34 deaths," he says, citing the official death toll on Feb. 28. | 21:49 |
| adventurer | I saw a joke on facebook...you know it's okay to wash your hands when there isn't a impending new coronavirus outbreak too | 21:49 |
| adventurer | I didn't assume SandyToo | 21:49 |
| adventurer | most people already do | 21:50 |
| SandyToo | you said "better" | 21:50 |
| adventurer | my point is prevention is better than cure | 21:50 |
| SandyToo | cure is prevention | 21:50 |
| adventurer | are you sick SandyToo ? | 21:50 |
| SandyToo | healing is prevention | 21:50 |
| adventurer | oh no | 21:51 |
| tinwhiskers | cure is prevention... healing is prevention... hrm | 21:52 |
| Andrei[m] | Trump declared national emergency from COVID-19 | 21:52 |
| Andrei[m] | This should be interesting | 21:52 |
| tinwhiskers | Andrei[m]: we already had the live transcript posted here earlier. It was truly horrible. | 21:53 |
| LjL | The speech was horrible | 21:53 |
| Andrei[m] | My state has 4 new cases today, homegrown ones | 21:53 |
| LjL | The fact itself of having drive-through testing I class as tentatively good news | 21:54 |
| tinwhiskers | we've had to give Birrosso the rest of the day off for PTSD from having to type that nonsense | 21:54 |
| Andrei[m] | My dad works in a hospital so he's got his work cut out for him | 21:54 |
| LjL | He had PSTD from being himself anyway | 21:54 |
| tinwhiskers | Andrei[m]: do you live at home? | 21:55 |
| Andrei[m] | Yes | 21:55 |
| tinwhiskers | I mean with your parents :-) | 21:55 |
| Andrei[m] | Currently my mom has our guest room set up as a "quarantine room" | 21:55 |
| tinwhiskers | I see | 21:55 |
| tinwhiskers | good planning | 21:55 |
| Andrei[m] | Yes I live with my parents, currently I don't see that as a bad thing | 21:55 |
| Andrei[m] | Because if I didn't, I'd move back in right now haha | 21:55 |
| python476 | Andrei[m]: you're 45yo ? | 21:55 |
| Birrosso | https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=48&v=iprOmLgE504&feature=emb_logo | 21:56 |
| Andrei[m] | I'm 25 | 21:56 |
| Birrosso | Is this a comedy sketch? | 21:56 |
| python476 | I am the only adult allowed to live at his parents ! | 21:56 |
| Birrosso | "There is nothing to worry about!" *Sweats profusely* | 21:56 |
| python476 | Andrei[m]: ok, you're a kid that's alright | 21:56 |
| Andrei[m] | Mom spent a ton of money on groceries to stock up | 21:56 |
| romare | do we have the numbers for those who are re-infected and died, and those who are re-infected and recovered? | 21:56 |
| Andrei[m] | Got some medical supplies like thermometers too | 21:56 |
| tinwhiskers | Birrosso: lol | 21:57 |
| LjL | romare: I wouldn't think so, we barely have clearcut reports if infection... | 21:57 |
| LjL | Of reinfection* | 21:57 |
| Andrei[m] | As far as I know, there's no *reliable* data for reinfections | 21:58 |
| tinwhiskers | agreed. There is no good evidence of reinfection | 21:58 |
| tinwhiskers | there is evidence for people testing positive again after already getting two negative tests though | 21:59 |
| Andrei[m] | So far all I've seen are fringe sites with no decent sources | 21:59 |
| Andrei[m] | I guess my job searching things are taking a halt | 21:59 |
| tinwhiskers | Someone linked to an article where four health workers were tested after getting the all-clear and all four had positive tests again several days later. | 22:01 |
| tinwhiskers | *four infected health workers | 22:01 |
| LjL | that one sounded quite concerning, but i didn't look into it any further than what was said here | 22:02 |
| LjL | possibly for the best | 22:02 |
| tinwhiskers | I think it was fructose | 22:02 |
| ryouma | does that occur with viruses in general? i mean, is there a rate at which this occurs that is epectex in some viruses, or is it a major concern with some viruses, or is it ... | 22:07 |
| ryouma | expectd | 22:08 |
| ryouma | e | 22:08 |
| tinwhiskers | BTW, I heard an interview on the radio where the doctor was saying one leading theory for why old people are affected so badly by covid-19 is due to "Antibody-dependent enhancement". We see the same thing with Dengue fever. | 22:09 |
| tinwhiskers | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antibody-dependent_enhancement | 22:09 |
| RougeR | tinwhiskers, eli5 | 22:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Basically if you've been exposed to one serotype of the disease your anitbodies can make it easier for a second serotype of the disease to affect you instead of less. | 22:10 |
| dunnp | https://twitter.com/virusninja/status/1238559618265165825 | 22:10 |
| dunnp | worst pcr primers | 22:10 |
| tinwhiskers | so old people, having been exposed to many other coronaviruses, may having an ADE type effect with covid-19. | 22:11 |
| RougeR | tinwhiskers, so they have had more coronavirus family exposure? | 22:11 |
| RougeR | huhi see | 22:11 |
| RougeR | any way of mitigating it | 22:11 |
| tinwhiskers | Young people haven't been exposed to many coronaviruses so don't get the same effect. | 22:11 |
