| [itchyjunk] | dunnp, for full sequence? | 00:00 |
|---|---|---|
| dunnp | yep | 00:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | wow | 00:00 |
| HeXiLeD | mefistofeles: might a be a good idea to know who are those that are willing to infect others. That is my point | 00:00 |
| dunnp | we are using nanopore sequencing | 00:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | didn't know it was that cheap already | 00:00 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: agreed. | 00:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | dunnp, do you know what these machines actually do? | 00:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2020/03/18/us-approves-abbott-labs-coronavirus-test-for-hospital-use/ | 00:00 |
| dividediff[m] | dunnp: A few dollors to sequence? After this is over could i get genetic testing for a few dollars too maybe? :p | 00:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | you put patients mucus and it figures out what part is human and what part is virus and checks if its cov-2? | 00:01 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: in NFL, canada they said something about being willing to jail ppl | 00:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | dividediff[m], they wil lcharge you $200 | 00:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | cause someone needs to make profit | 00:01 |
| dunnp | yea that is a real-time PCR machine [itchyjunk] | 00:01 |
| dunnp | or qPCR | 00:02 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: ahh, thats like 42and me prices or whtvr that company is called | 00:02 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: some other countries are going to that length. Portugal gives up to 8 years to any that violates mandatory quarantine. | 00:02 |
| v0idkr4ft[m] | when we gettin that $1000? | 00:02 |
| dunnp | dividediff[m]: no it is so cheap because the genome is so small | 00:02 |
| dunnp | human genome is a lot bigger | 00:02 |
| dividediff[m] | dunnp: TIL | 00:02 |
| [itchyjunk] | dunnp, so there was no need for automated machines thats why this didn't exist before? | 00:02 |
| HeXiLeD | aside of #wikimedia-covid and ##covid-19, are there any other chans? | 00:03 |
| dividediff[m] | Someone said america got a new testing procedure? | 00:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | 30 kBase for coronavirus? | 00:03 |
| dunnp | [itchyjunk]: no there are plenty of qPCR machines | 00:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | so why did this was get "expadited approval" from FDA? | 00:03 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: there is ##coronavirus-vox, but it's all memes | 00:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | this and few other | 00:03 |
| dunnp | any university could be running hundreds or thousands of these in parallel | 00:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | hmm, then i dont understand why these ones are special | 00:03 |
| dunnp | because there are special approvals for diagnostics versus just measurements | 00:04 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah | 00:04 |
| [itchyjunk] | these ones were approved for "diagnostics" then | 00:04 |
| dunnp | yep | 00:04 |
| dunnp | FDA approval costs a lot | 00:04 |
| [itchyjunk] | but we already had these for measurements. gotcha | 00:04 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah | 00:04 |
| cews | HeXiLeD: #coronavirus also | 00:04 |
| dunnp | but honestly the machines in the labs are probably better than these | 00:05 |
| [itchyjunk] | What makes you say that? | 00:05 |
| [itchyjunk] | Also, why can't the ones in lab be used for diagnostics in emergency? | 00:05 |
| HeXiLeD | cews: also yours? didnt you ban me from vox beucase i made a mistake posting a url? | 00:05 |
| dunnp | the fact that thousands of researchers use them | 00:05 |
| dunnp | and we dont want error in our measurements either... | 00:05 |
| HeXiLeD | cews: yah.... you did | 00:05 |
| dunnp | they should be able to be used | 00:05 |
| HeXiLeD | banned there too | 00:05 |
| cews | :) | 00:06 |
| HeXiLeD | you must fell great | 00:06 |
| dunnp | just like other RNA extraction techniques should be able to be used instead of the kits that are running out | 00:06 |
| HeXiLeD | congrats | 00:06 |
| dunnp | its stupid | 00:06 |
| tinwhiskers | dunnp: | 00:06 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah. what exactly is this kit business? | 00:06 |
| tinwhiskers | dunnp++ | 00:06 |
| [itchyjunk] | if you dont mind elaborating | 00:06 |
| tinwhiskers | Containers, swabs, reagents (including primers) measured to the right quantities | 00:07 |
| tinwhiskers | Labs have the same stuff in bulk | 00:07 |
| [itchyjunk] | which of these were they running out of? | 00:08 |
| tinwhiskers | None | 00:08 |
| dunnp | virus is like 20kb which you can sequence in a single nanopore read versus human chromosomes that are tens/hundreds of millions of bases each | 00:08 |
| tinwhiskers | They are running out of the pre-measured kits | 00:08 |
| tinwhiskers | The labs have plenty of everything | 00:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah | 00:08 |
| dunnp | yea it is something like tinwhiskers says: put 5ul of reagent A into sample, add 10ul reagent B, put through column | 00:08 |
| dunnp | spin | 00:09 |
| [itchyjunk] | holy shit, so what was with the lack of kits business? | 00:09 |
| dunnp | etc | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | [itchyjunk]: yeah, it's pretty crap | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | You have to use approved kits | 00:09 |
| dunnp | but the more traditional methods are doing something like a phenol chloroform reaction | 00:09 |
| [itchyjunk] | this is done to extract all rna in the sample mucus? | 00:09 |
| dunnp | which is really cheap and easy | 00:09 |
| dunnp | but the health department people are not trained to do that | 00:09 |
| tinwhiskers | No, extraction and sequencing are completely different from doing a pcr test | 00:10 |
| [itchyjunk] | so this kit is for pcr test? | 00:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah | 00:10 |
| [itchyjunk] | i'll google it | 00:10 |
| dunnp | this is a kit: https://www.qiagen.com/us/products/discovery-and-translational-research/dna-rna-purification/rna-purification/total-rna/rneasy-mini-kit/#orderinginformation | 00:10 |
| dunnp | but the whole idea of an approved protocol for testing by the FDA requires specific kits and specific machines | 00:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 23:05 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Frydenberg refuses to rule out nationalising airlines – latest: Treasurer says airline industry is ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to return home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 00:11 |
| [itchyjunk] | "PCR tests work by detecting specific genetic material within the virus." | 00:12 |
| [itchyjunk] | doesn't say how :( | 00:12 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: what do you want to know? | 00:13 |
| dunnp | they actually emailed all the labs asking for specific kits which I assume are the approved ones: QIAamp� Viral RNA Mini Kit, QIAamp� MinElute Virus Spin Kit or RNeasy� Mini Kit (QIAGEN), EZ1 DSP Virus Kit (QIAGEN), Roche MagNA Pure Compact RNA Isolation Kit, Roche MagNA Pure Compact Nucleic Acid Isolation Kit, Roche MagNA Pure 96 DNA and Viral NA Small Volume Kit | 00:13 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah extraction, then pcr amplifies then .. ? | 00:13 |
| dunnp | yes | 00:13 |
| [itchyjunk] | mefistofeles, how does "extraction" work, for example? | 00:13 |
| tinwhiskers | Gel to identify it | 00:14 |
| dunnp | they use qPCR to identify | 00:14 |
| [itchyjunk] | and how does the gel identify it | 00:14 |
| [itchyjunk] | :S | 00:14 |
| tinwhiskers | Err, rather, gel to confirm the presence | 00:14 |
| dunnp | extract from saliva with kit, qpcr to amplify and target the region | 00:14 |
| dividediff[m] | america got 4500 new cases. Like 2 days ago they were getting like ~2000 new cases. Are they gonna get 4500 new cases per day now or more, or is it just due to new testing? | 00:15 |
| tinwhiskers | If the dna is in there, the pcr will multiply it and it will show up in the gel | 00:15 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: probably | 00:15 |
| tinwhiskers | If there's none of the target dna/rna then the gel will show nothing from the pcr | 00:15 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: as it looks people there are still downplaying the issue. So, they will pay the price for that arrogance. | 00:16 |
| HeXiLeD | it does not look like they are being proactive | 00:16 |
| [itchyjunk] | so a dna vs rna virus would need different kit i assume. "extracting" from the sample is just some large soup of w/e is inside the cell | 00:16 |
| dunnp | that is what you'd normally do tinwhiskers, but they use qPCR to look at it instead of a gel | 00:16 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh. Ok | 00:17 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: proactivity is gone at this pt. Proactive is like 2 months ago stocking up on testing kits | 00:17 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: different primers/buffers for sure | 00:17 |
| mefistofeles | at least | 00:17 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: they're still down playing it? | 00:17 |
| fructose | dividediff[m]: There was cautioning that confirmed cases would rise as a result of increased testing | 00:17 |
| dunnp | [itchyjunk]: so kit to get the RNA, then put primers and a probe to the sequence and put in qPCR machine that measures the amount of probe-bound DNA in each PCR cycle to quantify the amount that is there | 00:18 |
| dividediff[m] | I could be wrong, but i think Italy's new cases have increases even more than a few days ago. The other day, it looked like they were reaching peak new case | 00:18 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: it never really looked like it was peaking | 00:18 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: the increase dipped a few days ago https://covid19tracker.cc/ | 00:19 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: look at pics from clearwater and general opinion about miami spring break. (2 examples) | 00:19 |
| dividediff[m] | USA is fast tracking to become #2 for corona, with italy being #1 | 00:19 |
| [itchyjunk] | I see, makes sense at high level at least | 00:19 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: agreed | 00:20 |
| HeXiLeD | it will | 00:20 |
| [itchyjunk] | but qpcr machine is just checking for a match? | 00:20 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: yea ive seen that stuff in chat here :( | 00:20 |
| dunnp | google taqman to see how it works in detail | 00:20 |
| HeXiLeD | the US will at some point surpass .eu | 00:20 |
| [itchyjunk] | but since SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 look really alike, how can it tell? | 00:20 |
| HeXiLeD | then will probably be the middle east | 00:20 |
| dunnp | but it is quantifying the amount of RNA that was there | 00:20 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: for some reason I can't get .cc URLs but there's no indication of a dip in the JH data | 00:20 |
| mefistofeles | dividediff[m]: they are still exponential, so they will still report more cases every day, if that'swhat you mean | 00:20 |
| tinwhiskers | There was one day where there was apparently no reporting | 00:20 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: piss that was prob the dip | 00:21 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: you put a primer that's unique | 00:21 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: also from observation i noticed over time where one random case would show up. then... a few more. it went state by state. Given the size of the country and the lack of care along with a delayed action. They are in it for a bad outcome. | 00:21 |
| mefistofeles | or, unique enough, at least :P | 00:22 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah, you are amplifying only cov-2 to begin with? | 00:22 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: yes | 00:22 |
| [itchyjunk] | makes sense | 00:22 |
| mefistofeles | I guess in practice is not that "pure", but essentially yes | 00:22 |
| tinwhiskers | You have a forward and a backward primer that identifies the start and end of the sequence you want to multiply | 00:22 |
| tinwhiskers | Anything that matches between those gets doubled each pcr cycle | 00:23 |
| dividediff[m] | thank fortuna that canada closed the border shuder | 00:23 |
| dunnp | exactly and with taqman there is an extra probe to a unique part of the amplified sequence so even if the PCR isn't perfect, the signal is all from the sequence you care about | 00:24 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: should be building a wall. | 00:24 |
| HeXiLeD | i will help for free | 00:24 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: we gotta stop farming pigs, that's what kicked off the LAST thing! also we should get rid of birds | 00:26 |
| dunnp | especially with the kit the whole protocol is super easy to do | 00:26 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: in a twist of fate, americans may start illegally immigrating to canada and mexico. At least mexico got a wall, that america paid for | 00:26 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: i ph3ar that | 00:26 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: heh | 00:26 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: #Fbirds | 00:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | so CDC wouldn't make the kits in months? | 00:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | and had to get FDA to drop standards | 00:27 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: they tried, but bureaucracy. | 00:27 |
| tinwhiskers | We'd be a lot safer if we just got rid of all wild animals... and farm animals... and humans | 00:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | just let the viruses live without any host | 00:28 |
| mefistofeles | tinwhiskers: humans first :P | 00:28 |
| dividediff[m] | Can anyone expplain why america was messing around for like a month with inventing testing kits instead of buying a patent from like korea? | 00:28 |
| fructose | tinwhiskers: Exactly what a superintelligent AI might conclude if we tell it to minimize suffering | 00:28 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: humans are the problem. not wild life | 00:28 |
| tinwhiskers | fructose: heh | 00:28 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 23:23 UTC: Doctors and patients wonder if the NBA is getting special treatment with coronavirus tests: Sick patients are being turned away, unable to receive tests because they simply aren't available. In a stark contrast, the NBA said that as of Wednesday, at least eight teams had been tested for the COVID-19 coronavirus. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Uik00a | 00:28 |
| dividediff[m] | #Fbirds #pigs but most of all #Fme | 00:28 |
| dividediff[m] | ha | 00:28 |
| [itchyjunk] | HeXiLeD, humans are wild life. | 00:29 |
| Spec | oh yeah, people are getting upset that famous and wealthy are getting special treatment | 00:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | Where and who? | 00:29 |
| mefistofeles | Spec: that was really expected from the US | 00:29 |
| Spec | mefistofeles: for sure | 00:29 |
| dunnp | dividediff[m]: the kits already existed - CDC wanted to use their own PCR primers for some reason | 00:30 |
| dunnp | who knows | 00:30 |
| dividediff[m] | i thought americans were often upset at the class previliages | 00:30 |
| Spec | i don't think it's terribly often | 00:31 |
| Spec | it's usually not on stark display | 00:31 |
| mefistofeles | dividediff[m]: one of them was fucked up :P | 00:31 |
| mefistofeles | sorry, dunnp ↑ | 00:31 |
| dividediff[m] | dunnp: til. my guess was they wanted it to be 'made in america' | 00:31 |
| mefistofeles | then they realized it wasn't even needed | 00:31 |
| dunnp | instead of a kit, this is probably < $1 and about an hour: https://www.protocols.io/view/rna-extraction-with-trizol-for-cells-ssheeb6 | 00:31 |
| mefistofeles | there's a nice article about it from the new yorker, it's ther in the topic resources | 00:31 |
| Spec | was that irish 15-min test claim real? | 00:31 |
| Spec | is that also one of these PCR tests | 00:32 |
| dunnp | 15 min test would be some sort of test without amplifciation | 00:32 |
| dunnp | like if you had an antibody | 00:32 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: there is an antibody test method but it doesn't work very well in the early stages of the disease so is not so useful for detecting new cases | 00:33 |
| Spec | oh, i see, so useful to check up on people who already were sick? | 00:33 |
| Spec | can an antibody test determine whether or not you're infectious? | 00:33 |
| dunnp | yea the irish test is antibodies | 00:33 |
| tinwhiskers | Good for testing to determine how many people actually ended up getting infected regardless of symptoms though so a useful research tool | 00:34 |
| dunnp | the nice thing about the qPCR test is that it can even detect just a few hundred molecules of viral RNA | 00:34 |
| dunnp | very early infection | 00:34 |
| dividediff[m] | 'idris Elba urges people not to spread conspiracy theory about black people being immune to Coronavirus' | 00:34 |
| dividediff[m] | wait who the duck thought blak ppl are immune? | 00:34 |
| python476 | dividediff[m]: blacks | 00:34 |
| python476 | surprisingly a lot of people on twitter went weird with covid | 00:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | idris Elba did it seems | 00:34 |
| python476 | nah, reddit showed a few random black people saying covid < slavery | 00:35 |
| python476 | and similar bs | 00:35 |
| dividediff[m] | python476: darnn | 00:35 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: I'm not sure. It's possible you could be infectious before you develop enough antibodies to be detected | 00:35 |
| pingveno[m] | This is when the woo goes up to 11 | 00:35 |
| pingveno[m] | <python476 "surprisingly a lot of people on "> surprisingly? | 00:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | venessa hudgins was saying it would be better to let the 1% die off instead of her staying in her house for months of something | 00:35 |
| python476 | pingveno[m]: I assumed white supremacist started the rumor | 00:35 |
| python476 | not black people themselves | 00:35 |
| dividediff[m] | python476: that was my guess too | 00:36 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]:he is not showing any symptoms | 00:36 |
| RougeR | contingo, | 00:36 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: some people have limited capacity to understand "real world impact" | 00:36 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: indeed | 00:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spec, other people drink wine and get on the internet | 00:37 |
| dividediff[m] | some black dude thought he was from fast and furious i bet: 'i'm like black superman' | 00:37 |
| Spec | i think this is a good exercise for the entire world to participate on the brink of massive, sweeping changes global warming/food supply shortages will bring | 00:37 |
| Spec | i hope we work together :) | 00:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | i hope not | 00:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | we're suppose to practice social distancing | 00:37 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: this is the planet giving a lesson to everyone | 00:37 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: dude, i was telling my gf that! | 00:37 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: well, yes, we can work together...apart :) | 00:37 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: you were saying "You think this is bad? lol just wait for next generation's major issues" | 00:38 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: the real time for fear will come with a global-warming fueled cold-war | 00:38 |
| Spec | well, maybe, but maybe not | 00:38 |
| pingveno[m] | It is a little frustrating to need to shelter in place for a threat that is basically invisible. | 00:38 |
| HeXiLeD | good point | 00:39 |
| CrystalMath | well you can also just get the virus | 00:39 |
| AimHere | pingveno[m], think of it as training for when the nuclear winter arrives and the Fallout is everywhere | 00:39 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: global warming is epxected to destabilizing afaik | 00:39 |
| CrystalMath | there won't be a nuclear winter... | 00:39 |
| HeXiLeD | practice session AimHere | 00:39 |
| pingveno[m] | Like, on the logical level I know that I need to avoid getting/spreading it, but it's not like there are piles of dead bodies outside. | 00:39 |
| pingveno[m] | The grocery store shelves may be emptying of some goods, but there's still food. | 00:40 |
| dividediff[m] | pingveno: thats a good pt, if they left the bodies in the street evyone would take it srsly... | 00:40 |
| xionbox[m] | Wow! A friend three times removed is a bar tender in New York City. He was tested positive for covid. Went to work as a bar tender THAT SAME NIGHT over the weekend! Said that "he was being cautious." People are simply NOT taking this seriously enough at all! This infuriates me sooo much | 00:40 |
| HeXiLeD | pingveno[m]: agree. | 00:40 |
| dunnp | ugh xionbox[m] | 00:40 |
| CrystalMath | if they left the seasonal flu's bodies outside, you'd be even more terrified | 00:41 |
| AimHere | A nation of Patient #31s | 00:41 |
| xionbox[m] | up | 00:41 |
| HeXiLeD | xionbox[m]: some people need to leave the planet. | 00:41 |
| AimHere | Though I think the UK is a bit similar :( | 00:41 |
| dividediff[m] | AimHere: how many ppl does the flu kill? | 00:41 |
| pingveno[m] | Lots | 00:41 |
| AimHere | dividediff[m], depends | 00:41 |
| CrystalMath | more than a thousand just today | 00:41 |
| farn | pingveno[m]: Not yet. Italy is at the point where the bodies are piling up. And the thing with exponential growth is that things can go from "everything is fine" to "holy fuck" in a couple of days | 00:41 |
| dividediff[m] | CrystalMath: how many ppl does the flu kill? | 00:42 |
| dividediff[m] | clicked the wrong name oops | 00:42 |
| CrystalMath | darsie: 1000+ daily | 00:42 |
| CrystalMath | 1,500+ daily most of the time | 00:42 |
| CrystalMath | people die, i think people should get over it | 00:42 |
| CrystalMath | one day we will all be dead | 00:42 |
| pingveno[m] | <farn "pingveno: Not yet. Italy is at t"> Yeah, and I get that. But a lot of people are bad at math. | 00:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 23:35 UTC: Republican stimulus package proposes up to $1,200 for individuals – live: Plan includes aid for small businesses but leaves notable gaps State department warns all Americans to avoid leaving country Trump sows confusion with claim drug will be ready soon Coronavirus – latest global updates See all our coronavirus [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/2triVA | 00:42 |
| dividediff[m] | CrystalMath: the flu globally 1000+ kills / day? | 00:42 |
| CrystalMath | sure we don't have to try to make it soon, but we can never avoid it fully | 00:42 |
| HeXiLeD | we have created a comfortable society that has made the individual to think that the individual is above the rest and the individual needs are more important than the rest. Now, people will have to learn how to make sacrifices and look at priorities as a whole and not as the individual | 00:42 |
| pingveno[m] | They don't have an intuitive understanding of exponential growth | 00:43 |
| CrystalMath | dividediff[m]: more than that | 00:43 |
| CrystalMath | sorry i pinged darsie but i should have pinged dividediff[m] | 00:43 |
| AimHere | dividediff[m], flu kills ~500k per year give or take | 00:43 |
| CrystalMath | 1,000 is a good day | 00:43 |
| AimHere | dividediff[m], except in bumper bonanza years where it might kill tens of millions | 00:43 |
| dividediff[m] | CrystalMath: AimHere i thought flu shots take care of most of the risk? | 00:43 |
| AimHere | dividediff[m], coronavirus looks like having one of those years | 00:43 |
| CrystalMath | dividediff[m]: nope, flu shots have a poor risk/benefit ratio | 00:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Unemployment is going to shoot up. | 00:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Food pantries probably aren't getting donations. | 00:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Hmm. | 00:44 |
| AimHere | dividediff[m], flu shots are imperfect. They tend to only go to known at-risk groups, they only apply to places with enough healthcare to have them, and sometimes the flu shots indemnify against the wrong strain | 00:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Not sure if it is, though. | 00:44 |
| CrystalMath | malaria kills twice as much as the flu, every single day | 00:44 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: last i checked a few days ago, usa unemployment 18% | 00:45 |
| dividediff[m] | food banks in my city are staffed by mostly retirees | 00:45 |
| CrystalMath | there is no malaria vaccine | 00:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | dividediff[m], don't food banks rely of consistent donations ? | 00:45 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: TO? | 00:45 |
| CrystalMath | nobody is buying toilet paper because of malaria though | 00:45 |
| dividediff[m] | AimHere: :( | 00:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | Or do they have purchase power as well? | 00:45 |
| pingveno[m] | <CrystalMath "nobody is buying toilet paper be"> Also, the rich world is much less affected by malaria. | 00:45 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: yea they do | 00:46 |
| CrystalMath | pingveno[m]: yep, entitled humans feeling entitled | 00:46 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: basically | 00:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | So the can buy enough to keep food supplies up? | 00:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | I am trying to figure out if I personally can keep it up and for how long. | 00:46 |
| CrystalMath | i don't believe i'm above malaria | 00:46 |
| CrystalMath | or even dying of malaria | 00:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | Month? two? five? ten? | 00:46 |
| pingveno[m] | <CrystalMath "pingveno: yep, entitled humans f"> Not just entitled. The people with the resources to do the research are naturally going to address their own problems first. | 00:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | Malaria isn't new. | 00:47 |
| dividediff[m] | CrystalMath: malaria is dumb, like the rich countries should just ban together and get rid of malaria in the poor countries, like theyve done in themselves | 00:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | It was a big issue at one point. | 00:47 |
| pingveno[m] | Or more specifically, their customer's problems. | 00:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | It took years to get to where we are at in the countries where the cases are low. | 00:47 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: the government would have to help a lot | 00:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | Malaria problem wasn't magically solved in developed country. | 00:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | The countries spent money on it, initially. | 00:47 |
| pingveno[m] | dividediff: My understanding is that it is more that the regions where malaria is the worst are also the poorest. | 00:48 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: whic country are you from? | 00:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | Doesn't matter. | 00:48 |
| dividediff[m] | pingveno: i heard that too. It's like mostly a tropical disease | 00:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's "whereever there is mosquito" disease. | 00:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | Zika was a problem (still is). | 00:48 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: that is almost anywhere | 00:49 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: i believe the europeans in like 1900s didn't have much malaria even wo meds | 00:49 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: dividediff[m] also gets the mosquito issue every summer | 00:49 |
| darsie | CrystalMath: ok :) | 00:49 |
| Jigsy | %data China | 00:50 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, China, there are 81156 cases, 3249 deaths (4.0% of cases), 70535 recoveries as of March 11, 02:18Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=China for time series data. Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.3% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 4.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). | 00:50 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: at least in northern territories in canada, i've heard the bugs are more numerous since they're dormant for like 8 months | 00:50 |
| Jigsy | More confirmed infections in China? | 00:51 |
| [itchyjunk] | HeXiLeD, zika could spread. | 00:51 |
| Jigsy | Oh, it hasn't been updated. | 00:51 |
| [itchyjunk] | Lot of other viruses/ disease weren't a problem because people were containing it. | 00:51 |
| Spec | pingveno[m]: i mean, there's rumors that italian military is trucking bodies in military trucks | 00:51 |
| [itchyjunk] | When world goes to shit, these have a chance to spread again. | 00:51 |
| LjL | Spec, i think it's more than rumors | 00:52 |
| Spec | pingveno[m]: so like, not sure you know, what else you need to see the "visible threat" | 00:52 |
| pingveno[m] | Spec: I saw that photo. No idea if it's real. | 00:52 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Os1TJHJ_ijc | 00:52 |
| pingveno[m] | I mean visible threat as in something that is outside my door. | 00:52 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: humans r like: 'what is containment' with corona basically | 00:52 |
| Spec | photo? | 00:53 |
| Spec | there is video -- from washington post | 00:53 |
| [itchyjunk] | I just linked to the video. | 00:53 |
| pingveno[m] | Okay, haven't seen that. | 00:53 |
| dividediff[m] | technically there is no proof that bodies are in the tuck from the vid | 00:53 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: not rumours https://metro.co.uk/2020/03/19/army-trucks-filled-bodies-overflowing-morgues-drive-streets-italy-12423685/ | 00:54 |
| pingveno[m] | You don't have to convince me. I'm following all of the precautions. | 00:54 |
| Jigsy | I'll need to buy some masks... after this entire situation ends. | 00:54 |
| dividediff[m] | Has anyone looked into buying those new reusable korea masks? | 00:55 |
| dividediff[m] | the ones that can used 20x | 00:55 |
| dividediff[m] | "Minnesota classifies grocery store workers as emergency personnel" | 00:56 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 23:48 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: Italy death toll rises to 3,405, overtaking China — from WHO at 23:48: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/domI8y | 00:56 |
| dividediff[m] | When Elon Musk is informed that ventilator shortages are not hypothetical, but exist now, he is skeptical, and asks for names of the hospitals that have the alleged shortages. | 00:56 |
| LjL | dividediff[m], i can link him to every official press conference where it's specifically stated that we don't have enough ventilators, especially in lombardy | 00:57 |
| LjL | i trust he understands italian, all-knowing as he is | 00:57 |
| pingveno[m] | A close family friend is from Italy, so we've been hearing updates occasionally from them. | 00:57 |
| aeth | Elon should just stop tweeting... | 00:57 |
| aeth | I thought he was going to? | 00:57 |
| pingveno[m] | Elon should take a ride on one of his spacecraft | 00:58 |
| pingveno[m] | Permanently | 00:58 |
| Spec | eh, we'll see what he does | 00:58 |
| dividediff[m] | earth is full go home elon ha | 00:58 |
| pingveno[m] | The Italian relatives are in a somewhat isolated village, so the virus is taking a while to reach them. | 00:58 |
| LjL | lucky them | 00:58 |
| LjL | i could be in a somewhat isolated village but then police would send me back here if they found me there | 00:59 |
| pingveno[m] | Even then, they've heard about someone in the village who has it. | 00:59 |
| LjL | with three months jail on my record, for added fun | 00:59 |
| LjL | yes, the doctor in "my" village had it | 00:59 |
| LjL | as well as a patient he treated, who apparently died | 00:59 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: i have heard P100(niosh pink) cartridges can be used for many months and while they lose effectivity against volatile organics with exposure, the filters do not degrade for ~6 months to 12 months. I have not validated this info tho | 00:59 |
| LjL | the doctor made it, wasn't *too* sick | 00:59 |
| HeXiLeD | can i post these links or going to get banned for it due to someone personal feelings? You Can Help Break the Chain of Transmission - https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/19/health/coronavirus-distancing-transmission.html | 01:00 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: do you get banned regularly? | 01:00 |
| HeXiLeD | no | 01:00 |
| HeXiLeD | never | 01:00 |
| HeXiLeD | 1 time in over a decade | 01:00 |
| Spec | then why bring up the concern? | 01:00 |
| HeXiLeD | by cews | 01:00 |
| LjL | yeah, i was also thinking, "why would someone post that with a disclaimer about being banned" | 01:00 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: good point, but does it work for viruses? | 01:00 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: yes. | 01:00 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, that channel is more, uh, i dunno, they have different views on what's okay i think | 01:00 |
| dividediff[m] | It's subscription only, so maybe thats why? | 01:01 |
| LjL | you have annoyed me sometimes, tbh. but that NYT article? it only annoys me... lol, yes, that | 01:01 |
| LjL | but i'm not going as far as banning people for posting paywalled articles :D | 01:01 |
| LjL | at best i'll tell you sorry, can't read | 01:01 |
| Jigsy | >“It feels like a year ago,” Dr. Jenkins said. | 01:01 |
| Jigsy | Probably because it was. | 01:01 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: well.. we will all annoy everyone at some point | 01:01 |
| LjL | yeah | 01:01 |
| LjL | especially these days, even though we should all be calmer instead | 01:02 |
| LjL | but it's how we are | 01:02 |
| HeXiLeD | agreed | 01:02 |
| docwon | it's only paywalled if you enable 3rd party JS | 01:02 |
| LjL | docwon, touché | 01:02 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: oh hey that good! Health care workers could use those? | 01:02 |
| HeXiLeD | i did not even noticed it was paywalled. only cared about the info on it | 01:02 |
| Jigsy | I get paywall notifications if I view websites with my adblocker on. | 01:02 |
| LjL | well it's not technically PAYwalled i guess since it asks me to make a free subscription | 01:03 |
| LjL | i just don't want to subscribe | 01:03 |
| Jigsy | A lifehack is changing from Basic Style to No Style. | 01:03 |
| Jigsy | :> | 01:03 |
| LjL | not sure what to call... registerwalled? accountwalled? | 01:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 23:59 UTC: Coronavirus: California estimates 25.5 million residents — 56% of the state — will get virus in next 8 weeks: "In the last 24 hours, we had 126 new COVID-19 cases, a 21 percent increase. In some parts of our state, our case rate is doubling every four days," Newsom wrote in a letter dated Wednesday. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/wiJrCs | 01:03 |
| LjL | mailwalled, maybe, since that's the main thing they get from you | 01:03 |
| HeXiLeD | if we are putting rules on every detail, we will be censoring ourselves on everything. Social distancing will be social mute | 01:03 |
| LjL | ... 8 weeks? | 01:03 |
| LjL | seriously? | 01:04 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, i'm specifically not making any explicit rules for this channel | 01:04 |
| LjL | ugh | 01:04 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: These cartridge/filters can help reduce inhalation exposures to certain airborne biological particles (e.g. mold, Bacillus anthracis, avian influenza, Mycobacterium tuberculosis, etc.) but cannot eliminate the risk of contracting infection, illness or disease | 01:04 |
| LjL | best time to mention that, too | 01:04 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: they are also expensive | 01:04 |
| dividediff[m] | Whats the best eqipment to wear when i have to go out of the house? Surgical mask (boughht 1 yr ago) and swim googles? | 01:05 |
| dividediff[m] | Actually i have ski goggles | 01:06 |
| berndj | are there any symptoms (or lack thereof) that can exclude a covid-19 (lay) diagnosis? | 01:06 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: best best? hazmat suit :P | 01:06 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: surgical mask can help some, no guarantee | 01:06 |
| Spec | i have read it improves chances :) | 01:07 |
| docwon | berndj, most common symptoms are fever and persistent dry cough | 01:07 |
| HeXiLeD | for $350 you can get a custom facial mask respirator | 01:07 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: unfortunately no hazmat suit at home ha | 01:07 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: yah. i feel you man | 01:07 |
| HeXiLeD | getting warmer too for ski googles | 01:08 |
| berndj | docwon, does *any* cough productivity exclude covid-19? | 01:08 |
| dividediff[m] | Do the things docs wear good enough to prevent 99% of corona infections? | 01:08 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: next time i hear of a new infectious disease, i' might buy one | 01:09 |
| docwon | i don't know | 01:09 |
| HeXiLeD | berndj: check the notice. sent you a link with info. scroll down | 01:09 |
| CrystalMath | berndj: if you have bronchitis, it could still be covid-19, as far as i know (but not a doctor) | 01:09 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i'll do it sweaty ha | 01:10 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i have a half face respirator | 01:10 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: howe about some !triggers here? ie: !symptoms and then tue user gets a notice from a bot with relevant links? easy to do with an eggdrop to avoid the need to code python | 01:11 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: docs should be wearing medical-grade N95 masks, which is different than when they wear surgeon masks due to critical supply shortages | 01:11 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: got it too. OV filters. not sure but may have to buy new filters. N100 too. | 01:11 |
| Spec | P100 acid/vapor filters is what i have | 01:11 |
| Spec | they're good for 30 days once opened | 01:12 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, i'm not adding more bots in here, but the current bot does have a "resources" feature, although i haven't used it in quite some time | 01:12 |
| LjL | still | 01:12 |
| HeXiLeD | organic vapors | 01:12 |
| Spec | yeap | 01:12 |
| HeXiLeD | mine. | 01:12 |
| LjL | i think too many people just ignore the topic link | 01:12 |
| LjL | i kind of wrote it for... someone to read | 01:12 |
| berndj | HeXiLeD, that link seems to list just one mode the disease can present, but i gather there's a LOT of variability between cases | 01:12 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: specifically, 3M 60923 | 01:12 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: n95 are dust masks? I have 1 left and 1 broken 1 | 01:12 |
| Spec | is what i have | 01:12 |
| LjL | so it would be nice if we could just refer people to that list, i think, until it's too long at least | 01:12 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: no/yes | 01:12 |
| pingveno[m] | %data oregon | 01:12 |
| Brainstorm | pingveno[m]: In Oregon, US, there are 68 cases, 2 deaths (2.9% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 19, 02:35Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 01:12 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: n95 dust masks aren't sized/fitted for dat seal, but are better than nothing | 01:12 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: link for yours? | 01:12 |
| LjL | but i think so far it's good enough to say "go there for symptoms". except, there is no good information about symptoms there, right now... but that can be mended. | 01:12 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/3M-Organic-Vapor-Acid-Gas-Cartridge-Filter-60923-P100-60-EA-Case/ | 01:13 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i don't have many | 01:13 |
| HeXiLeD | you selling? | 01:13 |
| Spec | i certainly don't have a case or 60 :P | 01:13 |
| HeXiLeD | eheh | 01:13 |
| HeXiLeD | i should get filters for mine | 01:14 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: no, not nearly enough | 01:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 00:10 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Coronavirus live news: Italy death toll rises to 3,405, overtaking China — from WHO at 00:10: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/domI8y | 01:14 |
| ubLIX | LjL: perhaps just a direct link to this image, until a better image comes along? https://ourworldindata.org/uploads/2020/03/Coronavirus-Symptoms-%E2%80%93-WHO-joint-mission-2-800x429.png | 01:14 |
| dividediff[m] | "I couldn't find any masks so I am wearing sanitary napkins on my face." | 01:15 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i hope we increase our manufacturing of surgical masks tbh, we need to stop spread more than be individually protected | 01:15 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: shouldn't we try to increase manufacturing of n95 masks since they're bettr? | 01:15 |
| HeXiLeD | n100 are even better | 01:15 |
| LjL | ubLIX, hmm i don't know, i'd like to write a few words about it also, to clarify that if you have a fever it doesn't mean 88% you have covid. i know that's obvious to you, and it's obvious to me too, but remember the pond? | 01:15 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: true, mass produce n100 | 01:16 |
| berndj | is that even possible | 01:16 |
| ubLIX | i suppose | 01:16 |
| Spec | LjL: the pond? | 01:17 |
| dividediff[m] | surgical mask, also known as a procedure mask, is intended to be worn by health professionals during surgery and during nursing to catch the bacteria shed in liquid droplets and aerosols from the wearer’s mouth and nose. They are not designed to protect the wearer from inhaling airborne bacteria or virus particles and are less effective than respirators, such as N95 or NIOSH masks, which provide better protection d | 01:17 |
| dividediff[m] | to their material, shape and tight seal. | 01:17 |
| LjL | ubLIX, also like, "shortness of breath" is a minor symptom according to that chart, but it's actually a sort of "distinguishing" symptom and a worrisome enough one that they tell you to call emergency immediately if you also have that | 01:17 |
| LjL | ubLIX, tell Spec about the pond | 01:17 |
| LjL | sorry ubLIX you clearly aren't Brainstorm, my mistake | 01:17 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: yes, exactly . everyone should wear those masks :) | 01:18 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: especially people who are handling goods/critical services | 01:18 |
| berndj | ubLIX, my frustration with all these "lists of symptoms" is that they give you no real way to distinguish covid-19 from a flu | 01:18 |
| Spec | but also people who go to grocery store with "just a slight headache" | 01:18 |
| Spec | etc | 01:18 |
| Spec | berndj: because there is no way to distinguish without a test, man. | 01:18 |
| ubLIX | ^ | 01:18 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: mine https://safetyzone-thesafetyhouscom.netdna-ssl.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/thumbnail/300x300/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/n/_/n_5500.jpg | 01:18 |
| Spec | that's why there's this whole deal about tests | 01:18 |
| dividediff[m] | For reddit; LPT: if you're rich, buy a ventilator in advance at the first sign of a new virus | 01:18 |
| berndj | ah, so i'm just asking for the (lay-)impossible? | 01:18 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: this is what you want http://www.onlinesupplyrequest.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/Resp-Pro-Full-Face-7600.jpg | 01:19 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: ah, yeah, half mask style, too | 01:19 |
| HeXiLeD | me too | 01:19 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i hesitate wearing it because i don't want to scare the general public | 01:19 |
| Spec | berndj: unfortunately at the moment, yes | 01:19 |
| berndj | ok. that's unfortunate, but i guess it is a valid answer to my Q | 01:19 |
| Spec | and yeah, full mask would be better, haha | 01:19 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: if you scare them enough maybe they'll stop going to beaches in the 1000s. But RIP the toliet paper | 01:19 |
| Albright | The pink is very stylish | 01:19 |
| Spec | except i usually use it for you know, spraying urethanes and shit | 01:20 |
| Spec | :P | 01:20 |
| HeXiLeD | pink is only for very secure men :P | 01:20 |
| Spec | berndj: it is unfortunate and highlights the pressing need for testing (and mask) production | 01:20 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: if stuff gets worse... full face is the only way to go | 01:20 |
| berndj | maybe i should go hang out in the infectious diseases ward of the local hospital and see if i get sick to figure out what i had over the last week | 01:20 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i'd rather everyone wear mask to prevent spread then protect just myself | 01:21 |
| dividediff[m] | This would help slightly https://www.amazon.com/Sporting-Style-Glasses-Glasses-Eyeglasses/dp/B07P6TZZXQ/ref=sr_1_7?dchild=1&keywords=eye+shields&qid=1584663615&sr=8-7 | 01:21 |
| ubLIX | oooooh, the pond | 01:21 |
| ubLIX | haha i was really scratching my head there LjL | 01:21 |
| berndj | Spec, yeah, in my country there's also a severe bottleneck on tests. only "high priority" persons under investigation get tested, whether free (public) or self-funded (private) | 01:22 |
| analogical | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BtN-goy9VOY | 01:22 |
| dividediff[m] | I'm surprised they have these in stock, face shield https://www.amazon.com/Adjustable-Transparent-Protective-Protects-Anti-Spitting/dp/B085X6V1V7/ref=sr_1_22?dchild=1&keywords=eye+shields&qid=1584663615&sr=8-22 | 01:22 |
| Spec | so, i've got a question i haven't seen quite addressed | 01:22 |
| Spec | is it positive you can get it from the air (within 3 hours of a patient being in same room, coughing), via eye contact? | 01:22 |
| dividediff[m] | analogical: kurtzy! | 01:22 |
| Spec | because if so, my face shield isn't going to be effective at all and i'd need to consider a sealed approach | 01:22 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: afaik yes | 01:22 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: i'm talking about eye contact from floating in the air, not coughed into your eyeballs, if that makes a difference (particle sizes and all) | 01:23 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: not sure. some say no. some say it stays in the air a for a bit but not 3h. It is not like asbestos fibers | 01:23 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: i know it works thru eyes | 01:23 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: oh hmm | 01:23 |
| berndj | Spec, you're asking about aerosol vs droplets i think? | 01:23 |
| Spec | hmm. i'm not sure how i could seal eyeballs in a grocery store. | 01:23 |
| Spec | berndj: yeah | 01:23 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: swim goggles | 01:23 |
| Spec | i'm not sure those are effective | 01:24 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]:poor mans solution | 01:24 |
| Spec | it will be difficult to remove them and not become infected by the action | 01:24 |
| berndj | Spec, most of what i've seen says no, only droplets, but i did see a paper or two showing viability after aerosolization | 01:24 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: agreed | 01:24 |
| LjL | <berndj> ubLIX, my frustration with all these "lists of symptoms" is that they give you no real way to distinguish covid-19 from a flu ← this is something that i want to cover if i write something up about this, aside from simply linking to a symptoms list. i'll jot down something, then you can give me some feedback | 01:24 |
| berndj | maybe it can happen, but just isn't very common?? | 01:24 |
| LjL | but maybe not right now | 01:24 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: look into half mask or full mask | 01:24 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: swim goggles? They're fight enough to prevent water from going thru | 01:24 |
| Spec | dividediff[m]: it's the removing of them that is a challenge | 01:24 |
| berndj | LjL, ping me whenever, if this chat tab goes blue from the nick catcher i'll grep the logs | 01:25 |
| LjL | :) | 01:25 |
| Spec | berndj: a log grepper eh | 01:25 |
| Spec | but blue, not pink? | 01:25 |
| LjL | incidentally, Brainstorm is supposed to provide updates of the "topic links list" github page | 01:25 |
| LjL | but somehow, it doesn't | 01:25 |
| LjL | like it also does not do other things | 01:25 |
| Zalyssa | and finally, stop listening to HeXiLeD | 01:25 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec;ideally wash your before removing | 01:25 |
| dividediff[m] | wash your hands i mean | 01:26 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: https://www.amazon.ca/3M-Face-Mounted-Respirator-Respiratory-Rechargeable/dp/B0002XJ1QO/ref=pd_sbs_469_6/138-6347662-6286439 | 01:26 |
| dividediff[m] | Zalyssa: not a fan of HeXiLeD? Why? | 01:26 |
| HeXiLeD | solution to 'all' the problems | 01:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 00:24 UTC: /u/slakmehl: The Philadelphia Inquirer su Twitter: "Gov. Tom Wolf orders all Pennsylvania businesses that aren’t ‘life-sustaining’ to close, will enforce order https://t.co/z2WvPdUYYc" — from WHO at 00:24: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/RDl1vK | 01:26 |
| Zalyssa | dividediff[m]: misinformation | 01:26 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: basically scuba equipment | 01:27 |
| Zalyssa | + shitty arguments amounting to "I'm older therefore I know better" | 01:27 |
| HeXiLeD | well... kinda | 01:27 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: yea, no blow hole basically | 01:28 |
| LjL | hey everyone don't make things too personal | 01:28 |
| LjL | if at all possible! | 01:28 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: there will always be people that refuse to hear the train even at 2 steps from it and decide to ignore reality based on subjective beliefs and feelings. | 01:28 |
| HeXiLeD | i am looking into these. seeing what to order | 01:29 |
| HeXiLeD | i do need filters. | 01:29 |
| python476 | '/join #covid-19-offtopic | 01:29 |
| dividediff[m] | ##covid-19-offtopic | 01:29 |
| LjL | python476, don't be such a D | 01:29 |
| HeXiLeD | mmm.. is the mask talk offtopic? | 01:29 |
| LjL | no | 01:30 |
| dividediff[m] | python476: freenode? | 01:30 |
| LjL | personally i want this channel to offer an ample perspective on things that are related to COVID, i don't want to keep politics out, i don't want to keep "prepping" out, but it clearly must not become *only* one of these things | 01:30 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i might buy the face shiled one | 01:30 |
| LjL | also if you're scared and want to vent and say you're scared, that's fine with me too | 01:30 |
| LjL | just let's all try to realize most of us *are* pretty scared, probably, and tense, and we should get along | 01:31 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m] Spec : this would probably get people panic https://www.amazon.ca/3M-Versaflo-Easy-Clean-TR-300-ECK/dp/B007PB4BFW/ref=pd_sbs_328_3/138-6347662-6286439 | 01:31 |
| LjL | or maybe i should speak for myself. i'm scared, i'm tense, and i'd like this channel to be an outlet and an inlet (and outlet for my fears and an inlet for useful information), not a reason to be tenser | 01:31 |
| dividediff[m] | LjL: thumbs up | 01:32 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: if it were colored a different color, you would be a cosplayer | 01:32 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: yah face shield is reasonable if stuff gets complicated | 01:32 |
| HeXiLeD | but i do get the eye's worry | 01:32 |
| HeXiLeD | there are some cheap ones for less than $100 | 01:33 |
| HeXiLeD | what matters is then, the filters | 01:33 |
| dividediff[m] | Heres a diy cheap face shield https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A0Y5Ua_ioAQ | 01:34 |
| HeXiLeD | i am still having doubts about these filters. I mean OV organic vapors may work but it is mostly construction and or industrial work protection, I do wonder about the filters for bio hazards | 01:34 |
| Zalyssa | ljl, I'm sure you can agree that misinformation and a poor capacity to argue a point is something you probably don't want here | 01:34 |
| Zalyssa | but what do I know? | 01:34 |
| LjL | Zalyssa, yes, i think i can agree to that, but the specifics of what counts as that may vary subjectively | 01:34 |
| LjL | also i wasn't really following the whole discussion to be honest | 01:34 |
| Zalyssa | it was like, the other day | 01:34 |
| Zalyssa | I wouldn't worry too much about it | 01:35 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: that is a easy to do for sure. | 01:35 |
| LjL | oh okay | 01:35 |
| LjL | Zalyssa, i don't want to be like "source!" for anything anyone says, either, but when there's something that smells fishy i won't just let it fly. i mean, flying fish? no thanks! | 01:35 |
| LjL | but i'm only here for those 10 hours a day when i'm not sleeping | 01:36 |
| Zalyssa | lol | 01:36 |
| LjL | the rest of the time, i have other ops, who are generally very competent at everything to do with IRC channels, except being ops | 01:36 |
| LjL | which is honestly pretty okay | 01:36 |
| Spec | i'm not convinced like, full supplied-air respirator is realllly warranted | 01:36 |
| Spec | individual concerns isn't really as high as like, the sum total concerns | 01:36 |
| LjL | but do let me know if at some point Spec's exhaustive details of how to 3D print an autonomous respiratory environment become tedious | 01:37 |
| HeXiLeD | really? | 01:38 |
| ryouma | i have a reusable half mask, but my concern is the same as with valve n95 (which i don't have). when you breathe in, the valve takes a fraction of a second to shut. during this time, you inhale unfiltered air. i don't really get why this is considered ok. | 01:38 |
| HeXiLeD | or was that a bit sarcasm | 01:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 00:30 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: China reports 39 new cases, California estimates 25.5 million residents will get virus — from WHO at 00:30: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/vuBQMz | 01:38 |
| LjL | i wouldn't go as far as sarcasm, just banter | 01:38 |
| LjL | Spec has thick skin, don't worry about him | 01:39 |
| ryouma | your english is good | 01:39 |
| HeXiLeD | and he is unaffiliated :P | 01:39 |
| LjL | why thank you, yours seems alright too! | 01:39 |
| Spec | the U.S. numbers aren't looking good | 01:39 |
| Spec | i hope that's reflective of increased testing more than anything else | 01:39 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: i lean towards arrogance | 01:40 |
| LjL | yes, unlike you who are affiliated with the heinous affront to the government's sacred right to surveillance, Tor | 01:40 |
| ryouma | LjL: well mine is native. i assume with insufficient evidence that yours is not. | 01:40 |
| HeXiLeD | not caring | 01:40 |
| berndj | ryouma, isn't the unfiltered air you inhale for a fraction of a second just air you've just exhaled yourself? | 01:40 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: and much more. :) | 01:40 |
| Spec | thick skin, stops virus easily | 01:40 |
| LjL | ryouma, you'd be right, but let me assure you that being native doesn't automatically make someone's english decent | 01:40 |
| ryouma | true | 01:40 |
| dividediff[m] | You guys know the judy law suit from contagion? | 01:40 |
| ryouma | berndj: you mean if you are not moving? | 01:41 |
| HeXiLeD | yes | 01:41 |
| ryouma | berndj: i odn't know why it would be | 01:41 |
| HeXiLeD | want to do one of those dividediff[m] ? | 01:41 |
| Spec | ryouma: i think it's probably also a complex equation of "viral load" and time | 01:41 |
| LjL | ryouma, anyway you should try my spoken english, it's terrible | 01:41 |
| Spec | like, is one viral molecule being inhaled enough to infect you? i don't know | 01:41 |
| Spec | but i doubt it | 01:41 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: maybe | 01:41 |
| ryouma | Spec: well do med professionals wear valve n95? or non-valve n95? | 01:41 |
| berndj | ryouma, honestly i'm not quite sure what you are talking about, i'm just inferring it's about some sort of fluidic logic type issue | 01:42 |
| dividediff[m] | Spec: i think thats how it works | 01:42 |
| LjL | Spec, "viral molecule"? | 01:42 |
| Spec | LjL: i don't know what you call a viron | 01:42 |
| LjL | a virion | 01:42 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: i am told that cp24 is talking about the virus being airborne for longer than initially thought. @ Spec | 01:42 |
| Spec | ryouma: i would assume it has forced-close valves fwiw | 01:42 |
| Spec | and i would assume cheaper dust masks do not | 01:42 |
| HeXiLeD | was looking for urls on the matter | 01:42 |
| Spec | but i don't really know | 01:42 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: cp24? | 01:42 |
| HeXiLeD | ya | 01:42 |
| ryouma | Spec: nope, not the ones i ahve eseen | 01:42 |
| LjL | Spec, i mean a virion is multiple molecules, only one of them is unlikely to infect you. but also, a single virion is unlikely to infect you | 01:43 |
| Spec | LjL: right | 01:43 |
| ryouma | Spec: relies on your intake of breath to close valve | 01:43 |
| ryouma | berndj: i am saying that with both the n95 with exhale valves and the non-rebreather north honeywell for example half masks, breathing in closes teh valve. which means breathing unfiltered air for a fraction of a second. every intake. | 01:43 |
| Spec | ryouma: well, n95 is only 95% effective amirite | 01:43 |
| ryouma | so maybe med professionals use non-valbe ones? | 01:43 |
| ryouma | Spec: sure | 01:43 |
| Spec | i think my valves are force-closed silicone gaskets of some sort | 01:44 |
| ryouma | what brand | 01:44 |
| Spec | not really sure tho | 01:44 |
| Spec | ryouma: it's a 3M half mask w/ P100 cartridges | 01:44 |
| ryouma | idk about 3m n95 disposable, but the north masks have just an elastomer disc that does not stay perfectly closed by any kind of pressure except intake of air | 01:44 |
| berndj | ryouma, is it really unfiltered though, as in coming in from outside, and not just air that's just been inside your mouth / nose a fraction of a second ago? | 01:45 |
| ryouma | and it takes p100 cartridges too | 01:45 |
| Spec | ryouma: ah, probably similar to that | 01:45 |
| ryouma | berndj: for that to be teh case, you;'d have to have a long proboscis extending from the mask. this is not hte case. it is only a cm or so | 01:45 |
| Spec | ryouma: how long? :) | 01:45 |
| HeXiLeD | there is a way to test masks and fitting methods. when we test, we can confirm leaks or not. you have the positive test and negative test | 01:46 |
| ryouma | i shall not make a joke based on your comment | 01:46 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: we could use some humour to bring the moral up | 01:46 |
| ryouma | i will let you infer the joke! | 01:46 |
| Spec | so like, i have a question | 01:47 |
| HeXiLeD | you can always /notice me. | 01:47 |
| Spec | i've got ethanol and aloe to make some hand sanitizer, but it needs some nice fragrances | 01:47 |
| ryouma | what does /notice do? like msg? | 01:47 |
| Spec | Yes or No to garlic-bread scented hand sanitizer | 01:47 |
| Spec | i have ... garlic fragrances and bread scent fragrances because that's how i roll | 01:47 |
| HeXiLeD | in between ryouma | 01:47 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: it does not open a chat window | 01:47 |
| berndj | ryouma, yes, a bit like a private message in that only the named recipient receives it, but usually shows up in the common channel | 01:48 |
