| await-further-in | <LjL-Matrix> "await-further-instructions ✓: hi..." <- Just trying to invite people to chat. No worries | 00:14 |
|---|---|---|
| LjL | await-further-in, please don't do that randomly like that | 00:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Paxlovid accelerates cartilage degeneration and senescence through activating endoplasmic reticulum stress and interfering redox homeostasis → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z6g3ti/paxlovid_accelerates_cartilage_degeneration_and/ | 00:25 |
| LjL | nooooo | 00:56 |
| LjL | please don't tell me Paxlovid does bad things :( | 00:56 |
| LjL | it's the one thing i'm excited about | 00:56 |
| LjL | lol post deleted | 00:56 |
| LjL | r/COVID19 sure has a stick up their asses | 00:56 |
| LjL | "In vivo experiments showed that intraperitoneal injection of Paxlovid for 1 week exacerbated cartilage abrasion and accelerated the development of osteoarthritis in a mouse model. " | 00:57 |
| LjL | so maybe don't inject Paxlovid into cartilage | 00:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Men infected with COVID have one third less sperm compared to uninfected men over 3 months later. Of 100 men infected and not hospitalized four had no viable sperm. Of 100 men not infected, none had this condition. → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/z6gu8i/men_infected_with_covid_have_one_third_less_sperm/ | 01:21 |
| gry | what about '3 months after vaccination' ? | 01:22 |
| gry | and how many of the people in this study were vaccinated and how many weren't | 01:22 |
| LjL | gry, generally vaccine side effects and COVID sequelae aren't studied together | 01:51 |
| LjL | but just your luck, there's this study linked in the "related" https://obgyn.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/ijgo.14135 | 01:51 |
| LjL | can't vouch on anything about it | 01:51 |
| LjL | but it basically says "makes no difference" | 01:51 |
| gry | good | 01:51 |
| gry | Completely random question, if someone develops anti-flu and anti-coronavirus vaccine, will it be good enough? do any of these things occur in humans in a useful capacity? like sometimes viruses occur inside of a human body and as long as there is balance, they do not all need to be killed | 01:53 |
| LjL | "Balance" isn't usually how viruses work in humans. In bats, maybe. | 02:06 |
| LjL | What happens with some (very common) viruses is that they *stay in humans* forever. But there's not much balance, they are still major causes of cancers and other things. Sure, it doesn't happen to most people, fortunately, but since almost everybody has them, it's still a high disease burden. | 02:07 |
| LjL | Hence: HPV vaccinations, chickenpox vaccination, herpes and shingles vaccination, perhaps in a near future, EBV vaccination | 02:07 |
| LjL | EBV has recently been found to be necessary for multiple sclerosis to develop. That's a staggering finding. | 02:08 |
| LjL | Sure, most people have EBV, and most people don't develop MS... | 02:08 |
| gry | LjL, there was example, streptococci (Sp?) always live on the skin, but if the immune system is weakened, they can cause various skin infections | 02:08 |
| LjL | but, nobody *without* EBV develops MS; that's the finding. So a 100% effective EBV vaccine would stop MS. | 02:08 |
| LjL | gry, those are bacteria, not viruses | 02:08 |
| gry | ah | 02:08 |
| gry | what about viruses that live inside of humans? are there any? | 02:09 |
| LjL | yes, the ones I just listed | 02:09 |
| LjL | but it's not established that viruses "live" :P | 02:09 |
| LjL | (probably a bunch more, too; those are the ones I know about) | 02:09 |
| LjL | (and I always forget at least one) | 02:09 |
| LjL | oh, it's not a virus, but toxoplasma is fun | 02:09 |
| gry | I'm asking because if new vaccines are more powerful and start to target a whole category, like flu or coronaviruses, then it may be interesting to see what happens when a virus is completely kicked out from a human body. Maybe it is necessary there for some reason or another | 02:10 |
| LjL | doubtful | 02:11 |
| LjL | but we'll see, hopefully | 02:11 |
| LjL | I say hopefully because that's one of the *few* ways I see for us to do something meaningfully close to "getting rid" of COVID | 02:11 |
| LjL | and I really wouldn't mind kicking HSV, VZV and EBV out, too | 02:12 |
| gry | right | 02:12 |
| LjL | hey why not HIV | 02:12 |
| LjL | gry, so far, I can tell you one *tentative* hypothesis as to getting rid of a virus "making things worse" | 02:12 |
| gry | i'm seeing some people peacefully thinking that growing up on an animal farm among mud and animals strengthens their immune system, and i'm curious how that works compared with being vaccinated against all sorts of things and staying away from such an environment they describe | 02:12 |
| LjL | gry, it appears that the average age for getting shingles is getting lower and lower. younger people are getting it | 02:12 |
| LjL | gry, shingles is caused by the same virus as chickenpox (VZV) | 02:13 |
| gry | doesnt everyone have a vaccine agaisnt it | 02:13 |
| LjL | gry, today, all children in the developed world take a vaccine against chickenpox, but that wasn't the case in the past (I had chickenpox for example) | 02:13 |
| LjL | so in the past, it was normal for adults to often be exposed to children who had chickenpox and were contagious | 02:13 |
| LjL | the hypothesis is that those were "reminders" to the immune system that it still needed to deal with the VZV in their own bodies forever | 02:14 |
| LjL | without those reminders, the immune system is more likely to forget, and you get shingles | 02:14 |