| tinwhiskers | RougeR: Not that I'm aware of. Looking into ways of combating dengue might reveal something because it's the ADE that makes dengue life-threatening | 22:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 21:10 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Anna Fifield su Twitter: "China is portraying itself as a magnanimous and trustworthy global leader in the coronavirus response. eg: sending ventilators to Italy. Turns out they’re exports with purchase deals, not donations. With @lucrepogge (and @giuliapompili) https://t.co/VMzNZ8pVO2" → https://is.gd/TFBUu7 | 22:12 |
| commandocrypto[m | !cases UK | 22:13 |
| commandocrypto[m | How to do uk? | 22:14 |
| tinwhiskers | Crap. data collection has gone bung again | 22:14 |
| RougeR | 790? | 22:14 |
| RougeR | https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/13/herd-immunity-will-the-uks-coronavirus-strategy-work | 22:14 |
| tinwhiskers | I'll fix it camm | 22:14 |
| tinwhiskers | *commandocrypto[m | 22:14 |
| RougeR | so yeah | 22:15 |
| RougeR | UK gov is lying tous | 22:15 |
| RougeR | big supprise | 22:15 |
| RougeR | they are going for herd immunity | 22:15 |
| RougeR | because it will impact business les | 22:15 |
| astraliam[m] | When the NHS collapses will they lock down or just keep going? | 22:17 |
| RougeR | no ideas | 22:17 |
| RougeR | but i was right | 22:17 |
| RougeR | they are lying and are taking a different approach | 22:17 |
| RougeR | wether it works is a different matter | 22:17 |
| RougeR | but they are NOT following who guidelines | 22:17 |
| Andrei[m] | Meanwhile, a lot of british twitter is bitching about how the "good tea" is already taken up | 22:17 |
| Andrei[m] | This is a *very* British complaint | 22:17 |
| RougeR | lol | 22:18 |
| ryouma | perhaps citizens/subjects will have less confidence in their governments when they find that out | 22:20 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases UK | 22:20 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases United kingdom | 22:20 |
| commandocrypto[m | > they are lying and are taking a different approach | 22:20 |
| commandocrypto[m | U saying they arent actuslly gonna try the herd immunity science experiment on the general population? | 22:20 |
| tinwhiskers | herd immunity is hardly an experiment. That happens in all outbreaks over time. they are talking about how to manage getting there (or not) | 22:21 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases United kingdom | 22:22 |
| RougeR | commandocrypto[m, they are lying by saying that social distasncing is ineffective | 22:22 |
| RougeR | and saying it is because people wont put up with it | 22:22 |
| RougeR | if they want to try herd immunity | 22:22 |
| RougeR | fucking say so | 22:22 |
| RougeR | dont lie to us | 22:22 |
| RougeR | tinwhiskers, but its against who advice and not the reasons they gave the public | 22:22 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah. that's true. | 22:22 |
| RougeR | im not saying it is wrong, im saying it is going against the grain and they lied | 22:22 |
| commandocrypto[m | (Sorry ill try to use mentions instead of quotes, love ya irc guis) | 22:23 |
| commandocrypto[m | @freenode_tinwhiskers:matrix.org: lol i brought up ade to u the other day also | 22:23 |
| tinwhiskers | commandocrypto[m: maybe you did | 22:23 |
| commandocrypto[m | tinwhiskers did we get there in the end with tb? | 22:23 |
| commandocrypto[m | Did we acheive herd immunity with ebola? | 22:23 |
| commandocrypto[m | What about smallpox? Thank fuck we got the herd immunity to that one | 22:24 |
| LjL | can't you just tab complete the nickname -.- | 22:24 |
| RougeR | lol commandocrypto[m | 22:24 |
| RougeR | commandocrypto[m, get hexchart | 22:24 |
| tinwhiskers | We would have if it hadn't been controlled, but no we didn't | 22:24 |
| RougeR | commandocrypto[m, get hexchat | 22:24 |
| tinwhiskers | we did get herd immunity with smalpox, yes | 22:24 |
| RougeR | we could try herd immunity | 22:24 |
| RougeR | but they need to inform us that is their technique | 22:25 |
| RougeR | again they LIED | 22:25 |
| RougeR | as tories always lie | 22:25 |
| tinwhiskers | I probably just ignored what you were saying the other day about ADE because you were spouting a lot of nonsense as well, really doing yourself a discredit. | 22:26 |
| slash_ | imho, we should not discuss politics like that here, pretty much every country has shitty political parties.. | 22:30 |
| RougeR | holy shit | 22:30 |
| RougeR | https://twitter.com/iandonald_psych/status/1238518371651649538 | 22:31 |
| RougeR | B O O M | 22:31 |
| RougeR | i was fucking right | 22:31 |
| RougeR | pwr22, | 22:31 |
| slash_ | But.. no measure can be correct, we do not know enough about the virus. But I think it is better to overreact and be proven wrong instead of underreacting. | 22:33 |
| tinwhiskers | You can take an approach that doesn't require you get it correct though | 22:34 |
| commandocrypto[m | @freenode_tinwhiskers:matrix.org: Ill be proven right about ade and eberything else i was spouting | 22:34 |
| commandocrypto[m | I huffed all the docs in january | 22:34 |
