libera/##covid-19/ Friday, 2020-12-11

Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: Walmart prepares to administer Covid vaccines at stores across the U.S.: Walmart is getting ready to administer Covid vaccinations across the country once a vaccine is approved, the company's chief medical officer said Thursday. → https://is.gd/q2eaPb	00:01
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: Loss of smell in patients with COVID-19 MRI data reveal a transient edema of the olfactory clefts (81 votes) \| https://n.neurology.org/content/95/23/e3145 \| https://redd.it/kagzkk	00:03
Jigsy	de-facto: Not 100% sure.	00:03
Jigsy	I know he's allergic to fish.	00:03
Jigsy	Has to carry an epi pen with him.	00:03
Jigsy	Probably something related to that.	00:03
LjL	Yes, having to carry an epi pen disqualified you since after the two allergic reactions happened in the UK	00:09
de-facto	Can I have his dose please? :D	00:10
de-facto	I am still curious about those, they say two cases of allergic reactions in hundreds of doses or such?	00:11
de-facto	and those two already got a known history of allergic reactions before	00:11
de-facto	i wonder how severe their reactions were (e.g. if they required treatment or just observation etc) and due to what ingredient of the vaccine	00:12
de-facto	if that was known maybe ryoumas idea of the pricktest prior to taking the shot would not be the worst	00:12
de-facto	e.g. assumed it was PEG, make a Pricktest with PEG and if its negative go for the shot	00:13
de-facto	i dont know it is PEG, just as example	00:13
LjL	de-facto: well that's why they are just disqualifying those with a known history if serious allergic reactions	00:13
LjL	Seems reasonable to me	00:13
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: FDA panel recommends approval of Pfizer's Covid vaccine for emergency use: If the FDA adopts the recommendation it would mark a pivotal moment in the Covid-19 pandemic, which has killed roughly 290,000 in the U.S. in less than a year. → https://is.gd/4dWdJu	00:14
de-facto	yeah but the approach should be more distinct like finding out the cause of the allergic reaction and test for that or even work on an alternative ingredient then?	00:14
LjL	I don't know about a pricktest, maybe they need to be sure what ingredient is causing it and it's not clear yet	00:14
de-facto	exactly	00:14
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: Safety and Efficacy of the BNT162b2 mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine (81 votes) \| https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577 \| https://redd.it/kag41v	00:15
LjL	de-facto: it's been just a couple of days since the UK started deploying the vaccine	00:15
LjL	Maybe I'm too used to Italy but I don't expect light speed	00:15
de-facto	oh wow	00:15
de-facto	%title https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2034577	00:15
Brainstorm	de-facto: From www.nejm.org: Safety and Efficacy of the BNT162b2 mRNA Covid-19 Vaccine \| NEJM	00:15
LjL	That's Pfizer right?	00:16
de-facto	yup	00:16
LjL	This seems like an "equivalent" to the study recently published about AZ	00:16
de-facto	BIoNTech/Pfizer	00:16
de-facto	oh and with some of the Graphs i already linked yesterday	00:17
de-facto	neat	00:17
de-facto	This is the important paper	00:18
gigasu_shida	hi de-facto	00:30
gigasu_shida	why did you say oh wow?	00:30
de-facto	because its the final Phase III trial report of BioNTech/Pfizer that we were looking forward to reading	00:33
de-facto	it looks like its extremely well done on first sight	00:34
gigasu_shida	oh at first glance. yeah	00:36
de-facto	https://www.nejm.org/na101/home/literatum/publisher/mms/journals/content/nejm/0/nejm.ahead-of-print/nejmoa2034577/20201210-05/images/img_xlarge/nejmoa2034577_f2.jpeg	00:39
de-facto	seems like they precisely documented the reactions	00:40
gigasu_shida	did the FDA panel endorse the Pfiz/Bio vax?	00:40
de-facto	Very consistent efficiency across age groups https://www.nejm.org/na101/home/literatum/publisher/mms/journals/content/nejm/0/nejm.ahead-of-print/nejmoa2034577/20201210-05/images/img_xlarge/nejmoa2034577_t3.jpeg	00:45
de-facto	and most cases in the verum branch occured before dose 2 even was able to induce full immunity: https://www.nejm.org/na101/home/literatum/publisher/mms/journals/content/nejm/0/nejm.ahead-of-print/nejmoa2034577/20201210-05/images/img_xlarge/nejmoa2034577_f3.jpeg	00:46
de-facto	this is extremely good news	00:47
de-facto	After primer dose 50 Covid cases, 39 between primer and booster, 2 between booster and 7 days after that and only 9 after 7 days post booster	00:49
de-facto	according to their graph it almost looks like the verum branch diverges sharply from the placebo branch as soon as 10 days after the primer dose	00:50
de-facto	so this deserves a WOW.	00:50
de-facto	ok in the text they say 12 days	00:51
de-facto	"The cumulative incidence of Covid-19 cases over time among placebo and vaccine recipients begins to diverge by 12 days after the first dose, 7 days after the estimated median viral incubation period of 5 days,10 indicating the early onset of a partially protective effect of immunization. The study was not designed to assess the efficacy of a single-dose regimen. Nevertheless, in the interval between the first and second doses, the	00:56
de-facto	observed vaccine efficacy against Covid-19 was 52%, and in the first 7 days after dose 2, it was 91%, reaching full efficacy against disease with onset at least 7 days after dose 2."	00:56
gigasu_shida	what's a verum branch	00:57
de-facto	vaccine "the real thing"	00:58
de-facto	placebo "the fake thing"	00:58
de-facto	"With approximately 19,000 participants per group in the subset of participants with a median follow-up time of 2 months after the second dose, the study has more than 83% probability of detecting at least one adverse event, if the true incidence is 0.01%, but it is not large enough to detect less common adverse events reliably. This report includes 2 months of follow-up after the second dose of vaccine for half the trial participants	00:58
de-facto	and up to 14 weeks’ maximum follow-up for a smaller subset."	00:58
de-facto	WHOA	01:00
de-facto	they stole my idea :P	01:00
de-facto	" These data do not address whether vaccination prevents asymptomatic infection; a serologic end point that can detect a history of infection regardless of whether symptoms were present (SARS-CoV-2 N-binding antibody) will be reported later."	01:00
tinwhiskers	nice	01:00
de-facto	neat, so they will do that then :)))	01:00
de-facto	"Although the vaccine can be stored for up to 5 days at standard refrigerator temperatures once ready for use, very cold temperatures are required for shipping and longer storage. The current cold storage requirement may be alleviated by ongoing stability studies and formulation optimization, which may also be described in subsequent reports."	01:02
tinwhiskers	also nice	01:03
tinwhiskers	Don't they already have containers that are suitable for shipping for one week or so?	01:03
tinwhiskers	It seems if you had a steady stream of them being shipped the cold storage thing is not really an issue.	01:04
tinwhiskers	Provided you can use each one within 5 days of opening, which seems highly likely.	01:05
de-facto	It looks extremely good and consistent	01:09
de-facto	id say above expectations on all parts	01:10
de-facto	although it looks like the shot might hurt	01:10
de-facto	like pain, but ok the results really seem to be worth it, they are stellar	01:10
LjL	de-facto: may hurt enough that even though Pfizer didn't consider an event of "shoulder injury" as vaccine-related, the investigator for the FDA considered it as such	01:13
LjL	So yikes. But well, shoulder pain is not as bad as, I dunno, Bell's palsy!	01:14
LjL	Just being sassy, I'd still take it over AZ	01:14
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: Covid pandemic drove a record drop in global carbon emissions in 2020: Researchers said carbon emissions will likely rebound in 2021 and urged governments to prioritize a shift to clean energy in their Covid recovery plans. → https://is.gd/uWEL83	01:16
Brainstorm	Updates for Uruguay: +383 cases (now 8487), +3 deaths (now 90) since a day ago	01:21
LjL	from de-facto's Reuters link earlier	01:29
LjL	South Korea is also at the centre of global efforts to research the potential of reinfection with a different strain of the virus after reports in April that scores of people who had recovered from COVID-19 later tested positive again. Health officials at the time said they suspected it was due to tests picking up remnants of the dead virus. Since then, there have been documented reports of individuals being reinfected with different versions of the	01:29
LjL	virus. In a recently published paper in the journal Clinical Infectious Diseases, researchers from Seoul National University Hospital used computerised analysis to show that one woman was first infected with the V strain and later reinfected with a G strain.	01:29
de-facto	i did not have the time to read it in detail yet	01:32
LjL	well i just skimmed it	01:32
LjL	but you probably know i'm a bit obsessed with re-infection	01:32
de-facto	well it is the interesting question in the long term	01:32
LjL	in particular this passage makes me wonder for how long the current vaccines may hold, since both G and V were variants on the spike protein that obtained significant transmission	01:33
LjL	and the vaccines basically all target the spike protein	01:33
LjL	and as you said, once we start vaccinating many people, there may be more selective pressure	01:34
