| Brainstorm | New from ##covid-19 Zotero group: Bivalent booster is 4x better against BA.5 in older adults, Pfizer says: Type Web Page Author Beth Mole URL https://arstechnica.com/science/2022/11/bivalent-booster-is-4x-better-against-ba-5-in-older-adults-pfizer-says/ Date 11/4/2022 Accessed 2022-11-04 23:04:39 Language en-us [... want %more?] → https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/JSEA2HJE | 00:08 |
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| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: Impact of hospital strain on excess deaths during the COVID‐19 pandemic: when ICU bed occupancy reaches 75% of capacity, there are an est. 12,000 additional excess deaths; when hospitals exceed 100% of their ICU [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/ymdgkk/impact_of_hospital_strain_on_excess_deaths_during/ | 00:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: King's study provides vital information to guide COVID-19 vaccine development: The researchers examined antibodies from people who had recovered from COVID-19 in multiple countries. → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/ymdrgr/kings_study_provides_vital_information_to_guide/ | 00:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from Eric Topol on Substack: Daily pandemic briefing, 4 November 2022: Today, the CDC updated the case attribution by variants with BQ.1.1—the main one of concern here—at 19%, and combined with BQ.1 at 35%, not dissimilar to where BA.5 is now (39%) that has faded considerably. While there are other [... want %more?] → https://erictopol.substack.com/p/daily-pandemic-briefing-4-november | 00:55 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for North Dakota, United States: +967 cases since 6 days ago | 01:01 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Slovakia: +414 cases since 14 hours ago — Canada: +1181 cases since 7 hours ago | 02:03 |
| de-facto | %title https://investors.biontech.de/news-releases/news-release-details/pfizer-and-biontech-announce-updated-clinical-data-omicron | 02:32 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto, the URL could not be loaded | 02:33 |
| de-facto | "Bivalent booster elicited approximately 4-fold higher neutralizing antibody titers against Omicron BA.4/BA.5 sublineages compared to the original COVID-19 vaccine in individuals older than 55 years of age " | 02:33 |
| de-facto | LjL | 02:34 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.scmp.com/news/china/diplomacy/article/3198513/coronavirus-mainland-china-set-approve-biontech-vaccine-foreign-residents | 02:41 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.scmp.com: Coronavirus: mainland China set to approve BioNTech vaccine for foreign residents | South China Morning Post | 02:41 |
| de-facto | %title https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/scholz-secures-agreement-allowing-expats-china-use-biontech-covid-19-vaccine-2022-11-04/ | 02:44 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From www.reuters.com: German expats in China will have access to BioNTech vaccine, says Scholz | Reuters | 02:44 |
| de-facto | %title https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1010367 | 02:58 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From journals.plos.org: Exome-wide association study to identify rare variants influencing COVID-19 outcomes: Results from the Host Genetics Initiative | PLOS Genetics | 02:58 |
| de-facto | %title https://journals.plos.org/plosgenetics/article?id=10.1371/journal.pgen.1010253 | 02:59 |
| Brainstorm | de-facto: From journals.plos.org: COVID-19 and systemic lupus erythematosus genetics: A balance between autoimmune disease risk and protection against infection | PLOS Genetics | 02:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Science: science: Accumulation of mutations in antibody and CD8 T cell epitopes in a B cell depleted lymphoma patient with chronic SARS-CoV-2 infection → https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/ymhwba/accumulation_of_mutations_in_antibody_and_cd8_t/ | 04:21 |
| Brainstorm | New from This Week In Virology: TWiV 951: Clinical update with Dr. Daniel Griffin: In his weekly clinical update Dr. Griffin discusses Influenza incidence and vaccine effectiveness during the southern hemisphere influenza season in Chile, Nirsevimab for prevention of RSV infection in healthy late-preterm and term infants, severe [... want %more?] → https://www.microbe.tv/twiv/twiv-951/ | 05:18 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Germany: +38859 cases, +207 deaths since a day ago | 06:00 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Lombardy, Italy: +19798 cases, +102 deaths since 6 days ago — Veneto, Italy: +14204 cases, +51 deaths since 6 days ago — Lazio, Italy: +11994 cases, +20 deaths since 6 days ago — Piedmont, Italy: +10062 cases since 6 days ago | 07:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from Il Sole 24 Ore: (translated) Over 15 million vaccines in the fridge, but the fourth doses collapse: -35% in 7 days: In the last week, we have progressed at a rate of less than 25 thousand doses per day, but the audience to be protected is still 13 million → https://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/oltre-15-milioni-vaccini-frigo-ma-quarte-dosi-crollano-35percento-7-giorni-AEgEiLEC | 08:06 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Venezuela: +84 cases, +1 deaths since a day ago | 08:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV: Fact Check: "A large study, published in JAMA in July 2022, found that vaccinated individuals were less likely to experience strokes after infection with COVID-19 than those who were unvaccinated, suggesting that [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/CoronaVirus_2019_nCoV/comments/ymmu1j/fact_check_a_large_study_published_in_jama_in/ | 09:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from Retraction Watch: Weekend reads, double edition: Science’s ‘nasty Photoshopping problem’; Dr. Oz’s publication ban; image manipulation detection software: Would you consider a donation to [... want %more?] → https://retractionwatch.com/2022/11/05/weekend-reads-double-edition-sciences-nasty-photoshopping-problem-dr-ozs-publication-ban-image-manipulation-detection-software/ | 12:39 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for China: +5768 cases, +18 deaths since 19 hours ago | 13:03 |