| aradesh | https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-51876784 | 22:34 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers yes I suppose you are right, the correct response now would be to take measures as best as we know but that can be considered an "overreacting" later | 22:35 |
| slash_ | better safe than sorry basically | 22:35 |
| slash_ | it is the sensible thing to do when lacking data | 22:36 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah | 22:36 |
| ryouma | ade? | 22:36 |
| RougeR | LjL, | 22:36 |
| commandocrypto[m | Antibody Dependent Enhancement. Basically a virus feature that meeans it can envelop the macrophages of white cells that have adapted to fight it | 22:38 |
| commandocrypto[m | Really bad if u eber get reinfected | 22:38 |
| slash_ | we have a saying here, translated it means: "soft healers make dirty wounds" | 22:39 |
| slash_ | we need hard action now, we can argue later | 22:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 21:27 UTC: (news): Google is making a coronavirus information site to help find testing as more kits become available → https://is.gd/REp9x5 | 22:40 |
| Andrei[m] | I've said this isn't a political issue now | 22:41 |
| Andrei[m] | This is a humanitarian thing | 22:41 |
| slash_ | it is | 22:41 |
| eviscerate | The second he said he was suspending travel from Europe, I requested a 30 day leave of absence. | 22:41 |
| eviscerate | people have already accused me of panicking | 22:41 |
| slash_ | the corona subreddits are very annoying to read right now, they're turning into political fights | 22:42 |
| slash_ | blaming whoever | 22:42 |
| eviscerate | staying home is patriotic | 22:42 |
| eviscerate | give me my ubi | 22:42 |
| berndj | how do we know those structures in iran are actually burial pits for human bodies? | 22:43 |
| slash_ | unless we have actual evidence of that, then no | 22:44 |
| eviscerate | satellites | 22:44 |
| eviscerate | they can read a street sign from space | 22:44 |
| slash_ | no they can't | 22:44 |
| slash_ | what? | 22:44 |
| ryouma | they? | 22:45 |
| ryouma | is sourcen amed? | 22:45 |
| slash_ | that's literally impossible, regardless of how good their camera's are, the atmosphere makes that impossible | 22:45 |
| slash_ | unless the satellite is floating 10 meters above the street or something | 22:46 |
| RougeR | slash_, because like it or not thisw is driven by politics | 22:46 |
| eviscerate | lol | 22:46 |
| RougeR | and differnt policies are driven by political leaning and image | 22:46 |
| RougeR | economy vs health | 22:46 |
| berndj | it's really annoying though, RougeR, and counterproductive | 22:46 |
| RougeR | yeah, but its true | 22:46 |
| RougeR | i wish it wasnt | 22:46 |
| RougeR | but it being annoying does not make it less true | 22:47 |
| eviscerate | The ones they build in the 1980's had a resolution of < 1meter | 22:47 |
| berndj | i don't care. i don't want this channel to be a pro trump vs anti trump fest | 22:47 |
| RougeR | the UK gov is lying to its people | 22:47 |
| berndj | or boris or whatever | 22:47 |
| RougeR | i dont care about trump | 22:47 |
| RougeR | oh yeah okay | 22:47 |
| berndj | just stop it please | 22:47 |
| slash_ | RougeR don't know about that? it seems here at least left and right are very united on this at least | 22:47 |
| RougeR | i wont day boris | 22:47 |
| RougeR | ill say | 22:47 |
| RougeR | uk gov | 22:47 |
| RougeR | uk gov is risking its citzens lives | 22:47 |
| ryouma | 14:45 <slash_> that's literally impossible, regardless of how good their camera's are, the atmosphere makes that impossible | 22:47 |
| ryouma | dunnof if this sheds light? https://www.techtimes.com/articles/12938/20140813/digitalglobe-launching-hi-res-satellite.htm | 22:47 |
| RougeR | on a gamble which goes against common scientific consensus | 22:47 |
| berndj | lives are at risk no matter what strategy you take | 22:47 |
| RougeR | no shit sherliock | 22:47 |
| berndj | there is no perfect solution here | 22:47 |
| slash_ | RougeR we even had joint motions in parliament by far left and far right wing parties | 22:47 |
| RougeR | but DONT lie | 22:48 |
| berndj | and you're not an oracle | 22:48 |
| ryouma | it is also a moral decision | 22:48 |
| RougeR | berndj, i dont even 100% disagree | 22:48 |
| RougeR | but they are lying | 22:48 |
| dunnp | I hope that this at least shifts the world away from the anti-intellectualism | 22:48 |
| ryouma | who dies who lives who gets serious disabled | 22:48 |
| RougeR | they are not allowing us to protect my family | 22:48 |
| RougeR | if my father dies | 22:48 |
| RougeR | if my brothers die | 22:48 |
| RougeR | because they lied about their tactics and ignored WHO advise | 22:48 |
| RougeR | you dont think thats reasonable of critisism | 22:48 |
| RougeR | going against WHO advise and against the advise of other countries is one thing, lying is another | 22:49 |
| berndj | i don't think it's reasonable to spam that criticism in a channel about the disease | 22:49 |
| RougeR | Its risky, the public deserve to know the risk | 22:49 |
| RougeR | berndj, i disagree | 22:49 |