| HeXiLeD | (unless the receiver wants) | 01:48 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: How to make gel sanitizer https://www.who.int/gpsc/5may/Guide_to_Local_Production.pdf | 01:48 |
| Spec | yeap, done read | 01:48 |
| HeXiLeD | so you just want a better scent? | 01:49 |
| dividediff[m] | they recast jude law's character from contagion (2011). | 01:49 |
| dividediff[m] | Who is playing krumwiede In corona (2020) ? | 01:49 |
| Spec | i didn't really do what they say though | 01:49 |
| HeXiLeD | is this for mass production :P ? | 01:49 |
| Spec | no, i just have a few bottles | 01:49 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i just have 75% denatured ethanol and 25% aloe vera gel | 01:49 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: remake ? | 01:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 00:48 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Matt Pearce 🦅 su Twitter: "🚨Los Angeles mayor Eric Garcetti announces a stay-at-home order effective midnight tonight, calling today “a moment when everything changed.”… https://t.co/JBIUM8jQln" — from WHO at 00:48: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/oTpO7v | 01:50 |
| Spec | interesting they recommend hydrogen peroxide to deal with contaminants | 01:50 |
| pingveno[m] | %data washington | 01:51 |
| Brainstorm | pingveno[m]: In Washington, US, there are 1376 cases, 74 deaths (5.4% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 01:51 |
| HeXiLeD | i ve wondered what were the chinese using when they were spraying the streets | 01:51 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: (i'm being a lil sarc, but it's still an actual question) | 01:51 |
| dividediff[m] | yea, it features donald trump as the president of america. That one british guy, as the prime minister of uk. It even has a cameo by tom hank as some sick guy! | 01:51 |
| pingveno[m] | I know a couple who went to Vegas just a day or two ago. | 01:52 |
| pingveno[m] | It was like "honey, what are you doing?" | 01:52 |
| pingveno[m] | Another couple headed out to Orlando | 01:52 |
| Spec | > The addition of fragrances is not recommended | 01:53 |
| Spec | because of the risk of allergic reactions. | 01:53 |
| Spec | lame | 01:53 |
| LjL | Spec, i envy your aloe gel, amazon is probably never sending me mine | 01:53 |
| Spec | LjL: it smells gross | 01:53 |
| ryouma | they seem to have a bunch on amazon but maybe the sellers are dodgy | 01:53 |
| LjL | Spec, it's just aloe! | 01:53 |
| ryouma | adn they are high price) | 01:53 |
| ryouma | (and they have werid i9ngredients) | 01:53 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: there's all sorts of products that sterilize surfaces like that, some are even safe for food contact | 01:54 |
| Spec | i assume spraying isopropyl everywhere will create fires :P | 01:54 |
| LjL | probably best not to spray it on an active stove then! | 01:54 |
| pingveno[m] | Spec: It's the only way to be sure | 01:54 |
| LjL | ryouma, what, aloe gel? you want as pure as possible if you want to use it for mixing with alcohol and making hand gel. for instance mine contained xanthan gum, and turns out that's not soluble in alcohol, and it just made it sticky without actually mixing | 01:55 |
| Spec | "Business Insider" suggest it could be a mixture of low concentration bleach-and-water | 01:56 |
| Spec | damn | 01:56 |
| HeXiLeD | this is a great scene. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tkeDTL7bIKM i keep thinking about humans when we mess up the ecosystem that much that the planet takes care of us. This is usually the moment when humans think that they should change. ( last minute and it comes with a price https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzqICRceZDU ) maybe after covid19... we realize that life is not just about us as the | 01:56 |
| HeXiLeD | individual who thinks to be entitled to whatever | 01:56 |
| ryouma | LjL: interesting | 01:56 |
| ryouma | i didn't even know that hand gel without washing off existed until recently | 01:56 |
| CrystalMath | HeXiLeD: it's also not about us as a society | 01:56 |
| ryouma | (that wouldn't be sticky or slimy) | 01:56 |
| dividediff[m] | celion dion actually just a common cold just now rather than corona | 01:57 |
| Spec | LjL: mine has: Carrageenan (thickening agent), citric acid (pH stabilizer) and potassium sorbate (mold inhibitor). | 01:57 |
| ryouma | are tehose ok? | 01:57 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 00:53 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: COVID-19: Morocco Declares State of Emergency — from WHO at 00:53: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/hoZWtZ | 01:58 |
| LjL | i'm probably unable to tell, i only learned about mine not being okay after... trying | 01:58 |
| LjL | %wik Carrageenan | 01:58 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, from English Wikipedia: Carrageenans or carrageenins (/ˌkærəˈɡiːnənz/ karr-ə-gee-nənz, from Irish carraigín, "little rock") are a family of linear sulfated polysaccharides that are extracted from red edible seaweeds. They are widely used in the food industry, for their gelling, thickening, and stabilizing properties. [... want %more?] → https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrageenan | 01:58 |
| pingveno[m] | %data Portland, oregon | 01:58 |
| Brainstorm | UnboundLocalError: local variable 'database' referenced before assignment (file "/home/brainstorm/brainstorm/bot/modules/covid.py", line 91, in covid) | 01:58 |
| pingveno[m] | Huh, that's fun | 01:58 |
| LjL | whoops | 01:58 |
| LjL | i'm working on that module | 01:58 |
| LjL | give me a minute | 01:58 |
| derpadmin | brainstorm ahd a brainfart | 01:59 |
| pingveno[m] | Ah | 01:59 |
| LjL | but also Portland wouldn't work | 01:59 |
| Spec | ryouma: it dissolved in the alcohol just fine | 01:59 |
| derpadmin | at line 91 | 01:59 |
| LjL | it's state-level | 01:59 |
| pingveno[m] | ah | 01:59 |
| Spec | ryouma: doesn't leave my hands sticky at all | 01:59 |
| Spec | smells like f'n ethanol | 01:59 |
| oxalis | Can someone tell me how screwed I am? 43m, with wife 41f, child 6m, and parents, mother 71f with pulmonary issues, father 75, with history of heart disease and cancer, and in-law parents 74 was a retired RN who is anal about cleanliness and in good health, and Father in law with diabetes, but otherwise good health, except a family history of men dying early. | 02:00 |
| HeXiLeD | oxalis: that is very hard to tell | 02:00 |
| oxalis | Merica so shitty health care for the dollar. | 02:01 |
| ryouma | oxalis: take care of parents | 02:02 |
| HeXiLeD | oxalis: ultimately, online chats are not the best place for desperate information. But here is how we can look at it. Along with a few other relevant factors, an undeniable factor is that the virus is taking down humans that are biologically not as strong as nature could make them. Then the rest is all about personal and social practices to avoid contagion | 02:02 |
| ryouma | i would not put it like that | 02:03 |
| HeXiLeD | pre existing health conditions are a plus to the virus | 02:03 |
| ryouma | you have a broken leg and you are not strong. but you are probably not more susceptible to the virus. | 02:03 |
| HeXiLeD | there are people dying with 21 y as well as people with 75 surviving | 02:03 |
| oxalis | Sooooo. I need to convince elderly parents who believe the “rugged individualism” myth to stay the fuck at home and email me their grocery lists? | 02:04 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: i said biological and made by nature | 02:04 |
| ryouma | oxalis: good advice! | 02:04 |
| HeXiLeD | oxalis: yes | 02:04 |
| HeXiLeD | deliver to the elderly. plus... they raised you. you are only returning the favor | 02:05 |
| HeXiLeD | ;) | 02:05 |
| fructose | oxalis: There is plenty of medical information available, though it's not clear what you actually want to know. | 02:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 00:58 UTC: /u/EggCouncilCreeper: University of Queensland researchers have had a breakthrough with COVID-19 cure research. Animal testing of vaccine set to begin, with human trials slated for July — from WHO at 00:58: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/MkeP6N | 02:10 |
| RougeR | contingo, | 02:10 |
| RougeR | https://www.gov.je/News/2020/Pages/AllArrivalsSelfIsolate.aspx | 02:10 |
| RougeR | They implemented it | 02:10 |
| RougeR | just | 02:10 |
| contingo | ok RougeR good stuff | 02:15 |
| BruntLIVE | The first confirmed case of the coronavirus has hit the NFL. New Orleans Saints head coach Sean Payton told ESPN that he has tested positive for the virus, officially known as COVID-19. https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/saints/2020/03/19/sean-payton-coronavirus-covid-19-new-orleans-saints-coach/2879156001/ | 02:17 |
| RougeR | contingo, yeah | 02:21 |
| LjL | wow... for real, if you look at the world graph now, the China events just look like the "flat" part of the curve https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=World | 02:25 |
| LjL | especially for deaths | 02:25 |
| LjL | and by wow i mean, fuck | 02:26 |
| oriba | wtf | 02:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i can tell you spanish information is *not* accurate | 02:28 |
| LjL | goes for all of them | 02:28 |
| LjL | most countries are struggling with testing | 02:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | true | 02:28 |
| LjL | well, either struggling, or not wanting to test | 02:29 |
| LjL | in spain's case, though, struggling | 02:29 |
| oriba | yes | 02:29 |
| oriba | not wanting because of "we can't achieve it" | 02:29 |
| fructose | ^[bL1Tz]^: Can you elaborate? | 02:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 01:26 UTC: (news): Los Angeles mayor issues 'Safer at Home' order asking residents to limit 'non essential' movement as coronavirus spreads — from WHO at 01:26: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/dnm24p | 02:29 |
| ryouma | are vaccines cures? | 02:31 |
| LjL | not technically | 02:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | no | 02:32 |
| LjL | you cure something you get in the first place | 02:32 |
| LjL | if you don't get it you aren't curing it | 02:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | vaccines are inmunity before you get infected | 02:32 |
| ryouma | so this is 2 headlines? "University of Queensland researchers have had a breakthrough with COVID-19 cure research. Animal testing of vaccine set to begin, with human trials slated for July" | 02:32 |
| LjL | ryouma, the problem with that is that it's a headline | 02:32 |
| ryouma | :) | 02:32 |
| LjL | you can almost always assume they are faulty in some way | 02:32 |
| xrogaan | what isn't accurate about spain? | 02:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | at spain there are more than 10 times infected people | 02:33 |
| LjL | that seems likely, considering similar estimates are being made for Italy, parts of the US... | 02:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | they are not registering or making the tests for people that is not very ill | 02:33 |
| [itchyjunk] | Animal testing set to begin with human testing!!! | 02:33 |
| LjL | testing is mainly done on (very) symptomatic people | 02:33 |
| xrogaan | It's expected, we don't test everybody. We as in European countries. | 02:33 |
| AimHere | https://www.health.govt.nz/our-work/diseases-and-conditions/covid-19-novel-coronavirus/covid-19-current-cases <- 1/5 of New Zealand's current cases arrived by air from Los Angeles. Could it be much more common there than people realise? | 02:33 |
| LjL | AimHere, in the US? i'd say yeah. | 02:33 |
| fructose | ^[bL1Tz]^: That's common beyond Spain | 02:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | yes | 02:34 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but even don't testing everybody | 02:34 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | spain made more tests than, for example, us | 02:34 |
| LjL | yes, the US has been rather... underwhelming | 02:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | How many has spain done? | 02:34 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | several hundred thousands | 02:35 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], however many it has done, it's hard to compare with a number the US isn't publishing! :P or are they now? probably they are since they switched most testing to publish health structures | 02:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | Source? | 02:35 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | right | 02:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | LjL, USA's testing has quadrupaled since yesterday | 02:35 |
| LjL | good | 02:35 |
| LjL | (see, i didn't even say "source?") | 02:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | i linked to it several times already | 02:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | FDA expdited some machines and what not | 02:36 |
| LjL | that's fine | 02:36 |
| iz | it's like 40k cases tested or being tested in the usa now | 02:36 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | wrong data: spain (47 million) ~30.000 tests done | 02:36 |
| iz | but usa also has way more ppl over all | 02:37 |
| LjL | ^[bL1Tz]^, give us the source for goodness sake before you're "source?"d to death | 02:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and this week, at spain arrives the new "quick" tests | 02:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | spanish | 02:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | https://www.eldiario.es/sociedad/Restringir-COVID-19-distorsionado-epidemia-Espana_0_1007200432.html | 02:37 |
| iz | https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/cases-updates/testing-in-us.html 40k number for the usa from here | 02:37 |
| oriba | doctors in Berlin have problems with not enough protective clothes.... one or two weeks and a lot of docxtors must close, if no protective clothing comes in... | 02:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | The company makes 40,000 tests a day, but Spain has only done 30,000 since the beginning of the crisis. | 02:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://english.elpais.com/society/2020-03-18/lack-of-testing-hampering-spains-efforts-to-slow-coronavirus-outbreak.html | 02:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | so USA has done mroe tests. | 02:38 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the tests are not the issue | 02:38 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the *only* issue | 02:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | What is the issue? | 02:38 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | at spain they waited too long to force quarantine even knowing the italy's case | 02:39 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +459 cases (now 245779), +7 deaths (now 10053), +286 recoveries (now 88336) 🔶 US: +345 cases (now 14265), +4 deaths (now 218) 🔶 Korea, South: +87 cases (now 8652), +3 deaths (now 94), +286 recoveries (now 2233) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) 🔸 Cuba: +5 cases (now 16) 🔸 Uruguay: +15 cases (now 94) | 02:39 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the gap is in the time you wait to get people forced inside their homes | 02:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | I think that has been a common theme though. | 02:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | In most places. | 02:40 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | yes | 02:40 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the govs don't belive it, and they are not prepared economically to stop everything | 02:40 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but the result of not doing this is to have hundreds of daily deaths | 02:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | Governments are monolithic entities that are quicker at bailing out big companies than caring about it's publics health. | 02:40 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | right | 02:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | I recommend upgrading to government 2.0 | 02:41 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i recommend one government, and a liquid democracy | 02:41 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but that's not the theme here haha | 02:42 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | or is it? | 02:42 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | spanish healthcare system is free, efficient and universal and still it can't absorb the impact of infected people | 02:44 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i hope other countries can do the same but before | 02:44 |
| Spec | i will relay my personal life details to this channel in case you are also struggling with grocery store decontamination protocols | 02:46 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | please | 02:46 |
| Spec | I assume everything is contaminated, so groceries have a 10 day lag-time in storage as i wait for the virus to deactivate | 02:46 |
| Spec | My basement fridge/freezer is ContaminationZone, everything in it is to be treated as surface contaminated | 02:46 |
| Spec | to be handled with care | 02:46 |
| LjL | Spec, maybe the virus lives longer in the cold | 02:46 |
| LjL | do you know that? | 02:47 |
| Spec | true, fridge is always-contaminated | 02:47 |
| Spec | but dry goods are stored in pantry in quarantine zone, and get rotated into active-use-goods, which are stored in a different area | 02:47 |
| Spec | some things get washed immediately and put into use (like, the mayonnaise bottle got sterilized and put into use because ... because tuna needs mayo) | 02:47 |
| LjL | Spec, i wish i could convince my family that we have space for all this! which we certainly do... less than you do, but still, we have some space | 02:48 |
| Spec | anyways, the sour cream. It is in a bag right now...in the dry goods storage. rip sour cream | 02:48 |
| Spec | it is difficult adjusting to new routines | 02:48 |
| Spec | it seems like a reasonable plan, it also ensures you have 10 days of groceries on hand, mandatorily | 02:48 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | well | 02:49 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | it is nice | 02:49 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we do things differently | 02:49 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: i'm definitely not perfect -- what's your protocol | 02:49 |
| ryouma | what if food delivery companies had a uv chamber or something? | 02:49 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | here we are having shortage of things that we have to consume | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | ryouma | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the issue is not that | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the company can serve the food decontaminated | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the problem is the handling | 02:50 |
| ryouma | yeah | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and putting it into a grocery store | 02:50 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the people passing is contaminating everything | 02:50 |
| Spec | ^ | 02:51 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the solution is that the people can't touch and the clerks are on suits | 02:51 |
| Spec | people passing and coughing/breathing on things is my main concern with groceries | 02:51 |
| HeXiLeD | where is here? | 02:51 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but this is impossible | 02:51 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: yes | 02:51 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | there are shortage of protective gear | 02:51 |
| Spec | i don't think groceries are really contaminated (here) currently, i have no local evidence of extreme prevalence/breakout or anything | 02:52 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | for example | 02:52 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the method that china is using | 02:52 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | is very hardcore | 02:52 |
| ryouma | good testing would be good | 02:52 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | if you go to the grocery shop | 02:52 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | tghey test your temperature | 02:53 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and you have to show an app that evaluates you | 02:53 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | if one shop tests you and you are with fever or symptoms | 02:53 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the others shop will not let you enter | 02:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 01:45 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: banks announce six-month loan deferral for small business – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 02:53 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and the police "friendly" will tell you that you have to be at home | 02:53 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: nice | 02:54 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | well | 02:55 |
| Spec | just temp based, but reducing probabilities is the game | 02:55 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | is the good thing of having a communist gov, you can do this to everyone and they have to submit | 02:55 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but doing this at usa or europe is frankly difficult | 02:55 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | this times require union between countries | 02:56 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: i don't think businesses would be averse to guaranteeing some level of safety in the midst of a pandemic. | 02:56 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | to stop the virus going everywhere | 02:56 |
| Spec | especially if coupled with government-mandated-testing+quarantines | 02:56 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the business are not the issue | 02:57 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the people and the govs are | 02:57 |
| Spec | but, again, many of my fine, moral, ethical citizen-fellows think that the old people should "Just die and get this over with because of negative impacts to economy" | 02:57 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | this is plainly absurd | 02:57 |
| Spec | yes | 02:58 |
| Spec | it is wholeheartedly disappointing | 02:58 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the "herd" immunity is a myth | 02:58 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | that's the problem | 02:58 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | this people, and the people that don't stay the fuck home | 02:58 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | sorry for the word | 02:58 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | hahah | 02:58 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: that is a generation os entitlement. | 02:58 |
| HeXiLeD | *of | 02:58 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i've not seen it constrained to any one generation | 02:59 |
| HeXiLeD | the virus is also not constrained to any one generation | 02:59 |
| Spec | some people want to party, some people dont' believe it's a problem | 02:59 |
| HeXiLeD | it is cleaning the weaker | 02:59 |
| Spec | it is "entitlement to freedom", sure | 02:59 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the virus doesn't understand of generations, cultures, govs and nothing more | 02:59 |
| HeXiLeD | ^[bL1Tz]^: does not care | 03:00 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | sorry, my english is a little rusty | 03:00 |
| HeXiLeD | it is purely removing the 'less naturally fit" to stay | 03:00 |
| Spec | that is not what it is "purely" doing | 03:00 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | that's not darwin working | 03:00 |
| Spec | it's also gonna kill people point-in-time who would normally not have died | 03:00 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | there are young people very ill and dying too | 03:00 |
| Spec | people who get into accidents/etc but can't get the care to live | 03:01 |
| HeXiLeD | ^[bL1Tz]^: yes. underlying health issues | 03:01 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the septicemic shock can be suffered by anybody | 03:01 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | no | 03:01 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | that's not true really | 03:01 |
| Spec | i've read some reports that healthy young people can be pretty negatively afflicted, just in lower numbers | 03:01 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | here we've got cases of totally healthy young people death by septicemic shock in no time | 03:02 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: collateral damage. a virus does not care. | 03:02 |
| Spec | yes, but it's not "purely removing the less naturally fit" | 03:02 |
| HeXiLeD | well.. where is "here" ? | 03:02 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | not the bigger amount, but there are enough to make a milestone | 03:02 |
| ryouma | social darwinism stuff really doesn't belong here. there is no teleology, nor is there any specific goodness or badness attached to the vulnerable groups, nor are the vulnerable groups absolute. | 03:02 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | here is spain | 03:02 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: recover from the infection is best achieved by humans that can resist it. | 03:03 |
| HeXiLeD | another way to look at it. | 03:03 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | ryouma +1 | 03:03 |
| Spec | sure, but those aren't the only negative impacts this will/has had | 03:03 |
| Spec | and, what ryouma said | 03:03 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: i agree. not darwinism | 03:03 |
| Spec | it's not "less naturally fit", it's less naturally fit to fight against this one particular strain of virus | 03:03 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | HeXiLeD: a virus is not like not having a lung, is a random naturally happening | 03:04 |
| Spec | which is contrived, you know | 03:04 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: agree on not the only negative impact | 03:04 |
| HeXiLeD | well.. the end outcome will be that only those that will be able to resit the infections, will stick around | 03:05 |
| HeXiLeD | the rest is politics | 03:05 |
| Spec | that's...not necessarily true, either | 03:05 |
| Spec | it's not a foregone conclusion that we will all get it | 03:05 |
| HeXiLeD | we'll have to agree to disagree. | 03:05 |
| Spec | and many will survive due to intervention -- and some will die due to lack fo intervention/supplies | 03:05 |
| ryouma | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Darwinism | 03:05 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we must stop it. If it mutates into a more aggresive thing like ebola we are fucked | 03:05 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 01:59 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Naplan testing cancelled for 2020 – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 03:06 |
| Spec | what's Naplan testing? | 03:06 |
| HeXiLeD | every X amount of years something like this happens. ^[bL1Tz]^ will probably be able to tell us about spanish influenza. At that time... seems the target were not the old | 03:06 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | HeXiLeD: the "spanish" influenza (called this not beacuse was originated on spain, it was originated elsewhere and spread by all europe, but spain was the first country to admit it) | 03:07 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | is not that contagious | 03:07 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: it does not matter how we coat it. the end is always the same. human activity causes a problem in the ecosystem. The ecosystem sets it's final tone. | 03:07 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | take measles | 03:08 |
| HeXiLeD | those who can resist the outcome, survive. | 03:08 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | a lot more contagious illness | 03:08 |
| Spec | and/or get medical interventio | 03:08 |
| LjL | ^[bL1Tz]^, IF it mutates we're fucked? as if we're not pretty fucked anyway? | 03:08 |
| HeXiLeD | ^[bL1Tz]^: true. | 03:08 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | not like we can be | 03:08 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: that will only mitigate the issue but .. sure it is part of resisting it. | 03:09 |
| euod[m] | LjL: it's a virus, it's always mutating. that's sort of the thing with them. | 03:09 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, ^[bL1Tz]^ will likely not be able to tell you anything about the "Spanish" influenza that we don't already know, because it was only nicknamed Spanish because Spain was the only country reporting about it at the time, as other countries were still under war laws with press censorship. they actually had more cases, but they weren't reporting them. | 03:09 |
| euod[m] | RNA is very lossy, so you end up with a lot of mutation. | 03:09 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we will be fucked when we don't have old people to renember us their errors | 03:09 |
| euod[m] | we have wikipedia for that. | 03:09 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: so you're including resources/money/capital/equipment as part of being "fit" to survive, k | 03:09 |
| LjL | euod[m], well no, it's sort of the thing with certain RNA viruses. viruses "in general" don't necessarily mutate any more than other organisms do | 03:09 |
| ryouma | wikipedia is not reliable | 03:09 |
| LjL | anyway that wasn't my point | 03:10 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: what i meant was, that his ^[bL1Tz]^ country already had past bad experience. | 03:10 |
| ryouma | and old folk are "corporate dna" in govs and corps and nonprofits and communities | 03:10 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, and so did virtually every other country at the same time | 03:10 |
| ryouma | i.e. memory | 03:10 |
| LjL | there's nothing specific to Spain about the "Spanish" flu | 03:10 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | all countries, the black plague, measles, smallpox | 03:10 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the thing is | 03:10 |
| euod[m] | ryouma: you realise the policy about this is going to be that if you're older than like 50-60, you just don't get treated at all? | 03:10 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we erradicated measles for example | 03:10 |
| Spec | i don't think it's erradicated ^[bL1Tz]^ | 03:11 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we did | 03:11 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: it plays a minor role but sure. But if one still has a weaker human body, one may not be able to fight it with other resources. Biology has the last word | 03:11 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | at least first world countries | 03:11 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the problem are the people that is not vaccinating | 03:11 |
| Spec | HeXiLeD: i'm not sure it plays a minor role | 03:11 |
| ryouma | it is a major concern | 03:11 |
| LjL | ^[bL1Tz]^, "first world countries" won't be a thing anymore after this, so there is that | 03:11 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: as i said... i dont know much about it and probably ^[bL1Tz]^ knows more then at least me. | 03:11 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | only one case can turn the world in a nightmare | 03:11 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: yes, i meant, worldwide we haven't eradicated it -- as opposed to smallpox | 03:11 |
| ryouma | which is part of why that don't flatten the curve article is a big deal | 03:11 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | mexico right now have more measles cases in his outbrake than covid | 03:12 |
| Spec | ryouma: what article? | 03:12 |
| ryouma | https://medium.com/@joschabach/flattening-the-curve-is-a-deadly-delusion-eea324fe9727 | 03:12 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: look at it this way, no matter how much a body builder stuffs himself with enhancing drugs, if the body cant maximize it, the body will not grow. So yah. plays a role but not the last word | 03:13 |
| HeXiLeD | we all have limitations | 03:13 |
| Spec | ryouma: oh, yeah, that one | 03:13 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i readed it at the diary that actually mexico has a very bad measles outbreak, and this illness is only cointainable because we have new meds | 03:13 |
| HeXiLeD | there are people dying and they have all the resources. | 03:13 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | 50 years ago, were impossible | 03:13 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i mean, this country (mexico) i think can access to meds, but for the covid there are nothing proved | 03:14 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | they are testing hidroclorhiquine and azitromicine cocktail | 03:15 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | looks promising | 03:15 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but, meanwhile the deaths are spreading and the only way to stop it is being at home like a hikkikomoru | 03:15 |
| ryouma | one problem with the antimalarials that i have concern with that i hav enot seen mention is their potential connection with fluoroquinolone poisoning | 03:15 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | ryouma if you have to use this meds, you are alreal | 03:16 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | already very ill | 03:16 |
| HeXiLeD | Spec: i think a good example to my 'narrative' could be Dr Li who found the virus. Was a doc, was young, had all the resources and died. The His body could not resist. | 03:16 |
| ryouma | there might be sequelae | 03:16 |
| HeXiLeD | nature has always the last word | 03:16 |
| Spec | he was exposed to a high viral load while doing his job, presumably | 03:16 |
| Spec | sure, nature kills things | 03:16 |
| HeXiLeD | does not change the outcome. could not resist. | 03:16 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | hexiled well, in some whays, if you look today at the world, the nature is recovering territory, the contaminating emissions are very very low, even at venice you can see the fish on the channels | 03:17 |
| euod[m] | yeah but not in a sustainable way. | 03:18 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | maybe the nature sent it to say "hello, stop this shit" as a warning | 03:18 |
| HeXiLeD | ^[bL1Tz]^: i agree. | 03:18 |
| euod[m] | sure if you stop production of absolutely everything, stop every industry, it's fine. but you don't have long before there's no supply of anything left. | 03:18 |
| HeXiLeD | will not be the last time | 03:18 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: that's just sediment not being stirred up, pretty sure | 03:18 |
| Spec | and boat activity halting | 03:18 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | maybe the "gea" thing is not an stupid thing seeing the ordered facts | 03:18 |
| HeXiLeD | this is also very complex and we should look at the picture from all angles. the outcome of this crisis will reset everything everywhere and will force people to be a bit more humble in regards to everything. | 03:19 |
| HeXiLeD | we have been basically shitting on everything and everyone | 03:19 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | Spec: right, but is not that the thing? we are demonstrating that we can live without cars, doing remote work | 03:19 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and surviving | 03:19 |
| euod[m] | uh | 03:19 |
| euod[m] | not really. see most people have buffers. | 03:20 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the things we thought that are needed to live, in the perspective of death turns a lot less important | 03:20 |
| euod[m] | people arem't working. which means they can't buy food. | 03:20 |
| euod[m] | companies are producing things, so they can't pay people. | 03:20 |
| Spec | ^[bL1Tz]^: we are temporarily borrowing time tho | 03:20 |
| Spec | we're not in a sustainable operation period | 03:20 |
| Spec | afaik | 03:20 |
| HeXiLeD | call me cold and robotic... (been told many times) but ... this scene https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4rvuueqs3vI resonates so much right now. | 03:20 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | euod[m]: the money is a mind thing, is not real if the majority of the people stops beliving in it | 03:21 |
| truths33k3r[m] | this will only work for about 30 days then everything falls apart imho | 03:21 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we are exchangin things with our neighbourgs (after dissinfection) | 03:21 |
| AimHere | truths33k3r[m], how will it fall apart? Hubei has been under lockdown for closer to 60 days | 03:21 |
| truths33k3r[m] | im not sure what their long term plan is but youre right this is not sustainable. | 03:22 |
| euod[m] | uh, exactly. | 03:22 |
| euod[m] | where do think everything is made. | 03:22 |
| euod[m] | china. | 03:22 |
| truths33k3r[m] | we all dont live in under a communist regime | 03:22 |
| Brainstorm | Why does nobody call ME robotic?! | 03:22 |
| truths33k3r[m] | they are just holding it together, maybe those people are dead we dont fucking know | 03:22 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i don't belive it, even falling apart, is not falling apart because the effect of this quarantine is: 1. the most important things are food, basics and meds | 03:22 |
| HeXiLeD | Brainstorm: because your owner has feelings | 03:22 |
| HeXiLeD | :P | 03:22 |
| AimHere | truths33k3r[m], thing is, once the infection subsides, there will be a few relaxations of the lockdowns, and then the disease sparks up a bit. The hospitals will increasingly be able to cope | 03:22 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | 2. the industry stopped doing clothes to do face mask | 03:23 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | as an example of the changes of the industry | 03:23 |
| truths33k3r[m] | yeah but thats what 18mo out? | 03:23 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | 3. a lot of people is working in a remote fashion | 03:23 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i mean we are moving the resources to the basics | 03:23 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | prouction of food, electricity and other commodities AND health things | 03:24 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the people can't care about the basics and the new led plasma tv at the same time | 03:24 |
| AimHere | Thing is, we have excess capacity of all of those so it's not a huge problem for the nonessential folks to stay at home | 03:24 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | you can care about it if you cough randomly at your home? | 03:24 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | true AimHere | 03:25 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but | 03:25 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the basic production is not stopping | 03:25 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the people at the fields are still cultivating | 03:25 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the transport companies are transporting basic goods | 03:25 |
| truths33k3r[m] | as long as we can stay alive, food is crucial. not sure how we get that and stay uninfected. | 03:25 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and the technicians are ensuring you have power and comms | 03:25 |
| euod[m] | yes, and coronavirus. | 03:26 |
| euod[m] | and every technician is a severe risk of being a carrier. | 03:26 |
| euod[m] | it's not like service people are all immune or something. | 03:26 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | not really if it is equiped | 03:26 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | this virus is not like enbola | 03:26 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | ebola | 03:26 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | it's don't kill young people | 03:27 |
| truths33k3r[m] | in that it takes longer to kill? | 03:27 |
| euod[m] | it's air transmissible, contact that lingers. | 03:27 |
| truths33k3r[m] | thats not true | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | it doesn't kill sorry | 03:27 |
| euod[m] | it does kill. | 03:27 |
| oriba | ebola kills 50%, not 2% | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | not a large number | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i mean | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | in 9 months | 03:27 |
| euod[m] | yes, 50% is far better as it wipes itself out. | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | when the system recovered | 03:27 |
| euod[m] | 2% or whatever it is means people spread it far and wide. | 03:27 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the virus will stay on the people | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | like the flu | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | or the common cold | 03:28 |
| oriba | but it will become less aggressive | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | there are not a single proof of this | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | *usually* | 03:28 |
| oriba | we will see... | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | they become less aggressive due the mutations on the jumps | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but ebola didn't | 03:28 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | for example | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | on the contrary | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | it turned more aggresive with time | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but the case is, the virus will stay on us | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | for generations | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but we will have meds to treat or prevent it | 03:29 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | vaccines to make our immune systems to act correctly on an infection event | 03:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 02:23 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Maharashtra mulls full shutdown of Mumbai; cases rise to 48 - mumbai news - Hindustan Times — from WHO at 02:23: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/8Ua67o | 03:30 |
| oriba | when we have solved all the viruses and bacteria through modern medicine, the next asteroid comes... | 03:30 |
| truths33k3r[m] | vaccine doesnt seem likely | 03:30 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i mean, we must be at home to give time to the scientific people to do their jobs xD | 03:30 |
| truths33k3r[m] | wishful thinking | 03:30 |
| euod[m] | <^[bL1Tz]^ "vaccines to make our immune syst"> funny how vaccines went from causing autism to being essential again. | 03:30 |
| oriba | euod[m]: they dont caus autism | 03:30 |
| oriba | its a myth | 03:31 |
| truths33k3r[m] | hehe right euod | 03:31 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | euod[m]: the vaccines are essential | 03:31 |
| AimHere | If you ever thought they did, you're listening to the wrong people | 03:31 |
| tinwhiskers | truths33k3r[m]: a vaccine has entered the first stage of human testing yesterday | 03:31 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | maybe they cause autism and hemorroids, but the thing is, that, without it, we lose our herd inmmunity | 03:31 |
| euod[m] | <oriba "euod: they dont caus autism"> of course they don't. you'd have to be a fucking idiot to believe that. | 03:31 |
| truths33k3r[m] | i read this, but its wishful thinking | 03:31 |
| truths33k3r[m] | read about the vaccines they tried to make for sars1 | 03:31 |
| tinwhiskers | ^[bL1Tz]^: no they don't | 03:31 |
| truths33k3r[m] | its all there on NIH website | 03:31 |
| truths33k3r[m] | this is sars2 its nearly identical | 03:32 |
| tinwhiskers | nonsense | 03:32 |
| oriba | euod[m]: ok I missed the irony. thats too autistic... vaccine victim... thats why I defend it ;-) | 03:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | tinwhiskers: i don't belive this, but ey, they have secondary effects on people | 03:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | maybe not autism | 03:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | maybe only rash | 03:32 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but is better a rash than a pandemic | 03:32 |
| tinwhiskers | wtf | 03:33 |
| oriba | maybe corona virus cam eout of vaccine laboratories .... | 03:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | the vaccines are needed, that's the point | 03:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | oriba: maybe | 03:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we will discover with enough time | 03:33 |
| oriba | ^[bL1Tz]^: sure! | 03:33 |
| euod[m] | <oriba "euod: ok I missed the irony. tha"> yeah. I was commenting on the general population panic about vaccines being bad for you / causing autism / etc, and that very quickly got replaced with people clambering for them. | 03:33 |
| tinwhiskers | btw, there's ##coronavirus-vox for people who just want to speak unsubstantiated bullshit | 03:33 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | we don't know nothing right now | 03:33 |
| truths33k3r[m] | lol its all unsubstantiated bullshit at this point | 03:34 |
| truths33k3r[m] | theyve told us very little about this virus even with all the cases | 03:34 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | i mean i don't know a shit about this conspiracy things, i only know that we need vaccines | 03:35 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | and covid vaccine asap | 03:35 |
| oriba | does corona cause drunkeness symptoms? am I sick? | 03:35 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | yes | 03:35 |
| yuriwho | hard to sort out who is trolling here | 03:35 |
| tinwhiskers | indeed | 03:35 |
| oriba | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corona_(beer) | 03:35 |
| fructose | Using incomplete data from today, but still... https://i.imgur.com/8SH8agA.png | 03:35 |
| oriba | afaik jhu data is always incomplete | 03:36 |
| tinwhiskers | fructose: nice | 03:36 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | sadly the data is inaccurate | 03:36 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | but is nice to have graphs | 03:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | thank you | 03:37 |
| oriba | I wonder how tinwhiskers cleans the jhu data | 03:37 |
| yuriwho | all data stes are incomplete | 03:37 |
| yuriwho | sets | 03:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | https://www.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6 | 03:37 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | https://data.oecd.org/healtheqt/hospital-beds.htm | 03:38 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | interesting info | 03:38 |
| yuriwho | without vast surveillance testing we are just seeing what happened 1-5 weeks ago transmission wise | 03:38 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | sure | 03:38 |
| darsie | fructose: What's the growth rate? | 03:39 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | at spain health the handle 10x | 03:39 |
| fructose | darsie: (DayB-DayA)/DayA | 03:39 |
| oriba | Does it make sense to create 10, 20, 50 dashboards with more or less the same analysis/visualization of data, which itself seems to be dirty? | 03:40 |
| darsie | ok | 03:40 |
| ^[bL1Tz]^ | bye people good night and stay safe | 03:40 |
| dividediff[m] | ^[bL1Tz]^: sano! | 03:41 |
| oriba | gn8 ^[bL1Tz]^ | 03:41 |
| darsie | US looks dangerous. | 03:41 |
| yuriwho | I would like a GIS dashboard for Canada with region/city lvl data even if it's what was reported yesterday | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | damn, the uk seems to have the same % infected than the uk | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | United States: %infected:0.00420540 %not_infected:99.99579460 | 03:41 |
| HeXiLeD | yuriwho: portugal did one for them | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | +------------+---------+---------+----------+ | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | | States | Cases | Recov | Deaths | | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | +============+=========+=========+==========+ | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | | all states | 13920 | 121 | 214 | | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | +------------+---------+---------+----------+ | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | United Kingdom: %infected:0.00482251 %not_infected:99.99517749 | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | +----------+---------+---------+----------+ | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | | all uk | Cases | Recov | Deaths | | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | +==========+=========+=========+==========+ | 03:41 |
| derpadmin | | all uk | 3269 | 79 | 144 | | 03:42 |
| derpadmin | +----------+---------+---------+----------+ | 03:42 |
| derpadmin | my daughter is over there | 03:42 |
| derpadmin | fucking Boris Johnson | 03:42 |
| derpadmin | *than the us | 03:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 02:26 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Naplan testing cancelled for 2020 – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 03:42 |
| tinwhiskers | yuriwho: http://offloop.net/covid19/ has the regional data for Canada | 03:42 |
| dividediff[m] | impeach johnson! | 03:43 |
| derpadmin | damn right! | 03:43 |
| HeXiLeD | ah the politician blame. i ll make this comedy bit my comment https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=07w9K2XR3f0 (maybe we can have a laugh at the same time). | 03:44 |
| derpadmin | HeXiLeD : I don't mean to make this political, but the way governments react to the crisis when it start is crucial | 03:46 |
| yuriwho | ty tinwhiskers | 03:46 |
| derpadmin | and they will be remembered for a swift response or a lack of leadership | 03:46 |
| derpadmin | happy to be in canada so far | 03:46 |
| HeXiLeD | derpadmin: they play a crucial role. sure. | 03:46 |
| derpadmin | but I agree that the virus itself is apolitical :) | 03:47 |
| HeXiLeD | people need to keep in mind who elects the politicians | 03:47 |
| derpadmin | yup, I saw the George Carlin lately :) | 03:48 |
| HeXiLeD | analogy: it is always easier to replace the soccer/football coach than the whole team | 03:49 |
| HeXiLeD | with a bad team. no coach makes a good game | 03:49 |
| HeXiLeD | with a bad coach and good team, something can still be scored | 03:49 |
| HeXiLeD | human nature has the tendency to always blame something other than oneself for the consequences of ones actions. | 03:50 |
| Zalyssa | that's an awful analogy | 03:50 |
| oriba | a good team without a coach is better than a good team with a bad coach | 03:50 |
| HeXiLeD | oriba: agree | 03:50 |
| HeXiLeD | in the past 20y, the amount of humans always avoiding responsability for their own actions and paying attention to causality, has grown too much. It is always someone else's fault. | 03:53 |
| HeXiLeD | by the way.. i cant stand politicians | 03:54 |
| HeXiLeD | they should be replaces by A.I | 03:54 |
| HeXiLeD | *replaced | 03:54 |
| oriba | politicians are the true pandemy | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | all this would a lot better with a lot less 'feelings' | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | yup | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | lets hope covid19 focus on them | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | and lawyers | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | ah .. bankers too | 03:55 |
| derpadmin | this will be a real test for the capitalist model I believe | 03:55 |
| Zalyssa | and this is why I don't like HeXiLeD | 03:55 |
| HeXiLeD | derpadmin: agree | 03:56 |
| derpadmin | we saw china (china being far from perfect) implementing drastic actions | 03:56 |
| Zalyssa | china welded peoples' doors shut | 03:56 |
| derpadmin | that may cause more protest in western civilisations | 03:56 |
| derpadmin | Zalyssa : yup | 03:57 |
| Spec | i don't think those actions were particularly good though | 03:57 |
| Spec | they started separating the sick and isolating them from family units -- instead of barricading them all together | 03:57 |
| derpadmin | well, they don't get points for silencing the whisleblowers | 03:57 |
| Spec | i suspect that's a better approach | 03:57 |
| tinwhiskers | China controlled single points of building access by shutting some doors. They didn't weld people into buildings or something like that. | 03:57 |
| HeXiLeD | yes | 03:58 |
| HeXiLeD | they did. | 03:58 |
| HeXiLeD | say some videos | 03:58 |
| tinwhiskers | No, they didn't. | 03:58 |
| derpadmin | they did | 03:58 |
| derpadmin | nailgun, chains & padlocks | 03:58 |
| HeXiLeD | there are some videos on youtube that show that | 03:58 |
| tinwhiskers | You saw pictures of doors being welded shut. Yes, they restricted buildings to a single access point to control movement, take temperatures, etc. Don't buy into the bull. | 03:58 |
| tinwhiskers | Since buildings had more than one door they welded some of them shut. They didn't weld people into buildings ffs. | 03:59 |
| HeXiLeD | i saw videos taken from people on the buildings. not pics | 03:59 |
| tinwhiskers | You saw evidence they welded ALL doors shut? no | 03:59 |
| Zalyssa | lol | 03:59 |
| Zalyssa | I just said they welded some doors shut | 04:00 |
| tinwhiskers | yes, they did | 04:00 |
| Zalyssa | i have no idea if they welded people in or not (seems silly if they did so though) | 04:00 |
| Spec | people...sick people should be taken from populated buildings, and put into GetBetterCamps | 04:00 |
| HeXiLeD | if i come across those vids we can see what happened | 04:00 |
| derpadmin | they put a chain on the guy's appartment door... it was... not negociable... doors open outward and that already have bars to their windows | 04:00 |
| tinwhiskers | but when you say "china welded peoples' doors shut" it implies they welded people into their homes, which is simply untrue | 04:00 |
| Zalyssa | tinwhiskers: you inferred | 04:01 |
| Zalyssa | I didn't imply | 04:01 |
| tinwhiskers | It's implied | 04:01 |
| Zalyssa | not really | 04:01 |
| HeXiLeD | by untrue you mean false. better language | 04:01 |
| tinwhiskers | Since the common myth going around is that chinese did weld people into their homes your comment feeds into that myth. | 04:01 |
| HeXiLeD | i never said homes | 04:02 |
| HeXiLeD | building from what i saw from a resident | 04:02 |
| dividediff[m] | Alts to handshakes | 04:02 |
| dividediff[m] | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Covid-19-Handshake-Alternatives-v3.gif | 04:02 |
| oriba2 | the time that the western / "democratic" states needed for their decision making was provided by china, and china is bashed for that... so regarding corona virus, western democratic slow and sloppy decision making is grounded on chinas harsh acting. But there is no "thank youchina for providing us the time so that we can show the world we are not autoritative" | 04:03 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: i like the 2x chest fist pound and V finger sign. Also recommend japanese bow | 04:03 |
| Zalyssa | tinwhiskers: I know what I said and what I meant by what I said, and I'm satisfied that I made no implication that people were actually welded into their homes | 04:03 |
| tinwhiskers | heh. sure. ok | 04:03 |
| Zalyssa | if I say "they welded people in!", you are more than welcome to pull me up on it | 04:04 |
| derpadmin | oriba2 : that is a good point, and we snoozed with the time they bought us | 04:04 |
| tinwhiskers | <Zalyssa> china welded peoples' doors shut | 04:04 |
| HeXiLeD | this makes no sense "thank you china for providing us the time so that we can show the world we are not autoritative" | 04:04 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: yea those are missing | 04:04 |
| Zalyssa | tinwhiskers: I'd also encourage you to focus your mythbusting efforts on people actually spreading misinformation and wildly speculating, such as HeXiLeD | 04:05 |
| tinwhiskers | Zalyssa: you're not wrong there | 04:05 |
| dividediff[m] | oriba2: Not all democratic states, but yes 99% | 04:05 |
| Zalyssa | \o/ | 04:05 |
| HeXiLeD | by the way... on the myth of stuff that is false or not. Whats the story with North Korea? I hear some stuff hard to believe. How are they controlling the problem? | 04:06 |
| tinwhiskers | I don't think we really know that | 04:06 |
| dividediff[m] | Is madagascar democratic? iceland? | 04:07 |
| oriba2 | similar case with usa... 4 days before europe closed their doors, trump was bashed to close usa's doors. trump bashing four days before they do the same | 04:07 |
| euod[m] | by literally shooting anybody who crosses the border? | 04:07 |
| euod[m] | that's the only way to deal with it for NK. | 04:07 |
| HeXiLeD | euod[m]: i hear stuff like that and worse but was wondering if there is any data out there | 04:07 |
| euod[m] | there's not any I'm aware of. | 04:08 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: s korea has provided some intel saying Nk has had like 200 military deaths i think | 04:08 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, to be fair, i didn't delve much into it, but the video(s) i saw seemed to be of an *apartment* door being "welded" (really, blocked with a steel bar) | 04:08 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: can you read my notice? | 04:08 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: you can't read korean right? | 04:08 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: right | 04:08 |
| LjL | in a manner that'd let the people in the apartment partly open the door, possibly to get food | 04:08 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: i cannot | 04:08 |
| LjL | so it wasn't just a building entry point. but it was one video | 04:08 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: last notification i got from u is " like the 2x chest fist pound and V finger sign. Also recommend japanese bow" | 04:08 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: yah i saw that one too | 04:09 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: ah ok. | 04:09 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: oh, you mean an individual apartment? | 04:09 |
| tinwhiskers | With no other door? | 04:09 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, what certainly looked like one, yes | 04:09 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: if you could read korean, i think s korean might have media reports on n korean | 04:09 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, whether it had another door i cannot know | 04:09 |
| tinwhiskers | I see | 04:09 |
| HeXiLeD | none of us sleeps ... eheh | 04:10 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: werent you crashing? | 04:10 |
| LjL | i was confused and tired in general but not from need of sleep | 04:10 |
| LjL | well, perhaps also from need of sleep | 04:10 |
| euod[m] | try substituting sleep for sugar | 04:11 |
| LjL | "I'm from Wuhan and I can tell you the video is true but not fully true. First, the video was not happened in Wuhan but somewhere else in China, some extreme community welded the door. Second, this is not permitted by Chinese government, and once this behaviours were found by government, the community leader would be punished. Under the epidemic, as a person may make drastic moves, but at the government level, behavior will be more rational. Now, Thanks to | 04:11 |
| LjL | effective government measures, China is returning to normal, just some days ago, president Xi has come to Wuhan. Nowadays, Much of China has" | 04:11 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 04:11 |
| LjL | https://skeptics.stackexchange.com/questions/46044/were-covid-19-patients-in-wuhan-welded-into-their-apartments-to-enforce-the-lock | 04:11 |
| dividediff[m] | LjL: ! | 04:12 |
| HeXiLeD | :) | 04:13 |
| tinwhiskers | I hadn't heard of the skeptics stackexchange | 04:13 |
| LjL | but also "The reporter confirmed this "door-closing incident" from a person in charge of the propaganda department of the Lianshui County Party Committee, which said that the method was a little overdone in the special period, and the facilities to close the gate had been removed." | 04:13 |
| LjL | a little overdone! | 04:13 |
| tinwhiskers | heh | 04:14 |
| HeXiLeD | over zealous | 04:14 |