| LjL | note again: VZV stays in your body forever, once you catch it, period | 02:14 |
| gry | yeah it would be nice to know how to lenthen immunity without re-vaccinating, or learn to make vaccines in more and more cities and towns in the world so that 'supply issues' do not cause big trouble | 02:14 |
| LjL | but for many decades after giving you chickenpox, nothing happens, until it comes back as shingles | 02:14 |
| LjL | <gry> doesnt everyone have a vaccine agaisnt it ← against what, chickenpox or shingles? it's "no" in both cases: all *children* are given a chickenpox vaccine in the developed world, but it's a relatively recent thing, and people as young as 30 may not have had it; and the vaccine for shingles is not universally available, and the most effective one (Shingrix) is very expensive | 02:15 |
| LjL | the original shingles vaccine (Zostavax) was just a lower dose of chickenpox vaccine, but it's not very effective. 50% or so | 02:16 |
| LjL | in my country, Zostavax is available free of charge to people 65 years old. not 64, not 66, you must be exactly 65, so if you missed it, tough luck. Shingrix is simply not available unless you want to spend €350 | 02:16 |
| LjL | gry, also, we have a case of completely getting rid of a virus, of course: smallpox. doesn't seem to have affected us negative, except, err, for the small monkeypox outbreak there was recently | 02:19 |
| LjL | (I relate them because getting rid of smallpox has meant we've stopped vaccinating people against it, so they were susceptible to monkeypox) | 02:19 |
| LjL | negatively* | 02:20 |
| LjL | but still, smallpox affected us in a way that's hard to imagine now, when we had no vaccine against it | 02:20 |
| pwr22 | Iirc there's lots of bits of our genome that looks like it was horizontal gene transfer from viruses | 02:24 |
| pwr22 | So whether it's good or not, they have certainly had an effect | 02:24 |
| LjL | indeed | 02:27 |
| LjL | "good" for us in the span of our lifetime and "good" for the ecosystem forever are two very different things | 02:27 |
| LjL | and those are extremes, one definitely has to define the context for "good" :P | 02:27 |
| Brainstorm | New from ##covid-19 Zotero group: The impact of COVID‐19 vaccine on sperm quality: Type Journal Article Author Shimi Barda Author Ido Laskov Author Dan Grisaru Author Ofer Lehavi Author Sandra Kleiman Author Atalia Wenkert Author Foad Azem Author Ron Hauser Author Nadav Michaan URL [... want %more?] → https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/V7B75UXA | 02:28 |
| pwr22 | Oh no | 02:32 |
| pwr22 | Not the sperm! | 02:32 |
| LjL | pwr22, gry wanted to know... won't hurt to have some studies debunking the cheapest "vaccine's bad" theories around in the Zotero, considering if they're not in the Zotero i can never find anything :P | 02:46 |
| gry | it would be interesting to know how dna became altered, i do not understand it well | 02:53 |
| gry | say i get infected with a virus, but this should not edit my genes right | 02:53 |
| pwr22 | That's a complicated question | 02:59 |
| pwr22 | There are some viruses which edit themselves into our genome as part of their strategy for reproducing | 03:00 |
| pwr22 | And there are also cases where genetic material from a virus that doesn't do that can end up incorporated into our genome by accident. | 03:02 |
| pwr22 | In similar ways, different viruses can incorporate genetic material from other viruses that happen to be infecting the same person | 03:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from ##covid-19 Zotero group: Effectiveness of Bivalent mRNA Vaccines in Preventing Symptomatic SARS-CoV-2 Infection — Increasing Community Access to Testing Program, United States, September–November 2022: Type Journal Article Author Ruth Link-Gelles URL https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/71/wr/mm7148e1.htm [... want %more?] → https://www.zotero.org/groups/covid_links/items/62E2Y9M3 | 03:06 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for New Zealand: +27047 cases since a day ago | 04:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Science: science: Scientists just made a major stride toward a hepatitis C vaccine → https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/z6mnvl/scientists_just_made_a_major_stride_toward_a/ | 05:49 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Germany: +1 cases since 2 days ago | 05:59 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Hiroshima, Japan: +3496 cases, +5 deaths since a day ago — Mie, Japan: +1762 cases since a day ago — Beijing, China: +856 cases since a day ago — Saint Petersburg, Russia: +547 cases, +14 deaths since a day ago | 07:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Cambodia: +10 cases since 23 hours ago | 08:59 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread | November 28, 2022: Please refer to our Wiki for more information on COVID-19 and our sub. You can find answers to frequently asked questions in our FAQ , where there is valuable information such as our: → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/z6qn7w/daily_discussion_thread_november_28_2022/ | 09:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from Reddit (test): nCoV: More than 500 subvariants of Omicron circulating, says WHO expert | 28NOV22 → https://old.reddit.com/r/nCoV/comments/z6tajn/more_than_500_subvariants_of_omicron_circulating/ | 11:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Shared genetic influences between blood analyte levels and risk of severe COVID-19 → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z6tqwn/shared_genetic_influences_between_blood_analyte/ | 12:10 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Science: science: Men with COVID-19 had significantly lower concentrations of sperm compared to men that were negative suggesting that COVID-19 may have a negative effect on male fertility. → https://old.reddit.com/r/science/comments/z6tur9/men_with_covid19_had_significantly_lower/ | 12:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from ScienceNews: How researchers are working to fill the gaps in long COVID data: Collaboration with patients and with researchers from many specialties is key to better understanding long COVID and managing its many symptoms. → https://www.sciencenews.org/article/researchers-fill-the-gaps-long-covid-data | 13:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Germany to China: Use Western vaccines, duh: Government spokesperson suggests Beijing should start using Western mRNA jabs to get out of the pandemic → https://www.politico.eu/article/germany-to-china-use-western-covid-coronavirus-mrna-vaccines-duh/ | 13:46 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Romania: +2387 cases, +23 deaths since 6 days ago — Afghanistan: +190 cases since 2 days ago | 14:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: Weekly Scientific Discussion Thread - November 28, 2022: This weekly thread is for scientific discussion pertaining to COVID-19. Please post questions about the science of this virus and disease here to collect them for others and clear up post space for [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z6vyn5/weekly_scientific_discussion_thread_november_28/ | 14:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: An Outbreak of SARS-CoV-2 Omicron Subvariant BA.2.76 in an Outdoor Park — Chongqing Municipality, China, August 2022 → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z6x0ze/an_outbreak_of_sarscov2_omicron_subvariant_ba276/ | 14:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from Politico: Biden administration critical of ‘zero COVID’ amid Chinese protests: The Biden administration has so far held back on issuing a larger condemnation of President Xi Jinping amid the unrest. → https://www.politico.com/news/2022/11/28/biden-administration-china-protests-zero-covid-00070924 | 15:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from Ars Technica: Cars: Rolls-Royce tests hydrogen-fueled aircraft engine in aviation world first → https://arstechnica.com/?p=1900145 | 16:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Covid deaths skew older, reviving questions about ‘acceptable loss’ → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/z6zu0q/covid_deaths_skew_older_reviving_questions_about/ | 16:53 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for China: +46447 cases since 21 hours ago — Denmark: +1826 cases, +11 deaths since 3 days ago | 17:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Latest COVID vaccine will help people 'move on' from the pandemic, White House's Jha says → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/z70egk/latest_covid_vaccine_will_help_people_move_on/ | 17:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Coronavirus: Coronavirus: Covid blood-thinner drug treatment dangerous and does not work – study → https://old.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/z70sza/covid_bloodthinner_drug_treatment_dangerous_and/ | 17:51 |
| LjL-Matrix | ublx | 18:07 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for Serbia: +590 cases, +3 deaths, +9615 tests since 23 hours ago | 19:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: Is It Long COVID, or Dementia, or Both?: Scientists are starting to confirm what doctors, patients, and their families can already see: Older patients who have had COVID-19 have a higher risk of getting dementia. → https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20221128/is-it-long-covid-or-dementia-or-both | 19:18 |
| LjL | :( | 19:39 |
| Brainstorm | New from WebMD: College Students Found Help in Personal Pandemic Stories: The COVID-19 pandemic was hard on everyone, especially during the early months of the lockdown. But college students had particularly high stress levels, with mental health effects that have remained in [... want %more?] → https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20221128/college-students-found-help-in-personal-pandemic-stories | 20:36 |
| Brainstorm | Updates for South Korea: +71476 cases, +41 deaths since a day ago — Canada: +2055 cases, +62 deaths since 2 days ago — Uzbekistan: +390 cases since 3 days ago — Dem. Rep. Congo: +366 cases, +3 deaths since 9 days ago | 21:08 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Protection against symptomatic infection with delta (B.1.617.2) and omicron (B.1.1.529) BA.1 and BA.2 SARS-CoV-2 variants after previous infection and vaccination in adolescents in England, August, 2021–March, 2022: a national, observational, [... want %more?] → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z76vye/protection_against_symptomatic_infection_with/ | 21:15 |
| Brainstorm | New from CIDRAP: Survey: Stigma, discrimination add to long-COVID hurdles: Lisa Schnirring | News Editor | CIDRAP News Nov 28, 2022 The research team was surprised at how prevalent stigma was, with levels higher in those with a clinical diagnosis. → https://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspective/2022/11/survey-stigma-discrimination-add-long-covid-hurdles | 22:23 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/COVID19: COVID19: Alarming antibody evasion properties of rising SARS-CoV-2 BQ and XBB subvariants → https://old.reddit.com/r/COVID19/comments/z7b6ym/alarming_antibody_evasion_properties_of_rising/ | 23:50 |
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