| aradesh | LjL: maybe the countries that have had very low fatality rates, perhaps for them for whatever reason, the main demographs who have caught it so far have been young? for example, if the london tube passengers all caught it, it'd be mainly people under 50. | 22:49 |
| LjL | politics is definitely part of the reaction to this, and will shape outcomes, and i don't think i want to stop discussing the politics related to it in this channel... but i think we (probably) all want to survive and have other people survive, first and foremost, so let's remember starting to yell at each other about politics 1) makes actually exchanging information about the virus more difficult, 2) makes everyone angrier and more stressed, which does | 22:49 |
| LjL | lower immune defenses. sounds like a joke maybe but i kind of mean it | 22:49 |
| RougeR | are you higher on the food chain berndj | 22:49 |
| tinwhiskers | berndj: There was also video footage on the ground: "More than 80 [people] have been buried in this section so far, and they say only 34 deaths," he says, citing the official death toll on Feb. 28. | 22:49 |
| aradesh | today at work, someone who had been on the london tube earlier in the week was in my office, standing near me and talking a lot :| | 22:49 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers, ah, i didn't catch that | 22:49 |
| RougeR | aradesh, thats what they want | 22:49 |
| RougeR | they want the young to get sick | 22:50 |
| berndj | oh ffs stopit | 22:50 |
| aradesh | RougeR: why's that? | 22:50 |
| RougeR | how is that not bombshell news | 22:50 |
| tinwhiskers | berndj: yeah the "can be seen from space" thing was just clickbait | 22:50 |
| RougeR | aradesh, herd immunity | 22:50 |
| LjL | aradesh, i don't know. Korea had this church thing going on, about half of their infected are related to it, and i don't really know the details of that. i can find age group information about Italy, but finding it about other countries is not straightforward | 22:50 |
| RougeR | https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/13/herd-immunity-will-the-uks-coronavirus-strategy-work?CMP=Share_iOSApp_Other | 22:50 |
| aradesh | but it's no good if the young are immune, but the elderly aren't? | 22:50 |
| RougeR | berndj, i dont understand how one country deciding to roll the dice against the common advice is not acceptable to be angry and crearte a fuss over | 22:51 |
| RougeR | aradesh, thats how herd immunity works | 22:51 |
| RougeR | we cant pass it on if we are immune | 22:51 |
| berndj | aradesh, it's good if the young are immune and reduce the R0 or whatever it's called | 22:51 |
| RougeR | its a rational tactic | 22:51 |
| aradesh | i see | 22:51 |
| aradesh | so people like me get it | 22:51 |
| RougeR | but its risky and against everyone elses tactics | 22:51 |
| aradesh | but my dad will refuse to not see me | 22:51 |
| RougeR | its the fact they are lying and rolling the dice | 22:51 |
| ryouma | (1) it makes assumptions (2) it makes value of human life decisions | 22:51 |
| RougeR | aradesh, thats the idea | 22:51 |
| berndj | being an unpopular strategy does not make it wrong | 22:51 |
| RougeR | but they are not saying that | 22:51 |
| RougeR | berndj, no it doesnt | 22:52 |
| RougeR | BUT THEY ARE LYING | 22:52 |
| RougeR | so we cannot help it work | 22:52 |
| berndj | doesn't seem like it to me? | 22:52 |
| LjL | aradesh, no, it's actually what makes herd immunity "good" (if you believe this is a good strategy, anyway). if most of the low-risk people have become immune by getting the disease (or by vaccination, but not in this case), then the virus will not find easy paths to keep infecting others, and that in turn will make non-immune at-risk people safer, because *everyone* will get the disease less. at least, at slower, more manageable rates. | 22:52 |
| slash_ | ryouma thanks, very interesting, seems I was wrong. It seems the imagery is processed to compensate for the atomospheric issues to produce a clearer picture | 22:52 |
| berndj | i've been seeing stories about this UK herd immunity thing for 2 days now | 22:52 |
| aradesh | why have they chosen a picture of boris johnson looking like he's doing a nazi salute? lol | 22:52 |
| LjL | aradesh, but i have no idea how/whether the government intends to protect the people actually at risk until herd immunity has been achieved... | 22:52 |
| RougeR | when the government is sayuing "there is no evidence stopping events will help stop the spread" but actually they want it to spread for heard immunity reasons | 22:52 |
| RougeR | that is wrong | 22:52 |
| python476 | here's some hand sanitizer for you https://twitter.com/iandonald_psych/status/1238518371651649538 | 22:52 |
| python476 | woops | 22:53 |
| python476 | https://youtu.be/W6FbUiiwutQ?t=1005 | 22:53 |
| RougeR | berndj, you have to understand, this government has lied and manipulated us for 10 years | 22:53 |
| aradesh | maybe i should continue going to work then? until they tell me not to | 22:53 |
| RougeR | our health care system is on its knees | 22:53 |
| RougeR | they keep lying | 22:53 |
| RougeR | we dont trust them | 22:53 |
| berndj | ok ok take it to ##politics maybe | 22:53 |