| dividediff[m] | To make westerns stay at home, all we have to do is pay them. Get ppl to install an app and it sends gps location and tell the gov if ppl should be paid. Pay ppl more the closer they stay to their home | 04:14 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: lol. good point but then... gps spoofing becomes the sport | 04:14 |
| LjL | that's more or less what Korea did i believe, except instead of getting paid, you'd get useful information on where people with covid were | 04:14 |
| LjL | also china, but in china's case, i suspect you sort of have to install the app | 04:15 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: that is something useful | 04:15 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: out of my friends, i think i'm the only one who uses adblock on youtube. So i think many people wouldn't figure out gps spoofing. | 04:15 |
| HeXiLeD | like when they tell people where a pedo lives and everyone to watch out . | 04:15 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: sure.... until it gets out | 04:16 |
| LjL | Lombardy is also monitoring people's movements using cell towers, but aiui it's been done only for statistical purposes right now... but they are thinking of doing it to actually monitor people who are supposed to be self-isolating | 04:16 |
| dividediff[m] | Skorea; install our app and you won't accidentally get killed by the infected! | 04:16 |
| dividediff[m] | that pitch would have me in a heartbeat | 04:16 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: also using drones right ? | 04:16 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, in lombardy? doubtful | 04:16 |
| HeXiLeD | other places. | 04:16 |
| LjL | in italy? | 04:16 |
| HeXiLeD | saw some footage in the news. I think so. | 04:16 |
| LjL | i missed that | 04:16 |
| HeXiLeD | european news tho | 04:16 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: outside of chyna? i'd doubt it | 04:17 |
| dividediff[m] | maybe vietnam since they're comrades | 04:17 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, I heard about the drones somewhere too (outside china) | 04:17 |
| LjL | drones don't strike me as incredibly effective unless you are already quite up to speed with drone surveillance | 04:17 |
| tinwhiskers | People were complaining about the noise | 04:17 |
| HeXiLeD | but it is a good idea to monitor stuff. Even food delivery could use them | 04:17 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: objection, good idea to monitor stuff during corona/war but not afterwards | 04:18 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=italy+using+drones+corona | 04:18 |
| LjL | i dare hope that "it is a good idea to monitor stuff" is only something you believe to be true during this exceptional emergency | 04:18 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: agree | 04:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 03:15 UTC: (news): Los Angeles mayor issues 'Safer at Home' order asking residents to limit 'non essential' movement as coronavirus spreads — from WHO at 03:15: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/dnm24p | 04:18 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: agree. for sure only during the emergency | 04:18 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, eh... that search seems to mainly show drones being used to survey roads | 04:18 |
| LjL | get an idea of how many people are around | 04:19 |
| LjL | and sure, they're used for that... like, all the time | 04:19 |
| HeXiLeD | yah. that was what i meant | 04:19 |
| dividediff[m] | china: yes we agrees and won't use it for anything bad pinky promise | 04:19 |
| LjL | but it's not like they're chasing after specific "quarantine evaders" | 04:19 |
| HeXiLeD | lol dividediff[m] | 04:19 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, well traffic drones are deployed in lots of countries | 04:19 |
| LjL | even in normal times | 04:19 |
| tinwhiskers | Police use drones to enforce movement restrictions in Spain's fight against the coronavirus infection - https://www.bbc.com/news/av/world-europe-51900325/coronavirus-please-stay-at-home | 04:19 |
| euod[m] | see that's part of the issue. | 04:20 |
| euod[m] | lots of people seem to just.. ignore all requirements of social distancing. | 04:20 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, that looks very polite | 04:20 |
| HeXiLeD | https://globalnews.ca/news/6535353/china-coronavirus-drones-quarantine/ | 04:20 |
| LjL | they are asking people (with drones and speakers on cars and similar ways) to please leave the park and stop gathering | 04:20 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: someone (prob LjL) was saying that china took a look around italy and was like 'ppl need to stay at home more' | 04:21 |
| LjL | in italy, they'd just ask you for your papers and if you don't have a convincing reason, you get reported and it's €300 and/or three months jail | 04:21 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh, here's a better one: https://www.businessinsider.com/spanish-police-using-drones-to-ask-people-stay-at-home-2020-3 | 04:21 |
| LjL | dividediff[m], yes | 04:21 |
| LjL | dividediff[m], https://youtu.be/8rhP2MC7pDY?t=85 | 04:21 |
| LjL | they took a tour of Milan, specifically | 04:21 |
| LjL | (which is where i am, and which is spiking its exponential curve right now) | 04:21 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: how is your area being hit? | 04:22 |
| LjL | it's... spiking its exponential curve right now | 04:22 |
| LjL | i really don't have better information than that :P | 04:22 |
| dividediff[m] | LjL: i'm quite impressed with how italy and china's 1 belt 1 road to rule them all initiative has taken off | 04:22 |
| HeXiLeD | how is your shutdown? | 04:22 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, badly enfroced | 04:22 |
| LjL | watach that video i linked | 04:23 |
| HeXiLeD | people out? not caring ? | 04:23 |
| HeXiLeD | sure. 1sec | 04:23 |
| LjL | everything the chinese doctor says is translated to english | 04:23 |
| LjL | he spoke at a press conference with the governor of Lombardy (the person on the lef) | 04:23 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, also, check out here https://lab24.ilsole24ore.com/coronavirus/ and scroll until it says "L’andamento nelle province con più contagi". the gray curve is Milan | 04:24 |
| LjL | today's increase don't look good | 04:24 |
| HeXiLeD | the translator does have a shiny sweaty? forehead... | 04:24 |
| HeXiLeD | i understand the italian ;) | 04:25 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, do you wear face masks currently? | 04:25 |
| HeXiLeD | almost all of it | 04:25 |
| LjL | because rest assured they make you sweat as fuck | 04:25 |
| HeXiLeD | i have been home LjL | 04:25 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: *flash backs to that iranian minister sweating buckets* | 04:25 |
| HeXiLeD | going out tomorrow and or only at night . | 04:25 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: ya. eheh | 04:25 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, anyway you should still listen to the english since the italian is only a translation of a translation :P | 04:26 |
| LjL | ideally you'd listen to the chinese | 04:26 |
| HeXiLeD | yah it's playing. | 04:26 |
| LjL | i have no idea how we could possibly not have a chinese interpreter | 04:26 |
| LjL | Milan is full of Chinese immigrants | 04:26 |
| LjL | Chinatown used to have Chinese classes, and Italian classes alike, offered in various places | 04:26 |
| LjL | and yet we somehow don't have an interpreter | 04:27 |
| HeXiLeD | strange/weird | 04:27 |
| LjL | maybe his assistant "had" to translate to english as a, uhm | 04:27 |
| LjL | they wouldn't trust a direct italian translator? :P | 04:27 |
| LjL | someone who may say what he said instead of what he should have meant | 04:28 |
| LjL | tinfoil hat: on | 04:28 |
| HeXiLeD | could be. | 04:28 |
| LjL | anyway, you do get to hear "Milanese are behaving like idiots" in three languages | 04:28 |
| LjL | it gets the point across | 04:28 |
| kreyren | any information on the theory of SARS-CoV-2 being created in the labolatory? | 04:28 |
| LjL | no | 04:29 |
| LjL | i should sleep | 04:29 |
| LjL | don't let the virus enter you | 04:29 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: just some newspaper reports | 04:30 |
| dividediff[m] | covid-19 is the snydrome | 04:30 |
| dividediff[m] | corona virus is the infectious agent right? | 04:30 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, anything relevant is helpful, reference it | 04:30 |
| tinwhiskers | kreyren: there's no evidence of that | 04:30 |
| HeXiLeD | 1 sec | 04:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 03:20 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Naplan testing cancelled for 2020 – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 04:30 |
| kreyren | tinwhiskers, according to Sona Pekova in CZ there is | 04:30 |
| oriba2 | LjL: sleeping is a good idea... the good night video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aezikcoCr4o | 04:30 |
| kreyren | Sona Pekova being respected chemist and expert on viruses | 04:31 |
| tinwhiskers | Link? | 04:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | bbc really downplays stuff huh? | 04:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-51957532 | 04:31 |
| LjL | oriba2, HeXiLeD linked that before :P | 04:31 |
| kreyren | tinwhiskers, it's in czech https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gG7oEmuVrH0 | 04:31 |
| tinwhiskers | oh | 04:31 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: you got this guy https://www.blackenterprise.com/former-president-of-iran-covid-19-produced-biological-weapon/ | 04:31 |
| oriba2 | LjL: ah, didnt know | 04:31 |
| kreyren | i am unable to find english version where she is preparing a report about it | 04:31 |
| LjL | instead i will listen to some De André on my Walkman | 04:32 |
| HeXiLeD | i think there is a canadian newspaper also reported something kreyren | 04:32 |
| HeXiLeD | walkman! | 04:32 |
| tinwhiskers | I've only heard people conflating coincidences as evidence, when they could equally be explained by a natural origin. | 04:32 |
| HeXiLeD | you just lost 50% of the users here | 04:32 |
| HeXiLeD | orange sponge headphones LjL ? | 04:32 |
| oriba2 | LjL: good night story to read: https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/17/a-fiasco-in-the-making-as-the-coronavirus-pandemic-takes-hold-we-are-making-decisions-without-reliable-data/ | 04:32 |
| [itchyjunk] | Yes, govs have limited reliable data quite a bit. | 04:33 |
| LjL | HeXiLeD, no, those should be coming from Amazon next Monday | 04:33 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's pretty shitty. | 04:33 |
| HeXiLeD | classic! | 04:33 |
| LjL | (not really, but, really a couple of headphones, since i only have earbuds currently) | 04:33 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, If relevant then reference it please | 04:33 |
| LjL | the classic orange ones are both too expensive and too eww at the same time | 04:34 |
| LjL | what i did want to buy was a remote control for it, since it supports one | 04:34 |
| LjL | but... i'm afraid it's late now | 04:34 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: research for stuff about that iran guy. check the link i posted. I am looking for another | 04:34 |
| LjL | no more ebaying, no more amazoning | 04:34 |
| LjL | or close to it | 04:34 |
| LjL | but hey at least this walkman is mint and sounds fine | 04:35 |
| LjL | %tr Tutti morimmo a stento | 04:36 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: We all barely died (MyMemory, Google) — Tutti morimmo a stento (Wikipedia) — #All died to *stento (Apertium) | 04:36 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, checking.. | 04:36 |
| LjL | hmm | 04:36 |
| LjL | that's not what it means | 04:36 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren check this https://www.project-syndicate.org/commentary/china-exploit-control-of-pharmaceutical-exports-by-brahma-chellaney-2020-03 | 04:36 |
| LjL | anyway, it's the De André's album i'm going to play for sleep | 04:36 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, thanks | 04:36 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/03/13/asia-pacific/science-health-asia-pacific/china-us-military-brought-coronavirus/ | 04:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | that stats news articles is hard to read. | 04:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | They start with "case fatality rate could be lower" then build a whole story around it. | 04:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | Well, "count be higher" and all that fantisy is pointless | 04:38 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: There is also a book written on the 80s or something like that that describes this virus. Some psychic lady or something like that. It is going around the net | 04:38 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, if relevant reference it | 04:38 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: Chinese scientists says COVID-19/coronavirus could have originated from government https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZC0gww2yznI | 04:39 |
| LjL | "this virus"? i mean... let's keep it real shall we | 04:39 |
| tinwhiskers | oh, please. a psychic from the 80s. let's get serious | 04:39 |
| LjL | the coincidence is admittedly staggering, but still | 04:39 |
| LjL | that's how coincidences often are | 04:39 |
| HeXiLeD | hey... apparently was written. just happens to match. Not much different from the movie contagion | 04:39 |
| HeXiLeD | LjL: true | 04:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | In what way did they describe the virus that it makes you think its "this virus" ? | 04:40 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: compiling a conspiracy site? | 04:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9 | 04:40 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: oh... let me try to find it. | 04:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | Here is a nature article giving you a lot of good reasons for it to most likely not be man made. | 04:41 |
| LjL | this Walkman looks too much like an iPod though. it's sleek, but i wanted a black one, not this shiny silver thing | 04:41 |
| rahiakherajot[m] | %title | 04:41 |
| Brainstorm | rahiakherajot[m]: From www.nature.com: The proximal origin of SARS-CoV-2 | Nature Medicine | 04:41 |
| HeXiLeD | one of these "people" even wrote a name for the virus. whuan-400 or something like that. i have not paid much attention to it. | 04:41 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, no compiling a data to determine the facts since this is currently being investigated in CZ where i am politically active so that i would be educated on the subject | 04:41 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: cool. | 04:41 |
| tinwhiskers | [itchyjunk]: thank you for injecting some rational content into conversation | 04:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 03:33 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 04:42 |
| LjL | this cassette sounds horrid though | 04:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | My pleasure. | 04:42 |
| HeXiLeD | found it. Okay no flames... i am not supporting these 'theories" just sharing what is going around https://centerforinquiry.org/blog/sylvia-brownes-non-psychic-non-coronavirus-prediction. | 04:42 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: is it an actual cassette walkman? | 04:43 |
| LjL | yes | 04:43 |
| tinwhiskers | oh, sweeet | 04:43 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: and ya i agree about the natural process. been talking about for some time. | 04:43 |
| tinwhiskers | what sort of cassettes do you have? | 04:43 |
| kreyren | any reference on the lab that allegedly studied SARS-CoV-1 in hubei province ? | 04:43 |
| fructose | There is nothing conspiratorial about the idea that a pandemic-generating virus was the result of a laboratory leak. Please stop dismissing it as such. | 04:43 |
| HeXiLeD | and 8mm cassetes btw | 04:44 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, i've got two of them, thye are... fairly different. don't ask me how much i paid for the professional one, which is actually faulty :\ (but still plays) https://framapic.org/0AprdN3bTTpe/DUmmPIfr4D8S | 04:44 |
| tinwhiskers | oh, good lord | 04:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | there is no SARS-COV-1 | 04:44 |
| fructose | Look at the evidence, stop pre-judging the outcome | 04:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | There is SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2 | 04:44 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/books/news/coronavirus-book-psychic-sally-browne-predict-debunk-a9403076.html | 04:44 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, i have, well, a lot of De André, Guccini, and other italian singer-songwriters... a few Beatles albums, some Cohen albums, and some classical | 04:44 |
| fructose | As far as I know, there is no evidence. It's still utterly absurd to dismiss the possibility. | 04:44 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], makes sense to me to differenciate them like that to avoid confusion | 04:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Wuhan Institute of Virology were studying batcoronas. | 04:44 |
| HeXiLeD | dont flame me. just sharing asked links. | 04:44 |
| tinwhiskers | fructose: unless there is evidence it should be dismissed. | 04:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | kreyren, making up a scientific name doesn't avoid confusion. | 04:45 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], reference please? | 04:45 |
| fructose | tinwhiskers: Which there is not. | 04:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | Use their website. | 04:45 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: got the 2 last links? | 04:45 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, yes | 04:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | http://english.whiov.cas.cn/ | 04:45 |
| HeXiLeD | so there you go. stuff is going around that. | 04:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's pretty well known institute. | 04:45 |
| LjL | i added a "Do I have it?" section to the resources link. it should be visible in a few minutes. it's just a stub, so there isn't even a symptoms list in it yet (ref ubLIX), but first i want to refine the wording to get the right message across. | 04:46 |
| LjL | it's not finished, but i need to sleep now | 04:46 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: not to support these man made virus leaks, but... lets be reasonable. If it was ( by any gov) do you think any gov would admit it? | 04:46 |
| truths33k3r[m] | nah, but it wasnt the govt it was bill gates | 04:47 |
| HeXiLeD | worldometers.info has reset for another 24h. numbers are crunching in. | 04:47 |
| HeXiLeD | truths33k3r[m]: eheh | 04:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | HeXiLeD, you can look at a virus and infer. | 04:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | You don't need "gov to admit it". | 04:48 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], yes but there is no evidence of it working on bat coronaviruses | 04:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | This isn't a conspiracy theory channel last I checked. | 04:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | kreyren, evidence? | 04:48 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], yes | 04:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | they have 30 papers published. | 04:48 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: well... i am still gathering data but so far i lean to the natural occurrence caused by human stupidity | 04:48 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], where? | 04:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | They are the one that sequenced the badvirus SARS-CoV-2 is 96% similar to. | 04:48 |
| kreyren | and this is not conspiracy just researching the theory for it to be hopefully disproved. | 04:49 |
| kreyren | since it is a hot topic in CZ atm | 04:49 |
| [itchyjunk] | kreyren, where all papers are. In journals. | 04:49 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], reference them please | 04:49 |
| [itchyjunk] | http://english.whiov.cas.cn/Research2016/Brief_Introduction2017/ | 04:49 |
| [itchyjunk] | did you try clicking the "research" button on their institutes website? | 04:49 |
| kreyren | thanks | 04:50 |
| HeXiLeD | by the way, on this topic and because what orange president said about the virus, the chinese are upset and are saying that it may have come from the US | 04:50 |
| HeXiLeD | now it is the usual back and forth pointing finger while the common citizen pays the price | 04:50 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-chinas-bat-woman-hunted-down-viruses-from-sars-to-the-new-coronavirus1/ | 04:50 |
| [itchyjunk] | Lets give up on this conspiracy theories for now. | 04:50 |
| tinwhiskers | yes, please | 04:51 |
| HeXiLeD | this bat thing.. annoys me. i mean.. leave the creatures alone. Always messing with wild life | 04:51 |
| [itchyjunk] | There are atleast 400 other coronaviruses in bats. | 04:52 |
| [itchyjunk] | Probably better to study them. | 04:52 |
| HeXiLeD | i see your point. it is valid. lets not eat bats | 04:52 |
| HeXiLeD | or any other animal that carries 'stuff' that kills humans | 04:53 |
| HeXiLeD | and we have reached 10k deaths | 04:54 |
| HeXiLeD | passed | 04:54 |
| HeXiLeD | guilhermeesq[m]: that is.... how much can even be eaten... ffs | 04:55 |
| HeXiLeD | that is basically a rat with wings | 04:55 |
| tinwhiskers | cultural bias. Pigs carry things that kill humans. We better ban them too. | 04:56 |
| tinwhiskers | [itchyjunk]: great article on the bat hunter! | 04:56 |
| tinwhiskers | We better ban chickens too, obviously. | 04:57 |
| HeXiLeD | well... tinwhiskers. They do but seems we have more control on that. | 04:57 |
| HeXiLeD | plus is a pig wild life? | 04:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | thanks, the virologists in twiv were talking about her. she has done really good work and the institute is fairly well known for colaborating with west. | 04:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | they brought in 2 dozen researchers over several years after SARS-CoV to prepare for next outbreak | 04:58 |
| [itchyjunk] | Wild boars are uh | 04:58 |
| [itchyjunk] | wild. And a fairly popular game in USA. | 04:58 |
| HeXiLeD | never had them. | 04:58 |
| HeXiLeD | not into | 04:58 |
| tinwhiskers | yes, and how does it matter if they are wildlife or not? We get diseases from them | 04:58 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: stuff we domesticated we seem to have better control | 04:59 |
| tinwhiskers | In any case you don't need to eat the bats for the disease to spread. It just happens. | 04:59 |
| HeXiLeD | yah but... if we know that bats carry corona, why even consider them as a meal? | 04:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | I wouldn't consider swine flu "controlled". | 04:59 |
| HeXiLeD | not everyone eats a pig | 05:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | Everyone eats something. | 05:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | And there is a virus associated with it. | 05:00 |
| tinwhiskers | There's no need to knee-jerk blame other cultures for things that are different to our culture when it really doesn't have anything to do with the cause, and we also get diseases cropping up from our own animal husbandry behaviours | 05:00 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: well careful cuz you may get a vegan jump on you | 05:00 |
| HeXiLeD | :P | 05:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | Virus were first discovered in plants. | 05:00 |
| HeXiLeD | now i risk getting attacked | 05:00 |
| tinwhiskers | potato? | 05:01 |
| HeXiLeD | which plant? | 05:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | tobacco | 05:01 |
| tinwhiskers | ah | 05:01 |
| HeXiLeD | ah ... dont smoke | 05:01 |
| HeXiLeD | smokers can go too. | 05:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tobacco_mosaic_virus | 05:02 |
| kreyren | btw. Referrencing https://github.com/Kreyren/SARS-CoV-2-bioweapon in case someone has relevant info. | 05:02 |
| HeXiLeD | again.. just another weird thing we can live without | 05:02 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's a hypothesis. | 05:02 |
| kreyren | +1 | 05:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | And it's fairly well addressed in the natur article. | 05:03 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: tks man. i ll save it for. lets see if it gets traction | 05:03 |
| [itchyjunk] | And your 2) is clearly false. | 05:03 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, i want to keep it without traction so that people woudn't be motivated to create false info about it | 05:04 |
| kreyren | [itchyjunk], elaborate? | 05:04 |
| HeXiLeD | i see. okay. low key. | 05:04 |
| kreyren | HeXiLeD, see license that attempts to prohibit redistribution | 05:05 |
| tinwhiskers | I really think this channel should be above stooping to conspiracy FUD | 05:05 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +157 cases (now 245936), +4 deaths (now 10057), +13 recoveries (now 88349) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +27 cases (now 146), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +40 cases (now 271), +1 deaths (now 8) 🔸 Grand Princess, Canada: +1 cases (now 10) 🔸 Ontario, Canada: +1 deaths (now 2) [... want %more?] | 05:06 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: should it be about censorship? | 05:06 |
| tinwhiskers | Personally I think it's already been indulged far too long now | 05:06 |
| HeXiLeD | whats wrong about civil discourse | 05:06 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 05:06 |
| tinwhiskers | heh | 05:06 |
| [itchyjunk] | Great, move the bs there. | 05:07 |
| tinwhiskers | This should be about rational discussion of covid-19. These theories are not rational | 05:07 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: this is the way i treat stuff that gets too long. /ignore add <stuff> . just a tip. | 05:07 |
| kreyren | tinwhiskers, the approach seems rational to me | 05:07 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: that is always subjective. for a lunatic... lunacy is normal | 05:07 |
| tinwhiskers | well, there is the credibility of the channel to consider as well | 05:07 |
| tinwhiskers | I really wish you would take it to ##covid-19-bioweapon or ##coronavirus-vox | 05:08 |
| kreyren | tinwhiskers, i did | 05:08 |
| tinwhiskers | great. thanks | 05:08 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: ah.. diverting now... i see.. well not one is taken sides on the matter. I stand on the side that human stupidity lead nature to slap us in the face. But dont see a problem with other theories | 05:09 |
| HeXiLeD | kreyren: new chan? reged? | 05:09 |
| tinwhiskers | Yes, I understand how the conspiracy theorist brain works | 05:09 |
| HeXiLeD | i think we all do understand tinwhiskers | 05:09 |
| derpadmin | but 9/11 ! | 05:09 |
| derpadmin | (jk) | 05:10 |
| HeXiLeD | oh ffs. | 05:10 |
| HeXiLeD | dont bring that here | 05:10 |
| tinwhiskers | umm | 05:10 |
| HeXiLeD | i like to look all info and then make my own mind. tends to avoid potential bias | 05:10 |
| dividediff[m] | Just spent 40 mins explaining to some guy on reddit why corona is a big deal. He's prob sealioning me, but hopeully it helps! | 05:12 |
| tinwhiskers | Yes, as I said, I understand how that appears like a logical approach to a conspiracy theorist | 05:12 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: good effort but ... dont think it will make much of a diff | 05:13 |
| tinwhiskers | hey, I like to look at all info and then make my mind up | 05:13 |
| dividediff[m] | In the future, does anyone have a vid i can link ppl to when/if someone asks me why corona is a big deal? | 05:13 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: thanks. My hand is soreeee | 05:13 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: lol. you know... it kind seems tht you dont want people to look at other possibilities by mocking people who may think of them rather than with civil discourse, prove they are wrong. | 05:14 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: i wonder if you are under some interest | 05:14 |
| Zalyssa | I told you not to listen to HeXiLeD | 05:14 |
| tinwhiskers | You're welcome to think whatever you like but this channel is about rational discussion of covid-19 | 05:14 |
| Zalyssa | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 05:14 |
| [itchyjunk] | dividediff[m], if someone asks that, you ignore them and go read up on some interesting topic. | 05:14 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: topic has a lot but most people doen want to read | 05:15 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: are you the owner that dictates? or a mod? | 05:15 |
| HeXiLeD | we honestly do not know | 05:15 |
| tinwhiskers | Does that matter? | 05:15 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: i have to agree | 05:15 |
| HeXiLeD | ye it does tinwhiskers | 05:16 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: Exponential growth, what if i could show them a better path? | 05:16 |
| HeXiLeD | cuz it seems you want your will above the rest | 05:16 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: yea which is somewhat why the public doesn't get it | 05:16 |
| tinwhiskers | sheesh. the engineered virus thing is a conspiracy theory and has had more than enough timeshare here now. lets just drop it please | 05:16 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: tinwhiskers : argument? What r u guys talking about? | 05:17 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: i am not in favor of those theories but mocking people that might be researching about it for study purposes, only looks like you want censorship for some reason. | 05:17 |
| HeXiLeD | just ignore | 05:17 |
| [itchyjunk] | dividediff[m], understanding large scale disaster take a lot of time and effort. | 05:18 |
| HeXiLeD | or have civil articulate conversation disproving the theory | 05:18 |
| [itchyjunk] | If someone is not interested in accumulating a large amount of new information, they will just says "its another flu" and move on with their life. | 05:18 |
| HeXiLeD | yup i agree with [itchyjunk] @ dividediff[m] | 05:18 |
| HeXiLeD | most people do not want to read up, research, etc, it is tiring. | 05:19 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: the conspiracy angle is done now please | 05:19 |
| HeXiLeD | okay | 05:19 |
| HeXiLeD | it is not mine anyway. i have said several times i dont subscribe to them | 05:20 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: HeXiLeD : i agree. But unfortunately for us, we need them. We need the ppl who are readers and the non-readers to try their best to help | 05:20 |
| [itchyjunk] | You might, I don't. | 05:21 |
| HeXiLeD | that was quite a dictatorial move btw | 05:21 |
| HeXiLeD | but sure. | 05:21 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: making it simple may help | 05:21 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: social distancing won't work with just the readers doing the distancing | 05:21 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's too late to contain it and you just need less than half the population to cooperate to delay the spread. | 05:22 |
| ryouma | readers of what | 05:22 |
| [itchyjunk] | You are welcome to try and change people's mind. It's a massive waste of time for me. | 05:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Shi breathed a sigh of relief when the results came back: none of the sequences matched those of the viruses her team had sampled from bat caves. “That really took a load off my mind,” she says. “I had not slept a wink for days.”" | 05:23 |
| HeXiLeD | yup a massive waste of time. | 05:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | Fun fact, it's called "novel" virus because we (humans) hadn't seen this virus before it was first sequenced in december. | 05:24 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i'm looking for a resource like a vid to convince ppl that corona is a big deal. Someone on reddit asked me why it's a big deal and i explained it in words and it ook a long time | 05:24 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: were you successful? | 05:24 |
| ryouma | good idea | 05:24 |
| HeXiLeD | [itchyjunk]: if you dont mind me asking, you seem quite informed in general. Research or work in the field? | 05:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | Nope. | 05:24 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: it's on reddit, so they'll reply to me tmr and hopefully | 05:25 |
| tinwhiskers | oh. right | 05:25 |
| ryouma | you could always do the "governmetns would not have done all the stuff they have done if it were not" trick but idk if that owrks | 05:25 |
| tinwhiskers | good luck | 05:25 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: maybe showing them the military trucks in italy carrying bodies? | 05:25 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: Anyone have any models of covid spread with varying lvls of social dsitancing? | 05:25 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: hard to trust governments with johnson and trump unfortunately | 05:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | sure. | 05:26 |
| tinwhiskers | well there's the imperial college paper I guess | 05:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | here is a simplified article on it with pictures: | 05:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/world/corona-simulator/ | 05:26 |
| dividediff[m] | dividediff: true! should have tried showing them something about italy in case they don't look at news at all | 05:27 |
| tinwhiskers | https://www.imperial.ac.uk/media/imperial-college/medicine/sph/ide/gida-fellowships/Imperial-College-COVID19-NPI-modelling-16-03-2020.pdf | 05:27 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: that was to u i mean | 05:27 |
| HeXiLeD | :) | 05:28 |
| tinwhiskers | One Italian newspaper had 11 pages of obituaries the other day :-( | 05:28 |
| HeXiLeD | yah .. saw a few. | 05:29 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: if someone is asking why corona is a big deal, they def won't read that ha | 05:29 |
| ryouma | what are the main points? exponential. novel. hospitals overwhlemed. shortage of ppe for them. us mask strategic supply too small. no vaccine. no proven treatment. no experience with it. global. dunno if any of that helps. | 05:29 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: no, but that's an eye opening thing to tell them | 05:29 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i basically typed up the long version of that | 05:29 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: hmm | 05:29 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: for the general public, if you want attention, you may have to bet on shock value with realist stuff that is happening. Italy may be the best resource. | 05:30 |
| dividediff[m] | lets say only like 25% of ppl socially distance and the rest do the usual, what difference would that make? In actual numbers roughly | 05:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | i linked you to an article. | 05:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | It addresses that. | 05:31 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: yea. | 05:31 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: i've read the whole thing before, but it doesn't talk about real numbers. Which is hard to do i get it | 05:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | Those are real numbers. | 05:31 |
| dividediff[m] | [itchyjunk]: Like lets say there is a village of 100 ppl. | 05:32 |
| [itchyjunk] | For a virus they made up. | 05:32 |
| dividediff[m] | 75% act typical and 25% socially distance. How many days roughly would it take to spread to all 100 ppl? | 05:32 |
| dividediff[m] | vs 100% of ppl are typical | 05:33 |
| dividediff[m] | bonus round 100% of them are spring breakers | 05:33 |
| dividediff[m] | With the spring breaker round that pretty simple, like 2 days and evyone is infected | 05:34 |
| ryouma | the pathos argument might be surprisingly effective. normally in our age of callousness it is probably not. but think of everybody you care about. think of those above a certain age especially. and those who are vulnerable. if they died tomorrow, wouyld you regret it? | 05:35 |
| dividediff[m] | socially distancing is rough and gets demotivating something to see other ppl not doing it | 05:35 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: pathos argument? | 05:36 |
| ryouma | maybe we should issue or wear proximity alarms | 05:36 |
| ryouma | pathos is a rhetorical appeal. basically emotional rather than e.g. logical. | 05:36 |
| ryouma | it's not the english word but the greek word with a special rhetorical meaning | 05:37 |
| dividediff[m] | like atm i hear a small party. But its suppose to be a state of emergency | 05:37 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: huh sounds promising | 05:37 |
| ryouma | it's an option at least | 05:37 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: have a fav video on the topic? | 05:38 |
| ryouma | on rhetoric? | 05:38 |
| ryouma | this site has a lot of interesting stuff: https://changingminds.org/ | 05:39 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: ty | 05:39 |
| ryouma | too much stuff there though | 05:39 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: fav thing there? | 05:39 |
| ryouma | dunno, trust your gut i think | 05:41 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: thumbs up | 05:41 |
| ryouma | avoid all the woo | 05:41 |
| balaa[m] | What’s the latest? Did this all blow out bee yet? | 05:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 04:30 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Nate Silver su Twitter: "Depending on what that growth curve looks like, we could either be heading for Lombardy++, or something more salvageable." — from WHO at 04:30: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/wfRy22 | 05:42 |
| balaa[m] | * What’s the latest? Did this all blow over yet? | 05:42 |
| ryouma | istr a climate change site that had a debunking 101 that might be useful | 05:42 |
| ryouma | (it wasn't topic-specific. it was ideas like "if you repeat a myth in order to debunk it you might reinforce it" | 05:43 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: huh i'll look into it to. | 05:43 |
| dividediff[m] | balaa: I have some bad news for you | 05:44 |
| balaa[m] | What’s the word | 05:44 |
| ryouma | balaa[m]: last i heard (somebody please tell me this is a hoax) usa was considering 18mo of national lockdown in some document leaked to nyt, although perhaps there is less tot hat story. | 05:44 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i searched for it but i didn't see this climate page in the first few links, can u link me? | 05:45 |
| balaa[m] | That seems fake. | 05:45 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i heard the same thing too. | 05:45 |
| balaa[m] | Why commit to 18 months when you could do it a month at a time | 05:45 |
| balaa[m] | Or week or day etc | 05:45 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: Considering all the interest in covid, i think we'll get good antivirals within 1 yr | 05:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | Plan for this to last 18 months. not 18 months of lockdown. | 05:46 |
| dividediff[m] | balaa: considering 18mo. | 05:46 |
| balaa[m] | Link | 05:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | black_owl[m], do what in a day? | 05:46 |
| dividediff[m] | i think theyve decided to try this whole planning business ha. Like that way if it does last 18mo they'll have something ready | 05:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's okay to google yourself sometimes. | 05:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2020/03/us-govt-expects-18-month-pandemic-with-widespread-supply-shortages/ | 05:47 |
| dividediff[m] | https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/488156-us-plan-warned-coronavirus-pandemic-would-last-18-months-report | 05:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | ~18 months because that how long the vaccine might take. | 05:48 |
| fructose | https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2020/03/does-gamestop-really-need-to-be-open-during-the-coronavirus-pandemic/ | 05:48 |
| dividediff[m] | fructose: lol what | 05:49 |
| ryouma | prima facie more plausible, certainly --- 21:46 <[itchyjunk]> Plan for this to last 18 months. not 18 months of lockdown. | 05:49 |
| ryouma | but i can't find the supposed nyt article | 05:50 |
| ryouma | ah it's there | 05:51 |
| ryouma | in dividediff[m] link | 05:51 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: do you remember anything about it? | 05:51 |
| tinwhiskers | The imperial college paper, which quite a few govts are following now calls for something between "flatten the curve" (about four months but a lot of deaths) and suppression (indefinite -> 18 months). Most likely periods of suppression and then relaxing the restrictions until/unless the infections build up again. | 05:52 |
| tinwhiskers | But the hybrid scenario is still an 18 month plan, with easing of restrictions largely to stop people going mad. | 05:53 |
| dividediff[m] | Baseless speculation time: how long do yall think antivirals will take? | 05:53 |
| ryouma | HeXiLeD: no | 05:53 |
| tinwhiskers | specifically antivirals or any useful treatments? | 05:54 |
| dividediff[m] | Even an antiviral that improves prognosis 1% | 05:54 |
| ryouma | just look in dividediff[m] link | 05:54 |
| dividediff[m] | any useful treatment | 05:54 |
| tinwhiskers | well me may already have some, but they need approval | 05:54 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: i thought antivirals and vaccines were the only useful treatments? | 05:54 |
| tinwhiskers | any drug that stops the cytokine storm will save lives | 05:54 |
| dividediff[m] | Yea i was thinking like 2 months tops for something helpful to come out | 05:55 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: Hmm? A person's own cyto storm kills them? | 05:55 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah | 05:55 |
| ryouma | anakinra works on one cytokine. i wodner if anybody has tried it. | 05:55 |
| ryouma | il6 i think | 05:55 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: cyto storm is an immune function right? So shouldn't immunosuppressants help? | 05:56 |
| tinwhiskers | chloroquine is one such drug that may be saving lives by stopping the cytokine storm, but need approval | 05:56 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: yeah, by chloroquine is more of a moderator than a suppressor | 05:56 |
| tinwhiskers | *but | 05:57 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: what is approval? Is it like testing? | 05:57 |
| tinwhiskers | it's already been tested so mostly just needs approval | 05:57 |
| tinwhiskers | it was widely used as an anti malaria drug and other things so it's fairly safe | 05:58 |
| dividediff[m] | wait what, it jsut needs an approval stamp? Who stamps it, WHO? | 05:58 |
| tinwhiskers | there are side-effects but as a last ditch it's probably worth doing | 05:58 |
| dividediff[m] | i heard it was only tested in small samples of like 30 ppl | 05:58 |
| tinwhiskers | Trump even said it was approved before FDA said it wasn't | 05:58 |
| dividediff[m] | good ol cheeto dust man | 05:58 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: it's been used on thousands of people previously though | 05:59 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 05:59 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: for corona? | 05:59 |
| tinwhiskers | no | 05:59 |
| HeXiLeD | a drug/vaccine/cure this fast... umm... how safe will it be... will we develop horns of fins later on... | 05:59 |
| ryouma | dividediff[m]: can't find the debunking 101 thing either | 05:59 |
| dividediff[m] | oh so it still needs more testing for corona? | 05:59 |
| tinwhiskers | but China claims it's been saving lives. If people are going to die anyway, it's a good chance to test | 05:59 |
| HeXiLeD | true | 06:00 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: yeah, it's not well studied | 06:00 |
| tinwhiskers | *for corona | 06:00 |
| dividediff[m] | who needs to approve it for corona? | 06:00 |
| tinwhiskers | FDA, although trump could probably order them to | 06:00 |
| ryouma | can't be used off label? | 06:01 |
| Joe | we are supposed to have BIG news from the FDA tomorrow | 06:01 |
| dividediff[m] | ahh so other countries could just approve it with their own fda equivalents | 06:01 |
| tinwhiskers | ryouma: you'd think, but that's what the approval is for | 06:01 |
| tinwhiskers | law suits | 06:01 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: yep | 06:01 |
| Joe | the US FDA is a circle jerk | 06:01 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: agree | 06:02 |
| tinwhiskers | obviosuly given the small test cases people are moving slowly with it, but there is some hope. It's probably not a magic bullet though. | 06:02 |
| Joe | for which tinwhiskers ?? | 06:02 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: a 1% improvement is a 1% improvment | 06:02 |
| tinwhiskers | agreed | 06:02 |
| ryouma | antimalarials are used for sle i wonder if that was related to the theory for trying it | 06:02 |
| tinwhiskers | when all else is lost it's a shame we are not trying it | 06:02 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: chloroquine | 06:02 |
| Joe | ahhh | 06:03 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: sle? sleep? | 06:03 |
| ryouma | lupus | 06:03 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah, right | 06:03 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: Aside from china, someone else must be using it | 06:03 |
| Joe | i thought Remdesivir was the magic bullet | 06:03 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah, remdesivir is another possibility | 06:03 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: vaccine is the end goal | 06:03 |
| Joe | obviously | 06:04 |
| tinwhiskers | treatments would be good in the meantime | 06:04 |
| Joe | and then world immunity. | 06:04 |
| Joe | it's a shame we stopped on MERS and SARS | 06:04 |
| Joe | they would be thru testing an possibly ready to go | 06:04 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: depending on corona mutation rate it may come back periodically | 06:04 |
| tinwhiskers | even with a vaccine some people people will still be getting ill so treatments are still useful | 06:05 |
| Joe | both true!! | 06:05 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: i thought vaccines are 100% cure unless a person cannot receive a vaccine? | 06:05 |
| Joe | no no | 06:05 |
| tinwhiskers | no | 06:05 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: Why else do vaccines fail? | 06:06 |
| tinwhiskers | they're pretty good but some people can't have them and they are not always effective (mutations aside) | 06:06 |
| Joe | and slight mutations to the RNA can render certain people susceptible. | 06:06 |
| dividediff[m] | okay. | 06:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:00 UTC: Africa's fragile health systems rush to contain coronavirus: With limited intensive care beds, governments are putting their hopes in preventing and detecting the outbreak — from WHO at 05:00: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/dnJRnM | 06:06 |
| Joe | there is no 100% in RNA viruses | 06:06 |
| dividediff[m] | So the plan, wait for some country that isn't china to approve chloroquine and then boom at least a 1% improvement? | 06:07 |
| tinwhiskers | well, it may not work as advertised, but maybe | 06:07 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: trump plans to approve it without adequate testing? | 06:08 |
| tinwhiskers | I have no idea | 06:08 |
| Joe | no | 06:08 |
| Joe | FDA compassionate use | 06:08 |
| tinwhiskers | He just said it was approved but then the FDA guy corrected him on that | 06:08 |
| Joe | google it | 06:08 |
| dividediff[m] | If say france fda says 'its good' will other western countries say 'good enough for france, good enuff for us'? | 06:09 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +181 cases (now 246117), +1 deaths (now 10058) 🔸 Australia: +58 cases (now 814) 🔸 Austria: +17 cases (now 2196) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 279) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +27 cases (now 146), +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 British Columbia, Canada: +40 cases (now 271), +1 deaths (now 8) [... want %more?] | 06:09 |
| Joe | they are using Remdesivir in washington state too, but it isn't approved in anyway for the use. | 06:10 |
| Joe | no | 06:10 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: any news on success there? | 06:10 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: they're not worried about lawsuits if it fails? | 06:10 |
| Joe | not under compassionate use | 06:11 |
| Joe | tin. no i tried to follow up and haven't caught a story either way | 06:11 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: til about compassionate use | 06:11 |
| Joe | ya it's a FDA exclusion "might as well try it since you are terminal" | 06:12 |
| dividediff[m] | so overall, the world is pretty close to at least a 1% improvement | 06:12 |
| Joe | no one knows that | 06:12 |
| tinwhiskers | maybe | 06:13 |
| tinwhiskers | let's hope the chinese were seeing a real effect | 06:13 |
| Joe | china news. no news | 06:13 |
| dividediff[m] | well in that case, i'm be bold and say, apr 1 there will a 1% improvement. Or china is lying again | 06:13 |
| tinwhiskers | 21 or so patients might have just been good luck, confirmation bias, etc. | 06:13 |
| Joe | sprry they can't be trusted | 06:13 |
| tinwhiskers | and that | 06:13 |
| Joe | sorry^ | 06:14 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: you're one of the phd's python was talking about? | 06:14 |
| tinwhiskers | no | 06:14 |
| tinwhiskers | I only have a masters looking at wildlife vectors of tuberculosis | 06:14 |
| HeXiLeD | i am wondering and it may be weird question, but how is the porn industry dealing with covid19. | 06:14 |
| ryouma | Joe: that was teh aids activists thing in the 1980s? | 06:14 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: if i may ask, how do you know so much? | 06:15 |
| dividediff[m] | ahh | 06:15 |
| Joe | huh? | 06:15 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: pornhub premium is free in italy | 06:15 |
| HeXiLeD | lol dividediff[m] how do you know that lol | 06:15 |
| Joe | yes, compassionate use is from the aids attack vectors for the 80s/90s | 06:16 |
| tinwhiskers | Oh hell, we just had a state of emergency called here. | 06:16 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: reddit.com/r/coronavirus . they list like 85% american news but there is some other stuff too | 06:16 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: here? | 06:16 |
| tinwhiskers | Tonga | 06:16 |
| Joe | i'm concerned about the lack of concrete hardsurface destruction times. | 06:16 |
| Joe | it seems no one knows as of yet | 06:17 |
| HeXiLeD | really tinwhiskers there? gg. the weather must be good tho. | 06:17 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: I saw a decent looking paper on that the other day | 06:17 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: so the 5 are in an emergecy, thats cute ha | 06:17 |
| Joe | ya? ive seen them all over the place from hours to multiple days | 06:17 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: lol | 06:17 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: on the mainland :-) | 06:18 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: oh thats not cute | 06:18 |
| ryouma | what about laundry? | 06:19 |
| Joe | we just don't know destruction times, obviously soap is opening the RNA capsules and destroying it. | 06:21 |
| Joe | or at least the S and L strain lipid capsules respond to destruction by common soaps | 06:21 |
| tinwhiskers | State of Emergency Declared today 20th of March 2020. | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | Effective today: 1. Borders have closed to all foreigner; 2. All Tongans arriving home will be quarantined for 14 days; 3. Police assisted by HMAS will enforce; 4. The 9 committees that deal with Emergencies in Tonga have been activated; 5. Social gathers will be restricted to; 1. No gatherings in public places over the number of 20 inside and 40 outside; 2. These gathering include; concerts, sports, funerals, birthdays, marriages, bars | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | and kava clubs | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | 3. Church gathers may continue; 4. Work places will continue; 5. Schools will continue; 6. Shops can continue | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | 7. Public transportations can continue; 8. Restrictions on Social gatherings will be effective Monday 23rd 1am; 9. Restrictions on bars will commence on Wed 25th at 1am; To be Reviewed weekly | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | Whoops. Bit longer than I anticipated | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | I'm sure everyone wanted to know :-) | 06:22 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: any cases there yet? | 06:22 |
| Joe | we are so much more restrictive here | 06:22 |
| dividediff[m] | "2. All Tongans arriving home will be quarantined for 14 days" oh my word that is amazing. Tonga best gov | 06:22 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: Not that I have heard of so this is a bit of a surprise | 06:22 |
| Joe | we are hours or days away form shelter in place | 06:23 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: where are you? | 06:23 |
| Joe | NYC | 06:23 |
| tinwhiskers | Ah. right | 06:23 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: then it seems they are being proactive which is good. | 06:23 |
| dividediff[m] | Canada was like 'arrive home, do whatevr the heck you want, tell us if you become sick ' | 06:23 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: the politeness | 06:23 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: yes, true. If it gets away here the health system will collapse in short order so it's good to see | 06:24 |
| Joe | we got some legit idiots... in the metro area so we may need state soldiers to lock everyone down. | 06:24 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i gotta try to uphold that canadian stereotype ha | 06:24 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: you mean .. 'hey' not ha | 06:24 |
| ryouma | does cetaphil or generic cetaphil work the same as soap? for those who cannot use soap. | 06:25 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i frequent use a phone and use ha instead of ha ha | 06:25 |
| HeXiLeD | :) | 06:25 |
| dividediff[m] | #savethesyrup | 06:26 |
| HeXiLeD | impressive to see that some small fiji islands for infected | 06:26 |
| HeXiLeD | lol @ dividediff[m] | 06:26 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: you'd nvr guess where i got that hastag from | 06:26 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: now we must wonder if the syrup industry gets affected too | 06:26 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: Conservative porn bots on trudeau's speech were spamming it lmao | 06:27 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 06:27 |
| Joe | yes cetaphil, phisoderm type soaps attack the capsules and result in lipid "ripping", they promote near instant destruction. | 06:27 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: in yt's live chat | 06:27 |
| ryouma | thank you | 06:28 |
| Joe | yw | 06:28 |
| dividediff[m] | tonga fun facts: | 06:29 |
| ryouma | i do laundry with baking soda. no detergent or soap. only low heat on dryer. is that enough? | 06:29 |
| Joe | no | 06:29 |
| Joe | you need the lye based soap | 06:29 |
| ryouma | can't do soap | 06:29 |
| ryouma | angioedema | 06:29 |
| Joe | hmmmmm | 06:29 |
| Joe | give me a second, let me consult the doctor in the house. | 06:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:14 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 06:30 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: you're a doctor? | 06:32 |
| Joe | heck no | 06:32 |
| Joe | i'm a drunk | 06:33 |
| ryouma | he's consulting one | 06:33 |
| Joe | my wife is tho | 06:33 |
| Joe | lol | 06:33 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: oh lol | 06:33 |
| ryouma | this would be rather useful information so please thank her | 06:33 |
| Joe | she said baking soda is effective on bacterias, not so much on viruses | 06:33 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: i thought you were gonna say you're drunk at a hospital ha | 06:34 |
| ryouma | what about vinegar then? or... anything else? | 06:34 |
| Joe | i asked for an alternative..... and she is mulling it over | 06:34 |
| HeXiLeD | by the way... anyone wanting to escape the infection here are some places. Canada: nunavut, yukon, northwest territories and st john then elsewhere Svalbard and there is always siberia. Also Tajikistan, Burma, Papua new guinea, Angola Botswana, Mozambique, Madagascar, Yemen, South Sudan, Libya, Mali, Uganda, Zimbabue and there is always Antarctica | 06:34 |
| Joe | i'll advise when i get a ciherent answer | 06:34 |
| Joe | coherent^ | 06:34 |
| ryouma | thanks | 06:35 |
| ryouma | presumably even nyc can be safe if you just hole up with no deliveries | 06:35 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: no don't come to canada, we need the non infected provinces to build the rest of canada back up ha | 06:35 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: st john's NFL is also basically bankrupt last i heard | 06:36 |
| Joe | <ryouma>presumably even nyc can be safe <--- we ran to the country tho | 06:36 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: which teams actually even win anything | 06:36 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: sry, newfoundland | 06:37 |
| dividediff[m] | NewFoundLand | 06:37 |
| HeXiLeD | central/country side australia seems safe too. | 06:37 |
| tinwhiskers | You forgot Tonga! | 06:38 |
| HeXiLeD | ah yes! | 06:38 |
| HeXiLeD | and good weather | 06:38 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i expect some bilonaries must be adrift in the middle of teh ocean for protection | 06:38 |
| Joe | mcaffe is | 06:38 |
| Joe | lol | 06:38 |
| tinwhiskers | lol | 06:38 |
| HeXiLeD | being on a boat seems to me a good option | 06:38 |
| Joe | and he's crazier than shit | 06:38 |
| tinwhiskers | that's unfair to crazy shit | 06:39 |
| HeXiLeD | yes ... tonga is part of my fav places to chill | 06:39 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: he's so crazy i still doubt whether he's real and not just a meme | 06:39 |
| HeXiLeD | those Polynesian islands... mmmhmm | 06:39 |
| HeXiLeD | Samoa also declared state of emergency | 06:39 |
| tinwhiskers | and Fiji I think | 06:40 |
| Joe | ryouma: she and i seem to think, launder in free detergent, and once clear water, you really need to the soap bases to aid destruction. | 06:40 |
| Joe | obviously if you try keep an antihistamine handy. | 06:40 |
| HeXiLeD | one case in fiji | 06:41 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: angioedema doesn't like fumes? | 06:41 |
| dividediff[m] | sudan is gonna get wrkecked, 2 cases 1 death | 06:41 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: eheh quite the ratio | 06:42 |
| Joe | hyper contact dermatitis disorders don't like strong anything or even thinking about it. | 06:42 |
| ryouma | what is free detergent? i don't think i can use soap at all. i got non-histaminergic (4x normal dose antihistamines useless) angioedema from rags that were washed only once in soap-containing laundry detergent, then washed 4 times in water and in vinegar and water. i had to wash at least 6 times before they did not trigtger attack., | 06:42 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: delicately put :-) | 06:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:27 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: Some Australian aged care homes go beyond official coronavirus advice with lockdowns — from WHO at 05:27: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/uvj6oo | 06:42 |
| ryouma | Joe: it's not clear what type of angioedema it is but it is classic symptoms and there is a delayed reaction and antihistamines are useless and c1-inh is normal | 06:43 |