de-facto	a hint to how long those mRNA vaccines may hold can be given by the Moderna vaccine https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMc2032195?	01:34
de-facto	%title	01:34
Brainstorm	de-facto: From www.nejm.org: Durability of Responses after SARS-CoV-2 mRNA-1273 Vaccination \| NEJM	01:34
de-facto	yes indeed	01:35
Brainstorm	Updates for France: +10605 cases (now 2.4 million) since 22 hours ago — Netherlands: +6031 cases (now 586168), +47 deaths (now 9913) since 22 hours ago	01:35
LjL	that's Moderna?	01:35
de-facto	yep	01:35
LjL	i heard they had a study on potential duration, had dropped off my radar though	01:36
LjL	sometimes i feel the most important articles don't actually end up in my list for one reason or another	01:36
de-facto	id guess the Moderna mRNA-1273 will be similar to the BioNTech BNT162b2	01:36
LjL	maybe because i keep them there thinking okay, i need to figure out exactly what the important parts are here to describe it... and then i don't	01:36
LjL	by the way, de-facto, since i probably won't be following here as much as i was until recently now, if you feel some links should end up into the list, you can also do "%tell ljl: blah" to the bot and it'll relay the message when i'm around	01:37
LjL	since i no longer really check the entire backscroll when i log in	01:37
LjL	same for everybody else of course	01:38
de-facto	%tell LjL he will try to remember	01:38
Brainstorm	de-facto, I'll pass LjL your message when they are around.	01:38
LjL	:)	01:40
LjL	(you don't see anything but it worked)	01:40
Brainstorm	New from https://covid19.specops.network : ljl-covid: Add Reuters article about mutations and strains → https://is.gd/qzmNRq	01:41
de-facto	neat :)	01:41
de-facto	I am curious what Derek Lowe will write about the BNT162b2 paper	01:42
LjL	well he doesn't hide being a fan of the mRNA vaccines i think	01:43
de-facto	already was ontop of the approvals	01:43
de-facto	hmm interesting, i wonder why the GV strain spreads in Europe so efficiently when they associate no selective advantage with that mutation on the s-protein	01:57
de-facto	in the reuters article	01:57
de-facto	hmm well ok it speads while incidence increased, so it really does not mean it dominated other strains, maybe its the "tourists party" strain?	01:59
LjL	de-facto, the site makes the "tourists party" hypothesis	02:02
Brainstorm	New from https://covid19.specops.network : ljl-covid: Strip irrelevant data from URL → https://is.gd/wMmFw4	02:06
Brainstorm	Updates for Panama: +2447 cases (now 185424), +23 deaths (now 3287) since a day ago	02:06
de-facto	LjL, about that reinfection, is it this paper here they talk about? https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciaa1421/5997517	02:10
de-facto	%title	02:10
Brainstorm	de-facto: From academic.oup.com: Evidence of Severe Acute Respiratory Syndrome Coronavirus 2 Reinfection After Recovery from Mild Coronavirus Disease 2019 \| Clinical Infectious Diseases \| Oxford Academic	02:10
LjL	de-facto, seems plausible, may be more than one paper, since Korea started early with suspected reinfection cases	02:13
LjL	which at first were like "naah probably just false negative PCRs"	02:13
de-facto	yep indeed so quite good they went ahead and sequenced	02:15
de-facto	btw the reuters article mentions my fears too	02:16
de-facto	"Still, experts who have watched influenza and HIV mutate over years, evading vaccines, warn that future mutations of SARS-CoV-2 remain unknown. And the best shot at avoiding changes that make the virus impervious to a vaccine remains curtailing its spread and reducing the opportunities it has to mutate."	02:16
de-facto	"“If the virus changes substantially, particularly the spike proteins, then it might escape a vaccine. We want to slow transmission globally to slow the clock,” said Deakin’s Bennett. “That reduces the chances of a one in a squillion change that’s awful news for us.”"	02:16
LjL	which vaccines did HIV evade? i didn't think there were ever HIV vaccines :o	02:16
de-facto	yeah they probably mean they monitored Influenza evading vaccines but those experts also are knowledgeable about HIV or some such	02:17
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: (news): Covid testing of students finds few positive cases → https://is.gd/MOxmI4	02:18
de-facto	i feel uneasy with such a huge "bruteforceing power" being allowed to spend time on trying to uncover an escape mutation against the currently very effective vaccines	02:19
LjL	would you say Nextstrain, the Reuters article, and other things like that should go under the heading Epidemiology instead of general Science?	02:19
LjL	de-facto, when tens of millions of vaccines will be available, i think it will be VERY hard for the ones in power to justify withholding them from the population, and to explain it's better do it all at once. even if the logistics could get figured out.	02:20
LjL	maybe the route should be spending tons of research into streamlining the logistics for production and deployment as much as possible, so that the moment a mutation appears, a day later you are already producing vaccine doses adjusted for that	02:21
de-facto	well its molecular biology with statistical analysis of genetics, hence could be employed to study the Epidemiology of the virus as they did with correlating geographic locations with spreads of specific strains	02:21
LjL	i feel my section headers are a bit confusing and inaccurate :\ reflecting the fact i just don't know the field very well	02:21
de-facto	i guess those mRNA vaccines could be changed very quickly since it only would require to produce them from a different DNA template but then would that have to be approved again?	02:22
LjL	when i added it (the page has a different name now) Nextstrain had the title "Nextstrain genomic epidemiology"	02:22
LjL	de-facto, i'm not sure they would have to be approved again if it's the exact same platform with just a mutation	02:23
LjL	i think regulatory agencies would probably make room for that	02:23
LjL	and if not, laws would	02:23
de-facto	maybe but what if that new spike protein makes cells fuse more efficiently together or somesuch?	02:23
de-facto	(idk probably would not happen, just as example)	02:24
LjL	we're already running big risks with these current vaccines, let's say it how it is	02:24
LjL	these are quick trials	02:24
de-facto	i wonder about the same question when they say they want to improve the formulation to make it more temperature stable	02:24
de-facto	would they need to re-approve it then?	02:24
LjL	they seem reassuring, they are reassuring, but we never made vaccines this fast	02:24
LjL	so we're already playing with fire in a way, because... well, because we need to	02:24
de-facto	well the house already is on fire with the wild type virus	02:25
de-facto	so we cant argue to long about water damage, at some point we just need to go for extinguishing the fire, all at once would be best since then no embers survives that might reignite the fire	02:26
LjL	de-facto, there was a piece i think from Lowe (for a change) pondering what happens once we have an approved vaccine - in terms of the other vaccines. what happens to the placebo arm? do they get the actual vaccine? (Pfizer wants them to) and if not how do we STOP them from getting the vaccine, or another vaccine? we can't really, they can just drop off the trial	02:26
LjL	and if COVID cases "dry up", what happens to trials of newer vaccines?	02:26
LjL	they may not have enough cases to continue the trials at an acceptable speed	02:27
de-facto	thats quite a valid problem indeed	02:27
de-facto	how will vaccine manufacturers find enough participants for double blinding including high risk demographic elderly etc	02:28
LjL	hmm i cannot find that article now	02:28
LjL	de-facto, oh, i found it. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/10/21/the-vaccine-tightrope	02:29
LjL	i thought it was newer	02:29
de-facto	from the BioNtech paper	02:31
de-facto	"Although the study was designed to follow participants for safety and efficacy for 2 years after the second dose, given the high vaccine efficacy, ethical and practical barriers prevent following placebo recipients for 2 years without offering active immunization, once the vaccine is approved by regulators and recommended by public health authorities. Assessment of long-term safety and efficacy for this vaccine will occur, but it cannot	02:31
de-facto	be in the context of maintaining a placebo group for the planned follow-up period of 2 years after the second dose."	02:31
LjL	de-facto, Lowe also makes the argument that even if you (or Pfizer) stubbornly insisted in not unblinding the participants, in most cases the participants would already have a pretty good idea whether they received an actual dose or not, because the local adverse effects (pain!) are quite different	02:32
LjL	which is probably why one of those trials, but only one, used a meningitis vaccine for the control arm, interestingly	02:32
de-facto	also: participation in trials always can be withdrawn, so even if they would not offer them to get verum, they just could pull out and go for vaccination	02:32
LjL	yes	02:32
LjL	and they can definitely do that if they know they've gotten a placebo	02:32
LjL	as soon as they hear that the real vaccine hurts a fair amount, and theirs felt like fresh water, well, they'll know they got placebo	02:33
LjL	and even myself, i can see the ethical doubts... i think they should get a vaccine	02:33
LjL	they've already been "brave" enough for the rest of us. denying them the vaccine for two years would be debatable at best	02:33
de-facto	thats what they did quite well in the OX/AZ study, they gave them meningitis? vaccine or such that also did had similar sideeffects	02:34