| RougeR | nmo | 22:53 |
| RougeR | this is releveant | 22:53 |
| RougeR | and highly so | 22:53 |
| slash_ | ryouma do we have images from these kinds of satellites from Iran? | 22:53 |
| ryouma | dunno | 22:53 |
| RougeR | you can disagree, but you have no more weight in this channel than i do | 22:53 |
| RougeR | if you want me to stop talking about it, kick me | 22:53 |
| LjL | aradesh, i don't know, what is your goal? complying with the government strategy? i can't tell you what you should do, because it depends on what you want to achieve :P | 22:54 |
| slash_ | no need to kick anyone as long as people act respectable to eachother | 22:54 |
| RougeR | this is the lives of 100,000s of people | 22:54 |
| slash_ | we can disagree all we like | 22:54 |
| aradesh | LjL: well.. i strongly suspect i personally won't die or suffer major problems from getting it | 22:54 |
| RougeR | people are going to be emotive on this topic | 22:54 |
| aradesh | it's just i don't want to pass it onto other vulnerable people | 22:54 |
| aradesh | like my parents and grandparents | 22:55 |
| aradesh | though, i suspect my dad is more likely to get it than me. he'll take absolutely no precautions | 22:55 |
| aradesh | never washes his hands | 22:55 |
| aradesh | will continue to go out | 22:55 |
| aradesh | my mother also works in a supermarket... | 22:56 |
| LjL | aradesh, even after everyone's been told (ordered) to stay home here, they're still out and about... many of them, anyway | 22:56 |
| LjL | aradesh, that's... not a great line of work to be in at this time | 22:56 |
| slash_ | aradesh they do the same thing to my sisters, she had contact with a coronavirus patient, but she is not allowed to stay home from work until she gets sick, she works in a restaurant lol | 22:57 |
| slash_ | aradesh sister*, not sisters, I only have one lol | 22:57 |
| M_[m]4 | woah, I thought the brit herd immunity thing was a joke | 22:57 |
| tinwhiskers | r'oh roh. My server can no longer connect to worldometers.info | 22:57 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, b&? | 22:58 |
| slash_ | the doctor recommend to stay home though, but her boss disagrees | 22:58 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, it's not really responding for me either | 22:58 |
| tinwhiskers | oh. that's good news. It's working fine for me in a browser here in Tonga | 22:58 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, downforeveryone says it's up, though | 22:59 |
| tinwhiskers | hrm | 22:59 |
| tinwhiskers | I'll try again soon | 22:59 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, also now it loaded just fine. no idea what they're behind, cloudflare, own load balancers | 23:00 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh, I can connect again from the server too. phew | 23:00 |
| tinwhiskers | Turns out they're putting some comments in their table that contains extra cells, so my parser is now getting the wrong values in some cases. I just need to strip out the comments before parsing. | 23:01 |
| slash_ | you can read their database directy? | 23:03 |
| slash_ | or some sort of API? | 23:03 |
| LjL | don't ask don't tell? :P | 23:03 |
| slash_ | yes that is similar to the documentation of many API's I work with LjL :( | 23:04 |
| slash_ | validation error? 500. server issue? 500. wrong time of the day? 500 | 23:06 |
| LjL | slash_, when there's an earthquake that involves a bit too many people, i occasionally have to solve a captcha for twitter to confirm that i'm not a bot. that is, that i am a bot. but with a human behind the bot. or something. | 23:07 |
| slash_ | b2b API's are terrible | 23:07 |
| slash_ | LjL well how do I know you're not a bot though? | 23:08 |
| LjL | slash_, you don't, but i pass the turing test, so i am a good enough conversation partner anyway | 23:09 |
| slash_ | LjL for all I know you're just some elaborate AI run by Russians! | 23:09 |
| LjL | nyet | 23:09 |
| slash_ | LjL good bot | 23:09 |
| slash_ | lol | 23:09 |
| LjL | %compliment ljl | 23:09 |
| Brainstorm | ljl, has anyone ever told you about the discriminable meaningfulness you take so okay? | 23:09 |
| berndj | LjL, but can you get the virus? | 23:10 |
| slash_ | maybe we are this virus? | 23:11 |
| LjL | berndj, maybe the virus will eventually mutate into a form that's capable of infecting both humans and bots. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polyglot_(computing) | 23:12 |
| berndj | ah, sars-cov-2 is actually autoconf | 23:13 |
| slash_ | hmmm, maybe we should install Linux in humans, just for some added security | 23:13 |
| slash_ | Coronavirus is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported. | 23:15 |
| tinwhiskers | %cases united kingdom | 23:17 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1369 cases (now 145644), +22 deaths (now 5420), +1 recoveries (now 71001) 🔶 US: +277 cases (now 2269), +7 deaths (now 48) 🔶 Spain: +898 cases (now 5232), +11 deaths (now 133) 🔸 Albania: +10 cases (now 33) 🔸 Argentina: +1 cases (now 31), +1 deaths (now 2) 🔸 Armenia: +2 cases (now 8) 🔸 Australia: +43 cases (now 199) 🔸 Belgium: +3 cases (now 559) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 18) 🔸 C | 23:17 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 798 cases, 11 deaths (1.4% of cases), 18 recoveries as of March 13, 22:15Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 23:17 |