| sandro_ | %data germany | 06:43 |
| Brainstorm | sandro_: In all areas, Germany, there are 15320 cases, 44 deaths (0.3% of cases), 115 recoveries as of March 20, 05:32Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 06:43 |
| dividediff[m] | :) | 06:43 |
| Joe | oh wow! hyper/hyper. free is completely hypo detergent it has nothing but sulfates in it. | 06:43 |
| ryouma | dunno what you're talking about? | 06:44 |
| HeXiLeD | 160 countries ... out of what 194? | 06:44 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: 206 | 06:44 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: oh, Nepal had a case but is now clear | 06:44 |
| ryouma | i can touch something that touched fabrics that were washed in laundry detergentt hat contained soap and get an attack | 06:44 |
| ryouma | i.e. idk what free detergent is | 06:45 |
| Joe | free and clear | 06:45 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: after corona is ovvr hopefully science can take care of angiodema | 06:45 |
| ryouma | but attack is not at location of touching; it can be anywhere | 06:45 |
| HeXiLeD | French Polynesia 11 cases. damn tourists :P ruined ma place | 06:46 |
| ryouma | so not local contact dermatitis | 06:46 |
| Joe | i'm googling to find what i'm talking about | 06:46 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: :-( | 06:46 |
| Joe | ya i got it after relaying more of this to my wife | 06:46 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: NYC you said? | 06:46 |
| HeXiLeD | i lost hope when i saw greenland getting infected | 06:46 |
| Joe | yes | 06:46 |
| HeXiLeD | that was it. | 06:47 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: tell your wife this chat wishes her the best | 06:47 |
| Joe | oh ty, no need | 06:47 |
| HeXiLeD | Vatican City 1 case... (have I shown my depreciation for religious entities?) very low number | 06:48 |
| HeXiLeD | this place could go | 06:48 |
| Joe | she is a aesthetics doctor currently and will not be helping in the hospital | 06:48 |
| Joe | we have children and the risk is toooo great | 06:48 |
| HeXiLeD | Togo 1 case | 06:48 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: thats like nose jobs? | 06:48 |
| Joe | ya and lip filler and what not | 06:49 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: there's still a bunch of small countries in the pacific that don't have it | 06:49 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: vatican has a high rate of infection/population. Something like 1/1200 ppl | 06:49 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: we could lose the pedos thats for sure | 06:50 |
| Joe | ryouma: https://www.seventhgeneration.com/home like this is what she meant after another round of 22 questions with her. | 06:50 |
| tinwhiskers | many of those small countries don't have any health services to speak of so must exclude it at all costs | 06:50 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: agreed. they should block any entrance | 06:50 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: Wiki said ? hospital beds in tonga, a quick search said 307 for the whole country. Is that about right? | 06:51 |
| tinwhiskers | one of them (I forget which) even turned away a supply ship | 06:51 |
| ryouma | Joe: i react to that. it contains soap without listing it i think. iirc glycerin is a tip off that soap is part of it as it is a byproduct of soapmaking. | 06:51 |
| HeXiLeD | by the way there is an island that smoking is not allowed. Anything for your side tinwhiskers ? | 06:51 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: probably a bit more than that but maybe | 06:51 |
| tinwhiskers | HeXiLeD: smoking is allowed here. They smoke a locally grown tobacco that smells really strong | 06:51 |
| Joe | we luckily are getting the usn comfort in NY harbor that will some 1000 beds to our current capacity | 06:52 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: woah what, the hospital bed / pop x 1000 ratio is real good! | 06:53 |
| HeXiLeD | i am not very optimistic on the current lockdown by cooperation. | 06:53 |
| tinwhiskers | hrm | 06:53 |
| tinwhiskers | that's surprising | 06:53 |
| dividediff[m] | 350 beds /108020 pop *1000 = 3.2 | 06:53 |
| HeXiLeD | just does not seem effective | 06:53 |
| dividediff[m] | canada is 2.5, japan is 14 | 06:53 |
| Joe | HeXiLeD: where are you again? | 06:53 |
| dividediff[m] | ~ | 06:53 |
| HeXiLeD | on the tor network | 06:53 |
| HeXiLeD | ;) | 06:53 |
| Joe | lol | 06:53 |
| Joe | fine lets not have an educated conversation | 06:54 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: usn comfort, is that a military ship? | 06:54 |
| tinwhiskers | I don't imagine there are many ventilators here though. Those are just beds. When you go to hospital here you have to take your own pillow, sheets, food, towels, clothes, soap, etc. | 06:54 |
| Joe | ya navy hospital ship | 06:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 05:49 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 06:54 |
| HeXiLeD | i am dividediff[m] "neighbour" Joe | 06:55 |
| HeXiLeD | for you... up north | 06:55 |
| HeXiLeD | but the planet is round tho... | 06:55 |
| tinwhiskers | There's a high rate of obesity and related health conditions here. I have seen a couple of ventilators in the hospital but there is no oxygen supply to the beds or anything like that. It'll be carnage here | 06:55 |
| Joe | i'm not good at riddles, i'm good not having this conversation. | 06:55 |
| HeXiLeD | tinwhiskers: speaking of obesity. Any infos out there about obesity being a health factor that may facilitate covid19 to do it's job? | 06:56 |
| tinwhiskers | diabetes is a factor, and related | 06:57 |
| Joe | tin yo have A case? or not yet? | 06:57 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: not yet, I don't think. At least I haven't heard but they did have someone in testing so it's possible a positive test triggered the state of emergency | 06:57 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: i think i have heard of tonga now that you mention obesity, i think i heard they have more rate sof obesity than other countries for unknown reason | 06:58 |
| HeXiLeD | Gov. Gavin Newsom of California Orders Californians to Stay at Home https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/19/us/California-stay-at-home-order-virus.html | 06:58 |
| tinwhiskers | coconuts and mutton flaps | 06:58 |
| HeXiLeD | really? | 06:59 |
| JoeLlama | moo | 06:59 |
| Joe | oh wow tinwhiskers it's seems you have No cases and are shutting everything down. You may not even see this. | 07:00 |
| HeXiLeD | any info out there about skin absorption of covid19 droplets? | 07:00 |
| HeXiLeD | Joe: being proactive is good. | 07:00 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: maybe, except we're trying to escape back to New Zealand at present | 07:00 |
| JoeLlama | yup | 07:00 |
| JoeLlama | It's kinda funny, they are recommending social distancing... I've been doing that all of my life :/ | 07:00 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 07:00 |
| JoeLlama | and all I did was go moo | 07:00 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: JoeLlama we have 2 joes now? | 07:01 |
| HeXiLeD | this is great times for get off my back type thing JoeLlama | 07:01 |
| Joe | is NZ inherently safer do to higher medical availability of care? | 07:01 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: yeah, but I'm in two minds about it | 07:01 |
| Joe | i dunno i'm joe....it's all i got | 07:02 |
| JoeLlama | a good time for joes | 07:02 |
| JoeLlama | :) | 07:02 |
| Joe | higher exposure risk in kiwi land?? | 07:02 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: skin absorption - i looked it up yest, found nothing suggesting that it or sex can transfer covid | 07:02 |
| HeXiLeD | yah i read about sex. just not sure about skin | 07:03 |
| ryouma | kissing though? | 07:03 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: well we don't yet have community spread in NZ either and even tougher restrictions, but I suspect it's out there now as there have been a few imported cases that likely escaped. | 07:03 |
| Joe | ya that's a tough spot. That's like asking me if i would goto rural farmland or the city. | 07:03 |
| HeXiLeD | ryouma: yah that is a killer. i wonder how dating is going right now | 07:03 |
| tinwhiskers | We have a farm back in NZ | 07:03 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: yea that transfer it | 07:03 |
| Joe | just out curiosity are you in a risk group? | 07:04 |
| ryouma | who? me? yes. | 07:04 |
| tinwhiskers | maybe, yeah | 07:04 |
| ryouma | bedridden | 07:04 |
| ryouma | oh tinwhiskers | 07:04 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma:tinwhiskers best wishes toyou both | 07:05 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: tonga have any testing kits? | 07:05 |
| tinwhiskers | I'm only 50 but have an undiagnosed lung condition of some type. | 07:05 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: no, they have to send them away | 07:05 |
| Joe | interesting, not that you asked, i think i would choose the availability of better healthcare over a perceived lower risk model. | 07:05 |
| tinwhiskers | I was thinking of going back to NZ to get my lung thing looked at anyway, but that may increases the chance of getting it | 07:06 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: thanks for the opinion. | 07:06 |
| Joe | ya i would not go anywhere near a hospital for quite the while | 07:06 |
| ryouma | perhaps better now than later though maybe | 07:07 |
| dividediff[m] | tonga gdp per capita = ~6000. | 07:07 |
| dividediff[m] | So yeah bettr not get any cases despite ~3.5 hospital beds/capita | 07:07 |
| ryouma | sounds like i need to know what to do to kill viruses in laundry though. maybe try to find some non-soap-containing detergent and put up with the fact that it makes me sicker. | 07:07 |
| Joe | hecks no, some of the first cases world wide have been medical providers | 07:07 |
| Joe | i'm staying away from organized medicine for as long as humanly possible. | 07:08 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i'm not too shabby at coming with crazy ideas. | 07:08 |
| HeXiLeD | this is a good one https://twitter.com/mckellogs/status/1240474926995341317 | 07:08 |
| ryouma | dividediff[m]: all ears | 07:08 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: soaking clothes in alc to clean them? | 07:09 |
| ryouma | that would require a huge amount; no idea where we would get that. i wonder if washing soda, being stronger than baking soda, would help. or perhaps attack something other than the lipid? | 07:10 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i heard cola can be used to clean blood stains of roads. Soaking in coca cola? | 07:11 |
| ryouma | if i could get my hands on enormous quantities of generic cetaphil maybe that would work for laundry also but idk hwere to start there | 07:11 |
| dunnp | how does soap make you sick ryouma? | 07:11 |
| ryouma | it triggers angioedema | 07:11 |
| ryouma | extreme tiny quantities of it | 07:11 |
| dunnp | an allergy to soap? | 07:12 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: what about drying your clothes on hot? before washing. High temps might kill corona? | 07:12 |
| ryouma | i don't think it is an allergy, but idk the definition of allergy. it is not fixed or even touched at all by taking 4x normal dose of antihistamines for a month. so i don't think histamine is related. it has a 12h delay last i measured. | 07:13 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: if corona only can survive for 9 days on clothes, what about waiting 9 days til you wash your clothes? | 07:13 |
| ryouma | yeah getting an enormous amount of clothes and towels could do that. idk if i could get that done. we use cold water then low heat for drying. we might have to put up with shrinking if the heat in either washer or dryer would help. | 07:14 |
| ryouma | but for health raesons i use like 2 loads of laundry a day as it is so it would be ridiculous | 07:15 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: oh my | 07:15 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: you need something that can solve fats without destoying clothes, but has no scent right? | 07:16 |
| dividediff[m] | dissolve** | 07:16 |
| ryouma | that would be great | 07:17 |
| ryouma | suppose i find a magical detergent that has no soap and also is not too harmful to me. would it work against the virus? | 07:18 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i thought the first edition of soaps humans came up with were based on oils/meat. I'm not sure what they washed with that concoction tho | 07:18 |
| tinwhiskers | Hi Skylarc | 07:19 |
| ryouma | animal fat soap is no good and vegetable fat soap is no good | 07:19 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: i'd think so based on it dissolving, but we'd need joe back | 07:19 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: have you checked reddit? | 07:20 |
| ryouma | for what? | 07:21 |
| dunnp | ryouma: there are many types of sufacants that could be used with washing soda to make a more effective detergent | 07:21 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: specifically some kind of angiodema support group | 07:21 |
| ryouma | no, i had no idea ther were any and i am social media impaired | 07:21 |
| ryouma | dunnp: that would be great | 07:21 |
| ryouma | non-soap surfactants? | 07:22 |
| HeXiLeD | https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/coronaviruses-how-long-can-they-survive-on-surfaces | 07:22 |
| dunnp | I don't think that soap is really a surfacant? not sure.. | 07:23 |
| dunnp | also laundry detergent doesn't usually have soap I think | 07:23 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: wow this thing is rare! Nothing obvious on reddit about it | 07:23 |
| HeXiLeD | i am looking for info on how long can covid19 survive on paper and it seems Granted, that's the upper end of a coronavirus lifespan, but on average, researchers say this family of viruses can survive between four and five days on various materials like aluminium, wood, paper, plastic and glass. | 07:25 |
| ryouma | dividediff[m]: thanks for chekcing | 07:25 |
| HeXiLeD | 5 days on paper... damn... | 07:25 |
| Joe | ya stop getting your junk mail | 07:25 |
| Joe | it will kill you | 07:25 |
| dunnp | I wonder if SDS would cause that reaction to your skin | 07:26 |
| ryouma | sds? | 07:26 |
| dunnp | sodium dodecyl sulfate | 07:26 |
| dunnp | it is probably the most common detergent used in research labs | 07:27 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: good find. And then since the science will change over time we'd have to use the upper bounds to be safer | 07:27 |
| ryouma | ok | 07:27 |
| HeXiLeD | Joe: nah... just that i sign a lot of paperwork | 07:27 |
| Joe | all/most laundry detergents are going to have some form of sulfate in them. | 07:27 |
| Joe | UV light my dude | 07:27 |
| HeXiLeD | ummm | 07:27 |
| Joe | burn them damn things up | 07:27 |
| dividediff[m] | UV! Yo that sounds good! | 07:27 |
| ryouma | i have no idea. is sds related to soap chemically? | 07:28 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: we start going outside with a magnifying glass pointed at everyone during summer? | 07:28 |
| dunnp | no ryouma | 07:28 |
| ryouma | i wonder if i could get a large box with uv in it. would take up enormous space. you'd stick a whole load in it i guess. | 07:28 |
| HeXiLeD | on this note... could tanning beds clean a person externally | 07:29 |
| ryouma | so i go to a lab supply place, get sds, and throw it in the wash? | 07:29 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: perhaps | 07:29 |
| ryouma | (dividediff[m]: yeah angioedema is probably not that common. and dr. google says absolutely nothing about soap-related angioedema. in my searches at least.) | 07:30 |
| Joe | ryouma: that's most shampoos BTW | 07:30 |
| dunnp | you would need to mix is with washing soda | 07:30 |
| ryouma | ah good so maybe ok for consumers | 07:30 |
| dunnp | yea SDS isn't going to hurt you | 07:30 |
| dunnp | unless it gives you this skin reaction | 07:31 |
| Joe | do you have adverse reactivity to shampoos? | 07:31 |
| dividediff[m] | paper burns at 218 - 218 C | 07:31 |
| ryouma | i have avoided shampoo so i don't know. but it is possibly ok. | 07:31 |
| Joe | most shampoo is SDS and frangrance | 07:31 |
| dunnp | HeXiLeD: it doesn't clean, it damages the RNA/DNA | 07:32 |
| ryouma | sds is like sls? | 07:32 |
| dunnp | you'd need UVC though | 07:32 |
| Joe | same same | 07:32 |
| HeXiLeD | dunnp: does it render it ineffective? | 07:32 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i suspect corona can't survive on 200C paper, so that'd clean it ha | 07:32 |
| dunnp | yes it would kill it | 07:32 |
| Joe | yes SDS SLS will aid in cap destruction | 07:32 |
| dividediff[m] | dunnp: whats the temp limit on corona? | 07:33 |
| Joe | think of soaps as a bottle opener, they open the protein lipid cap and release the RNA. Not exactly it but close enough for a simple explanation. | 07:34 |
| sneep | https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-51968302 Netflix to cut streaming quality in Europe for 30 days | 07:34 |
| dividediff[m] | sneep: wow | 07:34 |
| HeXiLeD | no dough.. no flow | 07:34 |
| Joe | once it's open destruction has occurred. or if a virus can die, this is it. | 07:35 |
| dunnp | im not sure what temperature would kill a virus dividediff[m] | 07:36 |
| dividediff[m] | dunnp: aite, thxs | 07:36 |
| Joe | 200F typically | 07:36 |
| Joe | so near 100C | 07:36 |
| ryouma | presumably that would shrink all muy clothes | 07:37 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 07:37 |
| dunnp | maybe 250F at 15 psi for 15 mins | 07:37 |
| Joe | boiling water will sterilize most viruses to destruction | 07:37 |
| dunnp | autoclave :) | 07:37 |
| Joe | hence why steam is used as a disinfectant | 07:37 |
| sneep | You don't need that high temperatures | 07:37 |
| Joe | which? 100C | 07:38 |
| dividediff[m] | ryouma: if you can't come up anything, direct message me and i can help you set up a reddit account and maybe they'd lead to a few other ppl with your condition | 07:38 |
| Joe | or contact your allergist ?? | 07:38 |
| sneep | Sec, let me find that one study. I think there was one where a 30 minute water bath at 55C was enough | 07:38 |
| Joe | k | 07:39 |
| ryouma | bedridden so specialists are tricky to find and contact | 07:39 |
| ryouma | is that warm washer water? | 07:40 |
| Joe | thats about the high limit of HOT domestic water | 07:40 |
| dunnp | maybe a washer that has one of those additional water heaters in it? | 07:40 |
| sneep | https://eprints.lib.hokudai.ac.jp/dspace/bitstream/2115/10516/1/52(3)_105-112.pdf Original SARS virus though | 07:41 |
| sneep | %title | 07:41 |
| azbycx | https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/COVID-19-guidance-wearing-and-removing-personal-protective-equipment-healthcare-settings-updated.pdf | 07:41 |
| Joe | domestic hot water tends to be what 37C | 07:41 |
| Joe | sorry got tripped up converting F to C | 07:41 |
| Brainstorm | sneep, the URL could not be loaded | 07:42 |
| dunnp | wow only 56C sneep that is surprising | 07:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 06:35 UTC: Coronavirus latest: at a glance: A summary of the biggest developments in the global coronavirus outbreak — from WHO at 06:35: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/w9Mlyk | 07:42 |
| Joe | 56C is 132F thats hot, and won't be in any domestic hotwater use anywhere in the world. | 07:44 |
| sneep | The water in my kitchen is set to 65C I think | 07:45 |
| tinwhiskers | Joe: no, 37 is body temperature. It's around 60 | 07:45 |
| sneep | In my previous apartment it was even hotter | 07:45 |
| Joe | what??? | 07:45 |
| sneep | But it really depends on where you live etc. | 07:45 |
| Joe | domestic hotwater is hardly body temp | 07:45 |
| tinwhiskers | Your hot water is only body temperature? | 07:45 |
| tinwhiskers | wow | 07:45 |
| tinwhiskers | Nah, ours is well hotter than that | 07:45 |
| dunnp | my new LG washer has a sanitary cycle at 158F using an internal water heater so that would work | 07:46 |
| tinwhiskers | Hot water cylinders should normally be set to a minimum 60°C. At this temperature, bacteria cannot survive, and therefore keeps your water clean. When you set the temperature lower than this, it becomes an optimal breeding ground for Legionella bacteria, which is the main concern for hot water systems in New Zealand. | 07:46 |
| tinwhiskers | 37 is incredibly dangerous | 07:46 |
| sneep | I guess tt depends on whether it's a thing that heats up your water as you use it or whether it stores hot water in a tank | 07:47 |
| tinwhiskers | ah, true | 07:47 |
| Joe | i just walked to the basement | 07:47 |
| tinwhiskers | if it's heated at the point of use and not stored then that would be ok | 07:48 |
| Joe | i seem to be a bit off, the shower head is temp controlled at around 40C the hotwater heater is set at 50C | 07:48 |
| tinwhiskers | that's still very cool by our standards. Interesting. That's heated at point of use then? | 07:49 |
| tinwhiskers | gas? | 07:49 |
| Joe | i know the shower/tub has a some BS nanny setting on it, to not burn children or something | 07:49 |
| Joe | no oil indirect fired | 07:49 |
| dunnp | I never realized this tinwhiskers - I always set my water heater cooler to save energy | 07:49 |
| dividediff[m] | New idea | 07:49 |
| sneep | Oh, it was 56 C for 5 minutes | 07:50 |
| dividediff[m] | Instead of targetting corona, could we make bettr anti bacterial meds? | 07:50 |
| tinwhiskers | we have a wetback on the coal range and it boils the water in the tank. There is a tempering valve that mixes in cold water so you don't burn yourself. | 07:50 |
| dividediff[m] | since afaik it's the bacteria that kills rather than corona | 07:50 |
| tinwhiskers | the tempering valve is still set to about 60C though | 07:51 |
| sneep | Oh, no, 5 minutes "rapidly inactivated" and "only low infectivity" remained after 30 minutes :p | 07:51 |
| sneep | Anyway, my washing machine only uses cold water so I'm a bit worried on that front | 07:52 |
| tinwhiskers | hrm | 07:52 |
| tinwhiskers | You dry washing outside? | 07:52 |
| Joe | i can set the heater on 65C sort of, it has a rivet blocking it at 55ish | 07:52 |
| sneep | Tumble dryer, what what kind of temperature those have | 07:53 |
| ryouma | i am about to spontaneously fall asleep. appreciate the brainstorming etc very much but must afk. | 07:53 |
| tinwhiskers | gn ryouma | 07:53 |
| Joe | i would have to do some work to get it to turn up that high | 07:53 |
| sneep | ~57 C apparently | 07:53 |
| tinwhiskers | that's pretty hot | 07:53 |
| ryouma | so then all i have to do is shrink all my clothes in the dryer. maybe. | 07:54 |
| ryouma | presumably hottst setting | 07:54 |
| tinwhiskers | heh | 07:54 |
| Joe | we do have a sanitize cycle on the washer machine and the dryer? | 07:54 |
| Joe | evidently the dryer makes steam? i didn't know this or have it hooked up | 07:54 |
| ryouma | not we. just no heat, low heat, med, high i think.' | 07:54 |
| sneep | I lived in a place once where the tap water was 80-90C | 07:55 |
| Joe | tea water from the tap? | 07:55 |
| tinwhiskers | I don't even have a washing machine (use a 20L bucket) but when I go home we'll only be using cold wash as normal. I hadn't considered that. | 07:55 |
| sneep | And the shower would sometimes fail to regulate that and you'd have to hide in the corner | 07:55 |
| ryouma | before i fall asleep, why must sds or sls be combined with washing soda? | 07:55 |
| tinwhiskers | I've been kind of well prepped before I came and and while here, but when I go home to an empty farm with no garden and no livestock I will not be well prepared at all. All this prepping effort and when the rubber hits the road I'm not prepared. | 07:57 |
| Joe | it's doesn't need to but it aids in soil entrapment and odor elimination | 07:57 |
| dunnp | mine is set to 52C | 07:57 |
| Joe | dunnp: that's were mine was, a hair past the 50 mark | 07:58 |
| ryouma | ah but sls foams. sds might not i hope? | 07:59 |
| ryouma | he washer | 07:59 |
| Joe | tinwhiskers: i'm more concerned with looters than anything to be honest. | 07:59 |
| Joe | idle hands are the devils workshop | 07:59 |
| tinwhiskers | fair | 08:01 |
| Joe | the virus is scary, the government scarier, the looters are coming for sure. | 08:02 |
| Joe | and unlike elsewhere our government has a history of doing some real crazy stuff. | 08:04 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: NZ has barely conducted any tests https://ourworldindata.org/covid-testing | 08:04 |
| dividediff[m] | tho i guess they have no local spread? | 08:04 |
| tinwhiskers | Just heard a report that trump *has* now ordered the FDA to go ahead with using chloroquine | 08:04 |
| Joe | sort of | 08:04 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: yeah, no spread yet | 08:04 |
| xrogaan | Isn't there always somebody propping up chloroquine every time there is an epidemic? | 08:05 |
| tinwhiskers | xrogaan: that's true | 08:05 |
| Joe | in off label compassionate use | 08:05 |
| tinwhiskers | xrogaan: good reason to be sceptical | 08:05 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: woahwaoh chlo! | 08:05 |
| xrogaan | And it never delivers in the real world either. Works great otherwise. | 08:05 |
| Joe | yes it was a miracle for malaria, so we hope it's more than a one trick wonder | 08:05 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: okay thene no biggie on lack of tests then | 08:06 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: well, without tests how do we *know* there is no community spread?! | 08:06 |
| dividediff[m] | doesnt this mean by apr 1 we'll know if chloro works on corona? | 08:06 |
| xrogaan | people aren't getting sick. | 08:06 |
| tinwhiskers | yeah, things still look at right now | 08:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 06:49 UTC: US news: Coronavirus news: California governor issues statewide 'stay at home' order as Italy deaths pass China - live updates — from WHO at 06:49: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 08:07 |
| xrogaan | They're banking on the fact that nobody went to hospital with shortness of breath and all that. | 08:07 |
| dividediff[m] | tinwhiskers: Any travel bans in NZ? | 08:07 |
| tinwhiskers | xrogaan: that can take a couple of weeks though, so it could have just started | 08:07 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: yes, we're locked down now | 08:07 |
| xrogaan | Sure, but "governments". | 08:07 |
| dividediff[m] | uhh thats bold of NZ | 08:07 |
| xrogaan | Spain ran a disinformation campaign hoping tourists would continue to come. | 08:07 |
| xrogaan | And now they're in deep shit. | 08:08 |
| tinwhiskers | I suspect there might be a few cases of community spread but it can't be very far advanced yet, and it's possible there isn't any | 08:08 |
| dividediff[m] | doesnt this mean by apr 1 we'll know if chloroquine works on corona? | 08:08 |
| Joe | ok the governments aren't acting fast enough and private people are acting irresponsibly .... whats the solution?? | 08:08 |
| tinwhiskers | dividediff[m]: maybe | 08:08 |
| tinwhiskers | I guess so | 08:08 |
| tinwhiskers | good news! | 08:08 |
| Joe | china claims it does, but i assume they are sitting on a billion doses for sale. | 08:09 |
| xrogaan | Joe there is no solution. No solution? No problem! | 08:09 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: japans or koreas solution for democracies | 08:09 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: china's iron fist if your china | 08:10 |
| Joe | but but dividediff[m] but https://i.imgur.com/vztVf8m.jpg | 08:10 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: thats pre good ha | 08:11 |
| Joe | are you here? | 08:11 |
| Joe | in the states, if so i'm sure you get it | 08:11 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: canada | 08:11 |
| Joe | oh lucky | 08:11 |
| Joe | you can appreciate it from a small distance | 08:12 |
| Joe | lol | 08:12 |
| HeXiLeD | jim jefferies | 08:12 |
| dividediff[m] | but yea i see american news allthe time, so glad im here ha | 08:12 |
| Joe | not funny :( | 08:12 |
| Joe | lol | 08:12 |
| Joe | ok a little funny | 08:12 |
| HeXiLeD | mmhmm | 08:12 |
| dividediff[m] | Joe: did you remember to go out to buy your gun for the looters? | 08:12 |
| HeXiLeD | lol get shotgun. wide spread! widespread! | 08:13 |
| Joe | shiiiiieeeeeet i got guns | 08:13 |
| Joe | lots of guns | 08:13 |
| HeXiLeD | and a barn? | 08:13 |
| Joe | it's just a fucking reality | 08:13 |
| dividediff[m] | as a canadian, it's shocking to see corona epedemic, then immediately ppl at gun stores | 08:14 |
| Joe | our government and civil police have ummmmmm left us hanging here. All the bad guys are armed to the teeth, what am i to do? | 08:14 |
| HeXiLeD | tip of the day. lets say... joe you have 5 bullets and 8 people at you. what do you do to get them all | 08:15 |
| Joe | switch to a rifle | 08:15 |
| dividediff[m] | Yea that makes sense, but it really does look like a dog eat dog situation over there | 08:15 |
| HeXiLeD | actually ... military tip... | 08:15 |
| adventurer | where are you Joe ? | 08:16 |
| HeXiLeD | nah Joe . you dont kill any... you wound at least five but leave them alive. the others will be taken by helping the friends | 08:16 |
| Joe | not effective combat | 08:16 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: nyc | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | Joe: done military? | 08:17 |
| Joe | ya | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | for every wounded you mobilize 2 more | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | if you kill them, then you only take 1 down | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | no one rescues dead people | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | ;) | 08:17 |
| HeXiLeD | very effective | 08:17 |
| dividediff[m] | USA has really stepped up it's testing, usa is neck and neck with canada | 08:18 |
| HeXiLeD | now... where to wound them... must well done. | 08:18 |
| HeXiLeD | enough to keep them alive but not to be able to do anything | 08:18 |
| Joe | ineffective ideology for small unit tactics, engage and use overwhelming force to stop violent momentum. | 08:18 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:07 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 08:18 |
| HeXiLeD | Joe: if you have overwhelming force | 08:19 |
| Joe | who said i don't | 08:19 |
| HeXiLeD | arent we talking about looters | 08:19 |
| Joe | :) | 08:19 |
| Joe | we are | 08:19 |
| HeXiLeD | gatling gun at home? | 08:19 |
| Joe | no comment | 08:20 |
| HeXiLeD | okay.. well.. that is a diff matter | 08:20 |
| dividediff[m] | When did UK get in all of it's tests? | 08:20 |
| adventurer | I am a very small female dividediff[m] so I can imagine if anarchy comes i better get the hell out of town ...I think though China has flattened the curve they say so hopefully we all get through this | 08:20 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +161 cases (now 246278), +2 deaths (now 10060), +36 recoveries (now 88385) 🔸 Australia: +98 cases (now 854) 🔸 Austria: +17 cases (now 2196) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 279) 🔸 Bhutan: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) 🔸 Bulgaria: +5 cases (now 112) 🔸 Alberta, Canada: +27 cases (now 146), +1 deaths (now 1) [... want %more?] | 08:20 |
| Joe | adventurer: we are getting thru this, if people would just stay home!! | 08:20 |
| dividediff[m] | i thought boris's plan was to do not much but alright test numbers | 08:21 |
| Timvde | dividediff[m]: if only the US didn't botch their earlu testing... | 08:21 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: which country? | 08:21 |
| HeXiLeD | or you could use the gatling gun to help cleaning on the momentum | 08:21 |
| HeXiLeD | :P | 08:21 |
| dividediff[m] | Timvde: oh ic, they did canada lvl of tests but messed up a lot of them | 08:21 |
| adventurer | Australia | 08:21 |
| Timvde | Yea | 08:21 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: i dont think we will see a purge type scenario | 08:22 |
| Joe | we effectively missed the window to close everything and stayed in denial for two weeks while we figured out how and who to test. | 08:22 |
| Timvde | I just got out of bed, but this was probably linked here at some point: https://www.businessinsider.com/early-coronavirus-cdc-tests-distinguish-covid-water-2020-3 | 08:22 |
| Joe | the CDC is a joke company propped up by tax dollars to sell vaccines IMO. | 08:23 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: .au is big maybe a month or 2 to the interior and come back later? | 08:23 |
| adventurer | hopefully it stays out of indigenous communities | 08:24 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: how are things in australia | 08:24 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: probably not if we start going there | 08:24 |
| adventurer | they are increasingly putting rules down. they are saying keep a distance of 1.5m | 08:24 |
| dividediff[m] | Timvde: "couldn't distinguish between coronavirus and water" ahh a classic lol | 08:25 |
| adventurer | only 100 people together in one room 4 square metres per person | 08:25 |
| HeXiLeD | speaking of which... small amazon indigenous tribes could be wiped | 08:25 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: no state of emergency yet? | 08:25 |
| adventurer | yeah each state declared a state of emergency | 08:26 |
| adventurer | they are slowly adding more restrictions | 08:26 |
| dividediff[m] | !cases australia | 08:26 |
| CovBot | In Australia there have been a total of 854 cases as of 2020-03-20 07:00:00 UTC. Of these 801 (93.8%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 46 (5.4%) have definitely recovered and 7 (0.8%) have died. | 08:26 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: any deniers around? or are people understanding? | 08:26 |
| adventurer | Well | 08:26 |
| dividediff[m] | !cases canada | 08:27 |
| CovBot | In Canada there have been a total of 873 cases as of 2020-03-20 07:00:00 UTC. Of these 850 (97.4%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 11 (1.3%) have definitely recovered and 12 (1.4%) have died. | 08:27 |
| adventurer | I do Ubereats...things are a lot quieter but at some places people today were still at cafes...to the older men i felt like i wish they went home to protect themselves but i think the government is bringing nin more restrictions so maybe i wont see all the elderlies having their coffees next week | 08:27 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: thought so, your guys numbers are better than ours | 08:28 |
| adventurer | supermarkets are cleaned out of pasta and toilet paper but they are trying to refill stuff | 08:28 |
| adventurer | where ar eyou dividediff[m] | 08:28 |
| HeXiLeD | that seems counter productive to the gov. lets put it this way... those may be pensioners. | 08:28 |
| Joe | lol | 08:28 |
| adventurer | they are contact tracing known cases | 08:29 |
| Joe | will you stop killing all the pensions in the doomsday, why does everyone keep doing that? | 08:29 |
| dividediff[m] | canada | 08:29 |
| adventurer | but...there is no some community transmission i heard of around Sydney and the Gold Coast QLD | 08:29 |
| adventurer | dividediff[m], community transmission there? | 08:30 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: community transmission in a few places here. We have a few provinces with no cases than i'm hoping can rebuild the destroyed areas afterwars | 08:30 |
| dividediff[m] | than = that** | 08:30 |
| HeXiLeD | has anyone noticed some governments bringing/requesting retiree doctors and nurses over 60 to come join the front line battle against covid19? Is this not interesting? I think they should start bringing retiree politicians | 08:30 |
| adventurer | haha hex17or | 08:30 |
| adventurer | i mean HeXiLeD | 08:30 |
| adventurer | well.. | 08:30 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i thought thats only in italy? | 08:30 |
| adventurer | i had the same thought | 08:30 |
| HeXiLeD | true. dividediff[m] no. there are more countries doing it in .eu. Portugal too | 08:31 |
| adventurer | it's between we have to protect the elderly but they are doing the same thing here asking some retired doctors and nurses back and also...speeding along medical students and asking them to start working now | 08:31 |
| HeXiLeD | very interesting... | 08:31 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: are you guys testing enough? ourworldindata seems to be lacking autralia | 08:32 |
| adventurer | I walked down a hallway and over a bridge i stuck to my side and others got it and stuck to their side keeping a big distance...others hand no idea and walked right next to | 08:32 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: makes sense that might expand to evy western country at this rate | 08:33 |
| adventurer | they are starting to test more but on facebook i hear people with symptoms having major freak outs about being unable to get tested as they hadn't been over seas | 08:33 |
| HeXiLeD | i keep wondering about this testing. say... you test now and are clean, 3 days later you bump into someone infected not knowing.. and then? walk around thinking to be clean? | 08:33 |
| HeXiLeD | there will probably be people with colds thinking they have covid19. natural panic | 08:34 |
| adventurer | they had limited testing ability due to supply of some parts needed | 08:34 |
| adventurer | i think they are trying to fix this and test more | 08:34 |
| adventurer | some of the parts they got from Italy they couldn't get | 08:35 |
| azbycx | have seen / heard similar here too, they only will test the really sick here. | 08:35 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: found some evidence, the testing rate sounds reasonable in comaprison to other countries | 08:35 |
| adventurer | oh that's good to know dividediff[m] | 08:35 |
| tinwhiskers | Among the dross there's some really informative discussion about chloroquine here: https://science.slashdot.org/story/20/03/19/1810209/fda-testing-coronavirus-treatments-including-chloroquine-plasma-from-recovered-covid-19-patients | 08:36 |
| Joe | there is still very limited testing here and you need a doctors prescription for it | 08:36 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: S korea or/and japan does like multi testing to avoid cases like this i believe. i forget which, prob korea | 08:36 |
| dividediff[m] | azbycx: adventurer ; same testing policy here. If you haven't been across seas, no test for u | 08:37 |
| Joe | and even then you have to fit the criteria of exposure | 08:37 |
| HeXiLeD | yah multi testing is the way to go. | 08:37 |
| adventurer | I got the flu vaccine today | 08:37 |
| adventurer | southern hemisphere it just came out | 08:37 |
| adventurer | $20 at the pharmacy | 08:37 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: is all the tp gone yet? | 08:38 |
| Joe | oh it's almost fall! | 08:38 |
| adventurer | tp? | 08:38 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: toliet paper. | 08:38 |
| adventurer | yeah no toilet paper haha | 08:38 |
| HeXiLeD | i still dont get the toilet paper rush. are people that full of shit | 08:38 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: also, we'll see if trump's earlier theory about corona being afraid of summer works in australia | 08:38 |
| adventurer | soon we will need to wash in the bath perhaps but...they say there is a factory operating 24/7 | 08:38 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: lolol | 08:38 |
| adventurer | dividediff[m], that's not good as we are going into winter | 08:39 |
| Joe | HeXiLeD: i read it's mostly cathartic in nature to buy TP like that | 08:39 |
| adventurer | it's possible, I guessed the same about the summer thing just extrapolating from the flu...but this thing is new and noone is immune so we really don't knwo for sure | 08:39 |
| HeXiLeD | and the second one is bottled water. wtf?!. no plumbing ? | 08:39 |
| dividediff[m] | tp companies here said they can ram up production. I imagine by the time corona will past we'll have taken down a national forest for tp ha | 08:39 |
| HeXiLeD | lolol dividediff[m] | 08:40 |
| HeXiLeD | costco lines are for tp and water | 08:40 |
| HeXiLeD | ready ... people... really | 08:40 |
| dividediff[m] | I figured out a good way for canada to make it thru this. Canada can trade toliet paper for other countries ventilators. | 08:41 |
| adventurer | oh sad story of today | 08:41 |
| HeXiLeD | are you saying that canada a major producer of shit and hence it can supply the world?:P | 08:42 |
| azbycx | some of the sold pricing for toilet paper on ebay.com is crazy. | 08:42 |
| azbycx | 155,000.00 for 2 squares? sold? | 08:42 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: haha hear of krueger? i think its them, apparently they're a big tp name. At least thats what they said the other day | 08:43 |
| adventurer | so the government brought in limits to the amount of medication people could get to stop people bulk buying...when i went to get my flu vax an elderly lady came to get her medication and the pharmacy staff had to say to her, "I am sorry dear we can only give you one lot this time but you can come back again next week"...it's like...she'd obviously not prepping her her the medicine!! but you can't say that...they have to follow the | 08:43 |
| adventurer | rule...just an example of following rules and it actually being stupid in the real world | 08:43 |
| adventurer | s/her her/give her | 08:44 |
| Brainstorm | adventurer meant to say: so the government brought in limits to the amount of medication people could get to stop people bulk buying...when i went to get my flu vax an elderly lady came to get her medication and the pharmacy staff had to say to her, "I am sorry dear we can only give you one lot this time but you can come back again next week"...it's like...she'd obviously not prepping give her the medicine!! but you can't say that.. | 08:44 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: i haven't heard of ppl hoarding meds here. I think the OTC section is low however | 08:44 |
| adventurer | if they gave her the medicine and she didn't come back next week that might decrease her chances of catching it | 08:45 |
| Brainstorm | HeXiLeD: Do as you wish! | 08:45 |
| HeXiLeD | i know | 08:45 |
| dividediff[m] | That post is from ww1/ww2 | 08:45 |
| dividediff[m] | poster** | 08:45 |
| HeXiLeD | eheh | 08:45 |
| HeXiLeD | big fines | 08:46 |
| dividediff[m] | Looking at the poster made me realize, did ppl not used to hoard tp? | 08:46 |
| adventurer | maybe the pharmacy should do medicine deliveries to over 50s | 08:47 |
| HeXiLeD | probably not. makes no sense. one would hoard basic ingredients to be able to make food and meals which makes sense | 08:47 |
| adventurer | so they don't even have to come in | 08:47 |
| adventurer | they just drop it at their door | 08:47 |
| adventurer | or post it | 08:47 |
| adventurer | no contact...less likely to catach stuff | 08:47 |
| HeXiLeD | if Z gen had money they would probably be hoarding smartphones and blinky things | 08:47 |
| HeXiLeD | generational priorities i guess | 08:48 |
| adventurer | my thoughts of flu vax was by getting it i am helping not to spread the flu at least to an elderly person which is also dangerous | 08:49 |
| xrogaan | https://www.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/flk7ex/this_is_what_coronavirus_looks_like_in_an_italian/ | 08:49 |
| xrogaan | https://www.reddit.com/r/Coronavirus/comments/fln1vn/chinese_doctor_in_italy_saythe_lockdown_are_not/ | 08:50 |
| xrogaan | %title | 08:50 |
| Brainstorm | xrogaan, the URL could not be loaded | 08:50 |
| adventurer | https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=514263162611288¬if_id=1584688629819973¬if_t=watch_follower_video | 08:50 |
| adventurer | Bob Katter called for northern QLD to be closed off | 08:50 |
| adventurer | he has a heart of gold but he gets some of the facts mixed up | 08:51 |
| adventurer | like he called it a bacteria | 08:51 |
| adventurer | but it's going to be bad if it goes in remote communities | 08:51 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: i agree with the notion. Areas in canada high with natives prob are lacking in hospital equipment compared to like toronto | 08:52 |
| dividediff[m] | Spaish and italian clap, wuhanians cheer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpn5w8Pq25c | 08:53 |
| xrogaan | this is pretty impressive https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YfsdJGj3-jM | 08:53 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 07:38 UTC: US news: Coronavirus live updates: California governor issues statewide 'stay at home' order as Italy deaths pass China — from WHO at 07:38: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 08:55 |
| adventurer | it's all a bit scary though | 09:02 |
| dividediff[m] | New systems from top-tier Chinese tech firms require passengers to provide personal information before taking buses, trains or taxis. The data collection is intended to build a trip history for each citizen and monitor those who might have been in contact with COVID-19 patients. | 09:02 |
| adventurer | i just hope the government doesn't keep it's new powers after all this is over | 09:02 |
| HeXiLeD | that will be interesting | 09:03 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: i was thinking we're prob gonna see some new dictorships spring up after thsi is over | 09:03 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: Did youi get your flu vaccination? | 09:03 |
| adventurer | if only they make a vaccine sooner raather than later | 09:03 |
| euod[m] | <adventurer "i just hope the government doesn"> why would they give it up? | 09:03 |
| adventurer | yeah i did mandiblegrip did you | 09:03 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: I thought it wasn't available until the end of the month?! | 09:03 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: So it's just available everywhere now? Are there special requirements? Do you need an appointment or anything? | 09:04 |
| adventurer | it's not available through the doctors to the end of the month but it is in some chemists | 09:04 |
| adventurer | something like that | 09:04 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: How would I find out which? I rang chemists earlier this month and they said it wasn't available yet. | 09:04 |
| dividediff[m] | " Coronavirus outbreak: China returns to work as government eases restrictions " they're really managing huh | 09:05 |
| adventurer | there was a big sign FLU VAX $20 so it seemed like the right thing to do | 09:05 |
| adventurer | try again i only saw it yesterday and today | 09:05 |
| adventurer | maybe it's just come out | 09:05 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: Huh. I've just been inside for three weeks. OK, thanks. | 09:05 |
| adventurer | they hope to get just about everyone vaccinated this year | 09:05 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: Yeah, I wanted to beat the rush. | 09:05 |
| adventurer | https://www.priceline.com.au/pharmacy-services/vaccines/flu-clinics | 09:06 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +176 cases (now 246454), +1 deaths (now 10061), +13 recoveries (now 88398) 🔸 Armenia: +14 cases (now 136) 🔸 Australia: +120 cases (now 876) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 2203) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 279) 🔸 Belarus: +18 cases (now 69), +10 recoveries (now 15) 🔸 Bhutan: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) [... want %more?] | 09:06 |
| mefistofeles | %cases Germany | 09:06 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: I was too early :( | 09:06 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Germany, there are 15320 cases, 44 deaths (0.3% of cases), 115 recoveries as of March 20, 08:04Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 09:06 |
| adventurer | yeah that's what I thought...the optimum time is apparently mid April according to someone I heard but...who knows how crazy things will be by then, maybe by then we wont be able to go out so i figured i would get it now. | 09:06 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: Cheers. | 09:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 08:04 UTC: Psychology experts share their tips for safeguarding your mental health during quarantine: As people across the globe adjust to prolonged periods of quarantine, CNBC Make It spoke to psychology experts to find out how people can protect their mental health. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/tNxW3s | 09:07 |
| adventurer | the reason then was better is because it starts to wear off...but who knows what will happen between now and then so i got it. seemed like the right thing to do | 09:07 |
| xrogaan | %data US | 09:07 |
| Brainstorm | xrogaan: In all areas, US, there are 14366 cases, 217 deaths (1.5% of cases), 125 recoveries as of March 20, 08:04Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 09:07 |
| xrogaan | Look at that beautiful curve. A perfect curve. Best curve! | 09:08 |
| adventurer | I didn't book though I just walked in and said, "Do you guys have flu shots?" you fill out some paperwork and then after have to wait 15 mintues to make sure you are ok | 09:09 |
| adventurer | less flu around though everyone getting vaccinated might help people focus on corona | 09:10 |
| adventurer | through | 09:10 |
| xrogaan | oh, it doubled in one day. | 09:10 |
| adventurer | where xrogaan | 09:10 |
| xrogaan | in the US | 09:10 |
| dividediff[m] | Cruise companies might never recover from this | 09:10 |
| dividediff[m] | I used to imagine them as luxurious, now i imagine them as petri dishes | 09:11 |
| HeXiLeD | does not look like anyone will recover from this | 09:11 |
| xrogaan | The economy will not recover, this is at the level of the Great Depression. | 09:11 |
| HeXiLeD | air canada temporarily lays off over 5,000 employees | 09:11 |
| HeXiLeD | TTC confirms first case | 09:11 |
| dividediff[m] | bad time to be a pilot | 09:12 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: i don't know much about economics, do you have background in it? | 09:12 |
| HeXiLeD | massive lineup at EB games... | 09:12 |
| HeXiLeD | pack of dumb | 09:13 |
| adventurer | wht are they lining up for hex17or ? | 09:13 |
| HeXiLeD | EB Games (which was scheduled to hold a midnight release of the new Animal Crossing) and others have been told it's "business as usual." | 09:13 |
| adventurer | i mean HeXiLeD | 09:13 |
| Jigsy | %data China | 09:13 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, China, there are 81199 cases, 3253 deaths (4.0% of cases), 71265 recoveries as of March 11, 02:18Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=China for time series data. Fatality can be broadly expected to lie between 1.3% (assuming deaths/cases with ⅔ of cases undetected), and less than 4.4% (considering only deaths and recoveries). | 09:13 |
| HeXiLeD | Toronto/canada | 09:13 |
| Jigsy | More cases then? | 09:13 |
| HeXiLeD | probably | 09:13 |
| adventurer | eb games might not be around much longer everyone will just be downloading stuff from the internet or ordering it in the post | 09:14 |
| aradesh | morning all | 09:14 |
| adventurer | hi aradesh | 09:14 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: yah... | 09:14 |
| HeXiLeD | they may shutdown after all this | 09:14 |
| dividediff[m] | hi | 09:14 |
| HeXiLeD | everything gone digital... | 09:14 |
| HeXiLeD | anyone alive here now misses the arcade days ? | 09:15 |
| HeXiLeD | ... anyone... ? | 09:15 |
| dividediff[m] | Has anybody read about the economic dmg corona will cause? | 09:15 |
| HeXiLeD | i ve heard a few podcasts | 09:15 |
| aradesh | dividediff[m]: not read about it, but i have thought about how severe it could be | 09:15 |
| HeXiLeD | it is all around a market reset | 09:15 |
| xrogaan | dividediff[m]: everything's crashing down. The system is built on a house of cards, and it's been blown away. | 09:16 |
| adventurer | Coronavirus update from Scomo https://www.facebook.com/scottmorrison4cook/videos/347577742845201/?v=514263162611288¬if_id=1584688629819973¬if_t=watch_follower_video | 09:16 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: aradesh whats a market reset? How bad will it be ranging from great depression to like 2008 | 09:16 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: Scomo | 09:16 |
| adventurer | Scott Morrison, prime minister of Australia = Scomo | 09:17 |
| xrogaan | dividediff[m]: if you think things are hard now, wait a month to realize it hasn't ended yet. | 09:17 |
| aradesh | it could be similar to the great depression | 09:17 |
| aradesh | in my opinion | 09:17 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: probably worse but the great depression was decades ago in 1930's | 09:17 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: ahh the famous australian slang | 09:17 |
| adventurer | well i have stopped worrying about not being skinny enough | 09:17 |
| aradesh | adventurer: lol | 09:17 |
| aradesh | could come in useful | 09:17 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: thats the spirit haha | 09:17 |
| dividediff[m] | Anyone think post-corona will be worse than the great depression? | 09:19 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 08:15 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Buongiorno, mentre eravate via — from WHO at 08:15: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/XKMmoy | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | the only advantage of being skinny enough is to be able to outside during a rainy day without an umbrella and not get wet | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: nah | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: every country is halting the economy. | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | it would be bad if some did not. | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | so we will reset all at the same time | 09:19 |
| HeXiLeD | and start at the same way | 09:20 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: Huh that doesn't sound so bad? Like turning a light on and off. | 09:20 |
| HeXiLeD | that is what i think but... i am not an economist or a wall street coke user | 09:20 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: kinda | 09:20 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: ha fair. | 09:20 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: how's china's economy doing? Since most of their provinces are operational | 09:21 |
| HeXiLeD | no clue but one wonders if this will not boost chinas economy after. Specially if they find a cure | 09:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +286 cases (now 246740) 🔶 Luxembourg: +283 cases (now 618) 🔸 Armenia: +14 cases (now 136) 🔸 Australia: +120 cases (now 876) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 2203) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 279) 🔸 Belarus: +18 cases (now 69), +10 recoveries (now 15) 🔸 Bhutan: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) 🔸 Brazil: +7 cases (now 647) [... want %more?] | 09:21 |
| HeXiLeD | right now, they are slowly getting back to production | 09:22 |
| HeXiLeD | i think apple already opened a again | 09:22 |
| HeXiLeD | but... also one needs to have in mind that if the rest of the world is not able to buy... then, what good is to produce | 09:22 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: If china is the one that finds a cure AND their economy stays operational, we'll be calling xi jing daddy xijing the way the chinese naitonal supposedly do | 09:22 |
| euod[m] | "He was not worried about his family or his older relatives — “we’re all in good health” — and has gone ahead with plans to take a vacation in Arizona, where he plans to visit family and go out to restaurants as usual. The only bummer, he said, is that some parts of the Grand Canyon are closed." | 09:23 |
| xrogaan | HeXiLeD: you are forgetting the entropy we have set. Many businesses will go bankrupt, meaning that once the economy needs to restart, those won't be present to offer jobs. | 09:24 |
| HeXiLeD | "he"? euod[m] | 09:24 |
| xrogaan | So, lots of people without a job. Which is bad. | 09:24 |
| euod[m] | reference: https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/coronavirus-deniers-outbreak-hoax/2020/03/19/46bc5e46-6872-11ea-b313-df458622c2cc_story.html | 09:24 |
| euod[m] | <xrogaan "So, lots of people without a job"> majority of people without a job, probably, given knock on effects. | 09:24 |
| dividediff[m] | we have antivaxxers, climate deniers, now corona deniers | 09:25 |
| HeXiLeD | xrogaan: true unless the gov safes them. This can be done in 2 ways. The gov gives the biz bailout $$ or gives the banks to give to biz | 09:25 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: thats a 10/10 point | 09:25 |
| euod[m] | dividediff: yeah, I especially liked the ones claiming that going out to bars and things was all part of "owning the libs". | 09:25 |
| dividediff[m] | but yeah won't things like the airplane industry pick up again? | 09:25 |
| xrogaan | Also, what matter isn't the money but the stuff. People need to make stuff first in order to sell something. | 09:26 |
| HeXiLeD | umm... may take time | 09:26 |
| euod[m] | why would it? people won't have money to buy plane tickets. | 09:26 |
| xrogaan | So if you only have money right now, it'll become worthless. | 09:26 |
| HeXiLeD | market reset | 09:26 |
| sneep | https://epmonthly.com/article/not-heroes-wear-capes-one-las-vegas-ed-saved-hundreds-lives-worst-mass-shooting-u-s-history/ Here's a story about a doc who used one ventilator on two patients at the same time. (Maybe less likely to work when it's a disease rather than an injury) | 09:26 |
| HeXiLeD | euod[m]: wouldnt we love to see those covid19 deniers catching it? | 09:27 |
| xrogaan | sneep: aren't there some case in NY already? | 09:27 |
| sneep | Are there? | 09:27 |
| xrogaan | sneep: https://twitter.com/peterattiamd/status/1240293938684018688?s=21 | 09:27 |
| dividediff[m] | sneep: double ventilator is being used already in many places atm afaik | 09:27 |
| euod[m] | HeXiLeD: maybe. the problem is that people being shitheads doesn't necessarily kill themselves. | 09:27 |
| dividediff[m] | whats gonna happen to the money in our bank accounts? | 09:27 |
| sneep | :o | 09:27 |
| xrogaan | what money? | 09:28 |
| euod[m] | dividediff: isn't it obvious? it's worth a lot less now already. | 09:28 |
| HeXiLeD | what money | 09:28 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 09:28 |
| HeXiLeD | yah | 09:28 |
| dividediff[m] | sneep: double ventilator has problems i've heard, it doesn't provide enough for prolonged use | 09:29 |
| HeXiLeD | overall the way i am looking at things is simple. The people at the top need the bottom to sustain itself to make sure they remain at the top. So they will be motivated to get everyone on track again | 09:29 |
| dividediff[m] | maybe panic buying makes some sense then, convert the money into physical items while possible | 09:29 |
| HeXiLeD | those people (many) done even know how to make a soup | 09:29 |
| HeXiLeD | *dont | 09:30 |
| euod[m] | dividediff: there's nothing you could buy that has meaningful tangible value. things like supermarkets, costco, etc all rely on just in time delivery. in a normal day the stock that's on the shelf is close to what they have in total. as soon as people start panic buying, even a small amount of extra sales results in zero on the shelf. | 09:31 |
| xrogaan | dividediff[m]: you should buy gold or silver instead. | 09:31 |
| adventurer | ]I just hoping it doesn't just slowly go along in Australia then explode when we reach winter | 09:31 |
| adventurer | because they might get some false sense of security | 09:32 |
| adventurer | like the beat it | 09:32 |
| xrogaan | HeXiLeD: oh, come on. You just put stuff in a pot, boil it then mix it. | 09:32 |
| HeXiLeD | xrogaan: yes that easy. Many do not know | 09:32 |
| adventurer | then be not prepared | 09:32 |
| dividediff[m] | bitcoin? | 09:32 |
| adventurer | hopefully somehow it can be avoided | 09:32 |
| adventurer | doesn't seem likely | 09:32 |
| dividediff[m] | Is bitcoin a good purchase? | 09:32 |
| xrogaan | bitcoin is garbage. | 09:32 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: with summer time these virus tend to slow down but then come back stronger | 09:33 |
| HeXiLeD | that is usually what happens | 09:33 |
| xrogaan | People bought a lot of bitcoin, but you can't buy anything with bitcoin alone. So people will need *real* money, to get that they'll sell their bitcoin, which will drive the price down. | 09:33 |
| dividediff[m] | Who are western countries borrowing money from to fuel relief efforts? | 09:33 |