de-facto	not only salty water placebo, both study arms had similar side effects	02:34
LjL	de-facto, not in the OX/AZ study, i think. only in one branch of it, don't remember which country	02:35
LjL	which probably adds up to the mess that they did, using different control arm substances :\	02:35
de-facto	oh really? i did not know that	02:35
LjL	hm	02:36
LjL	in that article, he says "AstraZeneca has been giving a meningitis vaccine in the control group in the UK (and other countries?)"	02:36
LjL	so he isn't sure	02:36
LjL	maybe the study that was released yesterday talks about that	02:36
de-facto	they did actually do some thing very well (like weekly RT-PCR, placebo with similar side effects etc) but for some reason not consistently it seems then	02:36
LjL	"AstraZeneca has been giving a meningitis vaccine in the control group in the UK (and other countries?)"	02:37
LjL	or saline :\	02:37
LjL	err	02:37
LjL	wrong paste	02:37
LjL	"Participants aged 18 years and older were randomly assigned (1:1) to ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine or control (meningococcal group A, C, W, and Y conjugate vaccine or saline)."	02:37
de-facto	"This analysis includes data from four ongoing blinded, randomised, controlled trials done across the UK, Brazil, and South Africa. Participants aged 18 years and older were randomly assigned (1:1) to ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine or control (meningococcal group A, C, W, and Y conjugate vaccine or saline)."	02:37
de-facto	%title https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)32661-1/fulltext	02:37
Brainstorm	de-facto: From www.thelancet.com: Safety and efficacy of the ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine (AZD1222) against SARS-CoV-2: an interim analysis of four randomised controlled trials in Brazil, South Africa, and the UK - The Lancet	02:38
LjL	"Participants aged 18 years and older were randomly assigned (1:1) to ChAdOx1 nCoV-19 vaccine or control (meningococcal group A, C, W, and Y conjugate vaccine or saline)."	02:38
LjL	oh god	02:38
LjL	what's wrong with my pasting	02:38
LjL	"COV003 used MenACWY as the control for the first dose and saline for the second dose."	02:38
euod[m]	LjL: that probably shouldn't be that surprising though, a "placebo" in the context of medicine tests is almost never something inert.	02:38
LjL	euod[m], well all the other trials so far DID use something inert	02:38
LjL	and "COV003 used MenACWY as the control for the first dose and saline for the second dose."	02:39
LjL	oh	02:39
LjL	my	02:39
LjL	god	02:39
LjL	"In COV005, participants randomly assigned to the control group were administered saline solution."	02:39
LjL	i think this also means that side effect incidence (compared to the control arm) cannot really be compared across these studies	02:40
LjL	in Pfizer and Moderna, you'll see effects that are much stronger in the vaccine than in the control arm	02:41
LjL	but in AZ (at least some branches of it!), some of these effects may be common in both arms simply because the meningococcal vaccine also gives those side effects	02:41
LjL	i mean, i hope they picked the safest vaccine they could pick, but i dunno	02:41
gigasu_shida	what was the oh my god realization?	02:42
LjL	gigasu_shida, no, i was yelling at myself (and my computer) for continually pasting the wrong thing	02:43
gigasu_shida	hah	02:43
LjL	it seems like it takes some seconds between hitting ctrl+c and the browser actually copying the thing	02:43
de-facto	LjL, according to their Table 1 they employed MenACWY as control in COV002 (UK) and MenACWY plus saline in COV003 (Brazil)	02:43
LjL	i think it's something that has happened before to me on Wayland... i may just go back to Xorg again :\	02:43
gigasu_shida	ahh yeah i dealt with a slow PC for quite a while until it just died of a power converter failure	02:43
LjL	de-facto, yes, as i pasted, COV003 was meningococcal for the first dose, saline for the second. bit of a puzzling choice, since the booster dose usually gives worse side effects	02:44
LjL	but COV005 was all saline	02:44
LjL	(south africa)	02:44
de-facto	yeah i think thats their main problem not really consistently study protocols	02:44
LjL	COV005 was phase 1/2 though	02:45
de-facto	the idea is very good, others just went for saline alltogether	02:45
de-facto	and did not even tried to make weekly RT-PCR	02:45
de-facto	but now maybe BioNTech/Pfizer will try to do the N-protein ELISA post trial	02:46
de-facto	so that might become interesting to see that data	02:46
de-facto	"These data do not address whether vaccination prevents asymptomatic infection; a serologic end point that can detect a history of infection regardless of whether symptoms were present (SARS-CoV-2 N-binding antibody) will be reported later."	02:47
LjL	i bet you feel smug about thinking of an N-binding assay first :P	02:47
de-facto	its an obvious thing but also it would have to be normalized somehow, e.g. what portion of vaccinated asymptomatic infected develops antibodies against the N-protein	02:48
de-facto	nice thing might be that only that part of vaccinated might develop those antibodies against N-protein that also got significant viral replication ongoing to be infectious to others for some short duration	02:49
de-facto	but that would have to be confirmed with measuring the viral load	02:50
LjL	maybe AZ have been guilty of trying to do a bit too much	02:50
de-facto	i also thought that, they seem to have the right ideas but now got the stats probem	02:51
de-facto	im pretty sure they figure out some clever way to normalize their N-protein ELISA tests, it seems from reading their paper they are extremely pedantic about their stats	02:53
de-facto	probably others will follow up that approach since it can be done post study	02:53
de-facto	(if it will work at all that is of course)	02:53
de-facto	there is only one way to find out: take measure the seroprevalence and do the statistics	02:54
de-facto	they probably have to re-calibrate their ELISA tests for each of their geographic locations of their study arms	02:56
de-facto	like re-calibrate and normalize them for each environment of (other pathogen prevalence) and also ethnicity of participants	02:56
de-facto	and somehow they need to do that with a control group of vaccinated asymptomatic infected	02:57
de-facto	maybe they find some in the verum branch that would do a challenge test with the wild type pathogen?	02:58
de-facto	example: take a representative part of the verum branch, do an ELISA against N-protein, exclude positives, challenge with the wild type, monitor viral replication with a normalized RT-PCR (or maybe even with a sensitive antigen test?), correlate viral load with development of N-protein antibodies	02:59
de-facto	at least it seems protection from severe disease is very good, hence maybe participants would go for a challenge with wild type	03:00
de-facto	if its clear how the correlation between viral load and prevalence of N-protein antibodies is that data can be employed to extrapolate for asymptomatic cases over the whole phase III study with just doing properly calibrated ELISA against N-protein in their blood samples	03:02
Brainstorm	New from COVID-19 Vaccine News: biontech: Pfizer, BioNTech Receive FDA Advisory Approval for COVID-19 Vaccine Emergency Use in The US → https://is.gd/pKXiHZ	03:07
de-facto	%title https://ukcovidchallenge.com/	03:12
Brainstorm	de-facto: From ukcovidchallenge.com: UK COVID Challenge - COVID-19 Human Challenge Study Research	03:12
de-facto	interresting, not quite sure what their exact protocol would be though	03:13
de-facto	%title https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02821-4	03:15
Brainstorm	de-facto: From www.nature.com: Dozens to be deliberately infected with coronavirus in UK ‘human challenge’ trials	03:15
DocScrutinizer05	>>challenge test with the wild type pathogen<< will cause extreme dissent and never gets approval by ethics commission	03:17
DocScrutinizer05	a pity	03:17
de-facto	i am not so sure, look at the nature article	03:17
de-facto	"The UK government’s COVID-19 Vaccine Taskforce has agreed to pay the company up to £10 million (US$13 million) to conduct the trial, with the possibility of contracting Open Orphan to run several more to test various vaccines. The UK Medicines and Healthcare Regulatory Agency (MHRA), which regulates clinical trials in the United Kingdom, and an ethical review committee, still need to approve the initial trial and its design, and th	03:18
de-facto	at of future studies."	03:18
de-facto	so they are evaluating how and if they can do that	03:18
de-facto	but for a vaccinated study arm that might be much less risk	03:19
Brainstorm	Updates for New Zealand: +4 cases (now 2092) since 2 days ago	03:20
de-facto	"Once an appropriate dose is identified, Open Orphan could be asked to run a series of challenge trials testing several vaccines. Catchpole says that the design of these trials, including which vaccines will be included, has not been determined. "	03:20
de-facto	"He envisions that some trial participants will receive a placebo injection instead of a vaccine, but he also says that head-to-head trials comparing two or more vaccines could be run. Other vaccine studies that the company runs typically enrol 40–50 volunteers for each trial arm, he says."	03:21
de-facto	hmm ok so they even consider doing that for placebo	03:21