| slash_ | Spain is quikcly escalating | 23:18 |
| LjL | %title https://www.militarytimes.com/news/coronavirus/2020/03/13/national-guard-activated-to-combat-coronavirus-spread-in-six-states-more-to-follow/ | 23:18 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From www.militarytimes.com: National Guard activated to combat coronavirus spread in six states, more to follow | 23:18 |
| tinwhiskers | slash_: That's a correction due to worldometers.info just coming back online | 23:18 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers it says +2086 for Spain now on the website, is that incorrect? | 23:19 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, you should be able to type just "uk" now by the way, i added a short hardcoded list of synonyms | 23:19 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases united kingdom | 23:19 |
| tinwhiskers | what am I doing wrong here? | 23:19 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases spain | 23:19 |
| slash_ | I think it's just uk for united kingdom | 23:20 |
| tinwhiskers | !cases uk | 23:20 |
| slash_ | guess not lol | 23:20 |
| slash_ | !cases united kingdom | 23:20 |
| tinwhiskers | it's "united kingdom" in the csv file | 23:20 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: ^ | 23:21 |
| slash_ | !cases "united kingdom" | 23:21 |
| Andrei[m] | try this | 23:21 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, slash_: i can only speak for my bot, the % one... i put "uk" as a synonym for "united kingdom" there | 23:21 |
| slash_ | !cases brexit | 23:21 |
| LjL | %cases uk | 23:21 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 798 cases, 11 deaths (1.4% of cases), 18 recoveries as of March 13, 22:15Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 23:21 |
| tinwhiskers | that's what you'd expect if it can't find it but it doesn't respond at all | 23:21 |
| tinwhiskers | oh | 23:22 |
| tinwhiskers | crap. wrong bot | 23:22 |
| tinwhiskers | thanks LjL | 23:22 |
| slash_ | LjL's bot working at least :p | 23:22 |
| Andrei[m] | !cases "UK" | 23:22 |
| berndj | !cases england | 23:22 |
| slash_ | oi bruv, we got a fuckload a cases init | 23:22 |
| berndj | i saw a map earlier where there just weren't any dots on the UK | 23:22 |
| Andrei[m] | Does it do US states, I wonder | 23:23 |
| Andrei[m] | !cases Minnesota | 23:23 |
| Andrei[m] | Bullshit there's fucking 10 | 23:23 |
| slash_ | 798 cases for UK on worldometers website | 23:23 |
| LjL | yes, but can we keep the bot calls to a reasonable amount? i don't know about CovBot[m] but Brainstorm does respond in PM | 23:23 |
| berndj | what is it doing that it's taking so long to give the result? doing a web query for each request? | 23:23 |
| slash_ | +208 today | 23:23 |
| Andrei[m] | berndj, most likely | 23:24 |
| LjL | berndj, in a word, yes | 23:24 |
| LjL | but so does Brainstorm and it usually responds quickly... | 23:24 |
| berndj | do u even cache bro | 23:24 |
| slash_ | worldometers seems to be down a few times a day | 23:24 |
| slash_ | maybe some result caching? i.e. save last result for country or something | 23:24 |
| tinwhiskers | the data collection program will use the previous results from worldometer if it's unavailable when it checks | 23:25 |
| slash_ | ah alright | 23:25 |
| LjL | berndj, i do cache but the policy is far from aggressive, so chances are unless you call it just twice in a row, it'll make two calls | 23:25 |
| LjL | that's the bot's caching policy for everything, not specific to covid, and for other things i do need fresh results | 23:26 |
| tinwhiskers | the csv is not big and it's not being called enough to be a concern | 23:26 |
| berndj | as long as the bot doesn't get throttled by the data provider | 23:26 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers *is* the data provider | 23:27 |
| slash_ | idk about the code, but maybe an idea is to have a background process fetch the data like every 15 min, and the bot just pulls from its own db? | 23:27 |
| tinwhiskers | slash_: yes, it fetches data every 15 minutes and updates a csv file | 23:27 |
| LjL | i believe we have a floating ToS arrangement, where if he kicks my bot that means it's polling too much | 23:27 |
| tinwhiskers | heh | 23:27 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers ahh alright! | 23:27 |
| slash_ | winwhiskers why a csv though? isn't a simple sql database easier? | 23:28 |
| LjL | not for polling over http, and not for me | 23:28 |
| tinwhiskers | no | 23:28 |
| LjL | the thing here is, tinwhiskers runs https://offloop.net/covid19/ which grabs data from Magical Sources using Magical Methods and *both* presents it on its charts, and provide the bots with a CSV file to query | 23:29 |
| berndj | BREAKING: Kekistan renames itself '||(DROP TABLE countries)||' | 23:29 |