| xrogaan | They don't borrow money, the central bank creates a bunch of money instead. | 09:34 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: biotcoin always seemed unreliable | 09:34 |
| adventurer | dividediff[m], it htink it all goes around in a circle with smoke and mirrors | 09:34 |
| adventurer | just kidding i don't kow | 09:34 |
| HeXiLeD | speaking of which ... is it dropping? | 09:34 |
| dividediff[m] | inflation. Has the money printing already started? | 09:35 |
| xrogaan | since 2008, yeah. | 09:35 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: but it hasn't picked up significantly due to corona? | 09:35 |
| euod[m] | lol no | 09:35 |
| euod[m] | it crashed 50% almost instantly. | 09:36 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: it = money printing** | 09:36 |
| xrogaan | the US fed plans to inject around 7.5 trillions to bailout the companies. | 09:36 |
| xrogaan | QE comprised. | 09:37 |
| xrogaan | It's not backed by anything, it's magic money. | 09:37 |
| xrogaan | well, it's backed by the government. But the government is backed by the people. | 09:38 |
| dividediff[m] | which reduces the value of money. | 09:38 |
| xrogaan | So the government would issue "bonds" people would buy. Except that people don't have any money, nearly everybody is broke. | 09:38 |
| dividediff[m] | OH thats why bonds have been... increasing? in price | 09:39 |
| dividediff[m] | i saw stocks were weird but some of them were doing up and some down | 09:39 |
| dividediff[m] | going** = doing | 09:39 |
| dividediff[m] | I checked inflation on some random website and it still looks the same so far, idk if it's the wrong site or something | 09:40 |
| HeXiLeD | we could lose these people too https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XkYRI48bXRw Coronavirus outbreak: Miami spring breakers vow to keep partying amid pandemic | 09:41 |
| xrogaan | Effects doesn't happen right away. You can see a change in stock prices though. | 09:41 |
| dividediff[m] | darn... hmm, maybe i will buy gold | 09:42 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 08:24 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 09:43 |
| dividediff[m] | how long roughly before i should like panic buy silver/gold? | 09:43 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: that was like 2 days ago luckily. I thought miami shunt down it's beaches? | 09:44 |
| xrogaan | now | 09:45 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: darn it | 09:46 |
| dividediff[m] | ATM, nobody is borrowing money from china? | 09:47 |
| dividediff[m] | N95 > surgical masks | 09:51 |
| dividediff[m] | https://www.financegeek.org/news/anti-viral-masks-coronavirus/ | 09:51 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: "Coronavirus comes for spring break: Local officials close Florida beaches after governor refuses to" | 09:53 |
| xrogaan | dividediff[m]: don't do anything based on what I tell you, you'd be a fool :p | 09:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 08:39 UTC: Coronavirus symptoms: what are they and should I see a doctor?: What are the symptoms caused by the new coronavirus, how does it spread, and should you call a doctor? — from WHO at 08:39: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/RvARMd | 09:55 |
| Joe | wtf is wrong with FLA??? | 09:56 |
| HeXiLeD | good info on the masks dividediff[m] | 09:56 |
| HeXiLeD | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LwqhvRcBrK4 How China Is Reshaping the Coronavirus Narrative | NYT News | 09:57 |
| dividediff[m] | xrogaan: thumbs up, its worth considering | 09:58 |
| mefistofeles | Joe: FLA? | 10:01 |
| Joe | florida | 10:01 |
| Zalyssa | Flemish Lemon Association | 10:01 |
| mefistofeles | %cases Florida | 10:01 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In Florida, US, there are 432 cases, 9 deaths (2.1% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 10:01 |
| Strantrickt[m] | %data Turkey | 10:01 |
| Brainstorm | Strantrickt[m]: In all areas, Turkey, there are 359 cases, 4 deaths (1.1% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 01:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data. | 10:01 |
| Joe | FLA is trying to be italy | 10:02 |
| HeXiLeD | FLA? | 10:02 |
| mefistofeles | Florida | 10:02 |
| mefistofeles | xD | 10:02 |
| HeXiLeD | ah | 10:02 |
| HeXiLeD | too many acronyms around | 10:02 |
| Joe | thats the postal code for florida, usa | 10:03 |
| Joe | also the rapper Flo Rida | 10:04 |
| mefistofeles | Joe: why do you say that? People going out and gathering in beaches or something? | 10:04 |
| Joe | indeed | 10:04 |
| mefistofeles | yeah, people can be really careless and stupid, they don't think they should be doing something special | 10:05 |
| mefistofeles | now, it's better beaches than closed spaces, fwiw :P | 10:05 |
| dividediff[m] | "Alberta is testing at a very high rate, higher than all except two countries in the world." | 10:06 |
| HeXiLeD | url dividediff[m] ? | 10:06 |
| mefistofeles | dividediff[m]: that's interesting | 10:06 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 08:55 UTC: M&S warns of temporary store closures due to Covid-19 as firms await wage rescue plan - business live: The retailer was among a number of companies including Wetherspoons and Foxtons to warn on the impact of the pandemic as the chancellor prepares a package to protect wages and jobs [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/sZN454 | 10:07 |
| dividediff[m] | https://www.alberta.ca/covid-19-alberta-data.aspx | 10:07 |
| dividediff[m] | https://www.ontario.ca/page/2019-novel-coronavirus#section-0 | 10:07 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: https://www.reddit.com/r/CanadaCoronavirus/comments/flo9cx/alberta_population_43m_tested_17013_people_while/ | 10:07 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +237 cases (now 246977), +13 deaths (now 10074), +5 recoveries (now 88403) 🔸 Afghanistan: +2 cases (now 24) 🔸 Armenia: +14 cases (now 136) 🔸 Australia: +120 cases (now 876) 🔸 Austria: +24 cases (now 2203) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 279) 🔸 Belarus: +18 cases (now 69), +10 recoveries (now 15) 🔸 Bhutan: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Bolivia: +2 cases (now 17) [... want %more?] | 10:07 |
| adventurer | they ran out of hand sanitizer...one chemist i know of is making their own...but most people i guess would be running out of it | 10:07 |
| adventurer | i asked at a chemist i went to today and they said they ran out....i had hoped they would make their own like the other one i heard of | 10:08 |
| adventurer | so i will travel to the one that makes it to get some | 10:08 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: careful about travelling! In canada keep 2m apart | 10:09 |
| mefistofeles | https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/covid-19-tests-country fwiw | 10:10 |
| dividediff[m] | Apparently social distancing March 19, 2020 | 10:13 |
| dividediff[m] | https://streamable.com/ez23d | 10:13 |
| dividediff[m] | toronto airport | 10:13 |
| dividediff[m] | "U.S. ventilator manufacturer stops international shipments to Canada due to U.S. emergency demand" | 10:14 |
| adventurer | They are keeping the schools open | 10:15 |
| HeXiLeD | adventurer: there? | 10:15 |
| adventurer | it's like a death sentence to elderly parents | 10:15 |
| adventurer | yes | 10:15 |
| adventurer | almost like ... | 10:15 |
| adventurer | my uncle is in his 60s with a teen daughter | 10:16 |
| HeXiLeD | isolate the elders and have the young deliver them stuff and drop it at the door | 10:16 |
| adventurer | 2 weeks and it's going to be bed if italy is anything to go by | 10:16 |
| adventurer | yeah but...we are not in charge | 10:16 |
| adventurer | some other people are in charge and we have to do what they say | 10:16 |
| adventurer | it's the law | 10:17 |
| adventurer | so they keep the schools open | 10:17 |
| adventurer | with kids going home to elderly parents in somme cases | 10:17 |
| HeXiLeD | are people forced to go? | 10:17 |
| adventurer | bad not bed | 10:17 |
| adventurer | well...i heard at least one case of a lady who kept her son diagnosed with cancer at 6 home and they treatened her with fines and all sorts | 10:17 |
| HeXiLeD | if everyone disobeys at the same time. no one goes to jail | 10:18 |
| adventurer | this is not good | 10:18 |
| HeXiLeD | not possible | 10:18 |
| adventurer | yeah but they really do make people's lives hell | 10:18 |
| adventurer | i mean they probably could | 10:18 |
| adventurer | liek the mother with the son with cancer | 10:18 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: In japan they came up with a peak corona type formula | 10:19 |
| adventurer | i guess most others would just do what the government forces them | 10:19 |
| adventurer | but why are they dictating and mircomanaging everyone's lives | 10:19 |
| adventurer | what's that dividediff[m] ? | 10:19 |
| adventurer | my uncle will probably die if he gets this | 10:19 |
| adventurer | he had heart surgery not that many years ago | 10:19 |
| adventurer | but his daughter still goes off to highschool each day | 10:20 |
| adventurer | we havae no choice right | 10:20 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: Think about the first local transmission case in a given city. Now 3 months from that will have peak corona. Ofc corona has only been around for 3 months so nobody know for sure, but as an estimate. | 10:20 |
| adventurer | the other annoying thing is local news is often behind a paywall here | 10:21 |
| adventurer | i will try to find out about local transmissions more | 10:21 |
| dividediff[m] | So i don't think you guys will get to italy lvl in 2 weeks, depending on what your gov does. It realllllly should close schools tho | 10:21 |
| dividediff[m] | I wrote 2 letters to trudeau (PM) and called my 3 local representatives a few days ago when canada was doing very little | 10:22 |
| mandiblegrip | My family runs a child care centre. We are being forced to stay open because it is an "essential service". | 10:22 |
| mandiblegrip | In Australia. | 10:22 |
| mandiblegrip | The thing is, if you close the school/child care centre, all the parents that have their kids there have to find alternative arrangements. | 10:23 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: gggg... dedicated... man. Do you think they read it? | 10:23 |
| mandiblegrip | Someone made the point to me that this might entail leaving children to stay with elderly grandparents, but I think that's a weak point. | 10:23 |
| adventurer | they don't care about us | 10:23 |
| HeXiLeD | mandiblegrip: yah | 10:23 |
| adventurer | they would put us to jail without a sigh for not doing as told | 10:23 |
| adventurer | or fine us | 10:23 |
| adventurer | or worse | 10:23 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: i got thru to a receptionist at my mayors office. I don't know if she past the message on tho. She was pleasant to talk to so there was that at least ha | 10:23 |
| euod[m] | <mandiblegrip "The thing is, if you close the s"> why? it's not like anybody is working. | 10:24 |
| adventurer | what i mean is | 10:24 |
| mandiblegrip | euod[m]: Except people that are. | 10:24 |
| adventurer | my parents, my anties and uncles they all might die soon | 10:24 |
| euod[m] | <mandiblegrip "euod: Except people that are."> then they're fucking idiots. | 10:24 |
| HeXiLeD | this thing about letting kids staying with the elder and get retirees back to work to fight covid... is very very interesting. All these pensioners... | 10:24 |
| mandiblegrip | euod[m]: "Essential services" | 10:24 |
| euod[m] | yes, that's very likely. | 10:24 |
| HeXiLeD | mandiblegrip: cant you "cause" some sort of problem in the facility that will render it .. not usable ;) | 10:25 |
| mandiblegrip | HeXiLeD: I don't think it's a strong point. Everyone should just be at home basically, except those that must provide their service. | 10:25 |
| HeXiLeD | you know... upsy daisy... | 10:25 |
| mandiblegrip | HeXiLeD: I don't know man. What I do know is that it is definitely coming to my family, likely via my mother (the manager of the child care centre), and then the centre will close. | 10:25 |
| mandiblegrip | So I am making preparations for that. | 10:25 |
| adventurer | they don't care about our kids getting cared for by grandparents they are inviting the grandparents back to hospitals to fight this | 10:26 |
| adventurer | i guess they do | 10:26 |
| dividediff[m] | why are kids staying w grandparents? | 10:26 |
| adventurer | have faith in the government that has made my life hell for my whole life | 10:26 |
| euod[m] | <adventurer "they don't care about our kids "> this is a sort of chernobyl thing. who cares if older people are doing medical work? they're going to die anyway, might as well be doing something rather than waiting for it. | 10:26 |
| adventurer | they aren't dividediff[m] that's their excuse for not closing schools | 10:27 |
| mandiblegrip | I saw this one the other day: https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-18/coronavirus-queensland-child-care-centre-worker-positive/12064322 | 10:27 |
| mandiblegrip | So it probably won't be long. | 10:27 |
| euod[m] | remember that the tested numbers are meaningless. | 10:27 |
| euod[m] | in Canada the number reported is actually worthless. like it has no bearing on actual infection rates. | 10:27 |
| mandiblegrip | adventurer: Stop having faith in the government. We live in a free society, people seem to forget. The slave mentality is unbelievable. | 10:28 |
| adventurer | i think probably the saame here too euod[m] | 10:28 |
| euod[m] | you're refused a test unless you have a direct interaction with someone who is positive. this means community spread is completely unmeasured. | 10:28 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: Not no bearing, but yea huge undersestimate of the true rate | 10:28 |
| adventurer | if they wanted us all to die while pretending to try this would be a great technique...they could have closed the borders | 10:29 |
| HeXiLeD | finally some good news https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/03/18/coronavirus-corridors-power-which-world-leaders-have-covid-19/ Politicians being taken down | 10:29 |
| dividediff[m] | Australias: try to get the gov to close the schools if possible. Bars/restaurants/mall too | 10:29 |
| adventurer | i mean we wont all die | 10:29 |
| adventurer | but | 10:29 |
| adventurer | a lot of people will | 10:29 |
| adventurer | dividediff[m], what then | 10:29 |
| adventurer | how do we live | 10:29 |
| adventurer | survive | 10:29 |
| dividediff[m] | Australias = australians** | 10:29 |
| adventurer | we can't even farm | 10:29 |
| adventurer | they own all the land | 10:29 |
| euod[m] | <dividediff[m] "Australias = australians**"> trying to get australians to do anything is almost pointless. | 10:29 |
| adventurer | even the forest is theres | 10:29 |
| adventurer | you can't squat that's illegal | 10:29 |
| adventurer | or camp | 10:30 |
| adventurer | hah | 10:30 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: over here the gov is picking up the slack with unemployeement insurance etc | 10:30 |
| adventurer | yeah our government you wouldn't want it from | 10:30 |
| adventurer | they are so horrible | 10:30 |
| euod[m] | "Peter Dutton, above, Australian home affairs minister, was found to have the coronavirus after being admitted to a hospital. He had recently returned from Washington, where he met with Attorney General William Barr, Trump’s daughter Ivanka Trump, and other White House officials. " | 10:30 |
| euod[m] | that's very australian. | 10:30 |
| dividediff[m] | For the past while each day someone in gov announces broad sweping changes to the corona strategy, so they'll prob gonna announce financial assistance soon | 10:31 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: trump tested yet? | 10:31 |
| adventurer | yeah but i dont' trust them | 10:31 |
| euod[m] | “All those people have been notified now. Very unpleasant phone calls to make.” | 10:31 |
| euod[m] | I mean better than calling someone and say that they probably have HIV. maybe. | 10:31 |
| azbycx | kinda interesting how many people are fond to have the virus after visiting trump or his cabinet members. | 10:31 |
| HeXiLeD | dividediff[m]: trudy is saying that no canadian should be without $ for food | 10:31 |
| adventurer | they give only with conditions and they tell peopel who are the most vulnerable they got debt and make them pay it back...they are fake debts in many cases and people killed thmselves over this | 10:32 |
| euod[m] | <HeXiLeD "dividediff: trudy is saying that"> awkward to be in canada but not be canadian :P | 10:32 |
| HeXiLeD | i bet even the aliens will get $ | 10:32 |
| adventurer | Australia had a drought | 10:32 |
| adventurer | there really is a food shortage | 10:32 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: so far the eimployment uninsurance program is operating slowly | 10:32 |
| adventurer | they are bullshitting us saying it's not putting back on shelves | 10:33 |
| euod[m] | I doubt it. they're surprisingly difficult to get to do anything in particular. | 10:33 |
| HeXiLeD | lets put it this way... refugees get about +3K a month to settle. A retiree gets what ? 1500? | 10:33 |
| adventurer | there is less | 10:33 |
| adventurer | as well | 10:33 |
| adventurer | i mean after a drought how much rice and pasta do they have? | 10:33 |
| euod[m] | australia has lots of distance, which is nice. | 10:33 |
| adventurer | https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8132417/Farmers-struggling-cope-demand-rice-pasta-amid-coronavirus-panic-buying.html | 10:33 |
| adventurer | I didn't realise this | 10:34 |
| euod[m] | at the end of the day it means that places like alice springs can survive, inexplicably, and against everybodies desires. | 10:34 |
| HeXiLeD | have in mind that staying home, one tens to spend less energy and therefore not need as much "fuel/food" to stay alive. | 10:34 |
| adventurer | ??? | 10:34 |
| HeXiLeD | people can eat less | 10:35 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: oh wow more barren that here as of a few days ago | 10:35 |
| euod[m] | "Coles were forced to introduce a limit on mince purchases after shelves were stripped bare at the weekend " | 10:35 |
| euod[m] | yikes. | 10:35 |
| euod[m] | why mince of all things. | 10:35 |
| dividediff[m] | Purchasing limits being introduced by companies in canada recently too | 10:36 |
| euod[m] | wtf is with their limits list | 10:36 |
| HeXiLeD | i guess one can start looking into pet food if one does not mind a few extra thick hairs around their body | 10:36 |
| euod[m] | serviettes? yoghurt? | 10:36 |
| euod[m] | mince? frozen desserts? | 10:36 |
| euod[m] | no limits on wet cat and dog food. | 10:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 09:34 UTC: US news: Coronavirus live updates: California governor issues statewide 'stay at home' order as Italy deaths pass China — from WHO at 09:34: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 10:38 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: what is mince? | 10:38 |
| azbycx | some dog biscuits are pretty tasty. | 10:38 |
| HeXiLeD | lol azbycx | 10:38 |
| HeXiLeD | what is your recommendation? | 10:38 |
| euod[m] | so clearly people aren't actually shopping for any reason other than panic. | 10:38 |
| adventurer | Australia = drought, then massive fires like nothing else, then this | 10:39 |
| euod[m] | <dividediff[m] "euod: what is mince?"> ground up meat for burgers. | 10:39 |
| azbycx | the milk bone flavor snacks of course. :) | 10:39 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: oh yea | 10:39 |
| dividediff[m] | no purchasing limit on pet food and it's dry and will last forever, good corona food maybe? | 10:40 |
| dividediff[m] | TIL azbycx: is a dog food connoseur | 10:40 |
| euod[m] | dog food tends to be pretty nasty. a lot of it is sawdust and other packers. | 10:40 |
| azbycx | sad times when your dog eats better than you. | 10:41 |
| HeXiLeD | lol | 10:41 |
| HeXiLeD | any data on covid19 surviving in the freezer? | 10:41 |
| euod[m] | I've watched someone eat dog food as a result of losing a bet, it didn't look pleasant. | 10:41 |
| azbycx | need to think more like Sherman, peabody's boy. | 10:41 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: in general viruses seem to basically be okay aftter a freeze | 10:42 |
| dividediff[m] | HeXiLeD: have not particularly looked it up tho | 10:42 |
| sneep | Hmm, what makes you think that then? | 10:43 |
| azbycx | eventually people will get so hungry the dog food or worse will taste good. | 10:43 |
| docwon | kibble doesn't taste so bad | 10:43 |
| HeXiLeD | azbycx: agreed | 10:43 |
| docwon | like salty/meaty cereal | 10:43 |
| azbycx | course that is after they finish eating their dogs. | 10:43 |
| sneep | https://english.alarabiya.net/en/features/2020/03/19/How-long-can-coronaviruses-survive-in-a-freezer-Up-to-two-years-warns-expert.html Hmm :p | 10:43 |
| dividediff[m] | Presently at home i'm been spacing out my meals to try to reduce my food requirement | 10:43 |
| pagetelegram | Rice and Pasta ??? people need to stay away from starches,,,,what fools | 10:44 |
| dividediff[m] | sneep: 2 yrs, geez | 10:44 |
| docwon | remember to reduce your calorie intake if you're spending more time indoors doing less exercise | 10:44 |
| azbycx | wow 2 years, that is crazy. | 10:44 |
| HeXiLeD | sneep: that does suck. one can accidentally freeze them and then this stuff starts all over again | 10:44 |
| dividediff[m] | docwon: good pt | 10:44 |
| adventurer | i don't even know if i should bother warning peoeple | 10:44 |
| adventurer | they think it's crazy | 10:44 |
| adventurer | but it's like...uncle over 60 with heart surgery not that long ago | 10:45 |
| adventurer | maybe they think it's crazy who knows | 10:45 |
| adventurer | but...if they just hid away for one year maybe they could get the vaccine | 10:45 |
| HeXiLeD | probably | 10:45 |
| adventurer | maybe | 10:46 |
| sneep | I have a leg injury that causes pain when I don't move about a little every hour or so | 10:46 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: good news. trump recently approved chloroquine, an antiviral that mayyy help with corona | 10:46 |
| euod[m] | <dividediff[m] "adventurer: good news. trump rec"> did he though? the FDA claims this is false. | 10:46 |
| HeXiLeD | pub move? | 10:47 |
| sneep | And just moving about inside the room doesn't work very well :/ Maybe I should have gotten a home trainer or something | 10:47 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: a few hrs ago in chat someone talked about it being true now, i'll see if i can find it | 10:47 |
| euod[m] | interesting. | 10:48 |
| azbycx | watch some twerkercise videos and follow along.. | 10:48 |
| euod[m] | it was originally at least, just more trump shit. | 10:48 |
| azbycx | just make sure you secure your balls first. | 10:49 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: tinwhiskers: "Just heard a report that trump *has* now ordered the FDA to go ahead with using chloroquine" like 3 hrs ago | 10:49 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +937 cases (now 247914), +2 deaths (now 10076), +34 recoveries (now 88437) 🔶 Germany: +607 cases (now 16046) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 69) 🔸 China: +48 cases (now 81250), +1 recoveries (now 71266) 🔸 Guangdong, China: +1 recoveries (now 1323) 🔸 Hong Kong, China: +48 cases (now 256) [... want %more?] | 10:50 |
| HeXiLeD | https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-17/india-is-containing-coronavirus-despite-dense-population/12059024 | 10:50 |
| Jigsy | So much for that containment, China... | 10:50 |
| dividediff[m] | euod: tin didn't provide a cite unforunately | 10:50 |
| Jigsy | Though I guess +48 isn't too bad. | 10:50 |
| Jigsy | Compared to the hundreds from days before. | 10:50 |
| euod[m] | of course not. | 10:50 |
| Jigsy | The real problem now is Italy. | 10:51 |
| euod[m] | 48 is well within reasonability. | 10:51 |
| mefistofeles | %cases spain | 10:51 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Spain, there are 18077 cases, 833 deaths (4.6% of cases), 1107 recoveries as of March 20, 01:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 10:51 |
| Jigsy | %cases Italy | 10:51 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, Italy, there are 41035 cases, 3405 deaths (8.3% of cases), 4440 recoveries as of March 19, 17:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 10:51 |
| euod[m] | 48 in a population of over 1.3 billion is nothing. | 10:51 |
| azbycx | anyone following the group of Indians who claim cow urine cures them? | 10:51 |
| mefistofeles | nope | 10:51 |
| mefistofeles | why would we? | 10:52 |
| euod[m] | italy is all of 48 million people. | 10:52 |
| dividediff[m] | adventurer: Easier said then done, but try not to stress too much about this all. Australia will prob announce some good news soon, esp since it has been neck and neck with canada | 10:52 |
| mefistofeles | %cases australia | 10:52 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Australia, there are 876 cases, 7 deaths (0.8% of cases), 46 recoveries as of March 20, 09:47Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Australia for time series data. | 10:52 |
| azbycx | human interest mostly. | 10:52 |
| pagetelegram | Anyone have a link to scientific primary source for the Cleveland Clinic study about the two year survival of coronavirus when frozen....google search no results | 10:56 |
| azbycx | did oyu try searching on scholar.google.com ? | 10:58 |
| HeXiLeD | modern times https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ETfWWmCX0AASGp8?format=png&name=small | 10:59 |
| pagetelegram | * Al Arabia needs to provide their primary sources, wtf! | 10:59 |
| pagetelegram | azbycx going to try that thahks | 10:59 |
| azbycx | sure thing, it helps cut out some of the clutter from the google.com engine. | 11:00 |
| adventurer | To make matters worse my parents live remote but their neighbours just returned from France nd spain for some unknown reason why both...that's crazy | 11:01 |
| HeXiLeD | that is not good | 11:01 |
| adventurer | so even though they live in the middle of nowhere they are near people in quarantine | 11:01 |
| HeXiLeD | canada and australia are pretty close in the cases | 11:02 |
| HeXiLeD | 3 cases difference | 11:02 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 09:48 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: Scott Morrison delays the federal budget until October – latest: Treasurer Josh Frydenberg says airline industry ‘essential’ as Australians overseas scramble to get home and health authorities try to contain spread of Covid-19. Follow all the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Fvn5PP | 11:02 |
| adventurer | I did something maybe dumb | 11:09 |
| adventurer | I do a lot of dumb things | 11:09 |
| adventurer | oh well | 11:09 |
| HeXiLeD | recognizing is the first step to the cure | 11:10 |
| HeXiLeD | so... what was it? | 11:10 |
| azbycx | https://www.semanticscholar.org/ is also a good search engine for research | 11:11 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 10:04 UTC: 'We must work together': Gareth Southgate's message to England fans: England manager highlights challenges to mental health Fans urged to protect the vulnerable in coronavirus crisis Coronavirus – latest updates See all our coronavirus coverage Gareth Southgate has highlighted the challenge to mental health posed by [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/wSImuM | 11:15 |
| pagetelegram | Thank you azbycx, scholar yield no results for two years frozen from Cleveland Clinic | 11:16 |
| sneep | pagetelegram: I found that article just doing some random Google searching. I don't think it's implying that the study was made at Abu Dhabi's Cleveland Clinic | 11:17 |
| ruin-ghost[m] | /buffer 25 | 11:18 |
| sneep | https://www.researchgate.net/post/Can_anyone_give_advice_on_storage_of_Influenza_virus This guy recommends -70C :p | 11:18 |
| sneep | for inluenza | 11:18 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1088 cases (now 249002), +22 deaths (now 10098), +41 recoveries (now 88478) 🔶 Germany: +580 cases (now 16626) 🔶 Belgium: +462 cases (now 2257), +16 deaths (now 37), +39 recoveries (now 204) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 69) [... want %more?] | 11:20 |
| azbycx | I found this, but it is on canine coronavirus | 11:22 |
| azbycx | https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/0378113594900248 | 11:22 |
| pagetelegram | sneep thank you; that abi source or what ever also had article that virus is infectious in the air for up to two hours....I really need primary sources to confirm this shit | 11:22 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 10:20 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: UK coronavirus live: confusion over list of key workers as schools close — from WHO at 10:20: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/ns7KIJ | 11:26 |
| skullomania | things are just getting worse huh | 11:40 |
| skullomania | they will get much worse until they get a little better imo | 11:41 |
| HeXiLeD | and now i have to forcibly go out. if i dont come back within 13h hours... the zombies took me out. | 11:46 |
| Brainstorm | New from Scientific American at 10:45 UTC: How to Triage Patients Who Need Intensive Care: Antonino Marchese, chief doctor at the Casal Palocco hospital near Rome, in a new intensive care unit for COVID-19 cases. — from WHO at 10:45: Every country needs to take boldest actions to stop COVID-19 → https://is.gd/Qqg0Jw | 11:50 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1936 cases (now 250938), +166 deaths (now 10264), +481 recoveries (now 88959) 🔶 Spain: +1903 cases (now 19980), +169 deaths (now 1002), +481 recoveries (now 1588) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Hungary: +2 deaths (now 3) [... want %more?] | 11:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 10:50 UTC: Coronavirus outbreak: UK coronavirus live: confusion over list of key workers as schools close — from WHO at 10:50: Good hand hygiene protects you and those around you – World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing in containing the spread of COVID-19 and many other infectious diseases → https://is.gd/ns7KIJ | 12:02 |
| sneep | https://www.theverge.com/2020/3/20/21187930/youtube-reduces-streaming-quality-european-union-coronavirus-bandwidth-internet-traffic | 12:03 |
| Jigsy | %cases UK | 12:10 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 3269 cases, 144 deaths (4.4% of cases), 65 recoveries as of March 20, 11:04Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 12:10 |
| skullomania | so that's higher than 2% | 12:11 |
| skullomania | again lots of variables we still don't know about this wuhan virus | 12:11 |
| sneep | Let's not call it Wuhan virus | 12:12 |
| skullomania | why not | 12:13 |
| skullomania | if it originated from wuhan | 12:13 |
| Joe | looking at these numbers this early and trying to deduce a mortality rate is sort of pointless. | 12:13 |
| skullomania | some 36 yr old guy died where i live | 12:13 |
| skullomania | no latent health conditions | 12:13 |
| skullomania | he was just a regular healthy guy | 12:13 |
| skullomania | corona ravaged his respiratory system | 12:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 11:04 UTC: Coronavirus: Ecuador city blocks runway to Spanish repatriation flight – video: Authorities in the Ecuadorian city of Guayaquil have stopped a plane from landing by blocking its airport runway with trucks, cars and motorcycles. The Iberia plane had flown from Madrid to repatriate Spaniards after Ecuador closed its [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/RWvW5z | 12:14 |
| Joe | skullomania: you in the states? | 12:14 |
| skullomania | Joe no but it's spreading fast here too | 12:14 |
| Joe | i dunno, it's certainly spreading fast. | 12:15 |
| sneep | skullomania: Nobody called it that until a couple weeks ago | 12:15 |
| Joe | We need to figure out what SOK did vs other places. | 12:16 |
| Joe | they seem to hve some real success stopping it. | 12:16 |
| sneep | It sounds like a name pushed by people with an anti-China agenda | 12:16 |
| skullomania | Joe it's too soon to say | 12:17 |
| skullomania | but seems like isolation is key | 12:17 |
| mefistofeles | Joe: SOK did many random testing and they already had all these epidemic protocols/controls since last SARS outbreak back in 2003/4 | 12:17 |
| mefistofeles | of course, it is still ongoing | 12:17 |
| Joe | ahhh when the vaccine for SARS was abandoned? | 12:17 |
| mefistofeles | Joe: no, the actual first SARS outbreak, I'd think | 12:17 |
| Joe | Big hotshot politicians in the US, blowing their horn about how fast they got a vaccine, they just sent the SARS work to human trials. | 12:18 |
| sneep | They had a MERS outbreak in 2015 | 12:19 |
| _io_ | wow let's not call it MERS, sneep. | 12:19 |
| skullomania | that was in the middle east | 12:19 |
| skullomania | from eating diseased camel | 12:19 |
| euod[m] | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0jJ_MNvxtI | 12:19 |
| euod[m] | wow, Las Vegas and Chicago Midway are UNCONTROLLED. | 12:19 |
| Poon_ | %data texas | 12:19 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: In Texas, US, there are 260 cases, 5 deaths (1.9% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 12:19 |
| sneep | _io_: Isn't that the official name? | 12:19 |
| Joe | ya i don't want to think about MERS. | 12:19 |
| _io_ | sneep:it sounds like a name pushed by people with an anti middle East agenda. | 12:19 |
| sneep | skullomania: I mean South Korea had a MERS outbreak | 12:20 |
| euod[m] | both airports are at ATC ZERO, uncontrolled airspace. | 12:20 |
| sneep | _io_: Dunno about that | 12:20 |
| sneep | _io_: Feel free to complain to the WHO | 12:20 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1441 cases (now 252379), +151 deaths (now 10415), +12 recoveries (now 88971) 🔶 Iran: +1237 cases (now 19644), +149 deaths (now 1433) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 recoveries (now 1) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +7 cases (now 40), +4 recoveries (now 4) [... want %more?] | 12:20 |
| _io_ | you want to unquestioningly call one virus by the name of where it's from , but when people do it with another they have an "agenda?" | 12:21 |
| _io_ | nobody needs to tell you what that is right. | 12:21 |
| sneep | Anyway, South Korea is doing a _lot_ of tracking and I think countries that don't have little chance | 12:21 |
| euod[m] | what other examples do you have for that, though? | 12:21 |
| euod[m] | spanish flu isn't an example, it was just due to reporting that it looked like the spanish had more instances of it. | 12:21 |
| _io_ | spanish flu is not from Spain this is correct. | 12:22 |
| sneep | _io_: At no point was the official name "Wuhan virus" or "China virus" | 12:22 |
| _io_ | maybe it should be. | 12:22 |
| skullomania | but it is a wuhan virus | 12:22 |
| euod[m] | er, why? | 12:22 |
| skullomania | people from wuhan exported it | 12:22 |
| _io_ | maybe theyd stop spreading disease from their disgusting wet markets. | 12:23 |
| notkoos | 🤦 | 12:23 |
| skullomania | agreed | 12:23 |
| _io_ | how many plagues from Chinese wet markets does the world need before politely ask them to stop doing this? | 12:24 |
| _io_ | how many have we had now is this 3? | 12:24 |
| sneep | https://time.com/5782284/who-name-coronavirus-covid-19/ Anyway, here's an article from when they announced the name | 12:24 |
| sneep | Evola is named after the Ebola River | 12:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 11:19 UTC: ‘How do we survive coronavirus?’ Owen Jones meets low-paid workers – video: The Covid-19 crisis is expected to hit the lowest-paid and precarious workers the hardest – those who can’t work from home and those who might not be entitled to sick pay. In a rapidly changing situation Owen Jones spoke to some of [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/euaZIn | 12:26 |
| _io_ | was swine flu also from these Chinese cesspools of filth? and Sars[1, The Prequel]? | 12:26 |
| _io_ | I know by the way that most Chinese do not participate in such degeneracy. | 12:27 |
| _io_ | it's specifically the rich. | 12:27 |
| sneep | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swine_influenza | 12:27 |
| _io_ | anyway, what matters most isn't calling it China virus. it's getting them to stop spawning these plagues, permanently. | 12:29 |
| sneep | Impossible | 12:30 |
| _io_ | if anyone has any ideas on how to make that happen id love to hear about it | 12:30 |
| sneep | Could happen anywhere anytime | 12:30 |
| _io_ | not at all. | 12:30 |
| _io_ | there's a reason it came from a wet market. | 12:30 |
| _io_ | people in most places Dont engage in such violations of decency | 12:31 |
| _io_ | it's specifically a rich Chinese people thing. | 12:31 |
| sneep | The Chinese government has banned the sale of wild animals at wet markets | 12:33 |
| _io_ | https://youtu.be/TPpoJGYlW54 | 12:33 |
| _io_ | temporarily, I think they did. | 12:33 |
| _io_ | I'm hoping they can make that permanent. | 12:33 |
| skullomania | you can't stop exotic animals in china | 12:33 |
| _io_ | 8:49 | 12:34 |
| _io_ | Why new diseases keep appearing in China | 12:34 |
| _io_ | YouTube · Vox | 12:34 |
| _io_ | Mar 6, 2020 | 12:34 |
| skullomania | it's well rooted in their culture to eat that shit as a symbol of wealth | 12:34 |
| skullomania | and long life | 12:34 |
| _io_ | it's vile. they need to stop. these animals defecate urinate vomit and puss all over one another. and then we are supposed to pretend this disease has NOTHING TO DO WITH CHINA. lol. | 12:35 |
| pwr22 | Culture can change given a serious enough event | 12:35 |
| pwr22 | I'd say this is pretty serious | 12:35 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +698 cases (now 253077), +3 recoveries (now 88974) 🔶 Switzerland: +676 cases (now 4898) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 recoveries (now 1) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +7 cases (now 40), +4 recoveries (now 4) 🔸 Faeroe Islands: +1 recoveries (now 3) [... want %more?] | 12:35 |
| _io_ | i was thinking it might help if they know the world is watching and knows why it happened. | 12:36 |
| skullomania | i feel the same _io_ | 12:36 |
| ubLIX | _io_: who is asking you to pretend it's nothing to do with China? Are you referring to the general advice to not call it Wuhan Flu? | 12:36 |
| skullomania | no need for racism | 12:36 |
| skullomania | just point out the flaws and fix them | 12:36 |
| _io_ | yes | 12:36 |
| sneep | I'm not saying it's got nothing to do with China | 12:37 |
| skullomania | the spanish flu originated from china as speculated too | 12:37 |
| skullomania | while the chinese had immunity against it, the rest of the world suffered and many young people died | 12:38 |
| ubLIX | it is also speculated that Spanish flue originated in Kentucky, US | 12:38 |
| skullomania | very unlikely since people in china were not affected by it | 12:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 11:30 UTC: (news): Pornhub is offering free premium memberships to countries on coronavirus lockdown, sees traffic leap — from WHO at 11:30: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/q6Q8HG | 12:38 |
| skullomania | indicating that it had taken its early toll there | 12:38 |
| ubLIX | or that some peculiarity of their genetics conferred some resilience | 12:38 |
| skullomania | it did because they were already immune to it | 12:39 |
| skullomania | so bottom line, exotic animals kept in unsanitary conditions | 12:40 |
| _io_ | together. yes | 12:40 |
| skullomania | and animals in general | 12:40 |
| _io_ | and then eaten. | 12:40 |
| skullomania | the west is not an except..remember the mad cow disease | 12:40 |
| skullomania | exception* | 12:40 |
| skullomania | we've all seen what they do to dogs in china | 12:40 |
| _io_ | that was gross also actually it made me go vegan for a few years | 12:41 |
| skullomania | and how they keep them before beating them with a stick then frying | 12:41 |
| sneep | I don't think too many of us have seen that :p | 12:41 |
| euod[m] | " When compared to the rest of the world, visitors from Slovakia are 119% more likely to search for Coronavirus on Pornhub. Searches are more than 80% more popular in Bulgaria, Ireland, Malaysia and Serbia. " | 12:41 |
| skullomania | those videos went viral | 12:41 |
| skullomania | a few years ago | 12:41 |
| skullomania | i couldn't finish any of them | 12:41 |
| sneep | Why would anyone want to watch that? | 12:42 |
| skullomania | to know that it happens | 12:42 |
| skullomania | and to put an end to it? | 12:42 |
| RougeR | wegood morning | 12:42 |
| RougeR | events are moving quickly in my small island | 12:42 |
| RougeR | i am starting a daily diary | 12:42 |
| RougeR | I will share it with you shortly | 12:42 |
| skullomania | what island RougeR? | 12:42 |
| RougeR | Jersey, Channel islands | 12:42 |
| RougeR | we have just implemented a mandatory 14 day quarantine for all worldwide arrivals | 12:42 |
| RougeR | our cases jumped from 5 to 10 yesterday with 2 hospitalisations | 12:43 |
| RougeR | community transmission is confirmed in our 100k population | 12:43 |
| skullomania | all worldwide arrivals should be banned rn RougeR | 12:43 |
| skullomania | except emergencies | 12:43 |
| RougeR | quarantine is best we can do | 12:43 |
| RougeR | we have islanders and children returning still | 12:43 |
| pwr22 | !cases channel is | 12:44 |
| RougeR | ive been advocating ti for the past week and constantly campaigning and emailing politicians | 12:44 |
| CovBot | Which of these did you mean? Channel Islands - Channel Islands, United Kingdom | 12:44 |
| pwr22 | !cases channel islands | 12:44 |
| RougeR | they finnally listened and implemented quarantine from the UK | 12:44 |
| RougeR | !cases jersey | 12:44 |
| CovBot | In Channel Islands there have been a total of 11 cases as of 2020-03-20 11:18:00 UTC. Of these 11 (100.0%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 0 (0.0%) have definitely recovered and 0 (0.0%) have died. | 12:44 |
| pwr22 | !cases channel islands, UK | 12:44 |
| CovBot | I have searched my data but cannot find a match for channel islands, UK. It might be under a different name or there may be no cases! If I am wrong let @pwr22:shortestpath.dev know. | 12:44 |
| CovBot | In New Jersey, United States there have been a total of 742 cases as of 2020-03-20 00:50:03 UTC. Of these 733 (98.8%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 0 (0.0%) have definitely recovered and 9 (1.2%) have died. | 12:44 |
| RougeR | as soon as 2 people were hospitalised they finnally took this seriously | 12:44 |
| pwr22 | <RougeR "!cases jersey"> The data isn't that granular | 12:44 |
| sneep | "Jersey is the largest of the Channel Islands, between England and France. A self-governing dependency of the United Kingdom, with a mix of British and French cultures, it’s known for its beaches, cliffside walking trails, inland valleys and historic castles. " | 12:44 |
| sneep | Sounds like an interesting place | 12:44 |
| RougeR | and at midnight last night the cases were confirmed | 12:45 |
| RougeR | sneep, its a weird place | 12:45 |
| RougeR | i was hoping we might let this pandemic pass us buy and contain it | 12:45 |
| skullomania | it can't be contained | 12:45 |
| RougeR | but government inaction and the selfless actions of islanders have brought it to our doorsteps | 12:45 |
| RougeR | skullomania, we are an island. | 12:45 |
| skullomania | people will get it, some will die, some won't | 12:45 |
| RougeR | 14 day worldwide quarantines | 12:45 |
| skullomania | like every other epidemic | 12:45 |
| RougeR | it could have been contained | 12:45 |
| RougeR | draconian measure would be needed and decisive action | 12:46 |
| skullomania | not the way it spreads RougeR | 12:46 |
| RougeR | it still could be contained if those in power had the bravery to act | 12:46 |
| RougeR | skullomania, it only spreads in humans | 12:46 |
| RougeR | if no one here has it | 12:46 |
| skullomania | draconian measures means disrupting peoples lives and economies | 12:46 |
| RougeR | and everyone in quarantined for 14 days | 12:46 |
| RougeR | skullomania, that will already be the case | 12:46 |
| RougeR | if we could contain, out way of life and more business could continue | 12:46 |
| RougeR | life here is still relatively normal | 12:46 |
| ubLIX | that's a shame RougeR. you'd have thought that a small island would have been a perfect experiment for full containment | 12:46 |
| skullomania | yes but governments are slow implementing those because they want as little impact to the economy as possible | 12:46 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, well | 12:47 |
| skullomania | driven by capitalism and wealth | 12:47 |
| RougeR | guernsey has 0 cases and has better measures in place ubLIX | 12:47 |
| RougeR | 1 case* | 12:47 |
| RougeR | no community spread | 12:47 |
| sneep | RougeR: Were the people on your island split on Brexit or more clearly in one camp or the other? | 12:47 |
| RougeR | i fear this will turn into a perfect experiment showing a tales of 2 island | 12:47 |
| RougeR | sneep, we didnt get a vote | 12:47 |
| sneep | Aw | 12:47 |
| RougeR | im not quite sure where we stood | 12:47 |
| RougeR | its overall convservative in nature but we have french culture and are 14 miles from france | 12:48 |
| RougeR | I can see france from my windows as i am typing this | 12:48 |
| skullomania | 13k infected | 12:48 |
| skullomania | in the US | 12:48 |
| RougeR | its odd to think that they are in lockdown while life continues as normal here | 12:48 |
| RougeR | people are still in pubs | 12:48 |
| ubLIX | oops | 12:48 |
| RougeR | they are blissfully ignorant | 12:48 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, this is why im starting this diary/blog | 12:48 |
| skullomania | most people | 12:48 |
| skullomania | think its just a cold | 12:48 |
| sneep | RougeR: Do you speak French? | 12:48 |
| skullomania | and dgaf | 12:49 |
| RougeR | i feel we are very unique and that this is important to record for future generations | 12:49 |
| RougeR | and also for the possible trial of our politicians | 12:49 |
| sneep | Yes, please keep a diary | 12:49 |
| RougeR | sneep, id like to say yes...but no haha | 12:49 |
| RougeR | i used to be able to just about read it | 12:49 |
| RougeR | sneep, ive just started today | 12:49 |
| RougeR | im currently recapping the events leading up to today | 12:49 |
| RougeR | I will publish it as a blog if people are interested | 12:49 |
| sneep | You should | 12:49 |
| RougeR | This is just the beginning | 12:49 |
| ubLIX | it's a very good idea, RougeR. helps with general sanity too | 12:50 |
| RougeR | yeah i think so too | 12:50 |
| RougeR | im obsessing over this, i think i need an outlet daily to get it out | 12:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 11:38 UTC: Pound jumps and markets rebound as firms await wage rescue plan - business live: The pound is up as European markets rebound and the UK waits for details of the chancellor’s plan to protect wages in response to Covid-19 — from WHO at 11:38: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/sZN454 | 12:50 |
| RougeR | its really affecting my mental health, ive felt like the only person on this island who has seen this coming | 12:50 |
| RougeR | and ive been telling those around me for over a month to prepare | 12:50 |
| RougeR | ive been emailing politicians for 2 weeks | 12:50 |
| skullomania | RougeR turn off the tv and the computer and read a book about something completely unrelated | 12:51 |
| RougeR | advocating for the quarantine from the UK | 12:51 |
| RougeR | skullomania, i really struggle too | 12:51 |
| RougeR | i have poor impulse control and intrusive thoughts | 12:51 |
| skullomania | even if it spreads and kills a lot of people | 12:51 |
| skullomania | it's not your fault | 12:51 |
| skullomania | and there is nothing you can do about it | 12:51 |
| RougeR | skullomania, thats the thing | 12:51 |
| skullomania | why worry then | 12:51 |
| RougeR | if i was in the UK or a large country | 12:51 |
| RougeR | i would agree | 12:51 |
| RougeR | I am not, I live on a small island with an independant government | 12:52 |
| skullomania | you're part of the us | 12:52 |
| skullomania | what independent government | 12:52 |
| RougeR | huh | 12:52 |
| RougeR | im in channel islands | 12:52 |
| RougeR | jersey | 12:52 |
| RougeR | not Murica jersey | 12:52 |
| RougeR | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jersey | 12:52 |
| Joe | lol | 12:52 |
| skullomania | oh | 12:52 |
| RougeR | yeah | 12:52 |
| skullomania | i thought you were in new jersery | 12:52 |
| RougeR | if i was in a big country | 12:52 |
| skullomania | new jersey* | 12:52 |
| skullomania | lol | 12:52 |
| RougeR | i would not fret, id know i could not change things | 12:53 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: maybe once in a while just take a break from the news cycle | 12:53 |
| RougeR | but here i can | 12:53 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, yeah i need too | 12:53 |
| RougeR | ive made a big step though | 12:53 |
| Joe | before new jersey | 12:53 |
| Joe | there was???? | 12:53 |
| RougeR | the border is shut | 12:53 |
| ubLIX | watching it 24/7 will drive you nuts | 12:53 |
| python476 | another day, another plague | 12:53 |
| python476 | o/ | 12:53 |
| RougeR | quarantine is now in place from the UK and we no longer have 15 flights a day coming in from london | 12:53 |
| RougeR | id been writing to politicians, i had my concerens raised in our local parliment session | 12:53 |
| RougeR | and id spoken to papers and created a large stir on local social media channel and action groups | 12:54 |
| RougeR | I hope in some way it influenced their decision to act | 12:54 |
| Joe | RougeR: you said you had no community spread? | 12:54 |
| sneep | RougeR++ | 12:54 |
| RougeR | Joe, we do now | 12:54 |
| RougeR | as of yesterday | 12:54 |
| Joe | oh boy | 12:54 |
| RougeR | we had 1 case 10 days ago | 12:54 |
| RougeR | then 6 cases 3 days ago | 12:54 |
| RougeR | then 8 cases yesterday | 12:55 |
| RougeR | then 10 yesterday evening | 12:55 |
| RougeR | now 2 are in hospital and the hospital is in lock down | 12:55 |
| RougeR | no recent travel history | 12:55 |
| Joe | crazy | 12:55 |
| Joe | so there is more to the story | 12:55 |
| RougeR | Guernsey which is an almost identical island implemented better travel restricitons and had better messenging | 12:55 |
| RougeR | they have 1 confirmed case. no spread | 12:55 |
| RougeR | we both are acting independantly 20 miles apart | 12:56 |
| Joe | ya some of the politicians sure messed up | 12:56 |
| Joe | all over the world | 12:56 |
| RougeR | Joe, the politicians here are like something from parks and recreation | 12:56 |
| RougeR | or dads army | 12:56 |
| RougeR | so are the people | 12:56 |
| RougeR | they take 2 years to decide how to decorate a round about | 12:56 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: *they* (whoever they are) are A/B testing the islands | 12:56 |
| RougeR | or where to put a new skate park in | 12:56 |
| ubLIX | sry, bad joke | 12:56 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, its not tbh | 12:56 |
| RougeR | it would be fascinating if 100s were not to die | 12:57 |
| ubLIX | what's the population of your island? | 12:57 |
| RougeR | and i wasnt now forced to harshly social distance myself especially due to my vulnerable father and older mother im living with | 12:57 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, 100k | 12:57 |
| RougeR | bristol a Uk city i was living in has 12 confirmed cases | 12:57 |
| RougeR | it has a population of 550k | 12:57 |
| RougeR | ... | 12:57 |
| RougeR | we are doing less testing as well due to cases needing to be sent to the mainland, for this i dont blame my government but they need to realise they are working blind | 12:58 |
| RougeR | guernsey have realised this and even though they have no community spread they are debating closing pubs/bars/shops | 12:58 |
| RougeR | because they cannot know | 12:58 |
| RougeR | both accept they likely cannot contain this long term, however guernsey is focus on halting community seeding for as long as possible | 12:59 |
| RougeR | they keep uttering the who mantra "Test. Test. Test. Test. trace and test" | 12:59 |
| RougeR | i hope you can see why this is so stressful for me on a personal level. I can see exactly how we could prevent this incoming catastrophe. the example is right there. yet these old men and useless politicians wont listen | 13:00 |
| RougeR | our modeller has fucking typos in his model and takes 3 hours to get through a 5 min speach | 13:00 |
| Joe | ya we changed that here to, who needs a test, we can tell by the people sick. | 13:00 |
| RougeR | there is no communincation | 13:00 |
| RougeR | people dont get it still, the people here are ignorant | 13:00 |
| RougeR | they will soon. | 13:00 |
| RougeR | unfortunately people must die for them to see | 13:01 |
| RougeR | and i fear it will have to be someone young(ish) | 13:01 |
| Joe | how is this spreading so quickly | 13:01 |
| pwr22 | <RougeR "bristol a Uk city i was living i"> I'm there | 13:01 |
| pwr22 | When did you live here btw? | 13:01 |
| RougeR | Joe, we have islanders returning en masse due to travel restrictions coming in world wide | 13:01 |
| azy | lol | 13:01 |
| RougeR | students in jersey were classed as "essential personal" and did not have to follow quarantine requirements | 13:02 |
| RougeR | JErsey has also not followed guernsey and iom untill today of implemented a UK travel quarantine | 13:02 |
| Joe | well that's a fucker | 13:02 |
| RougeR | so we had 10-20 flights a day coming in from london | 13:02 |
| RougeR | with no quarantine | 13:02 |
| Joe | who approved that | 13:02 |
| RougeR | people are ignorant and still socialising | 13:02 |
| RougeR | Joe, the government. they decided the UK wasnt a high enough risk yet. Guernsey implemented the ban monday for world wide | 13:02 |
| RougeR | IOM around same time | 13:02 |
| RougeR | Ive been emailing and calling every day pleading for them to implement quarantine and ive been accused of scare mongering on social media. i had my posts removed for posting a screenshot of the arrivals board and simply quoting our gov website on how uk travel was exempt from quarantine | 13:03 |
| RougeR | the journalists here are useless too, they dont hold our politicians too account. the whole place is like a corrupt sleepy village full of rich wankers | 13:04 |
| RougeR | dont get me wrong some lovely people, but they are so naieve and so cut off from the rest of the world | 13:04 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: a couple of papers to forward to your parliament, on the off chance it can help with persuasion: https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/pediatrics/early/2020/03/16/peds.2020-0702.full.pdf and https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/pdfs/mm6912e2-H.pdf | 13:04 |
| Joe | u are an island for christ sake, only an idiot could get an infection started. | 13:04 |
| RougeR | our hospital has 20 ICU beds | 13:05 |
| RougeR | if we push it | 13:05 |
| ubLIX | ("Epidemiological Characteristics of 2143 Pediatric Patients With 2019 Coronavirus Disease in China" and "CDC Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report") | 13:06 |
| RougeR | Joe, im being called stupid for thinking we cant stop it | 13:06 |
| RougeR | my mother thinks its inevitable so does guernsey to be fair | 13:06 |
| RougeR | and maybe it is | 13:06 |
| RougeR | but we have given up to easily | 13:06 |
| RougeR | this virus thrives on human error | 13:07 |
| Joe | evidently | 13:07 |
| RougeR | im advocating for futher transparency with our government and a citizens panel | 13:07 |
| Joe | and politicians are quite error prone. | 13:07 |
| RougeR | I also want to advocate for a 10-14 island wide shutdown | 13:07 |
| RougeR | I fear it is the only way we can get this community spread under control | 13:07 |
| Joe | ya go in and stay in | 13:08 |
| RougeR | people think im insane for proposing it "BUSINESS WILL FAIL, hahahaha stupiodddd" | 13:08 |
| RougeR | they dont get it | 13:08 |
| RougeR | they think this will be over in a few months | 13:08 |
| RougeR | that we have to reopen sometime | 13:08 |
| Joe | it can be | 13:08 |
| RougeR | they dont understand the tourism industry is now dead | 13:08 |
| RougeR | but our bars, pubs, shops, retail could survive. | 13:08 |
| Joe | SOK managed it, or has come close. | 13:08 |
| RougeR | if we can effectively quarantine, test rigoriously, then once the spread is under control | 13:09 |
| Joe | ya there is no tourism | 13:09 |
| RougeR | we can reopen business | 13:09 |
| RougeR | locals can support the pubs | 13:09 |
| RougeR | if we contain the infection. implement rigorious 14 day quarantine | 13:09 |
| RougeR | and test test test. | 13:09 |
| RougeR | we can keep this place open | 13:09 |
| Joe | UK is putting together a package of help for everyone so you can. | 13:10 |
| RougeR | they dont get it.... | 13:10 |
| RougeR | The jersey gov just promised 180million to business to start | 13:10 |
| RougeR | but if we could contain this virus. we could keep life as normal | 13:10 |
| Joe | it seemed to coming shortly form what i seen | 13:10 |
| RougeR | ish | 13:10 |
| RougeR | i just...ugh im not an epidimiologist.... | 13:10 |
| RougeR | but this seems to obvious to me | 13:10 |
| ubLIX | the slow penetration of information and its meaning is a tragedy all of its own | 13:11 |
| RougeR | im sorry, im spamming the channel. But this place is my home has been on n off for 20 years. I cant bear to see them taint it and for so many to die unnecessarily | 13:11 |
| Joe | keep fighting maybe someone will listen | 13:11 |
| RougeR | i hope so | 13:11 |
| RougeR | im going to try focus the fight more now...ive been running around like a headless chicken. and its ruining my mental health | 13:12 |
| python476 | you all seem suspiciously alive to me | 13:12 |
| RougeR | i cant fight this if i lose my mind | 13:12 |
| RougeR | i think im so stressed because i saw this coming 6+ weeks ago...and been dismissed as crazy | 13:12 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: the two papers/articles i linked above show alarming severity of illness in infants and children, and alarming severity in the 20-54 age group. i thought those data might be useful to you | 13:13 |
| RougeR | every single thing that ive said will come to pass. has come to pass. family and friends are now listening to me | 13:13 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, will have a look | 13:13 |
| Joe | write a letter to the Queen, Johnson, whomever... try and fill your time trying to fix it. | 13:13 |
| RougeR | oh i should add, to add insult to fucking injury | 13:13 |
| RougeR | we have a lot of retired people here | 13:13 |
| Joe | of course you do | 13:13 |
| RougeR | over 65s are advised to socially distance/isolate | 13:14 |
| RougeR | i keep seeing them out n about. | 13:14 |
| Joe | the virus and politicians seem to target pensioners. | 13:14 |
| RougeR | Joe, they call it the boomer remover | 13:14 |
| RougeR | thats horrid but,..... | 13:14 |
| RougeR | i did laugh when i heard it | 13:14 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:07 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: New Orleans Saints coach tests positive, Spain's death toll tops 1,000 — from WHO at 12:07: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 13:14 |
| Joe | all three deaths here have been over 80 | 13:14 |
| RougeR | I must say, when all is said and done | 13:14 |
| RougeR | and if we survive this virus | 13:14 |
| azy | we will | 13:15 |
| RougeR | ignore the deaths, the mental anguish | 13:15 |
| RougeR | i think the world will be a better place for it | 13:15 |
| RougeR | honestly | 13:15 |
| azy | how so? | 13:15 |
| Joe | unless it's ww3 and there is another round coming. | 13:15 |
| azy | we already ignore way more deaths because of war, maleria, diabetes etc | 13:15 |
| RougeR | I think it will highlight inequality, better prepare us for future pandemics, show community and value for our healthcare | 13:15 |
| RougeR | azy, those things dont happen in the west | 13:15 |
| RougeR | they dont affect us all like this | 13:15 |
| azy | last one definitely does | 13:16 |
| RougeR | I think it will also show the impact on the enviroment and how much difference it makes to stop for a bit | 13:16 |
| RougeR | azy, its different though | 13:16 |
| RougeR | this is hitting economy | 13:16 |
| RougeR | and people will be unable to work | 13:16 |
| azy | our actions are, the virus isnt | 13:16 |
| RougeR | people will realise the need for a universal basic income perhaps | 13:16 |