de-facto	"Catchpole says that his team will take every precaution against participants in the initial trial developing severe disease. Volunteers will be treated with an antiviral drug, such as remdesivir, once a nasal swab gives a positive result for SARS-CoV-2 genetic material. In addition to age and health, participants will be screened for risk factors that have been associated with severe COVID-19."	03:21
de-facto	"Selecting participants at the lowest risk is the most important safety step in running a challenge trial, says Matt Memoli, an infectious-disease physician and virologist at the US National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) in Bethesda, Maryland. “Once you’ve given that virus to the person, anything’s possible,” he says. “You can’t control it, you can only react to it.”"	03:22
de-facto	"If Open Orphan moves on to vaccine trials, it will aim to recruit around 500 participants altogether, but Friel says the company will need to screen many times more people to identify suitable volunteers. An ethical review board will determine how to compensate participants. Open Orphan typically pays volunteers around £4,000 for their time, says Catchpole."	03:23
de-facto	anyhow if they to the N-protein antibody ELISA tests and publish that data for their phase III trials all such studies could even be normalized later when such data from challenge tests becomes available	03:26
de-facto	or maybe they find some other clever way to do that	03:26
de-facto	important is to take that data in time before antibody levels may decline under the detection threshold of such ELISA tests	03:27
Brainstorm	New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Australian Covid Vaccine Terminated due to False Positives for HIV. → https://is.gd/UqKMsB	03:32
LjL	... false positives for HIV?	03:44
LjL	"Open Orphan"? does that tell me they use orphans to test vaccines on? :P	03:45
LjL	uh i thought a challenge study would be unethical in general, even on people who had gotten a vaccine	03:47
LjL	but doing it on people who got placebo is... how do you call it	03:47
LjL	attempted murder?	03:47
LjL	they will "use all precautions" like... giving them remdesivir. yeah. that'll stop severe disease. come on.	03:48
DocScrutinizer05	^^^ +1	03:51
DocScrutinizer05	o.O	03:51
DocScrutinizer05	keep in mind it's totally illegal to sell your kidney in Germany	03:52
euod[m]	LjL: that's sort of the issue with testing a lot of modern medications.	03:53
DocScrutinizer05	now a >>we pay you a tiny fortune for infecting you with a very serious disease<< is legal?	03:53
euod[m]	it's impossible to work out the efficacy of a lot of them because it's completely unethical not to give someone it.	03:54
LjL	euod[m], this is different, they want to be giving them the virus... without vaccinating (some of) them first	03:55
LjL	this is the kind of thing that if China does it, you'll see headlines saying how China inhumanely uses human guinea pigs	03:55
euod[m]	oh yeah that's obviously unethical	03:57
DocScrutinizer05	this is already quite questionable for testing/challenging vaccinated individuals. But why the heck you even _need_ a placebo control group? To prove the virus kills?	03:58
DocScrutinizer05	for a "oh, of our 100 placebo individuals only 98 replicated the virus and a 20 got severe symptoms<<?	03:59
DocScrutinizer05	WTF?!	04:00
DocScrutinizer05	you already know the naive cohort ratio between mild (and asymptomatic) and severe outcome. You change the confidence interval of the vaccinated cohort results by a 2/100 when you learn that 2 of your 100 placebo cases didn't replicate the virus	04:04
DocScrutinizer05	is that worth infecting a huge number of people with a deadly virus?	04:06
Brainstorm	Updates for South Korea: +688 cases (now 40786), +8 deaths (now 572) since a day ago — France: +10363 cases (now 2.4 million) since 20 hours ago — Netherlands: +6550 cases (now 588348), +46 deaths (now 9928) since 20 hours ago	04:06
DocScrutinizer05	this is Mengele	04:08
de-facto	no	04:09
de-facto	I think they are still working out the details of the ethics of the possible studies and participation is on free will	04:09
Brainstorm	New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Coronavirus vaccine costs to be covered by Canadian government → https://is.gd/BTEj5S	04:10
de-facto	they just are discussing all possible scenarios, noone will be forced to risk anything they dont want to	04:11
DocScrutinizer05	no, there is no such thing like free will in this context. People participate because of money, because they hope they are in the lucky half getting the vaccine, whatever. Each single one of those reasons is a knock out criterion to allow them participating. Even "doing it for the science" probably is, since you got to question their common sense	04:11
de-facto	they are discussing about how to prevent participation because of the money. noone has to participate whatsoever.	04:13
de-facto	why would people "doing it for science" not be allowed to participate?	04:13
DocScrutinizer05	jeck, this isn't even practicable since every medical doctor swore hypocratic oath	04:13
DocScrutinizer05	heck*	04:13
de-facto	why would you allow them to participate in vaccination phase I trials?	04:13
de-facto	they could potentially die from that too	04:14
de-facto	with such an attitude you never could risk anything, so no trials, no medications whatsoever	04:14
de-facto	its about preventing harm to the majority by letting some brave minority help out with ruling out the potential risks in place of the majority	04:15
de-facto	that is exactly what they are doing when evaluating the safety of new medications	04:15
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: SFDA Approves Registration of Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine (81 votes) \| https://www.spa.gov.sa/viewfullstory.php?lang=en&newsid=2166947 \| https://redd.it/kanr9g	04:16
de-facto	and them thinking about doing it in the most safe way possible already shows that they want to minimize risk and prevent as much harm as possible	04:17
de-facto	they want to evaluate if people are willing to help them with participating in such trials, and probably the risk really can be minimized but in the end its statistical so it cant be eliminated that something wents wrong	04:19
de-facto	but thats always the case with medications, the chance that treatment goes wrong is very slim and minimized but never zero	04:19
DocScrutinizer05	sorry, I don't get those two in my mind concurrently: >>it's forbidden to visit your father dying from covid since you could catch the virus<< and >>we pay you money for catching the virus from somebody who's not your father and not dying<<	04:21
de-facto	to put it straight; its about preventing harm for the majority	04:23
de-facto	while minimizing the risk for the minority	04:25
de-facto	without forcing anyone to take any risks	04:26
DocScrutinizer05	our moral and ethics worked differently so far, from shooting down hijacked airplanes to visiting your mother who got covid	04:26
DocScrutinizer05	and infecting unvaccinated people just because... what exactly?	04:27
de-facto	i think its something that should not be a tabu-topic anymore, its good they put all possibilities on the table and discuss about them	04:27
de-facto	i dont know that, all i am saying is that we should consider every possibility with an open mind	04:28
de-facto	so for example if they could measure antibodies to s-protein an exclude antibodies to n-protein in advance for vaccinated people and exclude everyone with comorbidities the chance that someone gets severely ill on challenge is probably quite low for low doses	04:30
DocScrutinizer05	well, before you resort to taboo, you first have to deal with the quite obvious fact that _any_ german medical personal participating in such activity anywhere on this globe would face a trial and several years in jail	04:31
de-facto	then they could try to correlate n-protein antibodies with measured viral concentrations for different participants all challenged with the same low dose of pathogen that may be similar to exposure in everyday life	04:31
de-facto	why is that?	04:31
DocScrutinizer05	koerperverletzung	04:31
de-facto	oh an an operation is not?	04:32
de-facto	like they cut open your body for implanting silicone into womens boobs?	04:32
DocScrutinizer05	no since an operation is meant to cure you, not make you sick or even kill you	04:32
de-facto	yeah cure from a fashion hype?	04:32
DocScrutinizer05	yes	04:32
de-facto	no if the participant signs that its ok then its not koerperverletzung	04:33
de-facto	otherwise there would be no plastic surgery	04:33
de-facto	(and btw i am against that, but that is irrelevant)	04:33
DocScrutinizer05	and if a patient dies, you have the choice if you prefer a trial for Mord, for totschlag or for Toetung auf verlangen	04:37
de-facto	im sorry i dont follow that	04:38
de-facto	there is a new medication, asking for volunteers to help out with figuring out the risk that has to be prevented for all others that may benefit from it is not unethical in my opinion	04:40
de-facto	noone is forced to do anything	04:40
de-facto	risk will be minimized as much as possible and explained in as much detail to participants as possible	04:44
DocScrutinizer05	noone is forcing you to donate your heart to your daughter, nevertheless it's plain forbidden in germany. There are clear and very strict laws that forbid deliberately and purposefully doing harm to anybody	04:44
de-facto	i think they probably do that also in vaccine trials, yet there always is a risk associated with it, it may be that they find out that a new vaccine induces narcolepsy or provokes such a massive allergic shock that someone dies	04:45
de-facto	ok if that really was the case, why is plastic surgery allowed in Germany then?	04:45