| LjL-Matrix | de-facto: also given the new data, if someone had a 4th shot around the middle of August, would you book a 5th for the middle of November, or better wait longer? (They probably can't, but just in case) | 13:09 |
| -Bridgestorm- 🏠 Temblor! Sismo! Earthquake! 5.5 M tremor, registered by EMSC,alomax, with 46 reports, 7 early, occurred 5 minutes ago (12:12:39 UTC), during daytime, Tupungato, Argentina (-33.33, -69.02) ± 40 km likely felt 220 km away (in Villa Nueva, Las Heras, Mendoza, Luján de Cuyo, Godoy Cruz, Rodeo de la Cruz…) by 627800 people (www.seismicportal.eu) | 13:18 | |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: At one of Earth's most remote research stations, Covid is still a problem → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/ymrdqv/at_one_of_earths_most_remote_research_stations/ | 13:54 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Hong Kong: +5111 cases, +18 deaths since a day ago — Philippines: +1232 cases, +29 deaths since 23 hours ago | 13:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: CDC warns of tough winter as flu, RSV and covid collide → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/ymrh5f/cdc_warns_of_tough_winter_as_flu_rsv_and_covid/ | 14:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Ultrafast inactivation of SARS-CoV-2 with 266 nm lasers → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/ymtmpo/ultrafast_inactivation_of_sarscov2_with_266_nm/ | 14:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: China to maintain zero-COVID policy: Measures should be fine-tuned to better help vulnerable people, officials say. → https://www.politico.eu/article/china-maintain-zero-covid-policy/ | 14:41 |
| de-facto | LjL-Matrix, RKI recommends a gap of 3-6 months after the last "immunologic event" (in regards to SARS-CoV-2 antigen) | 16:59 |
| de-facto | the two extremes would be: 1) boosting too soon will just re-activate the immune response that was raised against the previous immuno-event in regard to that antigen, e.g. antibody levels rise without broadening the diversity in antigenic binding 2) the previous immune response already is completely forgotten and the immune system can learn everything new about the antigen exposure, almost as if it was naive | 17:01 |
| de-facto | in reality it will be somewhere there in between those two extremes, certainly the immune systems plasticity (in terms of ability to learn *new* antigenic epitopes) will increase with time after the last immuno-event for that specific antigen | 17:02 |
| de-facto | so in general id say the longer the gap the better for learning new things, but also it has to be taken into account that protection is required during certain (seasonal) episodes, yet id think August is not too far away | 17:03 |
| de-facto | it always depends on the individual case | 17:04 |
| de-facto | why do they want to get another booster only 3 months later? any medical special reason for that? | 17:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: A comparative characterization of SARS-CoV-2-specific T cells induced by mRNA or inactive virus COVID-19 vaccines → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/ymysp3/a_comparative_characterization_of/ | 17:34 |
| LjL-Matrix | <de-facto> "why do they want to get another..." <- Because back in August (actually it was late July, I remembered wrong) they didn't get the bivalent yet, and now we know that after all the bivalent ISNA fair bit better. Anyway I checked and they are eligible but only after 4 months, so around the end of November | 17:38 |
| de-facto | if there is not a special medical reason, imho it does not really make sense to boost that early again, it probably mostly will just increase the response they had to their monovalent booster in August | 17:42 |
| de-facto | the next variant most likely will evade the widespread immunity raised against the BA.5 wave anyhow and protection against severe progressions also should be given by the monovalent shots | 17:44 |
| de-facto | i think too many shots are not good | 17:44 |
| LjL-Matrix | I think too many identical shots are not good and risk imprinting, but we can't go back and undo their monovalent 4th, besides they got it at a time when the risk was high so it was the logical choice. But if they don't get anything else by December, they won't be protected very much against anything, and I think this year they plan on a family Christmas like before 2020 | 17:59 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Chile: +8990 cases, +52 deaths, +47212 tests since a day ago | 18:09 |
| de-facto | LjL-Matrix, its not so much about the identical antigen but more about letting the immune system forget how it reacted to the previous shot | 18:20 |