| RougeR | or at least the need for a solid social support system and a strong healthcare system | 13:17 |
| skullomania | lol you guys are dreaming | 13:17 |
| RougeR | I really hope so at least | 13:17 |
| skullomania | nothing will change | 13:17 |
| RougeR | skullomania, i might be | 13:17 |
| skullomania | this will pass | 13:17 |
| Joe | they are trying to push that in the HOC right now. | 13:17 |
| Joe | but i don't think it will happen | 13:17 |
| skullomania | trump will get re-elected | 13:17 |
| azy | our economy would go about fine if we hadnt locked down | 13:17 |
| RougeR | skullomania, the US might not change | 13:17 |
| RougeR | Europe and the UK i hold some hope for | 13:17 |
| azy | virus would rekt the old people, and we'd go about as usual | 13:17 |
| RougeR | azy, in many respects. but it would also hit the vulnerable | 13:17 |
| RougeR | and those with health conditions | 13:17 |
| skullomania | the US is the primary force that drives the world unfortunately RougeR | 13:18 |
| RougeR | the whole point of a society is to help those who cannot help themselves | 13:18 |
| azy | yeah. it would actually save us tons of money not having to care/pension them | 13:18 |
| RougeR | skullomania, for now. | 13:18 |
| RougeR | this might be Chinas time | 13:18 |
| RougeR | they recovered early | 13:18 |
| RougeR | azy, it would | 13:18 |
| RougeR | and would MASSIVELY reduce healthcare strain | 13:18 |
| azy | imagine if we had no concept of a virus? we'd just be like "woah old sick people are dying faster than usual" | 13:19 |
| RougeR | an ageing population is the number 1 cause for healthcare costs | 13:19 |
| RougeR | of | 13:19 |
| azy | kids would be in the street playing, not even noticing their body is killing the virus | 13:19 |
| Joe | the us will not be able to recover from the economic devastation, if this drags on. | 13:19 |
| RougeR | Joe, i fear that is the case world wide | 13:19 |
| RougeR | my biggest worry is this | 13:19 |
| RougeR | No long term immunity, No vaccine for years | 13:19 |
| Joe | china seemed to fix it self pretty quickly | 13:19 |
| RougeR | .... | 13:19 |
| RougeR | that will change life forever. | 13:20 |
| azy | flu doesnt change life much | 13:20 |
| RougeR | true we might be able to create treatments if not a virus | 13:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1038 cases (now 254115), +1 deaths (now 10416), +3 recoveries (now 88977) 🔶 Portugal: +234 cases (now 1020), +1 deaths (now 6), +1 recoveries (now 5) 🔶 Germany: +746 cases (now 17372) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +1 deaths (now 10) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) [... want %more?] | 13:21 |
| RougeR | and we may develop more immunity over more exposures | 13:21 |
| RougeR | this is way more deadly than the flu though | 13:21 |
| azy | flu isnt really that deadly | 13:21 |
| RougeR | 0.1%> | 13:21 |
| Joe | we don't know that, what if half the world population has it? | 13:21 |
| RougeR | this is 1-5% | 13:21 |
| RougeR | iin other news | 13:22 |
| RougeR | brexit is still a thing | 13:22 |
| RougeR | https://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2020/mar/20/coronavirus-live-updates-outbreak-deaths-italy-uk-us-australia-europe-vaccine-china-global-economy-toll-latest-update-news?page=with:block-5e7471098f088d7575596fcc#block-5e7471098f088d7575596fcc | 13:22 |
| ubLIX | some (shall we say, foolish?) people can be glib about the effects being restricted to the old and the weak (ignoring for now that this isn't even true). but the main reason not to be glib about and capacity to navigate a pandemic, is that it is only a matter of time before we are hit with a pandemic disease much more dangerous than this one. and this one is already pretty fucking dangerous. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | 21 new updates | 13:22 |
| RougeR | 3h ago | 13:22 |
| RougeR | 09:27 | 13:22 |
| RougeR | It sounds like a plot from the Police Academy films: hundreds of trainee cadets, some just a few weeks into their training, are sworn in and assigned to active duty to deal with a national crisis. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | A trope that Hollywood screenwriters have long used in various forms but on Friday it’s a deadly serious reality in Ireland where 319 students will be sworn in at the Garda College in Templemore, county Tipperary, to deal with the coronavirus emergency. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | The Garda commissioner, Drew Harris, and justice minister, Charlie Flanagan will preside over a brief attestation ceremony that will observe social distancing protocols. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | Some 124 tutors and instructors from the college are also being deployed to frontline policing. The eight-acre campus may be turned into an improvised health facility. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | On Thursday the parliament passed draconian legislation to allow police detain people who breach self-isolation instructions. It came as the Health Service Executive reported another 191 cases, bringing Ireland’s total to 557. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | Simon Coveney, the tánaiste and foreign minister said political leadership and people’s actions would determine whether Covid-19 “kills hundreds of people, thousands of people or tens of thousands of people in Ireland”. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | Irish Police officers walk past a boarded up bar following the cancellation of the annual Saint Patricks Day parade and celebrations on March 17, 2020 in Dublin, Ireland. | 13:22 |
| RougeR | Irish Police officers walk past a boarded up bar following the cancellation of the annual Saint Patricks Day parade and celebrations on March 17, 2020 in Dublin, Ireland. Photograph: Charles McQuillan/Getty Images | 13:22 |
| RougeR | FacebookTwitter | 13:22 |
| RougeR | 3h ago | 13:23 |
| RougeR | 09:18 | 13:23 |
| RougeR | The Guardian’s Editor-in-chief, Katherine Viner, has written to readers about how we aim to cover the Coronavirus crisis, emphasising the value of expertise, scientific knowledge and careful judgment in our reporting | 13:23 |
| RougeR | She writes: | 13:23 |
| RougeR | With you, we are trying to face this unsettling moment with fortitude, and we’re remembering our history – the Guardian and Observer continued to publish throughout the 1918 flu pandemic and both world wars, and we will do our best to do the same during this global coronavirus pandemic. | 13:23 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: did you just paste the text of a guardian article? | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Read on here | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Coronavirus: the Guardian's promise to our readers | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Katharine Viner | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Katharine Viner | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Read more | 13:23 |
| RougeR | FacebookTwitter | 13:23 |
| RougeR | 3h ago | 13:23 |
| RougeR | 09:18 | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Unlike many news organisations, our reporting is free and available for everyone. We need your support to keep delivering quality, unbiased, factual journalism that’s open and independent. | 13:23 |
| RougeR | The events of 2020 so far have demonstrated the crucial importance of clear, reliable information that explains, in steady measured tones, what is happening. We check facts, meticulously source information, explain the background and keep things in perspective, so that readers can use our work to make decisions about their life, health and security. | 13:23 |
| RougeR | For as little as £1 you can support us – and it only takes a minute. Thank you. Make a contribution - The Guardian | 13:23 |
| RougeR | 3h ago | 13:23 |
| RougeR | 09:08 | 13:23 |
| RougeR | Sales at the UK chain Wetherspoons have been falling sales after Prime Minister Boris Johnson told members of the public to stay at home and not visit Britain’s pubs. | 13:23 |
| ubLIX | knock that off | 13:23 |
| ubLIX | put it in dpaste | 13:24 |
| RougeR | ✔ | 13:24 |
| RougeR | @FFCyclisme | 13:24 |
| ubLIX | ok, RougeR? | 13:24 |
| RougeR | 📢 Face à l'épidémie de COVID-19, la @FFCyclisme demande à tous les cyclistes de faire preuve de responsabilité en évitant toute pratique à l'extérieur durant cette période. | 13:24 |
| RougeR | Un seul mot d'ordre : "Sauvez des vies ! Restez chez vous !" | 13:24 |
| RougeR | Plus d'informations ⤵ | 13:24 |
| RougeR | View image on Twitter | 13:24 |
| azy | he's probably pasted by accident | 13:24 |
| RougeR | 387 | 13:24 |
| RougeR | 8:02 AM - Mar 19, 2020 | 13:24 |
| RougeR | Twitter Ads info and privacy | 13:24 |
| RougeR | 357 people are talking about this | 13:24 |
| RougeR | A statement from a cycling body reads: “Faced with the COVID-9 epidemic the French Federation of Cycling asks all cyclists to show their responsibility and avoid all cycling outside during this period. Remember the rule: “Save lives! Stay at home!” | 13:24 |
| contingo | I would think this is somehow unintentional | 13:25 |
| contingo | good morning | 13:25 |
| ubLIX | morning | 13:25 |
| skullomania | stop pasting garbage RougeR | 13:25 |
| skullomania | do not paste anything in here the bot already posts enough text walls | 13:25 |
| ubLIX | well, lets say it was unintentional, and wish him luck regaining control of his computer | 13:25 |
| skullomania | yep.. | 13:25 |
| ubLIX | unquiet in 5 mins | 13:26 |
| contingo | he is usually well intentioned, if a bit disputatious | 13:27 |
| contingo | :) | 13:27 |
| azy | i think you can unset now | 13:31 |
| azy | i versioned him and his client finally responded | 13:31 |
| ubLIX | welcome back RougeR :) | 13:31 |
| RougeR | hey | 13:31 |
| RougeR | yeah, sorry about that everyone | 13:31 |
| RougeR | it was a complete accident. I double clicked and it selected the entire guardian news feed instead of one line. We really need some flood detection in place. I am very sorry | 13:31 |
| RougeR | Could we have some flood protection in place to prevent that happening again? | 13:32 |
| azy | no u ? | 13:32 |
| ubLIX | ^ LjL | 13:32 |
| skullomania | youd just get banned | 13:32 |
| skullomania | RougeR | 13:32 |
| RougeR | skullomania, | 13:32 |
| skullomania | let's just not paste | 13:32 |
| skullomania | :) | 13:32 |
| RougeR | skullomania, ill set it up client side | 13:32 |
| pwr22 | contingo: is disputatious a word? I feel like it is | 13:32 |
| azy | theres a command to stop pasting. unsure what it is | 13:32 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: please use dpaste for any such extract in future | 13:32 |
| RougeR | its not the first time thats happened in my history of irc | 13:32 |
| contingo | %w disputatious | 13:32 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, was literally 10 words | 13:32 |
| light | azy: /quit | 13:32 |
| Brainstorm | contingo, disputatious — adjective: 1. Of or relating to something that is in question as to its intent or value, 2. Inclined to argue or debate; provoking debate → https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/disputatious | 13:33 |
| skullomania | pwr22 that would be disputes | 13:33 |
| RougeR | but yeah i normally do use dpaste for large pastes | 13:33 |
| skullomania | on i first read disputations lol | 13:33 |
| RougeR | honestly ive been on irc a LONG time, work in tech etc | 13:33 |
| pwr22 | RougeR: if you were on matrix it would just come through as a link to the giant message | 13:33 |
| RougeR | i know about irc ettiqute | 13:33 |
| pwr22 | If you're interested in trying it out 😉 | 13:33 |
| RougeR | pwr22, ahh i dont use matrix | 13:33 |
| RougeR | i might have a look into it thanks | 13:33 |
| RougeR | Ive not really seen the benefit tbh | 13:33 |
| pwr22 | Fair enough, rather than try and sell it I'd just recommend giving it a shot and seeing if there's anything there for you | 13:34 |
| RougeR | pwr22, ill have a look into it now and see what i think | 13:34 |
| pwr22 | <RougeR "i know about irc ettiqute"> Translates basically 1:1 except less need for pastebins | 13:35 |
| pwr22 | <RougeR "honestly ive been on irc a LONG "> Me too, but matrix is a game changer for me. IMO much better than a traditional bouncer and I've been able to replace all my other IM apps with it | 13:35 |
| RougeR | pwr22, okay yeah thats fair | 13:36 |
| RougeR | ill check it out | 13:36 |
| azy | hows matrix work? | 13:36 |
| pwr22 | azy: bit of a nebulous question, probably better asked in | 13:37 |
| pwr22 | #matrix | 13:37 |
| ubLIX | lol the dramatic pause | 13:38 |
| iz | skullomania: are you named after a street fighter 2 ex plus alpha character? | 13:38 |
| pwr22 | I guess it would be on the IRC side? | 13:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 12:28 UTC: Pound jumps and markets rebound as firms await wage rescue plan - business live: The pound is up as European markets rebound and the UK waits for details of the chancellor’s plan to protect wages in response to Covid-19 — from WHO at 12:28: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/sZN454 | 13:38 |
| skullomania | iz 10/10 | 13:38 |
| skullomania | skullo crusha! | 13:38 |
| iz | skullomania: :D nice, he was one of my favs also | 13:38 |
| ubLIX | #matrix is on freenode, yes (500 users) | 13:39 |
| skullomania | i still play on mame now, i have a stick and it's a blast | 13:39 |
| iz | nice, i also would play doctrine dark | 13:39 |
| skullomania | iz i have it set to level 8 difficulty, i play all the chars, it's one of my fav games of all time | 13:40 |
| iz | back when i was in college in the late 90s, we would play that game all the time in the dorms on playstation | 13:40 |
| azy | https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/coronavirus-pandemic-bangladesh-india-muslim-prayer-gathering-healing-verses-a9410476.html | 13:41 |
| skullomania | iz im guessing we're the same age then | 13:42 |
| euod[m] | "for patients who have died positive COVID-19, the median times, in days, that pass from onset of symptoms to death (8 days), from onset of symptoms to hospitalization (4 days) and from hospitalization to death (4 days)." | 13:49 |
| euod[m] | I guess the horrific silver lining is that 4 days isn't a terrible amount of time to be in a hospital :\ | 13:50 |
| Jigsy | https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/mar/20/scottish-hotel-sacks-12-staff-over-coronavirus-making-them-homeless | 13:50 |
| Jigsy | %title | 13:50 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: From www.theguardian.com: Scottish hotel sacks 12 staff over coronavirus making them homeless | UK news | The Guardian | 13:50 |
| RougeR | has anyone got stats for deaths under 65 with no underlying conditions | 13:50 |
| astraliam[m] | %data italy | 13:50 |
| Brainstorm | astraliam[m]: In all areas, Italy, there are 41035 cases, 3405 deaths (8.3% of cases), 4440 recoveries as of March 19, 17:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 13:50 |
| RougeR | and also hospitalisations for under 65 no underlying conditions? | 13:50 |
| RougeR | 50-65 would be idea | 13:50 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: in the CDC article i linked you | 13:51 |
| euod[m] | figure 2 https://www.epicentro.iss.it/coronavirus/bollettino/Report-COVID-2019_17_marzo-v2.pdf | 13:51 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, ty looking | 13:52 |
| RougeR | thanks also euod[m] | 13:52 |
| euod[m] | under 49 seems to be the real drop off. there's still appreciable risk at 65. | 13:52 |
| python476 | we're all citizen of that new realm named covidia | 13:52 |
| python476 | the first fully decentralized kingdom | 13:52 |
| RougeR | euod[m], thank you | 13:53 |
| RougeR | so to extrapolate that | 13:53 |
| RougeR | do we have a CFR for age say 55-65 | 13:54 |
| RougeR | im just reading cdc as well | 13:54 |
| RougeR | my italian is merda | 13:54 |
| RougeR | 36% were aged 65–84 years, 17% | 13:56 |
| RougeR | were aged 55–64 years, | 13:56 |
| RougeR | hmmm | 13:56 |
| Strantrickt[m] | %data Turkeu | 13:56 |
| Brainstorm | Strantrickt[m]: Sorry, Turkeu not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 13:56 |
| Strantrickt[m] | %data Turkey | 13:56 |
| Brainstorm | Strantrickt[m]: In all areas, Turkey, there are 359 cases, 4 deaths (1.1% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 01:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data. | 13:56 |
| ubLIX | RougeR: Figure 2 on page 2 of euod[m]'s link gives you age-disposition without having to speak Italian | 13:57 |
| RougeR | ubLIX, yeah thats whatr i was looking on | 13:57 |
| RougeR | although to be fair that doesnt give percentage only numbers | 13:58 |
| RougeR | the cdc giver percent | 13:58 |
| python476 | I suppose turkey tests almost noone | 13:58 |
| ubLIX | taken from different data sets, too | 13:58 |
| RougeR | initial from USA: , 1% to 3% among persons aged 55-64 years | 14:00 |
| azy | we've no idea how many people have it, so 1-3% is... off, no? | 14:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 12:48 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: US cases cross 14,000, China economy shows signs of normalizing — from WHO at 12:48: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 14:02 |
| RougeR | guys | 14:02 |
| RougeR | so why are immunosupresants not listed | 14:02 |
| ubLIX | yes, those CDC numbers are an initial review of cases that have come to their attention | 14:02 |
| RougeR | has anyone got source on that? | 14:03 |
| RougeR | https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.epicentro.iss.it%2Fcoronavirus%2Fbollettino%2FReport-COVID-2019_17_marzo-v2.pdf | 14:03 |
| RougeR | any stats on these medicines would be awesome: https://dpaste.org/ugT8 | 14:04 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +701 cases (now 254816), +33 deaths (now 10449), +8 recoveries (now 88985) 🔶 Netherlands: +534 cases (now 2994), +30 deaths (now 106) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Austria: +130 cases (now 2333) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) [... want %more?] | 14:06 |
| pagetelegram | What is a good mesh network communication for Andriod with bluetooth and wifi mesh communication connection? One that is compatable with desktop systems? Any? | 14:07 |
| pagetelegram | BCM is closing btw; that was a great mobile option | 14:08 |
| pagetelegram | Rapidshare has option I think if I recall last I used it was buggy and no mobile option | 14:12 |
| pagetelegram | Anyone interested in assessing mesh communication options here they are: https://www.geckoandfly.com/22562/chat-without-internet-connection-mesh-network/ | 14:15 |
| ubLIX | seems like indoors you'd have some work to do (well placed repeaters) to get bluetooth signals propagating well enough inside a building to get a stable mesh of many people across many rooms and floors. and work to do outside with directional antennae for wifi if you wanted the mesh to span an entire village, say | 14:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +188 cases (now 255004), +3 deaths (now 10452) 🔶 Sweden: +167 cases (now 1623) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Austria: +130 cases (now 2333) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Brunei: +3 cases (now 78), +1 recoveries (now 1) [... want %more?] | 14:21 |
| Jigsy | %more | 14:22 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy, [...] 🔸 Bulgaria: +1 recoveries (now 1) 🔸 Burkina Faso: +7 cases (now 40), +4 recoveries (now 4) 🔸 Czechia: +1 recoveries (now 4) 🔸 Faeroe Islands: +1 recoveries (now 3) 🔸 Finland: +50 cases (now 450) 🔸 Gabon: +1 deaths (now 1) 🔸 Germany: +3 deaths (now 47) 🔸 Ghana: +8 recoveries (now 8) 🔸 Malaysia: +1 deaths (now 3) [...] → https://paste.ee/p/UyfE4 | 14:22 |
| pagetelegram | ubLIX, I want to start now. Question is what platform. Wish there was an open standard of blockchain mesh for anyone to create their messenger for the same network connection. Bc people will have different apps that dont connection with one another. | 14:23 |
| pwr22 | You could probably implement matrix on top of any transport medium | 14:25 |
| ubLIX | hardware or software platform? i have no expertise in this area but it has certainly been a popular project (eg rural mesh networks) over the years for many people | 14:26 |
| ubLIX | pwr22: well as soon as your mesh supports IP traffic, you can put matrix on top | 14:26 |
| ubLIX | pagetelegram: the hurdle (beyond choosing platforms) is the multi-stack integrations. not at all a trivial exercise for someone embarking on the idea for the first time | 14:28 |
| pagetelegram | No, I am more thinking that FEMA camps and ships will have no internet and we be close enouugh to each toerh | 14:28 |
| pwr22 | Matrix has been put over non-IP things in PoC | 14:29 |
| pwr22 | I believe | 14:29 |
| pwr22 | But yeah, the easiest way would be with IP for sure | 14:29 |
| pagetelegram | I am not sufficient enough in engineering to create something alone. I am only asking if something is already available and ready to go. | 14:31 |
| pagetelegram | The entire snowden releases have dispersed a lot of effort to create something universal for those not so concerned about big brother. | 14:32 |
| pagetelegram | *dispered=prevented | 14:32 |
| bin_bash | why are people so obsessed with blockchain? who the hell actually wants all of their data on a public ledger? are kleinrock meshes not enough? | 14:33 |
| pwr22 | I don't see any reason that the internet would go offline until we've got to a point where the bigger issue isn't having mesh communications | 14:33 |
| pwr22 | bin_bash: because it lets people assert the authenticity of the data | 14:33 |
| pagetelegram | In FEMA camps and ships during this crisis, they maybe sheilded from outside. This is why I ask | 14:33 |
| pwr22 | I guess | 14:33 |
| [itchyjunk] | What is the question? | 14:34 |
| pagetelegram | To be able to communicate to nearby folks across walls with a mesh network either wifi or bluetooth without reliance on cell and wifi data. | 14:34 |
| pagetelegram | Is there a universal standard that can be used? so any sort of software can connect. | 14:35 |
| bin_bash | yes i know what a mesh network is, pagetelegram, i'm saying including blockchain as a buzzword is unnecessary. | 14:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | Use walkie takie. | 14:35 |
| pagetelegram | Everyone has phones. Not everyone has walkie talkies...I am talking about for connecting to average civilians in crisis. | 14:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | Internet. | 14:36 |
| bin_bash | [itchyjunk]: stop you missed the beginning | 14:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | Why should I stop? | 14:36 |
| ubLIX | walkie-talkie 1000-people conference calls aren't a great idea, [itchyjunk] | 14:36 |
| bin_bash | because you're not contributing anything useful to this part of the discussion. you might want to consider a bouncer of some kind if you want to take part in conversations that began when you were not present. | 14:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | ubLIX, 1000 is a bit too much. but if it was 10 or so, you could arrange some multi channel stuff. | 14:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | bin_bash, I am not going to ask your permission before talking. So I recommend the ignore function in this case. | 14:37 |
| pagetelegram | Talking may be limited in such crisis. Texting, messaging not so much | 14:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | I hopped on and I asked what the question was. I am responding based on that. | 14:38 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: there isn't really a universal standard, no, but there's no reason why someone couldn't build an app and base it off an existing protocol like bluetooth or even location proximity/wifi networks | 14:38 |
| ubLIX | [itchyjunk]: with a well set up wifi mesh, a camp of arbitrary size could have their own irc or matrix server | 14:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 13:32 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: How the New York elite got tested, Coca-Cola pulls its 2020 outlook — from WHO at 13:32: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 14:38 |
| bin_bash | learn to lurk more [itchyjunk]. i'm not telling you to ask permission, i'm telling you to lurk and determine the context before jumping in. there's no requirment to chat. get a bouncer, dont join into an existing conversation and ask people to recap it's just bad manners. | 14:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | ubLIX, why even a mesh though? A LAN sounds easier. | 14:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | bin_bash, no thanks. | 14:39 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "because you're not contributing "> Matrix is good for this 👍️ | 14:39 |
| bin_bash | ok ccp plant | 14:39 |
| ubLIX | [itchyjunk]: sure. circumstances vary | 14:39 |
| pwr22 | You'd want to expose IP on top of whatever transport you implement, then everything will "just work" assuming you can route through to the desired hosts | 14:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | How is this about politics suddenly? | 14:39 |
| bin_bash | matrix is good for not contributing? | 14:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | What a joke. | 14:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | <bin_bash> ok ccp plant | 14:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | ubLIX, i think those cruise ship has such LANS right? | 14:40 |
| ubLIX | [itchyjunk]: no idea, not my area, i'm just joining in the speculation here | 14:40 |
| skullomania | this only highlights how unsanitary cruiseships are | 14:40 |
| skullomania | everyone passing along their bacteria to each other | 14:41 |
| skullomania | fecal matter and what-have-you | 14:41 |
| pwr22 | bin_bash, [itchyjunk] : please drop your antagonism now, lets get back to the topic | 14:41 |
| bin_bash | way back during initial ACTA considerations there were a lot of discussions about building kleinrock mesh networks based on existing WAP | 14:41 |
| bin_bash | i think the issue was just getting it proliferated, but now with androids and iphones being ubiquitous the possibility seems slightly more possible | 14:42 |
| pagetelegram | Drinking water from copper has been studied to kill bacteria. It also kills Viruses too. It is an ancient method of drinking hygeine that has taken eons to get science recognition. | 14:42 |
| bin_bash | the issue still would be getting it out to all devices in the area without direct contaxt | 14:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | pagetelegram, citation on "killing viruses". | 14:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | Virus might have envelop but they sure as hell don't have cell membrane. | 14:43 |
| [itchyjunk] | So i'd like to see what copper is doing there. | 14:43 |
| pagetelegram | I don't have that citation handy. I tried search for studies and just found it to kill bacteria of all types. | 14:43 |
| [itchyjunk] | http://theconversation.com/copper-is-great-at-killing-superbugs-so-why-dont-hospitals-use-it-73103 | 14:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Claims it does kill virus with envelops. | 14:44 |
| pagetelegram | It also increases PH of the water a little bit. | 14:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | "It" being copper. | 14:44 |
| aradesh | deaths in spain exceed 1000 | 14:45 |
| pagetelegram | I have been keeping copper and drinking water from it for 10 years; I was influenced by vedic sciences when younger. | 14:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://sfamjournals.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.1462-2920.2011.02677.x | 14:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | %title | 14:46 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk], the URL could not be loaded | 14:46 |
| pagetelegram | ^ thank you...much quicker than I with search | 14:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Mechanism of copper surface toxicity in Escherichia coli O157:H7 and Salmonella involves immediate membrane depolarization followed by slower rate of DNA destruction which differs from that observed for Gram‐positive bacteria " | 14:46 |
| pwr22 | !cases spain | 14:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | np | 14:47 |
| CovBot | In Spain there have been a total of 19,980 cases as of 2020-03-20 13:15:00 UTC. Of these 17,390 (87.0%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 1,588 (7.9%) have definitely recovered and 1,002 (5.0%) have died. | 14:47 |
| Joe | copper is nothing like hypoallergenic | 14:48 |
| Joe | and oxidizes like a mother. | 14:49 |
| bin_bash | https://www.fastcompany.com/90476550/copper-kills-coronavirus-why-arent-our-surfaces-covered-in-it | 14:49 |
| [itchyjunk] | "like hypoallergenic" ? | 14:49 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +116 cases (now 255120), +6 deaths (now 10458), +838 recoveries (now 89823) 🔶 Iran: +766 recoveries (now 6745) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Austria: +130 cases (now 2333) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) 🔸 Brazil: +3 cases (now 650) [... want %more?] | 14:50 |
| Joe | [itchyjunk]: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.1111/cod.12273 | 14:50 |
| Joe | like hypoalergenic ^^ | 14:51 |
| aradesh | https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51969104 <-- retired NHS staff asked to return | 14:52 |
| [itchyjunk] | ubLIX, looks like there are about a dozen or so meshnetworking apps for andriod. | 14:53 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FireChat | 14:53 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://github.com/moarpepes/awesome-mesh | 14:55 |
| [itchyjunk] | %title | 14:55 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk]: From github.com: GitHub - moarpepes/awesome-mesh: This is a list for mesh networking: Documentation, Free Software mesh protocols, and applications. A mesh network is a network topology in which each node relays data [...] | 14:55 |
| [itchyjunk] | These are some opensource mesh networking apps for android, it seems. | 14:56 |
| pwr22 | Time to get a bunch of Pi Zeros, put solar panels on them and then attach them to helium balloons? | 14:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | No need. | 14:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | Phone to phone would work, it seems. | 14:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | Oh look, there is an IPFS one as well? | 14:57 |
| Poon_ | %data sanfrancisco | 14:57 |
| Brainstorm | Poon_: Sorry, sanfrancisco not found. Either there aren't cases, or it's under a different name. | 14:57 |
| ubLIX | [itchyjunk]: it was pagetelegram who asked the original question; pagetelegram, see links above | 14:58 |
| [itchyjunk] | oh okay | 14:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | IPFS's official channel is on freenode too. so Go-IPFS might be pretty viable. Thought it's a "file sharing" over mesh, chatting would be possible. | 14:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | Hm, so copper and nickle seems like a good thing to consider for future? "We conclude that copper is a very weak sensitizer as comparedwith other metal compounds. However, in a few and selected cases, copper can result inclinically relevant allergic reactions." | 15:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | I am not sure how you would want to use it, but seems useful for pandemic is not everyday situations. | 15:02 |
| Timvde | %cases Belgium | 15:08 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Belgium, there are 2257 cases, 37 deaths (1.6% of cases), 204 recoveries as of March 20, 14:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data. | 15:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | I recommend natures correspondence on the origins of SARS-CoV-2 for everyone: | 15:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-0820-9 | 15:08 |
| darkbsd[m] | %cases Spain | 15:10 |
| Brainstorm | darkbsd[m]: In all areas, Spain, there are 19980 cases, 1002 deaths (5.0% of cases), 1588 recoveries as of March 20, 14:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 15:10 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: nice, thank you | 15:12 |
| darkbsd[m] | %cases Germany | 15:13 |
| Brainstorm | darkbsd[m]: In all areas, Germany, there are 17372 cases, 47 deaths (0.3% of cases), 180 recoveries as of March 20, 14:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 15:13 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: I don't understand how they claim "This is strong evidence that SARS-CoV-2 is not the product of purposeful manipulation." from what they just said up to that point, did you get that? | 15:15 |
| pagetelegram | ubLIX: got it thank you...was out for a moment. be back later. | 15:16 |
| yuriwho | what will determine how soon individuals can return to normal is a blood serology test for antibodies to the virus. This will become the gold standard for hiring and working and travel without restrictions (might even be required on passports and drivers licences). The opposite of a scarlet letter I guess: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/03/new-blood-tests-antibodies-could-show-true-scale-coronavirus-pandemic | 15:18 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +492 cases (now 255612), +8 deaths (now 10466), +10 recoveries (now 89833) 🔶 Germany: +370 cases (now 17742), +4 deaths (now 48), +65 recoveries (now 180) 🔶 Austria: +185 cases (now 2388) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +5 cases (now 284) 🔸 Bangladesh: +2 cases (now 20) [... want %more?] | 15:21 |
| bin_bash | oh sweet, they have a COVID-19 titer test | 15:22 |
| ubLIX | yuriwho: that is a chilling thought | 15:23 |
| bin_bash | ^^^^ | 15:23 |
| python476 | etymonline is now a monitoring tool https://imgur.com/9bgNVda.png | 15:23 |
| bin_bash | yeah i'm not a fan of that potential usecase, but I am a fan of titer tests in general and especially this one | 15:23 |
| yuriwho | for business liability purposes, I think my prediction will come true | 15:24 |
| ubLIX | eradicating the virus eventually via vaccine would be a better outcome for civil society | 15:25 |
| bin_bash | based on community spread and people ignore lockdown and quarantine i find it likely that this will become endemic unless we find a vaccine | 15:26 |
| yuriwho | ubLIx life will never be normal again IMO, but a widely available (and safe) vaccine is the primary goal for the medical and scientific communities | 15:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 14:24 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Facing 'worst crisis since 1929,' bosses watch when you work from home — from WHO at 14:24: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 15:26 |
| bin_bash | has there been any new info regarding immunity after recovery or re-infection? last i saw was the re-infection cases were all inside china and couldve been attributed to improper testing in the beginning | 15:27 |
| ubLIX | bin_bash: from yuriwho's link: "... Krammer notes, immunity after an infection is strong for several months, but then begins to wane. Doctors in Germany are now testing COVID-19 patients from the small cluster of cases in Bavaria in January. One month after infection, antibody levels remained high ..." | 15:28 |
| ubLIX | *the several months part was in reference to other coronaviruses | 15:29 |
| yuriwho | ubLIX: yep, regular recertification will be required | 15:29 |
| ubLIX | i would want strong evidence that the present re-infection suspicions are not just viral rebound | 15:30 |
| yuriwho | bbl afk life | 15:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | mefistofeles, if you study virus with animals as host or human cells in petrie dish, the selection would not be for ACE-2 like it is there. it might for petrie dish | 15:34 |
| NO-Covid | https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/ | 15:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | but there are some additional information that says it's probably not. | 15:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | that's what they are using as a strong evidence | 15:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | i.e spike protein has been through a very strong selection pressure to have high-affinity towards human like ACE2 | 15:35 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: that makes me think it could've been designed specifically to target humans (I mean, hypothetically) | 15:36 |
| mefistofeles | so I still don't get why is that evidence of the opposite | 15:36 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +443 cases (now 256055), +39 deaths (now 10505) 🔶 Spain: +432 cases (now 20412), +39 deaths (now 1041) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 CAR: +1 cases (now 3) 🔸 Cambodia: +4 cases (now 51) 🔸 Norway: +6 cases (now 1854) | 15:37 |
| bin_bash | ubLIX: thanks, just saw that actually, appreciate the recap. I agree, viral rebound seems much more likely than actual lack of immunity | 15:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | mefistofeles, you'ed have to be testing it in humans for that design to work | 15:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | so that extreme case is possible and is not addressed | 15:37 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: ok, I get it | 15:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from BBC Health at 14:35 UTC: Social distancing may be needed for ‘most of year’: The government's scientific advisers say this will help to limit the spread of coronavirus. — from WHO at 14:35: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/EvtJFp | 15:38 |
| mefistofeles | funny they don't really talk about the nature of these mutated residues. may not be significant though, but there used to be at least one charged residue in SARS-CoV that's not present in the new one, who knows if that can give hints into something at the molecular level | 15:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | SARS-CoV has a really optimized binding to ACE2 | 15:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | that's why it was so much more deadlier. | 15:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | This one seems to have staretd with a much shittier binding with strong early selective pressure | 15:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | So they take that to mean it was a host to human jump once and continues human to human | 15:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | as opposed to MERS where it was host to human repeatedly where it dies off | 15:45 |
| ubLIX | so down regulating this binding by weakening its affinity would make the virus deadlier in practise (since rapidly lethal infections burn out faster)? | 15:46 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: do you have the numbers on affinity? Because this paper doesn't seem to suggest that SARS-CoV binds with higher affinity than *-2, does it? | 15:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | ubLIX, well, i think what you are saying would make CoV-2 more like CoV, which was more deadlier | 15:48 |
| mefistofeles | actually, afaik, from CryoEM experiments the opposite has been shown | 15:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | tbh i dont know what exactly happened with CoV, i just assumed they "contained" it? | 15:49 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: I think it is still unknown, it just stopped spreading :P | 15:49 |
| ubLIX | [itchyjunk]: taken over the long term, it seems sars-cov-2 will be deadlier | 15:50 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 14:40 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Coronavirus: Spain warns 80% of people in Madrid will get infected — from WHO at 14:40: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/3brmDn | 15:50 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +152 cases (now 256207), +1 recoveries (now 89834) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 285) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 651) 🔸 Bulgaria: +17 cases (now 129) 🔸 CAR: +1 cases (now 3) 🔸 Cambodia: +4 cases (now 51) 🔸 Congo (Kinshasa): +4 cases (now 18) [... want %more?] | 15:52 |
| [itchyjunk] | mefistofeles, i am basing it off "While the analyses above suggest that SARS-CoV-2 may bind human ACE2 with high affinity, computational analyses predict that the interaction is not ideal7 and that the RBD sequence is different from those shown in SARS-CoV to be optimal for receptor binding7,11" | 15:53 |
| mefistofeles | [itchyjunk]: yes, but that's the thing, theory/computing predicts lower affinity but apparently it's not lower at all (maybe higher, have to check) | 15:54 |
| mefistofeles | so that's why they says the molecular mechanism is a different one, compared to previous SARS | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | I think | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | *say | 15:55 |
| mefistofeles | "Thus, the high-affinity binding of the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein to human ACE2 is most likely the result of natural selection on a human or human-like ACE2 that permits another optimal binding solution to arise." | 15:55 |
| [itchyjunk] | "SARS-CoV-2 RBD exhibited significantly higher binding affinity to ACE2 receptor than SARS-CoV RBD and could block the binding and, hence, attachment of SARS-CoV-2 RBD and SARS-CoV RBD to ACE2-expressing cells, thus inhibiting their infection to host cells." | 15:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.nature.com/articles/s41423-020-0400-4 | 15:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | hmm | 15:57 |
| mefistofeles | %title | 15:57 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: From www.nature.com: Characterization of the receptor-binding domain (RBD) of 2019 novel coronavirus: implication for development of RBD protein as a viral attachment inhibitor and vaccine | Cellular & Molecular [...] | 15:57 |
| mefistofeles | yes, that one is the one with the CryoEM structure | 15:58 |
| mefistofeles | pretty half-cooked, tbh, but since it is that relevant it makes a nature publication for sure :P | 15:58 |
| [itchyjunk] | The computational analysis they talk about might also be inaccurate and what not | 16:01 |
| [itchyjunk] | they are all citing all these "rushed" studies | 16:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:00 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Facing 'worst crisis since 1929,' JPMorgan giving some $1,000 bonus — from WHO at 15:00: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 16:02 |
| sneep | Breaking https://www.dailysquat.com/donald-trump-tests-positive-for-covfefe-19/ | 16:06 |
| [itchyjunk] | What broke? | 16:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | Any better source for that? | 16:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | oh covfefe | 16:08 |
| sneep | Sorry :p | 16:08 |
| [itchyjunk] | pretty sure that was -16 or something | 16:08 |
| bin_bash | lol good one tbh covfefe-16 | 16:09 |
| python476 | covfefe is contagious but doesn't harm lungs | 16:10 |
| python476 | only neurons | 16:10 |
| pwr22 | Fake news | 16:10 |
| bin_bash | it's satire, not fake news | 16:10 |
| sneep | whoosh maybe | 16:10 |
| pwr22 | I was making a trump joke 😭 | 16:11 |
| Poon_ | what is covfefe? | 16:11 |
| pwr22 | Something trump tweeting a while back | 16:11 |
| bin_bash | pwr22: my bad, it's obvious now... havent fully awakened yet apparently | 16:12 |
| pwr22 | Np | 16:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 15:10 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Diane Webber su Twitter: "LOCALIZE THIS: How many ICU beds in your county? Very important work from @KHNews The orange on the map are counties with 0 ICU beds. The gray = No hospital. https://t.co/b4D7gf4MhA" — from WHO at 15:10: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/wSf41q | 16:14 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Zoonotic SARS-CoV likely evolved to infect humans by a series of transmission events between humans and animals for sale in China." | 16:15 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://jvi.asm.org/content/82/5/2274 | 16:15 |
| [itchyjunk] | Quite different from our current cov-2 | 16:15 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Viruses related to the SARS-CoV epidemic strain have recently been found in Chinese horseshoe bats during surveillance of wild animals in Hong Kong (18). Since viruses similar to the epidemic strain have been found circulating within zoonotic pools, there is the potential for yet another reemergence (18)." | 16:19 |
| [itchyjunk] | By 2010, virologists seemed pretty sure we'ed see another pandemic causes by the viruses related to SARS-CoV | 16:20 |
| [itchyjunk] | This, to me, implies it was more of a management and resource allocation issue rather than science being in the drk issue. | 16:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +313 cases (now 256520) 🔶 US: +176 cases (now 14549) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 285) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 651) 🔸 Bulgaria: +17 cases (now 129) 🔸 CAR: +1 cases (now 3) 🔸 Cambodia: +4 cases (now 51) 🔸 Congo (Kinshasa): +4 cases (now 18) [... want %more?] | 16:22 |
| [itchyjunk] | How long are these qPCR tests taking currently? | 16:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | Locally, there is still a 48 hour wait time for results. But that might be because of backlogs. | 16:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | wat | 16:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | "To collect the test a swab will be moved along the tonsillar beds and the back of the throat, avoiding the tongue. | 16:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | In order to conserve swabs, that same swab should then be used in the nose." | 16:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-03-20/coronavirus-covid-19-test-where-how-and-how-long-does-it-take/12074746 | 16:24 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], yes, i think it's shorter than that if you just do it quickly... but my understanding is that there are *many* of these PCR tests around made by a number of companies... | 16:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | That sounds horrible. they stick it down your throat then they stick it down your nose. | 16:25 |
| [itchyjunk] | I guess better than the other way around | 16:25 |
| LjL | ugh don't remind me of the nose thing | 16:25 |
| [itchyjunk] | qPCR takes about 3 hours it seems | 16:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | If you can get your lab approved for testing, you get to decide who you test. | 16:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | If that's how this went down, it seems fine to me. | 16:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | Depends on how the lab got its CDC approval. | 16:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | guilhermeesq[m], link to it? | 16:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | I found it | 16:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-coronavirus-testing-sollis/how-one-elite-new-york-medical-provider-got-its-patients-coronavirus-tests-idUSKBN2170GR | 16:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | "The company triaged requests and only tested patients who showed symptoms that warranted further inquiry, in line with New York health department guidelines, one source said. " | 16:32 |
| [itchyjunk] | seems resonable. | 16:32 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +622 cases (now 257142), +5 deaths (now 10510), +2 recoveries (now 89836) 🔶 Germany: +586 cases (now 18328), +4 deaths (now 52) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +1 cases (now 285) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 651) 🔸 Bulgaria: +17 cases (now 129) 🔸 CAR: +1 cases (now 3) [... want %more?] | 16:36 |
| guilhermeesq[m] | Hey sorry I was chilling with my cats | 16:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 15:35 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Cuomo's order to keep entire non-essential workforce home statewide comes after a day in which 10,000 tests were performed and big jump in confirmed cases. — from WHO at 15:35: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/XYdsja | 16:37 |
| guilhermeesq[m] | I’ve got the coolest covid 19 action figure | 16:40 |
| pwr22 | Wyf | 16:43 |
| LjL | guilhermeesq[m], that is a bit much... | 16:44 |
| LjL | the channel isn't being very active but we don't need to see either a slew of pictures (if on Matrix) or a slew of annoying to look at links (if on IRC) | 16:45 |
| guilhermeesq[m] | It was released in 2005 | 16:45 |
| LjL | ... | 16:46 |
| ubLIX | hint, meet guilhermeesq[m]; guilhermeesq[m], meet hint | 16:47 |
| pwr22 | As someone suffering from severe OCD I don't super appreciate that | 16:47 |
| pwr22 | But I can see the humour | 16:47 |
| LjL | pwr22, well, some self-irony never hurt anyone, if you ask me. don't... obsess on it. *cough* but on the other hand... | 16:48 |
| LjL | don't we have just normal links to these things? | 16:48 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:45 UTC: New York Gov. Cuomo orders 100% of non-essential businesses to work from home: Gov. Andrew Cuomo is holding a press conference Friday to update the public on the COVID-19 outbreak in New York state. — from WHO at 15:45: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/9ST6MI | 16:50 |
| pwr22 | The problem with that action figure it's it's focused on surface level actions rather than the crippling anxiety side of it, but I digress | 16:50 |
| yuriwho | has anyone been able to find a Hans Rosling style bubble animation showing virus spread/country? | 16:50 |
| pwr22 | <guilhermeesq[m] "ima_9868154.png"> Maybe don't spam too many images, and maybe discuss them a bit rather than just dumping into the room? | 16:50 |
| pwr22 | Seems like BoJo will be on TV again in a bit | 16:51 |
| LjL-Matrix | Peter Roberts: if it were focused on the crippling anxiety, it wouldn't be light fun, it would actually just show how bad it is (or at least try, probably failing), wouldn't it? You generally make fun of surface aspects of "bad" things because the inside aspects are actually unsettling | 16:53 |
| pwr22 | I mean the crippling anxiety and suffering is why people with OCD don't generally love people making light of that | 16:55 |
| LjL-Matrix | also the Matrix bridge doesn't "translate" your name to IRC... pfft. It's probably because of the space | 16:55 |
| bin_bash | death 2 bridges | 16:55 |
| LjL-Matrix | Peter Roberts: I am admittedly a hypochondriac. Imagine how for a pandemic is for a hypochondriac. But my friends still sometimes make jokes about it, and maybe the line is subtle between what I will also laugh about, and what will actually make me go "hey are you aware it's actual panic for me?", but I feel that line does exist somewhere | 16:56 |
| pwr22 | Me? Probably because it's using my registered IRC nick | 16:57 |
| LjL-Matrix | If anything what makes me the most mad is people discounting my worries entirely because I'm a hypochondriac. Hypochondriacs are obsessive about their health, but guess what, sometimes they get sick too, and sometimes they are even right about pandemics | 16:57 |
| pwr22 | <LjL-Matrix "Peter Roberts: I am admittedly a"> Yeah, that sucks | 16:57 |
| LjL-Matrix | Peter Roberts: it's just showing "Peter Roberts" on IRC unchanged, instead of "pwr22" | 16:57 |
| LjL-Matrix | I mean when I highlight that | 16:57 |
| pwr22 | <LjL-Matrix "If anything what makes me the mo"> Yup | 16:58 |
| pwr22 | Oh in the mention, odd | 16:58 |
| LjL | pwr22, when I highlight you *from* IRC, I think that works, and is translated into Matrix's "Peter Roberts" | 16:58 |
| LjL | Yeah, "highlight" is the IRC term for mention | 16:58 |
| LjL | Also I'm seeing the bridge is being very slow from the IRC side | 16:59 |
| pwr22 | Hopefully this helps? | 16:59 |
| LjL-Matrix | pwr22: it should, thanks (I wasn't suggesting it has to be done though, it's a glitch in the bridge, obviously not the fault of people's nicknames) | 17:00 |
| pwr22 | Yeah, matrix.org is insanely overloaded so it's probably down to that | 17:00 |
| pwr22 | few seconds lag when I looked yesterday | 17:00 |
| pwr22 | LjL: It's no problem because I've just changed it for this room only | 17:00 |
| LjL-Matrix | Fancy, didn't know that was even possible | 17:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 15:58 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: IRS moves tax filing deadline, Spain warns 80% of people in Madrid will get virus — from WHO at 15:58: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 17:02 |
| pwr22 | https://matrix.to/#/!xYvNcQPhnkrdUmYczI:matrix.org/$qM8pcQ_p2mcG5UQ8A5ZP0o1TLNBPDeK1loBATcEyIZw?via=matrix.org&via=feneas.org&via=maunium.net | 17:02 |
| pwr22 | Relevant message | 17:02 |
| python476 | how much lives saved due to lack of road traffic ? | 17:02 |
| [itchyjunk] | At least 0. | 17:03 |
| LjL | https://www.punto-informatico.it/hd-ue-netflix-youtube-coronavirus/ (italian language) apparently the EU is asking Netflix and Youtube and other similar services to drop HD streams, to avoid risking the European backbones becoming overloaded | 17:03 |
| pwr22 | Haven't they done that already? | 17:04 |
| LjL-Matrix | Well, Netflix has, the article mentions it as an update... but I only got this article now as a mailing list item | 17:04 |
| [itchyjunk] | You can choose your quality anyways and the bitsream is dybanic for netflix. | 17:05 |
| LjL-Matrix | pwr22: I'm not sure I really understand what the relationship is between bridges and matrix.org specifically. I run my own homeserver (incompetently, most likely) but when I type from there, it just gets bridges as if it were matrix.org... I assume matrix.org effectively acts as a hub for all bridging? | 17:05 |
| [itchyjunk] | But the lowered it anyways. i guess they didn't want to say anything at a time of crisis. | 17:05 |
| Joe | wow how long are people sick with this virus | 17:06 |
| pwr22 | The freenode bridge is an appservice (matrix service with special powers) connected to matrix.org, which exposes the rooms | 17:06 |
| LjL | Joe, it's often something like 3 or 4 weeks | 17:06 |
| Joe | there are so many people | 17:07 |
| Joe | unrecovered | 17:07 |
| Joe | or there is no reporting | 17:07 |
| xrogaan | yes, the length is problematic as it bog down the ICU beds. | 17:07 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1652 cases (now 258794), +41 deaths (now 10551), +2 recoveries (now 89838) 🔶 US: +1509 cases (now 16058), +1 deaths (now 219) 🔸 Albania: +6 cases (now 70) 🔸 Algeria: +2 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Andorra: +1 cases (now 75) 🔸 Bahrain: +7 cases (now 291), +2 recoveries (now 112) 🔸 Brazil: +1 cases (now 651) 🔸 Bulgaria: +17 cases (now 129) [... want %more?] | 17:07 |
| pwr22 | Which are accessible from anything in the federation, like yours and my server | 17:07 |
| LjL | Joe, when you look at case numbers, they often include *everyone* who has had it, including both the recovered and those who sadly died. but also, the "recoveries" numbers seem to be very different depending on the country, so i strongly suspect it's not to be relied upon too much. it's probably not a big priority to keep it up to date | 17:07 |
| pwr22 | because matrix | 17:08 |
| LjL | pwr22, theoretically speaking, could i run my own bridge that uses my own homeserver as the "hub" instead of matrix.org, supposing some other service (like freenode) has an agreement with me on doing that? | 17:08 |
| pwr22 | > assume matrix.org effectively acts as a hub for all bridging? | 17:09 |
| pwr22 | So yeah | 17:09 |
| LjL | if not, then i'd have a thing or two to say about the supposed federation and equality of servers :P | 17:09 |
| pwr22 | Yes | 17:10 |
| pwr22 | I'm considering running my own IRC bridge just for myself | 17:10 |
| pwr22 | But for now its "good enough" | 17:11 |
| pwr22 | And I'm focussed on other things | 17:11 |
| bin_bash | im opposed to bridges on principal | 17:11 |
| bin_bash | principle | 17:12 |
| bin_bash | lol | 17:12 |
| LjL | i feel bridges are going to create increasing friction between Matrix and IRC in particular and at some point, each will go their own way | 17:12 |
| LjL | but for now... *shrug* | 17:12 |
| pwr22 | I'm pro-bridges on principal 😛 | 17:13 |
| pwr22 | Isn't like 25% of freenode now on matrix? | 17:14 |
| LjL | pwr22, i think Matrix is basically managing to "turn" many freenode channels into Matrix rooms with many of its users barely realizing | 17:15 |
| pwr22 | <LjL "i feel bridges are going to crea"> I hope not, I'd rather IRC networks start running matrix homeservers as well for their fans to use | 17:15 |
| LjL | the bridging thing was a good marketing move, so to speak, not just a technical thing | 17:15 |
| pwr22 | And with the reverse IRC bridge it means it'll be possible to expose an IRC interface to matrix for people who want to keep using it | 17:16 |
| pwr22 | Yeah, the bridging is what got me more interested in matrix | 17:16 |
| LjL | pwr22, but you see what happens with Matrix features increasingly diverging from IRC features. for instance when someone edits a message repeatedly, it's just horrid spam on IRC... and i guess the bridge could be tweaked to avoid that, just like it could be tweaked to make "replies" less annoying, but ultimately, it all just works in a different way, and it becomes even more different with time, as people start using Matrix-specific features more | 17:16 |
| LjL | pwr22, well, so basically you're wishing for a Matrix ecosystem with an "IRC backwards compatibility mode" | 17:17 |
| LjL | that's probably not what many IRC fans are after :P | 17:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from Scientific American at 16:15 UTC: How COVID-19 Drug Hunters Spot Virus-Fighting Compounds: A big project looks at “doorways” the coronavirus uses to get into cells&mndashand finds drugs that could block them -- Read more on ScientificAmerican.com — from WHO at 16:15: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/BLgBAd | 17:17 |
| pwr22 | I only tried it because I was looking for an opensource e2ee thing | 17:18 |
| pwr22 | <LjL "Peter Roberts, but you see what "> The fallback for that could change | 17:19 |
| LjL | pwr22, partly me too... i'm not sure E2E will ever be quite okay with Matrix at this point though | 17:19 |
| LjL | %cases japan | 17:19 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Japan, there are 963 cases, 33 deaths (3.4% of cases), 215 recoveries as of March 20, 16:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Japan for time series data. | 17:19 |
| LjL | so much for case fatality being 1% or less in my opinion... | 17:20 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, look at Japan's graph, it's probably your source dada's fault, but cases actually went *down* at some point, aside from having repeated values at other points | 17:20 |
| sneep | what does it look like when somebody edits their message? | 17:20 |
| sneep | are there any other channels that have a lot of matrix users? | 17:21 |
| LjL | sneep, to the second question, yes, definitely | 17:21 |
| pwr22 | LjL: the cross-signing stuff will make it good for me | 17:21 |
| LjL-Matrix | To the first question, let me right something | 17:22 |
| python476 | apparently quite many americans are already hurting hard due to economics side effects | 17:22 |
| LjL-Matrix | * To the first question, let me rite something | 17:22 |
| LjL-Matrix | * To the first question, let me rite something | 17:22 |
| LjL-Matrix | * To the first question, let me wright something | 17:22 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +395 cases (now 259189), +3 deaths (now 10554) 🔶 Germany: +227 cases (now 18588) 🔸 Austria: +103 cases (now 2491) 🔸 Ontario, Canada: +50 cases (now 308) 🔸 Colombia: +17 cases (now 145) 🔸 Greece: +31 cases (now 495), +3 deaths (now 9) 🔸 Kazakhstan: +3 cases (now 52) 🔸 Norway: +5 cases (now 1900) 🔸 US: +9 cases (now 16067) [... want %more?] | 17:22 |
| sneep | That looks okay | 17:22 |
| LjL | sneep, does it look okay when people repeatedly edit? which they do, because they don't assume it's an issue for anybody | 17:23 |
| LjL-Matrix | * To the first question, let me write something | 17:23 |
| pwr22 | <sneep "are there any other channels tha"> #perl for example | 17:23 |
| bin_bash | what's the point of the bridge | 17:24 |
| bin_bash | why does it need to exist at all | 17:24 |
| sneep | Really? I;m in #perl and don't see any [m] people talking | 17:24 |
| pwr22 | > <@freenode_sneep:matrix.org> what does it look like when somebody edits their message? | 17:24 |
| pwr22 | * edit1 | 17:24 |
| pwr22 | * edit2 | 17:24 |
| LjL | pwr22, lol don't do it again, i just did it :P | 17:24 |