DocScrutinizer05	I'm out. I can't explain it any more obvious	04:45
de-facto	ok	04:46
de-facto	and btw its not their deliberate goal to do harm to anybody with challenge studies they want to help people	04:47
de-facto	as they want with vaccination trials	04:47
de-facto	its a delicate topic hence i think it should be discussed publicly	04:48
KREYREN	Trump supporter asked if pandemic is real: https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=mWfBAqCJ3nM	04:49
KREYREN	wow..	04:50
de-facto	and to make that clear i am not trying to defend their position i just think it should be discussed because actually through the pubic medical thread placed right now by the pandemic it is something that affects everyone	04:50
DocScrutinizer05	I'd be really interested in the plot how infecting an unvaccinated individual with sars-cov2 would HELP this indicidual. Greater good / social help is not a concept in german criminal laws when it comes to hurting or killing people	04:55
de-facto	my opinion on it would strongly depend on the details, i think i cant give a generic statement about challenge trials other than we should keep an open mind for the details and publicly discuss the ethics of it	04:55
Brainstorm	New from Reddit (test): China_Flu: Rhode Island, Smallest State In U.S., Now Leading The Country In COVID-19 Spread → https://is.gd/3qPqQd	04:59
de-facto	i dont want to be put too far on the opposite site of arguing because its actually not my conviction, but i think it is possible to some degree to let an individual decide to take a risk voluntarily without having to argue for it with personal benefit	05:00
DocScrutinizer05	yes, but god's grace be with the doctor when that individual dies from such treatment he did	05:01
de-facto	not only in medicine, how do they do that with test pilots? astronauts? formula 1 drivers? bungee jumpers?	05:01
DocScrutinizer05	you don't see the difference in purpose	05:02
DocScrutinizer05	and intention	05:02
de-facto	yes there is a difference, but my point was about free deciding to take a personal risk	05:03
DocScrutinizer05	everybody does, every day	05:04
DocScrutinizer05	so it's a moot point	05:04
CoronaBot	04/r/coronavirus: FDA panel recommends approval of Pfizer's Covid vaccine for emergency use (10049 votes) \| https://www.cnbc.com/2020/12/10/pfizer-covid-vaccine-fda-panel-recommends-approval-for-emergency-use.html \| https://redd.it/kapfh1	05:05
DocScrutinizer05	it's basically about hypocratic oath, no doctor may do harm	05:05
de-facto	what about a doctor that cuts into a body of a woman that is in perfectly healthy condition only to put silicone into her breasts? its her decision to take that risk for whatever intention or purpose she thinks she wants to do that	05:05
de-facto	now it would become problematic if her husband seems to stand aside her to force her into doing that	05:05
DocScrutinizer05	again, taking risk is not the point. causing damage is	05:06
de-facto	but if she wants to do that on her own i think its perfectly legal in Germany afaik	05:06
Brainstorm	Updates for Belgium: +2754 cases (now 600397), +89 deaths (now 17692) since 23 hours ago	05:06
de-facto	well i would argue that this kind of operation is causing damage but thats my personal opinion on this	05:07
de-facto	plastic surgery on perfectly healthy i mean	05:08
DocScrutinizer05	that's why you got to telk to the surgeon to explain why and how it will inprove your life when you get this surgery. And no doctor in germany (I hope so) will amputate your leg just because you or your partner got a very strange fetish	05:14
DocScrutinizer05	talk*	05:14
de-facto	but of course its not the intention of a (plastic) surgeon to cause any harm and the goal is to give the intention of the patient reality while minimizing the risk, actually this is broadening the opportunities that free will can access (in this case the changes of the plastic surgery). I personally might not agree with the results being better but the patient has the freedom to think differently from that and i have to respect that	05:15
de-facto	opinion and intention aswell (because it does not affect my personal freedom)	05:15
DocScrutinizer05	and infecting you with a dangerous virus is virtually impossible to justify how it will improve YOUR life, so the doctor will violate their hypocratic oath and also a few criminal laws	05:16
de-facto	maybe that participant in such a study wants to contribute with fighting the pandemic, be brave like a soldier and take some (more or less estimable) risk with participating, it may improve the life by taking that opportunity rather not being able to do anything about it	05:19
de-facto	how does it improve the life of participants in a vaccine or medication trial? pretty much the same way	05:20
de-facto	i think its about managing the risk, being open with every information and make sure participation really is voluntarily	05:24
Brainstorm	New from The Indian Express: World: World carbon dioxide emissions drop 7% in pandemic-hit 2020 → https://is.gd/VrNq4y	05:25
DocScrutinizer05	all this doesn't make a difference for the doctor when they get judged for killing somebody	05:25
DocScrutinizer05	that doctor will go to jail no matter which contract or paper the killed patient signed	05:26
DocScrutinizer05	since there was no benefit whatsoever for the patient from the "treatment"	05:27
DocScrutinizer05	not even potentially	05:27
tinwhiskers	might be time to agree to disagree :-/	05:27
de-facto	i think it makes a big difference if risk was minimized or not (that would be unethical not to minimize it), if any information was known but hidden from participants (patients or scientists) it would probably also be quite problematic in front of a court and if participation was not voluntarily it would be extremely problematic for any court (and rightfully so)	05:27
tinwhiskers	this has been going on for 2 hours now?	05:27
de-facto	yes lets rest the case.	05:28
DocScrutinizer05	yeah, better ask your medical doctor to give you covid. See what they will answer	05:28
de-facto	alright.	05:29
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: Can Melatonin Be a Potential “Silver Bullet” in Treating COVID-19 Patients? (87 votes) \| https://www.mdpi.com/2079-9721/8/4/44 \| https://redd.it/kasasl	05:35
tinwhiskers	No	05:36
DocScrutinizer05	:-)	05:37
DocScrutinizer05	germany +29,875 - that's so devastating they did show yesterday's diagram in TV news (Morgenmagazin)	05:40
de-facto	ooh damn	05:40
de-facto	thats a all time record for sure	05:41
DocScrutinizer05	yes	05:42
de-facto	RKI Germany: Weekly Incidence 156.3/100k, Infections +29875 (1272078 total), Fatalities +598 (20970 total), COVID-ICU beds 4342 (2511 on ventilator)	05:43
de-facto	dang :(((	05:43
de-facto	how long till government decides for a real lockdown that deserves that name?	05:45
DocScrutinizer05	seems they already did, more or less, starting on 27th of december	05:46
de-facto	%title https://smw.ch/article/doi/smw.2020.20224	05:46
Brainstorm	de-facto: From smw.ch: Swiss Medical Weekly - Potential impact of seasonal forcing on a SARS-CoV-2 pandemic	05:46
DocScrutinizer05	get numbers up to a really challenging level before we do, so it's more fun >:-/	05:47
de-facto	quite old paper but look at the seasonality of HKU1/OC43 (also beta-CoVs)	05:47
de-facto	its incidence raises sharply from October, November to end of December	05:48
de-facto	sounds familiar?	05:48
DocScrutinizer05	ummm, somewhat	05:48
DocScrutinizer05	but wait, no. This whole thing took us by surprise! REALLY¡	05:49
de-facto	i think they even published their data https://github.com/neherlab/CoV_seasonality	05:50
DocScrutinizer05	maybe those 29.5k are a _good_ thinh, two days before Merkel and ministers meet	05:50
de-facto	i really really do hope they finally go for closing every school in whole of Germany	05:51
de-facto	its about time now	05:51
DocScrutinizer05	if they don't come up with a real plan on sunday evening, I prolly will emigrate	05:51
de-facto	id choose Australia or New Zealand :)	05:51
de-facto	if i was given the choice	05:51
DocScrutinizer05	I gotta adjust my diagram's Y scale	05:56
DocScrutinizer05	let's see if they got a up-to-date diagram in news	06:01
DocScrutinizer05	yep	06:01
de-facto	do you happen to know how to make a string from a number in LO?	06:06
de-facto	i guess the TEXT() function but it wants me to program in Germany, OMG this is annoying	06:10
de-facto	its the worst idea ever to internationalize programming comands	06:14
DocScrutinizer05	english works	06:21
DocScrutinizer05	iirc	06:21
DocScrutinizer05	I guess when your target cell has formating "text" (not "standard" or "generic" or whatever the default) then simply referencing the cell containing the date will convert it to text	06:23
DocScrutinizer05	however it might convert the date to an integer (internal representation) before that	06:25
DocScrutinizer05	no idea	06:25
DocScrutinizer05	http://reisenweber.net/et_al/covid/covid19_statistics.htm	06:25
de-facto	well according to the reason for the need of your adjustments i am not going to say nice to this one	06:26
de-facto	since begin of December case numbers seem to raise, thats horrible :(	06:28
ryouma	i was wondering why i had severe periodontitis and severe bone loss. i clicked on that melatonin link and found out this "Periodontitis has long been attributed to having its pathophysiology rooted in a cytokine response. The recent COVID-19 pandemic has been reported to have adverse outcomes related to the establishment of a cytokine storm, many of the components of which are common with the cytokine expression pr	06:28