| LjL | as long as the data grabbing happens in a way that doesn't get him banned by his sources, it'll be all good | 23:29 |
| berndj | yeah that's what i was referring to | 23:29 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers well, I do not like working with csv files personally, I always find a db of some sorts to be much more reliable, but maybe I am biased due to my experience | 23:30 |
| tinwhiskers | it syncs John Hopkins github and the italian github, then it loads those, it then gets a json file from JH arcgis and updates any newer values. then covid19info.live, the worldometers.info. If any data sources fail it also compares values to the last time it ran to see if any of those were higher and uses those if so. | 23:31 |
| tinwhiskers | the john hopkins data and italian data is in csv for a start | 23:31 |
| slash_ | not trying to critize tinwhiskers | 23:32 |
| slash_ | you've already done WAY more than I've done :p | 23:32 |
| tinwhiskers | well, there's no a lot to it. The only effort is keeping up with changes sites make. scraping web sites is notoriously unreliable. | 23:33 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers yes scraping can cause a lot of issues | 23:34 |
| tinwhiskers | but since that's the only way I can access the data from covid19live and worldometers (which is the most up-to-date) I don't have a lot of choice. | 23:34 |
| greyman | %data turkey | 23:35 |
| Brainstorm | greyman: In all areas, Turkey, there are 5 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 13, 22:15Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data. | 23:35 |
| berndj | tinwhiskers, are you running covid19info.live and worldometers, or are you using them? | 23:35 |
| tinwhiskers | berndj: not, just using them | 23:35 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers worldometers states in their faq that they do provide data in json, but you need to request it through their contact form | 23:35 |
| tinwhiskers | *no | 23:35 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers i suspect it costs money though | 23:35 |
| tinwhiskers | slash_: oh, nice. I didn't know that | 23:36 |
| slash_ | tinwhiskers https://www.worldometers.info/licensing/faq/ | 23:36 |
| tinwhiskers | Not sure I want to risk doing that and becoming visible to them | 23:36 |
| slash_ | crl+f api on that page | 23:36 |
| slash_ | use a throw away gmail/hotmail email for contact | 23:36 |
| tinwhiskers | could do | 23:37 |
| slash_ | oh wait, it's an on page form | 23:37 |
| slash_ | i'll send them a message, I'll let you know if it;s anything useful tinwhiskers | 23:37 |
| tinwhiskers | thanks | 23:37 |
| slash_ | sent them a message asking about it and potential costs | 23:39 |
| berndj | don't negotiate against yourself! | 23:40 |
| LjL | https://www.catalannews.com/politics/item/government-announces-lockdown-on-whole-of-catalonia | 23:45 |
| berndj | so so mixed feelings about this uk "herd immunity" strategy | 23:47 |
| adventurer | it's not really their strategy is it? | 23:48 |
| berndj | LjL, how are smoking rates in italy? | 23:48 |
| adventurer | surely they have been misunderstood?! | 23:48 |
| berndj | adventurer, i believe it is | 23:48 |
| LjL | berndj, i actually don't know, but i think pretty high compared to european average, yet not as bad as say greece | 23:48 |
| berndj | i've seen several mainstream sources report it, and no denials | 23:48 |
| LjL | also stark difference between men and women, although the gap is narrowing | 23:48 |
| adventurer | maybe they were just saying that would be a thing IF everyone got it but not that everyone should get it. ideally we slow this as much as possible until we get the vaccine available | 23:48 |
| berndj | LjL, i was there in, i think, 2004, and it seemed like EVERYONE smoked. has it reduced since then? | 23:49 |
| berndj | adventurer, what i'm getting from it all is that, realistically, it's impossible to contain it, so the remaining option is to "flatten the curve" | 23:50 |
| LjL | berndj, subjectively, yes, after smoking ban laws (not necessarily because, but after, i dunno it correlation implies causation here) i've sometimes been in the street thinking "how come i haven't noticed anybody smoking?" | 23:50 |
| adventurer | maybe they were just mentioning the phanoninum of herd immunity that would occur not that we should aim for that...we should aim for stopping the spread as much as possible | 23:50 |
| berndj | i have fond memories of semi backpacking through italy | 23:50 |
| adventurer | phenomenon | 23:50 |
| berndj | adventurer, the thinking, i think (heh) is that you can *slow* the spread, but you can't stop it | 23:51 |
| adventurer | we should get herd immunity from the vaccine when it comes and we should try to stop this as much as possible until then | 23:51 |
| slash_ | I like southern Europe for just walking and traveling | 23:51 |
| LjL | berndj, a rough Wikipedia table puts us between Spain and Switzerland, in 2016 | 23:51 |
| adventurer | hmm | 23:51 |
| slash_ | here everything is flat, you walk for an hour it's always the same view lol | 23:51 |
| adventurer | where are you slash_ | 23:52 |