| pwr22 | LjL: it might be useful to have a way to disable edits in matrix rooms for exactly this scenerio | 17:24 |
| pwr22 | <sneep "what does it look like when some"> original | 17:24 |
| LjL | sneep, they aren't necessarily [m], that's the default but the nick can be changed | 17:24 |
| bin_bash | it might be ideal to just get rid of the bridge entirely | 17:24 |
| sneep | i like the bridge | 17:25 |
| LjL | pwr22, yeah i'm not a fan of edits in general. message removal seemed to be enough for me, and i don't even like the part where the standard *requires* clients to actually remove the messages. that's a case of "it's on my computer so i decide whether or not it gets deleted" imo | 17:25 |
| LjL | bin_bash, well, i'm not going to remove the bridging in this channel. | 17:25 |
| bin_bash | LjL: why not? whats the point of it? | 17:26 |
| pwr22 | Because I'm not on IRC | 17:26 |
| bin_bash | people using matrix can easily use irc. i dont see a benefit. | 17:26 |
| bin_bash | it just adds noise | 17:26 |
| sneep | noise? | 17:27 |
| LjL | bin_bash, you already asked, but i don't know how to even begin answering that question. it seems obvious to me: just like it's nice that on IRC, people can choose their client, now we have a channel that's also a Matrix room so we get virtually twice the users, including those who are already on Matrix and don't really want to grab an IRC client (or vice versa), and with just a little patience and adaptability from both sides, we can get along fine. | 17:27 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "it might be ideal to just get ri"> For you, sure, but I'm also a freenode user of some years and have the opposite view | 17:27 |
| pwr22 | sneep: there's less there now | 17:27 |
| LjL | bin_bash, i've seen people from Matrix saying pretty much "people on IRC can easily use Matrix". that's simply flawed reasoning IMO. | 17:27 |
| LjL | and it doesn't just add "noise", it adds a lot of content from people chatting. | 17:28 |
| bin_bash | ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ | 17:28 |
| LjL | it may add some noise sometimes when features don't quite match, which i do recognize as an issue (and this is why we're discussing it at all) | 17:28 |
| sneep | i guess the birdge doesn't pass on ctcp version, or matrix doesn't support it | 17:29 |
| LjL | if i were primarily a matrix user i'd be offended by what you said, fwiw. just like i was offended when someone told me "why not just use matrix instead" | 17:29 |
| bin_bash | it makes more sense to say people using matrix should use irc because irc is an older and more established protocol and it's already well-known what the privacy and logging policies of freenode are, but when you bridge to another platform you throw all of that away | 17:29 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:27 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: IRS moves tax filing deadline, panicked wealthy flee for the Hamptons — from WHO at 16:27: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 17:29 |
| bin_bash | at the very least, you need to put it in the topic as the bridge could be considered public logging | 17:29 |
| sneep | btw, i'm logging everything that is happening in every channel i'm in | 17:30 |
| bin_bash | good for you, but that's a private log | 17:30 |
| bin_bash | public logging must be announced in the topic | 17:30 |
| sneep | i'm willing to sell it for $100 | 17:30 |
| sneep | kidding :p | 17:30 |
| LjL | bin_bash, i'm not going to do that, especially considering that *any* channel is going to be that way the moment someone uses it from Matrix (since channels don't have to be explicitly bridged for that to happen). if freenode staff is okay with that, then at this time, so am i. | 17:30 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "people using matrix can easily u"> You don't, I do. | 17:30 |
| bin_bash | LjL: it's a requirement for the ToS | 17:30 |
| LjL | if you think it's breaching freenode policy, take it to #freenode or to a staffer. | 17:30 |
| LjL | bin_bash, okay, take it up with freenode, because i'm not changing this. | 17:31 |
| bin_bash | I will | 17:31 |
| python476 | %report sneep --guantanamo --delay - | 17:31 |
| LjL | bin_bash, in the meanwhile, if you don't accept the premises for using this channel, please leave. | 17:31 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "it just adds noise"> I think you can manage to ignore the occasional messages starting with a * | 17:31 |
| pwr22 | And matrix has allowed me to easily write a bot for many different platforms | 17:31 |
| pwr22 | !source | 17:31 |
| CovBot | I am MIT licensed on Github at https://github.com/pwr22/covbot. I fetch new data every 15 minutes from http://offloop.net/covid19h/unconfirmed.csv. | 17:32 |
| bin_bash | pwr22: what stopped you from writing an irc bot? | 17:32 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "good for you, but that's a priva"> If it's in a public room you should consider it public imo. IRC or matrix. | 17:32 |
| sneep | what a silly thing to bicker about, in my opinion :p | 17:33 |
| bin_bash | pwr22: here are the freenode ToS: https://freenode.net/policies | 17:33 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "I will"> Ha ha. What makes you so annoyed that you need to actually prevent other people using the tool they want - we aren't stopping you using IRC ☹︎ | 17:33 |
| bin_bash | >>Nevertheless, we understand that projects might find it useful to publish channel logs so that other users may search and find answers to questions that have previously been addressed on the freenode network. Ensure that you notify users (by way of channel topic, channel entry message or similar) that the channel is being publicly logged and consider providing a way for users to make comments without | 17:33 |
| bin_bash | logging. | 17:33 |
| LjL | i said take it to freenode staff if you want to pursue, and in the meanwhile, if you disagree with *this* channel's functioning, leave. | 17:34 |
| LjL | i didn't need to see that paste. | 17:34 |
| pwr22 | I also drastically prefer matrix myself to IRC | 17:34 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "Peter Roberts: what stopped you "> There's already an IRC bot, I run a homeserver already, and IRC doesn't have the federation or bridging polish matrix has | 17:34 |
| LjL | i am going to ask everyone to move on from this topic at this point. | 17:35 |
| LjL | i know i started it, but it's no longer any fun. | 17:35 |
| pwr22 | <bin_bash "logging. "> It's no more logging than any user in this room is - and IMO this room is very useful in these troubled times | 17:35 |
| pwr22 | I wouldn't dare to try and restrict access to it myself | 17:36 |
| pwr22 | Ok | 17:36 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +164 cases (now 259353), +1 deaths (now 10555) 🔶 Germany: +168 cases (now 18756), +1 deaths (now 53) 🔸 Austria: +103 cases (now 2491) 🔸 Ontario, Canada: +50 cases (now 308) 🔸 Colombia: +17 cases (now 145) 🔸 Isle of Man: +1 cases (now 2) 🔸 Norway: +4 cases (now 1904) | 17:37 |
| pwr22 | Np, I'm just waiting for the UK conference and I'll summarise what's in it here | 17:38 |
| LjL | pwr22, it may overlap with the italian press conference. i guess we'll just make a duet. | 17:38 |
| sneep | Isle of Man :o | 17:38 |
| pwr22 | ha ha | 17:40 |
| zardoz1971 | excuse me. one question. i was banned from coronavirus channel but don't know why. could someone help with some info. | 17:40 |
| LjL | zardoz1971, we have no relationship with that channel, except that of "good neighborhood". we cannot and will not handle bans and other actions taken there | 17:41 |
| LjL | but you can hang out here and see if you like it. | 17:41 |
| sneep | zardoz1971: I'll take a look | 17:41 |
| zardoz1971 | yeah. the problem is i'm new, and i might do something wrong not even knowing it. it would be nice to get notice before ban. | 17:42 |
| zardoz1971 | thanks sneep | 17:42 |
| sneep | zardoz1971: You were sending xdcc chat requests | 17:42 |
| LjL | zardoz1971, you can probably message a channel op, maybe after letting things cool down a bit, and if you're polite and explain your situation, i'm sure they will be also | 17:42 |
| zardoz1971 | LjL, I guessed as much but my hope was that someone is maybe on that channel also | 17:42 |
| bin_bash | zardoz1971: it's not appropriate to join a channel and ask about a different, unrelated channel's ban list. you should instead message chanops of that channel privately | 17:42 |
| sneep | zardoz1971: These were interpreted as attempts to get the IP addresses of the users you sent them to, possibly to DoS/hack/etc. them | 17:43 |
| zardoz1971 | ok. but i don't know who the op is | 17:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 16:40 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: IRS moves tax filing deadline, panicked wealthy flee for the Hamptons — from WHO at 16:40: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 17:43 |
| LjL | zardoz1971, unless a channel is private, typing "/msg chanserv access #channelname list" (without the quotation marks) will show you who the ops are. | 17:44 |
| zardoz1971 | also i did send that xdcc not nowing what it is (wanted private chat). explained and was unbaned. than banned again but don't know why | 17:44 |
| zardoz1971 | ok. won't bother you any more with that | 17:44 |
| zardoz1971 | thanks | 17:44 |
| dTal | zardoz1971: cews is the owner of the channel, and I am also an op there | 17:45 |
| sneep | 02:32 < sneep> Is there a possibility that that guy just thought that xdcc chat is the correct way to do PMs in IRC? 02:32 < ingodid> sneep: doubt it | 17:46 |
| sneep | People are so mistrusting | 17:46 |
| zardoz1971 | sneep, i have mirc. just right clicked by the name i wanted to talk and thought that was it | 17:47 |
| LjL | sneep let them deal with it now | 17:47 |
| zardoz1971 | i'm here three days | 17:47 |
| sneep | ok | 17:47 |
| pwr22 | First UK hospital full up of covid patients | 17:48 |
| LjL | :( | 17:48 |
| LjL | %cases uk | 17:48 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, United Kingdom, there are 3269 cases, 184 deaths (5.6% of cases), 65 recoveries as of March 20, 16:35Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data. | 17:48 |
| LjL | that's not a great percentage to see | 17:48 |
| LjL | we are worse, but still | 17:48 |
| pwr22 | This is in North London | 17:49 |
| LjL | pwr22, do they have provisions to move patients that you know of? | 17:49 |
| pwr22 | Yeah, its shot up | 17:50 |
| AimHere | London is a big city, with lots of hospitals and ambulances so I'm sure they do | 17:50 |
| pwr22 | I'm hoping they'll accounce some more cases soon to dilute it out | 17:50 |
| AimHere | But it's likely all of London will be clogged up soon | 17:50 |
| sneep | are ambulances equipped with respirators? | 17:51 |
| sneep | just a random thing that came to my mind | 17:51 |
| AimHere | I'd be surprised if they don't have some kind of oxygen apparatus | 17:51 |
| AimHere | One issue is that ambulances used to transport Coronavirus patients can't easily be used to transport non-coronavirus patients for a while | 17:51 |
| cews | zardoz1971: you were sending xdcc to users in the channel even after you were instructed not to :) | 17:52 |
| pwr22 | LjL: they said there's room at nearby hospitals | 17:52 |
| pwr22 | So I guess so | 17:53 |
| pwr22 | sneep: I think they intubate and pump a manual bulb don't they? | 17:53 |
| sneep | manual bulb == this? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bag_valve_mask | 17:54 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 16:50 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Conferenza stampa 20 marzo 2020 ore 18.00 della protezione civile — from WHO at 16:50: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/LCnhQZ | 17:55 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: yeah, the dip in numbers for Japan is in the JH data. Hopefully it's a correction but a bit hard to explain. | 17:57 |
| LjL | oh right, the press conference | 17:57 |
| LjL | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M4kbPDHGR0 will have it shortly | 17:57 |
| pwr22 | LjL: update, apparently it was yesterday the hospital was full but not it is not | 17:58 |
| LjL | pwr22, good... in italy it seems the ability to move patients to different *regions* is very limited | 18:00 |
| LjL | and Lombardy is way beyond capacity :( | 18:00 |
| airgap | the invisible enemy | 18:02 |
| pwr22 | Boris has arrived | 18:05 |
| tinwhiskers | \o/ | 18:05 |
| pwr22 | Talking about how we're going to defeat the disease etc by doing the sensible things | 18:06 |
| LjL | Italy is 6 minutes late already | 18:06 |
| LjL | Italy press conference starting | 18:07 |
| LjL | Going to translate now | 18:07 |
| LjL | (Borrelli) Good evening. | 18:07 |
| LjL | Let me introduce Prof. Roberto Bernabei | 18:07 |
| LjL | geriatrist in Rome and president of the "Italia Longeva" association | 18:07 |
| LjL | He'll focus on older adults and their reaction to coronavirus. | 18:07 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:04 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: IRS moves tax filing deadline, panicked wealthy flee for the Hamptons — from WHO at 17:04: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 18:07 |
| LjL | Today's bulletin: | 18:07 |
| LjL | +689 recoveries, for a total of 5129 | 18:08 |
| LjL | +4670 new cases, for a total of 37860 | 18:08 |
| LjL | 19185 of them are in self-isolation with few symptoms | 18:08 |
| LjL | 2655 is the people in ICU, 7% of the total | 18:08 |
| LjL | Unfortunately we register +627 dead, and i want to remind they died "with" coronavirus, not necessarily "from" coronavirus: as you know, the ISS will certify the actual deaths "from" it. | 18:09 |
| pwr22 | Going to do things no other government has done before | 18:09 |
| LjL | We have 1000 more volunteers today fighting this epidemic, I want to thank them all, they are 7000 people in total now in this battle, next to healthcare workers, whom I also thank, as well as police forces and armed forces and everyone else who is fighting this. | 18:10 |
| LjL | Tents for pre-triage is +14 compared to yesterday, total 669 | 18:10 |
| LjL | 122 are still the ones in prisons. | 18:10 |
| pwr22 | Everything is intended to be termporary and economy will bounce back | 18:10 |
| LjL | The patients who were transferred with the "cross" system is +1 patient, for a total of 60, 23 of which having coronavirus, 37 the others. | 18:10 |
| LjL | Some information: first, I signed an ordnance that allows paying pensions in advance, in our post offices and banks. | 18:11 |
| pwr22 | How fast we recover depends how well we deal with the virus now as a whole country | 18:11 |
| LjL | Payment is no longer during just one day, but instead they will be across the whole month. | 18:11 |
| pwr22 | Telling cafes, pubs, bars and restaurants to close tonight as soon as possible but do not open tomorrow | 18:11 |
| LjL | We are working with Minister Boccia, the regional governors, and the Minister of Finances, to conclude the creation of a task force of 300 doctors which will support regions who require them | 18:11 |
| LjL | Shortly, we will announce signing this ordnance, likely by tonight. | 18:12 |
| pwr22 | This is for eat in, not takeaway | 18:12 |
| pwr22 | Telling supermarkets, gyms and leisure centers to close | 18:12 |
| tinwhiskers | Supermarkets closing... Wow | 18:12 |
| LjL | I want to reiterate what we said during the past few days: the commissioner of civil protection do not requisition materials destined to the regions, it would be an in-fight, and it is not happening, even though the web has talked about that. | 18:12 |
| LjL | I also want to deny that our department (why our department?) is preparing "bio-containment conditions" in the whole of the country by April. These are fake news, and people responsible must be punished. | 18:13 |
| LjL | [wow] | 18:13 |
| LjL | Now prof. Bernabei will speak, then we'll have questions. | 18:13 |
| aradesh | our government are launching a scheme to help employers pay their staff | 18:14 |
| LjL | (Bernabei) I can only go back to the analysis by the ISS that Borrelli cited. It's crucial, because the files that have been analyzed about the first 355 deceased: 3 of them (0.8%) had NO comorbidities; everyone else had 1, 2, or 3 comorbidities: respectively 25%, 25% and 48% | 18:14 |
| pwr22 | Everyone should stay at home | 18:14 |
| LjL | That tell us how the data point, which is important on one hand, and takes a snapshot of reality on the other, shows that having old age but also pathologies like diabetes, atrial fibrillations, and others, let the virus find a more fertile, more fragile ground. | 18:15 |
| pwr22 | Repeating "FOLLOW THE FUCKING ADVICE" - paraphrased | 18:15 |
| pwr22 | New economic measures | 18:15 |
| LjL | I think this is the snapshot that explains the excess of mortality, since it has been repeated several times, we are the second oldest country in the world: out average age of cases is 63, in China that was 46 years of age. | 18:15 |
| LjL | (Borrelli) Thank you, now taking questions. | 18:15 |
| AimHere | pwr22, is that Italy closing supermarkets? | 18:15 |
| tinwhiskers | AimHere: uk | 18:16 |
| LjL | Question: If i counted well, 5 regions have 77% of the sick; the percentage of the dead is 90% in these regions. Can this be explained scientifically? Secondly, Prof. Lopalco of Pisa talked today of the possibility of a very long epidemic, with restrictive measures only being lifted in the summer. Is this plausible? | 18:16 |
| pwr22 | UK is going to help pay peoples wages and retain their jobs | 18:16 |
| pwr22 | All companies are eligible | 18:17 |
| LjL | Answer: about the second part, anything is possible, we don't know yet until we have a full evaluation of the peak of this pandemic, we can't calculate this for now. I haven't seen these calculations that you saw, I don't know how truthful they might be. | 18:17 |
| LjL | Question: Today [someone] proposed to give a pulse oxymeter to anyone in self-isolation, to find out about shortness of breath early. Is this a useful proposal to intervene before it's too late? | 18:17 |
| pwr22 | If people are stuck out of work | 18:17 |
| pwr22 | Will pay 80% of their salaries | 18:18 |
| LjL | Answer: Certainly, anything that used to be called "remote medicine", today often termed "technical assistance", the pulse oxymeter is a tool that works, although there are technicalities that are not easy to implement, such as a 24/7 center that monitors the single pulse oxymeters. | 18:18 |
| AimHere | tinwhiskers, I don't see anything about supermarkets in the synopsis. Pubs, clubs, cinemas, and bars close, but that's sane | 18:18 |
| pwr22 | tinwhiskers: it might just be shops, can't imagine they'll close | 18:18 |
| LjL | It tends to be easier to do for individual realities than on a wide basis. But there is no doubt technological measures wshould be used. | 18:18 |
| twomoon | good question ljl. i don't have any experience with pulse oxymeters | 18:19 |
| pwr22 | No limit on funding for this scheme, will go on for at least 3 months | 18:19 |
| aradesh | pwr22: damn. these measures are going to cost them an utter fortune. but... good that they're doing them | 18:19 |
| LjL | Question: In the past few days we saw that some regions have implemented measures of their own, more stringent than the central government, in particular today we have that supermarkets have been limited to closing at 90, and we've been seeing queues become much longer. Do you think this is to be encouraged or not? | 18:19 |
| pwr22 | Government coronavirus loans in uk are interest free for 12 months now | 18:19 |
| LjL | Answer: I think the measures taken until now with the import of the scientific committees were the appropriate ones; if locally there are more things worth implementing, I have nothing to say on that. | 18:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 17:15 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: AGGIORNAMENTO 20/03/2020 ORE 17.00 POSITIVI AL nCov Regione DIMESS|, CASI iotele | peceouti | TAMPoNI attualmente | GUARITI TOTALI positivi Lombardia 7735 1050 6635 15420 22.264| 57.174 Emilia Romagna 2083 267 2739 5089 5.968 | 20.753 Veneto 843 236 2598 3677 4.031 | 49.288 Piemonte 1541 280 1423 [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Qg9uqH | 18:20 |
| AimHere | Holy fuck. 627 people died yesterday in Italy | 18:20 |
| aradesh | the UK are closing supermarkets? wut? | 18:20 |
| aradesh | how are we gonna get food? lol | 18:20 |
| LjL | Question: Today 4670 are the positives, but the recoveries are only 263. This number, considering the self-isolation number is rising, is it caused by low availability of hospital beds? How can we look at this data? | 18:20 |
| aradesh | did i hear that right? | 18:20 |
| LjL | Answer: I don't know... this could be true, but I only see 200 cases today more than yesterday. | 18:20 |
| AimHere | aradesh, I heard pwr22 say it, but I don't see it reported on the news | 18:20 |
| pwr22 | uk, but I'm pretty sure I misheard | 18:21 |
| LjL | (Borrelli) If I may, we look at the numbers every day, and we haven't had issues with being able to hospitalize people. | 18:21 |
| LjL | The ones who are at home are either asymptomatic, or only mildly symptomatic, and does not require hospitalization. | 18:21 |
| aradesh | pwr22: ah ok. rishi (or whatever his name is) did say "closing shops" but i think perhaps he misspoke | 18:21 |
| pwr22 | None of the subtitles have repeated it | 18:21 |
| LjL | I must make this clear because if someone NEEDS hospital assistance, we find solutions, including moving people to other regions. | 18:21 |
| LjL | (Prof.) Same here, for now we've always found solutions. | 18:21 |
| pwr22 | Gonna be an ad campaign outlining the national effort to protect jobs | 18:21 |
| pwr22 | Universal credit limit increased by £1000 a year, and tax credits too | 18:21 |
| pwr22 | Self employed people can get tax credit equivalent to statuatory sick pay (which is terrible in the UK) | 18:22 |
| pwr22 | aradesh: yeah a lot | 18:22 |
| LjL | Question: The percentages as said earlier, if we sum Lombardy and Emilia-Romagna, that's 60-70%. Have we found an explanation? We talked about excess use of anti-inflammatories or NSAIDs... it's been a few days sine the restrictive measures, people have "fled" towards southern regions, but those two regions are still at the top. What is the hypothesis? | 18:22 |
| pwr22 | Something about increasing how much you get for housing benefit, to help people who are renting | 18:22 |
| pwr22 | aradesh: I probably misheard, it was probably just "shops" | 18:22 |
| pwr22 | Though supermarkets are just being panic flooded right now | 18:23 |
| LjL | Answer: there could be many answers to this, and we do not have a crystal ball. I think it's more interesting to notice that the level of infections in the center-south is still limited, which means containment measures are working, because where clusters were small, they remained small. Of course where there were very many patients, things are still explosive. | 18:23 |
| LjL | But we only have 200 new cases more than yesterday, which I think is significant. I don't have a fuller answer. | 18:23 |
| LjL | Question: Today Prof. Carli(?) said in an interview that there are many asymptomatic people in self-isolation, and they risk infecting their relatives, and this way the epidemic doesn't end. Have you considered a quarantine in hotels or military structures? | 18:24 |
| LjL | (Borrelli) We gave indications about this to regions and municipalities. | 18:24 |
| pwr22 | Boris saying we need to get rid of 75% of unnecessary social encounters | 18:24 |
| LjL | There is also an issue with homeless people, or people who live in homes where adequate self-isolation cannot be guarantees. | 18:24 |
| LjL | Local realities, regions and municipalities, are the ones with the ability to intervene on this. | 18:24 |
| LjL | We must ensure that those people who must be in a period of quarantine are allowed to isolate themselves. | 18:24 |
| aradesh | pwr22: that means i probably shouldrn't see my parents at the weekend. but they wouldn't be happy | 18:25 |
| sneep | homeless people are in a bad position | 18:25 |
| LjL | Question: About mortality again, we see in other countries like Germany, the number of deaths is much lesser compared to the cases. Let me compare that with Lombardy today: +44 ICU compared to yesterday, and +381 died. Are we dying more because we cannot find ICU beds in Lombardy? | 18:25 |
| sneep | aradesh: yeah, you shouldn't | 18:25 |
| LjL | (Prof.) No, no, we don't see that. And how are these numbers being calculated? Who's being defined as "dead from what"? | 18:25 |
| LjL | If in Germany they say people died from "interstitial pneumonia" instead of COVID, sure, they'll have few COVID deaths. | 18:26 |
| sneep | aradesh: my mom has understood the situation, i'm sure your parents will understand too | 18:26 |
| LjL | Probably, when this ends and we can do a real post-hoc analysis, we'll understand these issues. | 18:26 |
| LjL | For now it's a blind shot. | 18:26 |
| tinwhiskers | Interesting | 18:26 |
| LjL | Question: but about ICUs, we keep hearing interviews from doctors who say they must select patients, triage. | 18:26 |
| LjL | Answer: what we are told is that when hospitals are too taxed they use the "cross" system, which has always worked. There are no problems from our point of view. | 18:27 |
| LjL | It's obvious that ICU beds are all taken up and work is very much ongoing, but I don't think we have had information about complete lack of availability. | 18:27 |
| LjL | Question: A question for you... | 18:27 |
| LjL | (Prof.) I am not... I must clarify, the Commissioner is Arcuri, but... | 18:27 |
| LjL | Question: So, "Mr Head of Department", today you basically moved the peak to two weeks from now. If this movement were confirmed, if you can confirm it now, de facto the predictions that were made before have been proven false. The measures that have been adopted... we can conclude they didn't work so well? | 18:28 |
| LjL | Answer: No, I thought I should highlight something that has been told to me by experts: we'll never know when the peak is. Rationally, based on the measures taken, we are guessing next week or the one after, but there isn't a scientific datum. There are trends which must be verified. | 18:29 |
| LjL | Question: [inaudible] | 18:29 |
| LjL | Answer: In my opinion, the measures taken gave results. | 18:29 |
| LjL | The number of new cases are due to virus circulation that occurred before the restrictive measures, which will help us stop the virus circulating. | 18:30 |
| LjL | (Prof.) Also consider it's been about 10 days. We must wait at least two weeks to mathematically model some data, but two weeks are the minimum required. | 18:30 |
| LjL | Question: Since you were talking about PM Conte's statement he'd like to introduce more resstrictions... have you suggested more specific punishments for violations? This seems to be missing at this point. Secondly, do you have data about beds and ICU beds in the less-hit regions so far? | 18:31 |
| LjL | Answer: (Borrelli) We started with 5400 ICU beds in Italy, and now, we have around 8000. I don't have the exact number but that's about it, and they are still growing, as have the beds in pneumology, and other specialized wards. | 18:31 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 17:26 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Unprecedented stop in economic activity, Americans worry about looming bills — from WHO at 17:26: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 18:32 |
| LjL | About sanctions and fines, as the Civil Protection we just do our activities... the political decisions are left to the PM and the government. | 18:32 |
| LjL | Question: something that's two questions in one: Zaia, the government of Veneto, says he's very worried about the presumed new Verona cluster, which is occurring despite the containment measures, and it's hard to contain at this point, so the virus is still expanding... and here in Latium, we found a cluster too... some nuns have been infected from being in hospitals... I know we aren't at the peak and everything is limited in the center-south... but? | 18:33 |
| twomoon | pneumology = pulmonology (?) | 18:33 |
| LjL | Answer: Well, the idea that the next few days may see more clusters is not something that would surprise me, but the important thing is to immediately take actions to limit them. | 18:33 |
| LjL | What's fundamental is to see what happens two weeks after the containment measures. | 18:33 |
| LjL | twomoon, probably thanks | 18:33 |
| LjL | Question: In the US, apparently we sent 500 tests there. Without going political, can we really export tests? DO we have enough? | 18:34 |
| LjL | Answer: we bought 390000 tests, which are being distributed to the regions. We don't have a critical situation, except for some regions which didn't have enough... if we have enough to export them, it seems that's fine | 18:34 |
| LjL | Question: [missed] more contagion has been registered. Is it wrong to consider the Veneto cluster "extinguished"? | 18:35 |
| LjL | Answer: We can have unforeseen clusters, but still, one is better than 100 | 18:35 |
| LjL | [?!] | 18:35 |
| LjL | (Borrelli) Thanks and good evening. | 18:35 |
| LjL | --- end | 18:35 |
| tinwhiskers | Thanks again LjL | 18:35 |
| LjL | [note: I believe we exported 500000 tests, or rather swabs, and not 500] | 18:35 |
| tinwhiskers | That's more than you bought | 18:36 |
| tinwhiskers | But 500 seems so low as to not be worth mentioning. | 18:36 |
| AimHere | aradesh, apparently the Chancellor did say 'shops', but really he just meant clubs/pubs/restaurants/bars, social arenas in general | 18:37 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, i suspect a problem with supermarkets closing, aside from strange orders from local authorities, is that employees are becoming scared to work and want to stay home | 18:37 |
| AimHere | You were vindicated! | 18:37 |
| LjL | i think supermarkets need to quickly up their ability to accept online orders | 18:37 |
| LjL | currently their websites are overwhelmed, and so are their delivery slots | 18:37 |
| LjL | the groceries we had ordered for march 23, we've just been told they'll come on march 27 instead | 18:38 |
| LjL | that's not dramatic for us, we'll survive, but it's an issue | 18:38 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: are you saying supermarkets are closed in Italy? | 18:38 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, no, i'm addressing your "wow" about opening hours being restricted | 18:39 |
| LjL | the fact some of them are closing at 19 | 18:39 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: that was apparently an error | 18:39 |
| LjL | i think it's not just random orders from local authorities, it's also the supermarket personnel | 18:39 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, oh, that was actually addressed to pwr22? | 18:39 |
| LjL | sorry, i was very intent on transcribing | 18:39 |
| tinwhiskers | Let's back up a sec | 18:39 |
| tinwhiskers | Yeah, I understand that LjL | 18:40 |
| LjL | %cases italy | 18:40 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Italy, there are 56182 cases, 4032 deaths (7.2% of cases), 5129 recoveries as of March 20, 17:33Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 18:40 |
| LjL | 56k... | 18:40 |
| tinwhiskers | Just before we send it the wrong message. | 18:40 |
| LjL | they no longer give the total case numbers, if you notice, in the press conference | 18:40 |
| LjL | they only give the *active* cases | 18:40 |
| LjL | and when they mention new deaths, they don't give the total | 18:40 |
| LjL | even though they give the totals for cases (active) and recoveries | 18:40 |
| LjL | i think Brainstorm has updated its data on Italy, but failed to send an automatic update about it :( meh | 18:41 |
| LjL | okay, today's transcription: https://dpaste.org/4g5O | 18:43 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 17:42 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Coronavirus UK: Boris Johnson announces lockdown measures in London — from WHO at 17:42: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/PJQymI | 18:44 |
| tinwhiskers | Just to reiterate, in case any rumors start, the mention of uk supermarkets closing is an error. | 18:44 |
| pwr22 | Yes, it is an error | 18:45 |
| pwr22 | They've just announced saying shops was an error too | 18:46 |
| pwr22 | Shops will remain open | 18:46 |
| LjL | here's a grep of pwr22 after Johnson started speaking https://dpaste.org/qDR8 | 18:46 |
| tinwhiskers | I suspect even the incorrect mention of shops closing will start another wave of panic buying. Ooops | 18:49 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: how do you do? | 18:50 |
| xrogaan | Gamestops stay open, force employee to work while managers take a leave. | 18:50 |
| xrogaan | That's downright criminal. | 18:50 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: how do you do | 18:50 |
| Spec | the front line workers...the emergency personnel, selling used games. critical to our economy | 18:50 |
| tinwhiskers | Heh | 18:51 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: i suspect i should stop wading through numbers all day on days off work | 18:51 |
| xrogaan | I'm going to sleep, otherwise I'll get angry. | 18:51 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: is there any way you could add some more fancy graphs | 19:03 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 18:00 UTC: /u/slakmehl: Percentage changes from yesterday in Italy, which continues to be hardest hit country in the world: — from WHO at 18:00: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/Eq7vRH | 19:03 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: i like being able to compare the curves from a normalized time...like when 10 deaths are reached, or 100 infections, instead of real-dates. is that possible? | 19:03 |
| Jigsy | There seems to be some normalcy at my local store now. | 19:03 |
| Jigsy | Shelves being stacked. | 19:03 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, indeed that kind of graph is pretty nice, although, Spec, i think one of the trackers in the topic does do that | 19:03 |
| Jigsy | Etc. | 19:03 |
| tinwhiskers | Ah. I see. That would be interesting | 19:03 |
| LjL | you may need to scroll down a fair bit though | 19:04 |
| Jigsy | Unless we're yet to have panic buying round two. | 19:04 |
| Spec | LjL: which tracker? i only saw point-in-time snapshots | 19:04 |
| LjL | Spec, let me see, i forget too | 19:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:05 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Unprecedented stop in economic activity, London goes into lockdown — from WHO at 18:05: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 19:10 |
| LjL | Spec, tinwhiskers: ah, i'm not sure if there was also an english one, but i can't find it right now... instead, i have https://lab24.ilsole24ore.com/coronavirus/ and you need to scroll down to "La traiettoria negli altri paesi" (meaning "The trajectory in other countries"), it starts from the 100th case | 19:11 |
| LjL | it only has a selection of countries | 19:11 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: that would require adding three new charts (normalised outbreak time for confirmed, deaths and recovered). How about instead just having a number you can set to normalise the outbreaks to, that defaults to 0, being no change, but if you set it to say 100, then all the graphs will shift to start at 100 | 19:11 |
| LjL | but you can add more manually, actually | 19:11 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, i would like that | 19:12 |
| Spec | LjL: is that...showing spain and usa having a worse curve than italia? | 19:12 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: ohh, that would be great | 19:13 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: just be clear that 0 means no normalization and not normalized to zero cases :P | 19:13 |
| LjL | Spec, Spain and the US are not doing great at all :( | 19:13 |
| LjL | so basically yes | 19:13 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: right | 19:13 |
| LjL | although we're still worst in terms of deaths | 19:13 |
| LjL | but today deaths went down a bit... or at least, not up? i'm not sure | 19:13 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: but yes, that would be amazing :) | 19:13 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: but I think that's the same thing? | 19:13 |
| Spec | LjL: zombies? | 19:13 |
| LjL | Spec, no i mean, *new* deaths | 19:14 |
| Spec | LjL: :) | 19:14 |
| LjL | compared to yesterday's increment in deaths | 19:14 |
| LjL | let's call it delta from now on so i don't get all confused :P | 19:14 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: would it? if your country gets it today, yesterday (0) would be lined up with when US got its first case a month ago, if it was normalized-at-0-cases, right? | 19:15 |
| Spec | LjL: is delta asking for government monies, too? | 19:15 |
| LjL | Spec, not the airline :P | 19:15 |
| LjL | Spec, you'll make me switch to the greek keyboard | 19:15 |
| LjL | then i'll also have to insult you in greek | 19:15 |
| LjL | αντε γαμησου Σπεκ... →Δ← | 19:16 |
| Spec | LjL: i'm hoping we take over boeing and shift production to medical equipments :D | 19:16 |
| bin_bash | that won't happen | 19:16 |
| LjL | Spec, i think you just gave boeing some money instead | 19:16 |
| Spec | lol, google translate -> if you fuck Spek ... → Δ ← | 19:16 |
| LjL | Spec, Δ looks a bit rough for that | 19:17 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:12 UTC: (news): UK PM Boris Johnson announces lockdown measures in London, telling cafes, pubs and restaurants to close — from WHO at 18:12: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/4rAJVx | 19:17 |
| Spec | bin_bash: ah i know, we'll just keep letting them abuse faa regulators, and maximize them profits | 19:17 |
| bin_bash | id be fine with it if they stopped outsourcing | 19:17 |
| bin_bash | the whole max fiasco is due to outsourcing | 19:17 |
| bin_bash | and lowered quality | 19:17 |
| tinwhiskers | Spec: yeah, it would be the same because all jh data is left-padded with 0s to make the data fall into the correct date column. | 19:17 |
| bin_bash | and just lack of care in general | 19:17 |
| bin_bash | sad! | 19:17 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: ah | 19:18 |
| Spec | tinwhiskers: oic | 19:18 |
| Spec | bin_bash: you can outsource and still maintain quality | 19:18 |
| Spec | lack of care and oversight, and allowing government oversight instead of hiding from regulators, is probably key tho | 19:18 |
| bin_bash | sure you can, but it costs about the same as it would to pay in-country | 19:18 |
| Spec | bin_bash: sure! | 19:19 |
| Spec | if it doesn't, good for them, if it does, move manufacturing local, *shrug8 | 19:19 |
| bin_bash | if trump was smart, he'd allow companies to be bailed out with the guarantee they don't outsource to 3rd world shitholes and if they do, the company would be dissolved and the culpable executives blackballed | 19:19 |
| BruntLIVE | massage parlors closed, no handy unless u want a face full of fecal covid-19 | 19:19 |
| Jigsy | There are three people in space right now. | 19:23 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:16 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: Unprecedented stop in economic activity, London goes into lockdown — from WHO at 18:16: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 19:24 |
| AimHere | Which one has the Covid? | 19:24 |
| euod[m] | meh, space has more issues. | 19:24 |
| euod[m] | did you know that GPS and GLONASS need constant upkeep? | 19:24 |
| euod[m] | if they don't get ground source sync information, they cease to work. | 19:24 |
| sneep | So my mom told me that she only has 8 rolls of toilet paper remaining | 19:26 |
| euod[m] | the EU version, GALILEO lost sync for a few weeks and everybodies stuff was reporting negative elevations and all sorts of crazy stuff. | 19:26 |
| sneep | And I said, cool so that's about eight weeks of toilet paper right? | 19:26 |
| pwr22 | She's doomed | 19:26 |
| euod[m] | there's already been two airports go to ATC ZERO (no controllers at all) due to coronavirus. chicago midway and Las Vegas https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0jJ_MNvxtI | 19:26 |
| sneep | And she said, no, I'm a woman and women need more toilet paper than men | 19:26 |
| bin_bash | are they like tiny rolls? | 19:27 |
| sneep | How much toilet paper do women need? | 19:27 |
| bin_bash | it depends on the size | 19:27 |
| bin_bash | of the rolls, i mean | 19:27 |
| euod[m] | more, is the answer. | 19:28 |
| euod[m] | you don't get away with 3 squares (one up, one down, one to polish). | 19:28 |
| LjL | Spec, tinwhiskers, mefistofeles: by the way, despite the bot failing to inform anyone about it (sigh), i have added, not quite a "symptoms list" yet, but a "Do I have it?" section that will eventually also contain a symptoms list. it's not complete, i just saved what i managed to do until i went to bed. you may want to have a look | 19:30 |
| LjL | i feel a symptoms list on its own does more harm than good | 19:30 |
| LjL | we need to explain symptoms in terms of specificity | 19:30 |
| LjL | (or, mostly, lack thereof) | 19:30 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 18:26 UTC: (news): Coronavirus live updates: States expand unemployment, WHO warns of health system collapse — from WHO at 18:26: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/chMNS3 | 19:31 |
| tinwhiskers | Cool | 19:31 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers, do you have a github account? | 19:32 |
| Spec | it's funny how all these social policies are coming out of the US | 19:32 |
| Joe | isn't it | 19:32 |
| Spec | these basic, basic policies that could have relieved so much suffering of the impoverished | 19:32 |
| Spec | during normal times | 19:32 |
| Joe | they got caught with a huge sham government on their hands | 19:33 |
| LjL | Spec, well to be fair, italy has allocated *billions* out of thin air, whereas usually, in the yearly budget law, they try to scrape scant millions from here and there | 19:33 |
| LjL | so i dunno, money can be pretty virtual | 19:33 |
| LjL | but eventually you pay for things somehow | 19:33 |
| tinwhiskers | LjL: yes, tinwhiskers2 | 19:34 |
| Joe | half the political rivalerys was just because the systems are broke or broken and the people were shammed into support the side of greed. | 19:34 |
| Spec | Joe: perhaps both sides are the side of greed | 19:35 |
| Joe | oh they are | 19:35 |
| Joe | no doubt | 19:35 |
| euod[m] | <LjL "but eventually you pay for thing"> trump actually made a sensible quote for once. who the fuck cares about the budget if you end up with a functioning country at the end of it. | 19:36 |
| Joe | suddenly universal healthcare and they aren't charging us interest on. the loans taxes paid for? | 19:36 |
| Joe | the money is FAKE | 19:36 |
| Joe | they can make as much as they want | 19:36 |
| Joe | they chose to suppress people | 19:37 |
| LjL | euod[m], well, "the end of it" is the issue. you may have a functioning country for a long time but then eventually you have to declare bankrupcy. i don't know, that wouldn't be great. | 19:37 |
| Spec | Joe: well, i'm not sure the current approach is necessarily sustainable | 19:37 |
| Spec | Joe: but certainly some core aspects are fundable and it is a lie that they aren't | 19:37 |
| Spec | Also, the "highschool jobs" being shown to be ultra critical to national security is a nice turn of events in the public mind | 19:38 |
| Joe | i'm well aware, siphon the actual tax dollars to their friends and run the joint on debt | 19:38 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 18:36 UTC: /u/slakmehl: New US data shows massive one day % increases: — from WHO at 18:36: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/oEdmdA | 19:38 |
| Spec | People stock shelves their whole lives and are told their jobs are unimportant, and the pay is commensurate with replaceability | 19:38 |
| Joe | oh you mean the girl at the gas station and the kid at the liquor store? while the police barely answer the phone for emergencies?? | 19:39 |
| Joe | the furnace repair man??? | 19:39 |
| Joe | the real heros of society, who will put there lives on the line for the comfort of others? | 19:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | Robots. | 19:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | We're almost there. | 19:40 |
| euod[m] | more likely these people just don't have a choice. | 19:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | Walmart is testing robots that can stock shelves already. | 19:40 |
| euod[m] | I'm very happy sitting in isolation doing the same thing I was doing a month ago (nothing). | 19:41 |
| euod[m] | I have the luxury of not thinking about rent, bills, things like that. | 19:41 |
| Joe | we all have a choice, my states is giving away max unemployment no questions asked. Yet the girl keeps showing up to run the register for less money | 19:41 |
| Acoustic[m] | !cases Poland | 19:44 |
| CovBot | In Poland there have been a total of 411 cases as of 2020-03-20 18:33:00 UTC. Of these 392 (95.4%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 13 (3.2%) have definitely recovered and 6 (1.5%) have died. | 19:44 |
| Joe | !cases newyork | 19:45 |
| Joe | no? | 19:45 |
| Joe | !cases usa | 19:45 |
| CovBot | I have searched my data but cannot find a match for newyork. It might be under a different name or there may be no cases! If I am wrong let @pwr22:shortestpath.dev know. | 19:45 |
| AimHere | 7245 cases in New York | 19:45 |
| AimHere | Up nearly 2k from yesterday | 19:46 |
| Joe | almost 2000 more | 19:46 |
| Joe | jfc | 19:46 |
| Spec | good, testing is vital | 19:46 |
| Spec | it's likely there are many more | 19:46 |
| CovBot | In United States there have been a total of 16,609 cases as of 2020-03-20 18:33:00 UTC. Of these 16,259 (97.9%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 125 (0.8%) have definitely recovered and 225 (1.4%) have died. | 19:46 |
| Spec | Joe: grocers aren't there for the "comfort of others", they're critical aspect of food distribution | 19:47 |
| Spec | It is interesting to see the various states come out with whether or not HVAC services are essential. Obviously heating is essential, but AC? | 19:47 |
| Joe | in texas in a few weeks? ya ac is essential | 19:48 |
| AimHere | Spec, if you live in New Mexico or Texas, it's probably essential, while in Minnesota, heating is essential and AC isn't | 19:48 |
| euod[m] | AC probably is. | 19:48 |
| Joe | or the over 80s will be dying of heat stroke | 19:48 |
| LjL | Spec, many people in Italy die from heat strokes during summers | 19:48 |
| euod[m] | for a lot of cases. | 19:48 |
| euod[m] | it definitely is for server farms, which are sort of melting at the moment. | 19:49 |
| euod[m] | well people over 80 are almost certainly going to die regardless. | 19:49 |
| AimHere | Not really | 19:49 |
| LjL | Spec, by the way... our Amazon order, which was placed "in one piece", was due for Monday, at least most of it. instead, two things arrived this morning, and a third arrived this afternoon. something else is "delayed" and it gives no delivery date. this seems... somewhat inefficient for delivery people? | 19:49 |
| Spec | euod[m]: not necessarily | 19:50 |
| AimHere | Maybe 5 or 10% of them | 19:50 |
| euod[m] | if you're over 80 and you show up at a hospital, you're the absolute last to be triaged. | 19:50 |
| Joe | spec i never said grocers or their stockers, my commentary was limited to the gas station and liquor store | 19:50 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1812 cases (now 270199), +79 deaths (now 11276) 🔶 France: +1617 cases (now 12612), +78 deaths (now 450) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +1 cases (now 84) 🔸 Channel Islands: +1 cases (now 12) 🔸 Germany: +137 cases (now 19848) 🔸 Hungary: +1 deaths (now 4) 🔸 Lebanon: +14 cases (now 177) 🔸 Qatar: +10 cases (now 470) 🔸 US: +29 cases (now 16638) [... want %more?] | 19:50 |
| LjL | %cases france | 19:50 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, France, there are 12612 cases, 450 deaths (3.6% of cases), 1295 recoveries as of March 20, 18:48Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=France for time series data. | 19:50 |
| Spec | Joe: yeah, i'm not sure how vital liquor stores are, gas stations...questionable as well | 19:50 |
| LjL | the "Chinese" 3.4% seems to hold true in many countries, Italy excluded | 19:50 |
| Spec | Joe: in some regards, diesel stations are ultra critical | 19:50 |
| euod[m] | LjL: amazon has always been like that. at one point they sent 5 different delivery people to my door for a single order. | 19:50 |
| LjL | euod[m], that seems now sillier than ever | 19:50 |
| euod[m] | 3 amazon, one UPS, one Fedex. | 19:51 |
| Spec | LjL: logistics are hard :P | 19:51 |
| Joe | ummm my gas station can run with out the girl inside selling smokes and chips | 19:51 |
| euod[m] | LjL: remember the amazon delivery people get paid in the order of a dollar per delivery. | 19:51 |
| Joe | or she can be inside with the door locked to make sure no one dies | 19:51 |
| LjL | euod[m], i don't feel great about relying on amazon so much, but... regular stores are practically useless (i mean, they were even before the lockdown) | 19:52 |
| oxalis | What is the malaria drug that works for COVID-19? | 19:53 |
| LjL | chlorequine | 19:53 |
| LjL | "works" may be an overstatement | 19:53 |
| Spec | Joe: yes, there is some safety concerns w/ operating gas stations - but truck drivers need food and diesel and need to keep a tight schedule, much demand | 19:53 |
| euod[m] | <LjL "euod, i don't feel great about r"> amazon is set to be more useless soon. they aren't accepting re-stocks of "non essential" items. | 19:54 |
| LjL | it's being employed as compassionate use with some apparent success, but real trials need to be made | 19:54 |
| oxalis | LjL is that that same quinine that’s in tonic water? | 19:54 |
| Spec | and nurses/doctors/essentials nstill need fuel to work | 19:54 |
| LjL | euod[m], i know, but considering supermarkets here are now almost unapproachable, that may not be a bad thing for us, depending on what they consider essential | 19:54 |
| twomoon | you have to watch out for heart function getting affected by chloroquine ljl | 19:54 |
| Joe | oh for sure most of those are sold on fleet cards, literally no one is there except for the fuel coordinator making sure things run smoothly. | 19:55 |
| twomoon | if you decide to take i think you should take some magnesium with it | 19:55 |
| euod[m] | "one day delivery" for me on amazon is uh, monday. | 19:55 |
| LjL | let's not start with medical advice twomoon | 19:55 |
| twomoon | i'm sorry | 19:55 |
| euod[m] | same with "same day delivery". | 19:55 |
| LjL | nobody here is saying, or should be saying, "use chlorequine" | 19:55 |
| LjL | perhaps i should have been clearer | 19:55 |
| LjL | DON'T use any medication without consulting a doctor | 19:55 |
| euod[m] | hell no. | 19:55 |
| twomoon | yes pls be careful folks | 19:55 |
| LjL | certainly don't based on things people (me included) say on this channel | 19:55 |
| euod[m] | it's not a safe drug for people to randomly be taking. | 19:56 |
| twomoon | it's toxic if you take it too long | 19:56 |
| euod[m] | it'll be a massive disaster if a bunch of people take it off demand and end up hospitalized. | 19:56 |
| twomoon | could even be toxic in small doses who knows | 19:56 |
| LjL | it's a drug that is given only to people with serious conditions, because it's itself a pretty damaging drug. | 19:56 |
| Joe | or it does work and we end up with a huge shortage from hoarder | 19:57 |
| LjL | let's follow the developments with full attention, but let's also not ingest pills based on that | 19:57 |
| euod[m] | <Joe "or it does work and we end up wi"> it's already happened. there's no stock of it even for people to take normally. | 19:57 |
| euod[m] | wait until people learn fingolomod is being trialed. | 19:57 |
| euod[m] | drug makes your fucking retinas detach and your skin fall off. | 19:57 |
| Joe | what about gilead's drug.. that is being used in a trial too? | 19:57 |
| twomoon | holy shit euod[m] | 19:58 |
| LjL | well, if you hoard any medical things "just in case" these days, you're basically killing people. keep that in mind. | 19:58 |
| JoeLlama | social distancing? I've been doing that my whole life | 19:58 |
| euod[m] | <twomoon "holy shit euod "> to be very clear it's an immunomodulator. it's being trialed for people whos lungs are filled with white blood cells. it's not even a recommended drug for the purpose it used to be used for treating. | 19:59 |
| LjL | JoeLlama, COVID! | 19:59 |
| JoeLlama | moo | 19:59 |
| JoeLlama | ya | 19:59 |
| JoeLlama | I'm having a covid party at my house | 19:59 |
| twomoon | is lungs filling with WBC = cytokine storm? | 19:59 |
| euod[m] | <twomoon "holy shit euod "> but for people with multiple scelerosis who are taking it, if they STOP taking it, their immune system attacks their nerves and brains. it's just a really shitty drug all around. | 19:59 |
| JoeLlama | ew | 19:59 |
| LjL | i think a cytokine storm tends to have whole-body involvement | 19:59 |
| JoeLlama | ew | 19:59 |
| twomoon | i see ljl | 20:00 |
| JoeLlama | I learn things here I never wanted to know :( | 20:00 |
| LjL | JoeLlama, yes, it's one of those times :( | 20:00 |
| euod[m] | heh, all MS drugs are awful like you wouldn't believe. | 20:00 |
| euod[m] | they're getting better. | 20:00 |
| euod[m] | fingolimod (right spelling now) is phased out because Roche managed to make a better immunomodulator. | 20:01 |
| LjL | -ChanServ- The entry message for ##covid-19 has been set to We do NOT provide medical advice. Anything medical mentioned here is for discussion purposes. Hoarding anything that may be essential for people at this time equates to killing them. Please keep that in mind whatever you do or say. | 20:01 |
| CovBot | In New York, United States there have been a total of 5,365 cases as of 2020-03-20 00:50:03 UTC. Of these 5,331 (99.4%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 0 (0.0%) have definitely recovered and 34 (0.6%) have died. | 20:02 |
| pwr22 | <Joe "!cases newyork"> !cases new york | 20:02 |
| Joe | oh it's just the space?? ty | 20:02 |
| Joe | !cases new york | 20:02 |
| CovBot | In New York, United States there have been a total of 5,365 cases as of 2020-03-20 00:50:03 UTC. Of these 5,331 (99.4%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 0 (0.0%) have definitely recovered and 34 (0.6%) have died. | 20:02 |
| Joe | ty pwr22 | 20:02 |
| euod[m] | you get a bunch of mice, genetically modify them, grind them into a paste, modify the paste to be closer to human, and then inject it into people. inject it, and it lasts a good 6 months of supressing people's immune response enough that their body doesn't attack their nerves. it's quite beaufiul. | 20:02 |
| euod[m] | pity it costs a solid $100,000 a year or something. | 20:03 |
| nichos[m] | !cases florida | 20:11 |
| python476 | damn nocebo | 20:12 |
| python476 | every time I speak with someone | 20:12 |
| CovBot | In Florida, United States there have been a total of 520 cases as of 2020-03-20 16:43:10 UTC. Of these 511 (98.3%) are still sick or may have recovered without being recorded, 0 (0.0%) have definitely recovered and 9 (1.7%) have died. | 20:12 |
| python476 | I feel headachy, dyspneic | 20:12 |
| euod[m] | oh yeah. | 20:12 |
| derpadmin | !cases italy | 20:12 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 19:09 UTC: US news: Coronavirus live updates: global cases top quarter of a million, as Italy sees biggest daily rise in deaths — from WHO at 19:09: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 20:12 |
| pagetelegram | !cases illinois | 20:12 |
| euod[m] | everyone is feeling the nocebo effect right now. | 20:12 |
| euod[m] | I have a mild cold, I know it's nothing, but all the same it's concerning. | 20:13 |
| pagetelegram | !cases Illinois | 20:13 |
| LjL | pagetelegram, if that bot doesn't seem to be working there is mine too | 20:14 |
| LjL | %cases illinois | 20:14 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In Illinois, US, there are 423 cases, 4 deaths (0.9% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 20:15 |
| [itchyjunk] | %cases alaska | 20:15 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk]: In Alaska, US, there are 12 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 20:15 |
| pagetelegram | thank you | 20:15 |
| oriba | tinwhiskers: would be nice to give more than one country as selection in the URL. | 20:16 |
| tinwhiskers | oriba: you can, just use, err semicolons | 20:16 |
| oriba | tinwhiskers: ah ok :-) | 20:16 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 19:16 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Il governo ha emesso una nuova ordinanza che restringerà ulteriormente gli spostamenti a partire da domani. — from WHO at 19:16: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/XjiWye | 20:19 |
| oriba | tinwhiskers: is there a list of country names? what to do with spaces? %-notation? | 20:19 |
| pwr22 | Cov Bot may take a few seconds to respond to stuff atm because matrix.org is super overloaded | 20:20 |
| tinwhiskers | oriba: countries as listed on the web page, yes, %20 for space | 20:20 |
| JoeLlama | time to go | 20:21 |
| tinwhiskers | oriba: you may have seen the groups such as EU or Sub-sahara. ATM using these names just selects the total series, but I'm going to make it so it will select all the member countries as well via the url (like it does by right-clicking on those) | 20:22 |
| danielp3344 | !cases MD | 20:25 |
| danielp3344 | !cases maryland | 20:26 |
| danielp3344 | %cases maryland | 20:26 |
| Brainstorm | danielp3344: In Maryland, US, there are 149 cases, 1 deaths (0.7% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 20:26 |
| python476 | TIL influenza comes from influenza di febbre scarlattina "old medical report of scarlet fever in Rome" | 20:28 |
| LjL | "scarlattina" is another disease in italian though | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | Roh rohh! | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://nypost.com/2020/03/19/second-dog-in-hong-kong-tests-positive-for-coronavirus/ | 20:29 |
| LjL | %tr <it >en scarlattina | 20:29 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: scarlet fever (Google) — Scarlet fever (Wikipedia) | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | Scooby doo is scared shitless now. | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | %title | 20:29 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk]: From nypost.com: Second dog in Hong Kong tests positive for coronavirus | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | First dog died. | 20:29 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], based on Civil Protection statements, people in Italy are already abandoning pets around :\ | 20:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | "The sick puppy’s diagnosis came just three days after the first known dog to test positive for the coronavirus — a 17-year-old Pomeranian — died in Hong Kong after returning home from quarantine." | 20:30 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], the "weakly" positive dog died? great. known cause of death? | 20:30 |
| oriba | https://nypost.com/2020/03/20/coronavirus-in-california-toilet-paper-alternatives-cause-sewer-problems/ | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | nope | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | the owner doesn't want the dog to be probed | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | and such | 20:30 |
| LjL | meh | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | so we won't know cause of death | 20:30 |
| LjL | can i say who the hell cares about the owner's wishes in this case? | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | HK apparently | 20:30 |
| [itchyjunk] | Imagine humans infecting animals | 20:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | it mutates | 20:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | and jumps right the fuck back into owners | 20:31 |
| LjL | let's not get ahead of ourselves, we really don't know that it does that | 20:31 |
| pagetelegram | People just need to shower after they shit. Toilet paper is over rated and I picture a scenerio of folks with a pile of toilet paper and no food. | 20:33 |
| [itchyjunk] | If you can't predict what might happen, it a lost game. | 20:33 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 19:21 UTC: US news: Coronavirus live updates: global cases top quarter of a million, as Italy sees biggest daily rise in deaths — from WHO at 19:21: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 20:33 |