ryouma	ofile of periodontitis. This communication explores the connection between COVID-19 and periodontal disease through their cytokine connection to form a translational basis for recommending maintenance of oral hygiene in the COVID era and to red flag patients with periodontitis as having an increased risk of exhibiting COVID related adverse outcomes." my inflammatory cytokines are high.	06:28
DocScrutinizer05	((so devastating they did show yesterday's diagram in TV news - let's see if they got a up-to-date diagram in news)) they are obviously totally puzzled by this bomb, this time they show the right diagram, right number (29,875) for today and display right number (23449) for last week, but claim >>ca. 1500 more than last week<<	06:37
Brainstorm	New from The Indian Express: World: Egypt receives 1st shipment of Chinese vaccine tested in UAE → https://is.gd/SYgLt7	06:38
ryouma	where is the rest of this? https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0306987720313578	06:49
ryouma	%title	06:49
Brainstorm	ryouma: From www.sciencedirect.com: COVID-19 & Periodontitis: The cytokine connection - ScienceDirect	06:49
de-facto	%title https://imgur.com/a/1nlOnQA https://i.imgur.com/tuZCNFK.png source: https://github.com/neherlab/CoV_seasonality	06:50
Brainstorm	de-facto: From imgur.com: Common Cold Coronaviruses: Seasonality of HKU1 and NL63 - Album on Imgur	06:50
de-facto	so seasonality of HKU1 really looks a lot like SARS-CoV-2	06:50
de-facto	this is a average positivity of all taken tests between 2010 and 2020 in their dataset	06:51
de-facto	well HKU1/OC43 actually	06:57
Brainstorm	Updates for Japan: +2977 cases (now 172406) since a day ago — Germany: +32734 cases (now 1.3 million) since a day ago — Heilongjiang, China: +2 cases (now 951) since a month ago	07:06
DocScrutinizer05	so Brainstorm has tomorrow's numbers today? :-) Looks about right	07:07
de-facto	%title https://science.sciencemag.org/content/369/6501/315	07:09
Brainstorm	de-facto: From science.sciencemag.org: Susceptible supply limits the role of climate in the early SARS-CoV-2 pandemic \| Science	07:09
de-facto	DocScrutinizer05, friggin heck where do all those cases originate from?	07:12
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: Covid response hits rural NHS services hard - report: Coronavirus pandemic measures mean the hospitals face an uphill struggle to restore services. → https://is.gd/pCH93G	07:15
de-facto	%title https://imgur.com/a/qFL4oHO https://i.imgur.com/cv3fELt.png source: https://npgeo-corona-npgeo-de.hub.arcgis.com/datasets/dd4580c810204019a7b8eb3e0b329dd6_0	07:20
Brainstorm	de-facto: From imgur.com: COVID-19 Germany: Federal states with increasing Incidence: Brandenburg, Sachsen, Sachsen-Anhalt, Thuringia - Album on Imgur	07:20
de-facto	but from 22k to 30k? thats not must have other contributions too	07:25
de-facto	DocScrutinizer05, https://www.tagesschau.de/inland/rki-zahlen-379.html	07:29
Brainstorm	Updates for Baden-Wurttemberg, Germany: +4212 cases (now 179160), +64 deaths (now 3293) since a day ago — Saint Petersburg, Russia: +3774 cases (now 163163), +79 deaths (now 6109) since a day ago — Saxony, Germany: +2809 cases (now 78704), +77 deaths (now 1505) since a day ago — Unknown, Germany: +2195 cases (now 13314) since a month ago	07:38
Brainstorm	New from The Indian Express: World: Australia halts local COVID-19 vaccine development due to false HIV positives → https://is.gd/lWQT4k	07:39
DocScrutinizer05	de-facto: I want to kick those politicians asses, from from austria to denmark and then back, when I read >>conference only when we know the result beforehand<<	07:44
de-facto	you really want something to get furious about?	07:45
de-facto	then read this: https://www.fr.de/frankfurt/corona-demo-frankfurt-querdenken-querdenker-hessen-polizei-grossdemonstration-hauptbahnhof-zr-90123483.html	07:45
de-facto	ok im not gonna rant about it here, but its astronomically infuriating	07:46
DocScrutinizer05	fremdgehen69	07:48
DocScrutinizer05	trolls	07:48
DocScrutinizer05	I hpe police will beat them properly	07:49
de-facto	we got 30k daily new infections and they want to circumvent the court order that they are not going to be allowed to demonstrate against containment?!	07:50
de-facto	"Joël Roux" and "Malin Joy Singh"	07:58
de-facto	"Michael Ballweg"	07:59
de-facto	they are still calling for nation wide participation in their demo in frankfurt despite the court order to stand down due to too high risk of contagion (based on experiences with them refusing to wear masks or distance)	08:03
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Egypt receives 1st shipment of Chinese vaccine tested in UAE: Egypt on Thursday received its first shipment of a Chinese coronavirus vaccine, which was tested in the United Arab Emirates and is said to be 86% effective. → https://is.gd/kGHwa0	08:04
DocScrutinizer05	see §landfriedensbruch	08:06
de-facto	nice they start in Egypt too	08:11
de-facto	"Egypt on Thursday received its first shipment of a Chinese coronavirus vaccine, which was tested in the United Arab Emirates and is said to be 86% effective."	08:11
de-facto	"The shipment by Chinese state-owned pharmaceutical giant Sinopharm landed at Cairo's international airport from the UAE. Cairo and Abu Dhabi are close allies."	08:11
de-facto	"Health ministry spokesman Khaled Megahed said in a statement that the government would first vaccinate health care workers, particularly those who deal with COVID-19 cases. He said they would receive two doses of the vaccine over 21 days."	08:11
de-facto	%vax Sinopharm	08:14
Brainstorm	de-facto, Trial start: Apr 29, Researcher: Beijing Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Participants: 24448, Vaccine: Inactivated, Stage: Testing on humans — Trial start: Apr 12, Researcher: Wuhan Institute of BioProducts (Sinopharm), Country: China, Participants: 23056, Vaccine: Inactivated, Stage: Testing on humans	08:14
DocScrutinizer05	see also § 113 Widerstand gegen Vollstreckungsbeamte (2) 3.	08:15
DocScrutinizer05	6 months min	08:16
de-facto	yeah, i feel sorry for the police to be honest	08:19
de-facto	why are there two Sinopharm and whats their connection? developer and manufacturer?	08:19
de-facto	like {Beijing,Wuhan} Institute of BioProducts developing and Sinopharm producing it?	08:20
de-facto	is it this here?	08:23
de-facto	%title https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2769612	08:23
Brainstorm	de-facto: From jamanetwork.com: Effect of an Inactivated Vaccine Against SARS-CoV-2 on Safety and Immunogenicity Outcomes: Interim Analysis of 2 Randomized Clinical Trials \| Global Health \| JAMA \| JAMA Network	08:23
de-facto	https://sci-hub.se/10.1001/jama.2020.15543	08:25
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: They got the placebo—should they be next in line for vaccine?: With America poised to become the next country to approve a COVID-19 vaccine, authorities find themselves facing an ethical dilemma: when to give trial participants who received a placebo the real deal. → https://is.gd/zMgEqY	08:41
Brainstorm	New from r/Coronavirus: Daily Discussion Thread \| December 11, 2020: The WHO pages contain up-to-date and global information. Please refer to our Wiki for additional information. → https://is.gd/BIaz8a	09:06
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Face masks provide additional communication barrier for nonnative speech: Though face masks are important and necessary for controlling the spread of the new coronavirus, they result in muffled speech and a loss of visual cues during communication. → https://is.gd/4fRaMZ	10:08
Brainstorm	New from EMA: What's new: Orphan: Orphan designation: Recombinant antibody derivative against human CD19 and CD3 (blinatumomab), Treatment of chronic lymphocytic leukaemia, 01/12/2003, Withdrawn → https://is.gd/1k6i0K	10:45
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Australian Covid vaccine dropped over false positive HIV result: Development of a Covid-19 vaccine in Australia was abandoned Friday after clinical trials produced a false positive HIV result among subjects involved in early-stage testing. → https://is.gd/m5xJQU	11:10
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: (news): AstraZeneca to work on Covid vaccine combinations with Russia's Sputnik V developers → https://is.gd/P45Usn	11:35
Brainstorm	Updates for US: +216912 cases (now 16.0 million) since 22 hours ago	11:37
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: US expert committee recommends Pfizer Covid vaccine approval: An expert committee convened by the US Food and Drug Administration voted heavily in favor of recommending the Pfizer-BioNTech Covid-19 vaccine for emergency use approval on Thursday. → https://is.gd/4ozGqf	11:47
Brainstorm	New from The Indian Express (Health): Life-style: Amid pandemic, this Indian couple delivered their wedding food to guests’ doorstep → https://is.gd/kKAJax	12:12
KREYREN	PSA consider investing in fire escape ladder https://invidious.snopyta.org/watch?v=JatG8KfKEbI .. There was recently a case in czechia where people died from burning as a result of being trapped in their home where their last ditch effort was to jump off +-60m to their death https://www.idnes.cz/ostrava/zpravy/bohumin-svedectvi-tragedie.A200808_221135_ostrava-zpravy_woj (article quotes "People saw burning bodies falling on the ground")	12:16
Brainstorm	Updates for Saint Lucia: +3 cases (now 274), +1 deaths (now 4) since a day ago	12:20
Brainstorm	New from ECDC: Download the daily number of new reported cases of COVID-19 by country worldwide: The downloadable data file is updated daily and contains the latest available public data on COVID-19. You may use the data in line with ECDC’s copyright policy. → https://is.gd/zYsz7d	12:24