| de-facto | i think if you get your bilavent too early after your monovalent it would just bring up the cells that already reacted against the monavalent in recent past | 18:20 |
| de-facto | and yet repeating the same shot in rapid sequence will increase immune imprinting most likely | 18:21 |
| LjL | still, i've seen the "4 months" as a generally agreed-upon timeframe in so many places | 18:22 |
| LjL | sometime "3-4" | 18:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Identification of mutations in SARS-CoV-2 PCR primer regions → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/yn09k0/identification_of_mutations_in_sarscov2_pcr/ | 18:22 |
| de-facto | RKI hat its original recommendation at 6 months, then went down to 3-6 months probably due to some pressure | 18:22 |
| LjL | it probably wasn't clear yet that after 4 months, protection was nearly nil | 18:23 |
| de-facto | " they won't be protected very much against anything" I dont think so, antibody levels most likely are very high and T-cells immuno-competent against many of their epitopes on SARS-CoV-2 | 18:24 |
| LjL | antibody levels very high? O.o that's not what i saw on most things that evaluated them | 18:24 |
| LjL | not after 4 months+ | 18:24 |
| LjL | T-cells, maybe, but there's lots of people saying T-cells don't matter very much with this disease | 18:25 |
| de-facto | protection against what? infection will happen anyhow because of antigenic drift and selection in the population, severe progressions it most likely will protect with the immuno-competent T-cells id assume also after 4+ months | 18:25 |
| de-facto | i personally think one annual shot before the winter season (e.g. in the fall) with the newest antigenic signatures should suffice, but thats my own opinion | 18:27 |
| LjL | de-facto, from what i've heard, the T-cells are trained after a primary series (two shot) and remain trained | 18:27 |
| LjL | so based on what you're saying... why even get *any* other shots? | 18:27 |
| LjL | well they never got an annual shot with antigenic signatures different from Wuhan, so | 18:27 |
| de-facto | T-cells are only one part of the immune system | 18:28 |
| LjL | but you just made the claim that they are the ones protecting from severe progressions | 18:28 |
| LjL | which admittedly i've heard some other times, but i'm really not convinced, considering how much worse people who never got boosted fare | 18:29 |
| de-facto | one also can go ahead and measure antibody levels, but imho after 3 months boosting again is too ealry, that is just my intuition | 18:30 |
| de-facto | if you boost too many times it even may de-sensitize the immune system making it less reactive to that antigen | 18:31 |
| de-facto | apart from refreshing what is left of the immuno-imprinting | 18:31 |
| de-facto | i think there is some evolutionary sense to letting the immune system forget (e.g. during the summer) the antigenic signatures of last winter (for e.g. seasonal respiratory diseases) | 18:32 |
| LjL | it's 4 months, not 3 months | 18:34 |
| de-facto | those immune systems that were able to still protect from severe disease in current winter (with the knowledge they learned last winter) while at the same time being able to learn enough from the new version of the respiratory pathogen in circulation at the current winter will then also be able to protect in the next coming winter | 18:35 |
| de-facto | hence i assume there should be a selection function that optimized our immune systems to adapt to this annual pattern | 18:35 |
| de-facto | i dont have data on that but i think this would be a natural assumption to make | 18:36 |
| de-facto | I got my 3rd Wuhan-Hu-1 Moderna booster in December 21 and 9.5 months later in September i got infected with some Omicron, most likely BA.5 and I think it may still have protected me from severe progression (although i dont have an alternative reality to compare) while hopefully at the same time being able to learn what is new about that version | 18:42 |
| de-facto | actually when testing positive i was happy that my last vaccination was quite some time ago, exactly because of that reason, to be able to learn the updated antigenic signatures, while at the same time still being recent enough to protect from severe progressions | 18:43 |
| de-facto | well ok to be honest at the begin i also was a bit nervous because i never have had COVID and i was a heavy chainsmoker before the pandemic began (but did quit in early 2020), so i was happy to know that my T-cells should protect me from severe pneumonia due to the 3 shots of Moderna i got last year | 18:49 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Malaysia: +4621 cases, +1 deaths since a day ago — Israel: +1521 cases since 2 days ago | 20:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Conspiratorial thinking as a precursor to opposition to COVID-19 vaccination in the US: a multi-year study from 2018 to 2021 → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/yn63gn/conspiratorial_thinking_as_a_precursor_to/ | 22:08 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Morocco: +89 cases, +3804 tests since a day ago | 23:11 |
| Timvde | de-facto: but you told me it would be okay to get my (BA-1) booster when it was offered to me 3 months after my infection :( | 23:35 |
| de-facto | i probably told that it was the lower limit from the RKI recommendation | 23:39 |
| de-facto | btw iirc you had your infection before that booster, so if the gap was short it may have revived that immune reaction you raised against that infection with SARS-CoV-2 in the summer | 23:51 |
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