| slash_ | but then the Chinese come here and they are "OMG ITS SO FLAT AMAZING" | 23:52 |
| slash_ | so I guess it's what you're used to | 23:52 |
| slash_ | adventurer netherlands | 23:52 |
| berndj | something like that the total number of people who get infected, over all time, is the same no matter what you do. the idea is to manage numbers so that a) it doesn't overwhelm the public health system (# of beds etc.), while b) also getting everyone through the meat grinder before the next winter (which brings other, new disease loads like the next flu) | 23:52 |
| LjL | %tr Per quanto riguarda l'Italia, dati del 2015 e 2016 riportano che i fumatori in Italia sono circa 11,9 milioni, ossia il 22% della popolazione, una percentuale che rimane prevalentemente stabile da circa 8 anni e che è incrementata di poco dal 2015 al 2016 con la percentuale della popolazione maschile che è passata dal 25,1% del 2015 al 27,3% del 2016, e quella della popolazione femminile che è passata dal 16,9% del 2015 al 17,2% del 2016. | 23:52 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: As for Italy, data from 2015 and 2016 report that smokers in Italy are around 11.9 million, or 22% of the population, a percentage that has remained mostly stable for about 8 years and has increased slightly since 2015 to 2016 with the percentage of the male population that went from 25.1% in 2015 to 27.3% in 2016, and that of the female population that [... want %more?] | 23:52 |
| adventurer | oh yeah i heard it was very flat there | 23:52 |
| adventurer | i like the tulips | 23:52 |
| berndj | adventurer, what if no vaccine becomes available until R0 overwhelms your health system? then you're rekt | 23:53 |
| RougeR | wtf is up with john campbell | 23:53 |
| RougeR | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYTFk34nhoI | 23:53 |
| slash_ | tulips are from Turkey originally, it's kinda funny it is associated with the netherlands haha | 23:53 |
| RougeR | is someone holding a gun to his head | 23:53 |
| berndj | LjL, i'm assuming that smoking significantly worsens your prognosis for covid19? | 23:53 |
| slash_ | netherlands used tulips to create a financial crisis though | 23:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 22:50 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Buonasera a tutti, ecco il vostro recap per il 13 marzo. → https://is.gd/Y4FcDN | 23:54 |
| tinwhiskers | %more | 23:54 |
| Brainstorm | tinwhiskers, [...] went from 16.9% in 2015 to 17.2% in 2016. (MyMemory, Google) → https://paste.ee/p/TU0k6 | 23:54 |
| berndj | slash_, we have streets with more elevation change than your whole country :p | 23:55 |
| tinwhiskers | lol | 23:55 |
| slash_ | berndj I am sweating just thinking of walking down those streets :P | 23:55 |
| LjL | berndj, people here have argued for that somewhat convincingly, but indirectly. like, if you look at the main "comorbidities" that tend to result in death, those are all things that are also correlated with smoking. and then there is the big difference in male vs female rates, which could be explained by various other things for sure, but smoking is a pretty obvious one | 23:55 |
| berndj | LjL, the main one i imagine is smokers vs non-smokers' likelyhood of getting pneumonia | 23:56 |
| berndj | i don't think i've ever had pneumonia. whereas my smoker friends apparently have it like every second tuesday | 23:57 |
| slash_ | the netherlands does have mountains btw | 23:57 |
| LjL | well i smoked for 15 years and never got pneumonia, but also i was pretty young | 23:57 |
| berndj | you mean "hills" :p | 23:57 |
| slash_ | they are both in the caribbean though., | 23:57 |
| berndj | oh haha touche | 23:57 |
| LjL | berndj, when i talk about the alps to my indian pal who sometimes hikes in the himalayas, he calls mine "hills" | 23:58 |
| azbycx | Does anyone know why the John Hopkins site is reporting a lower number of people infected in the US than other sources? | 23:58 |
| LjL | azbycx, no single source is completely up to date | 23:58 |
| python476 | I wonder which small islands will have zero infections | 23:58 |
| LjL | the ones with zero population | 23:58 |
| berndj | omg hiking up the one mountain next to bressanone is one of my fav memories | 23:58 |
| tinwhiskers | azbycx: it's only updated every 24 hours and is currently in a state of flux with merging data between counties and states. It's a real mess. | 23:58 |
| slash_ | berndj highest natural point is 322m | 23:58 |
| berndj | monte telegrafo or something | 23:58 |
| slash_ | partially it is graves | 23:59 |
| azbycx | But yesterday it was 1500+ today it is showing 1268 | 23:59 |
| azbycx | Some states it said had infected people are now blank. | 23:59 |
| slash_ | for some reason people in the past liked burying people on top of hills | 23:59 |
| LjL | berndj, not familiar. my family has a place in the alps near to where lombardy meets trentino | 23:59 |
| tinwhiskers | azbycx: yeah. They're screwing all sorts of stuff at at the moment. They give us a new surprise every day | 23:59 |
| azbycx | Was wondering if it is intentional. | 23:59 |
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