Brainstorm	Updates for Switzerland: +5136 cases (now 373831), +117 deaths (now 5867) since 22 hours ago — Germany: +432 deaths (now 21248) since 22 hours ago	12:37
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: Covid: UK isolation period shortened to 10 days: The change will apply to contacts of coronavirus cases and people quarantining after travel. → https://is.gd/fWGKDa	13:15
Brainstorm	Updates for Puerto Rico, US: +2741 cases (now 106866), +11 deaths (now 1249) since 23 hours ago	13:20
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: The frightening uncertainty of long-haul COVID-19: In February, when the world barely knew the name COVID-19, Marina Oshana had what she thought was the flu or some other bug. → https://is.gd/WAUDOp	13:40
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Bahrain plans free shots, Saudi Arabia approves Pfizer jab: Bahrain has announced plans to give the public free coronavirus vaccines, as Saudi Arabia said it approved an inoculation by Pfizer and its German partner BioNTech to fight the pandemic. → https://is.gd/9xCqss	13:53
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Calls grow for wider lockdown as German virus cases rise: Calls grew Friday for tougher lockdown measures soon in Germany as the country's disease control center reported record daily increases in both coronavirus cases and deaths. → https://is.gd/kdui00	14:05
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: Covid: London's coronavirus levels rising, ONS says: But coronavirus infections fell in most English regions in the week to 5 December. → https://is.gd/tk2FYJ	14:17
Brainstorm	Updates for Netherlands: +8838 cases (now 594523), +64 deaths (now 9966) since a day ago	14:37
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Superspreading events profoundly alter the course of an epidemic: A large team of researchers with members from a variety of institutions in and around Boston have found evidence showing that superspreading events may profoundly alter the course of an epidemic. In their paper published in the journal Science, the group [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/4SBS8V	14:42
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: 5 things to know before the stock market opens Friday: The Dow was set to open lower Friday as bipartisan talks on new stimulus stall even as Pfizer's Covid-19 vaccine moves closer to FDA emergency use approval. → https://is.gd/FWYZcM	14:55
Brainstorm	Updates for Belarus: +1967 cases (now 156359), +8 deaths (now 1246) since a day ago	15:05
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: The coronavirus mutates, but that shouldn't affect the current crop of vaccines: "Coronavirus" has already established itself as the scary new word of 2020. Add the word "mutant," and you've got an even stronger candidate for the scary new phrase of 2021. → https://is.gd/hdiS0D	15:08
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: People with severe allergies to previous vaccinations warned off Pfizer COVID vaccine—for now: Two people in the United Kingdom have experienced an allergic reaction to the Pfizer/BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine. This led the UK medicines regulator to issue precautionary advice earlier this week that "people with a significant [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/V0GJFo	15:20
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: AstraZeneca will test using component of Russia’s Sputnik V in clinical trials of its own vaccine against coronavirus (82 votes) \| https://sputnikvaccine.com/newsroom/pressreleases/astrazeneca-will-test-using-component-of-russia-s-sputnik-v-in-clinical-trials-of-its-own-vaccine-ag/ \| https://redd.it/kb008a	15:21
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: 'Psychological toll' of lockdown peaked in the early weeks: People's levels of anxiety and depression were at their highest (worst) in the early stages of the March lockdown but improved fairly rapidly following the introduction of restrictions, according to new findings by UCL researchers. → https://is.gd/Abi1KY	15:33
Brainstorm	Updates for Canada: +4037 cases (now 443192) since 21 hours ago — Switzerland: +65 deaths (now 5888) since 20 hours ago	15:37
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: (news): FDA advisor explains why she voted against recommending Pfizer's Covid vaccine for emergency use → https://is.gd/Yj37CQ	15:46
Brainstorm	Updates for Germany: +577 deaths (now 21414) since a day ago	15:51
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Who should get the first COVID-19 vaccines? Global study provides insights: Should people who already had COVID-19 step aside and give their place in the vaccine line to someone else? In some cases, yes, suggests new University of Colorado Boulder research. → https://is.gd/caFbCw	15:58
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Expert discusses the discoveries that enabled RNA vaccines for COVID-19: Some of the most promising vaccines developed to combat COVID-19 rely on messenger RNA (mRNA)—a template cells use to carry genetic instructions for producing proteins. The mRNA vaccines take advantage of this cellular process to make proteins that then [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/gwi5uM	16:11
hirogen	hi	16:16
hirogen	https://www.latimes.com/world-nation/story/2020-12-09/five-minutes-from-20-feet-away-south-korean-study-shows-perils-of-indoor-dining-for-covid-19	16:16
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: New report finds global health research infrastructure imperiled by COVID-19: The strong foundation of global health research and development (R&D) that greatly accelerated the development of COVID-19 innovations is now being weakened by pandemic pressures that are diverting funding and expertise away from other dangerous [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/kRldEa	16:24
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: FDA chief says agency will quickly approve Pfizer's Covid vaccine for emergency use: The authorization of the vaccine should come "in the next couple of days," Alex Azar, secretary of the Department of Health and Human Services, said on ABC's "Good Morning America." → https://is.gd/i7YRaV	16:37
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: UK to reduce virus quarantine for travellers: Britain said Friday it is to cut its period of self-isolation from 14 to 10 days for travellers arriving from overseas and people who come into contact with positive coronavirus cases. → https://is.gd/d35YBM	16:49
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: (news): FDA advisor explains why she voted against recommending Pfizer's Covid vaccine for emergency use → https://is.gd/Yj37CQ	17:02
Brainstorm	Updates for Pennsylvania, US: +13201 cases (now 475412), +216 deaths (now 12311) since 23 hours ago	17:05
Brainstorm	New from Virology.ws: An antiviral compound that blocks SARS-CoV-2 transmission in ferrets: COVID-19 vaccine candidates are garnering all the news these days, which is appropriate as they are our key to ending this pandemic. Earlier in this outbreak antiviral drugs received a good deal of attention, but they have proven less useful in curtailing [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/L2b6Ov	17:15
Brainstorm	Updates for Italy: +18726 cases (now 1.8 million), +761 deaths (now 63387) since a day ago — Namibia: +324 cases (now 16097), +2 deaths (now 160) since a day ago — Arizona, US: +6983 cases (now 394512), +91 deaths (now 7245) since a day ago	17:23
Brainstorm	New from In The Pipeline: A Wider Variety of Vaccine Platforms Report: Well, it’s definitely been a Vaccine Week around here, but it’s understandable. And we’ll finish off the week with a look at some types that we haven’t seen report yet. The news is. . .mixed. First off is a preliminary report on the inactivated virus vaccine from Sinopharm [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/jnGYYC	17:28
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: (news): Watch live: New York Gov. Cuomo holds a press briefing as state prepares to distribute Covid vaccine → https://is.gd/FEwSPA	17:40
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: Covid: London's coronavirus levels rising, ONS says: But infections kept falling in most English regions as the second lockdown ended. → https://is.gd/tk2FYJ	17:53
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: (news): Covid: Genes hold clues to why some people get severely ill → https://is.gd/Zw2Rcz	18:17
Brainstorm	New from EMA: What's new: Event: Public stakeholder meeting: development and authorisation of safe and effective COVID-19 vaccines in the EU, Virtual meeting, from 11/12/2020 to 11/12/2020 → https://is.gd/o8T8pn	19:09
Brainstorm	New from Medical Xpress: Drop in ED visits related to child abuse, neglect during COVID-19: (HealthDay)—During the COVID-19 pandemic, there was a decrease in the total number of emergency department visits related to child abuse and neglect, according to research published in the Dec. 11 issue of the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/wxYThK	19:47
Brainstorm	Updates for South Carolina, US: +3540 cases (now 245226), +46 deaths (now 4673) since a day ago — Spain: +7053 cases (now 1.7 million), +280 deaths (now 47624) since 23 hours ago	19:51
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: Covid: UK isolation period shortened to 10 days: The change will apply to contacts of coronavirus cases and people quarantining after travel. → https://is.gd/fWGKDa	19:59