| Spec | pagetelegram: people are beginning to try to return toilet paper to hilarious results-- as TP manufacturing was not actually negatively hit | 20:34 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], well, hopefully some can try, and succeed. but us, here, predicting things like that with no known factual basis? i don't think so | 20:34 |
| LjL | Spec, sigh | 20:34 |
| Spec | so there is plenty of supply | 20:34 |
| LjL | Spec, unused, hopefully | 20:34 |
| Spec | LjL: ofc | 20:34 |
| Spec | those people get to sit on their bed of toilet paper | 20:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | LjL, i know corona-like binds to bunch of animals. | 20:34 |
| pagetelegram | It is not predicting, It is understanding the trajectory. | 20:35 |
| LjL | but to be fair, some people need to use the bathroom multiple times a day, and they may need to use a bathroom at work. they cannot just shower every time. | 20:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | I know CoV and MERS jumped from animals to humans. | 20:35 |
| pagetelegram | Showering more than once a day is not a bad idea | 20:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | Till there is a sortage of water. | 20:35 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], sure, we know with some certainty that this one jumped from animals to humans, too. that doesn't automatically mean that it mutates to infect dogs OR mutates back to reinfect us from dogs | 20:35 |
| [itchyjunk] | It doesn't grow in tree. | 20:35 |
| airgap | +1 for showering daily | 20:35 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: and swine flu, from pigs. | 20:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | LjL, it does mean that. | 20:36 |
| pagetelegram | There will be shortage of food before shortage of water | 20:36 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spec, right. | 20:36 |
| LjL | showering several times a day would likely make many people's skin too dry and fragile, removing oils that *protect* from infections. | 20:36 |
| pagetelegram | LiL good point | 20:36 |
| Spec | maybe this is a good time to convert the entire world to a plant based diet | 20:36 |
| Spec | are there known instances of plants spreading diseases, other than when cows shit on them? | 20:36 |
| pagetelegram | Maybe try a different soap. I use Dr, Bronner Euclyptis | 20:36 |
| Spec | i suspect it's very unlikely | 20:36 |
| LjL | Spec, things like worms, but bacteria and viruses i think are very unusual to spread from plants to animals | 20:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Coronaviruses are common in several species of domestic and wild animals, including cattle, horses, dogs, cats, ferrets, camels, bats, and others." | 20:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.oregonvma.org/care-health/zoonotic-diseases/coronavirus-faq | 20:37 |
| Spec | pagetelegram: i use dr bronner's orangey one | 20:37 |
| Spec | LjL: oh yeah, worms, forgot about them. but they don't...spread. :P | 20:37 |
| LjL | [itchyjunk], i'm not sure what you're trying to show with these statement. how does it tell us that it *mutates* to infect dogs, and *mutates back* to infect us again? | 20:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | LjL, it binds to ACE2 receptors. | 20:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | Which is present in those animals. | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | Not sure what part you're having trouble with. | 20:38 |
| LjL | the mutation. | 20:38 |
| LjL | i thought that was clear. | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | They have tested it in labs with petrie dish. | 20:38 |
| LjL | why would it mutate to infect dogs, and mutate back to infect us? | 20:38 |
| LjL | what does binding to ACE2 have to do with that? | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's always mutating. | 20:38 |
| LjL | that means everything yet nothing | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | there is selective pressure in each species. | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | Different in dogs than humans. | 20:38 |
| LjL | you made a very specific statement | 20:38 |
| [itchyjunk] | which means our immune response for the ones we currently have wont work. | 20:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | once the ones in dogs jumps back. | 20:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | this is called re-infection. | 20:39 |
| LjL | you don't KNOW that it will mutate in the dog in ways that make our immune system unable to recognize it | 20:39 |
| LjL | that is pure speculation | 20:39 |
| LjL | it may happen, it may not | 20:39 |
| LjL | you have provided no evidence that it does | 20:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | it doesn't matter what ways it mutates in. | 20:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | if it mutates in a different selective environment, you need different immune response. | 20:40 |
| pwr22 | What about remaining in the shower all day? | 20:40 |
| pwr22 | Can't get sick if I'm constantly showering right? | 20:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 19:36 UTC: /u/BlatantConservative: Paris hospitals brace for coronavirus peak in April: doctors - Reuters — from WHO at 19:36: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/vBMIea | 20:40 |
| python476 | or in a soap bath | 20:40 |
| Spec | pwr22: sounds reasonable | 20:41 |
| pagetelegram | Point is using toilet paper *only* is very unclean. I rather shower and not bother unless clumpy dingles | 20:41 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25720469 | 20:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | "These characteristics make coronaviruses an interesting model system to study the mechanisms involved in viral evolution and the ways viruses adapt to switch host or to gain novel functions. " | 20:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | the "switch host" part. | 20:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | we've known this since SARS-CoV. | 20:42 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: i don't think that means it can happen, or is probable to happen, in the timeframe of the interaction of a sick patient and their household pet | 20:44 |
| Spec | and we'd need to see some compelling proof if that's the case | 20:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spec, we have taken sampels of the virus and a petri dish full of cells and tested if they can bind to the ace2 | 20:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | and it can. | 20:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | it not uncommon. what common is the mutation that allows inter species sustained tranmissions | 20:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | we've even seen bats to human jumps that wasn't sustained | 20:45 |
| [itchyjunk] | between 2010-2016 | 20:46 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: yes but probability wise, i suspect that risk is not there | 20:46 |
| Spec | for the local interaction of a sick patient and their dog | 20:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | So while i understand my human to dog to human was a very hypothetical scenario, it doesn't stem from complete ignorance of the topic. | 20:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spec, its a non 0 probability. | 20:46 |
| Spec | just because it can happen doesn't mean it will happen at such short cycles | 20:46 |
| [itchyjunk] | I never said it will happen. | 20:47 |
| Spec | k, non 0 can still be 0.000001% | 20:47 |
| Spec | and therefore is not important for a risk based assessment of actions | 20:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | It doesn't matter. A non-zero probability is a non-zero probability. | 20:47 |
| bin_bash | non-0 != statistically significant | 20:47 |
| Spec | ^ | 20:47 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: you just make everyone roll their eyes with those statements | 20:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 19:44 UTC: /u/slakmehl: WHO officials say at least 20 coronavirus vaccines are in development in global race for cure — from WHO at 19:44: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/9IvXhA | 20:47 |
| bin_bash | there's a non-0 probability that we're in a simulation and are in a continual time loop | 20:47 |
| Spec | it is not helpful | 20:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | It's not statistically insignificant either. | 20:47 |
| bin_bash | yes it is | 20:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spec, i don't care about who rolls what eyes. | 20:48 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: where is evidence it is statistically significant | 20:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | that's not what a statistical significance means. | 20:48 |
| bin_bash | you don't know what you're talking about | 20:48 |
| Spec | ^ | 20:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | But you can ask in ##statistics so clear it out. | 20:48 |
| Spec | hello Birosso | 20:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.latimes.com/homeless-housing/story/2020-03-18/homeless-occupy-more-vacant-homes-coronavirus-pandemic-los-angeles | 20:49 |
| Joe | so what | 20:50 |
| Joe | they belong to the bank that have been loaning us our own tax money for decades. | 20:50 |
| Spec | well, that's a small dent in the homeless population problem | 20:51 |
| Spec | we surely need to address that systemically in those cities most impacted by it...or suffer the consequences | 20:51 |
| bin_bash | homelessness is a big problem there because everyone wants to live there | 20:51 |
| Joe | yes , but why is homelessness now being addressed? | 20:52 |
| bin_bash | it's not | 20:52 |
| bin_bash | normally i'd be against this kind of thing, but theyre owned by the state so no individual is losing out | 20:53 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 US: +275 cases (now 16913), +5 deaths (now 230) 🔸 Canada: +19 cases (now 943) 🔸 Norway: +1 cases (now 1923) 🔸 Switzerland: +38 cases (now 5407) 🔸 Alabama, US: +3 cases (now 81) 🔸 Arizona, US: +20 cases (now 78) 🔸 California, US: +7 cases (now 1055) 🔸 Delaware, US: +8 cases (now 38) 🔸 Diamond Princess, US: +2 cases (now 49) [... want %more?] | 20:53 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK92442/ | 20:54 |
| [itchyjunk] | "However, veterinary coronavirologists had previously recognized the potential for coronaviruses to cause fatal enteric or respiratory infections in animals and for new CoV strains to emerge from unknown reservoirs, often evoking fatal disease in naïve populations." | 20:54 |
| Spec | yes, that's what happened | 20:57 |
| Spec | that doesn't mean it can, or is likely to, happen in the short cycle of illness w/ your local family pet | 20:57 |
| pagetelegram | free xinfinity nationwide USA fyi | 20:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | "Curiously, differences in the sizes of the 5′ end S gene deletion region (621–681 nucleotides) between European and U.S. PRCV strains provided evidence for their independent origin on two continents within a similar time frame (1980s)." | 20:59 |
| Joe | trust me it's free | 20:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | Sounds like the frequency is non trivial. | 20:59 |
| pagetelegram | source for free wifi that I got: https://onenorthside.ourpowerbase.net/civicrm/mailing/view?reset=1&id=2719 | 20:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | pagetelegram, hotspot? | 20:59 |
| [itchyjunk] | or who internet service? | 20:59 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: yeah charter/spectrum is doing that too | 21:00 |
| Joe | if they don't bill you for the service there is no reasonable expectation of privacy | 21:00 |
| bin_bash | there's no reasonable expectation of privacy on public wifi of any kind | 21:00 |
| bin_bash | even if you pay for it | 21:00 |
| Spec | Joe: although there should be :) | 21:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | ah it is hotspots. | 21:00 |
| [itchyjunk] | I use some of this already so not much for me :'< | 21:01 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 19:56 UTC: 'Sensationalism': Trump lashes out at journalist during coronavirus briefing – video: Donald Trump has hit out at NBC's Peter Alexander after the reporter asked the president if he was being too positive and what he would say to frightened Americans. Trump defended his approach and called said the journalist asked a [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/f16ZJ1 | 21:01 |
| bin_bash | i hope my ramen gets delivered tomorroe | 21:02 |
| bin_bash | never had a 1 week leas time when ordering food | 21:02 |
| Spec | %more | 21:03 |
| Brainstorm | Spec, [...] 'nasty question', calling him a 'terrible reporter'. He also attacked NBC and Comcast → https://paste.ee/p/XEDaX | 21:03 |
| Spec | what a nasty president | 21:04 |
| bin_bash | we should revoke trump's personhood | 21:04 |
| Spec | I'm beginning to suspect congress should rule he's unfit to serve and let Pence take over | 21:04 |
| LjL | Spec, would you really rather Pence? | 21:05 |
| Spec | LjL: only beginning to suspect. | 21:05 |
| Spec | I think he might be rational enough to listen to experts, and present a cohesive front | 21:05 |
| LjL | also, let's not make remarks about people please... even SOME people... their politics, remark to your heart's desire, if they are relevant to this virus | 21:05 |
| Spec | Maybe he'll say things like, "Stay home and pray", but that might be ok. | 21:05 |
| LjL | Spec, damn that's probably what we're missing, the prayer part | 21:06 |
| Spec | LjL: did you try having mass in public? | 21:06 |
| LjL | Spec, mass is suspended countrywide now | 21:06 |
| Joe | the entire "china flu" argument was crazy with the Chinese American reporter. wtf was he thinking? | 21:07 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1307 cases (now 270642), +21 deaths (now 11285) 🔶 US: +1208 cases (now 18121), +3 deaths (now 233) 🔸 Brazil: +96 cases (now 750), +4 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Canada: +19 cases (now 943) 🔸 Germany: +8 deaths (now 67) 🔸 Norway: +1 cases (now 1923) 🔸 Spain: +6 deaths (now 1050) 🔸 Switzerland: +38 cases (now 5407) | 21:07 |
| LjL | Spec, your curve is growing faaast | 21:08 |
| Spec | Joe: chyna | 21:08 |
| Joe | holy shit we managed to test 1200 people today, amazing | 21:09 |
| LjL | Joe, probably tested a lot more, it's rare to have more than 1/10 or at worst 1/5 positives | 21:09 |
| [itchyjunk] | Correspondence/pdf but interesting read : | 21:09 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.veterinariaitaliana.izs.it/index.php/VetIt/article/download/2173/665 | 21:09 |
| LjL | but today's jump is... huge | 21:09 |
| Joe | ya if only the tests worked | 21:09 |
| LjL | today's jump isn't very consistent with the previous curve, so maybe it should be taken with a grain of salt | 21:10 |
| LjL | it might be incorrect | 21:10 |
| LjL | the deaths also jumped up | 21:10 |
| LjL | well, today's and yesterday's :\ | 21:10 |
| LjL | maybe it's just that bad | 21:11 |
| [itchyjunk] | I didn't know there was an "HCoV-229E" that jumped from alpacas to humans. Time to stop kissing alpacas. | 21:11 |
| Joe | camelid rabies too | 21:12 |
| Joe | it's never been ok to sexually assault them | 21:12 |
| Spec | [itchyjunk]: ah yeah, don't kiss alpacas. everyone knows that. | 21:13 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 20:11 UTC: (news): Hospitals are still scheduling elective procedures during coronavirus crisis, and frontline medical workers fear they're infecting patients — from WHO at 20:11: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/8up9Vh | 21:16 |
| danielp3344 | %data maryland | 21:19 |
| Brainstorm | danielp3344: In Maryland, US, there are 149 cases, 1 deaths (0.7% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 21:19 |
| Albright | So if calling it "the Chinese coronavirus" and similar terms is racist, is it not racist to start calling Chinese people Coronans? | 21:21 |
| pagetelegram | DoD will be recruiting through social media | 21:22 |
| bin_bash | Albright: wat | 21:23 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +356 cases (now 270998) 🔸 Brazil: +152 cases (now 806), +4 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Canada: +19 cases (now 943) 🔸 Germany: +8 deaths (now 67) 🔸 Norway: +4 cases (now 1926) 🔸 Pakistan: +1 cases (now 501) 🔸 Poland: +14 cases (now 425) 🔸 Spain: +6 deaths (now 1050) 🔸 Switzerland: +38 cases (now 5407) | 21:23 |
| Albright | I'm not trollbaiting. I am the troll. | 21:25 |
| Albright | Jokes aside, even now, I'd love to visit Shanghai again. What a place, what a range between highs and lows. What a city. | 21:26 |
| pagetelegram | bin_bash yes, DoD announcing press conference 30min ago, CSPAN Radio live | 21:28 |
| Albright | Add oil, people of China! Eat shit, CCP! | 21:29 |
| Albright | Actually, I probably shouldn't say that if I ever want to go to China again… argh. | 21:30 |
| ubLIX | you probably shouldn't say that if you ever want to be taken seriously here again... argh | 21:33 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: why are you telling me | 21:34 |
| pagetelegram | Everyone should listen to this especially in the US ... no CNN and no Fox! CSPAN: https://playerservices.streamtheworld.com/api/livestream-redirect/CSPANRADIO.mp3 | 21:35 |
| pagetelegram | bin_bash I thought you asked | 21:35 |
| bin_bash | why'd you highlight me thoug | 21:35 |
| bin_bash | no | 21:35 |
| bin_bash | no prob | 21:35 |
| pagetelegram | sorry | 21:35 |
| pagetelegram | You said "wat" after I posted the DoD bit | 21:35 |
| bin_bash | i was talking about Albright's crap | 21:36 |
| pagetelegram | lol ok nvm | 21:36 |
| guilhermeesq[m] | That’s the airport at Quebec now | 21:36 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: no worries. i do appreciate the link. is there a video link or just audio | 21:37 |
| Jigsy | %deaths Spain | 21:37 |
| Jigsy | %death Spain | 21:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | are they 6 feet apart? | 21:37 |
| Jigsy | ... | 21:37 |
| Jigsy | What was the trigger again? | 21:37 |
| [itchyjunk] | %cases quebec | 21:37 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk]: In Quebec, Canada, there are 121 cases, 1 deaths (0.8% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 19, 17:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Quebec for time series data. | 21:37 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 20:30 UTC: US coronavirus news: Mexican border closed to non-essential travel as New York ordered to stay at home – live: States ask Trump to deploy military Cuomo orders New Yorkers to stay home Washington lobbyists in battle to secure bailouts Andrew Yang giving $1m in response to coronavirus All Californians ordered to [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/c8h9a0 | 21:37 |
| pagetelegram | There are three I think maybe four CSPAN stations in the US. | 21:37 |
| guilhermeesq[m] | No they are not 6 feet apart | 21:38 |
| Jigsy | %cases Spain | 21:38 |
| Brainstorm | Jigsy: In all areas, Spain, there are 20412 cases, 1050 deaths (5.1% of cases), 1588 recoveries as of March 20, 20:32Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 21:38 |
| Spec | guilhermeesq[m]: holy shit. | 21:39 |
| Spec | LjL: ^ that link no work | 21:39 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: i believe the link youve sent is based out of NY because theyre talking about the NY shutdown | 21:40 |
| Strantrickt[m] | %data Turkey | 21:44 |
| Brainstorm | Strantrickt[m]: In all areas, Turkey, there are 359 cases, 4 deaths (1.1% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 01:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Turkey for time series data. | 21:44 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 20:35 UTC: (news): Delta warns second-quarter revenue to fall $10 billion because of coronavirus — from WHO at 20:35: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/BFi060 | 21:44 |
| bin_bash | pagetelegram: where did you see that this stream was the DoD? | 21:46 |
| bin_bash | sounds like cuomo press conference | 21:46 |
| bin_bash | yeah this is not the DoD pagetelegram, but it is good info | 21:48 |
| pagetelegram | Stream is CSPAN, the DoD spoke hour ago over CSPAN networks on that. | 21:48 |
| bin_bash | ok the curent stream is not the DoD though | 21:48 |
| pagetelegram | You will hear it on CSPAN before anywhere else | 21:48 |
| bin_bash | the current stream is the NYS update | 21:49 |
| pagetelegram | I know. sorry if I confuse: DoD will recruit over social media nationwide. | 21:49 |
| bin_bash | gotcha | 21:49 |
| bin_bash | sorry i misunderstoo | 21:49 |
| bin_bash | d* | 21:49 |
| pagetelegram | Correct ^ NYC right now yes. It is national coverage usually just congress when in session,. | 21:50 |
| pagetelegram | * and of course or maybe not of course: no commercials | 21:50 |
| bin_bash | right | 21:51 |
| bin_bash | cspan can be great | 21:51 |
| pagetelegram | no slants no out of context no fallacies other than what the authorities put out....MSN, CNN vs Fox is causing division in this country and is ALL yellow jounralism | 21:52 |
| bin_bash | yeah | 21:52 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +377 cases (now 271375), +9 deaths (now 11293), +7 recoveries (now 90293) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 89) 🔸 Brazil: +165 cases (now 819), +4 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Canada: +19 cases (now 943) 🔸 Central African Republic: +2 cases (now 3) 🔸 Egypt: +29 cases (now 285), +1 deaths (now 8) 🔸 Germany: +8 deaths (now 67) [... want %more?] | 21:53 |
| python476 | what happened to french stats ? | 21:55 |
| python476 | it's gone from 10k to 1k | 21:55 |
| merethan_w | Here in NL recoveries are not recorded into stats. | 21:57 |
| [itchyjunk] | Why not? | 21:57 |
| gmacCash | https://youtu.be/ugtN6HCqatc | 21:58 |
| fructose | pagetelegram: Bullshit | 22:02 |
| pagetelegram | ok glucose! I substantiate myself. I have to go to a meeting. You all battle this fructose astroturfer | 22:03 |
| fructose | pagetelegram: Bye | 22:04 |
| LjL | Spec, all the CDC links from the RSS bot don't work, because an & gets turned into & ... it's due to the Matrix→IRC bridge. i could move them to Brainstorm but you can see Brainstorm is already failing to post too many RSS things | 22:06 |
| LjL | at least i think the links work *in Matrix* | 22:06 |
| bin_bash | man trump is so full of shit | 22:07 |
| Spec | LjL: oh, i see | 22:07 |
| Spec | hehe, it got rejected anyways | 22:08 |
| Spec | The requested URL was rejected. Please consult with your administrator. | 22:08 |
| LjL | yeah let me see that URL from Matrix | 22:08 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +620 cases (now 271995), +3 deaths (now 11296) 🔶 US: +616 cases (now 18737), +3 deaths (now 236) 🔸 Bosnia and Herzegovina: +5 cases (now 89) 🔸 Brazil: +156 cases (now 810), +4 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Canada: +19 cases (now 943) 🔸 Central African Republic: +2 cases (now 3) 🔸 Egypt: +29 cases (now 285), +1 deaths (now 8) 🔸 Germany: +8 deaths (now 67) [... want %more?] | 22:08 |
| LjL | %cases us | 22:09 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, US, there are 18737 cases, 236 deaths (1.3% of cases), 125 recoveries as of March 20, 21:02Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 22:09 |
| fructose | LjL: Where is 18737 coming from? Johns Hopkins is showing 16638 | 22:10 |
| [itchyjunk] | https://www.nytimes.com/2020/03/20/world/coronavirus-news.html | 22:11 |
| [itchyjunk] | Might be better for all States to just follow the same directive. | 22:11 |
| pagetelegram | guilhermessq: important to know that this is all prep for martial law, in order the maintain help with order. There are a lot of conspiracy nuts with guns that have to be put aside. This is a real concern, not only toilet paper off the shelves but guns too | 22:11 |
| [itchyjunk] | And not wait for federal government. | 22:11 |
| LjL | fructose, i don't know. i get the data from https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US as shown when you enable "non-authoritative". i think a major secondary source it uses is worldometers | 22:12 |
| LjL | tinwhiskers may want to interject | 22:13 |
| LjL | there definitely seems to be a *major* spike for the US, anyhow, particularly driven by the state of NY | 22:13 |
| tinwhiskers | yes, most likely from worldometers | 22:13 |
| [itchyjunk] | Where does worldometers get it from? | 22:15 |
| LjL | i'm not sure they disclose that | 22:16 |
| oriba | jhu takes data from worldometer and worldometer takes data from jhu... :P | 22:16 |
| fructose | It seems close to double the NY spike in the Johns Hopkins data | 22:17 |
| python476 | oriba: a recipe for exponential explosion | 22:17 |
| [itchyjunk] | so if we stop worlometers, we stop the exponential growth?!? | 22:18 |
| python476 | that's it, we solved it | 22:18 |
| oriba | python476: ah, ok, they multiply the value with each fetch.... true values are in the range up to 10. | 22:19 |
| [itchyjunk] | worldometer cites soem of their sourcea ta the bottom of the page | 22:20 |
| [itchyjunk] | they are using local state news agencies and such | 22:20 |
| tinwhiskers | Actually worldometers do disclose their sources | 22:20 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/WorldNews Live* at 21:16 UTC: /u/slakmehl: The growth curve is bending in a bad way for the United States. We know delayed testing capacity contributes to this. We do not know to what extent. — from WHO at 21:16: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/GEcOJI | 22:20 |
| docwon | geneva is closing even more border crossings tomorrow morning | 22:21 |
| docwon | the one by the airport is going to stay open | 22:21 |
| [itchyjunk] | well, i dont think i can be any more stuck in my house | 22:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 Brazil: +250 cases (now 904), +4 deaths (now 11) 🔸 Australian Capital Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 6) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +46 cases (now 353), +1 deaths (now 6) 🔸 Northern Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 3) 🔸 Queensland, Australia: +40 cases (now 184) 🔸 South Australia, Australia: +8 cases (now 50) [... want %more?] | 22:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | Whats the hottest place you know? | 22:24 |
| docwon | everywhere a long time ago | 22:25 |
| [itchyjunk] | Whats the hottest place you know at present time? | 22:25 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 21:20 UTC: Delta warns second-quarter revenue to fall $10 billion because of coronavirus: Delta's CEO issued another grim warning about the collapse in demand and the urgent need for government aid as coronavirus destroys travel demand. — from WHO at 21:20: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/BFi060 | 22:27 |
| romare | my bedroom ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) | 22:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | %cases hell | 22:28 |
| Brainstorm | [itchyjunk]: In all areas, Seychelles, there are 7 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 15:43Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Seychelles for time series data. | 22:28 |
| ubLIX | happy to know Brainstorm isn't connected to the underworld | 22:28 |
| [itchyjunk] | I don't think the "will die off in summer" hypothesis is holding much weight. | 22:29 |
| [itchyjunk] | Since its spreading it cold and warm places | 22:29 |
| mefistofeles | nah, this will probably stick with us a year | 22:30 |
| mefistofeles | I mean, a year or 3 months, but probably same amount of dead people :P | 22:30 |
| tinwhiskers | [itchyjunk]: no, was always suspect and looking very unlikely to be true now | 22:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | mefistofeles, idk about that. the actress venissa hudgens said she might die of boredom | 22:31 |
| mefistofeles | haha | 22:32 |
| Spec | LjL: see? ^^ it was delta | 22:33 |
| Spec | :) | 22:33 |
| LjL | Spec, were you giving me classified information using code | 22:33 |
| oriba | https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-51977802 | 22:35 |
| LjL | %title | 22:38 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: From www.bbc.com: Social distancing may be needed for ‘most of year’ - BBC News | 22:38 |
| LjL | no shit | 22:38 |
| python476 | vanessa hudgens was already spreading boredom for years | 22:38 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +1271 cases (now 273395), +39 deaths (now 11338) 🔶 Spain: +1098 cases (now 21510), +40 deaths (now 1092) 🔸 Australian Capital Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 6) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +46 cases (now 353), +1 deaths (now 6) 🔸 Northern Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 3) 🔸 Queensland, Australia: +40 cases (now 184) [... want %more?] | 22:39 |
| LjL | holy spain | 22:39 |
| LjL | %cases spain | 22:39 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In all areas, Spain, there are 21510 cases, 1092 deaths (5.1% of cases), 1588 recoveries as of March 20, 21:30Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 22:39 |
| Spec | :( | 22:39 |
| LjL | i was always comfortable with the percept that spain was very similar to Italy in many ways | 22:39 |
| LjL | but i wouldn't have wished them to be in this way :( | 22:40 |
| LjL | their mortality's skyrocketing too | 22:40 |
| LjL | actually their case DELTA is going "down" compared to yesterday, but i suspect there will be a further update | 22:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 21:26 UTC: US news: Coronavirus live updates: global cases top quarter of a million, as Italy sees biggest daily rise in deaths — from WHO at 21:26: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/XMXLZp | 22:42 |
| LjL | we must do what these Chinese doctors say | 22:43 |
| LjL | everyone inside, no exceptions except for health workers | 22:44 |
| LjL | it's horrid but 5% or so of us dying is also pretty horrid | 22:44 |
| python476 | brb | 22:47 |
| ryouma | analysis with charts of uk and us policy based on the uk academic report: https://mecfsresearchreview.me/2020/03/20/not-me-cfs-the-coronavirus-report-behind-the-big-shifts-in-policy-by-uk-and-us-governments/ | 22:48 |
| ryouma | hi python476: you just missed https://mecfsresearchreview.me/2020/03/20/not-me-cfs-the-coronavirus-report-behind-the-big-shifts-in-policy-by-uk-and-us-governments/ | 22:49 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 21:41 UTC: (news): Hospitals set up coronavirus tents, seek emergency credit and $100 billion in US aid as they face onslaught of cases — from WHO at 21:41: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/7iWEFf | 22:49 |
| python476 | thanks ryouma | 22:52 |
| python476 | hi back too | 22:52 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 21:48 UTC: US state governors impose tighter restrictions to slow coronavirus spread: New York among states to order residents to stay home Trump says no plans to mandate a national lockdown Coronavirus – latest updates See all our coronavirus coverage A growing number of US state governors are imposing tight restrictions on [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/308xVX | 22:57 |
| LjL | %tr Il Ministro della Salute, Roberto Speranza, ha firmato l'ordinanza che vieta: l'accesso del pubblico ai parchi, alle ville, alle aree gioco e ai giardini pubblici; di svolgere attività ludica o ricreativa all'aperto. Resta consentito svolgere individualmente attività motoria in prossimità della propria abitazione, purché comunque nel rispetto della distanza di almeno un metro da ogni altra persona. | 22:58 |
| Brainstorm | LjL, Italian to English: The Minister of Health, Roberto Speranza, signed the order prohibiting: public access to parks, villas, play areas and public gardens; to carry out recreational or outdoor activities. It is allowed to carry out individual motor activities close to your home, provided that in any case respecting the distance of at least one meter from each other person. [... want %more?] | 22:58 |
| mefistofeles | woah | 22:58 |
| mefistofeles | %cases Germany | 22:58 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Germany, there are 19848 cases, 68 deaths (0.3% of cases), 180 recoveries as of March 20, 21:39Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Germany for time series data. | 22:58 |
| Timvde | %cases Italy | 22:59 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Italy, there are 47021 cases, 4032 deaths (8.6% of cases), 5129 recoveries as of March 20, 21:39Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 22:59 |
| LjL | %cases Lombardia | 23:01 |
| Brainstorm | LjL: In Lombardia, Italy, there are 22264 cases, 2549 deaths (11.4% of cases), 4295 recoveries as of March 20, 16:00Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Lombardia for time series data. | 23:01 |
| Timvde | I didn't follow up for a few days and like everything exploded | 23:01 |
| Timvde | (But well yea exponentials) | 23:01 |
| LjL | mhm | 23:01 |
| LjL | our exponential has an uncanny death rate though | 23:01 |
| Timvde | oof, 11.4% :/ | 23:01 |
| Timvde | Let's assume it's because of lack of testing? | 23:02 |
| ryouma | %cases tx | 23:02 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma: In Texas, US, there are 260 cases, 5 deaths (1.9% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 23:02 |
| ryouma | %cases az | 23:02 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma: In Arizona, US, there are 78 cases, 0 deaths (0.0% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 23:02 |
| ryouma | %cases ct | 23:02 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma: In Connecticut, US, there are 194 cases, 3 deaths (1.5% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 23:02 |
| LjL | Timvde, we've assumed that for long enough. there is evidence it's not, imo. we must do what the Chinese delegation that came here said, and shut down *everything now* | 23:02 |
| ryouma | %cases ny | 23:03 |
| LjL | you know i'm the last person to push against privacy and personal freedoms | 23:03 |
| Brainstorm | ryouma: In New York, US, there are 5365 cases, 34 deaths (0.6% of cases), 0 recoveries as of March 20, 00:50Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=US for time series data. | 23:03 |
| LjL | in normal times | 23:03 |
| Timvde | LjL: Wait, isn't Italy fully shut down already? | 23:03 |
| LjL | Timvde, no, it's just ridiculous | 23:03 |
| Timvde | What's the line, though? | 23:03 |
| LjL | Timvde, today Milan's Prefecture allowed the use of the army to enforce the lockdown... was about time. people just go about for all sorts of reasons | 23:04 |
| LjL | Timvde, the line is we must stay home, period. supermarkets need to set themselves up for deliveries only. | 23:04 |
| LjL | it's too late to play the "moderate" game | 23:04 |
| Timvde | Hmkay | 23:04 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 22:00 UTC: (news): New York City is the new coronavirus epicenter with one third of all US cases, Mayor de Blasio says — from WHO at 22:00: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/sErgxp | 23:04 |
| Timvde | So I also can't go for a walk right now? :( | 23:04 |
| Timvde | It's 11 PM, barely anyone's on the street | 23:04 |
| LjL | Timvde, well i haven't followed the laws of your countries about it ;( | 23:04 |
| LjL | Timvde, i'm not stopping you | 23:05 |
| Timvde | Oh, I'm totally allowed to legally | 23:05 |
| Timvde | I just mean, is there really any risk in that? | 23:05 |
| LjL | Timvde, but rest assured that it'll be easier for me to have a walk if i'm alive than dead | 23:05 |
| LjL | Timvde, there? probably not, although i think airborne transmission is more than plausible | 23:05 |
| Timvde | It's calm enough to be able to stay probably at least 5 meters away from anyone | 23:05 |
| LjL | Timvde, just don't go where anyone has sneezed in the past hour or so! | 23:05 |
| Timvde | Is there any new evidence that it is? | 23:06 |
| LjL | Timvde, tentative | 23:06 |
| LjL | Timvde, but i think it's more reasonable to assume it is, than just keep denying it | 23:06 |
| LjL | Timvde, we've believed the WHO's assumptions for too long | 23:06 |
| LjL | they proved false time and again | 23:06 |
| LjL | like "masks aren't useful" | 23:06 |
| LjL | the hell they aren't | 23:06 |
| Timvde | That's probably just to keep the masks for the people who *really* need them | 23:07 |
| Timvde | I honestly rather get sick than to be responsible for a doctor to get sick | 23:07 |
| LjL | Timvde, yes, it probably was, but i don't condone lying to obtain results. it doesn't pay off. | 23:07 |
| LjL | people hoarded the masks *anyway* | 23:07 |
| LjL | you won't stop those people by lying about them | 23:07 |
| Timvde | Here, masks aren't being sold to consumers anymore | 23:08 |
| LjL | Timvde, we haven't had legal access to masks for months, even back in december | 23:08 |
| LjL | a few people are still wearing them but i don't really know where they get them | 23:08 |
| LjL | i'm sure most of them are reused multiple times | 23:08 |
| gmacCash | https://youtu.be/ugtN6HCqatc | 23:08 |
| LjL | Timvde, maybe give this a listen https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rhP2MC7pDY&feature=youtu.be&t=85 | 23:08 |
| LjL | it's a bit painful because of the three-language translation | 23:08 |
| LjL | but it has english, so | 23:08 |
| LjL | Timvde, this is the press conference that the governor of Lombardy held with the head of the Chinese doctor delegation | 23:09 |
| Timvde | My biggest risk atm is my roommate anyway | 23:09 |
| Timvde | Just got home from somewhere abroad (I think Ireland?) | 23:10 |
| LjL | gmacCash, terrible? | 23:10 |
| skullomania | you guys should watch this movie Contagion if you haven't | 23:10 |
| skullomania | clearly the virus is going to mutate into something much deadlier | 23:10 |
| LjL | i'm pretty sure it has been mentioned more times than any other movie lately | 23:10 |
| skullomania | yeah it's on the top 10 right now | 23:10 |
| LjL | Timvde, well if they have it, you get it. but chances aren't that high | 23:10 |
| skullomania | in* | 23:10 |
| LjL | also no i wouldn't say that's "clear" (not sure what the movie thinks about it) | 23:11 |
| Timvde | %cases Ireland | 23:11 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Ireland, there are 683 cases, 3 deaths (0.4% of cases), 5 recoveries as of March 20, 20:13Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Ireland for time series data. | 23:11 |
| AimHere | Ireland is probably less likely to have it than Italy | 23:11 |
| LjL | and i'd say it's already plenty deadly enough in Italy | 23:11 |
| Timvde | Oh, that's not too much | 23:11 |
| lids | %cases Greece | 23:11 |
| Brainstorm | lids: In all areas, Greece, there are 495 cases, 6 deaths (1.2% of cases), 19 recoveries as of March 20, 16:13Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Greece for time series data. | 23:11 |
| skullomania | %cases italy | 23:11 |
| AimHere | population of Ireland is only ~5 million or so | 23:11 |
| Brainstorm | skullomania: In all areas, Italy, there are 47021 cases, 4032 deaths (8.6% of cases), 5129 recoveries as of March 20, 22:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Italy for time series data. | 23:11 |
| skullomania | that's not the 2% they told us | 23:11 |
| LjL | yeah, it's not | 23:12 |
| LjL | it's not even the 3.4% that China supposedly has | 23:12 |
| AimHere | I'm guessing Italy has given up testing the general public | 23:12 |
| mefistofeles | hospitals collapsing for sure | 23:12 |
| AimHere | Unless it's for clinical reasons | 23:12 |
| LjL | also i dunno who told you it's 2%, i usually hear 1% as the projected real estimate | 23:12 |
| LjL | whatever "projected real" means | 23:12 |
| skullomania | they said 98% would be okay | 23:12 |
| LjL | skullomania, that was always nonsense, who said that? | 23:12 |
| skullomania | and around 70% of the population will get it | 23:12 |
| skullomania | worst case scenario | 23:12 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: what's the official explanation on the death rate? | 23:12 |
| skullomania | from 40 to 70% | 23:12 |
| LjL | skullomania, there is a big myth that it's full of people who are asymptomatic. i don't think this has proven to be true, so far | 23:13 |
| LjL | it's still vaguely possible, i'll admit that much | 23:13 |
| mefistofeles | from that cruise, 40% were asymptomatic, 40% not sever and 20% severe, afaik | 23:13 |
| skullomania | we don't know the effects long term | 23:13 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, mostly twofold: we have a much older population than China (second-oldest in the world, actually), with many comorbidities in the elderly; and we are only testing symptomatic people who go to hospital (and probably not even all of them) | 23:13 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, i don't think that fully explains it | 23:13 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: yes, that wouldn'tmake it go up, hospitals are clearly collapsing | 23:14 |
| skullomania | LjL another theory is that this has been circulating for months now undetected | 23:14 |
| skullomania | and didn't actually originate in november | 23:14 |
| AimHere | skullomania, that kindof doesn't make sense. | 23:14 |
| ubLIX | skullomania: I don't see how that could be true | 23:15 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, they do not admit that in the Civil Protection press conferences. they say they're doing all they can to get new masks and ventilators, but at the same time, when specifically asked, they say there is not a critical situation in Lombardy's hospitals, and that if the hospitals ask for ICU beds in other regions, the Civil Protection is able to provide for that. but... they've moved a total of 60 patients. they moved ONE today. | 23:15 |
| mefistofeles | ↑ | 23:15 |
| AimHere | You'd have to suggest that it changed strains inside infected people simultaneously | 23:15 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, but then, what various interviewed doctors say is on a wholly different tone | 23:15 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: that doesn't adds up, tbh | 23:15 |
| LjL | i know | 23:15 |
| skullomania | in spain and italy they have admitted that they had cases very early on that were mistaken for common pneumonia | 23:15 |
| mefistofeles | %cases spain | 23:16 |
| Brainstorm | mefistofeles: In all areas, Spain, there are 21510 cases, 1092 deaths (5.1% of cases), 1588 recoveries as of March 20, 22:01Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 23:16 |
| skullomania | and that helped spread the virus further to the most vulnerable people | 23:16 |
| mefistofeles | skullomania: they can easily correct for those, that's not a big issue, tbh | 23:16 |
| LjL | skullomania, we haven't "admitted" it, we have made that hypothesis. we can't confirm that hypothesis until we test those people post-mortem, and we can't do that now | 23:16 |
| AimHere | skullomania, there might be a few cases like that, but 'circulating for months undetected' is clearly false | 23:16 |
| AimHere | If it was the case that people were misdiagnosing, then the pattern would be a bunch of countries or regions suddenly testing for it and there'd be a big pile of 'omg we've got lots of coronavirus' simultaneously or near-simultaneously | 23:17 |
| AimHere | Instead, we're seeing a bog standard epidemiological curve | 23:17 |
| skullomania | really guys, anything is possible at this point..what matters now is finding a vaccine and unfortunately there is no magic cure for the flu | 23:17 |
| LjL | it's not a flu | 23:18 |
| LjL | let's not call it a flu, it's a short name, but very misleading | 23:18 |
| LjL | because some people are still perpetuating the idea it's "just a flu" | 23:18 |
| skullomania | I keep reading how they made a breakthrough that turns out to be sensationalist news | 23:18 |
| skullomania | it's not just the flu but it has the same characteristics | 23:19 |
| LjL | no, it doesn't, not in most ways | 23:19 |
| LjL | please refer to the link in the topic | 23:19 |
| skullomania | how does it get trasmitted? | 23:19 |
| skullomania | what are the symptoms on the human body? | 23:19 |
| skullomania | it's the flu x 100 | 23:19 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, please can you check https://lab24.ilsole24ore.com/coronavirus/ for me and see if the image in "L’andamento nelle province con più contagi" is a 403 forbidden? | 23:19 |
| LjL | (or someone else, too) | 23:19 |
| AimHere | Well flu, cold and coronavirus have similar symptoms | 23:19 |
| LjL | skullomania, so it gives you a fever and a cough, and it is transmitted in the air. that's true of about a thousand different diseases | 23:20 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: on it | 23:20 |
| oriba | RKI dashboard (germany) ... with cases over age: https://experience.arcgis.com/experience/478220a4c454480e823b17327b2bf1d4 | 23:20 |
| AimHere | But that's because the symptoms are the body's immune response to those diseases | 23:20 |
| x3n4 | However, corona often leads to permanent scartissue in lungs | 23:20 |
| yuriwho | %T https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/covid19-military-vance-1.5504247 | 23:20 |
| mefistofeles | lord_julius[m]: looks ok here | 23:20 |
| mefistofeles | LjL: ↑↑ | 23:20 |
| LjL | yuriwho, it needs to be %title, but i can add %t | 23:20 |
| yuriwho | ok my bad | 23:20 |
| yuriwho | %title | 23:21 |
| Brainstorm | yuriwho: From experience.arcgis.com: Experience | 23:21 |
| python476 | x3n4: are all infected concerned ? | 23:21 |
| mefistofeles | oriba: oh nice!! I was waiting for something like that anytime soon | 23:21 |
| LjL | oriba, thanks, that's getting added to the resources page | 23:21 |
| oriba | :-) | 23:21 |
| skullomania | %cases canada | 23:21 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +108 cases (now 273503), +3 deaths (now 11341), +314 recoveries (now 90607) 🔶 France: +292 recoveries (now 1587) 🔸 Australia: +1 cases (now 877) 🔸 Australian Capital Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 6) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +46 cases (now 353), +1 deaths (now 6) 🔸 Northern Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 3) [... want %more?] | 23:22 |
| Brainstorm | skullomania: In all areas, Canada, there are 951 cases, 12 deaths (1.3% of cases), 11 recoveries as of March 20, 22:19Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Canada for time series data. | 23:22 |
| LjL | yuriwho, do you have a github account that you can share? | 23:22 |
| yuriwho | I do not sadly | 23:22 |
| skullomania | why do they keep releasing these recovered individuals if we don't know how long they stay contagious for | 23:22 |
| skullomania | it's bonkers | 23:22 |
| oriba | oh, they also have a very detailed map with geolocations .... I'm astouned.... nevertheless I would like to have the data as csv or xml ... | 23:22 |
| yuriwho | I only code in fortran ;-) | 23:22 |
| Alohomora | %stats spain | 23:23 |
| Brainstorm | Alohomora: In all areas, Spain, there are 21510 cases, 1093 deaths (5.1% of cases), 1588 recoveries as of March 20, 22:19Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Spain for time series data. | 23:23 |
| x3n4 | Seems that everyone with serious respiratory symptoms have permanent damage to their lungs | 23:23 |
| LjL | yuriwho, okay. well it's not about coding in this case, it's that the resources page is now being maintained as a github readme | 23:23 |
| skullomania | not everyone x3n4 | 23:23 |
| [itchyjunk] | <x3n4> Seems that everyone with serious respiratory symptoms have permanent damage to their lungs | 23:24 |
| LjL | yuriwho, i've added some of the papers you've linked to but i'm sure i've missed a couple important ones at least | 23:24 |
| [itchyjunk] | fibrosis happens in low number of cases. | 23:24 |
| yuriwho | I will create an account to add refs that are relevent | 23:24 |
| python476 | x3n4: that's it i will not talk to a single soul until next month | 23:25 |
| [itchyjunk] | souls spread the virus too? | 23:25 |
| python476 | #selfish my lungs are already just too weak for my tastes | 23:25 |
| x3n4 | Well, we have to wait and see if it is really permanent | 23:25 |
| python476 | [itchyjunk]: only those connected to a body | 23:25 |
| LjL | yuriwho, i can still add them for you, especially if you make it explicit you want some particular thing added. i may sometimes be unable to discern between what's really noteworthy and what's more of a footnote | 23:25 |
| x3n4 | But if you have weak lungs already, that's going to be a really big issue | 23:25 |
| python476 | x3n4: i have low faith that lung tissue will regenerate well | 23:26 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 22:19 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: cabinet approves new restrictions as New Zealand cases increase: New Zealand reports its biggest single-day increase in positive tests to Covid-19 as Australia tightens social distancing rules. Follow the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Xj4H0j | 23:26 |
| x3n4 | The human body is quite good at regenerating | 23:26 |
| LjL | yuriwho, why do the military expect multiple waves? do you imagine it's because they expect it to get milder in the summer, or because they expect on-off lockdowns? | 23:26 |
| x3n4 | It depends on your lifestyle and overall health | 23:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | python476, lung tissue generate substantially better than brain tissue. | 23:26 |
| [itchyjunk] | for w/e that's worth. | 23:26 |
| LjL | well brain tissues really doesn't regenerate very well, i think, so it's kind of a low bar ;( | 23:27 |
| x3n4 | itchyjunk is right | 23:27 |
| python476 | [itchyjunk]: i heard fibrosis in alveola was the root of many lung failure (after exposure to toxins) | 23:27 |
| [itchyjunk] | its the lowest bar i could find | 23:27 |
| yuriwho | also, I am now starting a new project to develop adjuvants that will (hopefully) improve the immune response in any vaccine developed but our lab is closed till April 1.... hopefully that will get sorted if we get some funding for the project | 23:27 |
| oriba | Severe Outcomes Among Patients with Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19) — United States, February 12–March 16, 2020 https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6912e2.htm?s_cid=mm6912e2_w | 23:27 |
| python476 | many lifelong | 23:27 |
| python476 | brb | 23:27 |
| yuriwho | LjL: as for the multiple waves, it's the military gaming out worst case scenario's, I doubt that would happen in that time frame | 23:28 |
| [itchyjunk] | the fibrosis could be lifelong | 23:28 |
| [itchyjunk] | but this is the immune systems overresponse rather than the virus though | 23:28 |
| LjL | guys if you keep saying the fibrosis could be lifelong i'll get fibrosis just by thinking of it | 23:28 |
| python476 | lupus | 23:29 |
| Timvde | %cases Australia | 23:30 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Australia, there are 877 cases, 7 deaths (0.8% of cases), 46 recoveries as of March 20, 22:19Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Australia for time series data. | 23:30 |
| LjL | lupi lupo lupum lupe lupo | 23:30 |
| LjL | lupi luporum lupis lupi lupi lupis | 23:31 |
| LjL | lupos, also | 23:31 |
| [itchyjunk] | python476, the immune response is what leads to pneumonia is most cases :'( | 23:32 |
| [itchyjunk] | love hate relationship with the immune system | 23:32 |
| Timvde | Hmm, interesting, my headphone can be connected to both my laptop and my phone at once | 23:32 |
| Timvde | (but the one to start playing music first, will get the channel) | 23:32 |
| Brainstorm | New from CNBC Health at 22:30 UTC: New York City is the new coronavirus epicenter with one third of all US cases, Mayor de Blasio says: New York City accounts for roughly a third of all the coronavirus cases in the nation with 5,151 confirmed infections as of 10 a.m. Friday, Mayor Bill de Blasio said. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/sErgxp | 23:33 |
| [itchyjunk] | Well, if you mean bluetooth, it only check if connectivity is possible | 23:33 |
| LjL | Timvde, the more advanced bluetooth audio devices these days do do that | 23:34 |
| [itchyjunk] | or maybe you have a multichannel headphone | 23:34 |
| Timvde | %cases Belgium | 23:37 |
| Brainstorm | Timvde: In all areas, Belgium, there are 2257 cases, 37 deaths (1.6% of cases), 204 recoveries as of March 20, 22:30Z. See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=Belgium for time series data. | 23:37 |
| Timvde | We're starting to report recoveries | 23:37 |
| Timvde | That's nice | 23:37 |
| LjL | i pretty much never look at recoveries, every country does them differently | 23:37 |
| ubLIX | I guess long term smokers present with a degree of fibrosis, implying a lack of reserve with which to tolerate covid damage. Would interstitial fibrosis not be classified among the varieties of COPD? | 23:38 |
| LjL | ubLIX, one part of the definition of COPD is it's progressive i believe | 23:38 |
| ubLIX | LjL: but I am not clear on the coverage of the COPD classification; fibrosis in the interstitial sense isn't strictly obstructive, is it? | 23:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | Spain got worse quicker than their government were expecting. | 23:39 |
| LjL | ubLIX, i don't know | 23:39 |
| [itchyjunk] | Germany is doing suprising well so far. | 23:39 |
| Timvde | So, let's go for a walk | 23:39 |
| LjL | Timvde, good luck | 23:39 |
| yuriwho | believe it or not, China did not identify smoking as a risk factor..... probably because of general air quality in Wuhan | 23:40 |
| Timvde | I mean, the alternative is not moving at all for probably months | 23:40 |
| Timvde | I'd really rather not | 23:40 |
| Brainstorm | New from The Guardian at 22:32 UTC: Australia coronavirus live updates: cabinet approves new restrictions as New Zealand cases increase: New Zealand reports its biggest single-day increase in positive tests to Covid-19 as Australia tightens social distancing rules. Follow the latest news [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/Xj4H0j | 23:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | the fibrosis is not from the virus | 23:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | immune response kills of a layer of your lung cells that it thinks is infected | 23:40 |
| oriba | a dashboard with timely animation: https://covid19-dash.herokuapp.com/ | 23:40 |
| [itchyjunk] | in most people, it only triggers apoptosis is select cells | 23:41 |
| [itchyjunk] | the more cells your immune system kills, the more chances of fibrosis | 23:41 |
| [itchyjunk] | (and pneumonia) | 23:41 |
| LjL | Timvde, well do it now while you can i guess, because the "not moving for months" part *will* likely come | 23:41 |
| LjL | either that, or tons of people die | 23:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | Timvde, i talk a walk twice a day. I avoid people. | 23:42 |
| [itchyjunk] | I try to moving during sunlight. | 23:42 |
| Timvde | Harder to avoid people during the day, no? | 23:43 |
| Timvde | And I have to work during the day | 23:43 |
| [itchyjunk] | I manage it fine. | 23:43 |
| Timvde | I can do my job 100% from home | 23:43 |
| Timvde | So that's what we're doing | 23:43 |
| Timvde | It maybe depends on where you live | 23:43 |
| Timvde | I live in a crowded city | 23:43 |
| [itchyjunk] | I prefer sunlight because that helps with all sorts of internal regulations. | 23:44 |
| LjL | mefistofeles, now i can see the part that 403'd before, was just a glitch i guess. Milan still does look scary as expected :( | 23:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | Plus uv kills some of the virus. | 23:44 |
| LjL | Timvde, it won't be enough at some point | 23:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | I live in the city too. But the part i walk in is almost dead empty. | 23:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | I passed 1 person in the hour i walked | 23:44 |
| LjL | Timvde, the only way things got better in Wuhan was when everything shut down, and people just stayed at home. and it seems Lombardy will have to go that route soon. | 23:44 |
| [itchyjunk] | and she and i never got close enough | 23:44 |
| Timvde | LjL: well, it depends. I think it would probably be okay if we'd _mostly_ shut down and perform actual social distancing | 23:46 |
| Timvde | The problem is that many people just aren't | 23:46 |
| LjL | Timvde, yeah, same here. i think at minimum now Lombardy is asking the army to assist, but it'll probably go further. i *hope* it goes further. | 23:47 |
| Brainstorm | New from r/Italy Live* at 22:45 UTC: /u/pixelcraftables: Ecco il Recap per il 20 Marzo — from WHO at 22:45: World Water Day 2020 highlights the essential role of handwashing → https://is.gd/gdDaKX | 23:47 |
| fructose | LjL: I'm confused. The reports are that Italy is effectively shut down, but allowing restricted movement that seems to me like it should be drastically slowing growth. What am I missing? | 23:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | Kids are all palying together out here. | 23:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | So much for school closure | 23:47 |
| LjL | fructose, the typically Italian difference between theory (or law) and practice. | 23:47 |
| [itchyjunk] | Parents have no idea what is happening i bet | 23:48 |
| [itchyjunk] | (incubation period is 5 days to 2 weeks, so we see the result of restriction italy had 2 weeks ago today) | 23:48 |
| fructose | LjL: Is there no enforcement? Even if some manage to bypass the rules, I'd still expect drastic improvement. | 23:49 |
| LjL | fructose, work activities aren't being shut down, employers are just "encouraged" to allow remote working when possible. so at the end of the day, you can be found around and easily have a piece of paper that gives a plausible reason for why you're around, and police will have to say "uhm, okay". if they check you at all, which isn't so overwhelmingly common. | 23:49 |
| LjL | fructose, drastic improvement only happen when people stay drastically home, i think Wuhan's numbers showed that, and Lombardy will also (hopefully) | 23:49 |
| LjL | fructose, i'd ask you to listen to what that Chinese doctor said in today's press conference too | 23:50 |
| LjL | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rhP2MC7pDY&feature=youtu.be&t=85 | 23:50 |
| LjL | it has english, because apparently we can't find a chinese interpreter, somehow | 23:50 |
| fructose | LjL: So the work you're talking about isn't just essential work? | 23:50 |
| LjL | fructose, no, all work activities are continuing, except for some shops basically | 23:51 |
| Timvde | LjL: oh, here, there are big fines if you don't actually let your employees work at home | 23:51 |
| fructose | 8| | 23:51 |
| LjL | and even most of the shops that are shut down are still allowed to work by delivery | 23:51 |
| Timvde | Although companies are still cheating | 23:51 |
| Timvde | My mom is in food, so that's a sector that's still allowed to go to work, because well, it's kinda necessary | 23:52 |
| LjL | i think it might be hard to explain italy to others. | 23:52 |
| Timvde | But she's in administration, and you're not telling me administration workers have to be at the office every day... | 23:52 |
| oriba | LjL: thats your favourite video it seems :-) | 23:53 |
| LjL | oriba, well i can't keep explaining what's wrong with the current lockdown and what should be done instead | 23:54 |
| Brainstorm | 🔶 World: +334 cases (now 273837), +15 deaths (now 11356), +3 recoveries (now 90610) 🔶 US: +207 cases (now 19083), +15 deaths (now 252) 🔸 Australia: +1 cases (now 877) 🔸 Australian Capital Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 6) 🔸 New South Wales, Australia: +46 cases (now 353), +1 deaths (now 6) 🔸 Northern Territory, Australia: +2 cases (now 3) [... want %more?] | 23:54 |
| LjL | i've repeated it a number of times today | 23:54 |
| LjL | this person has said it... to our governor | 23:54 |
| LjL | our governor said "i'll tell the PM tonight" | 23:54 |
| LjL | so far, the PM has done nothing | 23:54 |
| LjL | i don't want to keep seeing that damned curve growing | 23:54 |
| oriba | hmhh | 23:54 |
| LjL | and especially not in Milan | 23:54 |
| LjL | i am already seeing the movie in my head, someone in our building getting sick, then us inevitably getting it | 23:55 |
| LjL | and i don't even have the thing i should have bought to at least try to handle it while hospitals are overwhelmed :\ | 23:56 |
| Timvde | https://twitter.com/PodSaveAmerica/status/1241041962871881728 | 23:57 |
| Timvde | What the hell o.o | 23:57 |
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