Brainstorm	Updates for United Kingdom: +19259 cases (now 1.8 million), +375 deaths (now 63506) since 12 hours ago	20:05
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: Walgreens may begin Covid vaccinations at nursing homes before Christmas: The start of vaccinations at nursing homes represents a significant milestone in the pandemic because long-term care facilities have been particularly hard hit. → https://is.gd/1bx1ya	20:12
Brainstorm	Updates for Canada: +6320 cases (now 446100), +153 deaths (now 13221) since 22 hours ago	20:23
Jigsy	%cases UK	20:31
Brainstorm	Jigsy: In United Kingdom, there have been 1.8 million confirmed cases (2.7% of the population) and 63506 deaths (3.5% of cases) as of 28 minutes ago. 47.1 million tests were performed (3.8% positive). See https://offloop.net/covid19/?default=United%20Kingdom for time series data.	20:31
Jigsy	Cases are back up again.	20:34
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: The Latest on Coronavirus Mutations (81 votes) \| https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/12/10/the-latest-on-coronavirus-mutations \| https://redd.it/kb4jdc	20:35
Brainstorm	New from r/WorldNews: worldnews: Australia records COVID milestone - one week with no new locally acquired COVID Cases → https://is.gd/uCpulu	20:37
Brainstorm	New from BBC Health: (news): Covid: Genes hold clues to why some people get severely ill → https://is.gd/Zw2Rcz	20:49
Brainstorm	New from StatNews: Listen: Pfizer’s Covid-19 vaccine: the debate, details, and distribution: Are Covid-19 vaccines safe for teens? Is the U.S. taking too long to authorize one? And how do you prepare for an FDA grilling? Find out on this week's episode… → https://is.gd/e1J5Ck	21:02
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: Black health leaders try to build trust in the Covid vaccine among African Americans: Most African Americans are highly skeptical of the Covid vaccine. Black health-care leaders are trying to build trust in communities hard hit by the virus. → https://is.gd/vGCdU6	21:14
Brainstorm	New from CNBC Health: White House threatens to fire FDA chief unless Pfizer Covid vaccine approved Friday, reports say: White House chief of staff Mark Meadows told the head of the FDA to submit his resignation if the agency doesn't approve Pfizer's vaccine Friday, reports say. → https://is.gd/Ii4dOH	21:26
DocScrutinizer05	>>New from Medical Xpress: Superspreading events profoundly alter the course of an epidemic:<< ORLY?	21:46
Brainstorm	Updates for Switzerland: +76 deaths (now 5900) since 22 hours ago	21:51
CoronaBot	04/r/coronavirus: Just Under Three Million Will Get COVID-19 Vaccine in First Week (10142 votes) \| https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/942491 \| https://redd.it/kb3e79	21:54
DocScrutinizer05	>>Oral administration of MK-4482 at 12 or 36 hours after infection, followed by treatment twice daily for 3.5 days, leads to complete clearance of infectious virus 24 – 36 hours later, demonstrating oral efficacy of therapeutic administration of the drug in ferrets.<< https://www.virology.ws/2020/12/11/an-antiviral-compound-that-blocks-sars-cov-2-transmission-in-ferrets/	21:56
tinwhiskers	o.O	21:57
genera	great news .. until the "in ferrets" :-)	21:59
DocScrutinizer05	%title https://www.bbc.com/news/health-54832563 >>... has identified specific genes that may hold the answer. They make some people more susceptible to severe Covid-19 symptoms.<<	21:59
Brainstorm	DocScrutinizer05: From www.bbc.com: Covid: Genes hold clues to why some people get severely ill - BBC News	21:59
Brainstorm	New from PLOS ONE: Influenza vaccination hesitancy in five countries of South America. Confidence, complacency and convenience as determinants of immunization rates: by Miguel Ángel González-Block, Emilio Gutiérrez-Calderón, Blanca Estela Pelcastre-Villafuerte, Juan Arroyo-Laguna, Yamila Comes, Pedro Crocco, Andréa Fachel-Leal, Laura Noboa, [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/xYphRK	22:03
Brainstorm	Updates for Syria: +124 cases (now 8911), +15 deaths (now 491) since a day ago	22:05
DocScrutinizer05	the above is just my subjective "reader's digest" of today's brainstorm aggregation, filtered for interesting new stuff I didn't her in mainstream news twice an hour yet	22:09
DocScrutinizer05	didh't hear*	22:09
DocScrutinizer05	maybe the regex needs some branch that says >>if SENDER="PLOS ONE" then NEEDS "covid\|corona\|cov2\|SARS"<<	22:16
Brainstorm	New from PLOS ONE: Cognitive flexibility and perceived threat from COVID-19 mediate the relationship between childhood maltreatment and state anxiety: by Vrinda Kalia, Katherine Knauft, Niki Hayatbini Converging empirical evidence indicates that exposure to adversity in childhood is associated with increased vulnerability to mental health problems in [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/pI2hfI	22:16
DocScrutinizer05	actually I guess spamassassin is the toolbox of choice for this task, with filter rules tailored to fit the topical domain at hand	22:19
Brainstorm	Updates for Bermuda: +27 cases (now 391) since a day ago	22:23
Brainstorm	New from PLOS ONE: Persistence of symptoms and quality of life at 35 days after hospitalization for COVID-19 infection: by Laurie G. Jacobs, Elli Gourna Paleoudis, Dineen Lesky-Di Bari, Themba Nyirenda, Tamara Friedman, Anjali Gupta, Lily Rasouli, Marygrace Zetkulic, Bindu Balani, Chinwe Ogedegbe, Harinder Bawa, Lauren Berrol, Nabiha Qureshi, Judy L. [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/1VyR3e	22:29
Brainstorm	New from PLOS ONE: Healthcare workers’ knowledge, preparedness, counselling practices, and perceived barriers to confront COVID-19: A cross-sectional study from a war-torn country, Yemen: by Fahmi Y. Al-Ashwal, Mohammed Kubas, Mohammed Zawiah, Ahmad Naoras Bitar, Ramzi Mukred Saeed, Syed Azhar Syed Sulaiman, Amer Hayat Khan, Siti Maisharah Sheikh [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/zPAFKm	22:41
Brainstorm	New from PLOS: The potential impact of urine-LAM diagnostics on tuberculosis incidence and mortality: A modelling analysis: by Saskia Ricks, Claudia M. Denkinger, Samuel G. Schumacher, Timothy B. Hallett, Nimalan Arinaminpathy Background Lateral flow urine lipoarabinomannan (LAM) tests could offer important new opportunities for the early detection of [... want %more?] → https://is.gd/rhXBW2	22:54
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: Male sex identified by global COVID-19 meta-analysis as a risk factor for death and ITU admission (84 votes) \| https://www.nature.com/articles/s41467-020-19741-6 \| https://redd.it/kb7ka7	22:54
DocScrutinizer05	%spam	22:57
Brainstorm	Updates for Mauritania: +233 cases (now 10501) since 22 hours ago	23:05
LjL	i removed plos one	23:06
CoronaBot	04/r/covid19: FDA Statement on Vaccines and Related Biological Products Advisory Committee Meeting (81 votes) \| https://www.fda.gov/news-events/press-announcements/fda-statement-vaccines-and-related-biological-products-advisory-committee-meeting \| https://redd.it/kb2trq	23:06
DocScrutinizer05	LjL: the PLOS ONE titles that have an unambiguous topical keyword like covid, sars-cov2 etc are ok, though often they deal with more peripheral aspects. At least that's how I conceive it.	23:20
LjL	well i cannot have different keywords for each source unless i overhaul everything	23:20
DocScrutinizer05	yeah, that's probably not worth it	23:21
Brainstorm	Updates for Wyoming, US: +562 cases (now 38785), +22 deaths (now 321) since a day ago	23:22
DocScrutinizer05	are you using perl-regexp ?	23:23
LjL	i'm using whatever python uses	23:24
LjL	r'(coronavirus\|COVID\|outbreak\|pandemic\|epidemic\|SARS\|face mask\|sanitizer\|cases\|Wuhan\|Hubei\|Lombardy\|Lombardia\|Moderna\|quarantena\|quarantine\|isolation\|lockdown\|swab\|Milan\|positive\|negative\|tests\|\bICU\b\|terapia\|therapeutic\|antibod\|pcr\|dexamethasone\|remdesivir\|chloroquine\|hcq\|ppe\|n95\|aerosol\|airborne\|icu\|triage\|reopen\|il-6\|il-8\|tnf\|cytokine\|vaccin)'	23:25
Brainstorm	New from NPR: 'Hold Their Feet To the Fire': Getting A COVID-19 Vaccine To Hard Hit Indian Country: A portion of the first coronavirus vaccines have been designated to go to Indian Country, but some tribes are skeptical about the federal government's ability to deliver and distribute it. → https://is.gd/nguSLx	23:26
Brainstorm	New from NPR: Wisconsin Hospital Leader On Getting Ready For Vaccinations: Dr. Jeff Bahr with the Advocate Aurora Health system in Wisconsin says his hospitals are "ready to go" for vaccinations. Staff who treat COVID-19 patients will be first in line, he says. → https://is.gd/qVrIKE	23:38
Brainstorm	Updates for Nigeria: +799 cases (now 72143) since a day ago	23:51
DocScrutinizer05	https://pypi.org/project/python-pcre/ I'm pretty sure you could write a leading (?(?=condition)x\|y) if/ten/else PCRE like r("(?(?=,*?PLOS ONE)(covid\|sars\|cov2\|corona)\|.) (coronavirus\|COVID\|outbreak\|pa......)") that - if it were formed correctly which it likely issnt - does a >>if "PLOS ONE" then ALSO (covid\|sars\|cov2\|corona)\|.)<< Alas I'm also no real wizard of PCRE	23:53
DocScrutinizer05	maybe useful startpoint: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/46432854/regex-if-then-else-statement	23:55
DocScrutinizer05	I'm not demanding this, just suggesting you could ponder if you consider it worth the effort	23:55
LjL	i think i'll just keep it out, among other things i have a broken tooth that needs extraction and i don't really feel like doing anything	23:59

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